1 00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:03,040 Speaker 1: Jomb mission with Jonesy and Amanda. 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 2: Well, it's hard to imagine it's been forty years since 3 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,719 Speaker 2: Lindy Chamberlain said the infamous words of Dingo took my baby. 4 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 2: The case of Azaria's death was one of the greatest 5 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,920 Speaker 2: miscarriages of justice in Australian history. We now know when 6 00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:20,000 Speaker 2: Lindy was first released from jail, there's only one person 7 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:22,840 Speaker 2: that she would speak to. She was interviewed by Ray Martin, 8 00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 2: and now here we are, forty years later, a new 9 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 2: documentary by Ray covering all the details of the case. 10 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:31,040 Speaker 2: Ray Martin, Hello, Hey. 11 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:34,839 Speaker 1: Jame Z's it's not like a docco But I'm just 12 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,280 Speaker 1: when I was interviewed, don I'm happy to just spook 13 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:40,000 Speaker 1: it because I love Lindy. She's fantastic. 14 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 2: Well, when you say you're one of the people being interviewed, 15 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 2: we also hear is this for the first time from 16 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 2: her children? 17 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:49,879 Speaker 1: Yes, I spoke to Reagan at the time when he 18 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: was only about six. That I got a bucketing to 19 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:55,120 Speaker 1: having talked to a six year old. As it happened, 20 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:57,160 Speaker 1: Michael and Lidley both said to me. I spent about 21 00:00:57,160 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 1: four days with them and played basketball on things with him, 22 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 1: and they said that the regular never talked to anybody, 23 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:05,760 Speaker 1: but he was comfortable with me. And they said, and 24 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 1: they start after one side and said, why don't you 25 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: talk to him and see what he's got to say, 26 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:11,800 Speaker 1: because he won't talk of us. He clams up. And 27 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: I know it about you know, a meet away from 28 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:18,000 Speaker 1: me socialist businessing at the time, unlessen to when I 29 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:20,160 Speaker 1: talked to him. But I remember Mike Gibson and others 30 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 1: getting happy for the rent for having spoken with the 31 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: little boy. But now the adults and now they can 32 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:27,480 Speaker 1: talk about what they remember, which isn't very much of 33 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:31,000 Speaker 1: course in their case. But Lindy and Michael, that's a 34 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: different thing. Yeah. 35 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:35,320 Speaker 3: Well, so telling of the time, how you behave in 36 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:38,559 Speaker 3: grief and Lindy Chamberlain, because she didn't behave our everyone 37 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 3: else wanted her to behave because she seemed kind of 38 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:44,040 Speaker 3: dismissive almost of the fact that she'd lost a daughter. 39 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 3: Everyone just presumed she was guilty. 40 00:01:47,560 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, incredible. I mean, a remarkable woman, one of the 41 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 1: most remarkable I've ever met. Resilient, which I guess is 42 00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 1: in other words for tough at the time, because she didn't, 43 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 1: you know, she didn't break down enough, because she appeared 44 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 1: to be tough at the time, occasionally smiled. She's got 45 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:07,000 Speaker 1: an extraordinary sense of human which is probably part of 46 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 1: how she survived. But I remember when I met her 47 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 1: first they're Ketchen up there in Newcastle, and she was 48 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:15,679 Speaker 1: a sparrow of a woman. She'd been three years in 49 00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:19,080 Speaker 1: jail and just tiny and brittle, and yet still, you know, 50 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 1: you could see that resilience and is still that determination 51 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: not to break down on camera, not to be someone's 52 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 1: victim in life. She was really quite remarkable. And the 53 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 1: times that we were doing Midday, she came to Midday 54 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: with a couple of girlfriends on occasion just sat in 55 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 1: the audience and we had that stupid spoof on a 56 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 1: Friday called a town like Dallas. And she rang me 57 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:40,920 Speaker 1: up once and she said that I'm coming with some girlfriends. 58 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 1: We're having a lunch down at Sydney and she said, 59 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:45,640 Speaker 1: can I come on the show? And I said, what 60 00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 1: she said, Dallas? We used to have someone from the audience, 61 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 1: and she said, I'd love to come on and be 62 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 1: sort of the visiting member. But she said, no jokes 63 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 1: about dingos, please, no choke. So that's what we did. 64 00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 1: So she camera and she was going. She took the 65 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:01,960 Speaker 1: bats from everybody, and which people had to do. But 66 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 1: she was just extraordinary fun and I kept thinking, you know, 67 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: how have you survived? Have you made it? 68 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 2: When we look at the miscarriage of justice, when we 69 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:13,640 Speaker 2: look at the details that led to her going to prison, 70 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:15,680 Speaker 2: how did we get it so wrong? 