Speaker 1: Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud Yr
Speaker 1: the Order Kerney Whalbury and a waddery woman. And before
Speaker 1: we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
Speaker 1: would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
Speaker 1: of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
Speaker 1: acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through.
Speaker 1: As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and
Speaker 1: the storytelling of you to make a difference for today
Speaker 1: and lasting impactful tomorrow.
Speaker 2: Let's get into it.
Speaker 3: She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
Speaker 4: Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
Speaker 4: for millennials who want financial freedom. Today, my friends, is Friday,
Speaker 4: which means it is time to get our little team
Speaker 4: together and celebrate you how incredible she is on the
Speaker 4: Money community today, Jess, go to your cheer over there. Hi,
Speaker 4: my friend. She is going to be sharing our favorite
Speaker 4: money wins. We're going to be helping to answer a
Speaker 4: juicy money dilemma, which this week is all about discussing
Speaker 4: your salary expectations in a job interview. And we're going
Speaker 4: to be unpacking something you slid into our DMS about
Speaker 4: which this week is all about employer remuneration and asking
Speaker 4: for a raise. So let's get into it. My friends, Beck,
Speaker 4: how has your week been?
Speaker 1: Hi?
Speaker 2: Pretty good?
Speaker 5: Slow, really slow, housing out produces out of the moment.
Speaker 2: So oh wait, does that mean you've got a cat?
Speaker 2: I've got a cat.
Speaker 5: We've got a cat, and honestly, I've never taken care
Speaker 5: of a cat before.
Speaker 2: My world has changed.
Speaker 5: Like I'm out of the pub, but I have to
Speaker 5: go home at five o'clock to feed something and maature,
Speaker 5: it's still alive and I don't actually know what this
Speaker 5: world is we converted?
Speaker 2: Now you a cat person? I think I'm pretty cold.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think I'm pretty close to me.
Speaker 2: I don't want this lie? Do you do?
Speaker 4: Our producer, for those of you following along at home,
Speaker 4: has a beautiful Burmese called Jean Parmesan is a brown Burmese,
Speaker 4: so he's like a chalky color and he is the
Speaker 4: most friendly boy.
Speaker 2: So tell us, Beck, where is he sleeping?
Speaker 5: I don't know because he leaves the room and only
Speaker 5: told me that he would be sleeping with me right
Speaker 5: against me, But he is avoiding me at all.
Speaker 2: Costs. That's making you feel bad. I'm like, what, he's
Speaker 2: trying to stop himself from falling in love with you.
Speaker 2: I think that's what it is.
Speaker 5: I think that's why I'm also still single. Everyone's just
Speaker 5: scared they'll fall deeply in love with you rifying. It's terrifying.
Speaker 4: I'm really scared of as well. I get it, you're
Speaker 4: only happens to dress all the time. Jess, how's your
Speaker 4: week ban? Have you accidentally fallen in love?
Speaker 2: I haven't, But you know what, I don't know if
Speaker 2: mekeur is in retrograde mercury has to be. I'm feeling
Speaker 2: frazzled for no good reason either, Like it's not as
Speaker 2: if anything's gone drastically wrong, but I think I just
Speaker 2: started off my Monday feeling like I didn't know I
Speaker 2: had from my toes, and then yeah, it's just continued
Speaker 2: through the week a little bit with these crazy things.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's scared that something is about to constantly about
Speaker 5: to go wrong.
Speaker 2: So that makes sense, Like you're on my edge.
Speaker 5: You're so frizzled that nothing's gone wrong yet, but any
Speaker 5: second now something will.
Speaker 2: Yes, I think so. And it was really funny. I
Speaker 2: was having a moment. The other day, I had no
Speaker 2: pepsi Max left in the house, not no, I was
Speaker 2: dealing with a crisis and all I had was solo,
Speaker 2: and it was It's things like that that are just
Speaker 2: so first world and inconsequential and absolutely ridiculously stupid. And
Speaker 2: I'm embarrassed that I'm even admitting them out loud. But
Speaker 2: it's just the compounding impact of like lots of teeny
Speaker 2: tiny little things going wrong, but I'm making me go,
Speaker 2: oh my god, like I just can't this week.
Speaker 4: I feel like that happens all the time to me,
Speaker 4: because if something actually goes into crisis, I seem to
Speaker 4: switch into crisis mode and I'm really good with dealing
Speaker 4: with it. Like I'll be like, okay, cool, well, Beck,
Speaker 4: you need to do this, and Jess, could you please
Speaker 4: Xyza doesn't matter work or life. I lose my shoe,
Speaker 4: I'm done. Yeah, I'm done. We are having a meltdown.
Speaker 4: I am not going to deal with that.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 4: I will cry, I'll be hysteric, i will literally be
Speaker 4: a little nightmare. But then you'll be like, oh v
Speaker 4: this actual, really big crisis happened, and I'll be like, oh, no,
Speaker 4: worries I'll pull my stuff together because I have every
Speaker 4: single ability to lead you in a crisis personal crisis. Though,
Speaker 4: when I lost a shoe different straight well, like we
Speaker 4: ran out of tea bags the other day and I cried,
Speaker 4: like what is.
Speaker 2: Wrong with me? That's fair, just a moment, mercury. She's
Speaker 2: doing her things.
Speaker 5: She's doing a thing.
Speaker 2: Something in the microwave. I don't know. I don't know. Gatorad. Yeah,
Speaker 2: in the gatorade in the microwave, like I don't know.
Speaker 4: Like someone's done it and they cooked it on high.
Speaker 2: Like I'm not interested.
Speaker 4: So, Jess, let's talk about something that is interesting, which
Speaker 4: is our community money wins. Every single week we go
Speaker 4: through these, and they one of my favorite things. Just
Speaker 4: sit on my phone and perve on what have you
Speaker 4: pulled out as your favorites of.
