1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: Hello there, it's Amantha. I'm currently on a Christmas break, 2 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:08,440 Speaker 1: so I've handpicked a bunch of my favorite episodes from 3 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:11,920 Speaker 1: the last year to share with you. Okay, on with 4 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:18,960 Speaker 1: today's best of episode what are you doing right now? 5 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:21,920 Speaker 1: I can guarantee there is one thing that we're all 6 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:29,160 Speaker 1: doing in this moment, breathing in and breathing out. It's 7 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 1: something that is part of our whole day every day, 8 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 1: but it's definitely not something I'm ever thinking about. Christian 9 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 1: O'Connell thinks a lot about breathing, and a week long 10 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:47,879 Speaker 1: retreat in breathwork became an absolute game changer. Now. If 11 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 1: you're not familiar with Christian, he was Britain's best known 12 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 1: and most awarded breakfast radio presenter, hosting his own top 13 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: rating national breakfast shows and collecting more industry awards than 14 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: any other presenter, and even becoming the youngest radio presenter 15 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 1: ever inducted into the UK Radio Hall of Fame. But 16 00:01:06,920 --> 00:01:12,959 Speaker 1: then he moved to Australia, where nobody knew him. The 17 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:15,759 Speaker 1: Australian Radio network took a punt on him, bringing him 18 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 1: to Melbourne's Gold FM, a move that has worked out 19 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 1: incredibly well. Now, my chat with Christian has been one 20 00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 1: of my favorite interviews this year. I can't think of 21 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,000 Speaker 1: a time that I had someone on the show who 22 00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:35,200 Speaker 1: was just so raw and open and honest about work 23 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:38,880 Speaker 1: and life and the stuff that can make life really 24 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 1: challenging at times. So we talk about the biggest lessons 25 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:48,560 Speaker 1: that Christian has learned in therapy and how he managed 26 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 1: to overcome panic attacks that were crippling him literally straight 27 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 1: before he was due to go live to air, and 28 00:01:55,840 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: I even become Christian's very first breath work client during 29 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 1: this chat. My name is doctor Amada Imba. I'm an 30 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 1: organizational psychologist and the founder of behavioral science consultancy in Ventium, 31 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:15,520 Speaker 1: and this is how I work a show about how 32 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 1: to help you do your best work. So I wanted 33 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 1: to know what's it like to have to be full 34 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: of energy at six am in the morning every morning 35 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 1: when Christian hosts his daily breakfast show on Gold one 36 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 1: oh four. 37 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:34,120 Speaker 2: Well, I don't have to be full of energy. I 38 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 2: don't think people want to turn their radio on in 39 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:39,800 Speaker 2: the morning and sort of have that fake, nervous, desperate energy, 40 00:02:39,919 --> 00:02:42,639 Speaker 2: you know, like someone trying to do an infomercial. I'm 41 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:45,959 Speaker 2: more like a dimmer switch. I am talkative at six 42 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:48,240 Speaker 2: am like this, but then who I don't need to 43 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 2: be yelling. So I actually learned that I had to 44 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 2: learn that lesson to be honest, because otherwise it puts 45 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 2: you on just terrible fake this kind of pressure. You know, 46 00:02:58,120 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 2: it's too hard to live up to that. You can't 47 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: do that. What do they actually need from me? They 48 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 2: need me to be present, and they do need to 49 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 2: be energized. But the more I'm dialed into beforehand, and 50 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 2: these are things I've learned the hard way through getting 51 00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 2: it wrong. I've been did breakfast radio for twenty three years, 52 00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 2: and it's only in the last couple of years I've 53 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:20,239 Speaker 2: actually learned to have some a bit more healthy rituals 54 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:22,920 Speaker 2: before a show to check in with my intention. And 55 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:25,200 Speaker 2: when I pay attention to that, I always have a 56 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 2: better show. When I struggle it doesn't quite work, or 57 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:32,440 Speaker 2: I'm having a tough time or too much self critical thought. 58 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 2: Is when I've got locked into that this isn't going 59 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:37,120 Speaker 2: well enough, I need to put more energy into it. 60 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 2: I need to be ten out of ten. I'm letting 61 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 2: myself down, letting the show down. Oh my god. And 62 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 2: you know, you know where that. 63 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 1: Goes absolutely, Now, can you talk me through your pre 64 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 1: show ritual? 65 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:48,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you'll have a film day with this, 66 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 2: But they work for me, and so the work works. Now, 67 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 2: the alarm goes off in the morning, and that's four 68 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 2: twenty seven, and I hope might think, why does he 69 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,960 Speaker 2: set off at four twenty seven am? Any extra minute 70 00:04:02,040 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 2: I can be in bed, I would be, so why 71 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 2: wouldn't you so? Yet four twenty seven? The first thing 72 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:10,120 Speaker 2: I'd do for about five minutes is I will do 73 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 2: some breathing energizing techniques that I've learned the last couple 74 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 2: of years, and they really really help. They vary. I 75 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 2: try not to do the same thing every day, as 76 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 2: you'll probably realize the more we get into this conversation. 77 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 2: I need I need that spontaneity. It's very important to me, 78 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 2: and so if it was to the same every day, 79 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 2: I'd get bored of it and stop doing it. So, yeah, 80 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:32,440 Speaker 2: I do something for five minutes, but a breathing kind 81 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 2: of thing to get me going and energize, jump in 82 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 2: the shower, and then head to work. And here's where 83 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 2: it all starts. Actually, I guess the first thing is 84 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 2: the would be the breathing stuff like five minutes. Then 85 00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 2: that time in the car twenty five minutes to get 86 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:52,080 Speaker 2: into the radio station. I would always listen to something 87 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 2: that tunes me into my heart, and either it would 88 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:59,800 Speaker 2: be something funny or it might be a interesting podcast, 89 00:05:00,360 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 2: just something which kind of I guess I'm trying to 90 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,680 Speaker 2: train myself to to find that part of me. You 91 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 2: know that I want to come forward to do the show, 92 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:11,359 Speaker 2: and so I use that twenty five minutes. I actually 93 00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:13,960 Speaker 2: look forward to it. It's a time when I can 94 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:17,559 Speaker 2: just silent my mind down before like six am, because 95 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:20,680 Speaker 2: when the show starts, things move quite quickly, and I 96 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 2: move quite quickly on and off air. So yeah, I 97 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:25,480 Speaker 2: do that for twenty five minutes. When I get into 98 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 2: the building, I say loo to the team that I 99 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 2: like to be in my studio alone by myself for 100 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:36,040 Speaker 2: fifteen twenty minutes. I will force myself to I'll start 101 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 2: with a blank piece of paper and I just write 102 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 2: down a word. I think what I actually want, what 103 00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:45,599 Speaker 2: I want the story today's show to be. So it 104 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:51,360 Speaker 2: might be joyful, it might be honest, it might be connected, 105 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:53,039 Speaker 2: whatever it is. I just I won't try and find 106 00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:55,480 Speaker 2: the word. I just let it come through, and then 107 00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:58,240 Speaker 2: I kind of like I dial into my intentions. I'm 108 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:02,719 Speaker 2: here to have fun, to be honest, and then I'll 109 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 2: go through the emails that have come through since the 110 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:08,960 Speaker 2: show ended. I read all the emails, good, bad, and everything, 111 00:06:09,040 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 2: because there's always there might be something I can use 112 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:13,480 Speaker 2: in them. Even if it's a story which isn't that good, 113 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,000 Speaker 2: there might be a final line at the end of it. 114 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 2: Or I always have a look at everyone's job tie 115 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:21,039 Speaker 2: sort at the end of their emails. I think there 116 00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: might be something in that. I like going through all 117 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 2: the emails. It feels like I'm connected to where they're at. 118 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,720 Speaker 2: And then Jack and Rio come into the studio. Rio 119 00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:32,720 Speaker 2: is one of my producers and Jack is my sidekick. 