1 00:00:01,520 --> 00:00:04,560 Speaker 1: Going by the beat of her own drum is aptly 2 00:00:04,640 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: the title of this installment of Rage Against the Menopause. 3 00:00:08,320 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 1: I'm Patrina Jones and I met Nicki Buckley through a 4 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: mutual friend, fashion designer Lisa Barron. The model and TV 5 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: presenter synonymous with shows like Sale of the Century and 6 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:23,639 Speaker 1: Perfect Match in the nineties and more recently Postcards, was 7 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:27,760 Speaker 1: keen to share her lived experience on menopause. Reeling from 8 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:31,320 Speaker 1: the early death of her mother from ovarian cancer. Nicki 9 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: has always been vigilant about her health and fitness, and 10 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:39,639 Speaker 1: a timely guest for episode eight, coinciding with Gene Hale's 11 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:45,400 Speaker 1: Women's Health Week. Well, my next guest is an Ossie 12 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 1: TV presenter and model. 13 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 2: Very well known. 14 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:51,519 Speaker 1: She became known in the nineties as co host to 15 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:55,440 Speaker 1: Greg Evans on The Blind. Daish also knew it as 16 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:59,520 Speaker 1: Perfect Match before that, and of course who could forget this. 17 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 3: Lumble century and now here is Glen rep Thank you 18 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:10,480 Speaker 3: very much. Be Hi everyone, Hello, walk in the file 19 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:12,120 Speaker 3: that could be when you were to Thursday Night. I'm 20 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 3: very exciting night Tray carry out the champions. Before we 21 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 3: talked to him, though, please give a very warm welcome 22 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:20,760 Speaker 3: to Nicky Buckley, Hey Nikki, how are you all? 23 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 4: Love? 24 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:25,319 Speaker 1: Hearing that that takes me back to being in secondary 25 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 1: school and mum cooking meat and three vegs for dinner. No, no, no, 26 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 1: but you've been doing it for a decade time. 27 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 2: Like, just hearing that is just fond fond fond, fond 28 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:36,760 Speaker 2: fond memories. 29 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 1: Tell me about Sale of the Century? How did it 30 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:39,279 Speaker 1: come about? 31 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:43,120 Speaker 2: Well, I mean I started out my I guess, my 32 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 2: career in that area as a model. Yeah, and then 33 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:50,040 Speaker 2: Murray when I was overseas, Murray got a job modeling 34 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 2: on Sale of the Century. Your husband, yes, And so 35 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 2: I remember coming back from overseas and him saying, come 36 00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 2: and have lunch with me in Channel nine. So I 37 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 2: went in and got spotted by I guess one of 38 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:05,200 Speaker 2: the producers from Grundy's, and so I started, I auditioned 39 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 2: and started as a model on the show for a 40 00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:10,079 Speaker 2: long time, which was just fabulous. And actually had a 41 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 2: dinner on Sunday with some of the girlfriends that I 42 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 2: used to work with and you know, and like you know, 43 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 2: nearly forty years still catching Yeah, So we had great, 44 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,239 Speaker 2: great time, great friendship. Got to work with Mars on 45 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 2: the show, and from that I got to audition when 46 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:32,080 Speaker 2: they were re auditioning for Blind Day, Perfect Match. Grundies 47 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 2: ran both shows, so they invited all of us models 48 00:02:36,720 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 2: to audition for the show, and I got the gig 49 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:42,959 Speaker 2: on Blind Day Perfect Match with Greg Evans. So I 50 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: left the modeling, went and did that for only six 51 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 2: months my time there, I you know, realistically kind of 52 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:54,240 Speaker 2: got the sack after six months because I wouldn't you know, 53 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 2: I was pretty straight, and so you know, they wanted 54 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 2: someone a little bit more giggly and flirty, and I 55 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:01,080 Speaker 2: was quite you know, they'd say before i'd go out 56 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 2: it tonight. Now, remember when you go out and I 57 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:04,919 Speaker 2: just be you know, say this joke to you know, 58 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:06,359 Speaker 2: to Greg and do a little bit of this, and 59 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:07,679 Speaker 2: I'd be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'd go out and 60 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 2: I'd be so straight, so, you know, fair enough. So 61 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 2: then I realized after doing that that I really enjoyed 62 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 2: the job, and so I went and studied acting and 63 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 2: took voice lessons just to kind of get me over 64 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,440 Speaker 2: that fear of making a fool of myself. And that's 65 00:03:22,480 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 2: where I was straight. Yeah, And so then at a 66 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:30,080 Speaker 2: certain point then I went back to modeling on Sale 67 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 2: and a lot of my friends, you know, and people 68 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:33,919 Speaker 2: said to me, why are you going back to modeling, 69 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 2: because you're now a presenter, you know, why are you 70 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 2: going back? And I'm like, well, because it's a good job. 71 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 2: I've got a mortgage and I enjoy the work. But 72 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 2: what I did along the way was I started studying acting, 73 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 2: which I loved, and then the opportunity came up to 74 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 2: audition for the role actually for the weather over, the 75 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 2: filling in for Rob Jel and so I auditioned for that, 76 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 2: and because of my confidence I built up with the acting. 77 00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 2: I guess I got that role. And then we were 78 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 2: asked to audition for the co host on Sale with Glenn, 79 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:07,839 Speaker 2: and I guess all of that kind of fell into place. 80 00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 2: I felt really when I was asked to audition for that, 81 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 2: I was really confident because I'd done my acting. I 82 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 2: just felt really comfortable. Yep. So I didn't feel like, oh, 83 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:18,239 Speaker 2: I've got to get this, and just like had fun 84 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 2: and got the job. So you were yourself. 85 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 1: I loved watching you you always now that I know you, 86 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:28,080 Speaker 1: I love that what I thought you would be you 87 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: really are. You're such a warm, down to earth natural person. 88 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 1: But you're also very I think why you were an 89 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:37,120 Speaker 1: idol to me is because I could see a strong 90 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: woman on the screen and you're saying that you wouldn't 91 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: sort of fit into that cookie cutter role of perhaps 92 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,919 Speaker 1: maybe I'm wrong, correct me being kind of the ditsy blonde. 