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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the

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Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants answers.

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Speaker 2: Now, So a child's been drown in less than twenty seconds.

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Speaker 2: It's faster than most people think, and as we say,

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Speaker 2: it's often silent, and those things are what make it

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Speaker 2: such a deadly and risky situation for children.

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Speaker 1: And now here's the stars of our show, my mum

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Speaker 1: and dad.

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Speaker 3: Hello, this is doctor Justin Coulson. As we move so

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Speaker 3: quickly now towards the summer holidays, Christmas is just around

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Speaker 3: the corner, and this is the time where the weather

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Speaker 3: warms up and we start to get into swimming pools. Now,

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Speaker 3: I'm going to share a story as we kick off

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Speaker 3: today's podcast that is a little bit hard to hear,

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Speaker 3: and I just want to, I guess, highlight that I'm

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Speaker 3: not sharing this to be sensationalistic, but to highlight the

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Speaker 3: importance of our conversation today. My guest on the podcast

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Speaker 3: is doctor Anthea Rhodes. Anthea joins me fairly regularly to

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Speaker 3: talk about the RCH National Health Pole. Doctor Rhodes is

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Speaker 3: the director of that pole, and there's been a new

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Speaker 3: pole just conducted with results currently being published. Looking at

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Speaker 3: kids and water safety, their capacity to be safe around water,

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Speaker 3: to be swimming, engaging in swimming lessons. And we're heading

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Speaker 3: to the beach that we've got swimming pools, we've got lakes, rivers,

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Speaker 3: whatever it might be. And this is the season where

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Speaker 3: we really need to have this conversation. This conversation is

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Speaker 3: really important to me because my family has come so

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Speaker 3: breathtakingly close to experiencing drowning. Where fortunate that it hasn't occurred.

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Speaker 3: But at a family barbecue a few years ago, probably

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Speaker 3: fifteen years ago. Now it goes really fast to the

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Speaker 3: elder you get, But at a family barbecue around about

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Speaker 3: fifteen years ago, everybody was hanging out of the pool

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Speaker 3: area having a great conversation. The pool area was full

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Speaker 3: of adults who were all having sausages and steak and

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Speaker 3: salad and standing and sitting and just being present. There

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Speaker 3: were kids swimming in the pool. My young cousin, James,

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Speaker 3: who I think at the time was about two, was

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Speaker 3: sitting on the edge of the pool and he slipped

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Speaker 3: into the pool. The thing with drowning is that it's silent,

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Speaker 3: and James just slipped into the pool and nobody noticed.

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Speaker 3: He sunk to the bottom of the pool and had

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Speaker 3: been on the bottom of the pool for an extended

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Speaker 3: period of time before somebody saw him. We dived into

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Speaker 3: the pool, pulled him out, and he was changing color.

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Speaker 3: He was definitely in the process of drowning. Fortunately we

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Speaker 3: were able to see him start breathing again fairly quickly.

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Speaker 3: He vomited up a whole lot of water and he

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Speaker 3: was okay. But another five, ten, twenty seconds and the

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Speaker 3: outcome could have been tragic and we would have been

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Speaker 3: attending a funeral rather than celebrating Christmas. So Anthea, thank

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Speaker 3: you so much for joining me for this conversation. That

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Speaker 3: story is one of those awful stories to start off

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Speaker 3: a conversation like this, but I share it because it

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Speaker 3: matters so much. When you did the RCH National Child

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Speaker 3: Health Poll, are you asking and what did you find

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Speaker 3: when it comes to kids and water safety?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks so much for having me on to talk

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Speaker 2: about this really important topic justin and as you say,

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Speaker 2: with summer and holidays around the corner, the risk period

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Speaker 2: really goes up.

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Speaker 4: Now. Your story, unfortunately.

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Speaker 2: Is not a rare one, and most people listening will

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Speaker 2: probably know of someone in their extended family or perhaps

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Speaker 2: someone very close to them who has maybe had a

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Speaker 2: near drowning episode. And of course in some situations it's

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Speaker 2: not a near drowning, it can in fact have devastating outcomes.

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Speaker 2: So we ask parents what they know about drowning and

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Speaker 2: the risks of drowning, and one of the biggest findings

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Speaker 2: is exactly as you say, it's that myth that perhaps.