120 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 2: And then for fifteen minutes, I will say, oh, here's 121 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:38,559 Speaker 2: what's happened to me. Here's a couple of ideas I've got. 122 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 2: Jack shares his, and we start to roughly a very 123 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,359 Speaker 2: pencil blueprint for that day show. Now there'd be some 124 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:47,320 Speaker 2: ideas that we already know that we might do on 125 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 2: a Tuesday or a Thursday, but yeah, we start to 126 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 2: just plot. I don't like to have too much in 127 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:55,920 Speaker 2: if I see a show where there's everything planned in. 128 00:06:56,360 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 2: I do want to do that show. I can't stand 129 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 2: the thought of that. I like that be some gaps 130 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:05,080 Speaker 2: for the spontaneity, for the magic, for the unpredictable to 131 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:06,840 Speaker 2: show up and do the show with us as well. 132 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: That's that's quite the ritual in terms of how you've 133 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 1: mapped that out. I find that really fascinating. I do 134 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: want to ask more about a few things there. I 135 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: want to get into breath work. And I remember when 136 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: when I read your book, no one listens to your 137 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 1: Dad's show, which I must say I loved, and it 138 00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:29,840 Speaker 1: was actually because of sounds. It sounds a bit weird, 139 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 1: but it was actually because of that book that I 140 00:07:32,760 --> 00:07:35,960 Speaker 1: was so keen to have you on the show, because yeah, 141 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,680 Speaker 1: i'd heard you on the radio a little bit but 142 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: not a lot. And your publisher sent me the book 143 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 1: and I thought, this looks interesting. And I try to 144 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: read at least the first chapter of books that i'm sent, 145 00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: but yours just scripped me. And I read it, you know, 146 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 1: over a few days, and I'm like, I have to 147 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:53,680 Speaker 1: talk to this man. And then finally enough when I 148 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 1: mentioned the interview to my mum, who doesn't listen to 149 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:01,200 Speaker 1: a great deal of radio. She said, Oh, yes, Christian O'Connell. 150 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 1: I've heard him, and I've always thought he sounds like 151 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 1: a very intelligent man. 152 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:11,760 Speaker 2: I don't get that a lot. I'll take that from you, mum, 153 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:14,560 Speaker 2: and please thank her. You must have just had a 154 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 2: very small slip of the show one day where I 155 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 2: might actually get somewhere near sounding intelligent. 156 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 1: But the seriously, I loved your book, and you do 157 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 1: talk about your breath work in the book, and for 158 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: a memory you actually mentioned I think your breathwork teacher 159 00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:31,480 Speaker 1: in the acknowledgments. Can you tell me what led you 160 00:08:31,560 --> 00:08:32,920 Speaker 1: to learning breath work? 161 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:36,360 Speaker 2: Well, I guess like most of the stuff that we 162 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 2: do as adults to try and bring us comfort, we'll 163 00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:42,679 Speaker 2: try and steady us because it's when you think about it, 164 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,880 Speaker 2: just being a human on this strange planet, having our 165 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:49,720 Speaker 2: strange existence. It's a lot, isn't it. As you get older, 166 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 2: you realize life is really odd, just being a human 167 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 2: just getting through the day. Is It's really odd sometimes, 168 00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 2: isn't it? And I'm very lucky, isn't entitled? You know, guy, 169 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 2: that I have a very good life. And so about 170 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:04,839 Speaker 2: seven or eight years ago, I had some very very 171 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 2: severe panic attacks, and they only came right before my 172 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:12,200 Speaker 2: job doing a live radio show and my last show 173 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 2: in the UK that I had for twelve years was National, 174 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 2: went all around the UK and I had two and 175 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:20,320 Speaker 2: a half million listeners. Never had any fear about radio 176 00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 2: or stand up or live TV. Suddenly out of nowhere, 177 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,440 Speaker 2: really severe panic attacks about twenty minutes before going on air, 178 00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 2: and I guess i'd call it was a mini breakdown. 179 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 2: When I look back now, it was the best thing, 180 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:34,840 Speaker 2: one of the best things that ever happened to me. 181 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 2: It made me go and get help, even though that 182 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:40,440 Speaker 2: was reluctant at first. I didn't know what was going on. 183 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 2: I remember going to see this therapist and even being 184 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 2: embarrassed that I'd had to go and see a therapist 185 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 2: that I somehow screwed up myself and my life. And 186 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:50,760 Speaker 2: I said, I just want the panic cut out. I 187 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 2: remember him just laughing lot, Oh, this guy is going 188 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:56,560 Speaker 2: to be a field day unpacked. This guy he wants 189 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 2: the panic cut out, and he went, where is it, 190 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 2: I'll do it now. And so through that I also 191 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 2: learned breath work because I needed to, and I realize 192 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 2: how how with panic or anxiety or anything, focus or anything. 193 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 2: Our breath is everything. It's the first thing we do 194 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:14,840 Speaker 2: when we're born and we start our life, and it'd 195 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:17,080 Speaker 2: be the very last thing we do. And we don't 196 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:19,560 Speaker 2: breathe very well. We don't know much about it. But 197 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:23,120 Speaker 2: I've learned through learning breath work is just how much 198 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:26,720 Speaker 2: it can change your mental, physical, your zest for life. 199 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 2: I've learned how to regulate myself ever get stressed or 200 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,000 Speaker 2: if I'm tired and I need a bit of energy 201 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:35,760 Speaker 2: rather than having caffeine. So yeah, I went away in 202 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 2: a week long retreat, a breath work retreat. I loved 203 00:10:38,920 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 2: it so much, went back the following year, did another 204 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 2: week and you'll love this. I'm currently doing a course. 