93 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 1: I love that about you, and I think you were 94 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,040 Speaker 1: such a role model to girls in their late teens 95 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 1: that I was. One other time that I really admired 96 00:04:57,480 --> 00:04:59,680 Speaker 1: you is when you were pregnant and I'm not sure 97 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:03,640 Speaker 1: if it was with your first son, and you copped 98 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 1: a lot of crap about what was it just wearing 99 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 1: a maternity dress on the show. 100 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 2: So I was, yeah, that was on Sale of the 101 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 2: Century and that that is like twenty seven years ago. 102 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:19,479 Speaker 2: Now this is how old Cooper is, So that's just 103 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 2: so bizarre. But at the time of doing Sale, it 104 00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 2: was a glamorous role, and you know, I was happy 105 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:26,560 Speaker 2: with that. I was a model and I enjoyed getting 106 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:28,400 Speaker 2: dressed up and you know, made up and all of 107 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:30,599 Speaker 2: that kind of thing. So we used to film five 108 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,039 Speaker 2: shows in one day, the week show, and you know, 109 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:35,039 Speaker 2: every night you had a different you know, dress, and 110 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 2: it was a glamorous you know, dress. So when I 111 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:42,160 Speaker 2: found out that I was pregnant, it was during our 112 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 2: summer break. I once again, you know, telling my girlfriends, 113 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 2: and they actually said to me, so, what's going to 114 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:49,960 Speaker 2: happen with your job? Will you continue working? I said yeah? 115 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 2: And they said, well, what will they do like build 116 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 2: a podium for you to stand behind or something. My 117 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:55,840 Speaker 2: girlfriends and I said, what do you mean? They said, 118 00:05:55,880 --> 00:05:57,039 Speaker 2: you know, see, you're not showing your tummy. 119 00:05:57,080 --> 00:05:59,920 Speaker 1: I said, oh no, and this is the late nineties, 120 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 1: we might point now, yeah, like not nineteen twenty. 121 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:06,839 Speaker 2: So he's ninety seven he was, you know wow. So anyway, 122 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:09,920 Speaker 2: I just said, no, I'll just keep working. And so 123 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:13,800 Speaker 2: what happened was there was no nice evening where it 124 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 2: was caftan neck. To me, that was what was ya? 125 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:20,279 Speaker 2: No choices? What's like a sheet? Yea and no choices. 126 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:22,919 Speaker 2: So we just kind of went, oh, well, we'll just 127 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 2: keep getting a bigger size in a stretchy, nice evening dress. 128 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: So that's what I and that's the point. No one 129 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:30,160 Speaker 1: wore type fitting Matt clothing. 130 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:30,600 Speaker 2: You know. 131 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 1: It was all sailor collars and stupid ties and big, 132 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:36,559 Speaker 1: billowy dresses like you'd take off in a gust of wind. 133 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,920 Speaker 2: And so Lisa Baron, who you know lovely. She is 134 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:44,320 Speaker 2: an Australian you know, iconic designer, and I always she 135 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 2: always dressed me. She dressed me on on blind dates, 136 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:49,039 Speaker 2: dressed me on sale and I used to be her 137 00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 2: you know, she calls it, you know, her muse for 138 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:53,559 Speaker 2: her fashion brades. And they used to have these strained 139 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 2: designer collection parades once a year and each designer would 140 00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 2: have you know, a celebrity or someone walk for them, 141 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 2: and they'd bring out international models from overseas. And this 142 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 2: particular year, Lisa and I had done the last couple 143 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 2: and Lisa said, I'd love you to walk for me again. 144 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 2: I said, oh, Lisa, I can't. I'm five months pregnant. 145 00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 2: And she goes, yeah, I know. And I said, well, 146 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 2: you know, I won't be offended because you know, I 147 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:15,520 Speaker 2: can't really do it. She goes, why not and I said, oh, well, 148 00:07:15,600 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 2: you know. She goes, no, I've got this idea. I've 149 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:19,640 Speaker 2: got this idea. And she created this dress which was 150 00:07:19,880 --> 00:07:24,240 Speaker 2: a black I remember it very well, sleeve hug the 151 00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 2: figure hugging with a heart cut out over the belly, 152 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 2: and she goes, I want to celebrate your you know, 153 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 2: your pregnancy and womanhood. And I'm like, okay, cool, and 154 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 2: so I bore that down the catwalk. 155 00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 1: It was groundbreaking. Yeah, it was ground and I remember 156 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 1: it made the news. It was on the nightly news. 157 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 2: It was yeah, it was. It became very controversial. It 158 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 2: like we were trying to make some kind of stance, 159 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:50,680 Speaker 2: which I guess in a way we were just going 160 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 2: and going, why can't I steal you? Embracing it, But 161 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 2: it cused a massive stir where, you know, a current 162 00:07:57,840 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 2: affair round a story on it. All the radio stations 163 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 2: and stories. Magazines ran stories, the newspaper had polls. Should 164 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 2: I be allowed to you know, be seen showing the belly, 165 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 2: you know, and everything that grew with it, you know, 166 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 2: the bust and everything. And I continue to work right 167 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 2: up until a week before and I look back at 168 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 2: some of the footage now of me jumping around that 169 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 2: you know turntable, wobbling, wobbling around, waddling, and just like 170 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 2: I look and go, oh my god, I was huge. 171 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 1: No, what a beautiful memory to capture. You've got that now, 172 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 1: and your son's got that and then future grandchildren. I 173 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 1: think it was amazing and I think, well, Lisa's a 174 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 1: trailblazer as well. You know, I think I think it 175 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: was great that brings to the point of here we are, 176 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 1: all these years, since the late nineties talking menopause. Yes, 177 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: you're a trailblazer. 178 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 2: That happened. 179 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 1: I know when did that happen? And I, you know, 180 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:57,840 Speaker 1: as someone in the limelight, as you are talking about menopause, 181 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 1: I want to play some audio Sophie Duchess of Wessex. 182 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 1: She is also really vocal in this space. 183 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:05,439 Speaker 2: I love this. 184 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,559 Speaker 4: We all talk about having babies, but nobody talks about 185 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 4: the parents. 186 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 2: Nobody talks about the menopause. Why not. 187 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 4: It's something that happens to us twelve times, certainly pair 188 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:18,440 Speaker 4: is twelve times a year. It's something that's incredibly normal. 189 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 4: But it's something that is very hidden, and I think 190 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 4: it's time to say enough. 191 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 2: Isn't that great? 192 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,559 Speaker 1: What is the shame? Why haven't we spoken menopause? 