1 00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:04,600 Speaker 1: The Rising Conquer Podcast acknowledges the traditional custodians of the 2 00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:08,320 Speaker 1: land which this episode is being recorded, the Yugen Bear region. 3 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:13,320 Speaker 1: We further acknowledge country throughout Australia and their connections to land, 4 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:16,840 Speaker 1: sea and community. We pay our respect to their elders 5 00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:20,840 Speaker 1: past and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal 6 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:34,040 Speaker 1: and terrest Raid Islander peoples today. Hello and welcome back 7 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:37,240 Speaker 1: to the Rise and Conquer Podcasts. This is the podcast 8 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 1: for ordinary people who want to do extraordinary things. Hello 9 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:54,720 Speaker 1: and welcome back to the Rise and Conquer Podcast. It 10 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 1: is your host, Georgie Stephenson. I'm a lawyer and entrepreneur, wife, 11 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:04,919 Speaker 1: mum all the things. Today we are joined by Lisa 12 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 1: Messenger as she unpacks what it's been like to be 13 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:11,840 Speaker 1: an entrepreneur for the last twenty years. If you don't 14 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:15,720 Speaker 1: know Lisa, she is a vibrant founder and CEO of 15 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: the Messenger Group as well as the founder and editor 16 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:23,320 Speaker 1: in chief of Collective Hub. She has authored over thirty 17 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: six books in the realms of positive psychology and business, 18 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 1: and as you're hear in today's chat, she has achieved 19 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:35,920 Speaker 1: so many incredible things. So I was just so excited 20 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:39,039 Speaker 1: to get her on the potty and to share all 21 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 1: her wisdom with you. So today we chat about how 22 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: she has been able to continually scale her business on 23 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 1: a global scale, what the pivoting of her business was like, 24 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:55,320 Speaker 1: what her marketing tactics are like, and basically just gives 25 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: us the inside scoop of how she has been so 26 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 1: successful in business. We also chat to Lisa about her 27 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: newest book, Start Up to Scale Up, and she gives 28 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: off her best tips for inspiring entrepreneurs on how they 29 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 1: can grow a successful brand. This chat was so insightful 30 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 1: and I hope you enjoy it. I just I love 31 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:20,000 Speaker 1: chatting to Lisa, So you guys, you're gonna love this one. 32 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:22,440 Speaker 1: Let's get into the show. 33 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 2: Lisa, Welcome to the Rise and Conquer Podcast. How are 34 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 2: you today? 35 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:29,720 Speaker 3: Thank you? It is so good to be here and 36 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 3: I am super well today. 37 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:36,639 Speaker 2: So good. How amazing is it that the sun is shining? 38 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:40,080 Speaker 3: Finally, the sun is shining. I'm not sure where you 39 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 3: are in the world, but I move around a lot, 40 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 3: but today I'm in Barron Bay and the weather is beautiful, amazing. 41 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 2: I'm at the Gold Coast, so I'm in a couple 42 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 2: hours away from you amazing. 43 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:53,640 Speaker 3: Well that's good. I know. I'm kind of living between 44 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:58,000 Speaker 3: Austin in the US, Sydney and Byron, so I never 45 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 3: know where I am on any given day. 46 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 2: I love that. Well, first of all, before we get 47 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:07,760 Speaker 2: into all the goodness, I know everyone would know who 48 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 2: you are, but can you tell the R and C 49 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 2: potty who you are and what you do? 50 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:17,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, so that is a long question, but I'll try 51 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:22,679 Speaker 3: and smush it down. So I'm Lisa Messenger and this 52 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:27,000 Speaker 3: is my twenty first year of having my own business. 53 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,240 Speaker 3: So there's little that I haven't failed at or had 54 00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 3: some level of success at. And yeah, there's a million 55 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 3: different things I can tell you, So maybe we'll unpack 56 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 3: that as we go. 57 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 2: One hundred percent will take us a little bit on 58 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 2: the journey. So you just said you've just you know, 59 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 2: gone through your twenty first year of entrepreneurship, which is incredible, 60 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,240 Speaker 2: what a ride. Can you tell us a little bit 61 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 2: about how your journey has really evolved from the beginning 62 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:00,960 Speaker 2: two now? 63 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, so massive evolution. And I think the lesson for 64 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 3: anyone listening is that a career trajectory doesn't necessarily have 65 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 3: to be formulaic and In fact, sometimes it's only looking 66 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 3: back retrospectively that everything makes sense, because if I look 67 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 3: at mine in a sequential order, it really makes no 68 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:30,600 Speaker 3: sense at all, except that actually everything is perfect in 69 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 3: terms of how I arrived at where I am today. 70 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:36,760 Speaker 3: So before I launched my business, which was the twenty 71 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 3: second of October two thousand and one, I was working 72 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 3: in conference and event management, and from there I love 73 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:49,039 Speaker 3: the sponsorship aspect. So often we kind of go your 74 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:51,839 Speaker 3: land somewhere and you go, which is the piece that 75 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 3: I love of this. So I loved doing deals negotiating, 76 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 3: and I ended up working for a company which was 77 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 3: the last company worked for that wasn't my own, doing 78 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 3: sponsorship for so Dislay and the Wiggles and Barring Humphreys, 79 00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 3: and it was heaps of fun. And so in two 80 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 3: thousand and one I started my own business. But that 81 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 3: was kind of back before anyone was talking about entrepreneurship. 82 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 3: I didn't know anything about podcasts or networking or mentors. 83 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 3: So it was really kind of, you know, just foundational 84 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 3: and rudimentary, and yeah, I didn't know definitely what I 85 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 3: knew now or have access to what we all fortunately 86 00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:36,480 Speaker 3: have access to these days. So I left the agency 87 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:38,839 Speaker 3: because I was a little bossy pants, and my boss 88 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 3: at the time very kindly said, maybe you'd be better 89 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 3: off doing your own thing. So I started a kind 90 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 3: of sponsorship slash marketing agency. And what I'm going to 91 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,359 Speaker 3: say next is kind of important for anyone you know 92 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 3: starting out, is that really for eleven years, I then 93 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:03,080 Speaker 3: over serviced, undercharged was everything to everyone didn't have systems 94 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 3: and processes in place, and because I wasn't plugged into 95 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:12,480 Speaker 3: the things that I said before, networks, mentors, podcasts, education, 96 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 3: So that was like a really long journey. I mean, 97 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 3: I had a lot of fun, I made a lot 98 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 3: of mistakes. I ended up having a very profitable business. 