1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:03,560 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 2 00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:08,560 Speaker 1: Bungelung Calcottin woman from Gadigl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 3 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:10,840 Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 4 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:14,400 Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 5 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 6 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,120 Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present. 7 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:28,320 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os. Happy Friday. 8 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 2: It's the eighth of September. 9 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 3: I'm Zara Sidler, I'm Sam Kazlowski. 10 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 2: Australia's largest coal fired power station will remain open longer 11 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 2: than planned. The New South Wales government says this will 12 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,520 Speaker 2: secure the state's energy supply in the face of predicted 13 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:45,879 Speaker 2: supply issues. I'm not willing to gamble the reliability and 14 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 2: cost pressures of New South Wales consumers and households and 15 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:54,000 Speaker 2: businesses on a hunch. But some are asking what this 16 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 2: means for Australia's climate targets and investment in renewables. But 17 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:01,120 Speaker 2: Fir Sam, some news from that's right. 18 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 3: Prime Minister Anthony Alberanzi has confirmed he'll travel to China 19 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 3: later in the year. To meet with President Jijimping. The 20 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 3: PM spoke with Chinese Premier Li Chiang at the Asian 21 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:16,440 Speaker 3: Summit in Indonesia, describing the meeting as respectful and constructive. 22 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,399 Speaker 3: The visit will be the first time an Australian Prime 23 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 3: Minister has visited China since twenty sixteen. It comes after 24 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 3: Albenzi and j met in Bali at last year's G 25 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:29,839 Speaker 3: twenty summit after years of tension between China and Australia. 26 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 2: A fourteen year old boy has been arrested in Melbourne 27 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 2: after an attempted abduction left another schoolboy with serious injuries. 28 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:41,480 Speaker 2: The school student was allegedly forced into a car on 29 00:01:41,560 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 2: Monday afternoon, later escaping a moving vehicle, leaving him with 30 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:49,880 Speaker 2: what police described as life altering injuries. Victorian police arrested 31 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 2: the teenager on Thursday afternoon, who they said is a 32 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:55,960 Speaker 2: known youth gang member who they believe is the principal 33 00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 2: offender from this incident. 34 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 3: And The Wallabies will begin their Rugby d World Cup 35 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 3: campaign in France this weekend. They played Georgia in the 36 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:06,480 Speaker 3: opening round of the group stages, and that kicks off 37 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:10,000 Speaker 3: at two am on Sunday. Australian Eastern Standard times, a 38 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 3: very unfortunate time. The tournament begins tomorrow morning when hosts 39 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:15,520 Speaker 3: France play New Zealand. 40 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,560 Speaker 2: Sticking with the theme of sport for today's good news, 41 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:23,440 Speaker 2: Matilda's players Sam Kerr and Hailey Rasso have both been 42 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:27,480 Speaker 2: nominated for world football's highest individual award. The two were 43 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 2: shortlisted for the Ballon d'Or, which is handed out each 44 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 2: year to the best men's and women's player across the 45 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 2: football season. It's Rasso's first nomination for the award and 46 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:39,799 Speaker 2: curs fifth. The winner will be announced in Paris in October. 47 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 2: The new South Wales government SAM has announced it will 48 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 2: work to keep a Arring power station, which is Australia's 49 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:52,119 Speaker 2: largest coal fired power station, open longer than it planned. 50 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 2: This is to ensure that the state doesn't run out 51 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:58,079 Speaker 2: of energy, but the move has been criticized by those 52 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:01,120 Speaker 2: advocating for a faster transition towards renewables. 53 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 3: So give me a sense of the factors at play 54 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 3: with this particular power station. 55 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,800 Speaker 2: Arang is owned by Origin Energy and it's pretty remarkable. 56 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 2: It's responsible for generating a quarter of this state's energy supply. 57 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:14,679 Speaker 3: That's a lot. 58 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fairly substantial, and at the beginning of last 59 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:21,919 Speaker 2: year Origin announced plans to close the station in twenty 60 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:26,119 Speaker 2: twenty five, which was seven years earlier than expected. I mean, 61 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 2: we see these announcements all the time of coal fire 62 00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 2: power stations being closed down. It's part of this move 63 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 2: towards renewables, and this was one of those announcements. 64 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 3: So that was last year, so then what's happened over 65 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 3: the last year also that means it's staying open. 66 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 2: So essentially, I mean there are a couple issues at 67 00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 2: play here and they all go to the heart of 68 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 2: the energy market in Australia. But one of the issues 69 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 2: is external pressures on the market, so things like the 70 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 2: conflict in Ukraine pushing up energy prices and we've spoken 71 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:59,000 Speaker 2: about that mostly with Tom a lot on this podcast, 72 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 2: but that has meant that there is this unused stress 73 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 2: on our energy market. Another concern is about whether we 74 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 2: actually have enough energy to meet demand. So obviously we're 75 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:12,000 Speaker 2: going into summer in a couple of months here in 76 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 2: Australia and we've just seen the hottest ever summer recorded 77 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 2: in the Northern Hemisphere, so we're hearing concerns about whether 78 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 2: or not we'll have enough energy to meet demand when 79 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,520 Speaker 2: it comes to things like air conditioning, which are there summer. 80 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 3: They've been talking about that for a couple of years. 81 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, as summers get hotter, there needs to be 82 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:32,919 Speaker 2: energy that actually mirrors that demand. And that's all happening 83 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 2: against the context of this transition from coal to renewables, 84 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:40,359 Speaker 2: which is expected to leave a gap in the amount 85 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 2: of actual energy available. 86 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:44,840 Speaker 3: And what would that look like for real people, like, 87 00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 3: how would that impact us day to day? 88 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: Well, what the New South Wales government is saying is 89 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,359 Speaker 2: that there's a potential here to actually run out of energy, 90 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:55,600 Speaker 2: which could mean regular blackouts in some parts of the country. 