Speaker 2: So this week I have a money win from Laura,
Speaker 2: who says I received a scholarship to do some post
Speaker 2: grad study. I originally thought it would cover the cost
Speaker 2: of ten K, but they emailed me to say I'd
Speaker 2: only get seven point five. I wrote a polite email
Speaker 2: asking why I wasn't getting the full amount reimbursed, and
Speaker 2: they've since emailed back saying they made an error and
Speaker 2: I'll actually get fifteen, not only covering the cost of
Speaker 2: the course, but the time for me to study as well.
Speaker 2: Money win and also pays to ask, doesn't it? Just
Speaker 2: ask the question? Just ask us. One thing they could
Speaker 2: say is no, one thousand percent. My next money win
Speaker 2: comes from Joe, who said, money win, my fiance proposed
Speaker 2: with his grandmother's ring. No, that's so wholesome, right, money loss.
Speaker 2: It will need to be resized, but that beats the
Speaker 2: cost of a new engagement ring from a jeweler. Absolutely, yee.
Speaker 2: Still money win. Still may that's sick. And there's a
Speaker 2: bunch of comments saying congratulations do you We're so excited
Speaker 2: for you. My next money win comes from Ilona, who said,
Speaker 2: got our lease renewed last week with an increase in
Speaker 2: our rent, of course, by one hundred dollars a week.
Speaker 2: I emailed the real estate agent to negotiate it down
Speaker 2: to an eighty dollars increase, and the owner agreed to it.
Speaker 2: Small money win from now, money loss from August when
Speaker 2: the inn prease rent kicks in, but put on you
Speaker 2: for negotiating it.
Speaker 4: I feel like they're going up, really really steeply at
Speaker 4: the moment, and it's always worth a crack.
Speaker 2: There's a post on our Instagram at She's in the
Speaker 2: money AUS. We put in a little scripty script with
Speaker 2: some suggestions of things you could say to your landlord
Speaker 2: or your property manager if they do email you with
Speaker 2: a rent increase. So if you're in the same boat
Speaker 2: as a learner, it might be worth going back and
Speaker 2: getting a little help from there. My next money comes
Speaker 2: from Catherine, who said one of my colleagues suggested I
Speaker 2: request higher duty's allowance to be paid as my supervisor
Speaker 2: has left and I'm assuming a lot of his workload. Raise.
Speaker 2: The paperwork on Friday and it was signed today. And
Speaker 2: the best part is it was backdated to the seventh
Speaker 2: of April when my old supervisor left.
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, how is that also good on your
Speaker 4: business for backdating?
Speaker 2: And I feel like that never happens. They're like, string
Speaker 2: it out.
Speaker 4: And string it out, and then they're like, oh, we'll
Speaker 4: start on the first of July, so you're doing that
Speaker 4: job until the first of July for three Yeah.
Speaker 2: And also, I'd never thought about allowance if you're taking
Speaker 2: over a role temporarily while someone's gone you know that
Speaker 2: should be standard. Yeah, we've spoken before about how like
Speaker 2: if someone leaves and you take on their job, you
Speaker 2: shask for a raise. But if you're doing it temporarily
Speaker 2: and maybe your management say, oh no, we can't do that.
Speaker 2: You're only looking after it for six weeks, maybe an
Speaker 2: allowance is the way to go very much business. I
Speaker 2: think so as well. My next money win comes from Becky,
Speaker 2: who said money win. I've been making myself a nice
Speaker 2: breakfast on the weekends instead of going out for breakfast
Speaker 2: or grabbing something on the go. It's amazing to see
Speaker 2: how easy it is to pop some bacon, an egg
Speaker 2: and an avocado on a bagel and such a good
Speaker 2: feeling not spending thirty dollars. And to be honest, she
Speaker 2: put in a photo it looks like brunch that was
Speaker 2: gone now it does, doesn't it? Well done, Becky. And
Speaker 2: then my last one this week from Amanda said, SotM
Speaker 2: will appreciate this. I got a free container of minor
Speaker 2: figures oat milk in my Fortnightly Farmers Pick fresh fruit
Speaker 2: and vegebox. Oh that's the money wee.
Speaker 4: I feel like oat milk is increasing at the same
Speaker 4: rate as inflation.
Speaker 2: Leader.
Speaker 4: That's at least what it costs I paid a million
Speaker 4: dollars a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2: That's absolutely cooked.
Speaker 4: All right, let's go to a quick break before we
Speaker 4: start making up even more.
Speaker 2: Don't go anywhere. Welcome back, everybody. Let's take a listen
Speaker 2: to this week's money dilemma. Hi.
Speaker 4: There, have you got a money dilemma you just can't solve?
Speaker 4: The Sheese on the Money team is here to help.
Speaker 4: Every week, we tackle your dilemmas, both big and small,
Speaker 4: to answer your most burning money, career and life questions.
Speaker 4: To get involved, simply head to our website and leave
Speaker 4: us a short voice recording and you might just find
Speaker 4: yourself on the show. Now, let's take a listen to
Speaker 4: this week's money dilemma.
Speaker 3: Hi, Victoria, I've been applying for jobs in an industry
Speaker 3: that is new to me. Some of the online applications
Speaker 3: ask for an expected salary, and I never know how
Speaker 3: to answer that question or what consequences the answer will have.
Speaker 3: I have arranged in mind that I think would be
Speaker 3: fair and I'll be willing to accept, But I don't
Speaker 3: know if I'm lowbuling myself, and what if that bites
Speaker 3: me in the bum later or if I'm putting in
Speaker 3: arrange its way over what the job is worth and
Speaker 3: my application might not be considered.
Speaker 2: Because of this.
Speaker 3: Any help on this would be amazing, Thank you.
Speaker 4: This one is spicy because I get where she's coming from.
Speaker 4: Like when she said and what consequences answering that carries.
Speaker 4: I was like, yeah, that's exactly how I feel about it.
Speaker 4: What would you guys do?
Speaker 2: That's a really good question.
Speaker 5: I shouldn't do this, but I always lowball because I
Speaker 5: am scared, and if, like I put what I really
Speaker 5: actually want, then they will whoever's recruiting will just skip
Speaker 5: right past me because they can get someone a little
Speaker 5: bit cheaper, probably the same qualifications, the same skills, what
Speaker 5: do you call it, experience experience, the same experience.