99 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 3: And then in two thousand and twelve, I was surrounded 100 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:30,920 Speaker 3: by so many entrepreneurs by then and amazing innovative thinkers 101 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:34,600 Speaker 3: and thought leaders and game changes. But I was frustrated, 102 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:38,360 Speaker 3: and frustration can be a really great space from which 103 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:41,760 Speaker 3: to start a business or really step into your purpose, 104 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 3: which I did in twenty twelve. Absolutely. So I decided 105 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:50,240 Speaker 3: that there were so many amazing stories being told in 106 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:55,200 Speaker 3: the media of different businesses and entrepreneurs and leaders, but 107 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 3: often it was only the surface level that was being told. 108 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:01,160 Speaker 3: It was kind of like, you know, this person is 109 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 3: successful because of blah, and so we were just reading 110 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 3: about that. But I was always left scratching my head 111 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 3: and going, but how about how? Why? But why? Like 112 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 3: how did they come up with the funding to do that? 113 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:16,440 Speaker 3: What's their supply chain? Like? Where do they get that made? 114 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 3: You know? How are they finding distributors? How are they 115 00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 3: marketing this? Like? So I was always scratching my head, 116 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 3: and I found that these conversations were being had off 117 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:29,040 Speaker 3: and behind closed doors and often very sort of hush hush, 118 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 3: we won't talk about money, we won't give away our suppliers, 119 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 3: you know. And so I decided in twenty twelve to 120 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 3: create a magazine, which I launched in February twenty thirteen 121 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:43,840 Speaker 3: called Collective Hub, which was all about, you know, the 122 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 3: story behind the story, real, raw, attainable, relatable and you know, 123 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 3: it's a very well documented story that I had never 124 00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 3: worked in media, I'd never worked in magazines, and I 125 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:58,480 Speaker 3: entered a highly saturated market. There were about five and 126 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:00,960 Speaker 3: a half thousand print mags in a Styustralia alone at 127 00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 3: the time, but in eighteen months the print magazine was 128 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 3: in thirty seven countries, and I had people like an 129 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 3: A Winter flying me to New York to meet with her. 130 00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 3: And so after eleven years, almost twelve years of kind 131 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 3: of you know, bumbling along, finally something really worked. And 132 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 3: so over the course of the following five years I 133 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 3: did fifty four issues. It exploited. It was enormous. I 134 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 3: was the only person in Australia to have Jamie Oliver 135 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 3: on a cover when he flew to Australia. I've shared 136 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 3: a stage now five times with Sir Richard Branson and 137 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 3: we're good friends and like, it really was amazing until 138 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 3: it wasn't so. Two thousand and eighteen, I was hemorrhaging cash. 139 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:47,959 Speaker 3: I'd grown too quickly again, didn't have the right systems 140 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:50,680 Speaker 3: and processes in place. It was now a very large, 141 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 3: very global business with a lot of people working for me, 142 00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 3: and so I made the courageous decision after fifty four 143 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 3: issues to close the print magaz and from then I 144 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,319 Speaker 3: basically kind of sat for a while and went, Okay, 145 00:09:05,880 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 3: I now have the confidence, the resilience, the tenacity, the 146 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 3: self belief to know that I can do this again. 147 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 3: But sometimes we have to break something in order to 148 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:17,839 Speaker 3: truly remake it. And so for the last couple of 149 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:23,319 Speaker 3: years I've been producing well, we've done over sixty books, journals, 150 00:09:23,720 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 3: dated products, affirmation cards and yeah, and it's we now have. 151 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 3: I now have a much bigger, much more sustainable, much 152 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:36,960 Speaker 3: more global profitable business than I had back then. And 153 00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 3: we've just bought out issue fifty five of the print bag. 154 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 3: So even though I closed it for four years, I'll 155 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,880 Speaker 3: probably now do one issue a year, but as a 156 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 3: chunky coffee table book or look as we're calling it. 157 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 3: So that's kind of the snapshot of twenty one years. 158 00:09:56,200 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 2: That is incredible. And I think what I love most 159 00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:04,679 Speaker 2: about you and what you do and all your books is, 160 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:10,120 Speaker 2: like you said, just how honest, real and raw you are, 161 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:14,040 Speaker 2: Like you just completely tell us how it is, and 162 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 2: it is sometimes it feels like, especially with entrepreneurship, it's 163 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 2: like this secret. It's like everyone has this you know, 164 00:10:23,559 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 2: secret about what they're doing and no one wants to 165 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 2: tell anyone. So I just love how you completely open 166 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 2: it up, give us everything. And then you're also just 167 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:38,479 Speaker 2: so honest about you know, learning your lessons, evolving, realizing 168 00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:42,160 Speaker 2: that something that worked really well for a certain amount 169 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:45,120 Speaker 2: of time, you know, then didn't and you had to 170 00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:48,440 Speaker 2: pivot and you had to evolve, and just you know, 171 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:50,800 Speaker 2: taking that being like, yes, this is it. 172 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 3: Yes, definitely lots of lessons And I think one of 173 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 3: the biggest learnings in all those years is that and 174 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 3: this takes a long time to learn. It's really in 175 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 3: my experience, the times of hardship and adversity, whilst often 176 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 3: excruciating at the time, they are the points if I 177 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 3: can lean into them, where the most growth comes, and 178 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 3: you know, where the evolution and the ability to pivot, 179 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 3: the word of like twenty twenty twenty twenty one come. 180 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 3: So I would say to anyone you know in life, 181 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 3: I mean I've been through divorce, my dad has died, 182 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 3: you know, I've been through a lot of excruciating, very difficult, 183 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 3: tumultuous times in both my personal life and in my 184 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 3: business life. And it's those times if we can really 185 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 3: lean in and go, Okay, what am I learning? What 186 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:47,680 Speaker 3: is the lesson? You know, this is happening for me 187 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:51,520 Speaker 3: as opposed to this is happening to me and trying 188 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 3: to reframe our mindset, then we have the ability to 189 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 3: you know, somehow move through and rise up. 190 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,199 Speaker 2: That I love that so much, So, Lisa, before we 191 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:08,040 Speaker 2: get into entrepreneurship and talking about your new amazing book, 192 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:11,560 Speaker 2: this is just something that I love chatting to you know, 193 00:12:11,800 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 2: successful people, and especially because I know that you're just 194 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,439 Speaker 2: going to give us the most honest answer. How much 195 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 2: would you say of your you know, routines and rituals 196 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:27,080 Speaker 2: really have led to your success, And could you give 197 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 2: us an insight into you know, maybe your ideal routine, 198 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 2: like you can do your morning routine, your routine to 199 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,080 Speaker 2: you know, get back into it to find motivation, whatever 200 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:39,000 Speaker 2: you want to chat about. 201 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:43,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, So it's such a good question because I think 202 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:48,600 Speaker 3: it's almost counterintuitive to what we expect being an entrepreneur, 203 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:53,760 Speaker 3: is right, because we largely start with the notion of 204 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:57,120 Speaker 3: I'm going to start my own business for freedom and choice. 205 00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:03,479 Speaker 3: But in my experience, one hundred percent, we need routines, rituals, 206 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:08,080 Speaker 3: and disciplines in able to be the biggest, best version 207 00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 3: of ourselves. So for me, because I'm leading such a 208 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:15,720 Speaker 3: kind of large life across multiple time zones and you know, 209 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:18,320 Speaker 3: traveling a lot, so it's really imperative to me that 210 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:22,120 Speaker 3: I'm able to you know, have some structure and feel 211 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:26,040 Speaker 3: kind of centered and grounded. So for me, my morning 212 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 3: really or my day is divided into two. And I 213 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,560 Speaker 3: always say to people, you know, work out what works 214 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 3: for you, and you know, listen to the similarity. It 215 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 3: is not the differences. But for me, I basically pre 216 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 3: ten am it's about me. So it's about I do 217 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:45,560 Speaker 3: some meditation, I always do some training, so exercise in 218 00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 3: the morning. I have a personal trainer, or I go 219 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:50,720 Speaker 3: to a yoga class, or I'll do a walk, and 220 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:55,319 Speaker 3: I'll do some journaling and I will do something nutrition Also, 221 00:13:55,400 --> 00:13:58,200 Speaker 3: I'll always have a green smoothie and I'll listen to 222 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:01,000 Speaker 3: a podcast. So pre ten am is really for me 223 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 3: all about filling my mind, my body, my spirit and 224 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 3: kind of really taking all of that in. Now, that 225 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 3: doesn't work for everyone. You know, people have kids, they 226 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 3: need to take them to school, they have other responsibilities. 