1 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:07,520 Speaker 1: Coming up on today's show, Matt Zukowski breaks his silence 2 00:00:07,560 --> 00:00:11,200 Speaker 1: after being accused of cheating on Tammy, Hembro, Taylor Swift 3 00:00:11,240 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: steals the show at Coachella, TikTok and Nara Smith's postpartum update, 4 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:21,240 Speaker 1: and the landmark defamation case that's destroying reputations. Hello, and 5 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 1: welcome to Outspoken. It's your dose of the hottest influencer 6 00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:27,960 Speaker 1: and pop culture news twice a week. I'm Sophie Torbert, 7 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 1: and it has been a big weekend for Olivia Rodgers' 8 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 1: most recent exes because they had a reunion at bar 9 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: Bambi on Saturday night. Now, the former Miss Universe's ex boyfriend, 10 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 1: Morgan Waterhouse, she had a photo to his Instagram story 11 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:44,960 Speaker 1: of him with none other than Olivia Rodgers' ex husband 12 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:48,159 Speaker 1: Justin mckeann. I really felt for Nick Russian, who was 13 00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: actually in the middle of the pair. So he is 14 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:53,479 Speaker 1: the owner of bar Bambi, and he looks like he 15 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: is an awkward third wheel in the middle of this photo, 16 00:00:56,600 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 1: So Morgan and Justin look pretty cozy. Wilkin's arm is 17 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:04,920 Speaker 1: extended out, so he's basically grasping onto Justin's shoulder. It's 18 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: very clear that Morgan shared this photo to make a point. 19 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:10,080 Speaker 1: He is trying to have a potshot at Olivia Rogers. 20 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: It comes off the back of him sharing a video 21 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:15,720 Speaker 1: of highlights of his with the caption you look happier, 22 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:20,080 Speaker 1: as well as his friend starting rumors that Olivia apparently 23 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 1: cheated on him. None of those allegations have been proven 24 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 1: to be true, but he clearly has an ax to grind. 25 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 1: It was one of those moments where I actually gasped 26 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:31,479 Speaker 1: when I saw the photo. It almost didn't look real. Yeah, 27 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 1: I felt like it was very cringe and very high school. 28 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,920 Speaker 1: It's clear he just needs to move on now. I 29 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: wonder if Justin was annoyed that this photo was posted 30 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 1: or if he was happy to oblige and be involved. 31 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 1: Can you imagine waking up on a Sunday morning to 32 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:50,440 Speaker 1: find two of your exes in a photo together. All 33 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:53,680 Speaker 1: I would be thinking is are they comparing notes? What's 34 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 1: going on? What are they trying to achieve? I think 35 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 1: Olivia would have been fuming because those two appearing together 36 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: it almost adds validity to Morgan's claims about infidelity. See, 37 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: I actually think it makes them look bad because it 38 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,920 Speaker 1: looks really petty that these two guys are catching up. 39 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 1: They seem a bit jaded. That's attention seeking. Yeah, it's 40 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: very attention seeking. And I think a lot of people 41 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:20,440 Speaker 1: are thinking, look, Morgan, your fifteen seconds of fame is 42 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 1: over fifteen minutes. Whatever it is, move on and be 43 00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:27,679 Speaker 1: happy and try and share content that people actually want 44 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 1: to see. Because the only reason people were following him 45 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 1: is because he was Olivia Rodgers's boyfriend for about two minutes. 46 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 2: Well, I just wanted to sort of like tell people 47 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 2: like that because I've just like, you see the comments 48 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 2: and you see people running their mouths, and you see 49 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:46,079 Speaker 2: like all their what's word perceptions or they're like stories 50 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:48,799 Speaker 2: they're making up, and you're like, dude, you don't know nothing. 51 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:52,920 Speaker 1: Matt Sakowski has broken his silence after being accused of 52 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:56,440 Speaker 1: cheating on his fiance Tammy Hembro. In an episode of 53 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 1: his podcast Wears Your Head At, he confirmed he did 54 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 1: message enough woman, but says he did so on behalf 55 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: of his friend. 56 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:03,639 Speaker 2: Now. 57 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: It is clear this episode was shared as part of 58 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:08,720 Speaker 1: damage control, but I personally think it has done more 59 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: damage than good. I agree it was very difficult to 60 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: listen to. It did feel like Matt and his co 61 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:17,400 Speaker 1: host Anna McK andvoy were working in overdrive to justify 62 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:21,240 Speaker 1: his actions. However, you'd probably get as drunk as Matt 63 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 1: claims he was the night he sent those messages if 64 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 1: you took a shot every time. They claimed they weren't 65 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 1: trying to acuse his behavior, So for those who haven't 66 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 1: listened to the episode, from the get go, it seemed 67 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 1: like they were trying to garner sympathy for Matt, so 68 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 1: they painted this picture of him looking disheveled and lost. 69 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 1: Anna even said that she barely recognized him because he 70 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 1: hadn't shaved, and they also mentioned he'd spent the last 71 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: three weeks on the Gold Coast with Tammy. Now, when 72 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:50,880 Speaker 1: Anna asked Matt how he was coping, he said this. 73 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 2: I'm not gonna lie, I'm in a pretty bad place mentally, 74 00:03:55,080 --> 00:04:00,839 Speaker 2: like it's just I don't know, like look like it's 75 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 2: just more embarrassed than anything. And it's just taken a 76 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 2: strain on Mike everyone around me like it. I'll go 77 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 2: into more details later, but like, yeah, I'm exhausted, I'm drained. 