205 00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 2: It will take me about another four or five months 206 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 2: to be a breath work master so that I can 207 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 2: actually teach it. I would love to be teaching it 208 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:56,679 Speaker 2: next year. Not full time. I didn't expect, but it's 209 00:10:56,720 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 2: only because it's helped me so much, so much, and 210 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:02,319 Speaker 2: I use it every day and it makes a big 211 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 2: difference in my life. I'm like, I'd really like to 212 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:07,560 Speaker 2: be able to share this with people. I've struggled so 213 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 2: hard to meditate. This feels like this is something I 214 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 2: can do. Whether it's five or ten minutes. You don't 215 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 2: need any more than that. It's not just that it's 216 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:16,800 Speaker 2: some that it's portable. I can do it in the car. 217 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:20,320 Speaker 2: You know. I'm trying to teaching my teenage daughters to 218 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 2: help them, but they are that age fifteen and seventeen 219 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:25,319 Speaker 2: when they're just resistant to anything that comes to mom 220 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,080 Speaker 2: and dad. You know, they want to go the other way. 221 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,840 Speaker 2: So I've got to let them come to it their 222 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 2: own way. But yeah, I'm such a big fan of it. 223 00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 2: It's free, it's very easy to learn, and they're all 224 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 2: kinds of different breathing techniques you can do to help 225 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 2: bring about different changes. Yeah, I do it regularly during 226 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 2: the radio show before the show in the car. Like 227 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,480 Speaker 2: I said, I loved it better for it. So yeah, 228 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 2: I'm currently I'm actually learning. You know, I have to 229 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 2: go on these calls once a week. I get up 230 00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 2: even earlier and at half three am I'm on a 231 00:11:57,679 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 2: call for an hour and a half with an instructor 232 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 2: mentor for that week's homework and how I've got on 233 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:06,680 Speaker 2: and teaching him online how I should teach somebody to 234 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:08,199 Speaker 2: do it, and I love all that. It's really nice 235 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,960 Speaker 2: learning something new that's nothing to do with what I 236 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,160 Speaker 2: do for a living. It'll be a part time thing 237 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:15,720 Speaker 2: for me next year. I don't know how it's online 238 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 2: or in person, but that excites me doing that. I'm like, 239 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,280 Speaker 2: that's something new, that's something which isn't about me or 240 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 2: trying to be funny or you know, sell something. It's 241 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 2: just me trying to share something which really really has 242 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 2: helped me through a really really tough time. And anxiety 243 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,680 Speaker 2: and panic attacks aren't something that go away. The panic 244 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 2: attacks I don't have so much anymore now, but low 245 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:40,680 Speaker 2: level anxiety is something which has still be around in 246 00:12:40,679 --> 00:12:44,160 Speaker 2: my life. Hasn't defined me, but I know the breathing 247 00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:47,400 Speaker 2: really really really helps, and a lot of people since 248 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 2: the book came out, like you, have said, oh, I've 249 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 2: suffered panic attacks. What helped? Getting help? Going to see 250 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:56,680 Speaker 2: a therapist really helped massively. And the breathing thing, Matt, 251 00:12:56,800 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 2: that was a big difference to me and will always be. 252 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: So let's just say I'm preparing to do a podcast 253 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,960 Speaker 1: interview and like, even though I've been doing it for 254 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:10,920 Speaker 1: a few years now, I still get nervous before some interviews, 255 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: particularly where I'm going to be speaking to someone who's 256 00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 1: been a hero of mine for years, and can you 257 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 1: give me something that I can do, like in the 258 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:23,079 Speaker 1: five or ten minutes before I'm live? What can I do? 259 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 2: First of all, why are you doing this? 260 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:30,240 Speaker 1: Why am I doing this? Well, firstly, I'm doing it 261 00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:34,440 Speaker 1: to learn, and secondly, I'm doing it as a way 262 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:39,280 Speaker 1: to I guess, like scale the impact that I can have. 263 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: So I'm very motivated by, you know, unpacking complex science 264 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:46,320 Speaker 1: and putting that into simple strategies that people can use 265 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:48,920 Speaker 1: to improve the way that they work. And for me, 266 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:52,000 Speaker 1: the podcast came out of a natural curiosity around how 267 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,319 Speaker 1: do the world's most successful people work? But also as 268 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: a channel. I mean, podcasting is so brilliant for reaching 269 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 1: lots of people with their strategy. Isn't impacting as many 270 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:03,319 Speaker 1: lives as possible? So that's why I do it. 271 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I can understand, right, all that big brain stuff. 272 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 2: What feelings when it goes well or afterwards, when you 273 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 2: go that is a groat? I really enjoyed that. What 274 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:15,080 Speaker 2: is that feeling if you have to give it a 275 00:14:15,160 --> 00:14:17,199 Speaker 2: value a couple of words, what is that when it's 276 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 2: going well, what is that? What does it do to 277 00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:21,360 Speaker 2: you on a physical level? What does it do? Does 278 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:23,240 Speaker 2: it make you feel happy? What would you say? 279 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: I'm just like, I'm so energized, I'm pumped up. I'm 280 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:31,320 Speaker 1: kind of on a high. Like you know, when I 281 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 1: learned some really cool stuff, I'm like, oh my god, 282 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: I can't wait to share that. 283 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:36,680 Speaker 2: Right. So now you've got that, Now you're in touch 284 00:14:36,720 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 2: with why you really do it. Okay, Now close your 285 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 2: eyes and think about the last chat you did where 286 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:46,119 Speaker 2: you really felt that you know, your words, energized, connected, 287 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 2: and breathe in. Just close your eyes, breathe in through 288 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 2: your nose. It's account of five. Don't have to be 289 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 2: big breath, but just and then just told it be 290 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:02,240 Speaker 2: and then breathe out slowly again to the count of five. 291 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 2: Three your nose again, and then breathe again through your nose. 292 00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:17,360 Speaker 2: Look out of five. So wait a beat and slowly 293 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 2: out through the nose again. Look at the five, four, three, 294 00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 2: two one one more round of this in through the nose, 295 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 2: look aunt of five, one two, three four five, Have 296 00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 2: a gentle smile with your mouth that's closed, and then 297 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:39,880 Speaker 2: breathe out again. Look ount of five through the nose, 298 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:47,320 Speaker 2: count down five or three, two one? Feel that warm, 299 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 2: energized glow and open your eyes and how do you 300 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 2: feel now? Ah? 301 00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 1: So so good and calm and just different. I feel 302 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 1: like I've shifted. 303 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's like thirty seconds. Anyone could do it. Now, 304 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 2: you understand why I like it. It's quick, it's instant. 305 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 2: You don't even have to get into a woo woo 306 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,920 Speaker 2: of what's happening there, don't even try to analyze it. 307 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 2: It's that's all in us. And now, if you were 308 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 2: to go and do a chat now, whether it's this one, 309 00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:15,880 Speaker 2: you will do it differently. You would enjoy it more, 310 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 2: and you'll be more connected to yourself and there you're 311 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 2: also to be more engaged and connected to what you're 312 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 2: actually trying to do as well, rather than the strategy. 313 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 2: And yeah, I get I understand about networking and what 314 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 2: it can do for you, but that isn't really why 315 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 2: you're doing it. It's something else. 316 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: Absolutely. 