227 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 3: They might have an actual job where they need to 228 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:19,520 Speaker 3: turn up at eight o'clock in the morning or whatever 229 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 3: it is. But for me, I kind of go, okay, 230 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 3: that's my time when I'm you know, searching within, I'm 231 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 3: filling my own cup and from there it's like game on. 232 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 3: From ten am, it's like whatever the world needs of me. 233 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:38,280 Speaker 3: So I'm responding, reacting to emails, my team, I'm having meetings, 234 00:14:38,280 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 3: I'm doing podcasts, I'm doing all the things required of 235 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 3: me during the day. But I absolutely, unequivocally use the 236 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:49,160 Speaker 3: morning to fill my cup and to fill myself up. 237 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 2: It's so important and I love that you, you know, 238 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 2: touched on as much as you know. We want to 239 00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 2: be entrepreneurs so we can be on our own time 240 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,800 Speaker 2: time and do what we want when we want. I 241 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 2: am the exact say where if I don't have, you know, 242 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:10,120 Speaker 2: a routine or ritual that really kind of steps me up, 243 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 2: fills up my cup. I just noticed the day just 244 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,960 Speaker 2: goes completely different compared to when I'm in that and 245 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 2: I am I'm a new mum. So the morning routine 246 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 2: used to be much like you to ten am, and 247 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:29,280 Speaker 2: oh my god, I relished in it. Now I miss 248 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 2: it so much. But it's a little bit different, but 249 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:34,920 Speaker 2: honestly much the same. And it's just about realizing that, 250 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 2: you know, we go through seasons where it does change 251 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 2: and you have to do different things. But like for 252 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 2: me personally, a big ritual is like at least half 253 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:47,200 Speaker 2: an hour to an hour in the morning and the 254 00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 2: night that is for me filling up my cup. It's just, oh, 255 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 2: it's just such a game changer. 256 00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think, you know, it's really important because 257 00:15:57,520 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 3: and I have certainly been guilty of this, particularly having 258 00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:04,000 Speaker 3: your own business. You know, you think, oh, I've just 259 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 3: got to work all the time, and there's always something 260 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 3: to be done, and you know, because there is a lot, 261 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:12,600 Speaker 3: and often, particularly when you're starting out, it's like, you know, 262 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 3: am I ideating? Am I building the product? Am I 263 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 3: trying to work out more distributors? Am I trying to 264 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 3: sell more? Am I trying to come up with new 265 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 3: marketing plans? You know? Should I be posting on Instagram 266 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 3: or Twitter or LinkedIn or TikTok. If I'm on Instagram, 267 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:31,160 Speaker 3: should I be making a real or a static post 268 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 3: or a story? Like? It can be a lot, right, 269 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 3: And so the mistake we often make is we think 270 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 3: I just need to be busy, I just need to 271 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:40,000 Speaker 3: keep going, I need to be frenetic, I need to 272 00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 3: do all of it. But actually I find it is 273 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 3: only when we allow ourselves the time and space to 274 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 3: breathe and stop that that's when my good ideas come, 275 00:16:51,160 --> 00:16:54,920 Speaker 3: or that's when I regain that sense of calm and composure, 276 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 3: and I feel grounded and centered and only from that 277 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 3: space can I actually do the big things. 278 00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 2: And do them well one hundred percent. Well, let's start 279 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:08,200 Speaker 2: talking about well, you know, we are talking about entrepreneurship, 280 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 2: but I really want to get into more about that 281 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:15,159 Speaker 2: because I recently just read your book Start Up to 282 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:19,719 Speaker 2: Scale Up, and it was incredible. Not only is it 283 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 2: like the most beautiful, you know, business book it is 284 00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 2: you know, it very much looks like a coffee table book, 285 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 2: and I know that to your style it is so beautiful, 286 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 2: but everything inside it just like I loved reading it. 287 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:36,000 Speaker 2: I actually just read it. I've just went to holidays 288 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,480 Speaker 2: for a week in Fiji and I read it on 289 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 2: holidays and it just it was such an amazing experience. 290 00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,919 Speaker 2: And I think that's something you do so well, you know, 291 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:47,840 Speaker 2: with everything you do. It is such an experience, and 292 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:50,960 Speaker 2: it is the whole thing where I'm getting, you know, 293 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,960 Speaker 2: I'm getting the value, I'm getting, the business ideas, I'm 294 00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 2: getting all that. Plus it comes in a way that 295 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 2: it's very aesthetically pleasing. Please this is my eyes, and 296 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:04,520 Speaker 2: I feel like you just you encompass that so well. 297 00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:08,200 Speaker 2: I would love to know what is like a simple 298 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:12,639 Speaker 2: and actionable I guess like tip or just suggestion from 299 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:17,360 Speaker 2: you to turn an idea into a business. And I'm 300 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,959 Speaker 2: interested in this just because I feel like you very 301 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:24,639 Speaker 2: much break the boundaries where you're not really listening, you 302 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:27,560 Speaker 2: know what everyone else is doing. Much like you said 303 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:29,680 Speaker 2: when you started your print company, like a lot of 304 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:32,120 Speaker 2: people said, you know, print was dead, and then you 305 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,760 Speaker 2: completely prove them wrong. So I would love to hear 306 00:18:35,119 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 2: your opinion on turning an idea into a business. 307 00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, so I mean and thank you for your beautiful 308 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:47,240 Speaker 3: words about startup to scale up. I feel like, oh gosh, 309 00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 3: I've written I think over body books now, but that's 310 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:54,520 Speaker 3: probably one of the most useful because it's almost like 311 00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:57,720 Speaker 3: I've put every single thing that I've learned over the 312 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:01,199 Speaker 3: last twenty one years into that book, from how to 313 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:04,520 Speaker 3: ida through right through to how to sort of scale 314 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:10,120 Speaker 3: a business. In terms of starting, I always say, find 315 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:12,959 Speaker 3: a problem and you would know from the book. I 316 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 3: kind of had a different take on that. I'm like, 317 00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:18,439 Speaker 3: rather than carry around an ideas book, carry around a 318 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:25,160 Speaker 3: problems book, because so often what becomes a startup idea 319 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:28,560 Speaker 3: is it often comes from a problem that we've encountered. 320 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,919 Speaker 3: And in fact, pretty much all of my businesses or 321 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 3: all of the products that I produce, come from a problem. 322 00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 3: So for example, I wrote my first book in two 323 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 3: thousand and four and it was called Happiness Is. And 324 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 3: the reason I wrote that was at the time, I 325 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:50,440 Speaker 3: was so incredibly unhappy and I was holding myself back 326 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 3: and I was self sabotaging. So I was right, right, 327 00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 3: I'm going to solve this. And when I put that 328 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 3: book out, I realized that so many other people, you know, 329 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:01,560 Speaker 3: felt the same same. With the magazine, I was like, oh, 330 00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 3: I'm so frustrated, like why isn't there media telling the 331 00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:08,280 Speaker 3: story behind the story and you know, what's raw and 332 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:10,919 Speaker 3: real and all of that kind of thing. So again 333 00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 3: I identified a problem or a gap in the market, 334 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:17,199 Speaker 3: and therefore it worked. And that can be also as 335 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:19,400 Speaker 3: simple as you just said, you're a new mum. If 336 00:20:19,440 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 3: you're you know, putting nappies on your baby, that you 337 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:26,320 Speaker 3: realize that they're I don't know, rubbing them the wrong way, 338 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:28,399 Speaker 3: or they don't fit properly or something like that, you 339 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:32,280 Speaker 3: can identify a problem. And I think often when we 340 00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 3: identify it, it means that other people are also experiencing that. 341 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:40,400 Speaker 3: So I highly encourage anyone to kind of carry around 342 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:44,360 Speaker 3: a problems book and just find, you know, what is lacking, 343 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:47,840 Speaker 3: what's annoying me, what am I frustrated with? Where do 344 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 3: I find there's a gap in the market? What do 345 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 3: I think could be done better? So that's number one. 346 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 3: Number two would be then you need to feel into 347 00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 3: Does this excite me, juice me up, make me feel alive? 