78 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 2: It's just something that's like to me, was and I 79 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 2: get what I did and I'll explain, like, I get 80 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 2: what I did was wrong. Yeah, it's just exhausting. We're 81 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 2: just working through it. 82 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 1: The thing I don't understand there is if you're completely 83 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: innocent in sending a message to a random girl that 84 00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 1: you used to chat with when you were single, and 85 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:37,719 Speaker 1: your partner's fine about it, and everyone knows it was 86 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:40,480 Speaker 1: just asking for a friend, then why are you win 87 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:43,720 Speaker 1: such a disheveled state where you're very mentally drained and 88 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:45,560 Speaker 1: upset by the whole thing. I think he's trying to 89 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: get sympathy because there has been a lot of media scrutiny, 90 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 1: whether he said he did or didn't do this, it 91 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: has put his relationship under the microscope. Yeah, Amy, I 92 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: think you could be right. And one thing that really 93 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 1: stood out to me during this chat was just how 94 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,200 Speaker 1: much Anna and Matt tried to set the scene of 95 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 1: how hard they were partying after Glamour on the Grid. 96 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 1: So Anna and her fiance Michael, joined Matt and Tammy 97 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,040 Speaker 1: back at their suite and drank with him until three am, 98 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:13,440 Speaker 1: and Matt explained that he drank so much he projectile 99 00:05:13,520 --> 00:05:16,440 Speaker 1: vomited the next morning, while Anna said she had been 100 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 1: very sick the next day, and she went on to 101 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:22,080 Speaker 1: explain that she and Michael left at three am and 102 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 1: Matt had just popped open another bottle of champagne and 103 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:27,720 Speaker 1: it was at this point Matt sent the questionable message. 104 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:30,159 Speaker 1: So Anna asked Matt to take the audience through the 105 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:32,679 Speaker 1: message that was sent. Let's throw to what he said. 106 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:38,279 Speaker 2: Honestly, I'm not making excuses, but I don't fully remember 107 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 2: sending any message. I know that sounds. 108 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,080 Speaker 1: Bad, but it doesn't sound bad because Michael was like 109 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,360 Speaker 1: when it came out, Michael was like, there's no way 110 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:49,479 Speaker 1: Matt would remember sending that because he was popping another 111 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:52,280 Speaker 1: bottle when we were leaving. Anyway, we're not, you know, 112 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: not making excuses. 113 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:58,239 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, So what happened was I saw I messaged 114 00:05:58,240 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 2: a girl and I asked her if she was single. 115 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,280 Speaker 2: But the story behind it is my mate showed me 116 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 2: her and he said, your sister and her follow each 117 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:07,479 Speaker 2: other and she follows you. Do you know her? And 118 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 2: then he goes, look, do you reckon? 119 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 1: You? 120 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:12,279 Speaker 2: Could you could message her for me and you know, 121 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:13,840 Speaker 2: put in a good word and tell her to message me. 122 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 2: And I was like, nah, man, like that's not I'm 123 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 2: not going to do that for you, and I'm engaged. Yeah, 124 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:20,360 Speaker 2: I mean, oh yeah, I just don't. It's not what 125 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:22,520 Speaker 2: it's not what I wanted to do. And then this 126 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 2: is cringe. But he did say you use your blue tick, 127 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 2: she'll message you back, and I was like, nah, man, 128 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 2: I'm not going to do that. And then I ended 129 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 2: up doing that when I was fucked off my head 130 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 2: at like three am, pissed as waking up the next day, 131 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 2: I realized that that is not a good idea. It's 132 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:44,120 Speaker 2: embarrassing for my fiance. It's embarrassing to my family, it's 133 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 2: embarrassing to my friends, it's embarrassing to her family, her friends. 134 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,160 Speaker 2: Most of all's embarrassing to the relationship. Like I don't 135 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 2: want to be someone in a relationship that does stuff 136 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:55,039 Speaker 2: like that, Like I'm not that sort of person, Like 137 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 2: I don't do stuff like that. I think at the moment, 138 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 2: I did it because because I was piersed. I know 139 00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 2: it's not an excuse and I'm not trying to make 140 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 2: any excuse, but the moment something like this came out, 141 00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:08,640 Speaker 2: they just jumped on it and they were just like, oh, 142 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 2: he's like this, this is like you know, I mean, 143 00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 2: cheat all this sort of stuff. But that's not what happened, 144 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:16,960 Speaker 2: and that's what has really like made me frustrated with 145 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 2: it all because I did live, did stay quiet on 146 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 2: socials about it. I didn't think that it was worth 147 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 2: addressing in that way, so I kept it quiet because 148 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 2: I wanted to do it like this where I could 149 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 2: actually talk raw and actually talk about it. But yeah, 150 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 2: I think that I'm not making excuses. It was the 151 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 2: wrong thing to do, But I feel like, yeah, it's 152 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:40,480 Speaker 2: embarrassed to Hammy, it's embarrassed me, it's embarrassed a relationship. 