1 00:00:02,200 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Outspoken. It's your dose of the 2 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: hottest influenza and pop culture news twice a week. I'm 3 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:12,559 Speaker 1: Amy Torber and coming up on today's show, The Kate 4 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 1: Forster and Sarbi Store TikTok blood Bath, Michael Finch opens 5 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 1: up about hitting rock bottom, and Andre Ribello is found 6 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:24,439 Speaker 1: guilty of murdering his mother. But first, Tammy Hembro and 7 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: Matt Zakowski have surprised their followers by opting for a 8 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 1: winter honeymoon in Lapland. It looks so Christmasy and magical there. 9 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:34,160 Speaker 1: It is the perfect time of year to go to Lapland. 10 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: But I did think that they might go back to 11 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 1: the Maldives, Yeah, because that's where they got engaged. I 12 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 1: think everyone thought that they would opt for a hot honeymoon. 13 00:00:41,440 --> 00:00:43,479 Speaker 1: But it sort of makes sense because they're from the 14 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: Gold Coast. They travel whenever they want. You know, Tammy's 15 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:48,800 Speaker 1: got the money to do so, so they're probably thinking, 16 00:00:48,880 --> 00:00:51,639 Speaker 1: what's something a little bit different. I also think they 17 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:53,599 Speaker 1: wanted to make a bit of a statement with their 18 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 1: choice of honeymoon location. I mean, their whole wedding has 19 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 1: been a statement so far, and the fact that They're 20 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:02,120 Speaker 1: doing something so different is creating a lot of attention 21 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 1: and engagement. Surely there is some kind of sponsorship agreement 22 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: going on, even if it was just Lapland's Tourism Commission 23 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:12,400 Speaker 1: sponsoring this holiday. Because there have been so many epic 24 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 1: tiktoks that Tammy has shared, it's made me feel like 25 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:17,679 Speaker 1: I need to go to Lapland. Like the shots they 26 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 1: got of the northern lights at their resort. I also 27 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 1: want to know did they have someone following them around. 28 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:24,280 Speaker 2: Filming these videos. 29 00:01:24,319 --> 00:01:26,640 Speaker 1: It's funny you say that, because they actually ended up 30 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 1: getting locked out of their cabin because they wanted to 31 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 1: do a little photo shoot. So Tammy asked Matt to 32 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,320 Speaker 1: take some photos of her, and she reminded him to 33 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:36,959 Speaker 1: grab the key card, but he forgot and they ended 34 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: up being stranded for quite some time outside. 35 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:41,560 Speaker 2: They actually had to seek. 36 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: Refuge in this half built cabin because it was so cold. 37 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:47,119 Speaker 1: This happened to some friends of mine who were holidaying 38 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 1: in the snow. So they went out to have a 39 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:51,400 Speaker 1: spa and decided to skinny dip and they got locked 40 00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 1: out of their chalet. And it was only out of 41 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,920 Speaker 1: luck that the person who owned the Airbnb popped by 42 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 1: to see if they're okay. 43 00:01:57,080 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 2: They're like, we could have died. That is my worst man. 44 00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 1: Going back to whether this is a sponsored trip or 45 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:05,520 Speaker 1: there's elements that are gifted, I think it could be 46 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 1: because Tammy has posted the name of the accommodation a 47 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:11,639 Speaker 1: number of times, so they're staying at the Aurora Collection 48 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:15,079 Speaker 1: Laplan Resort, and the Daily Mail is reporting that the 49 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 1: accommodation is costing as much as one thy one hundred 50 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 1: per night, which I actually thought was low balling it 51 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 1: because I definitely think that they're spending a lot more. 52 00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,119 Speaker 1: I had a look on the accommodation's website and they 53 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 1: offer a four night package, so for four nights is 54 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,800 Speaker 1: two nine hundred and sixty five dollars per person, and 55 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: with that it includes a lot of the activities that 56 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:39,520 Speaker 1: they're doing. So the activities range from a husky safari, 57 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 1: a reindeer safari, and also Arctic ice karting. I've seen 58 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: them do a couple of those activities so far. What 59 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:48,040 Speaker 1: they seem to be spending most of their time doing 60 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 1: is watching Christmas movies, though which I can get around. 61 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: It looks so magical. It's quite romantic as well. A 62 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: lot of people were calling Tammy and Matt's wedding the 63 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 1: content wedding, and I needed a palate cleanser from them, 64 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:01,800 Speaker 1: and this honey moon has provided the goods. I'm really 65 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 1: enjoying seeing it, but it may get to a point 66 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:05,840 Speaker 1: where I'm sick of it. I think that happens with 67 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:06,919 Speaker 1: when anyone. 68 00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 2: Goes on holiday. 69 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: Though you enjoyed the first couple of bits of content 70 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:10,600 Speaker 1: and then you're like, can you just get back? It 71 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:13,360 Speaker 1: was getting mass views on TikTok, and it makes me 72 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 1: think that it was a strategy to choose somewhere that 73 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: was out of the norm. Like if they went to 74 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:19,080 Speaker 1: the Maule Dives again, everyone would. 75 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:19,840 Speaker 2: Be like yawn. 76 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:22,480 Speaker 1: But the fact that they've gone somewhere like Finland, which 77 00:03:22,480 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 1: you don't often hear about it looks so magical. But 78 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 1: surely they're not sitting around saying, oh my god, let's 79 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 1: pick our honeymoon location based. 80 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:32,639 Speaker 2: On what will shop TikTok. These people are content creators. 81 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 1: I feel like, yes, it's not their whole reason for 82 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:37,320 Speaker 1: doing so, but I think it would take up some 83 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 1: of their thinking. Matt literally referred to his wedding photography 84 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 1: and videography as content, Like, of course they're thinking what 85 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: is going to create the best content, and they have 86 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 1: hit the nail on the head with this one. I 87 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: actually think they're winning people over a little bit with 88 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: their very cutesy, romantic content because there's been a lot 89 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 1: more positive comments about Matt in particularly see. I actually 90 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 1: kind of found it funny because it looked like they 91 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:00,360 Speaker 1: were getting on each other's nerves because everyone says that 92 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 1: the honeymoon, Like, I'm actually not referencing my honeymoon here 93 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 1: because I did recently get back. But it's funny because 94 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: a lot of the time, honeymoons can be actually the 95 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 1: place where a lot of arguments happen, because you know, 96 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 1: all of the hype from the wedding has ended and 97 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: it's just the two of you now focusing on maybe 98 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 1: each other's little quirks. And there were instances where I 99 00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 1: was wondering, I wonder if they're getting on each other's 100 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:24,239 Speaker 1: nerves because Tammy didn't look too pleased about getting locked 101 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 1: out of the cabin due to me. People are just 102 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 1: surprised that the marriage has lasted to the honeymoon. 103 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:32,200 Speaker 3: Hi, Tim, and welcome to fag town. So what I'm 104 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 3: going to do here is put all the shit up 105 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:38,280 Speaker 3: that I can't put up on fucking TikTok because I 106 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 3: hope are annoying. 107 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: TikTok is divided after author Kate Forster pointed out that 108 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:48,120 Speaker 1: local clothing brand Sabi is following Donald Trump in what's 109 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 1: been described as an internet blood bath. The latest controversy 110 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 1: has sparked death threats, mass reportings, and cancelation. Now, so 111 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 1: before we get into the drama, can you get listeners 112 00:04:58,279 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 1: up to speed. 