348 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:02,960 Speaker 3: Do I want to jump out of bed for this? 349 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 3: You know? Is this a problem that I want to solve? 350 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 3: Because there's plenty of problems out there, and particularly as 351 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:14,440 Speaker 3: a well seasoned entrepreneur, I see things everywhere across every industry, 352 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 3: whether I'm sitting in a coffee shop and something's annoying me, 353 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:19,159 Speaker 3: or I see I buy, you know, a piece of 354 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:23,400 Speaker 3: clothing and something frustrates me. But those things don't necessarily 355 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:25,760 Speaker 3: excite me. So the problem might exist, But if it 356 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 3: doesn't excite me, then it's not something that I'm personally 357 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:33,880 Speaker 3: going to tackle. So yeah, number one, identify problems. Number 358 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,000 Speaker 3: two does it really align with you? Does it make 359 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:41,000 Speaker 3: your soul feel alive and on fire? And number three 360 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 3: is there some kind of commercial opportunity? I mean that 361 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,880 Speaker 3: is imperative, and whilst I couldn't care less about money 362 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 3: for money's sake, I do care about it because it 363 00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 3: helps us to, you know, grow a sustainable business. So 364 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 3: then you need to think about, well, Okay, I see 365 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 3: a problem this idea, but are there people willing to 366 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:04,520 Speaker 3: buy it? And if the answer to number one was 367 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:08,159 Speaker 3: as a problem, then more often than not, there is 368 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:11,199 Speaker 3: probably an audience and a market ready to buy it. 369 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 3: So that's kind of what I do. Identify problems and 370 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,320 Speaker 3: make sure that they aligned with my kind of personal 371 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 3: values and where I want to be in the world. 372 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:23,679 Speaker 2: One hundred percent. And something I'd love for you to 373 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:27,480 Speaker 2: touch on just because, first of all, I think, like, 374 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:30,640 Speaker 2: that's incredible the way that you just explained that. What 375 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:34,639 Speaker 2: would you say in regards to people who they think, oh, 376 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,200 Speaker 2: you know, I have this amazing idea and I'm really 377 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:41,679 Speaker 2: passionate about it, but it is kind of going again, 378 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,159 Speaker 2: what everyone else is doing. What would you say to 379 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:44,719 Speaker 2: that person? 380 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 3: I think there's a couple of things I would say there. 381 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:51,399 Speaker 3: One is almost the opposite of what you just said. 382 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 3: A lot of people are afraid to go into a 383 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 3: highly saturated market, so a lot of people will kind 384 00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:00,360 Speaker 3: of go, oh, I'm not going to do something in 385 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 3: print because there's already in my case, as I explained, 386 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 3: five and a half thousand print magazines sitting in the 387 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 3: Australian market, or you know, it could be milk or 388 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,800 Speaker 3: toilet paper. People might shy away from things that are 389 00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 3: already saturated or you know, hotels or uber or all 390 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 3: sorts of things, right, and so in that case, it's 391 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:25,400 Speaker 3: like often with an existing highly saturated market where there's 392 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 3: a lot of competitors and a lot of noise, that 393 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 3: can be actually a great place to start because it 394 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,000 Speaker 3: means that there is a ready market. You've just got 395 00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 3: to be able to do something better and in your 396 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 3: own unique way. And the other side of it, which 397 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,639 Speaker 3: I think is your question, is around you know what 398 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 3: if other people are saying no, don't do that, is 399 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 3: that what you were asking? 400 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:49,359 Speaker 2: Yeah? 401 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So in that case, I think again, you've 402 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 3: got to be really careful about who you listen to. 403 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 3: So I'm always is very very careful, and I cash 404 00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 3: questions to people and I ask for very specific feedback. 405 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,720 Speaker 3: So there's something called the distalt theory, and it's basically 406 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 3: around you know that I will say to people, you know, 407 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,439 Speaker 3: do you have particular experience with this problem? Do you 408 00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:22,800 Speaker 3: understand you know what I'm talking about, because otherwise people 409 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:26,160 Speaker 3: will just put their own kind of you know, theories 410 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,800 Speaker 3: or their own experiences onto it, which aren't necessarily applicable 411 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:32,880 Speaker 3: to your situation, if that makes sense. So I'm very 412 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,359 Speaker 3: very careful about the feedback that I ask for because 413 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:37,800 Speaker 3: there will be a lot of people who will be 414 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 3: very quick to say, oh no, don't do that, that's 415 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:43,639 Speaker 3: a really silly idea. So you've got to just, you know, 416 00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:46,320 Speaker 3: if it's something that you feel really passionate about, if 417 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:52,040 Speaker 3: it's a problem that you've experienced, then more likely you're 418 00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:55,160 Speaker 3: going to have some kind of success because you're passionate 419 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 3: about it. So try and listen less and less to 420 00:24:57,800 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 3: other people's opinions. 421 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 2: Thank you for Shane. Yeah, and I guess even moving 422 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,760 Speaker 2: on to that, so what would your advice be for 423 00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:08,880 Speaker 2: someone who currently is, you know, they're doing their side hustle. 424 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 2: Their business has shown potential, it's you know, maybe it's 425 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:16,760 Speaker 2: not profiting, but it really needs that full time capacity. 426 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,680 Speaker 2: What would you say to that person who does want 427 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:23,000 Speaker 2: to transition into doing their side hustle full time. 428 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,119 Speaker 3: Yeah, so side hustle is great, and I think you know, 429 00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:30,639 Speaker 3: more and more people now are having side hustles and 430 00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:34,639 Speaker 3: it is a brilliant way to test an idea, test 431 00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,040 Speaker 3: the market whilst you're still you know, working for someone 432 00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:42,399 Speaker 3: else and earning money generally, so or you might be 433 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:44,440 Speaker 3: stay at home and you're doing you know, side hustle 434 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:46,760 Speaker 3: on the side, or there's a variety of different ways 435 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:49,919 Speaker 3: that people can start to do a side hustle. A 436 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 3: side hustle is great because you're testing and iterating generally 437 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:58,680 Speaker 3: in a smaller fashion. So I would say the time 438 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,719 Speaker 3: to jump and make it a full time gig is 439 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 3: don't wait for everything to be perfect, but it is 440 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:08,119 Speaker 3: good to actually, you know, test the market. And I 441 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,280 Speaker 3: talk a lot about this in startup to scale up, 442 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:12,560 Speaker 3: as you will know, I talk a lot about you know, 443 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 3: minimum order quantities in the case of products or minimum 444 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 3: viable products, and I go into a lot of detail 445 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,360 Speaker 3: around you know, how you test and how you ensure 446 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:26,160 