WEBVTT - John Worsfold - Ordineroli Speaking 0:00:05.280 --> 0:00:09.080 Ordinarily Speaking, I wouldn't be giving such an in depth 0:00:09.360 --> 0:00:14.160 chat about myself and my story, but hopefully some of 0:00:14.200 --> 0:00:16.799 the challenges of face will help other people. 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:31.880 To Hello and welcome to Ordinarily Speaking, a podcast that 0:00:32.000 --> 0:00:36.280 celebrates resilience in sport. I'm Narrowly Meadows and my guest 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:40.800 today is former AFL coach and player John Warsfold, or 0:00:40.920 --> 0:00:44.199 Usher as he's known. Usher has taken on some of 0:00:44.240 --> 0:00:48.360 the most challenging coaching jobs in footy. He enjoyed testing 0:00:48.440 --> 0:00:51.000 times at West Coast, took on a role at Adelaide 0:00:51.040 --> 0:00:54.760 following the death of their coach and his mate Phil Walsh, 0:00:54.800 --> 0:00:56.720 and he put his hand up for the job of 0:00:56.760 --> 0:01:00.160 guiding Essendon out of the most tumultuous period in the 0:01:00.160 --> 0:01:04.720 club's history, the aftermath of the supplement scandal. The Premiership 0:01:04.720 --> 0:01:08.280 player and coach's meticulous dedication to the job has at 0:01:08.319 --> 0:01:11.319 times been tough on his wife and kids. In the 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:14.080 more recent years of his coaching career, he lived in 0:01:14.120 --> 0:01:18.120 a different state to his family altogether. In this episode 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:21.640 of Ordinarily Speaking, the man known as Wusher speaks candidly 0:01:21.680 --> 0:01:24.920 about the true toll of a nineteen year coaching career 0:01:25.040 --> 0:01:28.240 in the AFL we met at his house in Perth. 0:01:28.319 --> 0:01:30.920 The only footy photo in view a pick of he 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:35.280 and his premiership teammate Chris Mainwaring, who died suddenly in 0:01:35.280 --> 0:01:38.960 two thousand and seven. As always, please remember if this 0:01:39.080 --> 0:01:41.920 chat is triggering for you, there is help out there. 0:01:42.280 --> 0:01:45.480 Beyond Blue and Lifeline are just a couple of places 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:48.280 you can go. I hope you enjoyed this chat with 0:01:48.360 --> 0:02:07.160 a man who generally prefers silence fashion well, thanks very 0:02:07.240 --> 0:02:10.080 much for joining me. I've spoken to a few of 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:12.000 your mates and a few of the players that you've 0:02:12.120 --> 0:02:14.840 coached in the build up to this. I've got to 0:02:14.840 --> 0:02:17.480 say each and every one of them were surprised that 0:02:17.520 --> 0:02:20.639 you've agreed to do it, which begs the question why 0:02:20.720 --> 0:02:22.640 have you agreed to come on? 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:28.600 I don't know. I mean when you asked me and 0:02:28.680 --> 0:02:32.920 you explained to me what it's about, I thought, why not. 0:02:33.480 --> 0:02:37.120 Now I'm not hiding anything. I get the feeling that 0:02:37.160 --> 0:02:40.040 it's about helping people. It's not about me telling my story. 0:02:40.080 --> 0:02:43.519 It's about hopefully people taking something out that helps them, 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:46.560 so that would be the reason I'm doing it. I mean, 0:02:46.560 --> 0:02:48.720 if it was just about tell us about your life 0:02:48.720 --> 0:02:50.760 and how good you are. I probably wouldn't have but 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:56.320 to talk about working through some of the pretty intense 0:02:56.360 --> 0:02:59.240 situations I've been through, and I feel like I've come 0:02:59.280 --> 0:03:01.760 out of them still pretty sane and cope pretty well. 0:03:01.760 --> 0:03:04.560 If I can share some of those strategies, then that'd 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:04.920 be great. 0:03:05.520 --> 0:03:08.720 From mates two players you've coached, the one thing that 0:03:08.800 --> 0:03:12.480 kept coming up is that you can sustain a silence 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:15.639 better than anyone. That you are a steel trap, a 0:03:15.720 --> 0:03:17.920 king of the awkward silence, are the best person ever 0:03:18.000 --> 0:03:20.639 to force you to talk by not saying anything at all. 0:03:20.919 --> 0:03:22.320 Is that a fair assessment? 0:03:22.919 --> 0:03:23.440 Probably? 0:03:23.560 --> 0:03:28.120 Yeah, Yeah, I suppose My nature is an introvert. 0:03:28.520 --> 0:03:29.480 I like to listen. 0:03:29.880 --> 0:03:34.440 Obviously, while I'm listening, I'm thinking, and I will not 0:03:34.600 --> 0:03:39.480 really give a response unless I'm absolutely comfortable in terms 0:03:39.480 --> 0:03:41.880 of the trust I have with that person. And you know, 0:03:41.960 --> 0:03:44.200 that's been a good thing for me, but it's probably 0:03:44.240 --> 0:03:46.880 also been a tough thing to deal with at times 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:47.280 as well. 