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Speaker 1: What a week it has been and joining us in

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Speaker 1: the studio this morning, we've got the Minister for Lands

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Speaker 1: Planning and Environment, Josh Burgoing, Good.

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Speaker 2: Morning, Good morning Katie.

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Speaker 1: Well we've also got the independent member for Ara lun

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Speaker 1: she's also the Speaker of the Northern Territories Legislative Assembly,

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Speaker 1: Robin Lambley.

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Speaker 3: Good morning, Robert, Good morning Katie.

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Speaker 4: Wonderful to have you in the studio.

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Speaker 1: And we're rounding out our politicians from Central Australia.

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Speaker 4: We've got Chancey Paike for the Labor Party. Good morning

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Speaker 4: to you.

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Speaker 5: Good morning Katie. And yeah you got the Alice crew.

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Speaker 3: I do.

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Speaker 1: I love having the Alice crew here. And I'll tell

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Speaker 1: you what it's been an interesting week. I mean well

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Speaker 1: from the Berkley and Central Australia all the way to

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Speaker 1: Catherine and.

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Speaker 4: Everywhere in between.

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Speaker 1: Really we have been experiencing some unprecedented weather conditions. What

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Speaker 1: we know this morning is that the Insurance Council of

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Speaker 1: Australia has declared widespread flooding across the Northern Territory a

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Speaker 1: significant event. Now. This declaration triggers a coordinator response from

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Speaker 1: the insurance industry to manage high volumes of claims in

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Speaker 1: the wake of a natural disaster. Now they say that

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Speaker 1: they've begun receiving claims from impacted communities, but it's too

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Speaker 1: early to estimate the bill. I would imagine that'll take

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Speaker 1: quite some time. But this does mean that for some

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Speaker 1: of those residents that have been really severely impacted by

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Speaker 1: the flood, that they're going to be able to now

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Speaker 1: start that process of hopefully recovering. But some locations will

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Speaker 1: well and truly underwater. I mean, you look at the

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Speaker 1: daily at the moment and things are peaking. It's tough going,

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Speaker 1: isn't it.

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Speaker 2: It's been incredible, Katie, and I think this really started

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Speaker 2: for us in Central Australia on the twelfth of February

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Speaker 2: with flash flooding and ola springs. We've seen the Barkley

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Speaker 2: impacted as well, with remote communities isolated. Then we move

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Speaker 2: up to Catherine where we've just seen huge river levels,

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Speaker 2: the town having to be evacuated in some areas, flooding

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Speaker 2: there and now really the recovery effort that's happening there

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Speaker 2: and people trying to access those disaster recovery payments. As

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Speaker 2: we move up to Darwin, and obviously you've spoken about

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Speaker 2: daily river and what's going to be happening out there,

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Speaker 2: people being evacuated from those remote communities, And I think

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Speaker 2: to your listeners in Darwin who have obviously this week

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Speaker 2: they've had to deal with the boil water alerts, ensuring

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Speaker 2: that we're all coming together here as a community to

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Speaker 2: make sure that we weren't watering our yards like we

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Speaker 2: used to, and we haven't really had to, thankfully due

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Speaker 2: to all the rain. But it's really been a community

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Speaker 2: effort of everyone coming together. And I want to thank

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Speaker 2: all those power and water crews who quite literally were

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Speaker 2: out there working through the night to get the Darwen

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Speaker 2: River Dam pumps back up and running, the pool generators

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Speaker 2: in there, and the pictures that are coming out of

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Speaker 2: there to quite literally see them taking these electrical components,

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Speaker 2: and for me, as a previous electrician, it was incredible

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Speaker 2: to see these huge, high voltage bits of equipment that

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Speaker 2: had to all be taken apart essentially make sure there

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Speaker 2: was no moisture so they could all go back together

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Speaker 2: and get it back up and running. And I think

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Speaker 2: the latest on that that I have for everyone is

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Speaker 2: that two of those four pumps are opery' operating off

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Speaker 2: the temporary generator and now it will be really going

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Speaker 2: back to ensuring that that's all up and running into

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Speaker 2: the grit She is.

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Speaker 1: Really good news and thankfully that water boil alert lifted

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Speaker 1: as well.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely, I think, you know, Katie, I don't think there

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Speaker 5: is a piece of the territory that hasn't been wet

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Speaker 5: over the last few weeks to a month. So you know,

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Speaker 5: I mean just a strength and resilience of territorians right

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Speaker 5: across the place and you know, just seeing what we

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Speaker 5: do best, and that's coming together. The territory has come together.