Speaker 3: that you're you know, mitigating risk. But I think if 447 00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:29,040 Speaker 3: someone started something, if it's a I don't know, service 448 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:32,159 Speaker 3: based business and you've tried to get a couple of 449 00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:34,920 Speaker 3: clients and people are happy to pay, and you haven't 450 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 3: had to outlay a lot of money, then you can 451 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,320 Speaker 3: kind of go, okay, I've tested that, I know there 452 00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,480 Speaker 3: are people there, so you know, I can probably take 453 00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:45,959 Speaker 3: the leap because I've tested it. Products are slightly harder 454 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:49,560 Speaker 3: because often, you know, you have to produce a certain 455 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:53,720 Speaker 3: amount of widgets to meet you know, printer or factory 456 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 3: or supplier requirements. But again, if you can try to 457 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:01,920 Speaker 3: produce initially you know, the minimum order that is possible 458 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,720 Speaker 3: at the least possible cost and test the market, then 459 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,760 Speaker 3: that could be a side hustle. Once people start buying 460 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,040 Speaker 3: and you think, okay, I've kind of got proof of concept, 461 00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,000 Speaker 3: then again it might be time to actually, you know, 462 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 3: take the leap. I think it's really important to always have, 463 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:23,360 Speaker 3: if you can, some kind of cash reserve because nothing 464 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,399 Speaker 3: is fail safe, and as we've seen, particularly in the 465 00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 3: last couple of years, there are often a lot of 466 00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:32,600 Speaker 3: external factors at play that are beyond our control, which 467 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:36,520 Speaker 3: could be you know, economic uncertainty due to you know, 468 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:40,240 Speaker 3: wars or pandemics or a number of other things, and 469 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 3: so you know, we need to really ask ourselves the question, 470 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,119 Speaker 3: what am I prepared to lose and you know what 471 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:51,280 Speaker 3: is my backup plan? Because I can tell you right 472 00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 3: now in Australia, for example, even though we've got a 473 00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 3: pretty successful e commerce business now, the e commerce side 474 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:02,160 Speaker 3: of things in the last three months, probably doing about 475 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:06,119 Speaker 3: a tenth of our revenue on a daily basis at 476 00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:08,439 Speaker 3: the moment, and we've just launched into the US and 477 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:12,159 Speaker 3: that is like flying. But you know, there are certain 478 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:14,960 Speaker 3: things that come into play that are beyond that control. 479 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 3: So you've really got to kind of set up. Okay, 480 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,400 Speaker 3: am I ready to make this leap? You know what 481 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 3: resources to do I have behind me, how much am 482 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:26,040 Speaker 3: I prepared to lose? And then just go for it. 483 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,600 Speaker 3: You know, there's never going to be an exact right time. 484 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,919 Speaker 3: But I think the reason that I've written Startup to 485 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,480 Speaker 3: Scale Up is very much so that I can give 486 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 3: people a you know, step by step, this is exactly 487 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 3: what to do. These are the checklists, these are the plans, 488 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,600 Speaker 3: so that hopefully people can you know, take some of 489 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,320 Speaker 3: my experience and lessons learned over the years. 490 00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 2: And the book is just so incredible with so much 491 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,760 Speaker 2: information and you through like you really go so in depth. 492 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 2: I very much encourage anyone listening to check it out, 493 00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,800 Speaker 2: because it just yeah, it goes into everything, into so 494 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:07,320 Speaker 2: much detail. Something I wanted to ask you is, what 495 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 2: do you think are characteristics that a successful entrepreneur has 496 00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:13,040 Speaker 2: to possess? 497 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 3: Number one is self belief, And you know that takes 498 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 3: or can take a long time to build up because 499 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 3: you know, often when you start out, you think, oh gosh, 500 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:30,120 Speaker 3: can I do this? Imposter syndrome might creep in. You know, 501 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 3: you might try and self sabotage, you know, fear of 502 00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:36,720 Speaker 3: am I not good enough? Do I not have enough experience? 503 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,960 Speaker 3: So it's really really important to you know, get strong 504 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 3: and to get a you know, almost unshakable self belief. 505 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 3: I mean, I think that is absolutely number one. And 506 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 3: what kind of goes hand in hand with that is 507 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:56,440 Speaker 3: resilience and tenacity, because what I know for sure is, 508 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 3: you know, even still twenty one years in, people will 509 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 3: you know, slab a door in my face, or they 510 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 3: won't they won't take a phone call, or they won't 511 00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:09,200 Speaker 3: buy a product. And it can be really frustrating sometimes 512 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,880 Speaker 3: you think, but wait, this is like the perfect fit 513 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 3: for your customers or your audience, Like how can you 514 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,360 Speaker 3: not see this? But still you know, even though now 515 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 3: I have a pretty established brand and you know, some 516 00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 3: great product market fit, sometimes people will be like, nuts, 517 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,280 Speaker 3: doesn't work for us. So you've got to build up 518 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 3: that resilience muscle and that tenacity and kind of talk 519 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 3: a lot about duality. You've got to build you know, resilience, 520 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 3: but you've also got to be able to maintain a 521 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 3: certain level of vulnerability and you know, empathy and kindness 522 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 3: and humanness, and you know, people don't often always get 523 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 3: that right, particularly in you know, the corporate world. There's 524 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,160 Speaker 3: a lot of still unfortunately, you know, fist banging people 525 00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 3: who are all about ego and hard shells and I'm 526 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:02,760 Speaker 3: just gonna like win it all costs and you've got 527 00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:06,160 Speaker 3: to have a certain amount of that and a certain 528 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 3: amount of grit. But I really believe very very strongly 529 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:13,320 Speaker 3: that you've got to be able to maintain that human side, 530 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:19,760 Speaker 3: that vulnerability, that empathy, that compassion, that ability to you know, 531 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 3: have communication skills, and so they're all really important attributes. 532 00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 2: I think I love that you touched on those human 533 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 2: skills because I feel like I've asked quite a little 534 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:35,480 Speaker 2: people this question and no one has like touch on that. 535 00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:39,280 Speaker 2: But that's so true. Something else that you kind of 536 00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:42,960 Speaker 2: spoke about at the start is you explained that you know, 537 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 2: you and I remember reading this in the book too, 538 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:51,160 Speaker 2: that like everything happens for reasons, and your failures always 539 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,280 Speaker 2: lead you to where you're meant to go. And I 540 00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 2: love that. It's so it's similar to you know my 541 00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:59,840 Speaker 2: favorite quote of like everything happens for a reason. Could 542 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:03,120 Speaker 2: you possibly tell us about an example of this and 543 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 2: how a failure or something that you didn't quite like 544 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 2: at the time really set you on this new path 545 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 2: that turned out to be, you know, better than you 546 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:13,800 Speaker 2: could have imagined. 