193 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 2: Well? I think that it is coming out from under 194 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:33,960 Speaker 2: the covers at the moment, which is great. But yeah, 195 00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 2: I don't know. I guess you know from our mums 196 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:38,360 Speaker 2: and I lost my mum twenty years ago, so I 197 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 2: can never talk to her about it. But I just 198 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 2: know that, you know, people were seen to be a 199 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:45,960 Speaker 2: bit crazy and a bit nutty, and you know, perhaps 200 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:51,320 Speaker 2: worried about judgment like with the pregnant. Yes, yeah, like 201 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 2: hide it. Yeah, And it is interesting, you know, way 202 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 2: past periods and things like that. But growing up as 203 00:09:57,360 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 2: yeah girl, you know, it was like never kind of 204 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 2: spoken of out, I guess, And it is a bit 205 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 2: more now, which is kind of nice. But it's yeah, 206 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 2: like having myself now, I would say, I'd say I'm 207 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 2: five years into menopause. So are you post metopausal? Well? No, 208 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 2: I still well, you know, we could discuss in a 209 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:20,600 Speaker 2: sect just you know, having had my recent operation, but like, 210 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 2: how do you know exactly where you are? I know, 211 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 2: I'm still a frustrating thing. Yes, still still a little 212 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 2: bit in it because I still get a little bit 213 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 2: of the you know, the hot flushes, but nowhere near 214 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 2: what I endured. 215 00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:37,000 Speaker 1: Right, shall see? Five five years down the train, five 216 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 1: years down the safe to say, how how was your experience? 217 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:43,439 Speaker 2: Was it harrowing? Yeah? It was, really it was. And 218 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 2: I'm the kind of person that doesn't you know, wallow 219 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:49,079 Speaker 2: in that or you know, I put the best face forward. 220 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:52,200 Speaker 2: So when I knew I was coming on to discuss 221 00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:54,160 Speaker 2: this with you. I wanted to kind of have a 222 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:57,360 Speaker 2: bit of a think back, because you forget it's like childbirth. 223 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:01,560 Speaker 2: You forget how freck and painful that is, and you do, 224 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:03,760 Speaker 2: but I do know it, you know, it was kind 225 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:09,640 Speaker 2: of five years of I guess the worst of it 226 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 2: for me was part of it was the lack of sleep. 227 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 2: And I recall a time where I was trying to 228 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 2: work out exactly what was happening to me during the 229 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 2: night so I could tell my doctor, and so I 230 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 2: was had. I was documenting it quite an organized first 231 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:28,719 Speaker 2: year I had it. I had a book next to 232 00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 2: my bed, and every time I woke up in a dripping, wet, 233 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 2: you know, mess, but also that horrific panic attack and 234 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 2: anxiety that comes with it, or came with it for me, 235 00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:43,680 Speaker 2: I wrote down the time and it was like every 236 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 2: hour or hour and a half. So once that happens, 237 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:48,640 Speaker 2: it takes you quite a while to get back to succeed, 238 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:51,600 Speaker 2: and then then I'd go, seriously, has it really been 239 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 2: an hour? And so yeah, So the lack of sleep 240 00:11:54,640 --> 00:11:57,200 Speaker 2: from that was horrific, Like you wake up the next 241 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 2: morning and you feel nauseous and you feel sick and 242 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 2: like you've slept at all. No, you know you haven't. No, 243 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:08,959 Speaker 2: So yeah, that part of it, I guess I remember. 244 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:11,679 Speaker 2: And then just having to get through your day feeling 245 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:15,520 Speaker 2: like that is hard. 246 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,120 Speaker 1: Did you still have kids at school at that stage, 247 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 1: so you still had that routine of other people relying 248 00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:21,920 Speaker 1: on you heavily. 249 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:26,079 Speaker 2: Not too bad in that too, I'd say the middle 250 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 2: of it for me was during COVID. But the blessing 251 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 2: of that was that I could go so in the 252 00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:37,679 Speaker 2: morning up, you know, and I could go, you know what, 253 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:39,079 Speaker 2: I can't cope till I've gone back and had a 254 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 2: couple of hours sleep, So I could go back and 255 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:43,319 Speaker 2: sleep till eleven o'clock, could and get those few hours 256 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:47,200 Speaker 2: that then made you feel normal. And my husband was 257 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:49,680 Speaker 2: very supportive with that, and he just knew, like, I'm 258 00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:51,240 Speaker 2: just better and we're all better off being a bit 259 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:53,080 Speaker 2: quiet and letting mum get a couple of extra hours 260 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:55,080 Speaker 2: sleep and she'll be happy. Yeah. 261 00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 1: But I mean, you've got one of those beautiful, beautiful 262 00:12:57,480 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 1: marriages where you've been together. 263 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:02,560 Speaker 2: How long have you been together? Now? It's quite scary. Yeah. 264 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:05,320 Speaker 2: So it's like we met when I was sixteen and 265 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,880 Speaker 2: I'm fifty eight, So it's amazing A long time so 266 00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:09,080 Speaker 2: ying and Yang. 267 00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 1: So he could read the room. How important was he 268 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 1: in supporting you through that period? 269 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 2: So I said to him last night when I was 270 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:18,240 Speaker 2: coming in here, like, what's your memory of it? Just 271 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:20,320 Speaker 2: you know what from your point of view, as you know, 272 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:24,439 Speaker 2: being a husband kind of thing. And he said, he 273 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:26,559 Speaker 2: said that he kind of put it back in a 274 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:29,640 Speaker 2: nice one and me, he said that I was amazing 275 00:13:29,679 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 2: at how I dealt with it. And so we talked 276 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 2: all the way through it because I was jealous of 277 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 2: my girlfriends doing HRT, and I guess if we move 278 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 2: on to that kind of part of it. Whereas I, 279 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 2: having having had lost my mother to avarian cancer, I 280 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:52,120 Speaker 2: was under what I now call the false belief that 281 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:54,640 Speaker 2: if you took HRT you would increase your chances of 282 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 2: cancer avarian or breast. That was the information that we 283 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:02,440 Speaker 2: were and so I was anti anti anti. So all 284 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 2: my girlfriends were going on HRT and getting through everything fine, 285 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:08,840 Speaker 2: and so I was jealous. And I used to say 286 00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:11,080 Speaker 2: to Murray, you know, I just I wish I could, 287 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:12,840 Speaker 2: but I know I can't. I just you know, felt 288 00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:15,440 Speaker 2: ripped off. I just yeah, and he said yeah. But 289 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:17,079 Speaker 2: and how I remember him saying to me, because the 290 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 2: difference is, Nick, you can compartmentalize it, so you know 291 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 2: you're not going crazy. You know that what is happening 292 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 2: to you is you know the symptoms of menopause, So 293 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 2: you know the anxiety that you feel, the panic attacks 294 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 2: you feel, you know you're not going nuts. It's menopause. 