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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the

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Speaker 1: time poor parent who just answers now.

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Speaker 2: Daycare is the done thing for around about a million

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Speaker 2: families every year. We've got data from the Department of Education.

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Speaker 2: I think this shows something like one point four million

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Speaker 2: kids in Australia are attending daycare on any given three

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Speaker 2: month period. In any given term, about one and a

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Speaker 2: half million children are attending daycare. This is a big industry.

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Speaker 2: It's a huge sector and it affects all of us.

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Speaker 2: It affects us as parents. Research shows that a lot

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Speaker 2: of parents don't really want to take their kids to

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Speaker 2: day care, but cost of living. The reality is double

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Speaker 2: income is sometimes just an absolute requirement, but it also

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Speaker 2: affects our kids. And while a high proportion adjust really well,

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Speaker 2: the reality is a large minority of kids who are

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Speaker 2: in daycare unfortunately, they don't like it at all. I

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Speaker 2: was going to say they hate it. It's a strong wood,

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Speaker 2: but Kylie, you've worked in daycare and I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I mean, some kids really do hate it, don't they.

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Speaker 2: They cry from the minute they get dropped off to

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Speaker 2: the minute they get picked up. It's really stressing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's awful. It's awful for the care is, it's

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Speaker 1: awful for the parents. It's really hard watching a child

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Speaker 1: be that distressed for so long.

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Speaker 2: So in today's conversation, we want to talk to you

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Speaker 2: about daycare dramas and specifically what we can do about

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Speaker 2: helping our kids to adjust well to daycare. I guess

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Speaker 2: to preface this introduction, there's a world leading daycare researcher.

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Speaker 2: His name is Jay Belski. Jay has been researching in

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Speaker 2: this area for forty years now or thereabouts. He recently

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Speaker 2: dropped an absolute bomb on what has previously been pretty

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Speaker 2: well established science that kids thrive as a result of daycare.

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Speaker 2: Blown that up, and he's basically said, they don't really

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Speaker 2: thrive as much as we thought that they did. Research

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Speaker 2: is not pointing in that direction. There are some questions

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Speaker 2: that we need to ask that are going to make

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Speaker 2: every caring parent just a little bit nervous. And he

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Speaker 2: sort of is saying, we probably need to worry a

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Speaker 2: little bit about daycare, even though we're consistently told not

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Speaker 2: to worry about it. Now. I'm not saying this to

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Speaker 2: lump guilt or anything like that, or on anyone like

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Speaker 2: it is the reality but there are some things that

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Speaker 2: we can do to minimize those daycare dramas. And that's

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Speaker 2: what we want to talk about, because if you're dropping

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Speaker 2: the kids to daycare today or tomorrow or sometime this week,

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Speaker 2: you want to make sure that the kids are not

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Speaker 2: in that minority who are really feeling distressed about it. KILEI,

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Speaker 2: after the years that you spent working in various centers,

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Speaker 2: what do you think would be a couple of things

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Speaker 2: that would be most important for parents to really get

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Speaker 2: good at when it comes to this whole daycare drama thing.

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Speaker 1: My top three things, Yeah, would be setting up structures,

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Speaker 1: working around transitions with your kids, developing dialogue around what

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Speaker 1: this looks like, and building partnerships with your cares. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I love that one. Yeah, So if we were.

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Speaker 1: To break that down point number one, setting up structures transitions.

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Speaker 1: Transitions might not be something that the average parent would

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Speaker 1: use in their day to day conversation, but they probably

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Speaker 1: are doing it without knowing.

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Speaker 2: So this is the thing where you say, all right, kids,

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Speaker 2: so to get in the car, we're off to kindy.

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Speaker 1: That's a transition point and it's a.

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Speaker 2: Pretty rough one the way that I just did it.

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Speaker 1: That's exactly right. So with most small kids, they need

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Speaker 1: time to prepare for a transition. They need to know

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Speaker 1: that in five minutes time, maybe ten minutes time, might

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Speaker 1: be a ten minute warning and then a five minute

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Speaker 1: warning that this is going to happen.

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Speaker 2: On that I think it's really important to highlight as well.

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Speaker 2: A three year old or a two year old or

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Speaker 2: a five year old maybe who's off to daycare, they

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Speaker 2: don't necessarily know what five or ten minutes means. That's

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Speaker 2: exactly right. So can you talk through for parents to

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Speaker 2: give them that five and ten and that two minute

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Speaker 2: warning whatever, How do they do it in a way

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Speaker 2: that makes sense to the child since ten minutes doesn't

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Speaker 2: really mean anything, especially if you're only two or three.