547 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean there's so many there's I mean, I 548 00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 3: could give you millions of examples, big and small, but 549 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 3: I mean probably the biggest, like failure which didn't end 550 00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 3: up being a failure. But you know, when I grew 551 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 3: Collective Hub from twenty thirteen until twenty eighteen, and you know, 552 00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:36,080 Speaker 3: it was at its peak, like it was the hottest 553 00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 3: thing on everyone's lips. You know, I was invited to 554 00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:41,600 Speaker 3: the greatest parties. As I said, you know, Anna Winter 555 00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 3: invited me to go meet with her in New York. 556 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 3: I've spent time on Richard Branson's private Island Necker and 557 00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 3: make peace like several times, and like everything was amazing 558 00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 3: for five years, but I did not have the right 559 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,760 Speaker 3: foundations in place. So even though this brand was so 560 00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:03,480 Speaker 3: hot and growing, I hadn't set up the right systems 561 00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 3: and processes and I hadn't really tapped into what my 562 00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:12,240 Speaker 3: strengths were. So I am a great founder, and I'm 563 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,360 Speaker 3: a great visionary, and I'm a great leader, and I 564 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:19,120 Speaker 3: see things before they exist. I'm a great negotiator. I'm 565 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:25,960 Speaker 3: not necessarily great at the detail and the operational side 566 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 3: of it and the data. So in a business, you 567 00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:30,680 Speaker 3: need to have both. You need to have big ideas 568 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,560 Speaker 3: people and big visionaries, but you also need to have 569 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:39,440 Speaker 3: data orientated detail implementers. And I didn't have the right 570 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 3: people like that alongside me, and I didn't have the 571 00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:46,640 Speaker 3: right systems and processes. So what happened was I had 572 00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 3: to close the print magazine, which was my baby and 573 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:52,320 Speaker 3: you know, the love of my life and was at 574 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,800 Speaker 3: the center of my entire business. So that was gut 575 00:33:55,840 --> 00:34:01,760 Speaker 3: wrenching and heartbreaking and horrible, but it was also the 576 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 3: greatest thing to ever happen, because you don't know what 577 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:07,880 Speaker 3: you don't know, and I was suddenly sitting at the 578 00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 3: helm of a very big global business across multiple revenue streams, 579 00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:16,279 Speaker 3: across thirty seven different countries. But it wasn't until I 580 00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:19,359 Speaker 3: got there that I realized, oh my gosh, I need 581 00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,160 Speaker 3: to strip this back. I need to cut the guts 582 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,839 Speaker 3: out of it in order to break it to remake it. 583 00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:29,000 Speaker 3: So I did that. And it's only through doing that 584 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:32,759 Speaker 3: and that kind of almost epic failure and you know, 585 00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:37,560 Speaker 3: heart wrenching stuff, that I actually was able to build 586 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:43,440 Speaker 3: or rebuild a really strong, really great global business with 587 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:49,000 Speaker 3: really solid foundations that is now pretty unshakable and pretty 588 00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:51,239 Speaker 3: future proofed. So I had to go to the edge 589 00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:56,200 Speaker 3: of that uncomfortability in order to be really really strong 590 00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:58,359 Speaker 3: and to be able to move forward. And the same 591 00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 3: quld be said for a million things. You know, I 592 00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:03,800 Speaker 3: was married, wasn't the right marriage, you know that ended 593 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:08,120 Speaker 3: Now have been with my fiance for six years, you know, amazing. 594 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:12,240 Speaker 3: So I think everything at the time, personal or business wise, 595 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 3: that is difficult, excruciating, horrendous. You know, in time, even 596 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 3: though we may not be able to see it when 597 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,319 Speaker 3: it's happening and when we're in the midst of it, 598 00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:27,040 Speaker 3: in time, Actually, these things do generally happen for a reason. 599 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:30,880 Speaker 3: And now that I've had so much crap happened to 600 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,760 Speaker 3: me in life, generally, even when I'm in the midst 601 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:35,879 Speaker 3: of it, I can I kind of have this inner 602 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:39,960 Speaker 3: knowing of Okay, I've just got to move through this. 603 00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,480 Speaker 3: It is going to be better at the other side. 604 00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:46,359 Speaker 3: What other lessons? What is this teaching me? How can 605 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,880 Speaker 3: I use this hard time to springboard me into something 606 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,400 Speaker 3: much more powerful? And how can I rise up and 607 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:55,480 Speaker 3: be the next best version of me? 608 00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 2: I am so intrigued now. So you just chatted about 609 00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:03,160 Speaker 2: how you realize that, you know, the company grew so 610 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:06,200 Speaker 2: fast that you didn't have the systems and the processes, 611 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:09,279 Speaker 2: and I guess the foundations. And that's actually something I'm 612 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:12,239 Speaker 2: going through at the moment within my business, is like 613 00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:18,080 Speaker 2: really cementing the foundation so we can scale, you know, 614 00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:20,680 Speaker 2: later on. And that's why my favorite part of your 615 00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:24,520 Speaker 2: book was the scale section. But I'd love to know. So, 616 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 2: like you said, you're a person who that sort of 617 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:30,759 Speaker 2: side of things isn't isn't your vibe, isn't your zone 618 00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:34,640 Speaker 2: a genius? What did you then do to make sure 619 00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,920 Speaker 2: you do have the system and processes and really really 620 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:41,959 Speaker 2: kind of like build that foundation for the business going forward. 621 00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,879 Speaker 3: So everything now and some people are wits at this, 622 00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:52,600 Speaker 3: but everything is data. I mean there is so even 623 00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:55,840 Speaker 3: though I'm a creative, I come up with the ideas 624 00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,520 Speaker 3: for every single product that we do across the business. 625 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,799 Speaker 3: I'm kind of the one who you know comes up 626 00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:05,600 Speaker 3: with all the ideas, you know, like top level, and 627 00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:09,440 Speaker 3: I don't love the data. I have people around me 628 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:14,080 Speaker 3: now that every single day I'm looking at data. So 629 00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:17,720 Speaker 3: every single day I have a CFO. It's a chief 630 00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,760 Speaker 3: financial officer, but that could be a bookkeeper for other people, 631 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:23,920 Speaker 3: or it could be that you become you know, comfortable 632 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:27,920 Speaker 3: with using zero or moyob or one of the other programs. 633 00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:32,200 Speaker 3: But every single day I'm looking at spreadsheets. I'm looking 634 00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,440 Speaker 3: at profit and loss. I'm looking at our cash flow 635 00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 3: really important. I'm looking at break evens. I'm looking at 636 00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:45,640 Speaker 3: payables and receivables. I'm looking at kind of you know, 637 00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:50,239 Speaker 3: future projections for different products. And there is not a 638 00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:54,239 Speaker 3: day that goes by where I'm not looking at financial reports. 639 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,800 Speaker 3: Because my business is you know big. Now We've done 640 00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:01,640 Speaker 3: i don't know, close to sixty products in the last 641 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,600 Speaker 3: probably eighteen months, and every single time I hit print 642 00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:09,240 Speaker 3: on a product, it costs me at least probably sixty 643 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:13,160 Speaker 3: sixty five thousand dollars, so and then we're doing multiple reprints, 644 00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:15,239 Speaker 3: so I've got a lot of money moving in and 645 00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 3: out across a lot of different countries and markets and 646 00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:21,759 Speaker 3: distribution channels. So I've got to look at that all day, 647 00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:25,880 Speaker 3: every day. And I also look at numbers around social media. 648 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:29,000 Speaker 3: So we have I think seventeen different social media channels. 649 00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:32,719 Speaker 3: So I'm constantly looking at data in terms of what 650 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:36,720 Speaker 3: is our engagement, like, you know, what's the upshot? Because 651 00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:39,640 Speaker 3: I've got to measure everything. Everything's input and output. So 652 00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:42,840 Speaker 3: my team, my social media team is you know, a 653 00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:48,320 Speaker 3: content creator, graphic designer, someone who uploads and schedules everything 654 00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:50,960 Speaker 3: and responds. And then I've got, you know, an ads person. 655 00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:53,440 Speaker 3: So I've constantly got to be looking at, well, if 656 00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:58,239 Speaker 3: I'm spending x amount on salaries and freelancers, what is 657 00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:03,120 Speaker 3: the engagement and also what is the revenue that we 658 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:07,480 Speaker 3: are deriving specifically from organic social media and paid social media. 