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:50.640 Your wife, Georgina here, she's absolutely the opposite of that 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:52.640 and a real people person and super bubbly. 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:55.800 Yes, yeah, she's the one when we go to a 0:03:55.840 --> 0:03:58.920 football function and it's really like I'm at work. I 0:03:58.960 --> 0:04:02.280 suppose I'm trying to get out the door and say, look, 0:04:02.360 --> 0:04:05.240 we've done our bit, time to go, and there's at 0:04:05.360 --> 0:04:11.000 least thirty minutes of goodbyes. So yeah, Georgiana is very 0:04:11.080 --> 0:04:15.160 much comfortable mixing with people. She actually is now a 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:20.000 lifeline counselor, so she volunteers to do some of that work, 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:23.360 which she really enjoys. So she listens and has got 0:04:23.360 --> 0:04:24.159 that great nature. 0:04:24.320 --> 0:04:26.039 Tell me about your wife. What made you fall in 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:26.520 love with her? 0:04:27.160 --> 0:04:30.000 Well, I don't know. It was just an attraction of 0:04:30.520 --> 0:04:32.640 It's hard to say. I mean I met her at 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:36.320 a nightclub, so it wasn't like the greatest how we 0:04:36.400 --> 0:04:40.520 both feel in here, but I just felt something like 0:04:40.680 --> 0:04:44.200 as in I met her and then didn't see her 0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:46.159 again for a couple of months. I think, like the 0:04:46.200 --> 0:04:50.360 next day we were heading off on a players trip somewhere. Yeah, 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:53.279 I didn't really follow up at all. So was it 0:04:53.320 --> 0:04:56.479 your dance moves or it wouldn't have been that. No, 0:04:56.560 --> 0:04:59.200 there's no doubt about that. But maybe I look really sad. 0:04:59.240 --> 0:05:01.039 I've got a feeling we just lost the ninety one 0:05:01.120 --> 0:05:06.160 Grand Final, so yeah, maybe I was opening around, but yeah, anyway, 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:08.120 I just followed up it would have been a couple 0:05:08.120 --> 0:05:11.000 of months later, and I think something happened where sort 0:05:11.000 --> 0:05:12.719 of offered to take her out for a meal and 0:05:12.720 --> 0:05:14.480 then she couldn't do it, And then I waited another 0:05:14.520 --> 0:05:19.120 couple of months before I fight up again. Anyway, then 0:05:19.160 --> 0:05:21.480 we managed to actually meet and have a chat and 0:05:22.080 --> 0:05:22.840 hit it off. 0:05:22.720 --> 0:05:24.479 And all these years on. What do you love about 0:05:24.480 --> 0:05:24.880 her now? 0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:28.320 Well, she's such a people person. She's always looking out 0:05:28.320 --> 0:05:29.760 for people. It's probably one of the things she has 0:05:29.800 --> 0:05:31.719 to be careful of that she doesn't burn herself out 0:05:32.040 --> 0:05:35.320 looking out for everyone else. But she's worked out that 0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:39.359 she believes she can help people through her ability to 0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:41.240 listen to them and get them to open up. And 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:44.839 so she took that on herself to do the Lifeline 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:48.080 counseling course, which is a pretty big commitment just to 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:51.200 be a volunteer for them. And you know, for me, 0:05:51.440 --> 0:05:54.800 that would be something that I couldn't do. But that's 0:05:54.800 --> 0:05:57.320 a natural thing for her and she feels like she's 0:05:57.320 --> 0:06:00.359 making a strong contribution to the community. You know, I 0:06:00.360 --> 0:06:02.200 think that's a really strong trait. 0:06:02.400 --> 0:06:04.359 Has she been that for you the sounding board? 0:06:05.040 --> 0:06:08.480 Yeah, you know, she's probably one person who can get 0:06:08.480 --> 0:06:09.400 me to talk a little bit. 0:06:09.400 --> 0:06:10.960 But even then I'm. 0:06:10.839 --> 0:06:14.240 Still fairly guarded. But yeah, I certainly go to her 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:17.080 for advice on different things and for someone to see 0:06:17.240 --> 0:06:20.240 something totally different than me. I asked Georgina House she 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:25.120 would see things or perceive things, and yeah, that's been awesome. 