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Speaker 5: People have you know, supported one another, offered accommodation for

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Speaker 5: people who've lost their homes. I know that Duran Young

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Speaker 5: and Marian Scrimminger went out yesterday to the Daily and

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Speaker 5: then popped down and you know saw some of the

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Speaker 5: pastor lists in the Douglas Daily flew over the Darwin River.

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Speaker 5: You know. So look, there is a lot of water around,

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Speaker 5: and yes, people are displaced. I think, you know to

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Speaker 5: the earlier part. One area that we all have to

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Speaker 5: kind of keep an eye on is what does this

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Speaker 5: mean for insurance premiums post this event? You know what

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Speaker 5: I mean, Like Josh and Robin and myself. We're all

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Speaker 5: from Alice. We've heard some people who already live along

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Speaker 5: the Todd River in Alice Springs. You know, thirty thousand

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Speaker 5: dollars a year for insurance as some of the quotes, So,

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Speaker 5: you know.

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Speaker 1: I think, and then they're a bloody nightmare to deal

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Speaker 1: with when you actually need to take.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely So, you know, I think, you know, like everyone

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Speaker 5: has said, this is a long process. We've got to

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Speaker 5: get into the recovery. We've got to assess I think,

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Speaker 5: you know, the government have spoken about it. You know,

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Speaker 5: I'm you know, in good faith hoping it does happen,

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Speaker 5: but you know, having a review around how we can

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Speaker 5: improve things in the future. And clearly we need to

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Speaker 5: look at how we adapt to the changing climate and patterns.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's been a huge time, Robin, hasn't it.

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Speaker 3: Yes, And a lot of Territorians will be experiencing great

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Speaker 3: loss and trauma. I guess listening to Duran Young, the

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Speaker 3: Member for Daily, he spoke last in Parliament last night

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Speaker 3: about what he saw on the Daily River, the Darwin

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Speaker 3: River yesterday and it was very sobering to hear the

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Speaker 3: degree of devastation and the fact that a lot of

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Speaker 3: Territorians will be left with nothing. Yeah, literally nothing. And

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Speaker 3: I think that this is a point that we do

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Speaker 3: need to move to. I mean, we know that the

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Speaker 3: Daily River at Daily Police Station, well it's currently at

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Speaker 3: fifteen point eighty one meters and rising. With major flooding,

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Speaker 3: the daily River at the Daily River Police Station may

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Speaker 3: exceed sixteen point two zero meters during Friday, so today

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Speaker 3: that is close to the nineteen ninety eight flood level.

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Speaker 3: Now they will be experiencing great loss, there is no

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Speaker 3: doubt about that. As the flood waters are flowing through,

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Speaker 3: you know, it's going to be a tough time and

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Speaker 3: people displaced I would imagine for quite a period of

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Speaker 3: time as well. You know, then you look at locations

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Speaker 3: as you touched on there Robin as well.

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Speaker 4: Like Darwen River.

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Speaker 1: Now throughout the last couple of days, we've had residents

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Speaker 1: of Darwin River really you know, devastated basically to put

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Speaker 1: it mildly, about what has occurred, that flash flooding that

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Speaker 1: they experienced. They really didn't feel as though they received

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Speaker 1: the communication in the early days of you know.

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Speaker 4: Well that this could potentially happen.

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Speaker 1: But then you know, in terms of the response they

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Speaker 1: really felt like they had just been left on their own.

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Speaker 1: And we took a call from Tom, one of our

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Speaker 1: listeners earlier in the week on Wednesday, I reckon it

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Speaker 1: was now, thankfully, everybody's okay by the sounds of it now,

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Speaker 1: well not in terms of their property, but in terms

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Speaker 1: of life. But he told us of an elderly couple

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Speaker 1: that lived next door. You know that he wasn't sure

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Speaker 1: at that point in time whether they were okay or

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Speaker 1: not because they'd stayed in their home. Nobody had gone

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Speaker 1: out there to see them. Now we since learned yesterday

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Speaker 1: when we caught up with him again that they apparently

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Speaker 1: sheltered in their home in the highest part of their

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Speaker 1: home that they could, and were on top of a table,

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Speaker 1: is what he had told us. You know, you think

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Speaker 1: about that, it's hard not to feel quite emotional thinking

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Speaker 1: about two I don't know that ages, but I'm going

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Speaker 1: to stay older territorians having to deal with that, and

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Speaker 1: the level of you know, resilience and toughness to get

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Speaker 1: through that. It's just like it gives me goosebumps thinking

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Speaker 1: about them in their home and that feeling of being

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Speaker 1: alone and wondering if anyone's going to get.