153 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:44,480 Speaker 1: The whole thing makes zero sense to me. So Matt 154 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 1: claims that he was so drunk he didn't know what 155 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 1: he was doing. Yet he managed to troll through a 156 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:53,000 Speaker 1: year's worth of this girl's photos to find a bikini 157 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 1: photo to reply to and ask if she had a boyfriend, 158 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: and why would he be so concerned about helping out 159 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 1: his friend at three am who wasn't even with him, 160 00:08:03,440 --> 00:08:06,280 Speaker 1: the same friend he told in person that he wasn't 161 00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 1: comfortable helping. Also, if he was just a wingman to 162 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 1: his friend, then why is Tammy so unhappy about it? 163 00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:14,480 Speaker 1: I just don't get how he thought any of this 164 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 1: would help his case at all, like going into explicit 165 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: detail of how absolutely shit faced he was and talking 166 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 1: about projectile vomiting. If anything, it just makes him look 167 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: even more guilty because obviously he was off his absolute 168 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: face and probably reverted back to his single days and thought, well, 169 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:32,520 Speaker 1: who can I tune while I'm off my face? And 170 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 1: even the fact that Anna was saying that she was 171 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 1: really annoyed by his behavior, I mean, what was she 172 00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:42,079 Speaker 1: annoyed about? The whole conversation completely contradicts itself, and I 173 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 1: think Matt needs to provide the screenshots to this apparent 174 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 1: extended conversation because more receipts are definitely needed. There's a 175 00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: difference between showing a screenshot, which this woman did, and 176 00:08:52,880 --> 00:08:55,080 Speaker 1: then Matt saying, oh no, this is actually what was 177 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:57,440 Speaker 1: said and reading it out like why not back it 178 00:08:57,520 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 1: up with a screenshot. There were a lot of influence 179 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:03,680 Speaker 1: of whatchdog accounts who originally posted the screenshots of these 180 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 1: messages and then removed them. I think So Dramatic is 181 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 1: one of the only media publications to have actually published 182 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:12,199 Speaker 1: the screenshots, and I think that there were some concerns 183 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:18,360 Speaker 1: over these screenshots not being verified or you know, going suit. Yeah, 184 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 1: and all Matt has done now is verify that those 185 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:24,400 Speaker 1: messages were true. There was so much mixed messaging going 186 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:26,880 Speaker 1: on in this episode, because Matt kept saying that he 187 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,320 Speaker 1: was in the wrong and had learned his lesson, but 188 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 1: then denied cheating. And then Anna backed up what sounded 189 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 1: like admissions of guilt, saying it had been a big 190 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 1: learning curve for Matt, and she told him that he 191 00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:40,280 Speaker 1: shouldn't have any contact with women. I thought it was 192 00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:42,840 Speaker 1: a bit hypocritical how Matt and Anna kept using Matt 193 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:45,600 Speaker 1: being drunk as an excuse, but then they would be like, oh, 194 00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 1: alcohol isn't an excuse, and he takes full responsibility. Yeah. 195 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:51,600 Speaker 1: They decided to bring up other instances where Matt had 196 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 1: lost control whilst he was binge drinking. So Matt shared 197 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:57,960 Speaker 1: one night after drinking, he fell through the glass door 198 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: of his house, causing his roommates go to call the police. 199 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 1: And he also spoke about how after Anna's thirtieth he 200 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 1: woke up on a street off Chapel Street and his 201 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: phone had been stolen and he didn't know where he was. 202 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 1: It's not really a good look when he's wanting to 203 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:15,079 Speaker 1: grow up and get engaged and join this woman who 204 00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 1: has three kids. It's not particularly what you would expect 205 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 1: of a husband, but it's also just highlighting that he 206 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:24,559 Speaker 1: obviously gets drunk and does stupid things. Yeah. Yeah, I 207 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,280 Speaker 1: don't know what it was actually proving. It's clear that 208 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:30,120 Speaker 1: Matt has a lot to lose in this situation and 209 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 1: he thought that he could easily change the narrative by 210 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: jumping on his podcast. But for me personally, I think 211 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,439 Speaker 1: he's just made the situation worse because all it's done 212 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:43,440 Speaker 1: is confirmed that he did in fact message this woman 213 00:10:43,559 --> 00:10:46,480 Speaker 1: and that Tammy isn't happy about it, so much so 214 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:49,880 Speaker 1: that he said that they're actually in counseling overall. And 215 00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 1: I think this was the real cherry on top. Is 216 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,120 Speaker 1: there anything else that you want to say, Matt? 217 00:10:56,480 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd like to, officially, in front of everyoneologize to Tammy. 218 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:06,600 Speaker 2: I am sorry that I did that. I really do 219 00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 2: love you and I can't wait to spend the rest 220 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:10,320 Speaker 2: of my life with you. 221 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:14,640 Speaker 1: This apology made it very clear that things are not 222 00:11:14,840 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 1: okay between Matt and Tammy, and it sounded like he 223 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:21,959 Speaker 1: was begging for her forgiveness on a public platform. Anna 224 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:24,920 Speaker 1: even made a comment that they are often teething issues 225 00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 1: at the start of relationships that either make or break them. 226 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 1: But I think we're forgetting they are engaged to be 227 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: married this year. Yes, they've only been together for a 228 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 1: couple of months, but this situation makes a complete mockery 229 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,480 Speaker 1: of the seriousness of this whole relationship. I'm also confused 230 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 1: why he used his podcast as a forum to air 231 00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:47,520 Speaker 1: this conversation, because to me, I mean, I assume he's 232 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 1: trying to say, Oh, I'm being upfront and I'm letting 233 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 1: everyone know and I'm trying to shoot down these rumors, 234 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 1: But it kind of seemed like he was just using 235 00:11:55,160 --> 00:11:58,199 Speaker 1: it for views because neither Tammy or Matt had commented 236 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 