71 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:18,959 Speaker 1: It's amazing. I mean, had we had the death pedalty, 72 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: I think we would have hanged it. That was our 73 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: bes league. People felt about it. A journalist who should 74 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:26,519 Speaker 1: know better, he should be a bit skeptical about this 75 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:29,920 Speaker 1: sort of stuff. Journal's friends of mine. I was working 76 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 1: on sixty minutes when it happened, so I really didn't 77 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 1: follow it minute five minute, but Australia did. It's an 78 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: extraordinary look at Australia in the eighties and attitudes and 79 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: apart from hairstyles and cars and things like that, but 80 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: it's also a news coverage. The way we made opinions 81 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 1: up and you go to a dinner party or go 82 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: to a barbecue on everybody had an opinion when they 83 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,080 Speaker 1: shouldn't have had because they knew nothing. And of course 84 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 1: when she went to jail, probably most of the people 85 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: I knew thought she was guilty, and yet when I 86 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:02,119 Speaker 1: was asked through the interview and jumped at the opportunity. 87 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 1: I shifted on to Midday and she'd been watching Midday 88 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: and where I'm a jail up and Darwin when she 89 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 1: was there with the other women and she asked me 90 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:11,640 Speaker 1: to do the interview and which was which is fantastic. 91 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 1: So I went back and I read the transcript and 92 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: I said, how could anybody have thought in the eight 93 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 1: minutes surrounding when the baby disappeared, that this poor woman 94 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:23,039 Speaker 1: had be guilty as charged? As I say, three years 95 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 1: up there having had another baby girl and having that 96 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:30,160 Speaker 1: her taken away from Lindy and Michael looking after the 97 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: baby and said, we stood in the ketch and had 98 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 1: a cup of tea and she said almost first thing, 99 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: you know, I don't think the marriage could survive, and 100 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:39,600 Speaker 1: it didn't. God knows how she survived. 101 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 3: It's extraordinary as well with that Melbourne connection that there 102 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:46,159 Speaker 3: was those guys and this was kind of documented afterwards. 103 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:48,360 Speaker 3: There was these guys that were camping and they were 104 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 3: shooting illegally or hunting near Ularu and they reported that 105 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:58,120 Speaker 3: they saw a dingo with a baby came into their 106 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 3: camp because they're in the wrong place. They they just 107 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:02,920 Speaker 3: ran away from it. Did did you hear about that? 108 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 1: That was one of the no it did. In fact, 109 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 1: when I was trying mid day again, that guy rang 110 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 1: me and it turned out he was. It was one 111 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:12,480 Speaker 1: of the bizarre Everyone's had a bizarre story about about 112 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 1: the you know, Zari being seen with Aboriginal tribes or 113 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: community that in the western desert, that sort of nonsense 114 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: over the years, and so this one came along. I 115 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:23,600 Speaker 1: thought he rang up and spoke to my pa at 116 00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 1: the time, and she was a trained lawyer, and she said, look, 117 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,359 Speaker 1: I think this guy's makes sense of it. So I 118 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: listened to him and took about sixteen pages of notes, 119 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 1: and that he disappeared, didn't come back to me, but 120 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: he talked about having shot the dingo with the baby 121 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 1: and I it was as bizarre as everything else to 122 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 1: do with the Czari's disappearance. And he then appeared in 123 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:50,479 Speaker 1: the Herald Son in Melbourne about six years later, and 124 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 1: I contacted him and we put him on a current 125 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:55,840 Speaker 1: affair and Michael meet him with Michael's lawyer, who was 126 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,160 Speaker 1: very skeptic about such things, and we ended up doing 127 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:02,160 Speaker 1: a mine detective tests, as unscientific as they are, and 128 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 1: he passed with flying colors, having all the truth, and 129 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: both Michael and the lawyers thought that the fact he 130 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: was telling the truth, but that was just one of 131 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 1: those bizarre things that it won't the story won't go away, 132 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 1: as you said, a man of forty years later was 133 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 1: still talking about it as long as it's got It's 134 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:20,479 Speaker 1: got all the ingredients of you know, I feel like 135 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:25,159 Speaker 1: a murder mystery and about it, plus the being, plus 136 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 1: the what was called thought to be a bizarre religion 137 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:31,160 Speaker 1: at the time, which of course it isn't, and the 138 00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:33,680 Speaker 1: center of Australia and a young brother and a couple 139 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:35,640 Speaker 1: of us and all that sort of stuff, and had 140 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 1: the elephants for Meryl Street to make it a great movie. 141 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:41,359 Speaker 3: Yeah, well right, well we'll be watching a definitely Lindy 142 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 3: Chamblin The True Story. It's this Sunday and Monday, seven 143 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 3: thirty on ten, and it's always a trait just to 144 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 3: talk to Raymond. 145 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 2: Nice to talk to you, ray 146 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,800 Speaker 1: Thanks Amda, Thanks Jonsiy, You've got here with Joins and 147 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 1: Amanda