113 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 2: With who Kate Forster is. 114 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:03,720 Speaker 1: She is an author who has really exploded in popularity 115 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 1: on TikTok this year. In the space of a few months, 116 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 1: she gained ninety five thousand followers on TikTok. And what 117 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 1: really makes her stand out is that she's not afraid 118 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 1: to share her opinion, which I think all of us 119 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:18,919 Speaker 1: have found really refreshing this year because she's so funny. 120 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:22,279 Speaker 1: She doesn't take herself too seriously, and she doesn't play 121 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:24,920 Speaker 1: into a lot of the games that we see influencers 122 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,599 Speaker 1: or TikTokers playing into, like you know, those people who 123 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 1: just want to keep their little click happy and try 124 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 1: and say the right thing. I think That's why she 125 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: is so divisive and people are so threatened by her 126 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:39,160 Speaker 1: at the moment because she doesn't just fit into this 127 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: influencer click that we've come to know, and she doesn't 128 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 1: care who she upsets. Well, yeah, you don't know what's 129 00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 1: coming out of her mouth neck, but you know that 130 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 1: what she's saying she has conviction in and actually believes in. Now, 131 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:55,040 Speaker 1: she's also known for sharing fashion reviews and also encouraging 132 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 1: her audience not to be sheep and to support local businesses. 133 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,279 Speaker 1: So she's all about encouraging her followers to not just 134 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:04,520 Speaker 1: buy the brands that fashion influencers are promoting and getting 135 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 1: kickbacks from. Yeah, and she gained a massive amount of 136 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 1: traction back in August when she called out the viral 137 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:13,440 Speaker 1: Henny cardigan. So we covered that story in death. But 138 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 1: at the time, the fifty three year old simply question 139 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 1: why young people all want to look the same and 140 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:21,920 Speaker 1: are wearing this specific cult cardigan, which was created by 141 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: influencer Nadia Bartel's label Henny Now. This led to Kate 142 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:30,280 Speaker 1: receiving prank calls and even death threats. It also resulted 143 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 1: in her developing an even stronger follower base. I know 144 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: I followed her after this drama. Yeah, a lot of 145 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:39,479 Speaker 1: people did. Now let's get into this latest controversy. And 146 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: as we touched on, Kate often creates fashion reviews and 147 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 1: she received an influx of messages from followers asking her 148 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:49,720 Speaker 1: to look into a local brand called Sabi. And this 149 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:53,080 Speaker 1: brand is known for selling oversized T shirts with positive 150 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: affirmations across them, and it's owned by a husband and 151 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 1: wife team called Jace McDonald and Ashtadu who live in 152 00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:02,880 Speaker 1: Queen Now, some of Kate's followers had noticed that a 153 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 1: growing number of Mummy influencers had started wearing Sarb's shirts, 154 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:11,240 Speaker 1: and all of those influences held very far right views. 155 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 1: Now it is unclear if those influences were gifted the 156 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: shirts or if they were just organically wearing them, And 157 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: this led Kate to do some research into SARB and 158 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: she quickly discovered that one of the owners, Jace, was 159 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 1: following Donald Trump on his personal account. Now he was 160 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:33,160 Speaker 1: also following podcaster Joe Rogan, who heavily supported Trump's campaign. Now, 161 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 1: this led Kate to create a TikTok video connecting the dots, 162 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 1: saying it kind of seems like the brand's co owner 163 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: is a Trump supporter. She then referenced the problematic Mummy 164 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,160 Speaker 1: influencers who were wearing the brand and explained that a 165 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: lot of them share anti vax and also anti suncream views. Now, 166 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 1: she didn't blame Sarby for it, but she pointed out 167 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:57,360 Speaker 1: that if Sarb's views don't align with these influences very 168 00:07:57,440 --> 00:08:00,640 Speaker 1: far right views, then they should touch with them and 169 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 1: say don't wear ushirt. I don't know if you can 170 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:05,520 Speaker 1: tell someone not to wear your brand if they've purchased it. 171 00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 1: I mean you can obviously say, look, if we've gifted 172 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 1: you something and you're going to be spouting our offensive things, 173 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: we prefer you not to wear our clothes. I mean 174 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: that is very dependent on what the relationship is between 175 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 1: the brand and the influencer. And I think that's why 176 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 1: Kate has used this as an example, because she must 177 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 1: know that this brand has gifted these influences these T shirts, 178 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: and she's trying to point out that clearly they all 179 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 1: have the same views and all their views aligned, and 180 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:29,440 Speaker 1: that's why they're wearing. 181 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:29,680 Speaker 2: The T shirt. 182 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 1: Well, yeah, and that's the thing, because if these influencers 183 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:37,200 Speaker 1: have been organic customers and purchased them themselves. I don't 184 00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:39,560 Speaker 1: think that the brand necessarily has the right to tell 185 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:41,000 Speaker 1: people that you're not allowed to wear, and it would 186 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:42,840 Speaker 1: be very difficult for a brand to say, actually, don't 187 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 1: wear that, Like what control do they have over people 188 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:46,319 Speaker 1: wearing their items of clothing? 189 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 3: Now? 190 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 1: As always on TikTok, the response was very mixed to 191 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: Kate's video, so there were some followers who immediately started 192 00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:57,960 Speaker 1: accusing Ash and Jason being Trump supporters and threatening to 193 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:03,319 Speaker 1: boycott the brand. TikTok videos also started surfacing of Sarbi 194 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: customers clarifying that whilst they have worn the t shirts 195 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 1: in the past, they have left leaning views. They were 196 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:13,280 Speaker 1: quite funny on the flip side, Kate started receiving an 197 00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:16,400 Speaker 1: influx of hate from some Sabi supporters and. 198 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 2: Also death threats. 199 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:22,040 Speaker 1: I just think it's so wild that this woman has 200 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:26,080 Speaker 1: received so many death threats for simply pointing out who 201 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:28,400 Speaker 1: the brand is followed. But I think it's much greater 202 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,079 Speaker 1: than that in terms of it's not just about fashion. 203 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:34,760 Speaker 1: This is about politics and how fashion and politics intersect, 204 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: and that's. 205 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:36,240 Speaker 2: Why people are so upset. 206 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: It is being alleged that one of the Sabi owners 207 00:09:38,760 --> 00:09:42,280 Speaker 1: posted a TikTok in response to Kate's video threatening her. 208 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:45,560 Speaker 1: Now those claims have come from Internet sleuths who say 209 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: that the video was quickly taken down, So I want 210 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:50,720 Speaker 1: to reiterate that is just an allegation. There is no 211 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 1: proof of this video still being online. I had actually 212 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 1: never heard of the brand Sabi until this TikTok drama. 213 00:09:57,440 --> 00:09:59,440 Speaker 1: But all I could think of was the Sabi and 214 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 1: Soul who were caught up in that Moroccan pillow drama 215 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:03,719 Speaker 1: with Sarah's Dave Rember that a. 216 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:04,400 Speaker 2: Few years ago. 217 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 1: I was like, oh no, these poor bastards. Have they 218 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: been dragged into something again. But I can confirm this 219 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: is a completely separate business. This is the danger with 220 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 1: TikTok and how quickly things spread. And also when you 221 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 1: like I think I've heard of that brand, I actually 222 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: thought of Sabo skirt, which are not in any way 223 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 1: attached to this brand. 