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Speaker 4: Out there to help you.

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Speaker 2: I've heard a lot of this over the last month

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Speaker 2: as well, Katie and Alice. Springs was a classic example

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Speaker 2: of this, where people literally woke up at four am

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Speaker 2: with water through their homes and I filled a number

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Speaker 2: of calls from angry residents that felt like they wanted

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Speaker 2: more more alerts about what was occurring, and I hear

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Speaker 2: them loud and clear. What I will say on that

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Speaker 2: is that it was a flash flooding event.

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Speaker 5: I believe.

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Speaker 2: I looked at the figures, two hundred and twenty millimeters

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Speaker 2: over a twenty four hour period out there towards Darwin River.

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Speaker 2: We have had the Commissioner Andy Wharton out there in

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Speaker 2: that area, so it doesn't get any higher than that.

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Speaker 2: When it comes to the fire and rescue space. He's

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Speaker 2: out there on the ground wanting to speaking with people,

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Speaker 2: hearing their concerns and about what we can do better

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Speaker 2: in the future. Absolutely, we acknowledge that, but I think

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Speaker 2: think it's important to also note as we go through

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Speaker 2: these unprecedented levels of rainfall, when we're dealing with these

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Speaker 2: essentially disaster recovery efforts, there's a level that we're now

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Speaker 2: working through. We're seeing people in Catherine that are being

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Speaker 2: offered those payments. Just in Ala Springs now the Central

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Speaker 2: Desert region they're going through that same thing, will work

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Speaker 2: through this, and we really just need to thank the

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Speaker 2: people that are out there quite literally as we speak.

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Speaker 2: And I saw the incredible helicopter rescue from Catherine with

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Speaker 2: John Armstrong the pilot and the police officer there.

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Speaker 4: We're going to catch up with Ben and the police

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Speaker 4: officer after incredible efforts.

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Speaker 2: So this is still unfolding across Northern Territory. We're still

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Speaker 2: seeing flood events occur. Absolutely, We're reacting to them when

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Speaker 2: they occur, and where we can, we are making sure

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Speaker 2: that we're planning for the works.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and look, I get it right when it comes

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Speaker 1: to communication around an emergency. You know, in a former life,

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Speaker 1: I worked in the police media unit. I've worked as

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Speaker 1: a media advisor on several different departments. I totally understand

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Speaker 1: that it's a difficult job trying to get out, you know,

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Speaker 1: all of this information and it's a real moving feast. Now,

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Speaker 1: my criticism isn't towards anybody, really, but I think if

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Speaker 1: I was to provide some constructive feedback, I would say

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Speaker 1: that you know, posting things on social media and letting

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Speaker 1: media outlets know, Yes, good idea, but it's not enough.

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Speaker 1: I feel like, if I can get twenty messages from

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Speaker 1: Clive Palmer's bloody United Party before an election, why can't

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Speaker 1: we all get messages on our phones? Are learning us

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Speaker 1: if there is an emergency? And I know that that

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Speaker 1: may be a little bit difficult to coordinate in the

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Speaker 1: first instance, you know, when we do it. We saw

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Speaker 1: a little bit of it earlier in the week from

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Speaker 1: power and water around the pumps and around the water

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Speaker 1: saving measures. But if we are able to coordinate this

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Speaker 1: a little bit better, I think it would be incredibly

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Speaker 1: helpful to all territories because the last thing anybody wants,

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Speaker 1: whether you're a politician or you're a publican, whatever your

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Speaker 1: job is, is to see people's homes in undated and people,

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Speaker 1: you know, suffering.

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Speaker 5: That's right, Katie. I think you know when we talk

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Speaker 5: about that situation with that elderly couple, I mean you

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Speaker 5: have to to put yourself in their shoes. They are

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Speaker 5: worried not only about the water, but those are croc

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Speaker 5: infested waters. You know, it's a terrifying, terrifying story to hear.

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Speaker 5: I think we've got systems. We've got secure NTE which

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Speaker 5: has the ability to send out those messages. Look, I

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Speaker 5: you know, for me, this is absolutely above politics. This

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Speaker 5: is about and it's not a targeting individuals. This is

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Speaker 5: a system issue that we need to look at and overcome.