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Speaker 4: Children struggle or splash or make.

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Speaker 2: A lot of noise or do something obvious if they're

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Speaker 2: struggling in the water and starting to drown. In fact,

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Speaker 2: in most instances it's quiet can in fact be silent

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Speaker 2: and often goes unnoticed.

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Speaker 4: So forty four percent of Australian parents didn't know that.

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Speaker 4: They didn't know that.

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Speaker 2: Drowning is often silent, and so they expect that if

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Speaker 2: they've got half an hour on what's going on, they'll notice,

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Speaker 2: there'll be a commotion, something will happen, the alarm will

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Speaker 2: be raised, and everyone will be aware.

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Speaker 4: But in fact, in.

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Speaker 2: Studies where they've looked at footage that's been captured incidentally,

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Speaker 2: like CCTV type footage where near drownings or drownings have happened,

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Speaker 2: often there's people standing right alongside the incident, there's adults there,

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Speaker 2: but it quietly happens just outside of someone's gaze. And

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Speaker 2: once that child has started to struggle underwater takes that

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Speaker 2: first breath of water rather than air, then they really

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Speaker 2: rapidly become weak, lose consciousness, and are not able to

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Speaker 2: reach up for the top. So knowing that drowning happens quickly,

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Speaker 2: it can happen in very shallow water, and it's often silent,

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Speaker 2: is really really important for parents to be aware of.

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Speaker 3: And I'm stounded when you share those statistics because I mean,

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Speaker 3: you're saying forty four percent of parents weren't aware of that.

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Speaker 3: Is there anything else surprising in terms of parental knowledge

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Speaker 3: parental awareness when it comes to this particular topic.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so around half of parents. We're also not aware

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Speaker 2: how quickly a child can drown. So a child can

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Speaker 2: drown in less than twenty seconds.

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Speaker 4: Wow, that's really not a long.

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Speaker 2: Period of time if we think about and this is

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Speaker 2: a classic situation in near drowning type episodes. Nowadays, we

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Speaker 2: might be on our phone as a parent, you might

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Speaker 2: stop to read one text message or have a look at,

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Speaker 2: you know, one image that's popped up on the screen

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Speaker 2: in that short period of time, you know, twenty seconds

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Speaker 2: or less, that can be enough for a child to

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Speaker 2: actually enter that drowning episode. So it's fast, faster than

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Speaker 2: most people think. And as we say, it's often silent,

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Speaker 2: and those things are what make it such a deadly

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Speaker 2: and risky situation for children.

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Speaker 3: Anthe two things come to mind when you share that.

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Speaker 3: The first is a news story that I remember from

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Speaker 3: a few years ago now where a mum ended up

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Speaker 3: tragically in court because she had been literally just scrolling

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Speaker 3: Instagram and her little one had been in the bath.

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Speaker 3: I mean, this isn't even a summertime thing, right, this

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Speaker 3: is just bathtime, scrolling Instagram. Little one's in the bath,

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Speaker 3: she's there, didn't notice that her little toddler had stuck

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Speaker 3: its head under the water and actually inhaled the water

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Speaker 3: and drowned right there. The other one, the other story.

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Speaker 3: I'm at pains to share it, but I think again

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Speaker 3: emphasizing the purpose of this conversation is to emphasize just

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Speaker 3: how important it is that we keep closely on our kids.

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Speaker 3: A good friend of mine is a paramedic down in

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Speaker 3: New South Wales and he was called to a job

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Speaker 3: where a grandfather had been looking after two little twin

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Speaker 3: boys toddlers around three years of age. The pool gate

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Speaker 3: was closed, but it wasn't locked. Somehow the lock hadn't

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Speaker 3: snapped into place, so he knew that the poolgate was closed. Therefore,

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Speaker 3: he wasn't supervising the kids particularly closely. They were in

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Speaker 3: the rumpus room. He was in the kitchen. He thought, Hey,

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Speaker 3: the kids are pretty quiet. I should go and check

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Speaker 3: on them. All of a sudden, they weren't in the

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Speaker 3: rumpest room. He saw the sliding door was open, walked out,

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Speaker 3: saw the poolgate was open. Couldn't work out what had

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Speaker 3: happened both of the boys, one had gone and the

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Speaker 3: other one had followed him, and one had drowned on

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Speaker 3: the spot. The other one passed away in hospital a

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Speaker 3: short while later. My friend was the paramedic that was

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Speaker 3: called to the job, and he described the emotional devastation

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Speaker 3: of this grandfather as he was coming to grips with

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Speaker 3: the reality of what had occurred. He said, He's never

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Speaker 3: seen pain like it when it comes to parents and

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Speaker 3: their involvement with helping kids to be safe and supervising them.