0:06:25.480 --> 0:06:29.599 How does she perceive your public persona and your press conferences? 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:30.640 What does she make of them? 0:06:31.279 --> 0:06:35.880 I think she knows. I'm just towing the line, the 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:40.000 club line, like supporting the club, supporting the players, never 0:06:40.040 --> 0:06:42.240 throw anyone under the bus, even if it was in 0:06:42.279 --> 0:06:46.320 the case of defend yourself first and don't support everyone else. 0:06:46.360 --> 0:06:48.920 It's like, no, I'm going to support everyone first. And that, 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:51.599 I would say, would be something that frustrates her at times, 0:06:51.640 --> 0:06:54.440 where she says, you should have stood up for yourself 0:06:54.480 --> 0:06:59.920 in that situation, and I would say, I'd gain nothing 0:07:00.120 --> 0:07:05.160 from trying to defend myself. My actions will always stand 0:07:05.279 --> 0:07:09.159 the test of time, not a once off criticism that 0:07:09.240 --> 0:07:11.720 someone wants to try and spark a reaction. 0:07:12.240 --> 0:07:14.160 It must be hard for a family, though, to sit 0:07:14.200 --> 0:07:15.520 back and watch it all unfold. 0:07:15.720 --> 0:07:17.920 Yeah, I would say that's the most stressful thing. I 0:07:17.920 --> 0:07:20.840 don't get stressed by the public or the media reaction. 0:07:21.040 --> 0:07:23.400 I would get stressed by how it's affected my family. 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:27.040 So when I come home, if Georgina or the kids 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:29.800 look out, they're just saying that person shouldn't have said that, 0:07:30.080 --> 0:07:33.480 or that was wrong. What they wrote there that affects 0:07:33.520 --> 0:07:35.960 you more than what was actually written, because I would 0:07:35.960 --> 0:07:39.320 say to them, it's just opinions. That just the industry. 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:43.040 Everyone's going to do that. Don't take it personally. But 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:46.000 they're more protective of me that I am of myself, 0:07:46.040 --> 0:07:48.840 I think, so I would say to look, what stresses 0:07:48.880 --> 0:07:52.080 me the most is what's happening. 0:07:51.760 --> 0:07:52.480 In my world. 0:07:52.560 --> 0:07:55.320 It's my work world, it's what's happening in my personal world, 0:07:55.360 --> 0:07:57.200 and if you guys are affected by it, then that 0:07:58.080 --> 0:08:02.840 makes me up tight and stressed, not what was actually written. 0:08:03.200 --> 0:08:05.120 Have you felt misunderstood over the years. 0:08:05.480 --> 0:08:07.680 I don't really feel like I've been misunderstood, but I 0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:10.080 don't think too many people have made an effort to 0:08:10.280 --> 0:08:13.760 understand me personally and then therefore. 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:18.200 How I work and how I operate. But that doesn't 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:18.560 fade me. 0:08:18.560 --> 0:08:20.720 I've made a decision when I started coaching that I 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:22.320 will do it on my own. I'm not going to 0:08:22.440 --> 0:08:26.200 form alliances with any media people. I told my first 0:08:26.240 --> 0:08:30.040 statement to all my friends that i'd created or built 0:08:30.120 --> 0:08:33.040 up in the media through my playing career. You know, 0:08:33.080 --> 0:08:36.720 anything on the record from then on, even off the record, has. 0:08:36.600 --> 0:08:37.760 To go through the football club. 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:40.800 You have to let them know that you want to 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:43.880 get a statement from me or talk to me. You 0:08:43.960 --> 0:08:46.120 can't just approach me direct, which they had done in 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:48.760 the past. Some took that really well. Some were a 0:08:48.760 --> 0:08:51.040 bit well, they made out they were offended by it. 0:08:51.120 --> 0:08:53.640 I just think they saw it was like, I thought 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:56.199 I had a really good in here. I've been working 0:08:56.200 --> 0:08:58.840 with you or alongside you closely for a number of years. 0:08:59.040 --> 0:09:01.080 Now you have seen your coach beautiful. That's going to 0:09:01.120 --> 0:09:01.720 help my job. 0:09:01.760 --> 0:09:04.680 But when I said to them, no, it's not, I 0:09:04.679 --> 0:09:06.839 think they felt like, well, that makes it a bit tougher. 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:10.360 But I stuck through that through my whole twenty years. 0:09:11.040 --> 0:09:15.280 Times I've seen other articles written some coaches. You get 0:09:15.280 --> 0:09:18.760 the feeling that they've had a journalist in the corner. 