659 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 3: So I'm looking at those reports all the time, and 660 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,200 Speaker 3: then I'm looking at all sorts of other things So for example, 661 00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:15,319 Speaker 3: at the moment, we're doing four trade fairs in five 662 00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:18,600 Speaker 3: weeks in the US. We're doing Atlanta, Vegas, LA, and 663 00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:21,319 Speaker 3: New York. So every day at the moment, I'm looking 664 00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:24,520 Speaker 3: at data because it's a relatively new market for us 665 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,799 Speaker 3: on a large scale, so I'm looking at what are 666 00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:30,160 Speaker 3: we selling, you know, on a daily basis. So we're 667 00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,759 Speaker 3: doing twenty grand a day across what skews like of 668 00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:36,839 Speaker 3: our sixty plus products, what's selling well? Because I need 669 00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:40,520 Speaker 3: to look at that data to inform what's my next 670 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:42,480 Speaker 3: print run going to be? How quickly do I need 671 00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:45,680 Speaker 3: to do that. So what I would say about scale 672 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:52,200 Speaker 3: is data and numbers become everything. And even though it's 673 00:39:52,239 --> 00:39:59,360 Speaker 3: definitely not my unique strength, I absolutely love data and 674 00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:01,719 Speaker 3: I'm into my with data every single day because I 675 00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:05,600 Speaker 3: cannot make creative decisions unless I know what's going on 676 00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:08,520 Speaker 3: with all of my numbers. So that's what I would 677 00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:11,640 Speaker 3: say about scale. It's different when you're starting out to 678 00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:15,600 Speaker 3: a degree you don't have to necessarily watch everything quite 679 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:19,200 Speaker 3: so closely. But I'm literally moving hundreds of thousands of 680 00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:22,400 Speaker 3: dollars every single day, so I've got to make sure 681 00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:26,839 Speaker 3: that every single position in the company, every single piece 682 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:31,000 Speaker 3: of input is you know, maximizing the returns and the output. 683 00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:35,799 Speaker 2: That's so interesting and something that you just touched on 684 00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:38,560 Speaker 2: that I guess I'm also very intrigued with, and I 685 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:41,040 Speaker 2: you know, would be my second last question. But so 686 00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:44,719 Speaker 2: you've got you know, you said over sixty products, which 687 00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:48,840 Speaker 2: is just incredible. What does the marketing side look like? 688 00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,840 Speaker 2: Because I could just imagine doing that many products in 689 00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:55,000 Speaker 2: such a small amount of time. Do you have much 690 00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:56,920 Speaker 2: to do with the marketing? What is your sort of 691 00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:57,719 Speaker 2: ideal there? 692 00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, so in any business, there's kind of almost two sides. 693 00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,680 Speaker 3: It's like, you know, particularly in product based businesses, it's 694 00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,080 Speaker 3: like you've got to come up with the product and 695 00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:10,960 Speaker 3: then and a lot of people think, oh my gosh, 696 00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:15,359 Speaker 3: that's the hard bit. It's almost the marketing and the 697 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:20,400 Speaker 3: sales and the distribution and the logistics are you know, 698 00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:24,880 Speaker 3: almost bigger than that, because once you have a landed product, 699 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:27,799 Speaker 3: you've got to make sure that you've got the you know, 700 00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:30,080 Speaker 3: that that is all flowing through. So, yes, I have 701 00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,600 Speaker 3: a lot to do with the marketing. So the marketing 702 00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:36,440 Speaker 3: works for us, and I go into a lot more 703 00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:39,719 Speaker 3: detail in startup to scale, but it's basically what I 704 00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:44,239 Speaker 3: call an ecosystem. So our marketing consists of a number 705 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:47,240 Speaker 3: of different things. So part of it is influencer marketing, 706 00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:50,279 Speaker 3: where we will send out you know, eighty to two 707 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,000 Speaker 3: hundred products probably every two weeks, so we're gifting a 708 00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:56,480 Speaker 3: lot of products to get into the hands of the 709 00:41:56,600 --> 00:42:00,920 Speaker 3: right people. Then we have all of our organic so 710 00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:06,080 Speaker 3: we're creating you know, constantly organic content, be it reals 711 00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:08,520 Speaker 3: or static posts or whatever it is, across all of 712 00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:12,960 Speaker 3: our social media channels. And we have paid socials, so 713 00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:15,640 Speaker 3: we spend a lot of money on Facebook advertising to 714 00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:19,680 Speaker 3: target and retarget the right people. We do trade fairs, 715 00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:23,160 Speaker 3: so at the moment, as I said, we're doing Atlanta, Vegas, La, 716 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:27,040 Speaker 3: New York in the US in two days. We're doing 717 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:30,120 Speaker 3: Life in Style in Melbourne, and Australia. We're doing one 718 00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:32,319 Speaker 3: in New Zealand in a couple of months. So trade 719 00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:35,400 Speaker 3: fairs is another big part of it. I do a 720 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:39,120 Speaker 3: lot of speaking gigs, you know, podcast pr so there's 721 00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:44,400 Speaker 3: a whole kind of ecosystem. And again for anyone listening 722 00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 3: who's like, oh my gosh, that so much, where do 723 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:49,799 Speaker 3: I start. It's really about picking you know, one or 724 00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:54,600 Speaker 3: two things off and then measuring again the input versus 725 00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,359 Speaker 3: the output, so everything, This is where the data comes in. 726 00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:02,160 Speaker 3: You know, if we're doing organic social media, which still 727 00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:06,120 Speaker 3: takes you know, resources, what are we actually selling? What's 728 00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:10,279 Speaker 3: the engagement? What's the brand uplift? Like how we're measuring that? 729 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:13,040 Speaker 3: If it's the trade fairs, you know, that's a very 730 00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:16,840 Speaker 3: costly exercise. I'm going to New York next week to 731 00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:18,359 Speaker 3: go to the New York Trade Fair. You know that 732 00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:21,360 Speaker 3: costs me to get on a plane, stay in a hotel, 733 00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:24,839 Speaker 3: have the booth, et cetera, et cetera. So again, what 734 00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,920 Speaker 3: do we think we can do? So everything? I would 735 00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:31,320 Speaker 3: really encourage people to look at what's the input, what's 736 00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:33,759 Speaker 3: the output? Like, what effort are you putting in for 737 00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:35,640 Speaker 3: what returns? Really important? 738 00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:37,560 Speaker 2: Get intimate with your data. 739 00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:41,520 Speaker 3: Yes, so important, and it's so so boring, but I 740 00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:45,520 Speaker 3: cannot express how important it is. And that is the 741 00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:48,480 Speaker 3: only way that I can scale without sinking up. 742 00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:50,680 Speaker 2: No, I love it. I love it so much. It's 743 00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:54,160 Speaker 2: been such like a good reality check to me. I'm like, 744 00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:56,480 Speaker 2: I know, I know, I'm much like you where I'm like, 745 00:43:56,600 --> 00:44:00,239 Speaker 2: I just love the creative side. And yeah, so no, 746 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:02,799 Speaker 2: I am with you on that, and it's it's such 747 00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:06,520 Speaker 2: great advice. Okay, so at least on my last question 748 00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:08,920 Speaker 2: and then I will let you go. I know you 749 00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:13,239 Speaker 2: are a busy, busy lady. But something that I absolutely 750 00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:15,640 Speaker 2: loved in the book, and I think I loved it 751 00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:19,160 Speaker 2: because I probably need to implement it the most. But 752 00:44:20,080 --> 00:44:28,200 Speaker 2: you explain exactly something that you chat about is, you know, 753 00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:30,439 Speaker 2: finding your purpose in the book, and you talk about 754 00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:35,279 Speaker 2: having a business purpose plus a purpose personal purpose, and 755 00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:40,240 Speaker 2: I personally am someone who you know, my business has 756 00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:43,359 Speaker 2: so much purpose and it just lights me up that 757 00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:48,239 Speaker 2: I often find, you know, I often find that I 758 00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:52,040 Speaker 2: don't have a lot of personal you know, purpose because 759 00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:55,440 Speaker 2: I'm so intertwined and get so much purpose out of 760 00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,080 Speaker 2: my business. But I would love if you can kind 761 00:44:58,080 --> 00:45:00,959 Speaker 2: of explain the difference between these. Just chat a little 762 00:45:00,960 --> 00:45:02,600 Speaker 2: bit further about what you mean by this. 763 00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:06,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you. And and I went one hundred percent 764 00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:09,400 Speaker 3: relate to you. I mean, for so many years because 765 00:45:09,520 --> 00:45:13,160 Speaker 3: I love business so much, I was like, no, this 766 00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:16,720 Speaker 3: is my bapose like this is everything. And it's probably 767 00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:21,120 Speaker 3: really only the last two or three years where I've 768 00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:24,680 Speaker 3: really gone, Okay, I need to really align with my 769 00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:28,040 Speaker 3: personal purpose as well. And I'll give you an example. 