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Speaker 3: Can you tell me some more about what your rh

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Speaker 3: pol found to help kids to be safe.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so just devastating hearing that story justin and sadly

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Speaker 2: we see cases just like that here in the hospital

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Speaker 2: every year. And one of the really important things that

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Speaker 2: is part of that story time and time again is

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Speaker 2: you know, these are not negligent parents who are choosing

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Speaker 2: or don't realize that it matters. They understand that it's

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Speaker 2: important to supervise they kids, and they understand that their

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Speaker 2: kids probably can't swim. But what people often don't realize

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Speaker 2: is just how quickly these things can happen. So common

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Speaker 2: myths that parents, you know, some parents believe are okay,

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Speaker 2: where things like if you've got older children in the pool,

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Speaker 2: it's okay to leave your younger child, you know, to

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Speaker 2: step away to do something just for a moment. Similarly,

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Speaker 2: in the bath you've mentioned really really important children can

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Speaker 2: drown in just a few centimeters of water in a bath.

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Speaker 2: It's not okay to leave a toddler with an older

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Speaker 2: child without an adult you know, there to supervise. So

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Speaker 2: those sorts of moments where often it's quick people think oh,

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Speaker 2: I'm just going to step away for a minute, it

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Speaker 2: can be enough to have devastating consequences, So this study

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Speaker 2: really reminds us how much we need to all talk

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Speaker 2: about this and be aware of this. We also found

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Speaker 2: interestingly that dads went quite as sharp on their water

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Speaker 2: safety knowledge as mums when we did the survey, so

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Speaker 2: dads were more likely to tell us that it might

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Speaker 2: be all right to you know, leave an older kid

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Speaker 2: to look after your younger kid in the pool or

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Speaker 2: in the path for example. Another really important one is

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Speaker 2: about being at the beach when kids are swimming between

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Speaker 2: patrolled flags. So we're super lucky here in Australia. We've

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Speaker 2: got incredible surf life saving you know, skills and services,

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Speaker 2: but they again don't replace supervision for you of your

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Speaker 2: own child.

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Speaker 4: So we found that around.

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Speaker 2: A quarter of Australian parents thought if they're at the

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Speaker 2: beach and their kids are swimming between the flags, then

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Speaker 2: they don't necessarily need to supervise them. Now, we know,

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Speaker 2: if you picture a busy beach and you know you

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Speaker 2: live in Queensland, I live in Victoria, so our beach

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Speaker 2: is you know, maybe not quite as fabulous. But on

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Speaker 2: a summer's day between the flags there are hundreds, you know,

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Speaker 2: if not thousands sometimes of kids and just a handful

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Speaker 2: of surf life savers there to supervise, so they cannot

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Speaker 2: you know, they do a fabulous job, but they do

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Speaker 2: not replace your.

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Speaker 4: Individual supervision of your young child.

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Speaker 2: So another really important message there for parents as we

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Speaker 2: head into the holiday season to.

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Speaker 4: Be aware of that.

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Speaker 3: When you consider the findings of this poll, what advice,

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Speaker 3: what are the stats? What other things do we need

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Speaker 3: to be aware of? And I know that there's probably

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Speaker 3: a handful of other things that we can pull out

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Speaker 3: of it that will be really useful over the next

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Speaker 3: sort of four six eight weeks as parents spend more

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Speaker 3: time near the water with their kids.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So the other big one that we asked about

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Speaker 2: in this study was swimming lessons. So obviously we're all

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Speaker 2: emerging from a couple of years as a COVID pandemic

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Speaker 2: and there's been pools closed. Perhaps families haven't been on holidays,

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Speaker 2: they haven't had a chance to get in the pool

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Speaker 2: with their kids for a couple of weeks, and you know,

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Speaker 2: really build those water safety in swimming skills. Around half

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Speaker 2: of Australian kids have had lost opportunities to build their