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:21.920 When someone attacks them, another journalist will write a really 0:09:22.000 --> 0:09:25.360 balanced piece for them. But I've chosen not to have 0:09:25.400 --> 0:09:27.600 that relationship and just do it on my own. So 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:31.600 that's part of maybe being misunderstood is that I've been 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:32.720 a bit more of a closed book. 0:09:33.120 --> 0:09:36.480 The moment that I worked out or decided that I'd 0:09:36.480 --> 0:09:38.640 really like to interview you in some sort of capacity. 0:09:38.679 --> 0:09:42.880 I was hosting the Coaches Awards in twenty nineteen and 0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:45.480 you got up at the end and kind of made 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:49.160 an impromptu speech. You were just there to give an 0:09:49.200 --> 0:09:51.360 award out and you decide to make a speech. Do 0:09:51.400 --> 0:09:54.480 you remember that speech and the realization you kind of 0:09:54.520 --> 0:09:55.280 had that night? 0:09:55.640 --> 0:09:59.200 I do remember, yeah, exactly what you're saying. I wasn't 0:09:59.200 --> 0:10:01.480 meant to give a sp each was basically just present 0:10:01.720 --> 0:10:05.240 the award, but Chris Fagan spoke, and a couple of 0:10:05.280 --> 0:10:08.160 the other people who had spoken. I was sitting there thinking, wow, 0:10:08.400 --> 0:10:11.520 it was just a realization for me, and I think, well, 0:10:11.520 --> 0:10:15.440 what I spoke about was, you know that football can 0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:19.840 just totally encompass all your thoughts to the point where 0:10:20.360 --> 0:10:23.000 when I thought of, you know, twenty years on from 0:10:23.080 --> 0:10:25.560 ninety ninety four, that was a twenty year reunion of 0:10:25.600 --> 0:10:29.480 our premiership, West Coast Premiership. Not that was my twenty 0:10:29.559 --> 0:10:35.319 year wedding anniversary, and when that football stuff overrides the 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:37.440 family personal stuff, it was a bit of a bit 0:10:37.480 --> 0:10:40.280 of a wake up call for me. Luckily, I still 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:45.600 did remember that it was my wedding anniversary. Yea, but yeah, 0:10:45.720 --> 0:10:47.839 thinking about oh, it's a big year this year, it's 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:51.079 twenty years since we won the flag. Not it's twenty 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:55.960 years since I got married. So, and there's various examples 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:59.760 of that through my career where you just immerse yourself 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:03.320 so much into your role you have to be like 0:11:03.480 --> 0:11:06.760 living and breathing it. You can miss some really important 0:11:06.760 --> 0:11:11.040 things that are happening with your family in particular, definitely 0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:15.320 with friends. I'm sure I've let a lot of friends 0:11:15.320 --> 0:11:19.120 down over the years. But there was another example which 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:22.280 was only last year. So I'm trying to remember the 0:11:22.360 --> 0:11:24.480 years because this COVID year is throw everything. 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:26.160 Out, but it's ten years one year. 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:26.720 Yeah. 0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:30.080 Last year my son was in year twelve having his 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:33.360 Year twelve ball, so a big night for him. And 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:35.520 it was a Tuesday night in late in the season, 0:11:35.840 --> 0:11:37.960 and I wasn't going to be able to get there. 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:40.520 I think we've played on the weekend. We're planning again 0:11:40.600 --> 0:11:44.320 on either Friday or Saturday. We've got main training. I 0:11:44.360 --> 0:11:46.880 can't get there. We've got match committee and right up 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:51.240 until so three four weeks out it's like I've resigned myself. 0:11:51.280 --> 0:11:54.120 I can't get over there to just time to have 0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:56.080 a good night and be there as he gets ready. 0:11:56.280 --> 0:11:58.319 And then Georgia asked me a couple of weeks out, 0:11:58.360 --> 0:12:00.280 you're sure you can't get over it, and I was like, well, 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:01.760 you know, I've looked at the fixtures, look at our 0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:04.559 training schedule, and it's just impossible to get over there. 