Speaker 4: Skills, whatever you want to call it, what you're actually
Speaker 4: bringing to the table, because like, you are a really
Speaker 4: good cook, so that could be put up for collateral.
Speaker 2: You think I'm a really good cook. I mean you
Speaker 2: can cook toast.
Speaker 5: Right, I'm really pretty good a toast. I've actually been
Speaker 5: complimented on my toast. Yea, all the way to this
Speaker 5: to the exactly.
Speaker 2: To the grass. What do you go to have the
Speaker 2: worst part with no butter. Yeah, exactly the worst part. Sorry,
Speaker 2: what crust is the best beer? Oh? I did not
Speaker 2: know this vote? Look at you anymore? Is she joking?
Speaker 4: Is she just trying to make this contents objectively?
Speaker 2: With any food? Crispy bit is the best bit? Is
Speaker 2: the crispy bit of the bread? No, no, no.
Speaker 5: I do like the ugly slice of the bread though,
Speaker 5: that's what fily crust?
Speaker 1: Do you mean?
Speaker 2: See that's my caveat. I don't like the butt piece.
Speaker 2: I see you call it a butt.
Speaker 5: I actually want to know what everyone calls the ugly slice.
Speaker 5: Maybe we can, we want.
Speaker 2: I want to know. He just calls it the butt piece.
Speaker 2: But I swear that's really normal. Sorry. The end of
Speaker 2: the bread, Oh, the end of the bread, that's okay,
Speaker 2: But in the middle yours, if you're sitting in your
Speaker 2: butt's the end? But is only the end?
Speaker 4: Anyway? Somebody is broken A very serious you need to answer.
Speaker 2: I'm also called.
Speaker 4: I have been like, hey, Steve, I'm making toast, but
Speaker 4: all I've got left is this rerange.
Speaker 2: No, I mean, your buddy is called a end. I'm
Speaker 2: still just that is the end of the human right
Speaker 2: with you?
Speaker 4: You are sorry, we need a baker, we need a
Speaker 4: baker curious in retrograde or gatorades in the microwave.
Speaker 2: But I'm done, sorry, sorry, back contrack, I'm done, beck
Speaker 2: back on track. So you just you would lowball it?
Speaker 5: I yes, basically I lobell it. I don't think it's
Speaker 5: the right answer, though, but I lowball it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Okay, Jess used to work in recruitment, so I
Speaker 4: feel like you're going to camper very intellectual answer, and
Speaker 4: so we'll probably wrap it up here.
Speaker 2: What's yours? Low Balling is definitely not the right answer. Good,
Speaker 2: but at least in you. So realistically, any recruiter is
Speaker 2: going to try and negotiate you down. So always shoot up,
Speaker 2: even if what you say is within the range. I mean,
Speaker 2: I say recruiter, and I know that people who work
Speaker 2: in recruitment will DM me if I don't put the
Speaker 2: caveat on it. No, it won't be recruiter, it won't
Speaker 2: be them doing it. The company will always come back
Speaker 2: and try and negotiate down that it's their job to
Speaker 2: do it. Yeah, even if you say I want to
Speaker 2: earn seventy thousand and their range was sixty to eighty
Speaker 2: They're still going to try and negotiate. It's just how
Speaker 2: that works as a company. So I say, always, always,
Speaker 2: always overshoot, because then you have room to negotiate down
Speaker 2: to somewhere where you're happy. I wouldn't be too stressed
Speaker 2: about setting your expectation too high. I think if you
Speaker 2: tacked one hundred grand on, people would probably be like, okay,
Speaker 2: like you're clearly But I think that is more of
Speaker 2: a reflection that you don't have an understanding of that role.
Speaker 2: Because if you know your job, if you know what
Speaker 2: you're doing, and you have kept an eye on the market,
Speaker 2: you should theoretically have a decent understanding of the value
Speaker 2: of that role. And if you don't, you can do
Speaker 2: some research. We've spoken about that on the pod before.
Speaker 2: So it's more of a red flag in the sense
Speaker 2: that you would probably go, oh, they don't really seem
Speaker 2: like they know what they're talking about. If your salary
Speaker 2: expectation is, you know, twenty thirty thousand, higher chances are
Speaker 2: you'll still go through the interview process, and if they
Speaker 2: really like you, they'll just try and negotiate you down
Speaker 2: because they always want the most skilled person possible. Kind
Speaker 2: of the least amount of money possible and then you're
Speaker 2: meeting in the middle somewhere. And that's not always the cruiter,
Speaker 2: like I said, it is often the employer doing that,
Speaker 2: and not every employer is like that, but most commonly
Speaker 2: that's kind of the thread that I saw happening.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I guess I'm coming to this from the
Speaker 4: perspective of somebody who has applied for jobs, and so
Speaker 4: I really resonate with you, Beck because I feel like
Speaker 4: I used to lowball it because you'd be like, well,
Speaker 4: they're just going to write off my salary or not
Speaker 4: even look at my CV if I put it too high.
Speaker 4: Not the case, because on the flip side, I also
Speaker 4: am an employer and we do all of our own
Speaker 4: recruitment internally outsource that I actually do it myself because
Speaker 4: I think that's helping me build my team, if that
Speaker 4: makes sense, Like I want to have control over that process.
Speaker 4: But we don't ask in the application phase. We actually
Speaker 4: ask in their first phone call, so we always do.
Speaker 4: I guess this is just that she's on the money process.
Speaker 4: You apply for the job, there would be like a
Speaker 4: telephone call to like have a chat and prevet and
Speaker 4: you know, go through a few like what would you say,
Speaker 4: like hygiene questions like when, where, how, why, how far
Speaker 4: can you jump? Kind of thing, and then if you're
Speaker 4: successful at that will actually go into the recruitment process
Speaker 4: of like sitting down and having proper interviews. But it
Speaker 4: seems to make sure that we can, you know, not
Speaker 4: waste people's time because like if you beck said, well
Speaker 4: I want to get paid X, and I'd be like, well,
Speaker 4: actually the job is valued at why I can say
Speaker 4: is that a deal breaker for you? Really upfront? And
Speaker 4: if it is, then cool, we go on our merry way.