224 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:21,840 Speaker 2: Eiough Well. 225 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:25,440 Speaker 1: Sabi have addressed the controversy on their Instagram account, so 226 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: they wrote legends we just wanted to quickly address some 227 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: things that are currently going on. We really didn't want 228 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 1: to get involved and it goes against everything we stand 229 00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 1: for here at Sabi. We would never condone bullying people 230 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 1: or brands online. So this is the one and only 231 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 1: statement we will be making. Our entire brand is built 232 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 1: upon building people up and helping them feel happy and 233 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 1: confident while wearing our brand. These comments and the video 234 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 1: that have been shared by people online are not a 235 00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: true representation of myself and Jas. It's unfortunate that people 236 00:10:56,679 --> 00:10:59,600 Speaker 1: can take things out of context and spread rumors and 237 00:10:59,640 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 1: missing information about us online. Our little brand means the 238 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:05,640 Speaker 1: world to us and our customers mean the world to us, 239 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: and we know there are a lot of you all 240 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 1: standing up for us on these posts. 241 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:11,559 Speaker 2: We appreciate you, but. 242 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:14,320 Speaker 1: Ultimately all we want is for everyone to interact in 243 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: a positive way that doesn't tear others down. We just 244 00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:20,360 Speaker 1: hope everyone can choose their words wisely as words have 245 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:22,679 Speaker 1: power and our actions are online forever. 246 00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 2: Big love, Jace and Ash. 247 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:24,559 Speaker 3: Now. 248 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:27,160 Speaker 1: The reason why that statement has been included in full 249 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 1: is because the one thing that stood out to me 250 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:34,080 Speaker 1: is that nowhere did they say we do not politically 251 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 1: align with Donald Trump, and one follower called them out 252 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 1: on the obvious admission, saying, maybe you should make it 253 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:43,840 Speaker 1: clear if you actually support Trump and right wing views 254 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 1: or not now. Sabi responded, saying this, we didn't want 255 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:50,920 Speaker 1: to talk about our political views because we aren't political. 256 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:54,400 Speaker 1: Jace in no way supports his views and values. Back 257 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 1: when he first got into government, he was threatening to 258 00:11:56,840 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 1: put tariffs on clothing importations to protect the US ACA 259 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 1: Jays had a factory in China with huge US orders, 260 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,160 Speaker 1: as if we wouldn't want to know everything and anything 261 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 1: to do with it. Also, he is now sitting there 262 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 1: culling who he follows and who he doesn't years later. 263 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: It's absolutely insane that people jump to conclusions. Jace is 264 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,439 Speaker 1: pro you and whoever you want to be, and all 265 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 1: about leaving a positive impact on the world. To me, 266 00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:23,839 Speaker 1: I think that they originally didn't touch on who they 267 00:12:23,880 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 1: support because they didn't want to offend any customers who 268 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:30,560 Speaker 1: may support Donald Trump, because they would be ostracizing a 269 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:32,959 Speaker 1: collection of their customers. Well, it's a pretty common thing 270 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 1: not to get political when it comes to business, because 271 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: we've seen a lot of companies having to backflip, Like recently, 272 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: there was a chain of pubs that came out and 273 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,520 Speaker 1: said that they were would not be supporting Australia Day 274 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:46,280 Speaker 1: and not be having any celebrations in their pubs literally 275 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:48,440 Speaker 1: twenty four hours after they had to backflip because they 276 00:12:48,520 --> 00:12:51,960 Speaker 1: got so many complaints. So I understand why they didn't 277 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: initially put it in the statement. However, the way TikTok 278 00:12:55,520 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 1: works is that the audience were never going to be 279 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: happy with that statement. I actually disagree from a pr perspective. 280 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:04,920 Speaker 1: I think it was incredibly important for the owners of 281 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,760 Speaker 1: the brand to refute these claims and say, just because 282 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 1: Jason's following Donald Trump, it doesn't mean that he supports 283 00:13:11,200 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 1: Donald Trump's policies. Because Donald Trump is obviously known for 284 00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 1: not caring about women's rights, He's made homophobic, racist comments 285 00:13:18,880 --> 00:13:21,080 Speaker 1: if but no one's here saying that Donald Trump is 286 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 1: a good guy. Like It's obviously not a great brand 287 00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 1: move to align, particularly from a female brand, to align 288 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:29,360 Speaker 1: with Donald Trump. But the issue is that I think 289 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:31,439 Speaker 1: a lot of people on TikTok and in the world, 290 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,319 Speaker 1: and this is why everyone a lot of people were 291 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: shocked by the election result. Is they operate in silos 292 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: where people think, oh, Donald Trump is the devil. Of course, 293 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:41,960 Speaker 1: no one would ever want to support him, but I mean, 294 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 1: the guy got voted in. There are a lot of 295 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:46,439 Speaker 1: people that support him and the business wouldn't have wanted 296 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,559 Speaker 1: to come out and offend those people that did. Particularly, 297 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:52,319 Speaker 1: it seems like they do a line. But does it 298 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:55,720 Speaker 1: mean now that if you follow somebody on social media 299 00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:58,800 Speaker 1: that means you one hundred percent support them. Because Abby 300 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,199 Speaker 1: Chatfield has also weighed into this debate, and we will 301 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:03,400 Speaker 1: get into what she has said later, but I remember 302 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:05,080 Speaker 1: Abby had to come out and say, oh my god, 303 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 1: I follow all of these people who I don't actually 304 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 1: support their views, but I followed them because I want 305 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 1: to be up to date on what's happening in the world. 306 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: I mean, for example, a lot of journalists would be 307 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 1: following Donald Trump. It doesn't mean that they support him 308 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 1: and believe in his views. It's to keep track of 309 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:23,720 Speaker 1: what he's doing. Well, I went and looked at who 310 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 1: followed Donald Trump from Outspoken's name, and quite a number. 311 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 2: Of high profile people did. 312 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 1: Again, I think that that is something that they should 313 00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:32,920 Speaker 1: have touched on in the statement, because you know their 314 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: point of view. Saying, oh, Jase's following him because of 315 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:38,120 Speaker 1: the tariffs that he's putting on clothing. That seem like 316 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: a pretty fair enough statement. But that's something that should 317 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 1: have been mentioned in the initial statement, not as a 318 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 1: response to someone's question. They just thought, from a pr perspective, 319 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:49,160 Speaker 1: it's best not to actually touch on this controversial part. 320 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: I'm always really fascinated to hear what actually goes on 321 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: behind the scenes when someone finds themselves in the middle 322 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: of an Internet controversy like this. And Ash and Jace 323 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:00,560 Speaker 1: were interviewed by news dot com and they said that 324 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 1: they were shocked when they first learned of the backlash. 325 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: So they were sitting at their desk and they got 326 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:07,440 Speaker 1: a call from a Stockers who was like, people are 327 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 1: debating onliner. You guys right wing or left wing? And 328 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 1: the Stockers then said, apparently you guys followed Donald Trump. 