317 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:32,600 Speaker 2: Hmm. 318 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 1: That's good. Oh, I feel like I feel like I've 319 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:37,640 Speaker 1: just had a shift and wear on to like act too. 320 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:42,800 Speaker 2: Well, you know what, You've just become my first ever 321 00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 2: and what do they call them? Clients? Yeah, you've just 322 00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 2: been my first time protege. 323 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:50,800 Speaker 1: Let's say you now, you mentioned therapy and you write 324 00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 1: a lot about that in the book and your experience, 325 00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 1: and I feel like it's something that I don't I 326 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:58,840 Speaker 1: don't know if I've ever talked about therapy with the 327 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:02,000 Speaker 1: guest on the show. And I'm a huge fan of therapy. 328 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 1: I'm a psychologist myself, and I've spent years in therapy 329 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:08,199 Speaker 1: and I currently see a psychologist every fortnight. And I 330 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:11,800 Speaker 1: want to know for you, what have been the biggest 331 00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 1: lessons or things that you've taken out of the therapy 332 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:16,359 Speaker 1: that you've done. 333 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:22,639 Speaker 2: Great question. Like I said, I was so reluctant. I've 334 00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:24,159 Speaker 2: don't know if it's a man thing. I think it 335 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 2: predominantly is that a fit embarrassed about having to ask 336 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:29,480 Speaker 2: for help. We're really good at giving other people help. 337 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:33,920 Speaker 2: We're terrible at asking for help, aren't we. I tet 338 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 2: know what I got from it really was compassion. When 339 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 2: I went in saying I'm having panic attacks, I can't 340 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 2: do my job. I think I'm going to you know, 341 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:43,560 Speaker 2: I can't want me to be any mortgage. I don't 342 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:44,800 Speaker 2: know if I can ever do it again. It was 343 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:49,280 Speaker 2: that bad. It was about understanding that it's not it, 344 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,680 Speaker 2: it's a part of me that's scared, and that part 345 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:55,600 Speaker 2: of me needs to be given I guess, compassion, listen 346 00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:58,880 Speaker 2: to and work out what is what's worrying at the moment, 347 00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 2: if it had a voice, what is it trying to say? 348 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 2: And dying to that because a lot of our critical 349 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 2: self talk is so judgmental and so mean. It's like 350 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 2: an inner heckla, you would never speak to someone in 351 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:14,040 Speaker 2: your life, I love one or colleague the way you 352 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 2: talk to yourself in the mirror. And it's learning about 353 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:21,200 Speaker 2: that and just watching that and that's a day to day, 354 00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:23,399 Speaker 2: rest of my life thing. But that I had to 355 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:26,080 Speaker 2: sum up the two years I did, that would be 356 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 2: the biggest takeaway for me that I still use every 357 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,879 Speaker 2: day and use it when I'm talking to my daughters 358 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 2: as well, is that you know, when they go, I'm 359 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:38,439 Speaker 2: feeling this, it's remind ourselves part of you is angry 360 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:41,240 Speaker 2: right now, part of you is really pissed off, and 361 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:43,399 Speaker 2: then understands you have to separate that because there are 362 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 2: many different parts of us, you know, we all have 363 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 2: different parts, and then actually to separate from that and 364 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 2: just go okay, I am angry, which part of me 365 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 2: is angry and why? And then you can have hopefully 366 00:18:54,760 --> 00:18:58,440 Speaker 2: a better dialogue with yourself and that that and changes everything. 367 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:01,120 Speaker 1: But then you're in an unusual city situation where you're 368 00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:05,679 Speaker 1: also like you're drowning in feedback from listeners and people 369 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 1: who maybe have just listened for a few minutes. 370 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 2: Well, see, even though isn't that interesting to use the 371 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:11,480 Speaker 2: imagery of drowning. If I thought of it like that, 372 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:16,119 Speaker 2: I'd have a flipp and panic attack. Han, I've learned 373 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 2: to swim, and sometimes the waves crash over me and 374 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 2: other times I can surf on it, and yeah, I 375 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:27,200 Speaker 2: can turn that on and off. On a bad day, 376 00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 2: your ego gets a bit of a din because someone 377 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:32,199 Speaker 2: shoots you an email and like hate this show, they 378 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 2: need to fire you, and you like, then you have 379 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 2: to remind yourself that's more about them. That's someone who's 380 00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:39,359 Speaker 2: having a tough time moment they've they thought the best 381 00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 2: choice for them in that morning is to find my 382 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 2: email address, type out an email, check it the spelling mistakes, 383 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 2: click send, and that is more about them. And actually, 384 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:50,520 Speaker 2: at the end of the day, other people's opinions of 385 00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:52,840 Speaker 2: me really aren't my business when it comes to a 386 00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 2: radio show, you know, I don't want the show to 387 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 2: be for everyone. I'd make a very different kind of show. 388 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:00,600 Speaker 2: I hope it's some people that are like me, and 389 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:02,120 Speaker 2: I put it out there and I hope it finds 390 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:06,480 Speaker 2: the right people and the right people find it. So, yeah, 391 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:09,920 Speaker 2: I've got a lot of a healthier attitude towards feedback, 392 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 2: should we call it, than I used to. 393 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. I want to know more about that, because in 394 00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:18,719 Speaker 1: your book you paint a really vivid image of what 395 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:22,120 Speaker 1: it was like packing up your bags from the UK, 396 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,919 Speaker 1: where you'd had this twenty year, super successful radio career, 397 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 1: and deciding to move your whole family to Melbourn, where 398 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 1: you really didn't know anyone except for a handful of 399 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:37,760 Speaker 1: people in the industry. And things are really tough when 400 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:41,760 Speaker 1: you started on air here, and people were really resistant 401 00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 1: to someone not from Melbourne doing a local radio show. 402 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 1: So what strategies did you use to cope, particularly in 403 00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 1: those early days. 404 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:54,480 Speaker 2: Unfortunately, I wish I could have an intelligent answer. Red 405 00:20:54,520 --> 00:20:59,880 Speaker 2: wine and spoiler alert it doesn't always help that strategy. Yeah, 406 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:01,399 Speaker 2: I mean, look, I might as well say what I 407 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,600 Speaker 2: am English in Australia. Suddenly, as someone in the early 408 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:08,280 Speaker 2: days emailed me, no one invited you. I felt like 409 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 2: that uninvited and how I just rocked up here and 410 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:14,040 Speaker 2: just put myself on a breakfast show and people like, no, 411 00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 2: so who i'd an English guy? We don't know him. 412 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,399 Speaker 2: You're not from here. You don't know about AFL, you 413 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,960 Speaker 2: don't know about John Farnham, you don't know about barn Zy, 414 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:27,760 Speaker 2: you don't know about Vida Crumble. And radio is built 415 00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 2: around intimacy. Intimacy is built around connection and shared experience, 416 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 2: isn't it. And suddenly my accent, I think, didn't have that, 417 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 2: and so there was a bit of a disconnect. However, 418 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,680 Speaker 2: looking back now, the single most exciting thing I've ever 419 00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 2: done in my radio career has come here, because it 420 00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 2: really really humbled me, stripped me of everything that I 421 