91 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 2: That's based on a warning that the government got last 92 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 2: week from the Australian Energy Market Operator or AMO, who 93 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:05,800 Speaker 2: manages energy markets to basically make sure that Australians have 94 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 2: enough supply. AMO projected supply issues for the next decade 95 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 2: and that was largely due to the planned transition from 96 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:16,599 Speaker 2: coal energy sources to renewables. The same message to the 97 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:19,600 Speaker 2: government also came from an independent check up report that 98 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 2: was released this week. That report found that closing a 99 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:25,360 Speaker 2: rah Ring, which as I've said a number of times, 100 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 2: is the biggest coal power station in the country in 101 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:32,680 Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, would cause reliability issues in the energy markets, 102 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:36,160 Speaker 2: quite significant ones, and that this could in turn drive 103 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:40,159 Speaker 2: up the price of electricity. And so in that report 104 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 2: it was recommended that the government and Origin actually extend 105 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,840 Speaker 2: operations at the power station and that they have a 106 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 2: strategy in place to achieve a new deadline. 107 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,120 Speaker 3: Okay, so the government clearly took that on board. What 108 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 3: did they say when they announced their intention this week? 109 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 2: So the New South Wales Labor government said that they're 110 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 2: now going to negotiate with Origin Energy to decide on 111 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:05,720 Speaker 2: a new closure date for AARHRNG. There was a press 112 00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 2: conference that was held this week where New South Wales 113 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:12,279 Speaker 2: Energy Minister Penny Sharp said that the decision would smooth 114 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 2: the bumps of the renewable energy transition. We come from 115 00:06:15,760 --> 00:06:18,479 Speaker 2: the starting point of we're not wanting coal fire to 116 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 2: be open one day longer than it needs to and 117 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 2: not one extra cent that needs to go into it 118 00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 2: from the people of New South Wales. She didn't provide 119 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 2: detail on costs related to the extension or go into 120 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 2: the idea of how long the station may actually need 121 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:34,480 Speaker 2: to continue operations, and that. 122 00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 3: Has been one of the criticisms towards this plan, and 123 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:40,839 Speaker 3: I want to talk through the implications for the planet 124 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 3: shortly because I think that's a really important part of 125 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:47,359 Speaker 3: this discussion. But firstly, from an economic perspective, what's that 126 00:06:47,440 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 3: going to cost tax payers to keep Rarring open for 127 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 3: the next couple of years. 128 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 2: So the government hasn't necessarily, as I said, provided us 129 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 2: with numbers on how much this will actually cost, but 130 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 2: they would have to invest money to keep a ring open. 131 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:05,919 Speaker 2: And so the argument that we're hearing from climate advocates 132 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 2: is that tax payer money should be spent on investing 133 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:12,800 Speaker 2: in renewables, not be spent on keeping a qulified power 134 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 2: station open even longer, and so bodies like the Climate 135 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 2: Council are saying that money should be reinvested into renewables. 136 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:22,760 Speaker 2: I should say though, that the New South Wales government 137 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 2: this week did announce that it would deliver a one 138 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,480 Speaker 2: point eight billion dollar boost two and this is the 139 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 2: government's words that I'm using rescue New South Wales's energy transition. 140 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 3: So Zara, we've talked through how the government and AIMO 141 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 3: view the necessity to keep open this power station so 142 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 3: that we avoid blackouts. And kind of the smoother transition 143 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 3: in the words of the New Southwest Minister. But give 144 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:50,960 Speaker 3: me a sense of what this means in the context 145 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 3: of our climate goals and the longer term vision in 146 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 3: Australian environmental policy. 147 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 2: I mean, just like we don't have the details on 148 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 2: when it's going to close or how it's going to close. 149 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 2: I still think this is the very preliminary stages of 150 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:06,880 Speaker 2: this announcement, and I mean all we know is that 151 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 2: there is an intention to keep it open, so it's 152 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 2: going to be a matter of time until we can 153 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 2: understand what the impact will be, for example, on the 154 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 2: government's climate targets. The New South Wales government and the 155 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 2: federal government both have climate targets when it comes to 156 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:27,400 Speaker 2: reducing emissions, and keeping open the biggest coulified power station 157 00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:31,280 Speaker 2: in the country will inevitably impact the way that we're 158 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,439 Speaker 2: tracking to meet those targets. It is still early days, 159 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 2: so we will have to wait and see what detail 160 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 2: the government provides, and when we understand how long it's 161 00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:41,719 Speaker 2: going to be open, I think that's when you can 162 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 2: start to really unpack what it means for those targets. 163 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:48,760 Speaker 2: I do think it's worth noting though that there is 164 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 2: quite a bit of literature out there, and certainly some 165 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,960 Speaker 2: of the analysis that's been done of the IPCC report 166 00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 2: says that in order for the world to meet its 167 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 2: climate targets. More broadly, countries like Australia would actually need 168 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:05,440 Speaker 2: to end call use entirely by twenty thirty, and so 169 00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 2: how this announcement fits into that broader context remains to 170 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 2: be seen. 171 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 3: Thanks for joining us on the Daily OS for that 172 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:18,320 Speaker 3: Friday episode. If you learn something from today's episode, or 173 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 3: you've got some questions yourself about how our energy grid works, 174 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 3: feel free to leave them in the comments on Spotify 175 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 3: and we'll have a read over the weekend. Enjoy your weekend, 176 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:29,679 Speaker 3: and we'll be back in your ears on Monday morning.