Speaker 4: You don't get to the end of the recruitment process
Speaker 4: and then you know, ditch us because you know the
Speaker 4: salary wasn't what you expected. So if I am asking,
Speaker 4: it's literally to make sure that your expectations are on
Speaker 4: par SORAC. I was recruiting for an admin role and
Speaker 4: that role was sitting between X and Y, and a
Speaker 4: few people were like wildly above that. It didn't mean
Speaker 4: I didn't call them and have that chat. We still
Speaker 4: had that chat, but it was like, hey, the roles
Speaker 4: actually valued between X and Y, Like you've said this, what's.
Speaker 2: The reason for that?
Speaker 4: And they've said oh, you know, a plethora of different reasons,
Speaker 4: and either some people said, oh I thought that the
Speaker 4: role was you know at that level, at which point
Speaker 4: I can say, hey, Beck, like, it's actually not like
Speaker 4: the roles and responsibilities look like a B and C,
Speaker 4: and that's why we pay between X and Y, and unfortunately,
Speaker 4: like that salary is not feasible or if it's lower, Honestly,
Speaker 4: I just go into peptok mode and I'm like, what
Speaker 4: the hell, Like, this role's worth way more than that,
Speaker 4: Like is it because you think you don't have the
Speaker 4: skills or the experience? Like your resume is the reason
Speaker 4: I'm calling you. So I think it goes one of
Speaker 4: two ways. But if I was answering that question and
Speaker 4: it was just strictly a number, I would do a
Speaker 4: little bit of research first and put a range. I'd
Speaker 4: ever say I want fifty thousand dollars. I'd be like, okay,
Speaker 4: I want fifty seventy thousand dollars and give a range.
Speaker 4: And in a position where I have been asked the
Speaker 4: question directly, I would say, look, I'm looking for a
Speaker 4: pretty competitive salary that respects my qualifications and my education
Speaker 4: and my experience, and based on the research that I
Speaker 4: have done into this space. As I understand it, this
Speaker 4: role would be valued between X and Y, so I
Speaker 4: would expect the salary to be reflective of that. And
Speaker 4: I think you can just take the emotion out of it.
Speaker 4: I think when we're having these emotional conversations that are
Speaker 4: related to money, we can easily just slip into talking
Speaker 4: to a new employer or talking in an interview about like, well,
Speaker 4: they'd really need seventy thousand dollars because like, you know,
Speaker 4: I'm on seventy thousand dollars right now, and I like
Speaker 4: I want to keep my lifestyle. They don't care, Like
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, they just don't care.
Speaker 4: What you need to do is prove yourself as an individual.
Speaker 4: I'm paying you for your skills and experience, and I'm
Speaker 4: not paying you because you want to earn that amount
Speaker 4: of money. I'm paying you because that's what the role
Speaker 4: is worth. So I think if you can distill it
Speaker 4: back down to all the role is worth between A
Speaker 4: and B, and that's how it's going to work. I
Speaker 4: could say, well, I actually have a bit more experience,
Speaker 4: so I'm closer to be than I am to a.
Speaker 4: Thank you, So much for you know, having that conversation,
Speaker 4: or you might go, all right, well, if this salary
Speaker 4: is you know, at why I actually want more than that?
Speaker 2: At some point? What does salary progression look like in
Speaker 2: this business?
Speaker 4: Is it an income based salary progression? Or is it
Speaker 4: do I have to change roles completely? What would that
Speaker 4: look like? What does it look like for past employees?
Speaker 4: So I think there's a lot of conversation to be had.
Speaker 4: I think on this though, before I stop ranting about it.
Speaker 4: The one thing that I wouldn't want to disclose is
Speaker 4: what I was currently being paid. So if I applied
Speaker 4: for a job and you know, they're asking me what
Speaker 4: is my salary expectation, I would not be saying, oh,
Speaker 4: I want sixty because I'm currently earning sixty and like
Speaker 4: I just want this job more than the other one. Yeah, no,
Speaker 4: I want sixty if that's what the role is worth,
Speaker 4: or I want more. Like the salary you currently earn
Speaker 4: is not a reflection of your billy to do a job. Yeah, Like,
Speaker 4: if you're currently on fifty thousand dollars and you're applying
Speaker 4: for a job that's one hundred thousand dollars, but you
Speaker 4: possess all the skills and the experience that is necessary
Speaker 4: for that job. It's none of their business that you
Speaker 4: came from fifty because that's what the role is worth,
Speaker 4: and that's what the role is worth to the business,
Speaker 4: and that's how much you should be remunerated for it.
Speaker 4: Like there is no you know, stepping stones necessary or
Speaker 4: oh well, I'm not on that much now, like maybe
Speaker 4: you could save some money.
Speaker 2: No. Yeah, I'm also a big believer in the fact
Speaker 2: that whenever you change roles, you should be stepping up
Speaker 2: your salary really if like and obviously caveats again where possible,
Speaker 2: depending on how blah blah blah blah. But every time
Speaker 2: I applied for a new job, especially when I was younger,
Speaker 2: I was always adding ten k onto my salary. Like
Speaker 2: if I'm earning fifty, I want sixty. If I'm earning sixty,
Speaker 2: I want seventy. And that's how I stepped up and
Speaker 2: stepped up and stepped up, because that's there's that statistic
Speaker 2: that says people it's just on six million dollars back
Speaker 2: now I'm the richest woman in the world. No, there's
Speaker 2: that statistic that says people who change jobs earn more
Speaker 2: than people who do not, because you have that opportunity
Speaker 2: in that interview process to set yourself up immediately, and
Speaker 2: so I feel like, take advantage of that and don't
Speaker 2: let them make you feel lack Just because they're negotiating
Speaker 2: doesn't mean you can't negotiate as well. During the recruitment process,
Speaker 2: I recommend that you employ out what would a mediocre
Speaker 2: middle aged white man do, and then do that strategy
Speaker 2: if they would have the audacity to ask for one
Speaker 2: hundred grand, Babe, that's what you're doing. Yep.