1: on the situation until now. I just think it was 237 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 1: the wrong move. I think you should have just said 238 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:05,480 Speaker 1: nothing and the story would have died. Yeah. I just 239 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:08,360 Speaker 1: feel so bad for Tammy in this situation because they 240 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:11,439 Speaker 1: kept referencing how embarrassing it was for her and her 241 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 1: family and friends, and it really is a complete and 242 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 1: utter shit show. Can you imagine how mad she must 243 00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 1: have been considering the timing of all of this. So 244 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,760 Speaker 1: she's having to defend their relationship while she's on a 245 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 1: press tour for her new book, and it's just giving 246 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:28,320 Speaker 1: all of the hater's ammunition to use against her as well. 247 00:12:28,360 --> 00:12:30,960 Speaker 1: She's been very defensive in her comments when people have 248 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:34,680 Speaker 1: called out this new relationship. Before we get into the 249 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:36,920 Speaker 1: next story, we want to issue a trigger warning as 250 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:39,920 Speaker 1: we do discuss issues surrounding suicide. 251 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 2: Having escaped the lines, dean mister Lhrman made the mistake 252 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 2: of coming back. 253 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 1: For his heat. On Monday, fifty thousand people tuned in 254 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 1: live on YouTube to discover Bruce Lehman had lost his 255 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:56,319 Speaker 1: multi million dollar defamation case against Network ten and journalist 256 00:12:56,400 --> 00:13:00,040 Speaker 1: Lisa Wilkinson. The judge rule that Ten had upheld the 257 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 1: truth defense, with Justice Michael Lee finding that on the 258 00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:07,440 Speaker 1: balance of probabilities Lherman did rate Britney Higgins at Parliament 259 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 1: House in twenty nineteen. Is likely Lherman will be left 260 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 1: of foot ten and Wilkinson's legal bill, but the price 261 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 1: is far more than financial. This case has ruined reputations, 262 00:13:18,679 --> 00:13:22,960 Speaker 1: cost people their careers, pitted media organizations against each other, 263 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:28,000 Speaker 1: and raised important questions about media ethics and paid interviews. Amy. 264 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 1: This case has so many twists and turns. The most 265 00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: scandalous being the revelations made by former seven Spotlight producer 266 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 1: Taylor Auerback. Yeah, it is really easy to see why 267 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: this case has captivated the public. Two weeks ago, Taylor 268 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:46,559 Speaker 1: Aurback sent shockwaves through the media when he made explosive 269 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 1: claims in the Federal Court about the length Seven allegedly 270 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:52,920 Speaker 1: went to to secure an interview with Bruce Lherman for 271 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:57,200 Speaker 1: its flagship current affairs show Spotlight. So this interview aired 272 00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty three, and it revealed a secret record 273 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:04,600 Speaker 1: between Britney Higgins and Lisa Wilkinson. So, in this leaked audio, 274 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 1: Lisa and Brittany discussed the best approach for Britney's upcoming 275 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:11,439 Speaker 1: interview on the project in which she alleged she was 276 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 1: raped by Bruce Lherman in Parliament House. Now, when this 277 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 1: Spotlight interview aired with Bruce Lherman, many viewers were shocked 278 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: by this leak recording, with some concerns that it appeared 279 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: that Lisa Wilkinson had coached Higgins on answers ahead of 280 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 1: the interview. So this Spotlight story prompted a turn in 281 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 1: public perception and many believed that perhaps they'd gotten it 282 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:35,440 Speaker 1: wrong and that Bruce Lherman was the victim. Now, following 283 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 1: the Spotlight interview, Lherman commenced defamation proceedings against Network ten 284 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:44,680 Speaker 1: and Lisa Wilkinson, which have completely backfired. Many are describing 285 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 1: his decision to do so as him scoring an own goal. Now, 286 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 1: the Spotlight producer Taylor hour Back emerged as a surprise 287 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: witness in the defamation trial and dropped some massive bombs 288 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: that have left the Seven Network reeling. So he claimed 289 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 1: that seven tens of thousands of dollars for massages, drugs, 290 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: sex workers and accommodation for Lherman in an attempt to 291 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 1: get him to speak exclusively to its current affairs show Spotlight. 292 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 1: His testimony has huge ramifications for the Seven Network and 293 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:17,560 Speaker 1: it really did give an insight into the length that 294 00:15:17,640 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: some media organizations will allegedly go to secure an interview. 295 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 1: It really didn't that got so many people talking, and 296 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:30,120 Speaker 1: Seven have denied reimbursing Lherman for illegal drugs and sex workers, 297 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:34,320 Speaker 1: but Taylor Auerbach has left the floodgates open, with more 298 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: accusations against the network emerging. So late last week, the 299 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 1: Sydney Morning Herald and Age ran with a front page 300 00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 1: story accusing the network of yet another expensive scandal, So 301 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,760 Speaker 1: this time it involved the morning show Sunrise. The newspaper 302 00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 1: alleged that back in twenty fourteen, a senior female reporter 303 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:55,600 Speaker 1: for the Sydney Morning Herald had contacted seven's then commercial 304 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: director Bruce McWilliam regarding an investigation she was conducting into 305 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: former Sunrise executive producer Michael Pell. So she questioned Mick 306 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:07,920 Speaker 1: william about claims Seven had quietly engaged a law firm 307 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 1: to probe allegations of fraud connected to Sunrise and some 308 00:16:11,400 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 1: of its employees. Now, these claims were around a much 309 00:16:14,920 --> 00:16:19,080 Speaker 1: publicized trip Sunrise made to La. The newspaper was investigating 310 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,280 Speaker 1: whether three Sunrise employees and a small number of friends 311 