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Speaker 1: But we know that the Australian Education Union, well the

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory branch, is concerned about a looming staff shortage.

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Speaker 1: Well that could leave classrooms without teachers from early next year.

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Speaker 1: Now joining me on the line is the president of

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Speaker 1: the Education Union here in the Northern Territory, Javishrin. Good morning,

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Speaker 1: Katie Jervis, what is the worry here? Why do we

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Speaker 1: think that we may not have all the teachers that

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Speaker 1: we need from early next year.

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Speaker 2: Well, I don't just direct anyone to the Teacher in

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Speaker 2: the Territory website where every day it appears that the

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Speaker 2: list of jobs is growing, and bearing in mind that's

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Speaker 2: not all of the positions. That's just the advertised classroom

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Speaker 2: teacher positions. That doesn't include senior teacher positions, principal positions,

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Speaker 2: support positions, and it's all over the territory. And I

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Speaker 2: just know we expect a certain level of turnover every year,

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Speaker 2: but this year it does seem and certainly what people

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Speaker 2: saying to us privately is it's proving to be a

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Speaker 2: real challenge in identifying people for all those vacancies.

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Speaker 1: It sounds that way, Javis. Do we have any idea

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Speaker 1: how many teachers we're talking about, well, was said.

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Speaker 2: I don't have the information, and I think that the

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Speaker 2: way that the department employs, one of the problems around

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Speaker 2: this model they've gone to is that they won't be

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Speaker 2: easily able to aggregate it because most of these decisions

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Speaker 2: are made, of course now at a school level. And

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Speaker 2: this is lauded as a great system that schools will

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Speaker 2: all determine their own staffing, But I see it more

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Speaker 2: as a case of schools are sort of largely left

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Speaker 2: to their own devices to try and fill vacancies. And

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Speaker 2: what the union's been banging on about for years now

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Speaker 2: is we have no strategic focus on recruitment. We don't

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Speaker 2: recruit any teachers permanently. We currently don't have any inducements

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Speaker 2: or programs going around recruiting teachers from interstate and so

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Speaker 2: I've sort of talked about the chickens coming home to

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Speaker 2: roost for some time now. I'm definitely seeing fatigue, particularly

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Speaker 2: in remote We've warned of COVID fatigue for people have

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Speaker 2: been very isolated from family, and just one day this

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Speaker 2: week in our office alone, we received a dozen resignations

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Speaker 2: of people that are all indicated to tick the box

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Speaker 2: for moving into state. So that's always been you know,

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Speaker 2: I think one of the challenges for the territory coming

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Speaker 2: out of the pandemic especially is where the people would

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Speaker 2: sort of vote with their feet and look to go

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Speaker 2: back home somewhere a bit closer to family.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's something you know that isn't isolated obviously,

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Speaker 1: just to teachers and education. I know that earlier in

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Speaker 1: the week we've spoken to the Department or sorry to

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Speaker 1: Tourism Central Australia about their needs for early next year

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Speaker 1: when it comes to staff in the tourism sector in

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Speaker 1: Central Australia. But then when you look at at you know,

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Speaker 1: a profession like teaching and the impact that that's going

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Speaker 1: to have in terms of the educating of our children,

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Speaker 1: it could be you know, it could be a real

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Speaker 1: worry come early next year if we head back to

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Speaker 1: the classrooms or the kids do, and there aren't the

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Speaker 1: teaching staff required.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and look, I certainly have some sympathy for the

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Speaker 2: senior officers and education I believe have been run ragged

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Speaker 2: over the last eighteen months and again recently with when

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Speaker 2: these COVID outbreaks occur and all sorts of restrictions are imposed.

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Speaker 2: There's a lot of work that then goes on to

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Speaker 2: into ensuring that schools are complying. And so of course

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Speaker 2: what all that means, and this is again not just

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Speaker 2: true in education but across the board is the ball

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Speaker 2: gets dropped and a whole lot of other measures. And

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Speaker 2: we were supposed to have a trial up and running

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Speaker 2: around permanent recruitment, as I said, a more strategic focus

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Speaker 2: around teacher recruitment, and that by a large way happen

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Speaker 2: this year, and to me, it's another lost opportunity going

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Speaker 2: into a new year that we are just as I said,

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Speaker 2: really leaving schools to go out and despine to who

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Speaker 2: they can. That's not a coordinate approach. We should be

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Speaker 2: marshaling our resources as a system to support schools to

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Speaker 2: go and get the best teachers, the most qualified teachers.

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Speaker 2: And as I always say, that we are competing with

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Speaker 2: every other jurisdiction really for recruiting our teachers, and that

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Speaker 2: they have that many vacancies with only a week left

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Speaker 2: in the school year tells me that we are going

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Speaker 2: to be a lot of people are going to be

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Speaker 2: working through the school holidays just to try and plug

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Speaker 2: all those hopes.