Speaker 4: So that's that's how I would do it, And I
Speaker 4: guess that's how I've gotten where I've gotten.
Speaker 2: If that's not good enough advice, I don't know what is.
Speaker 2: It's a middle aged white man the advice. Yeah, exactly, audacious,
Speaker 2: read the paper.
Speaker 4: I don't know what else did they do. There's are
Speaker 4: probably a whole heap of stereotypes.
Speaker 5: They sneeze really loudly.
Speaker 2: Sneeze, and they sit.
Speaker 4: On chairs weird so that you can't sit on the
Speaker 4: chair next to them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you got to do all these on the plane. Oh,
Speaker 2: they take both arm rests checks. Anyway, back on track, Yeah,
Speaker 2: let's get back on track. We have a bit of
Speaker 2: a theme this week because our community call out was
Speaker 2: all so about salary, wasn't it, Victoria.
Speaker 4: Yea, let's talk about that because I'm really excited about
Speaker 4: this topic. So this week's community dilemma, let's read it out.
Speaker 4: We got a message and it went like this, Hey, girls,
Speaker 4: would you be able to give me your opinion on
Speaker 4: this one. So recently my employer did their annual remuneration
Speaker 4: and review and gave most of the stuff an increase. However,
Speaker 4: the increase is not nearly anywhere close to inflation. They
Speaker 4: are not open to negotiating and think everyone should be
Speaker 4: grateful for the pay rise they got. I should add
Speaker 4: the company is not struggling. Last financial year, we did
Speaker 4: one hundred and seventy percent of our sales targets talking
Speaker 4: in the low millions. Interested to see what the community
Speaker 4: thinks and how you guys would handle this situation.
Speaker 2: Leave him sys SI. There so many red flags in
Speaker 2: that message. I think it's hard without I guess knowing
Speaker 2: the context of you know, the size of the business
Speaker 2: and all of those things. Not that that should fully matter,
Speaker 2: but it's something that I think you would consider. But yeah, Victoria,
Speaker 2: you've said before, if your pay rise doesn't align with inflation,
Speaker 2: you're actually getting a pay cup, yep.
Speaker 4: But if your pay rise doesn't align with inflation, you
Speaker 4: are getting a pay cup, full stop, end of story.
Speaker 4: Because if you got paid ten dollars last year and
Speaker 4: now everything's more expensive, and I gave you the same
Speaker 4: ten dollars and expected you to be able to live
Speaker 4: the same life on that, it's not going to happen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like it's not.
Speaker 4: Your lifestyle is going down When my back pocket is
Speaker 4: being lined, Absolutely not. It gives me the ick, like
Speaker 4: I just it's not even about the ick factor, it's
Speaker 4: this is what's fair, this is how the world works,
Speaker 4: and from my perspective as a business owner, this is
Speaker 4: a cost of business. Like I employed Jess for example,
Speaker 4: I employed her for a certain amount per annum, but
Speaker 4: as a part of my mapping, as a part of
Speaker 4: my planning, as a part of you know, working out
Speaker 4: what that looks like, I know that inflation will come
Speaker 4: into it. Did I know that inflation would be at
Speaker 4: seven point one percent this year? Absolutely I didn't. But
Speaker 4: last year, you know, it was two or three percent,
Speaker 4: the year before two or three percent. So in my
Speaker 4: head because inflation happens every single year in a healthy economy,
Speaker 4: so it should be happening anyway. I've always made sure
Speaker 4: that we have the buffer to increase my employee's salaries
Speaker 4: in line with inflation.
Speaker 2: This year was more. I get it.
Speaker 4: So for some businesses, especially ones that are, you know,
Speaker 4: coming out of the pandemic into hard times. Please don't
Speaker 4: get me wrong, like, this is not going to apply
Speaker 4: to every single situation. Yes, I do think it can
Speaker 4: be a struggle for some employers, But for me, that
Speaker 4: is a cost of doing business. That is a cost
Speaker 4: of just keeping the bare minimum. Like at the end
Speaker 4: of the day, just as salary increased by seven percent,
Speaker 4: and that she's on the money. I genuinely believe in
Speaker 4: walking the walk. So it's Jess, what was your pay rise?
Speaker 2: So it wasn't just seven percent, it was the seven
Speaker 2: percent for cost of living.
Speaker 4: Yeap, And then we wiped it off the table and
Speaker 4: said that's cost of living. Now let's talk about your performance.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I really appreciated that because it felt really
Speaker 2: transparent and it felt like you had really thought about it.
Speaker 2: And I think the thing in this situation that's making
Speaker 2: me mad is that she's saying they were up one
Speaker 2: hundred and seventy percent on Yeah, exactly. And so as
Speaker 2: you said, if you're if you work for a business
Speaker 2: or a small business or an industry that is really
Speaker 2: struggling right now, I think there's room for conversation. Are
Speaker 2: you go okay? You know, in the pandemic, I know
Speaker 2: a lot of people gave up there, you know, they
Speaker 2: didn't get increases, some people took pay cuts. I think
Speaker 2: that's a very different thing. If your company is performing
Speaker 2: well and they're not passing that on to employees, that
Speaker 2: makes you feel like shit. Like when we sat down,
Speaker 2: I felt really valued because you had thought about it
Speaker 2: and you said to me, you know, I want you
Speaker 2: to be able to live the life that you could
Speaker 2: live last year in the same way, and you've worked
Speaker 2: really hard, and I want to reward you for that.
Speaker 2: And I don't think that, you know, increasing your salary
Speaker 2: for cost of living that seven percent increase isn't actually
Speaker 2: rewarding anything. It's just letting you buy bread for the
Speaker 2: same amount that you bought bread for last year. You know.