329 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:16,960 Speaker 1: And they said they were so confused because Sabi itself 330 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:20,280 Speaker 1: doesn't follow Donald Trump, and Ash's account didn't follow Donald Trump. 331 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:23,000 Speaker 1: And then of course they worked out that Jase has 332 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: been following him and had been following him. 333 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 2: For over a decade. 334 00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 4: Now. 335 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 1: Ash got really overwhelmed because it got to the point 336 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:32,520 Speaker 1: where people were trawling through their personal Facebook accounts and 337 00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 1: looking for clues about their political alignment. And she said 338 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:38,840 Speaker 1: she felt sick all weekend and couldn't eat. Now, this 339 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,600 Speaker 1: just really demonstrates the toll that it took on her, 340 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:44,560 Speaker 1: and Jay said he found the backlash ridiculous and couldn't 341 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: believe there was discussion around who or who didn't buy 342 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:50,320 Speaker 1: and wear the t shirts. He said, it's hard you're 343 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 1: always offending somebody. Why do people need to know our 344 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:57,120 Speaker 1: political beliefs to buy our clothes? He continued, saying if 345 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,200 Speaker 1: he believed in Donald Trump, he'd come out and say 346 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 1: sober in gen he said, I don't care if you 347 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 1: do or not. Now, I do want to point out 348 00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 1: that the article did state that the couple do not 349 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 1: support Trump, but there wasn't a direct quote from Jay 350 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 1: saying it. And this controversy has gone viral on TikTok, 351 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: with creators weighing in on the drama and picking if 352 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 1: their team Kate or Team Sarby. It's even led to 353 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 1: high profile names in the media and influencer landscape also 354 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: weighing in. Yeah, so she's on the money. Podcast host 355 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: Victoria Devine shared her views on the controversy, and she 356 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 1: appeared to be shocked that some corners of the internet 357 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:34,040 Speaker 1: were siding with Kate Forster. 358 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 2: Here's what she said. 359 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 4: I'm so done with people coming in to defend someone 360 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 4: who has made their entire brand snarking other women, like 361 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 4: why are you coming in and being like, oh, well, 362 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:51,240 Speaker 4: she never said that exactly, or no, she never knew 363 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 4: who that person was to begin with, or she never 364 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 4: meant it that way. Didn't you watch her entire five 365 00:16:56,400 --> 00:17:00,480 Speaker 4: to ten minute rant, like I'm sorry. That content made 366 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:04,399 Speaker 4: with the intention of bringing other women down. It was 367 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 4: made with the intention of making them feel bad about 368 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 4: what they're wearing or what they're doing, or how that 369 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 4: they are doing it, and calling them sheep or calling them, 370 00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 4: you know, copy pastes of other. 371 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 2: People, like it's actually just ick. 372 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:20,720 Speaker 4: That content wasn't made with the intention of lifting women 373 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:23,399 Speaker 4: up and making them feel good about themselves or helping 374 00:17:23,440 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 4: them be in a better position. It was literally made 375 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 4: with the intention of making you snarky against other women. 376 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:32,879 Speaker 4: And now you're defending the person who said that. 377 00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: Victoria continued saying she's not naming names because she can't 378 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:39,439 Speaker 1: be bothered. But if followers were going to draw the 379 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:43,119 Speaker 1: inference about what she's talking about, then the shoe probably fits. 380 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:43,360 Speaker 5: Now. 381 00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:46,680 Speaker 1: This isn't the first time Victoria has commented on online 382 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 1: controversies surrounding Kate Forster. So during the viral Henny Cardigan's saga, 383 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 1: Victoria showed her support for a fashion TikToker who came 384 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,240 Speaker 1: up against Kate, writing under the post, it's not even 385 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: being passive aggressive, she's being a bully. I can't believe 386 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,360 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty four so many people are supportive of 387 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:06,760 Speaker 1: her content. I think there has been a bit of 388 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:09,320 Speaker 1: back and forth between the two and they both won't 389 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:12,919 Speaker 1: name one another when talking about one another. Victoria had 390 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:15,480 Speaker 1: a pretty mixed response in her comment section. There were 391 00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: some people who supported her sentiment, whilst others strongly disagreed. 392 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: So one user wrote, I don't agree with this. I 393 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:24,120 Speaker 1: don't think Kate was ever trying to tear women down 394 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: at all. She is a critical thinker on TikTok and 395 00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 1: I actually quite like her approach to talking about fashion. 396 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:32,200 Speaker 1: I watched her video. It wasn't that deep. She never 397 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:35,679 Speaker 1: tore down an individual person, just had an interesting perspective 398 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:37,880 Speaker 1: on a brand. I think the backlash of the comments 399 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 1: is what's gotten out of hand. Whilst another commented the 400 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:44,479 Speaker 1: irony of a woman ragging on another woman for ragging 401 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:47,960 Speaker 1: on another woman. Come on, ladies, see I thought that 402 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:50,399 Speaker 1: when I was watching it, because I find it a 403 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:54,320 Speaker 1: very lazy argument that whenever a woman critiques or analyzes 404 00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:57,760 Speaker 1: another woman's behavior, that people go, oh, shouldn't women be 405 00:18:57,800 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: supporting women? I mean, we cop it a lot, so 406 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: that's why I'm a little bit defensive about it. Just 407 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:04,320 Speaker 1: because you're a woman, it doesn't mean you have to 408 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: blindly agree with all women, because funnily enough, women all 409 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: share different opinions and points of view, and it's actually 410 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: unfeminist just to support someone because you're the same gender. Like, 411 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 1: I just find it such an interesting argument. I think 412 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:20,680 Speaker 1: people forget that feminism is about equality, so we can 413 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:23,320 Speaker 1: equally critique men and women if. 414 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:23,919 Speaker 2: We are a woman. 415 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:27,199 Speaker 1: Now. Abby Chatfield was also asked to weigh in on 416 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:30,720 Speaker 1: the drama, and she strongly threw her support behind Kate Forster, 417 00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:34,639 Speaker 1: calling her her very own Julian Assange. Let's listen to 418 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:35,920 Speaker 1: part of what she said. 419 00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 6: It's just interesting that Kate pointing out that someone follows 420 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:45,639 Speaker 6: a political leader is so scary to people because they 421 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:46,560 Speaker 6: know she's. 422 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 5: An awful person. 423 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 2: They know that it isn't the right thing to do. 424 00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:53,440 Speaker 6: So instead of being like, hmm, maybe me, a commenter 425 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:57,719 Speaker 6: should think about where my morals lie. They instead attack 426 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 6: Kate and get mad at her. Main thing is that 427 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:02,919 Speaker 6: no one should be sending Kate force to death threats 428 00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:06,439 Speaker 6: or threats of violence because she pointed out something that 429 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 6: was a fact. She didn't lie, she didn't make anything up. 430 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,920 Speaker 6: She just noticed something and she pointed it out. It's 431 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:15,400 Speaker 6: not really fair to shoot the messenger. And if you're 432 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:18,679 Speaker 6: commenting anything abusive to Kate or making videos saying that she's. 433 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:21,119 Speaker 5: A bully, I really want you to check your internalized misogyny. 434 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:27,639 Speaker 6: I really want you to maybe look into what activism 435 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:30,880 Speaker 6: is a little bit, and I want you to reevaluate 436 00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 6: your own. 437 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,639 Speaker 5: Moral coumbas seems extreme, but I want you to reevaluate 438 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 5: your own value system and why you're so angry that 439 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:43,120 Speaker 5: someone pointed out the truth like it's giving persecuting Juliane Massange. 