00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:50,200 Speaker 2: built up over a Korea. When you've got a following 422 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,959 Speaker 2: on TV, on radio, whatever, they're your people and they 423 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 2: follow you from a radio station to a radio station 424 00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,159 Speaker 2: and there you've got them, and that is amazing. I 425 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 2: didn't have that here. Suddenly it felt like I was 426 00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 2: starting all over again, and I actually I needed that. 427 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 2: I had to start all over again but differently, and 428 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:12,399 Speaker 2: that learning that first year of never ending trials in 429 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 2: my two worlds, which was at home, my personal life, 430 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:17,880 Speaker 2: and then at work as well doing a radio show 431 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 2: as an outsider. Oh yeah, really hard here, But I 432 00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:25,879 Speaker 2: came for a reason and it changed my life in 433 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:28,200 Speaker 2: bigger ways and just about a radio show, and that 434 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,440 Speaker 2: I'll always be grateful for every single one of those 435 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 2: hate emails. I'll always be thankful for I will. 436 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: We will be back very soon with Christian talking about 437 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:45,200 Speaker 1: how he got to know Melbourne through Uber Drivers, how 438 00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 1: he gets on stuck when he has a bit of 439 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: writer's block, and we'll be talking about life quakes and 440 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 1: how to deal with them and the impact that they 441 00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:58,000 Speaker 1: have on our relationships with those around us. Now, if 442 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:02,359 Speaker 1: you are not connected with me on the socials today, 443 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:04,679 Speaker 1: you might beg you the day to do so, because 444 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 1: I share a lot of really interesting content through a 445 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 1: couple of my social networks. So firstly, you can find 446 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:15,800 Speaker 1: me on LinkedIn just search for my name Amantha Imba 447 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:18,840 Speaker 1: and say hi that you found me through the show, 448 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:23,119 Speaker 1: or you can find me on Instagram at Amantha I 449 00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 1: You ride about getting to know Melbourne through Uber Drivers, 450 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 1: can you tell me how you did that. 451 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:32,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, obviously I had no car when we 452 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:34,240 Speaker 2: moved here, my wife and I and so I had 453 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,119 Speaker 2: to get to work every day and around the city, 454 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,200 Speaker 2: and so I'd use Uber a lot. And the great 455 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:41,440 Speaker 2: thing is those people are driving around a city all 456 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 2: the time. They know all the suburbs, and so most 457 00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 2: people don't ever talk to them. They're staring down at 458 00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 2: their phones. I'm certainly wide eyed. I was a Sponge. 459 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:52,000 Speaker 2: I really wanted to get to know the city. The 460 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 2: more I got to know it, the more I could, 461 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:55,680 Speaker 2: you know, have a better life on air and offair. 462 00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:57,600 Speaker 2: You know what areas to go and take my kids 463 00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,399 Speaker 2: to do? I'm a wife to go and eat, or 464 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:01,240 Speaker 2: let's go over here. There's supposed to be a great 465 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,680 Speaker 2: Italian restaurant. This is where all the Italian community is about. 466 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 2: The food here is amazing. There's the Greek one. The 467 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 2: Uber drivers, I would constantly say, what's this area, what's 468 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,159 Speaker 2: this area called, what's it known for? Where do you 469 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:14,280 Speaker 2: not like going? Where do you like going? What do 470 00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:17,520 Speaker 2: you think of this monument? What do you think of that? 471 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 2: What's the most popular place at the weekend? All this stuff, 472 00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:24,119 Speaker 2: and I was constantly just taking it all on board, 473 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,440 Speaker 2: loaning the shorthand of a city in the UK. I 474 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,119 Speaker 2: just i'd had that. I know the burroughs and the 475 00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 2: suburbs to make a joke about in London, there's almost 476 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 2: like a punchline. I didn't have that here, and I 477 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 2: had to learn it as quickly as possible. And the 478 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:40,960 Speaker 2: uber drivers will always be very, very grateful for they're 479 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:45,479 Speaker 2: up my spies. I've been spying on us all these years. 480 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 1: I love that. Now I want to talk about creativity, 481 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:53,399 Speaker 1: and I want to know for you, how do you 482 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 1: get your creative juices flowing? 483 00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 2: I do you know what I actually I hope you 484 00:24:57,320 --> 00:24:59,240 Speaker 2: will find this interesting. I don't know, but I love 485 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:03,320 Speaker 2: talking about creativity because creativity isn't limited to someone like 486 00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:06,320 Speaker 2: me who writes or talks or you know, stuff like 487 00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 2: that for a living, or comes up with ideas. It's 488 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,119 Speaker 2: actually creativity. Like a friend of mine is a carpenter, 489 00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:15,639 Speaker 2: and he once made these friends of ours as a 490 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:19,040 Speaker 2: wedding present a four poster bed. He made that from 491 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:22,280 Speaker 2: wood and carved it all and bit by bit I 492 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,080 Speaker 2: would go around his garage and workshop just see it 493 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 2: looked like to me hadn't made much progress, and then 494 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 2: suddenly there was a bed and I was genuinely right 495 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:35,400 Speaker 2: in all of his creativity, his focus, his craft. He's 496 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 2: had to learn and master, get wrong, still get right, 497 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 2: And that is creativity doing that, you know. It's like 498 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:45,560 Speaker 2: my plumber came around and I thought I would need 499 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 2: a really big part that was going to cost thousands. 500 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:49,120 Speaker 2: I was like, this is the last thing we need 501 00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,080 Speaker 2: this year. I was like, now I know I can do. 502 00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 2: I can do an improvise. That's creativity. I think sometimes 503 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:59,480 Speaker 2: we overemphasize the sort of creative fields, you know, of 504 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:03,720 Speaker 2: writing and talking and comedy and stuff like that and storytelling, 505 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:08,160 Speaker 2: and actually creativity is in bars. You hear it at barbecues. 506 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,240 Speaker 2: If there's a neighbor, a neighbor of mind told me 507 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:12,439 Speaker 2: a funny story the other day. He told it so 508 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:15,560 Speaker 2: well in that exchange with the two of us. That's creativity. 509 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,280 Speaker 2: That the choice and the words he had without maybe 510 00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:22,800 Speaker 2: even realizing it, or he's just instinctive storyteller. So I 511 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:27,360 Speaker 2: enjoy finding creativity everywhere. You see it in nature. It's 512 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:31,840 Speaker 2: all around us. It is our nature. Everyone is creative. 513 00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: So what do you do like? Because you must experience 514 00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 1: times where you do get stuck or you've got the 515 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:41,159 Speaker 1: you know, metaphorical writer's block. What do you do to 516 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 1: get unstuck? 