Speaker 2: So I feel like for this person, if I was
Speaker 2: in her shoes, I would be feeling really undervalued and
Speaker 2: I'd be feeling really sad, and I'd be feeling like
Speaker 2: my employer cares more about their bottom line than about
Speaker 2: their people. And I don't think that that's something that
Speaker 2: goes away.
Speaker 4: No, And I think that your people are the reason
Speaker 4: you have a bottom line.
Speaker 2: To begin with.
Speaker 4: You're not respecting them, Like it blows my mind right,
Speaker 4: like this idea that are so replaceable, like I get it,
Speaker 4: and having worked in like you know, development and HR
Speaker 4: and all of that. Historically, there seems to be this
Speaker 4: really transactional nature of talking about people. They'll be like, oh, well,
Speaker 4: if she doesn't like it, she can leave and we
Speaker 4: can re recruit. It's like, well, okay, but like, let's
Speaker 4: take Jess for example, Like let's pretend Jess was a
Speaker 4: disgruntled employee and wanted to leave. She has so much
Speaker 4: knowledge about my business that is really valuable. We're talking
Speaker 4: about the relationships, we're talking about how things work. She
Speaker 4: knows how I work, so that makes my life innately easier.
Speaker 4: There's a million other things that I guess come into that.
Speaker 4: But also the cost of recruitment isn't just oh, let's
Speaker 4: pop an add up on seak and what's at like
Speaker 4: twelve hundred bucks or something tangtise. That's fine, but that's
Speaker 4: twelve hundred bucks. You might not think that's expensive. But
Speaker 4: how many months is it going to take of lost
Speaker 4: productivity for that new person to be onboarded. Let's say
Speaker 4: it's three months, three months of not performing at their
Speaker 4: peak just because they're onboarding, and that that time needs
Speaker 4: to exist. What about the other implications of the rest
Speaker 4: of my staff having to sit down with this new
Speaker 4: person and train that person, the time, the energy that
Speaker 4: they're spending on you know, you know, training new jests.
Speaker 2: But then also what.
Speaker 4: About the lost productivity of them not doing their job
Speaker 4: nine to five month at a Friday because they're training
Speaker 4: somebody else. We know that on average, the cost of
Speaker 4: recruitment is about thirty five to forty thousand dollars to
Speaker 4: a business every single time you lose or gain someone.
Speaker 4: It's not a small thing like that's research. That's you know,
Speaker 4: not even taking into consideration what a recruiter would be paid.
Speaker 4: Because if we talk about the recruitment world, I think
Speaker 4: a lot of employees don't understand how that world works.
Speaker 4: But a recruiter is making about ten to twenty five
Speaker 4: percent of your annual salary just for placing you in
Speaker 4: a role, So you and one hundred grand. That placement
Speaker 4: fee for that recruiter is between ten thousand and twenty
Speaker 4: five thousand dollars, depending on who the recruiter is, what
Speaker 4: the recruiter is, if they're specialist, if they're not, what
Speaker 4: the salary is. So the higher the salary usually the
Speaker 4: lower the person antiage rate that they get.
Speaker 2: But to me, it's wild.
Speaker 4: And that's fine. I'm not saying it's bad. I'm not
Speaker 4: saying that they shouldn't be paid. That they're doing their job,
Speaker 4: and that's obviously a very big cost to a business.
Speaker 4: Like some businesses don't have time for that. I have
Speaker 4: historically used recruiters to help me find stuff when I
Speaker 4: didn't have the presence of she's on the money right,
Speaker 4: because we're in this lucky position where if I put
Speaker 4: an ad out, lots of eyes are going to see
Speaker 4: it because our community is quite large, Whereas historically, back
Speaker 4: when I was starting my finance company, nobody knew who
Speaker 4: I was or what I did. And you know what,
Speaker 4: it's even harder convincing them to want to work for me. Oh,
Speaker 4: I'm a small business and I'm run by a female.
Speaker 4: Everyone's like, wh like, no, thank you. So I think
Speaker 4: it's really interesting to talk about the cost of recruitment
Speaker 4: and what you mean to a business, and a lot
Speaker 4: of businesses don't see that value. And you know what,
Speaker 4: that's okay because if they don't see your value, you're
Speaker 4: going to leave them for somebody who does see your value.
Speaker 4: Because I guarantee you it's not about pay, Like pay
Speaker 4: is one component of it, but in and feeling like
Speaker 4: you're a part of something and feeling like you are
Speaker 4: respected to me are all just as important as the
Speaker 4: money that you bring home. So I guess TLDR, if
Speaker 4: your pay doesn't rise with inflation, it is a pay cut.
Speaker 4: End of story, that is it. And I think that
Speaker 4: I'm actually going to write a template. We're gonna put
Speaker 4: it on our website. You're going to be able to
Speaker 4: download it for free, and you can send that to
Speaker 4: your employer to address this, because I think there is
Speaker 4: a good conversation and your employer might come back and say, look, Beck,
Speaker 4: I'm really sorry, Like unfortunately, we are a very small
Speaker 4: business and at this point, like if I do it
Speaker 4: for you, I have to do it for everybody. And
Speaker 4: that would send us bankrupt. That's a conversation they should
Speaker 4: be having with you, though you deserve to understand why
Speaker 4: they don't think that you are worthy of the same
Speaker 4: lifestyle that you had this time last year.
Speaker 5: That is so true. Also, just to cap all of
Speaker 5: that off, if anyone tells you that you should be
Speaker 5: greedful in any context, I would run.
Speaker 4: Just beIN beIN it, beIN it. Nobody should tell me
Speaker 4: what I should be grateful for.
Speaker 2: It's an energy. You should be grateful for me to
Speaker 2: turn up and work my ass off your project seventy
Speaker 2: Are you joking?
Speaker 1: I know?
Speaker 5: Is that what they said in the DM that the
Speaker 5: the employees that they should be great?
Speaker 2: Okay, I just want to double check that that's what.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they should be grateful because they still got a
Speaker 4: pay rise. I don't, but it's not in line with inflation.
Speaker 4: So technically, my friends, that is still like less than
Speaker 4: what I had last year. Like, yes, the dollar amount
Speaker 4: is more, but that's inflation. And if your business doesn't
Speaker 4: understand that simple concept or respect.