440 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 6: Kate is mine, Julie Massage, you know what I mean. 441 00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 6: She's a wiki leaks right now, not her fault that 442 00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 6: they did it. 443 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:54,080 Speaker 1: I find it very interesting the vitriol that is thrown 444 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:57,639 Speaker 1: at people like Abby Chatfield and Kate Forster, because I 445 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:00,639 Speaker 1: think a lot of people don't know what to do 446 00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: with them because they don't want to align with a 447 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 1: group of influencers or a group of media personalities. They 448 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:11,040 Speaker 1: don't care who they piss off, and that is very 449 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: threatening to a group of people who don't want to 450 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:17,400 Speaker 1: be called out. And there is a click of influencers 451 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,639 Speaker 1: that We've spoken about this a lot, you know, Clementine 452 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 1: Ford has spoken about the cool group, whatever you want 453 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,760 Speaker 1: to call this group of people. It gets bigger and 454 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:28,600 Speaker 1: bigger to the point where if anyone ever says anything 455 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:32,040 Speaker 1: against these people, they've got a bunch of other high 456 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 1: profile people to back them up. 457 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:35,919 Speaker 2: And that's not what we want either. 458 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:38,719 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting because even when you look at the 459 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,240 Speaker 1: fact that Kate Forster called out a lot of influencers 460 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:45,960 Speaker 1: for all wearing the Henny cardigan, it seemed like it really. 461 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:46,760 Speaker 2: Hurt their feelings. 462 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:48,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, there was a lot of offense, like oh my god, 463 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:51,440 Speaker 1: when in actual fact, what they probably didn't like Kate 464 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:55,159 Speaker 1: pointing out is that they all get kickbacks for promoting 465 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 1: that cardigan constantly through their affiliate leaks. And what I 466 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,400 Speaker 1: find funny is people will call Abby or Kate bullies, 467 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:05,720 Speaker 1: but to me, a bullying behavior is when you gang 468 00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 1: up on someone and leave people out, and that's what's 469 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:11,719 Speaker 1: been happening online. And there was no bullying or snark 470 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,920 Speaker 1: in Kate's post about Sarbi anyway. I hate the way 471 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:17,360 Speaker 1: that the word bullying is being thrown around because all 472 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,879 Speaker 1: she did was review a local brand that she was 473 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: asked to review, and in this instance, I think her 474 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: intention was to help her audience make informed choices about 475 00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: who they want to support with their funds. And let's 476 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,879 Speaker 1: be honest, it wasn't just the fact that this owner 477 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 1: was following Donald Trump. She was connecting the dots of 478 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 1: quite controversial right wing influences suddenly popping up wearing these 479 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,199 Speaker 1: positive affirmation tis who most probably were gifted those T 480 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: shirts from the brand. Now Abby then offered up some 481 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 1: free pr advice, saying, if Sarbi don't actually support Donald Trump, 482 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: then create a TikTok clarifying it. 483 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 2: Here's what she said. 484 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:59,160 Speaker 6: Who knows if them following Donald Trump means they support him, 485 00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:00,920 Speaker 6: It could just mean it follow him because they think 486 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 6: he's so horrific. 487 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:04,359 Speaker 2: If that is the case, they could do a video. 488 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:07,160 Speaker 6: If you're watching this, if you don't actually support him, 489 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 6: I reckon do a video and just be like guys, 490 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,840 Speaker 6: we follow him because he's so cozy, like just I. 491 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:13,360 Speaker 5: Think that could be cleared up very easily. 492 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:16,040 Speaker 6: So there is a chance that them following Donald Trump 493 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 6: isn't them supporting him. 494 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:22,720 Speaker 1: I think she's right because they've sort of been tiptoeing 495 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:25,159 Speaker 1: around who they support and who they don't support. Have 496 00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:27,199 Speaker 1: seem like they don't want to offend anyone, but at 497 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,560 Speaker 1: the same time, being neutral is offending both parties almost, 498 00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 1: like I think it looks like they have something to 499 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:35,440 Speaker 1: hide when maybe they don't. That's why it's really dangerous 500 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:38,200 Speaker 1: for brands to be on TikTok if they haven't fully 501 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,040 Speaker 1: formulated what they stand for as a brand, if they 502 00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:43,439 Speaker 1: don't know their core values inside out, if they're not 503 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,120 Speaker 1: picking the right influences, because if you're marketing your product 504 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:50,400 Speaker 1: at young women, then you have to be very careful 505 00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:53,119 Speaker 1: because they are expecting more and more from brands. Well, 506 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:55,920 Speaker 1: it's because people find it hypocritical to have these positive 507 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:59,240 Speaker 1: affirmations splashed across a T shirt but then be potentially 508 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:02,639 Speaker 1: supporting some who was so negative. It's crazy as well 509 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,199 Speaker 1: that this isn't even a US company, like this is 510 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:08,639 Speaker 1: happening in Australia. It shows you how strongly people feel 511 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,680 Speaker 1: about Donald Trump and it just actually has been elected. 512 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,359 Speaker 1: But also it is a statement the influencers you choose. Now, 513 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:17,040 Speaker 1: they haven't come out and said whether they hand selected 514 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:19,840 Speaker 1: these influences or if they organically wore the T shirts, 515 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 1: but if it is the case and they have selected them, 516 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: that sends a statement of what your core values are. 517 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 2: It's more complicated these days to have a business now. 518 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: Following this shit storm, Kate Forster lost every single video 519 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 1: on her TikTok account, so her page was mass reported 520 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,400 Speaker 1: in what really seemed like an attempt to silence her. Yeah, 521 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 1: she told her followers that she spoke to the team 522 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,520 Speaker 1: at TikTok in length and they informed her that it 523 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: was mass fake reporting which lost all of her video 524 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:51,480 Speaker 1: So apparently that triggers every single video to be removed. 525 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,280 Speaker 1: It's not like a bot. Then someone's paid for a 526 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:57,160 Speaker 1: bot to report her page. Sounds like it. I really 527 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:00,120 Speaker 1: feel for her because she has spent months and months 528 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: creating this content, and she's had so many clever videos 529 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: which are either comedic or There's been a lot of 530 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:09,399 Speaker 1: time invested in these reviews, and she's really built a 531 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,320 Speaker 1: community by people sending those videos on so many people 532 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,520 Speaker 1: are asking her, can you please recreate some of the videos, 533 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,199 Speaker 1: but she said there's all this weird copywriting around it, 534 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:20,320 Speaker 1: so if she uploads a video that was similar, it 535 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: gets removed. Now she ended up switching her account to 536 00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 1: private to stop people from reporting her, and it's unclear 537 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,240 Speaker 1: what she's going to do moving forward because this seems 538 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:32,280 Speaker 1: to be a real issue for her. People want to 539 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 1: silence her, and people seems like they don't want women, 540 00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 1: particularly older women with a strong opinion. It's actually really 541 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 1: disturbing that there's been this orchestrated effort to silence her, 542 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:43,639 Speaker 1: and now this is going to be an example of 543 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:45,879 Speaker 1: what you can do if you don't agree with someone's opinion. 