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Speaker 1: So Javis, you touched on the fact that people are

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Speaker 1: quite COVID fatigued. It's something that you and I have

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Speaker 1: spoken about on the show before, about the fact that

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Speaker 1: you know, for a lot of teachers, particularly if they're

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Speaker 1: working remote, they haven't been able to go home to

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Speaker 1: see family and it has had an impact. Are there

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Speaker 1: other reasons also contributing to what could be a shortage

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Speaker 1: rely next year?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, I think it's a range of factors. You know,

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Speaker 2: we get asked about the mandate. I think that will

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Speaker 2: be having a small impact. Bearing in mind that mandate

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Speaker 2: is now in place or will be in place in

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Speaker 2: every jurisdiction, so there's nowhere else for those teachers to go. Clearly,

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Speaker 2: the pay free issue doesn't help. Yeah, So it's and

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Speaker 2: as a broader issue I've been trying to get a

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Speaker 2: bit more interest into of this is a national problem

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Speaker 2: of just a supply issue. So currently our country is

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Speaker 2: not training enough new teachers. We're seeing big shortages that

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Speaker 2: have culminated things like a full day strike in your

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Speaker 2: South Wales on Tuesday, where big system like that's talking

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Speaker 2: about you know, thousands of teachers. It's a shortage that

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Speaker 2: will only grow in years to come, and people not

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Speaker 2: staying in the profession for as long because they're getting

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Speaker 2: burnt out due to work life problems. And yeah, I

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Speaker 2: sort of again feel like our system here have got

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Speaker 2: to work probably harder than nearly anywhere to get our

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Speaker 2: teachers here to ideally keep them here as long as possible,

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Speaker 2: and they're just people trying their hardest but not really

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Speaker 2: working strategically on how we can support our teachers and

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Speaker 2: particularly early career teachers, nurture them to get through some

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Speaker 2: of the more difficult years, support for teachers out bush

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Speaker 2: around their mental health and well being, and some of

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Speaker 2: those sorts of things are chronic sort of problems for

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Speaker 2: our system.

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Speaker 1: Javis. There'll be a lot of parents listening this morning

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Speaker 1: wondering if this is, you know, if these vacancies, if

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Speaker 1: it's going to have an impact on the school in

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Speaker 1: which their children go to when they head back to

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Speaker 1: the classrooms from early next year, you know.

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Speaker 2: Is that. Look, I'm not in a position to say,

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Speaker 2: and you know, one of my frustrations is, you know,

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Speaker 2: I'll make these comments and the Education Department will issue

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Speaker 2: a fairly anodyne statement and it'll be reassuring and not

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Speaker 2: be specific at all, but privately, people are telling me

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Speaker 2: it is an issue, and I think this is the

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Speaker 2: case of where the government should come clean and talk

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Speaker 2: about what the challenges are and how they're going to

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Speaker 2: address it. I reiterate again that on the pay freeze issue,

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Speaker 2: the government does need to come and sit down and

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Speaker 2: work out what would be a fair and reasonable pay increase.

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Speaker 2: Because you're putting a message out to teachers there's no

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Speaker 2: pay rise for four or five years. That's going to

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Speaker 2: be that's going to be a huge challenge and people

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Speaker 2: can complain about that all they like. But if a

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Speaker 2: teacher looks around like anyone else and they want to

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Speaker 2: be paid what they're worth for the work they're doing,

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Speaker 2: and they will some of them will vote with their

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Speaker 2: feet if there's not a reasonable offer on the table.

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Speaker 2: So it's for the Education Minister of the Chief Minister

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Speaker 2: hope they address these issues. Honestly, When is that?

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Speaker 1: When is that vote expected? When it comes to the

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Speaker 1: pay frees and the offer that the Chief Minister had

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Speaker 1: put on the table a couple of weeks ago, Well.

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Speaker 2: They've elected not to put that offer out to teachers.

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Speaker 2: There is, as you probably aware, there is a vote

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Speaker 2: underway now for the general public service on mortivate for

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Speaker 2: teachers that we know vote until at least February next year.

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Speaker 2: But given the government's position, we're making preparations to look

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Speaker 2: at a protected industrial action in the new year, and

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Speaker 2: we will be escalating our campaign because there's no way

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Speaker 2: we're going to accept a four year pay freeze with

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Speaker 2: so called bonuses that freeze people's pay for four.

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Speaker 1: Years, right, so we could actually see our teachers striking

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Speaker 1: from early next year as well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a process we need to go through, and

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Speaker 2: part of that is we actually our members need to

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Speaker 2: through a democratic process to support the types of action

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Speaker 2: they would like to see.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 2: But there's a very strong message I'm getting from our

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Speaker 2: members and schools all across the Northern Territory is they

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Speaker 2: want to step up the action in this campaign and

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Speaker 2: we want to do that in a way that it's

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Speaker 2: not disruptive to schools and to parents. But we will

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Speaker 2: look at all the options available to us in the

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Speaker 2: new year.

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Speaker 1: Well, Javishrin, I've no doubt that we'll speak to you

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Speaker 1: early in the new year and probably hear more about that.

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Speaker 1: We will leave it there for this morning. Thank you

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Speaker 1: very much for your time today

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Speaker 2: Thanks very much, thank you,