1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,960 Speaker 1: Now as we know, a parliamentary committee conducting an inquiry 2 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 1: into voluntary assisted dying has recommended that laws be adopted 3 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:11,320 Speaker 1: in the Northern Territory. With its final report now complete 4 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 1: after consultation and public hearings right across the Northern Territory, 5 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:20,080 Speaker 1: the Legal and Constitutional Affairs Committee made eighty six recommendations 6 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 1: in its report, which will be tabled when Parliament sits 7 00:00:23,880 --> 00:00:26,639 Speaker 1: later this month. Now joining us in the studio is 8 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 1: the committee chair, Tansel Rahman. Good morning to you, Tansel. 9 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 2: Good morning again, Katie, thanks for having me Tansal. 10 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: I know it's been an incredibly busy process. I mean 11 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 1: you've over a short period of time. Let's be honest 12 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 1: about it, You've had to really hit the ground running 13 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: from about May, wasn't its correct? 14 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 2: It's been four months on the fourteenth of May that 15 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:48,519 Speaker 2: we got terms of reference asking us to do this 16 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 2: inquiry and ultimately to deliver everything back by the thirtieth 17 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:55,880 Speaker 2: of September, which we were able to do to the 18 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 2: best of our ability within those very tight times constraints. 19 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:01,600 Speaker 1: Danseil took us through sort of how many written submissions 20 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: or how many submissions did the committee receive, because I know, 21 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:07,280 Speaker 1: it wasn't just written ones. You actually, you know, you 22 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 1: had people coming in from communities, You went out to 23 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: communities and different you know, more regional and remote parts 24 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 1: of the Northern territory. 25 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 2: That's right. In the last parliamentary sitting we tabled our 26 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 2: second Interim Report and that details, chapter and verse, all 27 00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 2: the places we went to, all the people we heard from, 28 00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:27,560 Speaker 2: and in a nutshell, we've got about four hundred plus 29 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:30,800 Speaker 2: written submissions in addition to spending time out and dozens 30 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 2: of remote communities, and you know, you know, probably hundreds 31 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:36,640 Speaker 2: of hours of testimony from witnesses that we collected out 32 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 2: there as well in community consultations. And the focus right now, 33 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 2: of course, is on the drafting instructions for a bill 34 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:46,080 Speaker 2: and perhaps to some extent to the report that supports that, 35 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:48,560 Speaker 2: but I would encourage everyone to also be looking at 36 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 2: all of those submissions and all of that data and 37 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 2: all of that witness testimony because that is where you 38 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 2: find the rich understanding of people out in the bush 39 00:01:56,560 --> 00:01:58,920 Speaker 2: have to say on VAD. And the bottom line is 40 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 2: that it's very nuanced. You know, not everybody is for, 41 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 2: not everyone is against, you know, and it's been really 42 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 2: important for us to do those community consultations out in 43 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 2: indigenous communities in particular. 44 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:11,839 Speaker 1: I mean, what has been some of the feedback that 45 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:14,800 Speaker 1: you've received. I'm sure it would have been quite the 46 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: mixed bag. 47 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 2: Yep. Absolutely. As a general proposition, the phrase that I 48 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:22,120 Speaker 2: land on all the time now is help and choice 49 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:25,359 Speaker 2: to finish up. It's clear to me that Territorians by 50 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 2: and large would like people to have a good death, 51 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 2: and a lot of people want help and choice to 52 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:34,080 Speaker 2: finish up well. And the key thing in all of 53 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 2: this is choice. There are a small, a very small 54 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:39,840 Speaker 2: number of people who have flat out objections to VAD, 55 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 2: but there are a lot of people who have reasonable 56 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 2: objections to VD as well. And so when we talk 57 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 2: about choice, the important thing is to not just provide 58 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:49,920 Speaker 2: choice for people to choose VAD if they want it, 59 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 2: but also people involved in the process to choose to 60 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:54,760 Speaker 2: be part of it or to be able to conscientiously 61 00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:56,440 Speaker 2: object from being part of it as well. 62 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: Well. This is the thing. Nobody's going to get the choice. 