295 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:34,800 Speaker 2: And you can compartmentalize it and go, this is shit, 296 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:38,360 Speaker 2: but I know what it is, so I can put 297 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 2: it in that box and move on and you know, 298 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 2: wait for the glory days when it's all what a 299 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:44,560 Speaker 2: great husband. 300 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 1: So the panic attacks for you were really like had 301 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:49,280 Speaker 1: you had a history of panic attacks? 302 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 2: No? No, And it wasn't like some people say, like 303 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 2: I had a panic attack and I was in the 304 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 2: supermarket and I just had to get out to me, 305 00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 2: it was it was the feeling that came with the 306 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 2: hot flush or you know the f ashes that some 307 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,480 Speaker 2: people call them. So it was like, I liken it too. 308 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 2: If you're you know, if you're ever in a car 309 00:15:06,960 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 2: and you have to slam on the brakes because you're 310 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 2: just going to an avoid an accident, and that that 311 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 2: a dream comes through, it feels like it hurts. It's 312 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 2: like you feel that. So, you know, you would often 313 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:21,480 Speaker 2: at night and I would have that panic, panic, panic, 314 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 2: panic feeling, and I'd have to say to my head, 315 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 2: it's okay, it's all right, like you're just having just 316 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 2: before the flush comes, and what can I hear? 317 00:15:27,920 --> 00:15:31,880 Speaker 1: What can I smell? And ground yourself? A bit poor thing? 318 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 2: That's awful, it is, it was, But yeah, all good? Now? 319 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 2: So what did help you? So? I tried everything, you know, 320 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 2: I googled everything, tried everything organic natural that I could. 321 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 2: I remember going to I had a wonderful and have 322 00:15:47,640 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 2: a wonderful doctor who is a GP and also a 323 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:54,440 Speaker 2: natural path and and I was thinking about it, like 324 00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 2: I think that a lot of doctors that you spoke 325 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 2: to once you just straight away said no, I'm not 326 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 2: going down HRT. They didn't necessarily say to me why 327 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 2: because do you realize that there's you know, positive things 328 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 2: frozen cons And they just took me as going not 329 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 2: going there. And so I would try and work with that. 330 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 2: So I had all kinds of organic motion potions and 331 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 2: things you know, concocted that I tried, you know, and 332 00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:19,680 Speaker 2: I would try it for months and foul tasting years, 333 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:20,720 Speaker 2: and I would go, Okay, you got to have this, 334 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:22,480 Speaker 2: and then three hours out of lad you know, we'd 335 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 2: do it all. Nothing worked, And so the only way 336 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:29,880 Speaker 2: I got through it in the end was to have 337 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:34,480 Speaker 2: some sleeping pills that you know, steadfastly would not take 338 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 2: every night, but if I knew I had a big 339 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 2: day the next day, if I had because I was working, 340 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 2: if I had a job the next day, then I 341 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 2: would take a sleeping pill. And even though you might 342 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 2: wake up with the flush, you could kind of you 343 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 2: doped a bit, just you know, to go get back to. 344 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:52,040 Speaker 2: That's was how I could get through it kind of thing. 345 00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 2: And you know, allow myself maybe one or two nights 346 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 2: a week to have that, and that's what helped. 347 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 1: For me, you know what you mean when you were 348 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 1: talking about potions. When we were trying to get pregnant, 349 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:08,080 Speaker 1: we went down Chinese medicine because we tried five years 350 00:17:08,080 --> 00:17:12,639 Speaker 1: to get Audrey multiple miscarriages and within do polycystic. 351 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 2: And I went to see this. 352 00:17:14,040 --> 00:17:18,080 Speaker 1: Guy and he would boil up each individual woman's brew 353 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:20,720 Speaker 1: and mine and I'm not kidding you it actually had 354 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 1: chook pooh in it. But he would obviously either way 355 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:27,280 Speaker 1: that he cultivated or boiled it or whatever the. 356 00:17:27,240 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 2: Heck he did with it, it worked. 357 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:30,879 Speaker 1: In the end, I still believe it was him, that 358 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: goddess to the point of a live birth. But you'd 359 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:37,639 Speaker 1: stand on your head for a month if it meant 360 00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:40,399 Speaker 1: relief for anything. And I think that's the point is, 361 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,719 Speaker 1: you know, HRT has had a bad rap, but it's 362 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: something that you have to determine yourself, with all your 363 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,679 Speaker 1: team of specialists to see what's best for you, and 364 00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: what's right for you may not be right for someone else. 365 00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, when you said that about the Chinese medicine, that's 366 00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:58,719 Speaker 2: another thing that I tried as well. So I had 367 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:03,919 Speaker 2: Chinese medicine and I had you know, the dry needling, yes, 368 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 2: and you and stuff. Yeah, yeah, i'd give that a 369 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 2: go for a few months ago. And I hated that. 370 00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:10,920 Speaker 2: I hated, Oh did you You didn't like the no 371 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:13,000 Speaker 2: and it didn't you know. In the end, I kind 372 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 2: of thought, yeah, maybe it's working, Maybe it's work, and 373 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:16,680 Speaker 2: they're like, oh no, it's not. So there was another thing, 374 00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:22,240 Speaker 2: but yeah, look that I mean the HRT, Like I said, 375 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:24,840 Speaker 2: I had been of the belief. Everything I read, everything 376 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 2: I was told was that if you took HRT, if 377 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:32,240 Speaker 2: you had an occurrence of you know, breast cancer or 378 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 2: a bearing cancer in your family, then it would increase 379 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:37,160 Speaker 2: your chances of getting that. So that that was what 380 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 2: rang true in my. 381 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 1: Ear is a bit trauma tised from losing your mum 382 00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 1: to that trauma disease. 