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Speaker 1: I think it's just that it's that constant reinforcement. They

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Speaker 1: won't know. If you've got an analog clock or even

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Speaker 1: a digital clock, you can teach them the numbers so

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Speaker 1: that they can see what it's happening. But at that

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Speaker 1: really young age, it really is just about that constant reinforcement,

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Speaker 1: which is why you wouldn't say just once in five

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Speaker 1: minutes time, we're leaving, right. You would have a number

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Speaker 1: of interactions with them leading up to that time so

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Speaker 1: that they know.

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Speaker 2: So it's consistent reminders about the transition that's coming. And

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Speaker 2: as they hear the number getting smaller. It was ten

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Speaker 2: outs five, now it's three, and now it's two, and

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Speaker 2: now it's one, that actually does mean something to them.

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Speaker 2: They can feel the difference.

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Speaker 1: If you don't want to use a number, it might

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Speaker 1: be that you play a song and they know that

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Speaker 1: once that song finishes, it's the same song every time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: for that particular activity, and at the end of that song,

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Speaker 1: they know that that's a transition point. That's the time

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Speaker 1: where they're going to now going to have to go

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Speaker 1: put their shoes and socks on and we're going to

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Speaker 1: jump in the car.

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Speaker 2: For a number of years, in our home, I used

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Speaker 2: to do that with the piano. So I don't play

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Speaker 2: the piano well, but I've got enough skills on the

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Speaker 2: piano to play a handful of songs. And we used

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Speaker 2: to have a family meeting every morning and I would

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Speaker 2: play that song on the piano and the kids would

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Speaker 2: know that by the time that song was finished, everyone

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Speaker 2: had to be in the living room so that we

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Speaker 2: could have our five or ten minutes together as a family.

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Speaker 2: It worked so well.

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Speaker 1: Music is actually one of the best things you can

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Speaker 1: do for engaging kids because it's so easy. They don't

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Speaker 1: have to keep the time going. They understand and know

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Speaker 1: how the song works because it's the same song every day,

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Speaker 1: and it really does help them when they're still learning

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Speaker 1: to read time and things like that, to know, Okay,

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Speaker 1: the chorus is coming, now, this is about to finish it.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to have to keep moving forward.

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Speaker 2: So this idea of setting up structures, it's about more

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Speaker 2: than just transitions. It's about predictability. It's about routine. The

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Speaker 2: kids understand the routine. We go from A to B

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Speaker 2: to C, and then we're in the car and we

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Speaker 2: go to KINDI or daycare or preschool or whatever it

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Speaker 2: is that you call that. So setting up structures, having

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Speaker 2: those transitions and those systems in place matters.

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Speaker 1: The other reason structures are so important is because everything

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Speaker 1: about that makes their life predictable.

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Speaker 2: And that makes them feel safe and secure.

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Speaker 1: Everything is about their sense of security.

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Speaker 2: The second thing that you set up to setting up

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Speaker 2: structures and getting those transitions right was we've got to

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Speaker 2: develop dialogue.

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Speaker 1: This is great because you're having conversations with your children

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Speaker 1: all the time. This is about helping them to see

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Speaker 1: what is happening in their world, asking them questions and

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Speaker 1: helping them to see all of the exciting things that

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Speaker 1: are happening in their world. When you pick them up,

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Speaker 1: asked them what they did today, what was.

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Speaker 2: That, what was their fa They will tell you what.

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Speaker 1: Was their favorite thing that they did, and they'll pull

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Speaker 1: you across the room and they'll show you the book

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Speaker 1: corner or wherever they dressed up as a ferry or

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Speaker 1: They love you being a part of their world. And

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Speaker 1: the more you can engage in that space and create

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Speaker 1: dialogue around it means that when you come home, you

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Speaker 1: can continue that dialogue at home and continue to build

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Speaker 1: excitement around what might happen tomorrow.

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Speaker 2: I really like this, and it's something that I didn't

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Speaker 2: do well when our kids were young, usually because I

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Speaker 2: always felt like I was in a rush. So I'd

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Speaker 2: get to the pickup and I would walk in and

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Speaker 2: I'd sign the book, and I'd say, all right, let's go,

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Speaker 2: because we've got to get your bag, and we've got

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Speaker 2: to get your shoes and all your stuff, pick up

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Speaker 2: your drink bottle, whatever, and we've got to get in

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Speaker 2: the car. We've got to get home because we've got

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Speaker 2: to get to swimm lessons. We've got to do this,

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Speaker 2: We've got to do that. It always felt like it

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Speaker 2: was a hassle. And what you're saying is slow this down.