63 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:02,120 Speaker 1: Nobody's going to be able to choose for someone else. 64 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: Are they like it? You have to be dying, yes, 65 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: and it has to be your. 66 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:09,640 Speaker 2: Choice, correct. Yeah, And the key thing here is that 67 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,679 Speaker 2: we are trying to balance all the checks and balances 68 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 2: to ensure that people who are genuinely suffering, intolerably and 69 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 2: termally ill are going to be able to access this mechanism. 70 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 2: But likewise that if there are healthcare practitioners or even 71 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 2: institutions that want to be able to conscientiously withdraw from 72 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 2: the process object that they're allowed to do that as well. 73 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:34,320 Speaker 2: So it's about providing territorians with choice. And as I've 74 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:36,120 Speaker 2: said to you all along, Katie, for me, this is 75 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 2: not actually about being for VAD or against VAD. It 76 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:43,640 Speaker 2: was about conducting an inquiry with rigor and transparency and 77 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 2: making sure that we move the agenda on VAD forward 78 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:48,240 Speaker 2: for territorians. 79 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: And do you feel as though you've been able to 80 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:52,200 Speaker 1: do that? I mean, do you feel as though this 81 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:55,520 Speaker 1: report differs or extends on the work that was done 82 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: back in twenty twenty four? 83 00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:00,839 Speaker 2: Yeah? I think the report, but more broadly, the inquiry 84 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 2: has collected enormous amounts of data that will add to 85 00:04:04,840 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 2: our existing understanding and knowledge based on VAD. And I 86 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 2: think with time, as people have the opportunity to go 87 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 2: through all those witness transcripts and testimony, they will understand 88 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 2: that actually it's a very nuanced thing that people have 89 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 2: lots of different positions, but nobody is necessarily uniformly for 90 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:24,480 Speaker 2: or against it, and it's important for us to understand 91 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 2: the broader landscape here of aged care, of palliative care, 92 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:31,160 Speaker 2: of the healthcare system, of how all of this works together. 93 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:35,279 Speaker 1: Hey, a few people have asked, what exactly does cultural 94 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 1: safety mean. I don't know whether you've got an answer 95 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 1: for that based on some of the communication that you've 96 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 1: had and some of the you know, some of the 97 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 1: discussions that you've had in for those in remote communities. 98 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I think the I can't provide a textbook 99 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 2: definition for you that will be definitive, But I think 100 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,039 Speaker 2: it was important for the committee to be able to 101 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:58,280 Speaker 2: provide a framework that was going to allow people from 102 00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 2: the thirty percent indigenous population to feel like they could 103 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 2: be part of this or also not part of this 104 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 2: if they didn't want to be. And that's I think 105 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 2: broadly where we're going when we're talking about cultural safety 106 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,520 Speaker 2: in terms of how you adapt protocols and implement something 107 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 2: like this, it's always about the devil being in the details. 108 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 2: Principle of support for VAD is one thing, but the 109 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 2: bigger picture here is to think about the fact that 110 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,840 Speaker 2: to introduce a new health service costs money. There may 111 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 2: be you know, only a handful of people statistically speaking, 112 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:26,159 Speaker 2: probably twenty or less that might end up using VAD 113 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:28,560 Speaker 2: year on year in the Northern Territory. So there's a 114 00:05:28,600 --> 00:05:31,680 Speaker 2: competition here between equity making sure everyone can access this 115 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:34,280 Speaker 2: and economy making sure that it can happen and is 116 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 2: an unreasonable burden. 117 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: So in terms of the work that you've done, I mean, 118 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 1: have you looked at that how much something like this 119 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 1: will cost in terms of you know, the introduction here 120 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 1: in the Northern Territory. 