770 00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:33,200 Speaker 3: When I met my fiance, he was like, let's go 771 00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:35,239 Speaker 3: on a holiday. Where do you want to go? And 772 00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:37,960 Speaker 3: I do you know what? I burst into tears because 773 00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:42,040 Speaker 3: I had been because my business had gotten so big 774 00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:45,440 Speaker 3: and there were so many amazing opportunities. I was likely 775 00:45:45,719 --> 00:45:49,279 Speaker 3: reacting to things in my personal life. So you know, 776 00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:51,239 Speaker 3: like I said, and a winter invited me to go 777 00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:53,839 Speaker 3: to New York, amazing. I went to New York, like, 778 00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:55,759 Speaker 3: you know, there would be a trade fair somewhere, I 779 00:45:55,760 --> 00:45:58,560 Speaker 3: would go there. But when someone actually said to me, 780 00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:02,319 Speaker 3: where do you want to go on a holiday? For you? 781 00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:05,080 Speaker 3: I was like, oh, my gosh, I don't know. Like 782 00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:09,719 Speaker 3: I'd abandoned myself for such a long time, and I 783 00:46:09,800 --> 00:46:11,880 Speaker 3: was just having so much fun in the business that 784 00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:15,920 Speaker 3: I forgot kind of about hobbies and my own things. 785 00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:18,640 Speaker 3: And so for me now and they can align. I 786 00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:21,839 Speaker 3: mean for me, you know, for collective habits very much 787 00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:26,080 Speaker 3: around igniting human potential. But in my personal life now, 788 00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:31,799 Speaker 3: it's really important that I spend time with friends and 789 00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:35,719 Speaker 3: family and like I, you know, illuminate their lives a 790 00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:39,560 Speaker 3: little bit as well. It's important for me personally that 791 00:46:39,719 --> 00:46:42,200 Speaker 3: to be the best version of myself, you know, I 792 00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:45,040 Speaker 3: exercise and I do those rituals and routines, and that 793 00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:48,759 Speaker 3: you know, I find hobbies and things that light me 794 00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:54,160 Speaker 3: up because all of that personal purpose stuff really actually 795 00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:56,839 Speaker 3: makes me become a better human in business, but it 796 00:46:56,880 --> 00:47:00,319 Speaker 3: also means that I can take time out to really 797 00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:03,560 Speaker 3: enjoy my own life and give back to people who 798 00:47:03,600 --> 00:47:06,880 Speaker 3: are closer you know, to me than necessarily in the 799 00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:10,560 Speaker 3: business world. And whatever went as well is that whilst 800 00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:15,560 Speaker 3: business gives us those big, fist pumping, adrenaline fueled moments, 801 00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:19,600 Speaker 3: it's often the simple things like I'm staying with my 802 00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:21,440 Speaker 3: mum at the moment she hasn't been well and I'm 803 00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:23,680 Speaker 3: just cooking for her like breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and 804 00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:25,840 Speaker 3: she's loving it so much and it's bringing me so 805 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:29,160 Speaker 3: much joy and making me a better human. So I'm 806 00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:33,799 Speaker 3: really spending time tapping into what other things outside of 807 00:47:33,840 --> 00:47:37,000 Speaker 3: business that supplement me as a human. And when do 808 00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:41,680 Speaker 3: I feel on purpose underlive when it's not necessarily attached 809 00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:43,880 Speaker 3: to or associated with business. 810 00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:49,240 Speaker 2: I definitely need to take a ticket out that one. 811 00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:54,200 Speaker 3: It took me a long time and even now you know, 812 00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:59,080 Speaker 3: because I love business so much. I would literally happily 813 00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:01,600 Speaker 3: work twenty four hours a day, seven days a week 814 00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:04,680 Speaker 3: because I get so excited and do stuff about business. 815 00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:09,520 Speaker 3: So I have to very consciously purposely remove myself and 816 00:48:09,680 --> 00:48:13,000 Speaker 3: you know, make myself do other things. And then I'm like, oh, yeah, 817 00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:15,719 Speaker 3: I love this and this is feeding my soul and 818 00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:19,839 Speaker 3: this is actually making me a better human and it's 819 00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:24,920 Speaker 3: giving me more experiences that enrich my ability to write 820 00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,400 Speaker 3: and teach and speak about, you know, the things that 821 00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:33,040 Speaker 3: I do in business. So it actually does coexist symbiotically, 822 00:48:33,120 --> 00:48:35,440 Speaker 3: and I think it does make you a better human. 823 00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:38,719 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I guess I can kind of lean on 824 00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:41,200 Speaker 2: the fact that I've only been an entrepreneur for the 825 00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:43,799 Speaker 2: last couple of years. But I am just starting to 826 00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:47,480 Speaker 2: realize that, especially with becoming a mom and just like 827 00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:52,400 Speaker 2: realizing that I have my husband. He is obsessive golf, 828 00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:57,400 Speaker 2: and it's like his you know, passion, and it's his 829 00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:01,279 Speaker 2: hobby and he loves doing it and obviously nothing to 830 00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:04,680 Speaker 2: do with that, and he often says to me, like, 831 00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:07,479 Speaker 2: you need a hobby, you need something outside of work, 832 00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,200 Speaker 2: and I just haven't got there yet. But it's only 833 00:49:10,360 --> 00:49:13,920 Speaker 2: been recently where I'm starting to agree with him. And 834 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:16,320 Speaker 2: obviously when I was reading the book, I was like, yes, Lisa, 835 00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:19,120 Speaker 2: I know I've got to I've got to tap into 836 00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:21,239 Speaker 2: that a lot more. But I think, you know, having 837 00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:24,800 Speaker 2: that awareness is definitely the first step for me for sure. 838 00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, Well that is your that is your mission now 839 00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:32,279 Speaker 3: after this podcast, to go and find a hobby. 840 00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:35,520 Speaker 2: I'll do it. I'll do it. I'm just like not 841 00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:38,319 Speaker 2: very coordinated, so like sport doesn't interest me. But I'm 842 00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:40,839 Speaker 2: I'm you know, I'm a nature person, so I'm sure, 843 00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,839 Speaker 2: I'm sure I can find one. But Lisa, thank you 844 00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:46,319 Speaker 2: so much. It has been a dream to have you 845 00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:49,760 Speaker 2: on the RNC potty and thank you so much for 846 00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:55,680 Speaker 2: encouraging and inspiring and empowering us with all your amazing 847 00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:59,560 Speaker 2: books and words and everything. Yeah, it has just it 848 00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:02,359 Speaker 2: has been a treat. I cannot thank you enough. And 849 00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:05,160 Speaker 2: I'd love if you could just tell the audience where 850 00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:07,640 Speaker 2: they can find you, where they can find all your 851 00:50:07,680 --> 00:50:08,520 Speaker 2: beautiful stuff. 852 00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:11,080 Speaker 3: Amazing, and thank you so much for having me. It's 853 00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:15,320 Speaker 3: been an absolute joy. Everyone can find me at Lisa 854 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:20,960 Speaker 3: Messenger at Collective Hub across pretty much all channels and 855 00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:25,400 Speaker 3: coming soon Collective Hub Kids. So there's also an outlet 856 00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:29,040 Speaker 3: for that, so go follow and aspress that out as well. 857 00:50:29,239 --> 00:50:31,440 Speaker 2: So exciting. I'll have to get you back on the 858 00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:32,400 Speaker 2: pody to chaut about that. 859 00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:37,279 Speaker 3: Yes, a very very exciting brand launching in November. 860 00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:41,080 Speaker 2: Oh incredible, I cannot wait. Thank you so much, Litha. 861 00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:42,880 Speaker 2: I really appreciate you coming on the show. 862 00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:44,960 Speaker 3: Thanks for having me see you. 863 00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:54,600 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to another episode of 864 00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:57,799 Speaker 1: the Rise and Conquered podcast. If you enjoyed it and 865 00:50:57,880 --> 00:51:02,200 Speaker 1: want more, come connect with us on Instagram at Riseanconquer 866 00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:06,359 Speaker 1: dot podcast and join our Facebook discussion group, a Rise 867 00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:10,480 Speaker 1: and Conquer podcast community. We're an independent podcast and we 868 00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:13,279 Speaker 1: have a small team, so we do appreciate your time 869 00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:16,160 Speaker 1: and support. If you have a spare moment, a follow 870 00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:20,200 Speaker 1: or subscribe on whatever platform you listen to would be 871 00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:24,360 Speaker 1: so amazing. And look, if you're feeling extra kind, a 872 00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:29,600 Speaker 1: review on Apple Podcasts would be great