0:12:05.800 --> 0:12:09.760 And Georgina asked me, I think two days prior you 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:11.400 sure you can't get here. 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:12.160 And. 0:12:13.559 --> 0:12:15.880 Something clipped and I just said, of course I can, 0:12:16.240 --> 0:12:19.679 and jumped on a plane landed in Perth at about 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:24.440 I don't know, say two o'clock on Tuesday. Charlie got 0:12:24.480 --> 0:12:28.040 home from school at three point thirty. Georgina said to him, 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:30.520 I've got a surprise for you in the bedroom. 0:12:30.600 --> 0:12:31.920 He thought it was going to be like his little 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:32.840 flower or what. 0:12:32.720 --> 0:12:37.480 Have you given it me, don't do that. And you 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:39.120 know I was here for him to get ready. He 0:12:39.160 --> 0:12:42.080 had some mates over and then we sent him off 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:44.080 at seven o'clock and at ten o'clock I was on 0:12:44.120 --> 0:12:46.040 a plane back to Melbourne. So I was here for 0:12:46.080 --> 0:12:49.400 maybe six or seven hours. But yeah, you know you 0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:53.079 can miss those things and there's small things, but he 0:12:53.160 --> 0:12:53.680 remembers it. 0:12:53.720 --> 0:12:55.560 He knows I was here, and he knows you I 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:55.920 went to. 0:12:56.000 --> 0:13:01.440 And I nearly missed it. I was so close to 0:13:01.600 --> 0:13:03.720 not doing that because I. 0:13:03.679 --> 0:13:07.400 Was busy, And that was another moment that you went off. 0:13:07.679 --> 0:13:10.000 You know, I've got my priorities wrong? Or how did 0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:11.840 you know? How did you word it? 0:13:11.840 --> 0:13:14.600 It was just that realization that I love footy as 0:13:14.640 --> 0:13:18.120 a hobby. It's not my life as much as I 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:22.199 would say it's. It's been my vocation's been my job. 0:13:22.600 --> 0:13:26.440 It's been my passion footy sport since I was a kid. 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:29.679 But you know, just being there for your kids, your 0:13:29.720 --> 0:13:34.199 wife at those important moments is more than anything. So 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:39.400 somehow you need to have ideally yourself, but someone in 0:13:39.400 --> 0:13:40.880 your life that may be strange. 0:13:40.880 --> 0:13:43.280 You up at times and have you got your priorities right? 0:13:44.240 --> 0:13:48.840 You tear up reflecting on it. You must be extremely 0:13:48.880 --> 0:13:50.360 grateful that you got there in the end. 0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:56.120 Yeah, absolutely, you know to see his Charlie's face and 0:13:56.200 --> 0:13:58.240 how proud he was that I was there, that's like 0:13:58.360 --> 0:14:01.959 you don't think your kids are proud of you? And 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:05.000 you know we have our bantwer and we muck around. 0:14:06.640 --> 0:14:09.080 But that was a moment that he couldn't hide. You know, 0:14:10.840 --> 0:14:13.360 he just he'd resigned himself. That's not going to be 0:14:13.480 --> 0:14:16.520 he can't get over. So he was just wrapped. So 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:19.400 when his mates came over, a lot of them I 0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:24.160 hadn't met, so he had the pre's, the pre cordials. 0:14:24.480 --> 0:14:27.760 He just took me around, introduced me to all his mates, 0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:29.920 and you know, that's I could see that he was 0:14:29.960 --> 0:14:31.640 just proud to do that, that his dad was here 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:34.360 because their dads had brought them over to drop them off, 0:14:34.400 --> 0:14:37.080 and it was so special. 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.680 That is special. You've missed a lot of that stuff. 0:14:40.720 --> 0:14:44.239 I imagine in telling that story, you're sort of accepting 0:14:44.280 --> 0:14:46.080 of the fact that you missed a lot of stuff, 0:14:46.120 --> 0:14:48.800 and you almost got to the point where you forgot 0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:49.680 what you were missing. 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:52.200 In a way you can do, yeah, you can just 0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:52.640 roll on. 0:14:53.800 --> 0:14:57.040 I spent my last three years at Essendon in Melbourne 0:14:57.080 --> 0:14:58.800 while my family had relocated to Perth. 