383 00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 2: But of course you would naturally, and I knew that 384 00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 2: from my memory Mum was on HRT as well, So 385 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 2: I'm like, Okay, well that happened for her, so that 386 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:52,720 Speaker 2: will happen for It's not going to happen for me. Yes, yes, 387 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:56,399 Speaker 2: And so that's why I steered clear of it. And 388 00:18:56,760 --> 00:18:59,199 Speaker 2: because we are having discussions, we are talking with our 389 00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:01,800 Speaker 2: friends and that now obviously, one of my girlfriends said, 390 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 2: flicked me a podcast which I flicked to you, which 391 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:11,240 Speaker 2: was an incredible insight for me into the fact that 392 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:16,720 Speaker 2: that whole period of hearing that HRT increases your chances 393 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 2: of cancer was a misrepresentation of a study that was done. 394 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:24,120 Speaker 2: And the study was done in two thousand and two 395 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:27,920 Speaker 2: by the Women's Health Initiative in the USA, and they 396 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 2: did this massive billion dollar study and you know what 397 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 2: they did was, you know, they found all these things. 398 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 2: And they instead of releasing that study as you normally 399 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,240 Speaker 2: would to the medical fraternity and the medical people would 400 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 2: you know, dissect it and all out what they want 401 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:45,840 Speaker 2: and go, yeah, that's true. Now I haven't seen that. 402 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 2: They released their study to the media without going through 403 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:53,960 Speaker 2: those proper channel, proper channel. So they had a press 404 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:56,960 Speaker 2: release and put this out and so then as you know, 405 00:19:57,080 --> 00:20:00,239 Speaker 2: the press do, they take whatever bits they want. And 406 00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 2: the headline in the New York Times was HRT increases 407 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:09,040 Speaker 2: the chance of breast cancer big you know, bold prints. 408 00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 2: Same in England on the front cover of the papers. 409 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 2: They're so alarmist, so alarmist because as they dug deeper, 410 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 2: it didn't at all. Wasn't the case that has stuck. 411 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:21,119 Speaker 2: That's two thousand and two, and you know, the FDA 412 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:24,359 Speaker 2: put a black box on it, you know, stating that 413 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:27,200 Speaker 2: in anything that's got you know, estrogen in it, can 414 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:30,840 Speaker 2: you know, lead to an increase in cancer. So and 415 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 2: then they, you know, once they've gone back and checked 416 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 2: it all, it was all a misrepresentation. They misquoted themselves, 417 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 2: and it's the opposite, you know. So yeah, you know 418 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 2: it's important for me, having learned that to just get 419 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:49,719 Speaker 2: I guess that message out to just just check everything 420 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:53,320 Speaker 2: out and see, you know, because you know, it can 421 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:57,040 Speaker 2: be such a horrible, horrible time. You know, marriages can 422 00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:01,880 Speaker 2: end over you know, how we change and maybe and 423 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,359 Speaker 2: I just think I most definitely would have taken hit 424 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:06,159 Speaker 2: if I knew that. 425 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:07,360 Speaker 1: Then to get what you know now. 426 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:11,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I would have been a much happier person 427 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,399 Speaker 2: to be around. And I also remember, like you know, 428 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,119 Speaker 2: I probably didn't ask Murray this you listen to this 429 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,240 Speaker 2: and wanted to not, you know, he'll go. Yeah. I 430 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:21,880 Speaker 2: kind of thought at the time, I was we're having 431 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 2: problems as well, like everyone does in that time. But 432 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:29,160 Speaker 2: I used to think, no, I'm not crabby with my husband. 433 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,359 Speaker 2: No I'm not crappy with my menopause. No, not at all. 434 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:34,679 Speaker 2: I'm just having the hot flushes. And yeah, but it 435 00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:37,840 Speaker 2: hasn't made me a snooty, you know, bitchy, snappy person 436 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:38,200 Speaker 2: at all. 437 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: Zero two, one hundred and ten point. 438 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 2: Three of a second. 439 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: But in fact it probably it's horrible and I'm setting 440 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 1: other episodes. You know, there'll be days where the rage 441 00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 1: and it's usually for me when the hot flush is 442 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:51,919 Speaker 1: a bad it's sort of like hand in hand with 443 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:54,440 Speaker 1: the rage, and I'll just fly off the handle over 444 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:58,080 Speaker 1: something ridiculous, and then then you get that guilt and 445 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,159 Speaker 1: you think, oh, that was really out of portion, Like 446 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: even the volume of my voice was out of proportion. 447 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:07,200 Speaker 1: So my poor husband will say, you know what, I'm 448 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 1: going to go for a coffee or I'm going to 449 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:10,800 Speaker 1: go and have a walk and just give. 450 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 2: You some time over all off. 451 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:15,000 Speaker 1: But it's horrible because you can't control. It's a bit 452 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:17,440 Speaker 1: like PMT in that way, and that you just it's 453 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: kind of like a it's a real out of body experience. 454 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 2: And to me it would be an effect of the 455 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:28,920 Speaker 2: night before where yes, you hadn't slept, had not slept, 456 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 2: you know, and you've got to function through the day, 457 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:32,920 Speaker 2: so you're just. 458 00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:36,960 Speaker 1: On edge and running on adrenaline most of the time 459 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 1: on adrenaline. 460 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you can't you just can't deal with anything. 461 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 1: Did you find being in the spotlight? Was that harder 462 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:45,439 Speaker 1: for you? Did that put more pressure on you? Do 463 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: you think? 464 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 2: Or No? I don't think so. I it was obviously 465 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:50,760 Speaker 2: at a time when you know, we're talking the last 466 00:22:50,760 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 2: five years, so not the busiest time of my life. 467 00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 2: But I still was working and I do recall, and 468 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:01,120 Speaker 2: I was always open with you know, Mars, my boys. 469 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 2: You know, I've just got sons, so I want them 470 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 2: to kind of understand things. They haven't got sisters to 471 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:08,239 Speaker 2: see things. And I remember, you know, a couple of 472 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 2: times at work where I was filming, like presenting roles 473 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 2: and being being filmed interviewing someone and saying, oh, sorry, sorry, sorry, 474 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:23,840 Speaker 2: We've got to stop, you know, and I go, I'm sorry, 475 00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 2: I'm just having a whole flush. I've got to step outside. 476 00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 2: And I remember the cameraman saying, oh, yeah, my wife's 477 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,960 Speaker 2: you know, and just so it was just like, I 478 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 2: can't do anything. I'm actually interviewing someone and I'm overwhelmed, 479 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 2: overwhelmed and dripping the back of my neck is you know, 480 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,439 Speaker 2: dripping wet. And I could try and fluff through it. 481 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 2: Can we just stop, because I'm just going to go 482 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:46,359 Speaker 2: out and fand myself and get a bit of you know, 483 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:48,159 Speaker 2: fresh air and talk about it. 484 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 1: And yeah, that's great, And it was fine. And it's 485 00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 1: great too that the Cabraman could support you. 486 00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 2: That's the thing. Yeah. 487 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:57,960 Speaker 1: I had image and crump On in a previous episode. 