517 00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,800 Speaker 2: Stop looking directly at a blank piece of paper. It's 518 00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 2: too intimidating. I'll go for a walk. Then it's out 519 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,199 Speaker 2: of view. It's there, but it's out of view. The 520 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 2: amount of I get a lot of ideas just going 521 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 2: to walk in my dog. I talk to myself, you know, 522 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 2: and our write down idea. I got a small team. 523 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,360 Speaker 2: I like working in a small team. I bounce off them. 524 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:08,959 Speaker 2: Jack and Pat who do the show with me. They 525 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,199 Speaker 2: give me ideas. They might tell me a story or 526 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 2: just had an argument the other day about this, or 527 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:16,560 Speaker 2: what is it in a supermarket? When you do that 528 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:17,679 Speaker 2: and I'm like, go, oh, I know what we can 529 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,439 Speaker 2: do with that. Oh, I've got it reminds me of 530 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:22,000 Speaker 2: so and so. We could do this with it. So 531 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,720 Speaker 2: a very reactive, very reactive as well. Like I said 532 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,439 Speaker 2: about going through the listeners' emails, my job really is 533 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:31,920 Speaker 2: to pay attention. That's it. It literally is what we 534 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 2: should all be doing. But I pay attention. So even 535 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 2: if that's me yesterday and being crushed when I try 536 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,960 Speaker 2: and bond with my fifteen year old daughter and I 537 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 2: mentioned a song that i'd heard was a really big 538 00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:47,359 Speaker 2: hit on TikTok and she just raised her eyebrows because 539 00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:50,240 Speaker 2: teenagers are not there to validate you, and she just went, 540 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:53,800 Speaker 2: oh god, that came out like last year and I 541 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:57,000 Speaker 2: was shot down. She gave me nothing and that again, 542 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,080 Speaker 2: I just got to pay attention to that. What is 543 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,080 Speaker 2: it you feel embarrassed? You know, I tried to bond 544 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:05,600 Speaker 2: with a teenager. It's so hot, So yeah, it's to 545 00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:06,200 Speaker 2: pay attention. 546 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:10,040 Speaker 1: After I read your book and I've you know, followed 547 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 1: you on social media, and you share a lot of 548 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,760 Speaker 1: personal stuff about yourself, which you know, particularly I think 549 00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:19,639 Speaker 1: for a man, is fairly unusual. And you know, I 550 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,639 Speaker 1: was reflecting on just, you know, the idea of how 551 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,520 Speaker 1: much we share about ourselves in the last twenty four 552 00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,399 Speaker 1: hours because I'm doing this campaign with LinkedIn at the 553 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: moment called change Makers, and they emailed me yesterday and 554 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 1: they said, hey, I know this wasn't on the on 555 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 1: the kind of list of deliberables, but would you mind 556 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 1: just writing a post for are You Okay? 557 00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 2: Day? 558 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 1: Which is today? And I thought, yeah, yeah, sure, I'm 559 00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: so happy to do that, and so sat down to 560 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 1: write it yesterday afternoon, and I'm like, like, I didn't 561 00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 1: want it to be you know, some generic like you know, 562 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:54,280 Speaker 1: ask someone if they're okay today, you know, the world 563 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:56,120 Speaker 1: doesn't need more of those posts. And I thought, well, 564 00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 1: you know, for me, I think the thing that I 565 00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 1: was thinking about is the last couple of years of 566 00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,400 Speaker 1: my life have been quite quite challenging and stressful. So 567 00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 1: I separated from my husband two years ago by choice 568 00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: and became a single parent, and that has all sorts 569 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 1: of challenges, and I sort of I was always very 570 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,960 Speaker 1: conscious in terms of who I bring to work. I 571 00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 1: try to be very open and you know, transparent and 572 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:23,400 Speaker 1: vulnerable with my team. But in the back of my mind, 573 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:25,120 Speaker 1: like with some of the stresses I've had to deal 574 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 1: with over the last couple of years, it's like, well, I, 575 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 1: you know, I don't need to treat them as a 576 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,080 Speaker 1: dumping ground for my stress. So I'd withhold a lot 577 00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 1: of the time. And so I sort of I wrote 578 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,800 Speaker 1: the post about you know, I guess I kind of, 579 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:40,600 Speaker 1: you know, part of me regrets maybe not being you know, 580 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:43,240 Speaker 1: more open and more vulnerable during the really tough times 581 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:46,200 Speaker 1: where I kind of chose not to share because I 582 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,200 Speaker 1: thought that's going to have a negative impact on the 583 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 1: people around me. But instead I think maybe it created 584 00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 1: more distance. And I think about like the choices that 585 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 1: you've made in terms of how much you share about yourself, 586 00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:00,280 Speaker 1: and I want to know, how do you decide what's 587 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:04,320 Speaker 1: okay to share? And perhaps you know what you don't share. 588 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, once more, a brilliant question. And what I would 589 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:11,880 Speaker 2: just say to you, just thank you for sharing what 590 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:13,760 Speaker 2: you just did, is that often when we're going through 591 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 2: a really tough time, and that is I had this 592 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:21,320 Speaker 2: great phrase recently, life quake, an earthquake in our lives 593 00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 2: and that lovely life quake, our lives will give us 594 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 2: life quakes. They just will. That's just inevitable, what that is. 595 00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 2: We've all felt those already. You don't get to have 596 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,920 Speaker 2: a life without life quakes. And you've had a couple there. 597 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 2: Often when we're right in that, when we're right in it, 598 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 2: we don't know we're in the middle of it. We 599 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 2: don't know if we're near the end of it. And 600 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:44,440 Speaker 2: actually we don't have a very good connection to ourselves, 601 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 2: do we. So it's really hard if you haven't got 602 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,960 Speaker 2: good connection to yourself and a good ongoing conversation, a 603 00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:52,520 Speaker 2: kind one with yourself. There's no way you can have 604 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 2: it with somebody else. So you were just struggling to 605 00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,440 Speaker 2: get yourself of the day, let allowing it, knowing how 606 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 2: to open up a conversation with somebody. And you know, 607 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:02,080 Speaker 2: I get this at work as well. I used to 608 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 2: think that being a team leader, which I am of 609 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:09,360 Speaker 2: my team, was about being superhuman and actually bringing you 610 00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,080 Speaker 2: know the right time when it's appropriate. But vulnerability and 611 00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:16,240 Speaker 2: honesty actually connects you to your team on a much 612 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 2: deeper level than let's do this, let's do that. Here's 613 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 2: the next big thing we're going to do. That's far 614 00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 2: more important. So, yeah, those life quakes when you're in them, 615 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 2: But in terms of what to share and how much 616 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:31,080 Speaker 2: I think sometimes, I mean, I did share in the 617 00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 2: book about the panic attacks and therapy, just so you understand, 618 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 2: I'd never told anyone other than my wife about No 619 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:39,720 Speaker 2: one knew about that. My mum and dad didn't know. 620 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:41,400 Speaker 2: I had to tell them a week before the book 621 00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:44,520 Speaker 2: came out. I hadn't told anyone in eight years. My 622 00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:49,120 Speaker 2: best friend, when he read the book, rang me in tears. Going, 623 00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:52,920 Speaker 2: I knew we were hanging out, then you could have 624 00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:54,960 Speaker 2: said something I could have done. I could have done, 625 00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:57,640 Speaker 2: But like you, in that moment, that life quake, I 626 00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 2: was terrified. I was gripping onto everything. And as a