121 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:46,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, And the best place you can get the answers 122 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 2: from Matt are on the fifth of August and on 123 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:51,320 Speaker 2: the fifth of September we held public hearings where the 124 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 2: Department of Health, the AMA and various others we're all 125 00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 2: asked questions by myself and the rest of the committee 126 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:02,119 Speaker 2: to try and understand the true cost of what this involves. Because, 127 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 2: as I say, in principle, to just say do support VAD, 128 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:06,680 Speaker 2: yes or no, a lot of people will say yes. 129 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 2: But then you have to think about exactly what the 130 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 2: detail is, how will it be provisioned, how will it 131 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 2: be implemented, And so we have tried very hard to 132 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:17,360 Speaker 2: tackle those tough questions and to try and work out 133 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 2: a model that we think will work for the Northern 134 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 2: Territory based on our unique demographic circumstances and our unique 135 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 2: economic circumstances. We have a healthcare system that is understrained. 136 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 2: We want territories to be able to access this. But 137 00:06:30,080 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 2: the choices we've made throughout our report in many ways 138 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,680 Speaker 2: differ from the choices that were made in the twenty 139 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:37,279 Speaker 2: twenty four report, and we're going to have to go 140 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 2: through a process now of firstly explaining that to all 141 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,640 Speaker 2: the parliamentarians and then communicating that all out to the public. 142 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: So are you able to give us an idea of 143 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 1: how much money? It was sort of talented that this 144 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:51,279 Speaker 1: would cost. 145 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 2: Well, the numbers that were provided in the submission by 146 00:06:54,680 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 2: the Health Department in the fifth of September Inquiry hearing 147 00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:03,839 Speaker 2: by the Health Department in relation to looking at the 148 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 2: ACT model, there was a range of between one and 149 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:10,120 Speaker 2: twenty million dollars. So that's a big rate and that 150 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 2: there are large setup costs for a lot of these things, 151 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 2: and then they're ongoing costs as well, and so that's 152 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 2: a lot of money, and you have to think prudently 153 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 2: about you have to think sensibly about how you invest 154 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:22,240 Speaker 2: in your healthcare system. And so we've tried to make 155 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 2: choices to utilize the best of our existing services without 156 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 2: trying to create whole new structures if you like, that 157 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 2: will be expensive and difficult to get off the ground. Like, 158 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 2: what we broadly want Recommendation one is for there to 159 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 2: be a law on VAD for territories, and what we 160 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 2: want in practice is for territories to be able to 161 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 2: access that sometime in the future and hopefully not in 162 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 2: the far distant future, but in the conceivable future. 163 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:46,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, I was going to say, I mean, what kind 164 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: of implementation period do you know? Do you sort of anticipate. 165 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 2: Most Australian jurisdictions have an eighteen month implementation window after 166 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:59,120 Speaker 2: they have passed the legislation. So right now we've delivered 167 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 2: a report. Government I'm pleased to see has already committed 168 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 2: to drafting legislation. That legislation will have to come to 169 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 2: the House and be debated. So let's assume that gets 170 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:12,280 Speaker 2: passed at some point early next year, just based on 171 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 2: everything going well, there's still eighteen months of implementation probably 172 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:17,520 Speaker 2: time that you'd be looking at. So it's a couple 173 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 2: of years away before someone in the real world will 174 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 2: actually access FAT And the same is true in every 175 00:08:22,080 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 2: state and territory. Every state and territory is past a 176 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,640 Speaker 2: bad law, but nobody started using it in the act yet. 177 00:08:26,720 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 2: The implementation period is just coming to the close and 178 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:30,800 Speaker 2: it will just finally start to be used towards the 179 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 2: end of this year. 180 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:34,079 Speaker 1: Now. I know the Attorney General confirmed yesterday that there 181 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 1: will be a conscience vote on VAD laws. Do you 182 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: think that that's the best approach? Yeah? 183 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I think this is a matter of conscience and 184 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 2: the key thing now will be for all MLAs to 185 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:47,720 Speaker 2: work out for themselves how their electorates feel and how 186 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:49,920 Speaker 2: they feel when it comes to a conscience vote. So 187 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 2: I have a good sense about what the people in 188 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 2: Fonglin want, but that's not good enough for me just 189 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 2: by you know, My spidery sense is I'll be running 190 00:08:57,000 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 2: a survey of my whole electorate through my website, you know, 191 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:02,960 Speaker 2: towns rauma dot com soon for everybody in Fonglimb to 192 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 2: give me a good statistical base. 193 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:06,080 Speaker 1: We'll I'll certainly be jumping on there. I mean, I 194 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: live in your electorate, and I think it's incredibly important 195 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: for people to make sure that their voices are heard. 196 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 1: You know. To me, I go back to, well, why 197 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 1: would I make the choice for somebody else if they're 198 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:21,719 Speaker 1: terminally ill as to whether they can or cannot access that, 199 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:23,559 Speaker 1: that is their choice as an individual. 200 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 2: And I think right now the questions that there will 201 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 2: be in my survey, at least Kaie're not just going 202 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:30,079 Speaker 2: to be like do you support bad yes or no. 203 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:31,840 Speaker 2: Now there's going to be the opportunity to say, do 204 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 2: you support the kind of model that we've proposed in 205 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:37,840 Speaker 2: this report? Are you okay with a twelve month prognosis? 206 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 2: Are you okay with a decentralized model for service delivery? 207 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,520 Speaker 2: And these are the real questions that determine whether or 208 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 2: not VAD works and works well. And so you know, 209 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:48,400 Speaker 2: I'm still thinking through exactly the kind of things that 210 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 2: I want to make sure that my electric gets to 211 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:52,959 Speaker 2: provide feedback on. You don't want to overcomplicate it, no, 212 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 2: but the bottom line is that in principal support for VAD, yes, 213 00:09:56,640 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 2: there is tons and there are plenty of objections as well, 214 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:02,760 Speaker 2: some of which are unreasonable and some of which are 215 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:05,640 Speaker 2: much more reasonable. And that's why I encourage everybody to 216 00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:08,560 Speaker 2: look at the whole picture here. For me, this is 217 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 2: about running, as I say, an inquiry that has been 218 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:14,680 Speaker 2: done with transparency and integrity, and for everybody to be 219 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 2: able to look at the full picture and then make 220 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:17,680 Speaker 2: a determination on how to move forward. 221 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 1: So turns from your perspective and for everybody listening this morning, 222 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:22,080 Speaker 1: what are the next steps? 223 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 2: So at this stage, the next step really is in 224 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,800 Speaker 2: the hands of the government, and the Attorney General and 225 00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:31,719 Speaker 2: the Acting Chief Minister have made clear in the last 226 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 2: few days that they'll be moving forward with drafting some legislation. 227 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 2: There is really no formal obligation for myself to do 228 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:41,720 Speaker 2: much past this point, other than the fact that of 229 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:43,960 Speaker 2: the many dozens of locations we've been out to, there 230 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 2: are still some of the transcripts that are being approved 231 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 2: for publication, and so we'll be having a look at 232 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:53,079 Speaker 2: the last few of those. But there's a majority of 233 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,760 Speaker 2: them now that have been approved as is in the 234 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 2: associated minutes to the report that have been tabled. And 235 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 2: so if people are interested in and that you know, 236 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 2: the real nuts and bolts and the details or what 237 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:05,720 Speaker 2: people had to say out push on VAD good, bad 238 00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 2: and ugly and otherwise that's that's where to go. 239 00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 1: Well. Chair of the Legal and Constitutional Affairs Committee also 240 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 1: the member for Fong Limb, Tanseil Rahman, thanks so much 241 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: for your time this morning. 242 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:17,080 Speaker 2: Thanks as always, Katie, thank you