488 00:23:58,040 --> 00:23:59,879 Speaker 1: I'm not sure if you saw her piece on the APS. 489 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,679 Speaker 1: She's an editor at the University of Melbourne and she 490 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:07,119 Speaker 1: was doing an economics report on the ABC and just 491 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:11,080 Speaker 1: totally lost her place, as we all do at times, 492 00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:14,040 Speaker 1: and said, I'm sorry, but I'm having a really bad 493 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:18,399 Speaker 1: hot flush and this is on National Breakfast TV. And 494 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 1: I thought, you know what it's really I think it's 495 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 1: given me permission to be more open. I know it 496 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 1: seems like I'm opening doing a podcast on the topic, 497 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,680 Speaker 1: but never thought that I could be that open being 498 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:35,399 Speaker 1: in the media, and because I think there is a 499 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,080 Speaker 1: thing about you don't want to be seen as weak 500 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:42,959 Speaker 1: and incompetent in the workplace by being honest, but you 501 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 1: do need to lean into all the negatives and the 502 00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:48,800 Speaker 1: positives like not you know, I just think it's part. 503 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:51,639 Speaker 2: Of being human percent and it helps other people know 504 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,960 Speaker 2: that they're not yeah nuts, and it helps the other 505 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 2: people in the workplace realize that, you know, fifty percent 506 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,199 Speaker 2: of the population are going through this, so it's normal. 507 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,840 Speaker 2: You know, it's not something to be shamed into and 508 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 2: how normal to go sorry of Don'm just having a 509 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,400 Speaker 2: hot flush or you know, you get fold brain, folg, 510 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,600 Speaker 2: you go blank on things. Hence you know, I, you know, 511 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:18,119 Speaker 2: like to take notes on things because you can be foggy. 512 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:20,719 Speaker 1: Yeah all the time. Can we talk about your recent 513 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,639 Speaker 1: procedure there you had what led to that? 514 00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 2: So the recent procedure was a hysterectomy, a full hysterectomy, 515 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:32,639 Speaker 2: which means removal you know, of the ovaries, you know, 516 00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:37,240 Speaker 2: the uterex uterfus and the cervix. So when Mum, it'll 517 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:40,280 Speaker 2: be twenty years ago this year when Mum passed away 518 00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:44,160 Speaker 2: from a varian cancer. So I have been an ambassador 519 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 2: for avarian cancer for all this time, and my main 520 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:52,639 Speaker 2: reason for being ambassador is to present the signs and 521 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 2: symptoms of avarian cancer because it's still the silent killer. 522 00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:59,720 Speaker 2: There is no really detection test, you know, like you 523 00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:03,960 Speaker 2: can have for a mammogram and see a lump. So 524 00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:07,880 Speaker 2: ringing in my ears always is my mum at one 525 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:11,760 Speaker 2: of my boys christenings and just kind of standing you know, 526 00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 2: around next to me going, oh my god, look at me. 527 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:15,359 Speaker 2: I look like I'm five months pregnant. Look at me. 528 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:20,320 Speaker 2: And I remember thinking, because you know, I probably realistically 529 00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 2: a healthier person than mum. Mum you know, smoked a 530 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:24,639 Speaker 2: lot and drank a lot and I would love just 531 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 2: a pie or a cheese toasting. You know. I was 532 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:31,160 Speaker 2: way more organic than that, and so he and never exercised, 533 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 2: and I was so hearing her say that. I remember 534 00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:36,320 Speaker 2: in my head just thinking, Mommy's just not looking after yourself, 535 00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:37,560 Speaker 2: you know, because she said, yeah, look at me, I 536 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:39,280 Speaker 2: look like i'm and I'm thinking, yeah, that's because you 537 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,720 Speaker 2: don't need many clubs, too many cars, you know. Anyway, 538 00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 2: it turned out that it was, you know, overarian cancer. 539 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 2: So I just remember back then, for whatever reason, feeling 540 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:53,639 Speaker 2: for quite a while that mum had it. And it 541 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:55,919 Speaker 2: was so far out of the blue, you know, just 542 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,199 Speaker 2: all of a sudden. I had never lost anyone like that, 543 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 2: so was Nick. So it was only like sixty five, 544 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:07,200 Speaker 2: sixty six, not that old, no, And so I just thought, well, yeah, 545 00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:09,399 Speaker 2: I can get it too, because you know, so I 546 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 2: remember way back then going and seeing a guy on 547 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:14,200 Speaker 2: ecologist about having it or you know, let's just take 548 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:15,879 Speaker 2: it all out because then I can't get it. And 549 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 2: she's like, well, let's just wait awhile, like it's very early, 550 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,399 Speaker 2: you know, I went obviously when after I decided I 551 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,920 Speaker 2: wasn't having any more children. But you know, I can 552 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 2: throw you into early menopause and that can be quite 553 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 2: horrific and everything. So I just did you know, played 554 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,159 Speaker 2: the waiting game of twenty years of having you know, 555 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,119 Speaker 2: my ultra sounds and blood tests done every year to 556 00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:35,080 Speaker 2: hopefully detect anything. 557 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:36,919 Speaker 1: So do you carry a gene? Is there a gene that? 558 00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:40,919 Speaker 2: Well? I never see. I was always told test for 559 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 2: the bracker gene. Yeah, but I was also told that 560 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:46,320 Speaker 2: which stuck in my head and maybe it might have changed. 561 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:48,959 Speaker 2: But you needed some of your mum's DNA to tests, 562 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 2: so like when you had heard from a brush all this, 563 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:55,360 Speaker 2: which I didn't. So I never never went down that way. 564 00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,040 Speaker 2: And so for the for the some I'm getting a 565 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:02,760 Speaker 2: little bit of a flush now strip off. I forgot 566 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 2: to bring my fan no, so I so now I've. 567 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,120 Speaker 1: Lost my You was testing with the genes, so you 568 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:12,919 Speaker 1: were testing regularly genes. 569 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 2: But testing with it a larger sound and blood tests 570 00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 2: and never tested whether I had the gene or not. 571 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 2: And was kind of happy enough going along there. And 572 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:26,480 Speaker 2: then last December, just before December, I remember all of 573 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:30,040 Speaker 2: a sudden, I went to my doctor said, oh, I've 574 00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:31,959 Speaker 2: got because I knew the signs and symptoms you know, 575 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 2: and I'm having like, you know, I've got lower abdomen 576 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 2: pains kind of like period pains, you know, you know, 577 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 2: way past having a period, and so I just it's 578 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:45,040 Speaker 2: alarm bell to me, and also, you know, feeling a 579 00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 2: bit bloated. So she said, okay, well, let'sus go and 580 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:49,960 Speaker 2: do some tests other than you normal tests that you have. 581 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:56,400 Speaker 2: And then that came back with some polyps on the 582 00:28:56,400 --> 00:29:00,640 Speaker 2: ovaries and the thickening of the uterus and some fibroids. 