man, 627 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 2: you know, no sex, no gender, has it easier life. 628 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:07,280 Speaker 2: But as a man, I think we can all agree 629 00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:10,800 Speaker 2: we're not raised to trust our emotions and to know 630 00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 2: how to share them. You're actually taught not to do that. 631 00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:16,200 Speaker 2: It's dangerous. You can't trust people with your emotions. They 632 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:18,600 Speaker 2: might use it against you, take the mickey out of you, 633 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,000 Speaker 2: shame you, and make you feel ashamed. So suddenly, when 634 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,400 Speaker 2: you do have a life quake, you actually haven't got 635 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 2: a lot of the skills. You don't know. You feel 636 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,400 Speaker 2: like you're weak. I did. That's why I resisted going 637 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,800 Speaker 2: to therapy and actually getting help, And so the book 638 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,240 Speaker 2: came out. Really of my daughters start to have tough times, 639 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:39,480 Speaker 2: and my wife said, why don't you tell them you 640 00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:43,000 Speaker 2: know about your panic attacks? And I went, oh, I 641 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,040 Speaker 2: don't know. You know, I don't think they need to 642 00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 2: know that their dad's weak. And they went, well, what 643 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:49,120 Speaker 2: you're trying to tell them At the moment, you keep 644 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,560 Speaker 2: trying to tell them that it's human to struggle, which 645 00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 2: is what they were doing. And one day I was 646 00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:56,160 Speaker 2: trying to connect with my daughters who was having a 647 00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 2: really tough time settling into a new school in here 648 00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:01,080 Speaker 2: in Australia. You know, I was going, you know it's 649 00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 2: and I was giving her the lecture and she just 650 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:04,400 Speaker 2: looked in the eye and said, what do you know? 651 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:08,479 Speaker 2: And so I should have said, I do know about 652 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 2: my own but my own story with this it's not yours, 653 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:14,720 Speaker 2: but he's my. I didn't. I kicked quiet, and that's 654 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:16,120 Speaker 2: when I thought, do you know what, I'm going to 655 00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 2: tell the story now? I'm not going to have in 656 00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:21,000 Speaker 2: the shadows anymore. I need to share this with my kids. 657 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,920 Speaker 2: And it came to the conversations and what that brought us. 658 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:27,360 Speaker 2: That's when I start to think, well, maybe I'd been 659 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:28,720 Speaker 2: asking a couple of times, you should write a book 660 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:30,840 Speaker 2: about what it was like to come to Australia, the 661 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 2: sort of the world, and start again, what do you write? 662 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,880 Speaker 2: And I'd resisted it because it felt pretty boring. That story, 663 00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 2: I don't know, it doesn't interest me. Now I had 664 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 2: that oh, if I'm going to tell that story, I've 665 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:42,440 Speaker 2: got to take them back eight years to have them 666 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 2: panic attacks, because if I didn't have them, didn't get help, 667 00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:47,480 Speaker 2: didn't pay attention to what was really going on, I'd 668 00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:51,400 Speaker 2: lost my mojo and start asking questions why I've I 669 00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:54,680 Speaker 2: lost my mojo? What would get it back? What am 670 00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:57,200 Speaker 2: I really needing right now? In my life, I wouldn't 671 00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 2: have come to Australia. And so that's why I wrote 672 00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 2: the book. I wanted to share it, and I was 673 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 2: terrified about sharing it, and several times I said to 674 00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 2: my life, I can't I'm not going to put the 675 00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,759 Speaker 2: book out there. I'm really think I'm over sharing. I'm 676 00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 2: talking about therapy. I think the listeners are going to 677 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,399 Speaker 2: think I'm weak, you know. And I remember the week 678 00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 2: before the book came out, there was a profile in 679 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 2: the newspaper on me and it mentioned anxiety in the headline, 680 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 2: and I remember it was a Sunday. I remember throwing 681 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,200 Speaker 2: the newspaper at the floor and I started to cry. 682 00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 2: I was I felt ashamed. I'd used to seeing a 683 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,239 Speaker 2: picture of myself in the newspaper along the words with 684 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,040 Speaker 2: success or you know, something like that. I didn't want 685 00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:38,160 Speaker 2: to I couldn't see myself like that was, Oh God, 686 00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,120 Speaker 2: what have I done? And she was forty eight hours 687 00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 2: before the book coming out, and my wife looked to me, like, 688 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:45,360 Speaker 2: this is the start of it. 689 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:45,960 Speaker 1: The book. 690 00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:50,960 Speaker 2: Strap in and I remember, I, you know, almost starting 691 00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:52,600 Speaker 2: to have a full blown panic attack, and I had 692 00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,640 Speaker 2: to go back and do my breathing and paying attention. 693 00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:57,400 Speaker 2: You're sharing the story. You can't control how it's going 694 00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,600 Speaker 2: to be received. And I remember I found the first 695 00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:02,880 Speaker 2: couple of interviews, it's all what anyone want to talk about. 696 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 2: You've read them. It's only about ten percent of the 697 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 2: book about the panic attacks at the beginning, and then 698 00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,000 Speaker 2: we go on to the rest of it, but it's 699 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,800 Speaker 2: all anyone want to talk about. And it kept almost 700 00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 2: bringing them on going back into it. But then something 701 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:16,760 Speaker 2: really life changing happened. I would get I was getting 702 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:19,680 Speaker 2: these emails and people who were stunned that I'd been 703 00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:21,960 Speaker 2: that honest in it. And all I was getting from 704 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:26,280 Speaker 2: men and women was I had no idea, here's my story, 705 00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:29,160 Speaker 2: or thank you for saying that. I just presume that 706 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,960 Speaker 2: people like you don't get it. You know, it was 707 00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:36,959 Speaker 2: a story of hope mine and I guess we need 708 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 2: that in the world. Don't we. And yet I was 709 00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:42,160 Speaker 2: terrified of sharing that. I'm used to sharing stories where 710 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 2: I can control where people laugh. This is one I 711 00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:49,000 Speaker 2: couldn't and that really that was a radical, massive shift 712 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,920 Speaker 2: for me. I was, ah, yeah, so I do know 713 00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:55,279 Speaker 2: what it's like to risk yourself. And sometimes when we 714 00:35:55,360 --> 00:36:00,680 Speaker 2: risk ourselves, what actually comes back is it's great to connection, 715 00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:04,120 Speaker 2: far greater connection. And actually I think we connect to 716 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,640 Speaker 2: each other when we hear stories of overcoming tough stuff 717 00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:10,840 Speaker 2: and even just being honest about it and saying I 718 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:13,800 Speaker 2: went through this, because all people really feel is I, 719 00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,799 Speaker 2: oh you too. Everyone's struggling in their own different way, 720 00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:19,000 Speaker 2: in some shape or form. It's what it is to 721 00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:22,040 Speaker 2: be a human, to be honest. So it's been life changing, 722 00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 2: really has in small ways, you know, But those are 723 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 2: the important ways, aren't they? 724 00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:26,399 Speaker 1: In life? 725 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:27,240 Speaker 2: The small ways. 726 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,080 Speaker 1: Something that caught my attention in your book that just 727 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:33,480 Speaker 1: popped back into my mind is the death Watch. You 728 00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:35,960 Speaker 1: are a death watch for three days and I have 729 00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:39,920 Speaker 1: to ask you about like why and what happened? 