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:25,800 Speaker 1: and family had misused travel benefits provided to them by 312 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 1: Quantas and the Core Hotels. Now what's interested a lot 313 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,800 Speaker 1: of people is not the actual claims the newspaper was 314 00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 1: initially investigating. But how seven handled this matter. So seven's 315 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 1: then commercial director Bruce McWilliam is accused of firing off 316 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: the following message to the journalists. When confronted by the claims, 317 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 1: he wrote, this is what your unfounded reports have caused 318 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 1: Michael to do. Attached to The email was a photo 319 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:54,440 Speaker 1: of this Sunrise executive producer in a hospital gown, covered 320 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:56,840 Speaker 1: in blood with a large cut on his forehead. The 321 00:16:56,880 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 1: email continued, why don't you keep it up so he 322 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:02,280 Speaker 1: kills himself? If you are a complete disgrace, that law 323 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:05,719 Speaker 1: firm you name didn't conduct any investigation. If you publish 324 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:09,119 Speaker 1: unentree allegations and he tops himself, it's on you. We 325 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: are determined to protect him. Now. The kicker in this 326 00:17:12,520 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 1: is that the newspaper claims that Seven's Bruce McWilliam distributed 327 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 1: the image without Pell's knowledge, and it had actually been 328 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: taken several weeks earlier and was not the result of 329 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:26,080 Speaker 1: self harm but an accident. Now, Mick william has since 330 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:30,360 Speaker 1: labeled the media reporting around the incident as a pylon. Now, 331 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 1: what is referring to is the fact that nine owns 332 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 1: the Sydney Morning Herald and the Age and nine are 333 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: of course Seven's biggest rivals when it comes to ratings, 334 00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:42,639 Speaker 1: and it appears the gloves off, which I'm personally thoroughly 335 00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:45,080 Speaker 1: enjoying it. I have heard a lot of other journalists 336 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 1: say that they have just been living for this coverage 337 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:50,840 Speaker 1: because it has been so scandalous, and it has also 338 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 1: raised so many questions about journalism ethics. Now. The judge 339 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,439 Speaker 1: presiding over the case pointed out that none of the 340 00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 1: journalists involved in the story were part of them a union, 341 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 1: and he was confused why adhering to the code of 342 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 1: ethics was so difficult for many. So, according to the 343 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 1: Media Code of Ethics, journalists should report and interpret honestly, 344 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 1: strive for accuracy, fairness, and disclosure of all essential facts, 345 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 1: and not allow personal interests, belief, commitment, payment, gift or 346 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:24,600 Speaker 1: benefit to undermine your accuracy, fairness or independent. This is 347 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 1: what utterly confused me, because when we worked in the 348 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 1: Channel seven newsroom in Adelaide under news director Terry Plane, 349 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:36,680 Speaker 1: money was never exchanged for an interview. That was something that, yes, 350 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: some commercial networks did do, more so in a current 351 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,960 Speaker 1: affairs programs, but for a nightly news service, this is 352 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 1: something that was very frowned upon and was not done well. 353 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:50,840 Speaker 1: What's murky here is that seven didn't say, oh, here, Lehman, 354 00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 1: here's two hundred thousand K we want you to do 355 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,199 Speaker 1: this interview. The way they've done it is they've paid 356 00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:58,000 Speaker 1: for his rent. So they paid one hundred and four 357 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: thousand dollars towards his rent, and it's also been accused, 358 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 1: which seven have denied, that they also paid for cocaine 359 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 1: and sex workers, which is just so utterly against the 360 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 1: code of ethics, it's against any moral standing. So the 361 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:15,760 Speaker 1: issue here is that they've somehow worked out this gifting 362 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 1: system to try and get him to speak on camera. 363 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:21,200 Speaker 1: And what's really disturbing about this is when you start 364 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,200 Speaker 1: paying somebody for interviews, one, it should be disclosed to 365 00:19:25,240 --> 00:19:27,959 Speaker 1: the public that this person has been paid, because it 366 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,360 Speaker 1: does skew your opinion of what they're saying. Well, particularly 367 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:34,240 Speaker 1: in this case when he has been accused of rape 368 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:37,720 Speaker 1: and a network is literally paying for him to visit 369 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:40,399 Speaker 1: sex workers. I mean, it's not a very good look 370 00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:43,760 Speaker 1: and it just reiterates people's feelings towards here. And what's 371 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:48,480 Speaker 1: so disturbing is this Spotlight Report was actually nominated for 372 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:51,040 Speaker 1: a Walkley Award. It was shortlisted for one, and part 373 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:54,160 Speaker 1: of the criteria states that entrants need to disclose any 374 00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 1: payments or gifts exchange for access. So this nomination has 375 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 1: now been revoked. But this show is meant to be 376 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:03,520 Speaker 1: the top of the top current affairs show it's not 377 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:05,880 Speaker 1: a current affair, It's not today tonight. This is meant 378 00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 1: to be the flagship current affairs program. How is anybody 379 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: meant to take it seriously? After all of these allegations 380 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:15,800 Speaker 1: have come out, This is the program that is meant 381 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 1: to expose injustices. It almost seems like there needs to 382 00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:22,560 Speaker 1: be a spotlight program on Spotlight. This story makes me 383 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:26,879 Speaker 1: feel for female producers and journalists because it's quite clear 384 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 1: that this is all a boy's game. Particularly with this story, 385 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 1: it would have been very difficult for a female producer 386 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:36,199 Speaker 1: and reporter to be able to build any sort of 387 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:40,240 Speaker 1: rapport with Bruce in an ethical way. I mean, it's 388 00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:44,520 Speaker 1: clear that this producer was tasked with becoming friends with 389 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:47,120 Speaker 1: this guy. He went out drinking with him, They went 390 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 1: out to expensive meals where they had ridiculously priced steak. 