583 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:02,960 Speaker 2: So to me, that's like, whoa, all that stuff's happened 584 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:07,080 Speaker 2: since my last test. Yeah right, So I went and 585 00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 2: had them tested. That all came back fine, But I 586 00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 2: said to my gynecologist, Okay, that's it for me. That's 587 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 2: my warning sign. So having having what I doing what 588 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 2: I did was not because I had cancer or you know, 589 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:25,680 Speaker 2: everything came back clear. It was purely my choice for prevention. Yep. 590 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 2: And yeah, I feel good about that. 591 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's good, and I'm glad that you had 592 00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 1: a specialist that supported what you wanted to do as well. 593 00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:38,240 Speaker 1: It's good to have a good relationship with your doctor 594 00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:40,560 Speaker 1: to touch in and not be scared to go, because God, 595 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 1: prevention is so much better than cure. 596 00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And I remember saying to her once we 597 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 2: did the test and it came back that everything was fine, 598 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,920 Speaker 2: you know, like the thickening of the uterus can happen. 599 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,920 Speaker 2: It was getting you know, fibroads are fine, and the 600 00:29:56,000 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 2: polyps were benign or whatever. I said, so what do 601 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:02,480 Speaker 2: you think, like, what are your thoughts? And she said, well, 602 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 2: if you you know, I didn't have any history or reason, 603 00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 2: I would say, look, if you know, it's up to 604 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 2: you if you want you But she said, having your 605 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,280 Speaker 2: history and having your reasons, I think you are fully 606 00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 2: going down the right position, you know, which is all 607 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 2: I needed to hear for her. Yep, you know. And 608 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:23,960 Speaker 2: then I kind of went I didn't look into it 609 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 2: too much, you know, I just kind of went, Okay, 610 00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:27,400 Speaker 2: I made up my mind. I made up my mind 611 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,720 Speaker 2: that's what I'm doing. And if there had been a 612 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 2: few problems, I would have gone to do it straight away. 613 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:33,960 Speaker 2: There wasn't, so I went, okay, I'll do it in 614 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:36,800 Speaker 2: winter because that's probably, you know, a better time, And 615 00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 2: I just didn't investigate too much more than that. It 616 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:40,880 Speaker 2: wasn't ntil I've had it done. I started googling everything, 617 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,280 Speaker 2: going right, Okay, so that's all gone, and that's all 618 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,040 Speaker 2: what is left. What happened in there? You know, well 619 00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 2: with it too, Like everyone said to me, oh my god, 620 00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:53,720 Speaker 2: it's a it's a really long recovery. Yes weeks and 621 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 2: I was kind of like, after, you know, a few days, 622 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:57,960 Speaker 2: I'm thinking I'll get through this, okay. You know, I 623 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 2: didn't quite understand how the severity, yeah, and how you 624 00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:06,000 Speaker 2: have to really just take the time and not do 625 00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 2: much at all, which is rather hard for me. 626 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm the same. I had a cesarean section when 627 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: I had Audrey and I was home and I'm not 628 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:17,000 Speaker 1: proud to say, but vacuuming like a couple of weeks 629 00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:20,240 Speaker 1: later and hanging washing out when I shouldn't, yes, I should, 630 00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:22,280 Speaker 1: like you know, yeah, but this is what we do. 631 00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:24,560 Speaker 1: We like we're our own worst had. 632 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:29,080 Speaker 2: I started baking bread and I posted something and my 633 00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 2: girlfriend who's had also had a hystoryctim me just I 634 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 2: hope Murray lifted that pot into it out of the oven, 635 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 2: because you know, you're not allowed to lift anything. 636 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:40,680 Speaker 1: We touched on golf before. I know you're an avid golf. 637 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 1: What is your handicap? 638 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,200 Speaker 2: I haven't played for six weeks, but I'm from memory 639 00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:45,960 Speaker 2: it was twenty five. 640 00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:47,840 Speaker 1: And do you play down the surf coast? 641 00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:48,080 Speaker 3: Yeah? 642 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. So one of my girlfriends that I play 643 00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 2: with message me is that when you're coming back. Yeah, 644 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:57,520 Speaker 2: it's really I got back into it during COVID. My 645 00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 2: husband's a great golfer. He really enjoys it. So it's 646 00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:03,160 Speaker 2: a great thing that you can do, you know, together 647 00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 2: and do it with your girlfriends, or you can do 648 00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 2: it with mixed couples. And it's yeah, great exercise obviously, 649 00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:12,680 Speaker 2: And I am a competitive person, so I like, you know, 650 00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,640 Speaker 2: whether you're competitive with yourself or competitive with other people. 651 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 2: You know, it's got that bit to it too. 652 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:21,560 Speaker 1: Did that help your mindset going through menopause doing all 653 00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:23,080 Speaker 1: those things that brought you joy? 654 00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:26,479 Speaker 2: Look for me, Actually it's a good good point. So 655 00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 2: dealing with the menopause symptoms which were horrific, knowing that 656 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:36,400 Speaker 2: I wasn't doing HRT, I did everything else that I 657 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:38,880 Speaker 2: could to keep myself fit and well and healthy. So 658 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:41,680 Speaker 2: you know, I'm not an angel. And you know, I 659 00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 2: like a pig out, I love chocolate, I you know, 660 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:47,960 Speaker 2: like to have a drink. But I also you know, 661 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,360 Speaker 2: I struggled the same with people with weight gain. And 662 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 2: I recall I recall before I ever was in that stage, 663 00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:57,280 Speaker 2: a bit like my mum saying look at me, I 664 00:32:57,280 --> 00:32:59,520 Speaker 2: look like I'm six months pregnant, and me just dissing 665 00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 2: it and going, oh, you know, you're just not fit. 666 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:04,479 Speaker 2: I would hear maybe when I was in my forties, 667 00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:06,320 Speaker 2: you know, women going oh my god, I've put all 668 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 2: this weight in menopause, and I used to just think, rubbish, 669 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:11,719 Speaker 2: It's all about input output, you just you know. And 670 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:14,040 Speaker 2: then