730 00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:45,480 Speaker 2: Yes, death watch is a watch and you are put 731 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:49,759 Speaker 2: into it your age, your way, your activity levels, and 732 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,560 Speaker 2: it crunches an algorithm and lets you know roughly when 733 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:55,399 Speaker 2: you're going to die, and it then starts counting down 734 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,239 Speaker 2: backwards until your death, and so you look at it 735 00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:00,480 Speaker 2: and you go, oh my god, time sticking away lost 736 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 2: five minutes doing this. I thought it would make me 737 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:07,239 Speaker 2: stop wasting time and be a wake up call. All 738 00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:10,840 Speaker 2: it does is it's satin traffic. Looking at it going 739 00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 2: three minutes closer to death. It raised my stress levels. 740 00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:17,880 Speaker 2: It was bringing me closer to death, closer than the countdown. 741 00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:21,719 Speaker 2: I remember. It became very problematic in my marriage. My 742 00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,719 Speaker 2: wife would be talking to me, you know, talk about 743 00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:25,719 Speaker 2: some arguments she'd had with her friend Marie, and I'd 744 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 2: be looking at a death watch, going this is another 745 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:30,799 Speaker 2: flip in five minutes until I die, and my wife 746 00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:33,239 Speaker 2: would get really annoyed going that watch. And then one 747 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,880 Speaker 2: day she just stamped on it. She broke it. One 748 00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:38,440 Speaker 2: of the best things, many great things, my wife has done. 749 00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:42,799 Speaker 2: When we're breaking that death watch. What a crazy idea 750 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,920 Speaker 2: for someone like me that overthinks anyway. 751 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:49,920 Speaker 1: Totally, Oh my gosh. Now I did. When I was 752 00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:52,359 Speaker 1: preparing for this interview like two months ago, because we 753 00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:52,880 Speaker 1: were meant. 754 00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:53,920 Speaker 2: To do it a little more. 755 00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:58,239 Speaker 1: I was at school, was open because we weren't in 756 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:02,040 Speaker 1: lockdown in Melbourne like we both had. And when I 757 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:05,000 Speaker 1: would drive my daughter to school she's seven and a half, 758 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,120 Speaker 1: I'd put on your show, the Christian O'Connell show, I'm 759 00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 1: Gold one oh four, And I explained to Frankie, I'm 760 00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:15,480 Speaker 1: going to be interviewing this guy, like, what questions do 761 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:17,879 Speaker 1: you think I should ask him? And at that point 762 00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:20,880 Speaker 1: in time, I think a song from Trolls came on. 763 00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:22,520 Speaker 1: It might have been like a Cyndi law for song 764 00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 1: that's in Trolls. And so Frankie's question for you is 765 00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,640 Speaker 1: do you like the movie Trolls? I do. 766 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:32,719 Speaker 2: I love kids movies. They're beautiful, aren't they the ones 767 00:38:32,840 --> 00:38:34,879 Speaker 2: we grew up with? And then the ones that come 768 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:38,120 Speaker 2: along now, the ones that come along now are masterful 769 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,680 Speaker 2: bits of storytelling. I love the movie Trolls. I would 770 00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:45,320 Speaker 2: like to ask your daughter why if she had to 771 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:48,680 Speaker 2: tell me one line, one sentence, why she loves that movie, 772 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:50,920 Speaker 2: what would she say. I'd love to know what it 773 00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:52,080 Speaker 2: is she really loves about it. 774 00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:53,480 Speaker 1: I will ask her, and I. 775 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:55,000 Speaker 2: Be if you could, and then report back to me. 776 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:57,680 Speaker 2: I do like the movie Trills, assure her. 777 00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:02,279 Speaker 1: Now, Christian for people want to consume more of what 778 00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:06,240 Speaker 1: you're doing and get the hands on. No one listens 779 00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:09,839 Speaker 1: to your dad's show, which I cannot recommend highly enough 780 00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,480 Speaker 1: actually thank you. It's just it's so brave and inspiring 781 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,640 Speaker 1: and like it's gripping. It's a gripping read. I was 782 00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:19,520 Speaker 1: just completely enthralled. What is the best way for people 783 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:20,160 Speaker 1: to do all of that? 784 00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:23,239 Speaker 2: I will say that I also say to you, I 785 00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:26,000 Speaker 2: think that there is a great story and book in you. 786 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,040 Speaker 2: I'll say this to you as a bit of dispersonal advice. 787 00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:33,640 Speaker 2: Whether or not you want to share this is entirely 788 00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:36,600 Speaker 2: up to you that feeling. When you're worried that you're 789 00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,799 Speaker 2: over sharing, you're not. You're actually putting into the world 790 00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 2: what's really really needed from you. Often what we are 791 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:45,560 Speaker 2: worried and think we need to hold back is actually 792 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:49,000 Speaker 2: a thing that's most it's most magical about us, that 793 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:52,279 Speaker 2: people really really really need more than any other part 794 00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:55,560 Speaker 2: of us. So I don't know what that might stir 795 00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:58,520 Speaker 2: up in you or nothing, probably, but just hearing your 796 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:00,799 Speaker 2: story what you've been through, I love I'd know, Yeah, 797 00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:03,640 Speaker 2: that's scripping. I'd like to know about what how are 798 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:07,320 Speaker 2: you balancing that and work and what you do. Now, 799 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,440 Speaker 2: that's a book i'd love to read where you talked 800 00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:12,400 Speaker 2: about that. That would be really interesting. 801 00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:15,040 Speaker 1: Thank you, Christian. I will take that on board. IM 802 00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,400 Speaker 1: actually working on a book for Penguin at the moment 803 00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:19,600 Speaker 1: it is certainly has nothing to do with that, but 804 00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 1: maybe that'll be the next book. Maybe I'll pitch that 805 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:24,280 Speaker 1: to them. So Christian, back to you. How can people 806 00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:24,920 Speaker 1: connect with you? 807 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:29,160 Speaker 2: Oh, you can find me hanging around looking around on Instagram, 808 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:31,560 Speaker 2: mister Christian O'Connell. You can know where you find your 809 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,839 Speaker 2: radio shows or podcast You can google the book, you 810 00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:38,319 Speaker 2: can buy it in the shops and you can get 811 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:43,520 Speaker 2: it online book Topia, Amazon, support your local bookshops, magical places. Yeah, 812 00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:46,600 Speaker 2: thank you very much for the chance to have a chat. Really, 813 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:49,399 Speaker 2: and just I've really enjoyed talking to you. I loved 814 00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:50,280 Speaker 2: all your questions. 815 00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:52,839 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. That's high praise coming from you. Well, 816 00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,680 Speaker 1: I've just I've loved this time to get the Christian. 817 00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:55,560 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. 818 00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 2: I'm blessed. It's been the high light of my day. 819 00:40:58,160 --> 00:40:58,520 Speaker 2: Thank you. 820 00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:02,960 Speaker 1: Hello, that is it for today's show. If you enjoyed 821 00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:06,759 Speaker 1: today's episode, why not share it with someone else? That 822 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,640 Speaker 1: you think would benefit and maybe get some useful tips 823 00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:12,439 Speaker 1: to improve the way that they work. How I Work 824 00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:16,080 Speaker 1: is produced by inventing with production support from Dead Set Studios. 825 00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: And thank you to Martin Nimba who does the audio 826 00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:21,719 Speaker 1: mix for every show and makes everything sound so much 827 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:24,200 Speaker 1: better than it would have otherwise. See you next time.