391 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,680 Speaker 1: He got to a position where Bruce felt comfortable enough 392 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: to discuss sex workers with him. I just can't imagine 393 00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,920 Speaker 1: this being a possibility for a woman to get this scoop. Yeah, 394 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:03,400 Speaker 1: but thank goodness it wasn't. I mean, can you imagine 395 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:06,119 Speaker 1: the uproar if seven had put a female produce, if 396 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:08,800 Speaker 1: they had tasked her with the role of getting this 397 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 1: interview over the line. I think what isn't being discussed though, 398 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,120 Speaker 1: is if the roles were turned and it was a female, 399 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:17,200 Speaker 1: there would have been a lot more outrage about how 400 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 1: seven treated their work. And this was still a very 401 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 1: confronting situation for Taylor Outback. He messaged his boss saying, 402 00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:27,719 Speaker 1: this is fucked. Yeah, But I mean, I personally think 403 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:30,520 Speaker 1: that maybe I'm may even saying this, but I feel 404 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:33,600 Speaker 1: like a lot of female producers and reporters would have 405 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,119 Speaker 1: refused to act in this manner, and I think that 406 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: they would have been questioning it. I don't know. I 407 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:44,199 Speaker 1: think that in the journalism world often, I mean you 408 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:46,400 Speaker 1: can probably think back. There are times where I think 409 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 1: if things that I have done that maybe I'm uncomfortable 410 00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:51,280 Speaker 1: and probably wouldn't do now in order to get a story, 411 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:53,880 Speaker 1: because you are pushed, you are rewarded. You know, you're 412 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:56,159 Speaker 1: told to God above and beyond, we need this scoop. 413 00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:58,600 Speaker 1: And this is what this guy, Taylor Alback did. He 414 00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:02,399 Speaker 1: got the interview that his bosses had tasked him to get. 415 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 1: It's funny because I thought it was such a good 416 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:07,200 Speaker 1: get and a big story to get. I mean, they 417 00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:11,920 Speaker 1: were rewarded with this Walkley nomination. However, it is completely 418 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:15,480 Speaker 1: blown up in their faces. And I mean Channel seven 419 00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 1: had a bad reputation before this, but this story has 420 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 1: just cemented and brought that home even more well. There 421 00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:25,240 Speaker 1: has been a lot of discussion whether this bad publicity 422 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 1: will impact on seven's revenue, and sadly, I don't think 423 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: it will. I read a piece in the AFI recently 424 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 1: and it said that because seven has the rights of 425 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 1: the football, a lot of people in the know don't 426 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,359 Speaker 1: believe that it will affect their advertising because people just 427 00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: go where the eyeballs are, so advertisers are going to 428 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,159 Speaker 1: keep their money at Channel seven purely based on it 429 00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 1: having the AFL rights. I wonder if it means that 430 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,479 Speaker 1: audiences will switch off, though, because we're already seeing a 431 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:56,040 Speaker 1: decline in the number of viewers who are tuning in 432 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: to nightly news programs. Obviously, a lot of these news 433 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:03,040 Speaker 1: organized have huge social media networks, so that's also where 434 00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:06,200 Speaker 1: they're able to tap into maybe a younger demographic online. 435 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:08,879 Speaker 1: But I do think that a lot of young people 436 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:11,439 Speaker 1: hold a lot of resentment towards Channel seven and they 437 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:14,240 Speaker 1: don't particularly want to tune in well That's what some 438 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 1: media insiders were saying that it's a really bad timing 439 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:19,400 Speaker 1: because a lot of the free to air networks they're 440 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 1: having to compete against streaming giants like stan and Netflix, 441 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 1: and it's really not a good look. I mean, as 442 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 1: we said, this is meant to be Channel seven's flagship program. 443 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: I don't know how this show can continue. I think 444 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:34,680 Speaker 1: they're going to have to dump it. They're going to 445 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 1: have to do a total rebrand because at the moment, 446 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 1: this show has no credibility. I think it's really sad 447 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,399 Speaker 1: because it just gives all journalists a bad name. And 448 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,719 Speaker 1: I want, you know, people who are listening to know 449 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: that all journalists don't conduct themselves in this manner. I mean, 450 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,840 Speaker 1: I think we recently saw with Lisa Wilkinson and the 451 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: recent defamation case that they were able to use the 452 00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:59,639 Speaker 1: truth defense in their favor. And I think that she 453 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 1: highlight someone who is a good journalist, who is worthy 454 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 1: of helping someone tell their story. And that's the thing. 