all of a sudden, I was in menopause, it 671 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:18,480 Speaker 2: plunged sizing, and I'm like, how is this weight coming on? 672 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 3: Like? 673 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:22,840 Speaker 2: How can I not control it? So I thought, okay, 674 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:25,239 Speaker 2: that is obviously part of it in metabolism slows down 675 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:27,840 Speaker 2: or whatever. So I can either accept it or I 676 00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:30,240 Speaker 2: can try and just push that little bit harder, you know. 677 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:34,360 Speaker 2: So I yeah, I just kind of kept exercising and 678 00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:37,720 Speaker 2: trying to you know, eat well. And that's kind of 679 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:39,960 Speaker 2: helped me deal with it because I knew I was 680 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,320 Speaker 2: doing the best that I could, or ye wallow the 681 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,440 Speaker 2: other way and just so I feel like shit, So 682 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:46,840 Speaker 2: I'm going to eat shep, but I'm going to drink 683 00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,840 Speaker 2: to kind of come in and comfort myself, which we 684 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,360 Speaker 2: all did a lot of in Covid Banana bread. 685 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 1: Who cooked banana bread? Everyone cooked banana bread. With your diet, 686 00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:59,560 Speaker 1: what do you do specifically with your diet? Do you 687 00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,000 Speaker 1: like mostly organic or what do you find? 688 00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 2: I like healthy food, I don't go organic. I like 689 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,080 Speaker 2: fresh juices. I love fruit bowls and things like that. 690 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,279 Speaker 2: But with you know, Muz and still having a son 691 00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:13,520 Speaker 2: at home, we still cook pretty much. You kind of 692 00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:15,799 Speaker 2: you meat and three veggies, but we're both you know, 693 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 2: I've gotten back into enjoying a bit more cooking and 694 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:21,719 Speaker 2: sharing it, so Murray will do it. The thing that 695 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:25,680 Speaker 2: helped me manage the wait a little bit better, which 696 00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:28,160 Speaker 2: I only kind of got onto I don't know, maybe 697 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:32,480 Speaker 2: in the last twelve months, is the intermittent fasting. Do 698 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:37,640 Speaker 2: you say that word intermitting fasting? And that is quite 699 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 2: incredible in that, you know, people talk about that and 700 00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:42,319 Speaker 2: I just go, oh my god, you're starving yourself, and 701 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:45,640 Speaker 2: how ridiculous. You know the way that it really can 702 00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:48,920 Speaker 2: give you mental clarity, and they're giving yourself that break 703 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:52,160 Speaker 2: from food, and so that has helped me. That has 704 00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:52,600 Speaker 2: helped me. 705 00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:55,640 Speaker 1: Tell me about the drums. You've taken up drums. 706 00:34:55,960 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 2: I have, Oh, thanks for asking. So during COVID, where 707 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:02,920 Speaker 2: my middle son was also living at home and he's 708 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:06,520 Speaker 2: a musician. I'm not musical at all, and he is 709 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,919 Speaker 2: in a couple of bands, plays guitar, teaches guitar, and 710 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 2: had the drums there and so he played that. He'd 711 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 2: taught himself that, and so there are a few times 712 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,560 Speaker 2: during COVID where you know, he go because you had 713 00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,480 Speaker 2: nothing to do in the time, Like the boys taught 714 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:21,600 Speaker 2: me how to escape on COVID as well. But if 715 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 2: I come down, mum and I'll teach you a couple 716 00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:25,360 Speaker 2: of things and I'll play some chords on the guitar, 717 00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:26,759 Speaker 2: and you know. So we started doing that and I 718 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,359 Speaker 2: enjoyed it, and so then I thought, oh, I'm going 719 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:33,600 Speaker 2: to teach myself dreams by Fleetwood Mac Like of course 720 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:36,799 Speaker 2: I wouldn't. So I found an online teacher who was 721 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,000 Speaker 2: teaching that, and yeah, so you know, I would do 722 00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:41,840 Speaker 2: a little bit of that, and so I really enjoyed it. 723 00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:45,560 Speaker 2: But then you know, got past COVID, stopped doing that complately, 724 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:47,759 Speaker 2: never went back to it. The end of last year, 725 00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:49,640 Speaker 2: I was up in Melbourne. I was driving home you 726 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,160 Speaker 2: have you know, it's an hour and a half time 727 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 2: with my own thoughts, and I was thinking, I need 728 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,319 Speaker 2: a hobby, I need to do something. What can I do? 729 00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,320 Speaker 2: I think maybe Fleetwood Mack came on the radio. I 730 00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:00,600 Speaker 2: thought I can do. I think go back and do 731 00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,960 Speaker 2: the drum. And then my negative ego, just when are 732 00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:06,040 Speaker 2: you kidding? You're way too old to do that. No, 733 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,760 Speaker 2: on my positive side, when Nikki, you could be ninety 734 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 2: and do it if you want. Absolutely. My son had 735 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,160 Speaker 2: a friend who's an awesome drummer, and he gave me 736 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,200 Speaker 2: a few lessons, but then it was hard to lock in. 737 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:18,000 Speaker 2: I needed it to be all once a week, so 738 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,920 Speaker 2: I have a reason, you have a lesson, committed to it. Yeah, 739 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 2: And so he put me onto this other guy who 740 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:26,960 Speaker 2: is teaching me now, and I love the way he 741 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:30,080 Speaker 2: teaches and it's really really fun and I'm enjoying it. 742 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:31,840 Speaker 2: And it's hard, you know, Yeah. 743 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,480 Speaker 1: I bet you know you're right hand the coordination all 744 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:38,080 Speaker 1: of that and your stuff, and it's a workout. I suspect. 745 00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:42,480 Speaker 2: It can be. Yeah. So yeah, so I've just got 746 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:44,239 Speaker 2: all these things I'm learning. At one point I want 747 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:46,200 Speaker 2: to get a couple of you know, good songs and 748 00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 2: just be able to rock out to it. 749 00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:50,719 Speaker 1: Well, you're certainly a woman who goes by the beat 750 00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:54,000 Speaker 1: of your own drum. Certainly say that. Thank you, Nikki, 751 00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:54,760 Speaker 1: It's been a delight. 752 00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:55,719 Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on. 753 00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,560 Speaker 1: How awesome is Key Buckley? Down to earth warm and 754 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:05,920 Speaker 1: refreshingly natural. So honored to have had her in the 755 00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:08,680 Speaker 1: iHeart Studio. I hope you enjoyed it as much as 756 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,040 Speaker 1: I did. As I round out the first series of 757 00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:14,440 Speaker 1: Rage Against the Menopause, my next guest describes herself as 758 00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 1: an ossie author, travel writer, TV presenter, deranged mum of two, 759 00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:24,000 Speaker 1: and frazzled feminist. Don't miss the effervescent Kathy Lett, who 760 00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:29,000 Speaker 1: talks about her latest novel, husband Replacement Therapy, among other things. 761 00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 2: I'm Petrina Jones.