544 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:47,680 Speaker 1: I mean, people are having a problem with her pointing 545 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,359 Speaker 1: out that this brand follows Trump. Isn't the behavior that 546 00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: you've just exhibited very trumpest. 547 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 3: From appearing to live a glamorous life to the inside 548 00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,760 Speaker 3: of a jail cell Andre Rabella is now facing a 549 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:01,240 Speaker 3: life life prison term. 550 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 1: Yeer Andre Rebello has been found guilty of murdering his mother. 551 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,240 Speaker 1: A jury took two days to deliberate after the eight 552 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 1: week trial. Prosecutors say Rebello killed his mother for money 553 00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 1: after taking out three life insurance policies in her name 554 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:21,240 Speaker 1: just days earlier. He'll be sentenced in April next year 555 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:24,439 Speaker 1: and is expected to get life in prison. Was anyone 556 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,560 Speaker 1: else pretty surprised to hear the news? Like from the onset, 557 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 1: I thought he probably was guilty, but to actually have 558 00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:35,639 Speaker 1: confirmation that this man murdered his mother, it just rocked 559 00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: me to my call that anyone. 560 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:37,359 Speaker 2: Could do that. 561 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:40,280 Speaker 1: I wasn't shocked, but I think it really did hit 562 00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,000 Speaker 1: a nerve to know that this is actually what has happened, 563 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 1: to know for a fact this is what happened, and 564 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,480 Speaker 1: more gruesome details have come out about the day. So 565 00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,200 Speaker 1: it started off as a very normal day for Colleen Rebello. 566 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,479 Speaker 1: So she had dropped her son off at work at 567 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 1: ten am and she came home and was visited by 568 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 1: andre So he originally denied his mum on the day 569 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,040 Speaker 1: of her death. However, in court he revealed he did 570 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,600 Speaker 1: in fact visit her, but he said he just chatted 571 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 1: about Gracie and their son over a coffee. Now prosecutors 572 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,960 Speaker 1: say that Andrea murdered his mother during this visit. Now, 573 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 1: Colleen's cause of death was actually ruled inconclusive by the coroner, 574 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,560 Speaker 1: but it's alleged that Andre suffocated her with a pillow. 575 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,080 Speaker 1: It's then believed he removed his mother's clothes and placed 576 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 1: her body in the shower to make it look like 577 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,159 Speaker 1: she'd had a medical episode and died of natural causes. 578 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,119 Speaker 1: And the saddest part is that at the time of 579 00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,920 Speaker 1: her death she was happy and healthy. There was no 580 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:38,320 Speaker 1: animosity between her and her son. Can you imagine how 581 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,479 Speaker 1: horrifying her final moments would have been for her and 582 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:45,200 Speaker 1: how scarring this also was for Andre's brother, Fabian, because 583 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,040 Speaker 1: his mum was meant to go and pick him up 584 00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 1: from work at two pm, and when she didn't arrive, 585 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 1: Fabian then returned home to discover her dead in the shower, 586 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,200 Speaker 1: so he called paramedics before calling his three siblings, and 587 00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:01,399 Speaker 1: Andre was the last sibling to be called. Now, he 588 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:04,240 Speaker 1: ended up joining his siblings at their mother's home as 589 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,040 Speaker 1: police arrived, and at no point did Andre mention that 590 00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:09,520 Speaker 1: he had seen his mum alive and well that day. 591 00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:12,639 Speaker 1: What really shocked me is that police set up surveillance 592 00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 1: on Andre, so they planted a listening device in the 593 00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: bedroom that he shared with Grace Episcopo and also a 594 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:22,640 Speaker 1: camera with audio in their loundroom, so they were listening 595 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,480 Speaker 1: into conversations for over three months. 596 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:25,920 Speaker 4: Now. 597 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,879 Speaker 1: Apparently these recordings made it very clear that Gracie was 598 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,760 Speaker 1: unaware that Andre had murdered Colleen, so that's why she 599 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 1: was ruled out of this investigation. Now, I do want 600 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,120 Speaker 1: to talk about the reporting because, as we have previously discussed, 601 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,479 Speaker 1: Gracie has been front and center despite having nothing to 602 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:44,240 Speaker 1: do with the murder. And of course a murder trial 603 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 1: of this nature, when a son kills their mother, it's 604 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,160 Speaker 1: going to have a bit of interest, but the interest 605 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 1: was next level due to Gracie's profile. And it also 606 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:54,320 Speaker 1: has a lot to do with the motive that the 607 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:58,280 Speaker 1: prosecutors were pushing, because during the trial, the prosecutors alleged 608 00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: that the reason Andre killed his mond was to get 609 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,160 Speaker 1: money to fund the couple's lavish lifestyle, and this was 610 00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 1: an angle very much focused on by the media. Well, 611 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 1: I'm not surprised because I watched quite a number of 612 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: TV reports about this, and they had the perfect overlay 613 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:14,640 Speaker 1: for all of those claims. So they used a lot 614 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 1: of vision from YouTube of Andre and Gracie on these 615 00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 1: extravagant holidays in the mal dives that showed him living 616 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:25,080 Speaker 1: the life, but it perfectly pictured his fall from Grace 617 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: as well. 618 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:25,760 Speaker 5: Well. 619 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 2: Also the fact that he was. 620 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:32,360 Speaker 1: A reported cryptocurrency trader, like it just fit into that 621 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 1: profile and that story. The reality of the situation is, yes, 622 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:37,920 Speaker 1: he was doing crypto on the side, but it was 623 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:41,240 Speaker 1: making him no money. He previously was actually a delivery 624 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 1: driver for Coals and he was studying, and in his 625 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:46,360 Speaker 1: final year of study he gave it up to be 626 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,440 Speaker 1: Gracie's assistant and also to be the primary caregiver of 627 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:53,080 Speaker 1: their son. So Gracie was the breadwinner in this relationship. 628 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:54,640 Speaker 1: And I think I shocked a lot of people because 629 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,960 Speaker 1: his background, you know, working for Coals and studying wasn't 630 00:29:57,960 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 1: really publicized. 631 00:29:58,920 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 2: It was almost like, oh. 632 00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:04,360 Speaker 1: He's this cryptocurrency bro who's very successful. And in the trial, 633 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 1: the prosecutors tried to play up that there was this 634 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:10,480 Speaker 1: power in balance in Andrea and Gracie's relationship. So it 635 00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:14,720 Speaker 1: was reported that Gracie was making six figures by twenty twenty, 636 00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:17,440 Speaker 1: but the court was told the couple were spending more 637 00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 1: than they were actually making. Yeah, And it was at 638 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: this point that Gracie's influencing career was taking off. She 639 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 1: had a million followers on Instagram and was making good money. However, 640 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,880 Speaker 1: she had to support Andre and their son, And if 641 00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: you cast your mind back to twenty twenty, everyone was struggling. 642 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:34,760 Speaker 1: Brands were cutting marketing budgets. 643 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 2: Everyone was losing their jobs. 644 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:38,360 Speaker 1: And it was at this point that Grace and Andre 645 00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 1: they were renting a house for eight eighty a week. 646 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:43,800 Speaker 1: This was this was before COVID, so that was very 647 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:46,760 Speaker 1: expensive at the time, and they all still expensive and 648 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,360 Speaker 1: they also had a big car loan for a Range Rover. 