455 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:09,640 Speaker 1: Seven is not a reflection of what every other networker 456 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:11,680 Speaker 1: is doing. They are amazing journalists out There are a 457 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: lot of great journalists, for example working at the ABC 458 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,520 Speaker 1: in particular, who do it here to the Media Code 459 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 1: of Ethics, and I think the issue is a cultural one. 460 00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:25,600 Speaker 3: At seven today, my todd there is one in cereal 461 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 3: for breakfast again, so I decided to make some cinnamon 462 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 3: toast crunch since that's my husband's favorite cereal and the 463 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 3: kids have never had it. 464 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:37,119 Speaker 1: On Thursday, TikTok and Nara Smith announced the arrival of 465 00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:40,440 Speaker 1: her third child with husband Lucky Smith. The video has 466 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:44,479 Speaker 1: already attracted over seventeen million views, and as expected, the 467 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:48,119 Speaker 1: Internet is losing their minds over the unusual baby name. Now, Kate, 468 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:50,439 Speaker 1: can you tell us the name? Well, the name is 469 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,280 Speaker 1: Whimsy Lou Smith, and I think it would have been 470 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:56,919 Speaker 1: more surprising if Nara and Lucky'd actually picked something more traditional, 471 00:24:57,440 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 1: seeing as their three year old daughter is called Rumbull 472 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,760 Speaker 1: Honey and their two year old son is called Slim Easy. 473 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 1: Lucky also has a daughter from his previous marriage with 474 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:10,240 Speaker 1: model Stormy bre called Gravity Blue, so Whimsy Louse Smith 475 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,439 Speaker 1: goes quite well with all of their names. What do 476 00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 1: you guys think about it? So? Is this a girl's name? Yes, 477 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 1: it is a girl. I don't think listeners will be 478 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:20,840 Speaker 1: surprised to know that I'm not a fan of these 479 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:25,440 Speaker 1: unusual names. I really like traditional names. However, as you say, Kate, 480 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:28,000 Speaker 1: I think it would have been odd if this child 481 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,840 Speaker 1: had just been called Sarah or Jane. I mean, she 482 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 1: would have felt a little bit left out. And the 483 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:34,760 Speaker 1: names all sort of kind of go together in a 484 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:36,879 Speaker 1: cute way. The first thing that springs to mind is 485 00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 1: how difficult would this be to get personalized stuff? You 486 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 1: know how they do like Christmas stockings with kids' names 487 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,680 Speaker 1: on it getting rumballed. They have unusual ones. Now when 488 00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 1: I go and look, there's all these very highly unusual 489 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:49,800 Speaker 1: names that we would have never seen as kids growing up. 490 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 1: Surely not whimsy. Yeah, but these days, with Etsy, you 491 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: can just get everything customized now. In December, Nara did 492 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,200 Speaker 1: drop some clues, so she shared a video that went 493 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 1: viral of the names that she but wouldn't be choosing, 494 00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 1: which included bubble, Pepper, Cherry, and Frosty. I think Frosty 495 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 1: would have been bloody hilarious. Is that like Frosty the Snowman? 496 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: Or is that related to the cereals cereal will Someone 497 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,000 Speaker 1: suggested arple bottom jeans because she said apple was a 498 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,960 Speaker 1: bit taste. Quite ironic that their last name is Smith 499 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 1: because you can't get any more basic than Smith. So 500 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,159 Speaker 1: perhaps that's why they've got to have a bit of 501 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:24,480 Speaker 1: fun with their first names. 502 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:25,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. 503 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 1: Well, I do feel like the name Whimsy really does 504 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 1: tie into Nara's personal brand of soft living and home baking. 505 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:34,760 Speaker 1: It's very delicate and whimsical, and just like all her 506 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:38,320 Speaker 1: other baby names, it's also very unique because people have 507 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 1: been looking into it, and apparently the name Whimsy has 508 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,840 Speaker 1: never been given to five or more babies in a 509 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 1: single year in the US. I think that is set 510 00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:48,119 Speaker 1: to change, though. I feel like there are going to 511 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,440 Speaker 1: be so many whimsies now that Nara Smith has called 512 00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 1: her daughter that. Oh you're trying to give us a hint, Kate, 513 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,240 Speaker 1: are we going to have Whimsy Turner coming out in 514 00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 1: a couple of weeks. Kate's having a boy, Well, it 515 00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:00,680 Speaker 1: could be a boy maybe maybe Rumble instead. It did 516 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 1: make Will Rumbles the girl as well, but it did 517 00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 1: make me reflect, I mean, slim easy. Definitely not going 518 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,400 Speaker 1: with that one. I think that's slimmed in her pat now. 519 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,480 Speaker 1: On Tuesday, Nara shared of log of her morning routine 520 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:13,639 Speaker 1: with a one week old Now. For those who aren't 521 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:17,360 Speaker 1: familiar with her content. She has over five million TikTok followers, 522 00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:20,480 Speaker 1: and she's known as being a Mormon trad wife. So 523 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,879 Speaker 1: in her videos she'll often say, Oh, my kids really 524 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:27,560 Speaker 1: wanted X for breakfast, and I made it. However, she 525 00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 1: doesn't just go and pour a bowl of cereal for 526 00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,400 Speaker 1: her daughter. She will make the cereal from scratch. It's 527 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,639 Speaker 1: actually insane. So in this flog you'll be happy to 528 00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,240 Speaker 1: know that she didn't make cereal from scratch. She made 529 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,240 Speaker 1: herself what she described as a very simple breakfast, and 530 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 1: to be fair, it was pretty simple for her. It 531 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,680 Speaker 1: was avocado and tomato on toast. Of course, she had 532 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:50,760 Speaker 1: to have olive oil, sea salt and pickled onions on top. 533 00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 1: Fortunately they did have lunch out in and out burger, 534 00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,880 Speaker 1: which was a relief because another theme in her TikTok 535 00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,840 Speaker 1: content is she'll be like, oh, my