0:14:59.040 --> 0:14:59.320 Again. 0:14:59.360 --> 0:15:02.200 That was just that's fine. I've got a job to do. 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:04.920 I'm doing my work. I'm at the footy club. Get up, 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:08.280 love going there every day, get home to an empty, 0:15:08.480 --> 0:15:11.160 empty apartment. But it was just like, have your meal, 0:15:11.280 --> 0:15:11.960 get to bed. 0:15:11.800 --> 0:15:12.800 Get ready to go tomorrow. 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:16.000 And when I came home for Christmas at the end 0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:19.320 of those those years, I came and had a suitcase 0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:22.640 open in my bedroom in my family home. Because I 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:24.360 was going to be here for three or four weeks. 0:15:24.760 --> 0:15:26.360 I didn't really feel like I had a home while 0:15:26.360 --> 0:15:27.800 I was here. I was living out of a seatcase. 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:29.160 When I was in Melbourne, I was just a place 0:15:29.200 --> 0:15:33.720 to sleep in between work. But I never once sat 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:37.200 there thinking why am I doing this? I'm not happy. 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:40.280 It was just enough. I've got a commitment that I've 0:15:40.280 --> 0:15:42.000 got to make and I'm going to see this through. 0:15:42.560 --> 0:15:46.240 But yeah, within a few weeks of being back in Perth, 0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:49.640 maybe after I got through my quarantine, I felt like 0:15:49.680 --> 0:15:50.160 I was home. 0:15:50.360 --> 0:15:50.800 I felt like. 0:15:50.800 --> 0:15:54.640 I'm back, and really i'd left home in the middle 0:15:54.640 --> 0:15:57.960 of twenty fifteen when I went to Adelaide, you know, 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:01.760 that was pack a suit case and within two days, 0:16:02.000 --> 0:16:05.440 you know, from when Phil Welsh passed away on the Friday, 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:08.280 by Sunday evening, I was in Adelaide and there for 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:11.040 three months, and then there was a short period where 0:16:11.080 --> 0:16:13.400 I came back here while I was flying to Melbourne 0:16:13.400 --> 0:16:16.640 for interviews with Essendon and then within a few weeks 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:21.000 I was based in Melbourne. Yeah, it's you do realize 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:23.720 what home means. And even then, for three years I 0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:27.080 tried to and this year everyone was away from home. 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:29.920 It was really interesting dynamic for me listening to everyone 0:16:29.960 --> 0:16:33.520 saying we can't go to a hub for two months 0:16:33.840 --> 0:16:36.840 and I'm thinking, welcome, welcome to by last three years 0:16:36.880 --> 0:16:39.640 guys or two years. But even then the hub for 0:16:39.720 --> 0:16:43.520 me was different because I conditioned myself to just go 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:46.000 into an empty apartment and just focusing on work. All 0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:49.480 of a sudden, I was around people from work, your 0:16:49.720 --> 0:16:53.880 workmates all day every day, so it was probably more 0:16:53.880 --> 0:16:55.480 of a challenge. They may have been lonely. I was 0:16:55.520 --> 0:16:56.960 like overwhelmed. 0:17:00.000 --> 0:17:03.040 Away from me. So yeah, again it's on. 0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:07.400 Reflection that he realized how much you are just sort 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:08.119 of surviving. 0:17:08.880 --> 0:17:10.120 And that's that's what it's hard. 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:14.800 Because my last year at Esenon was solely around preparing 0:17:14.840 --> 0:17:19.160 Ben Rutten to coach, giving him every opportunity to learn 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:21.520 what he was going to be in for, learn about 0:17:21.520 --> 0:17:23.399 some systems he'll have in place to deal with the 0:17:23.480 --> 0:17:27.159 extra time, workload, the extra commitments he'll have when I 0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:29.960 when I signed with the Bombers and the family move back, 0:17:30.160 --> 0:17:34.159 really open discussion with Xavier Campbell around I don't know 0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:38.440 how long I can do this, so let's just recommit 0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:41.200 