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Speaker 2: swimming skills due to COVID, So that's either missed lessons

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Speaker 2: or you know, missed a chance to get in the

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Speaker 2: pool and practice their swimming. So as we head into

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Speaker 2: the summer, if that's you and your kids, they're a

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Speaker 2: bit more vulnerable, you know, than they would have been

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Speaker 2: if they'd kept up those regular swimming lessons and been

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Speaker 2: a bit more aware of water safety. Of course, swimming

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Speaker 2: lessons does not replace supervision, and that was again a

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Speaker 2: really important myth that we found in this study. Some

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Speaker 2: parents felt if their children have had swimming lessons, then

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Speaker 2: they probably don't need supervision. They're safe in the water.

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Speaker 2: And we're talking about young kids here, kids under ten.

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Speaker 2: Even if they've had lessons, you still need to be

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Speaker 2: supervising them because you know, you don't necessarily know their

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Speaker 2: ability is enough to save themselves if a situation is

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Speaker 2: outside of their ability or control. But those swimming lessons

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Speaker 2: are a really important thing to get back into. Parents

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Speaker 2: are not going to have a chance to do that

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Speaker 2: before the end of the year. I don't know about you,

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Speaker 2: justment we're all limping to the line here, and they're

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Speaker 2: certainly looking forward to lots of things wrapping up, including

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Speaker 2: all those extracurricular activities for the holidays, but definitely a

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Speaker 2: message for families.

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Speaker 4: As well next year, re enroll in swimming lessons.

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Speaker 2: Half of families who had dropped out of these because

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Speaker 2: of COVID have not got back into those really important

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Speaker 2: lessons to build those safety skills for their kids, and

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Speaker 2: most people told us it's because they were too busy

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Speaker 2: or they hadn't got around to it. They know it's important,

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Speaker 2: but it's one of those things that you've got.

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Speaker 4: To factor it in.

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Speaker 3: I'd imagine that the costs would also be a little

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Speaker 3: bit of a challenge for a lot of families, especially

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Speaker 3: as we're watching the current economic situation unfold. Anthea, this

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Speaker 3: is such an important conversation obviously, with the stories that

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Speaker 3: I've shared and the statistics that you've brought to the four,

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Speaker 3: I just so much appreciate you taking some time to

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Speaker 3: share these ideas on the Happy Families podcast. Are there

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Speaker 3: any final thoughts, any last words before we wrap this up?

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Speaker 2: Look, the one parting message really for parents is keep

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Speaker 2: your eyes on your kids over the summer anywhere around water,

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Speaker 2: especially if you're in a new environment. If you're in

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Speaker 2: a mate's place for a barbecue and they've got a pull,

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Speaker 2: you're down at the beach, gathering with it extended family.

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Speaker 2: You've gone on holidays, you're somewhere new or different. Those

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Speaker 2: places especially are where we relax finally, but we might

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Speaker 2: drop our guard as well, and we're not aware of

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Speaker 2: the risks. Our kids certainly are not aware of the risks,

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Speaker 2: and drowning can happen quickly, silently, and it's absolutely devastating.

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Speaker 4: So be aware, you know.

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Speaker 2: Not about dramatizing things and taking away all the fun,

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Speaker 2: but recognizing this is a real risk for kids, particularly

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Speaker 2: those young kids, kids under ten, and then even more

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Speaker 2: so kids under five, preschoolers, you know, toddlers, they're the biggest.

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Speaker 4: Risk age group. We stay at arms reach all the

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Speaker 4: times around water.

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Speaker 3: Well supervised, supervised, supervised. Doctor Antheo Rhodes, the director of

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Speaker 3: the RCH National Child Health Phole, really appreciate you and

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Speaker 3: spending some time with us again on the podcast. Have

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Speaker 3: a oneful Christmas, stay safe and I hope we get

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Speaker 3: to talk to you again next year.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely you two. Thanks Justin.

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Speaker 3: It's doctor Antheo Rhodes, the director of the RCCH National

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Speaker 3: Child Health Whole, on the Happy Families podcast, which is

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Speaker 3: produced by Justin Rowland. For Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is

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Speaker 3: our executive producer, and for more information about making your

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Speaker 3: family safe and happy, visit happy Families dot com, dot

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Speaker 3: a