Speaker 2: You, I'm out. Yeah, I'm out.
Speaker 5: Yep.
Speaker 4: It's twenty twenty three, Like we're not putting up with
Speaker 4: this anymore. We don't go to offices with white walls
Speaker 4: and black desks for the culture. I'm telling you that
Speaker 4: right now, absolutely no where.
Speaker 2: To runs this.
Speaker 4: Very curious to see what everyone else said. All right,
Speaker 4: so thank you for sitting down and hearing another Victoria round.
Speaker 4: We did ask the community a few questions. So we said,
Speaker 4: have you had an increase in your pay from an
Speaker 4: annual remuneration review. Fifty one percent of you said yes,
Speaker 4: Forty nine percent said no. If yes, does this increase
Speaker 4: match inflation?
Speaker 2: Is really so angry? Are you ready? I'm ready? Eighty
Speaker 2: four percent of you said no. No.
Speaker 4: That means only sixteen percent of you got an increase
Speaker 4: that keeps your lifestyle the same.
Speaker 2: It's not even an increase. Crazy.
Speaker 4: We then said, if no, did you talk to your
Speaker 4: employer about it? So six percent of you said yeah,
Speaker 4: and we came to a good negotiation.
Speaker 2: Only six six percent.
Speaker 4: Twenty two percent said yes, but they didn't care about
Speaker 4: my concerns, and fifty two percent said no, I was
Speaker 4: just happy I got a pay rise. No, that sucks
Speaker 4: one out of ten cannot recommend. I also feel like
Speaker 4: this is really you know, it goes back to our
Speaker 4: community to keep in mind, we're not all females. We
Speaker 4: are ninety eight percent female, and I feel like a
Speaker 4: lot of the female experience is shared here. But this
Speaker 4: goes full literally everybody. We all deserve to have confidence,
Speaker 4: we all deserve to have some level of conviction in
Speaker 4: our role. We all should be getting consistent feedback throughout
Speaker 4: the years. So when you do sit down for a
Speaker 4: performance review, you can go, well, I did ABC and
Speaker 4: D and here's my job description, and here's how I
Speaker 4: met that criteria. But here's how I went above and beyond.
Speaker 2: So I think there's a lot to.
Speaker 4: This conversation that we have broken down before, and Jess
Speaker 4: and I have been talking, and there's going to be
Speaker 4: more career content coming up soon because you guys have
Speaker 4: been demanding it, like you have been asking for it
Speaker 4: and asking for it, and it's something that can help
Speaker 4: you increase your income and you know, change your life.
Speaker 4: So we're going to create that content for you. But
Speaker 4: if you if you are a bit spicy, I get it.
Speaker 4: So someone said, I deserve a pay rise, but I
Speaker 4: know the company is struggling, so I want to know
Speaker 4: the best way to approach this.
Speaker 2: That's really hard.
Speaker 4: Yeah, someone else said, I got a five percent increase,
Speaker 4: and when I spoke to my supervisor, his response was,
Speaker 4: you are lucky you even got one.
Speaker 2: What is it that you must be a great We
Speaker 2: all know.
Speaker 4: We all know that supervisor was a mediocre, middle aged
Speaker 4: white man.
Speaker 2: We know, we just know. Soh yeah, So you know,
Speaker 2: it's like one of like, I'm not turning up for
Speaker 2: the fun of it, doll like, I'm here to be paid.
Speaker 2: I would actually like to retire yesterday.
Speaker 4: In fact, if it was a choice, I'd be a
Speaker 4: trust fund baby.
Speaker 1: Oh.
Speaker 2: I was born to be rich, you know exactly. I identify
Speaker 2: as a billionaire.
Speaker 4: So so start treating me like one is that week?
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that makes me so angry.
Speaker 4: Someone else said, I can't imagine many employers can support
Speaker 4: a pay rise in line with inflation.
Speaker 2: So that's fair to say, yeah.
Speaker 4: But we've been given the additional context here where they've
Speaker 4: said last financial year, we did one hundred and seventy
Speaker 4: percent of our sales targets, and.
Speaker 2: Those targets would have been set in place to ensure
Speaker 2: that the business was profitable. So it's not as if
Speaker 2: if we hit a million dollars we break even. It
Speaker 2: would be if we hit million dollars. We have profited,
Speaker 2: we have done well for the year, So then to
Speaker 2: do an additional seventy percent on top of that means
Speaker 2: they're rolling in it right now.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so someone else said, I'm a midwife, so I
Speaker 4: get award. I'm glad union gets us as small in
Speaker 4: but we can't ask for more or get any more
Speaker 4: than that.
Speaker 2: Which that's tough. Is bullshit, Like, I.
Speaker 4: Think we learned so much during the pandemic about our
Speaker 4: frontline workers and how valuable they were to our community,
Speaker 4: and we're still not paying them properly.
Speaker 2: What is this? It's unacceptable any industry where it is
Speaker 2: standardized like that, teaching and things as well. It's really tough.
Speaker 2: And I a few of my friends are teachers, and
Speaker 2: it's hard having the conversation because they go, we just
Speaker 2: get X amount every year, and I feel like that
Speaker 2: amount definitely wouldn't account for inflation this year. But hopefully
Speaker 2: those industries are unionized and maybe that's would you say,
Speaker 2: that's the job of the union to then say the
Speaker 2: increase this year needs to be higher, Yes, but.
Speaker 4: That's the job of the government to allocate more budget
Speaker 4: towards our frontline and healthcare workers and every other type
Speaker 4: of frontline worker. So I think that they should be
Speaker 4: doing more. The unions exist because the government doesn't do enough.
Speaker 4: So I think, you know, the inner perfect world, unions
Speaker 4: wouldn't have to exist because everyone's being treated fairly and
Speaker 4: being paid properly and there's no like politics involved in it.
Speaker 4: But there is, so the unions are necessary. Someone else said,
Speaker 4: I was advised that base salaries will never increase with
Speaker 4: inflation because that's just how this company works.