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Speaker 2: When you walk in there, sit down on the floor

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Speaker 2: and say, show me what you did, Tell me what

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Speaker 2: you did. Make it so that you're comfortable there. You're

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Speaker 2: not rushing to get out. It's actually a nice place

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Speaker 2: to be because as they see that comfort and they

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Speaker 2: get to explore the environment with you and show you

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Speaker 2: their capability and competence in that environment, they're going to

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Speaker 2: want to be there more. That's what I'm hearing. Definitely,

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Speaker 2: that's what I'm layering into what you've just said. I

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Speaker 2: might be putting more words in your mouth than you

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Speaker 2: spat out at me, but that's kind of where I

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Speaker 2: see this going. When you say develop dialogue as well,

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Speaker 2: I think about that advice that we gave last week

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Speaker 2: with big kids, where you say, hey, what are you

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Speaker 2: looking forward to at school today? Surely this has got

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Speaker 2: to be part of it as well.

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Speaker 1: There's real power in helping our kids look forward to tomorrow.

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Speaker 2: Optimism and hope predictors of well being and definitely something

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Speaker 2: that's going to reduce children's anxiety and difficulty around this.

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Speaker 2: So we're validating, we're developing dialogue with the kids, and

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Speaker 2: we're also making sure those structures are good. The third

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Speaker 2: thing that you said is one that I got really

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Speaker 2: excited about when you said it. It makes so much sense.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned building partnerships.

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Speaker 1: This is really important for your children. They need to

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Speaker 1: see you having a good relationship with the people you're

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Speaker 1: leaving them with, and just like it's important for you

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Speaker 1: to spend time with them in the afternoon so you

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Speaker 1: can be a part of their day, starting the day

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Speaker 1: off as calmly as possible and allowing yourself as much

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Speaker 1: margin as you can within your own framework to be there,

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Speaker 1: have a chat with a caregiver in the room, and

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Speaker 1: just do that beautiful handover.

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Speaker 2: I'm feeling even more guilty now because I just mentioned

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Speaker 2: I would walk in, grab the kids, and walk out.

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Speaker 2: In all honesty, I didn't even know the names of

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Speaker 2: the people who were looking after our children in various

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Speaker 2: daycare scenarios. More often than not, I did know some

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Speaker 2: of them. I'm not completely oblivious, but I really didn't

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Speaker 2: know most of them. You were the one that had

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Speaker 2: the relationships. You did most of it because I was

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Speaker 2: traveling a lot, but I would literally be just in

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Speaker 2: transaction high, how'd she go? Great? See you later. What

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Speaker 2: you're saying again is by slowing down and creating that relationship.

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Speaker 2: I guess when you do that, you get to find

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Speaker 2: out how well they know your child. But you can

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Speaker 2: have important conversations like things aren't going so well or

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Speaker 2: what support can we give each other? Because this is

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Speaker 2: a little bit tricky the relationship.

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Speaker 1: Mornings are usually really hard in any daycare center, mornings

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Speaker 1: can be really tricky to connect with the caregiver, which

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Speaker 1: is why the afternoons really matter. Most people aren't picking

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Speaker 1: up at exactly the same time where often there's a

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Speaker 1: rush hour and the morning for drop off, so you

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Speaker 1: might not be able to have the kinds of conversation,

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Speaker 1: in depth conversations that you'd like to be having with

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Speaker 1: your caregiver in the mornings. But that's why either end

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Speaker 1: is so important. Helping your children to see that relationship

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Speaker 1: and being able to hand over in such a way

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Speaker 1: that they feel equipped to deal with the challenges that

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Speaker 1: your child might be experiencing in that day.

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Speaker 2: If you know anybody whose kids are struggling with daycare,

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Speaker 2: make sure you pass this podcast along, Hopefully it'll be helpful.

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Speaker 2: Three things we want to what was it? Set up structures,

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Speaker 2: develop dialogue, build partnerships. Dripping kids off at daycare is

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Speaker 2: a necessary reality for a whole lot of people. If

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Speaker 2: we do it well, it gives parents respite, It places

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Speaker 2: kids in potentially really enriching environments with great people who

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Speaker 2: are caring for them. But things are going to work

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Speaker 2: out best if we can spend time with our munchkins

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Speaker 2: talking positively about the experience and discussing their joyful moments

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Speaker 2: and reviewing their activities and helping them build that excitement

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Speaker 2: for what's coming next. If there's distress, make sure that

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Speaker 2: you evaluate whether the childcare center is a good match

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Speaker 2: for your child and have ongoing communication with educators and

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Speaker 2: implement strategies so that you can help them to positively

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Speaker 2: adjust over time. Fingers crossed. This will help if there's

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Speaker 2: been daycare dramas. The Happy Families podcast is produced by

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Speaker 2: Justin Ruland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive

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Speaker 2: producer for more and fow about making your family happier.

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Speaker 2: We've got it all at happy families dot com dot au,

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Speaker 2: or you can follow us on our social media platforms.

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Speaker 2: We've got doctor Justin Corson's Happy Families on Facebook, or

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Speaker 2: we're on Instagram and TikTok

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Speaker 1: Mhm