every August. If it changes for either of us, we'll 0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:44.879 just finish it. There'll we know obligation either way if 0:17:44.920 --> 0:17:48.040 it doesn't feel right, and we had a really open 0:17:48.520 --> 0:17:52.520 agreement with that, and so the last one was really 0:17:52.600 --> 0:17:54.119 I think I can go one more year, but it 0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:59.280 was more about to help Ben grow in his development 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:02.480 to become a long term senior coach. But again it 0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:05.240 was really just a survival year. I've just got to 0:18:05.280 --> 0:18:07.680 do that really well and then when the season finishes, 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:12.040 I'll be able to go home and be a family, husband, 0:18:12.119 --> 0:18:12.760 father again. 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:16.199 You talk about the empty apartment the first night that 0:18:16.240 --> 0:18:18.520 they weren't there, did you have any sort of moment 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:20.040 of shit, they've gone. 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:24.520 Not really, because my whole footy career has been staying 0:18:24.560 --> 0:18:28.439 in hotel rooms for two or three nights going on 0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:32.520 footy camp, so it wasn't initially like any different. I'm 0:18:32.600 --> 0:18:35.280 used to being in a room on my own for 0:18:35.840 --> 0:18:39.439 various reasons. But really what we did spend time on 0:18:39.720 --> 0:18:45.080 was once the fixtures were released, usually mid October. Georgiana 0:18:45.160 --> 0:18:47.199 and I would map out the next twelve months in 0:18:47.280 --> 0:18:51.800 terms of possibilities of them either all of them coming 0:18:51.800 --> 0:18:55.960 to Melbourne or kids at different times, or when time 0:18:55.960 --> 0:18:58.000 would allow me to get back to Perth, either through 0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:01.480 fixtures or through a nightgame where I could get home 0:19:01.560 --> 0:19:04.879 just for the weekend. And tried to not have any 0:19:05.119 --> 0:19:08.840 periods longer than three maybe four weeks where we were 0:19:08.840 --> 0:19:13.439 stuck with no contact at all, So we would do that. 0:19:13.480 --> 0:19:15.959 Then I would just have that locked away in my calendar, 0:19:15.960 --> 0:19:19.800 and I always knew the next either trip for me 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:22.000 or the next excuse me. The next time my family 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:24.000 were going to be in Melbourne was only ever two 0:19:24.080 --> 0:19:26.320 or three weeks away. Once I started to think that's 0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:29.000 a bit lonely, it'd been nice to see them. So again, 0:19:29.040 --> 0:19:31.120 it was just putting in a system in place, and. 0:19:31.119 --> 0:19:33.320 No coaches putting in systems. 0:19:33.400 --> 0:19:36.280 Yeah, absolutely, this is going to work. This is how 0:19:36.320 --> 0:19:36.959 we're going to do it. 0:19:37.040 --> 0:19:40.040 We'd agreed to it, Georgia and I'd obviously discussed it. 0:19:40.119 --> 0:19:43.040 We discussed it a bit with the kids, and then 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:45.760 try to make it work the best we possibly could. 0:19:46.040 --> 0:19:48.800 Have Your kids over the years ever had moments where they've, 0:19:49.240 --> 0:19:50.840 you know, said you've let me down, Dad, or you 0:19:50.880 --> 0:19:51.560 weren't there for this. 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:53.399 They haven't. 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:57.800 There may be moments where things were tough on them 0:19:57.800 --> 0:20:00.399 and I wasn't wasn't there with it. Certainly in the 0:20:00.440 --> 0:20:02.320 last couple of years there may have been those times. 0:20:02.359 --> 0:20:07.320 But hopefully I've always been available to them. When I 0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:11.359 am home, I'm around them. I don't play golf and 0:20:11.400 --> 0:20:15.479 I don't go fishing. My spare time is whatever they 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:18.399 want to do. If they've got their junior sport or 0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:20.880 if they want to go down the beach. It says, yep, 0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:23.679 let's go, and I sort of commit to that. I 0:20:23.720 --> 0:20:27.560 don't have my own personal escape. That is them, and 0:20:27.600 --> 0:20:29.240 that gives me the most joy. 0:20:29.960 --> 0:20:34.080 I always marvel coaches and the amount of dedication that 0:20:34.119 --> 0:20:35.720