Speaker 2: Red flag, What the hell? What do you mean that's
Speaker 2: how the company works. That's such a black and white,
Speaker 2: like tell me you don't care about your people without
Speaker 2: telling you don't care about it. Yeah, exactly, exactly. So
Speaker 2: every year you're actually worthless to me, Jessica.
Speaker 4: Yeah, if they get so every single year you stay,
Speaker 4: it actually gets worse for you. Yeah, I'm going to
Speaker 4: pay you less year on your own year. And you
Speaker 4: know what compounds inflation in the same way that investment
Speaker 4: returns to so it's just going backwards.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if they can increase your hex repayments in line
Speaker 2: with inflation, because they recognize that, that is a necessary break.
Speaker 2: Even why are we not recognizing that salaries are exactly
Speaker 2: the same.
Speaker 4: Yeah, do you want to hear one that's going to
Speaker 4: make you really angry already. So someone said, my work
Speaker 4: used scare tactics so people would vote for the EBA
Speaker 4: with the lower pay rise associated it worked.
Speaker 2: A company that I've worked for did something similarly. They
Speaker 2: did not. So it was a company that employed a
Speaker 2: lot of young women. And you know, in an industry
Speaker 2: where typically you have people who are young, don't I
Speaker 2: knew nothing about finance, and I think that was a
Speaker 2: very standardized thing. And they brought in an EBA and
Speaker 2: it was when for those who don't know, whenever you
Speaker 2: bring in that kind of agreement, an enterprise bargaining agreement,
Speaker 2: an enterprise bargaining agree, whenever you bring that in, if
Speaker 2: you're changing the policy for company as a whole, it
Speaker 2: has to be passed by a majority vote. So they
Speaker 2: can't a company can't just bring in an EBA like
Speaker 2: it has to be put to a vote by the
Speaker 2: people who were employed, and they were. Essentially there were
Speaker 2: two options on the table, one that paid more, one
Speaker 2: that paid less, the one that paid more. There was
Speaker 2: some leave that there was some change with the leave,
Speaker 2: and essentially rumors were being spread by upper management that
Speaker 2: the leave changes were going to like screen over and
Speaker 2: that's the worst. Like, you don't want that instability. And
Speaker 2: at the time I had no idea. Why would you know?
Speaker 2: But now as I trusted your manager, right as an adult,
Speaker 2: I look back and I go, oh my god, like
Speaker 2: that is actually not how that worked. Wow, that is
Speaker 2: so bad.
Speaker 5: That should be illegal.
Speaker 2: Is that illegal?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: I didn't think it is, because it's it's still freedom
Speaker 2: of choice, right, Like I could have made whatever choice
Speaker 2: that I wanted. But when I had people, you know,
Speaker 2: and everyone was talking about it, Oh, what should I do?
Speaker 2: None of us knew what anything meant, don't even know
Speaker 2: what any of being it was. If someone who is
Speaker 2: a bit more authoritative than you goes, oh, like I
Speaker 2: think that blah blah bah blah, Oh my god, yeah
Speaker 2: you're so smart, or at least that's what I did.
Speaker 2: But now, in hindsight, especially hearing that person, I reckon
Speaker 2: that's what happened. Oh that is LI truly the worst.
Speaker 4: So someone else in Bright and News said, well, they
Speaker 4: wouldn't give me a race. So I resigned, got a
Speaker 4: similar role I don't know the company, and got fifty
Speaker 4: percent more money Queen.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 4: I feel like that's probably a really good place to
Speaker 4: leave it, because the rest of them are just really depressing,
Speaker 4: like it's actually insane, and I just I think that
Speaker 4: we need to know what we're worth and then demand
Speaker 4: that because that should actually be the bare minimum. And
Speaker 4: if people are trying to tell you that you're three
Speaker 4: percent or your five percent pay rise is something that
Speaker 4: you should be grateful for.
Speaker 2: Like, please, don't get me wrong.
Speaker 4: I'm sure you're looking at it and going with me
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, like I have more
Speaker 4: money coming in, but that's not as respectful as it
Speaker 4: could be. And I think that mostly we are just
Speaker 4: trying to demand respect because there are going to be
Speaker 4: a lot of small business owners that aren't able to
Speaker 4: put up their salaries. Like we are so lucky in
Speaker 4: the world that we live in right now that she's
Speaker 4: on the money's doing well enough that we can do that.
Speaker 4: And I think then in every single opportunity where I
Speaker 4: can pass it on to my team or make sure
Speaker 4: that they're in the best possible position or being remunerated
Speaker 4: as well as they possibly could, that's my responsibility. And
Speaker 4: you know what, it could have been a really hard
Speaker 4: conversation if we didn't have a level of profit. But
Speaker 4: I also think that that comes down to ultimately the
Speaker 4: greed of the business owner as well. And I'm not
Speaker 4: saying that every business owner is greedy, But at the
Speaker 4: end of the day, I think I still would have
Speaker 4: passed it on regardless of wash my profits were looking like.
Speaker 4: I just would have changed what I was taking home
Speaker 4: to make sure that my staff knew that I still
Speaker 4: respected them in the way that I actually do. Yeah,
Speaker 4: so everyone's different again, but I think we should be
Speaker 4: asking for respect in our workplaces.
Speaker 2: And that's a bare minimum. Yep. And that's the tea.
Speaker 2: All right, that's a good tea.
Speaker 4: I'm going to go get a cup of tea now
Speaker 4: because mine's gone cold. So have the best week, guys.
Speaker 4: I love you, and we will see you on Monday
Speaker 4: for Money Days.
Speaker 2: Bye guys. Bye.
Speaker 4: The advice shared on She's on the Money is general
Speaker 4: in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
Speaker 4: on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should
Speaker 4: not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision.
Speaker 2: If you do choose to buy a financial.
Speaker 4: Product, read the PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice
Speaker 4: tailored towards your needs. Victoria, Divine and She's on the
Speaker 4: Money are authorized representatives of Money sherper P, T y
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