husband really wanted 536 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,320 Speaker 1: oreomic flurry, so I made him one from scratch. I'd 537 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: like to think that this is just for TikTok, though, 538 00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 1: and this doesn't normally happen. Well, you would hope that 539 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 1: this wasn't a regular occurrence in her house. Even though 540 00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:15,879 Speaker 1: her content is so unrelatable, She was actually praised to 541 00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:18,840 Speaker 1: have been quite relatable in this new vlog because she 542 00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:21,719 Speaker 1: showed herself going about her morning routine and you can 543 00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 1: actually see her wearing an adult diaper, like a maternity 544 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:26,720 Speaker 1: diper in it, and everyone was like, oh my god, 545 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 1: that is just incredible. You sounds so American diaper. Just 546 00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 1: days out from releasing her new album, Taylor Swift casually 547 00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:44,479 Speaker 1: dropped by Coachella. She managed to steal the show without 548 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 1: singing a single note. I still can't get my head 549 00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 1: around the fact that she was just there dancing in 550 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:52,280 Speaker 1: the crowd with Travis Kelsey as if she was just 551 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 1: a nobody. Yeah, she was clearly in some sort of 552 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,560 Speaker 1: VIP section, but I almost feel like Taylor Swift is 553 00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,240 Speaker 1: bigger than a VIP. I think that it's just weird 554 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:05,040 Speaker 1: to even think that some nobodies who probably spoke their 555 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,120 Speaker 1: way into getting VIP passes were able to rub shoulders 556 00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 1: with her. I have seen a few fan photos come 557 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 1: out of her at Coachella. I am happy though, that 558 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: she could just get out there and enjoy it like 559 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 1: a normal person, or a relatively normal person. Look Sophie, 560 00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:21,760 Speaker 1: I don't think they were complete nobody's in this VIP section, 561 00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 1: Justin Bieber was one of the people in there. I 562 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,200 Speaker 1: didn't even recognize him. There's a video going viral on 563 00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,400 Speaker 1: TikTok at the moment and it firstly shows Justin and 564 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: then pans to Taylor. But I only realized it was 565 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 1: him because of the comments. People were like, is that 566 00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,720 Speaker 1: Justin Bieber? What did everyone think about what they were wearing? 567 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 1: I like that she was just casually dressed. She was 568 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,840 Speaker 1: wearing a baseball cap with Travis Kelsey's podcast logo Honor, 569 00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 1: which was a really nice touch. And there is just 570 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,160 Speaker 1: such a clear distinction between celebrities and influencers at Coachella. 571 00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 1: We saw this last year because whilst influencers are trying 572 00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:58,040 Speaker 1: to attract a lot of attention by wearing really out 573 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,680 Speaker 1: their outfits, it sort of deemed a bit lame by celebrities. 574 00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 1: They just want to go to the concert, they don't 575 00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,120 Speaker 1: want anyone to hassle them, and I think it is 576 00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:09,480 Speaker 1: a real way of them showing they're a tear above influences. 577 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:12,680 Speaker 1: Talking about hats, I love Travis Kelsey's Happy Gilmore hat. 578 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 1: I thought he looked really cool. Well, he's been trolled 579 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:17,920 Speaker 1: for what he was wearing Amy, So everyone was saying 580 00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:20,479 Speaker 1: that what seems to have happened is that they were 581 00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: sitting on the couch at her La mansion and they said, oh, 582 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: should we get the private jet and go down to Coachella. 583 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,480 Speaker 1: And everyone's joking that he just grabbed in the dark 584 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:31,880 Speaker 1: some random pieces of clothing and put it together. So 585 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,120 Speaker 1: you're probably one of the only people Amy that think 586 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,800 Speaker 1: that his outfit was cool. I tend to agree with Amy. 587 00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 1: I like the fact that it looked like they didn't 588 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,400 Speaker 1: really care what they were wearing. They just looked like 589 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:42,480 Speaker 1: they wanted to go down there and have fun. And 590 00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:44,680 Speaker 1: it was clear that Taylor was having a good time 591 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,560 Speaker 1: because she was spotted singing along to her own song 592 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,400 Speaker 1: Karma during Ice Spices set. I love that everyone keeps 593 00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:54,360 Speaker 1: catching her singing and miming to her own songs. It 594 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 1: actually happened another time, so she was caught on video 595 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,320 Speaker 1: singing along to Cruel Summer. However she didn't really it 596 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:04,400 Speaker 1: was the remix edition, so suddenly it stops and she's 597 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 1: still singing and she's looking around like what the fuck. 598 00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 1: My favorite moment on TikTok was when Ice Spice appears 599 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 1: to be third willing Travis and Taylor, so she's just 600 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 1: shown in the background smoking a joint as they're just 601 00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:17,920 Speaker 1: off in their own little world. Dantzig, Well, I think 602 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:19,480 Speaker 1: that's where we're going to end it. Thank you for 603 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 1: listening to another episode of Outspoken. If you did enjoy it, 604 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:24,800 Speaker 1: we'd love if you could go and leave us a 605 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:28,280 Speaker 1: five star review because it really does help out the show. Also, 606 00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:30,160 Speaker 1: if you want to hear a little bit more from us, 607 00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 1: please make sure you do subscribe to Outspoken Plus we 608 00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 1: do drop episodes every Wednesday. This episode was recorded on 609 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 1: the traditional land of the Ghana people of the Adelaide Planes. 610 00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:42,800 Speaker 1: We pay respect to elders past and present.