649 00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:52,920 Speaker 1: And it's interesting because when you are an influencer with 650 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: a million followers on Instagram, it does come with a 651 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 1: certain expectation and an image to uphold. And Gracie is 652 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:02,840 Speaker 1: a lifestyle influencer and her content is about promoting an 653 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,760 Speaker 1: enviable lifestyle with a nice home, clothes. 654 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:06,080 Speaker 2: And holidays. 655 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 1: So she did have this image to uphold, and it's 656 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:12,560 Speaker 1: believed that Andre was feeling a lot of pressure about that. 657 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,520 Speaker 1: What does make me feel uncomfortable about some of this coverage, though, 658 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:20,240 Speaker 1: is the implication that Gracie was pushing this lifestyle or 659 00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 1: that she had anything to do with this murder because it's. 660 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 2: So far from the truth. 661 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:27,640 Speaker 1: Katie obviously got involved in his own lives, like if 662 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 1: he was making up lives that he's made all of 663 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: this money off crypto. There are a lot of skeletons 664 00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:35,680 Speaker 1: obviously in his closet. And I think it's really unfair 665 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,200 Speaker 1: that Gracie isn't being portrayed as a victim in this case. 666 00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,800 Speaker 1: She's a young mum who now her partner of eight 667 00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:44,720 Speaker 1: years has been found guilty of the worst possible crime, 668 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 1: but her baby daddy as well, and instead of feeling 669 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:48,920 Speaker 1: sorry for her, I feel like the media are trying 670 00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:50,520 Speaker 1: to portray her as being part of the problem. 671 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:50,719 Speaker 4: Yea. 672 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,240 Speaker 1: And I think that really speaks a lot to how 673 00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 1: society views influences at the moment. We want to believe 674 00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:58,640 Speaker 1: the worst in people. 675 00:31:58,360 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 2: And so women as well. 676 00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:02,240 Speaker 1: And if you think about how the media has covered 677 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,160 Speaker 1: this story, you know they've used a lot of photos 678 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:07,760 Speaker 1: of Gracie and it's because the media rely on clicks 679 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,600 Speaker 1: and engagement and they know that using an image of 680 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,120 Speaker 1: this beautiful girl with this guy and saying he murdered 681 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:16,240 Speaker 1: his mum to fund this lifestyle, people are gonna hate 682 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:19,160 Speaker 1: on her. People are going to write disgusting things when 683 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:21,200 Speaker 1: it didn't even have anything to. 684 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 2: Do with her. 685 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: Look On a different level, I do understand why the 686 00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:27,120 Speaker 1: media is reporting it in this way from working there 687 00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:29,880 Speaker 1: for many years. It's the perfect story for them. It's 688 00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,080 Speaker 1: got all of the right ingredients to sell papers. Not 689 00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:34,000 Speaker 1: saying it's the right thing to do, but I totally 690 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:37,640 Speaker 1: understand it. Before we get into the next topic, we 691 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:39,800 Speaker 1: want to issue a trigger warning as we do touch 692 00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:44,560 Speaker 1: on issues surrounding alcohol and drug use, as well as suicide. 693 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: Freshman taking out food Creator of the Year at the 694 00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:50,720 Speaker 1: TikTok Awards, Michael Finch has opened up about hitting rock 695 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 1: bottom and losing his passion for makeup. In the raw 696 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,720 Speaker 1: interview on his best friend Amy Jane Brand's podcast Emotional Content, 697 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:01,560 Speaker 1: Michael spoke about suffering from drug and alcohol addiction. I 698 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,360 Speaker 1: found this interview fascinating because a lot of our listeners 699 00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:06,720 Speaker 1: will know that we did a deep dive into Michael's 700 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 1: career and also his social media transformation last year, and 701 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 1: this filled a lot of blanks for us about what 702 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 1: was going on in the background. 703 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:14,760 Speaker 2: He might have to redo that. 704 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, and this was Michael's first ever podcast interview and 705 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,160 Speaker 1: a bit sad that it didn't take place on our podcast, 706 00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 1: But I think the fact that he did it with 707 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:24,719 Speaker 1: his best friend it really helped him feel comfortable and 708 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:27,920 Speaker 1: also safe to open up, and he really. 709 00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:28,360 Speaker 2: Did bear all. 710 00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:32,200 Speaker 1: In this interview, he spoke about gradually losing his passion 711 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,960 Speaker 1: for makeup. He said he became hyper aware of the 712 00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:38,640 Speaker 1: ingredients going into some makeup brands and no longer felt 713 00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 1: comfortable putting on his skin every day. When I first 714 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,320 Speaker 1: heard this, my first thought was, I wonder how all 715 00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,000 Speaker 1: of those makeup brands feel that have worked with him 716 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:49,680 Speaker 1: over the years. It's interesting because a part of his 717 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,360 Speaker 1: job was to influence people to buy that makeup, and 718 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:54,640 Speaker 1: if he's worried about what's in it and he's telling 719 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:57,080 Speaker 1: people to buy it as well, I mean ethically, he 720 00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:58,480 Speaker 1: might have a bit of a hang up about it. 721 00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:00,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, that kind of makes more sense why. 722 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 1: He's deleted a lot of his old videos over the years, 723 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,000 Speaker 1: because he's really wiped his YouTube channel, and maybe it's 724 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,759 Speaker 1: because he doesn't want to encourage something that he no 725 00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:12,719 Speaker 1: longer supports. Wow in influencer actually taking accountability for the 726 00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:15,000 Speaker 1: past mistakes that they've made, you know. I mean he's 727 00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 1: deemed the mistakes and clearing it off the internet and 728 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:18,759 Speaker 1: not making ad revenue off it. 729 00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 2: Wow, that is an absolute shot. Yeah, it's fair on him. 730 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:22,239 Speaker 2: It's very refreshing. 731 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,240 Speaker 1: Now, as he started falling out of love with makeup, 732 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:28,880 Speaker 1: Michael said he stopped creating content altogether. Now, this was 733 00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:31,960 Speaker 1: around twenty nineteen, and he said he quickly ran out 734 00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:34,960 Speaker 1: of money and found himself in debt. So he started 735 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,240 Speaker 1: working at a friend's nursery. Now, he ended up working 736 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:41,440 Speaker 1: there for over six months, and then COVID hit. I 737 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:45,200 Speaker 1: specifically remember this period of time and I was thinking, God, 738 00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,840 Speaker 1: I hope he's okay. Yeah, let's listen to what he 739 00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:48,800 Speaker 1: said about that time. 740 00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:52,719 Speaker 7: COVID happened after that, and then I didn't want to 741 00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:54,839 Speaker 7: put that shit on my skin anymore. Like, you know, 742 00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:56,759 Speaker 7: a lot of people had like where they call it 743 00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:00,040 Speaker 7: like an awakening before like COVID happened or whatever. I 744 00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 7: guess I kind of had that and just like looked 745 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:03,760 Speaker 7: into a lot of the shit that was in makeup 746 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:05,359 Speaker 7: and just was just like, I don't want to put 747 00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:07,520 Speaker 7: this shit on my skin anymore. I learnt a lot. 748 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:12,160 Speaker 1: Michael also said he became totally disillusioned by the industry, 749 00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 1: and he was rapidly losing followers and relevance from not 750 00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:17,759 Speaker 1: posting content, and he knew that the only way to 751 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:21,000 Speaker 1: get attention was to insert himself into some type of drama. 752 00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 2: But this wasn't for him. 753 00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 1: He said, he found it gross and took a further 754 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: six month hiatus to try and find himself. Yeah, and 755 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: he said during that time he went completely off the 756 00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 1: rails and became heavily addicted to drugs and alcohol. 757 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:35,600 Speaker 2: Here's a bit of what he said. 758 00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:38,440 Speaker 7: There was a point where I really hit rock bottom 759 00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:40,160 Speaker 7: where I was just like a four blown alcoholic and 760 00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:42,000 Speaker 7: I was so addicted to that. I don't know if 761 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 7: anyone knows, but there was like this thing that you 762 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:45,239 Speaker 7: used to be. I'm pretty sure. I don't know if 763 00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:46,440 Speaker 7: you can still get it, but I used to get 764 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:48,960 Speaker 7: this weed oil, but it was like fake weed oil, 765 00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 7: and it was like one hundred anesthetic, yes, synthetic. It 766 00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:52,640 Speaker 7: was like one hundred and ten dollars for like a 767 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,960 Speaker 7: little bottle of oil. And used to put it through 768 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:56,480 Speaker 7: a veight that used to get up to two hundred 769 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:59,239 Speaker 7: degrees celsius. And I used to just rip that all day, 770 00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:02,000 Speaker 7: every single day. My rock bottom was that smoking that 771 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:05,760 Speaker 7: getting addicted to bricks. You know, bricks are fucking those bricks. 772 00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:07,799 Speaker 7: I don't know what the real name is, but I don't. 773 00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:10,400 Speaker 7: But wait, but like the pharmaceuticals, like the bricks and 774 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 7: the xanax. Yeah, I don't know bricks. I don't know 775 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 7: if bricks and zannies the same thing. I'm pretty sure 776 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:18,680 Speaker 7: it is. Yeah, I got so addicted to them. 777 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,840 Speaker 1: This actually really shocked me because I know he's tiptoed 778 00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:25,600 Speaker 1: around having some sort of issues with alcohol and maybe 779 00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:28,680 Speaker 1: dabbled in drugs, but the extent of what he was 780 00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:31,760 Speaker 1: going through, I had no idea. And he did reference 781 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 1: one occasion where he thought he might not wake up 782 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:36,480 Speaker 1: from his drug binge. And this was very upsetting for 783 00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:39,160 Speaker 1: the host, Amy jayden Brand, because she said that she 784 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:41,600 Speaker 1: and Michael had lost contact at that time. They had 785 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:44,160 Speaker 1: a bit of a falling out, and it was really 786 00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:46,600 Speaker 1: upsetting to hear that things had gotten so bad for 787 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:49,759 Speaker 1: Michael like that. It's really sad and it just demonstrates 788 00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:53,720 Speaker 1: the lack of support influencers have because like child stars 789 00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:55,520 Speaker 1: Michael Finch, Shiny Grimman. 790 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:58,279 Speaker 2: They're the first lot of child. 791 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:02,279 Speaker 1: Teenage influencers who have had this level of fame and 792 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:05,040 Speaker 1: money given to them at this young age, and it's 793 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:07,200 Speaker 1: clear that it's been very hard for Michael to navigate 794 00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:09,480 Speaker 1: that well. In this interview, he went into a lot 795 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:13,280 Speaker 1: of detail how he actually developed anxiety from being followed 796 00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:15,840 Speaker 1: around by fans. He said he didn't have a problem 797 00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,760 Speaker 1: with people asking for photos, but what became a problem 798 00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:22,000 Speaker 1: was that feeling of being followed. And this happened a 799 00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 1: lot to them at nightclubs as well, because at the time, 800 00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:28,359 Speaker 1: Michael said that he was secretly smoking. So he said 801 00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: that Shanny, his best friend at the time, didn't even 802 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:32,799 Speaker 1: know that he was smoking, but he would try and 803 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:35,280 Speaker 1: have a sneaky cigarette when he was out and about, 804 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:38,080 Speaker 1: and he mentioned that someone tried to snap a photo 805 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:40,840 Speaker 1: of him smoking and his manager at the time. I 806 00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: don't know if this was me a pleasure, but they 807 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:46,839 Speaker 1: apparently grabbed the fans phone and threw it across the room. 808 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,400 Speaker 1: It sounds like maybe something me a plasic would allegedly do. 809 00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:52,680 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if that would be worse 810 00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,080 Speaker 1: pr someone a manager smashing someone's phone or a photo 811 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:58,080 Speaker 1: of him smoking. I don't know. I think that just 812 00:37:58,080 --> 00:37:59,880 Speaker 1: demonstrates to people who didn't grow up in the ear 813 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:01,920 Speaker 1: of Michael Finch just how big he. 814 00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:02,520 Speaker 2: Was at the time. 815 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,240 Speaker 1: Now, going back to this really difficult time that Michael 816 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:07,760 Speaker 1: found himself in, he said that things were so dire 817 00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:09,520 Speaker 1: that he thought he was going to have to move 818 00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:12,279 Speaker 1: back to his hometown with his parents. He said he 819 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 1: had a lot of support, though his parents ended up 820 00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:17,440 Speaker 1: loaning him fifty thousand dollars to get back on his feet. 821 00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,520 Speaker 1: He also said some of his influencer friends loaned him money. 822 00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:23,320 Speaker 1: I'm not sure if that were Shiny Grimmond, but interesting 823 00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:24,880 Speaker 1: that they were very kind enough. 824 00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:27,120 Speaker 2: To do that. He also said he sold. 825 00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:29,759 Speaker 1: A ton of his designer stuff and all of his furniture, 826 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,400 Speaker 1: which at the time sparked a lot of speculation. I 827 00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:34,759 Speaker 1: remember talking about it on the podcast. He said it 828 00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:37,279 Speaker 1: was so awkward because he's like, everyone's like, why are 829 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:39,880 Speaker 1: you selling it? And he's like, oh, it's a secret. 830 00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:42,320 Speaker 1: Like he didn't want to say that he had no money, 831 00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:45,120 Speaker 1: and he said that his motivation for getting out of 832 00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:47,920 Speaker 1: such a dark place was survival. He said he needed 833 00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:50,960 Speaker 1: to make money to keep afloat, and this is really 834 00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:54,200 Speaker 1: how he made his grand return with food. He said 835 00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:57,080 Speaker 1: it was scary to totally change his content because he 836 00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:00,560 Speaker 1: said he'd grown his followers by sharing about superficial content 837 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:03,000 Speaker 1: like makeup and design a gear, and he knew that 838 00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:05,520 Speaker 1: he was going to get a lot of his followers 839 00:39:05,600 --> 00:39:08,160 Speaker 1: dropping off, but he knew that he needed to try 840 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:10,560 Speaker 1: and get new people in. This just makes it even 841 00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:13,440 Speaker 1: better that he has become so successful in that area, 842 00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:17,200 Speaker 1: because it's just such an incredible transformation going from a 843 00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:21,000 Speaker 1: makeup guru to TikTok's best chef. Yeah, I mean, the 844 00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:23,160 Speaker 1: fact that he won the TikTok Creator of the Year 845 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 1: for food is incredible. And he said it's really paid 846 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:28,560 Speaker 1: off making the switch because he's now making more money 847 00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,360 Speaker 1: from his cooking videos than he ever was with Maybe 848 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:35,040 Speaker 1: that's surprising. And he also has said that he has 849 00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,480 Speaker 1: resided himself to the fact that he will always be 850 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,680 Speaker 1: an addict, whether it's with cigarettes, alcohol, or weed, but 851 00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:43,000 Speaker 1: it's just about managing it. That is all we have 852 00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:45,280 Speaker 1: time for today, though, thank you so much for joining 853 00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:48,120 Speaker 1: us for another episode. If you have enjoyed it, could 854 00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:51,359 Speaker 1: you please please please leave us a positive review and 855 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,760 Speaker 1: also make sure you are subscribed on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. 856 00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:57,759 Speaker 1: This episode was recorded on the traditional land of the 857 00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:00,400 Speaker 1: Ghana people of the Adelaide Planes. We pay respect to 858 00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:01,720 Speaker 1: elders past and present.