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Speaker 5: I'm interested to hear, you know, Josh, is this something

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Speaker 5: that the government will consider sending to the Public Accounts

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Speaker 5: Committee for an inquiry? Because I feel like the best

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Speaker 5: way to overcome this is to hear the real life

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Speaker 5: stories and experiences of people from right across the territory.

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Speaker 5: When we hear that lived experience, that's how we build

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Speaker 5: a better system for the future.

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Speaker 2: And I think in regards to the emergency warning system

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Speaker 2: and the emergency messaging in our springs, I can speak

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Speaker 2: to that because I know that after the initial floods

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Speaker 2: on the twelfth of February, there were messages that went

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Speaker 2: out the week later. It is I believe, and I'm

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Speaker 2: not going to again. I'll go and find out the information.

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Speaker 2: Believe it's a federal system that we utilize for that

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Speaker 2: emergency messaging. Again, when you get two hundred and twenty

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Speaker 2: millimeters falling suddenly, by the time you're sending messages out

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Speaker 2: because you're seeing river levels come up. A lot of

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Speaker 2: those people are already inundated and can't get it.

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Speaker 1: That's something still better than nothing, right, particularly if you

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Speaker 1: are maybe at work and you don't even realize that

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Speaker 1: that level of rain has actually come through at your place.

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Speaker 1: Let's say you live at Darwin River but you work

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Speaker 1: in town. You know, and look, I know it's not

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Speaker 1: a simple solution. I totally understand that, but I do

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Speaker 1: just think that there is potential here, and there's opportunity

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Speaker 1: for a bit of a review, a bit of a

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Speaker 1: look into it, and really understanding too that ordinarily, when

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Speaker 1: we have an emergency, you might have a cyclone that's

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Speaker 1: heading for one area and everybody's got all their.

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Speaker 4: Eyes on that.

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Speaker 1: But in this situation, I guess the issue has been

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Speaker 1: that there's been multiple different weather events across the board

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Speaker 1: and trying to coordinate all of that is really difficult.

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Speaker 4: But we do not want to wind up in this

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Speaker 4: situation again.

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Speaker 5: Look, Katie, there are some really simple things that we

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Speaker 5: can do. And you know I'm going to say today

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Speaker 5: any government can't change the past, but we can change

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Speaker 5: the future, and this is an opportunity for the CLP

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Speaker 5: to look at it. You know, we know where the

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Speaker 5: catchment of the Todd River is, we know where the

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Speaker 5: signals should be upstream in the rest of the river

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Speaker 5: systems in the top end. It's about bringing the Commonwealth

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Speaker 5: and the territory together. Let's look at how we improve

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Speaker 5: that infrastructure. I mean, Katie, I've been a member for

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Speaker 5: now nearly ten years. Every wet season we're now saying

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Speaker 5: we're seeing unprecedented levels of rain, of storms in isolated areas.

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Speaker 5: So clearly this is a real result of climate change.

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Speaker 5: How do we prepare better for that? How do we

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Speaker 5: become more adapt to deal with this in the future.

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Speaker 5: And I'm not attributing the blame to one person. The

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Speaker 5: public service has been working amazing over this time. What's

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Speaker 5: the infrastructure needed to support them in the future to

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Speaker 5: communicate the.

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Speaker 1: Message and point you made there about the Northern Territory

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Speaker 1: and the federal government's working together as a good one.

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Speaker 1: Because we're even in a situation, you know, to harp

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Speaker 1: on about something I've been talking about for a couple

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Speaker 1: of weeks where some parts of you know, of the

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Speaker 1: Barkley region don't even have a rain radar. You know, like,

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Speaker 1: we've got to get a bit better at this when

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Speaker 1: we are actually dealing with some really tough situations. And yes,

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Speaker 1: Territorians are a resilient bunch, but you've got to give

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Speaker 1: us a bit of a chance, you know. And for

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Speaker 1: some people, if you don't even have a rain radar,

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Speaker 1: how are you meant to prepare anything?

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Speaker 3: And you can add flood mitigation to the y S two.

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Speaker 3: In our springs, we've had no new flood mitigation initiatives

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Speaker 3: for over a decade, so these things are just put

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Speaker 3: on the boiler because they don't happen frequently. This is

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Speaker 3: a one in thirty year floodp and you tend to

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Speaker 3: procrastinate and think, yes, we'll get around to it. But

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Speaker 3: I'm just thinking as I'm listening. In other parts of

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Speaker 3: the world, they still use the good old sirens. They

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Speaker 3: drive around the streets with a siren if there's some

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Speaker 3: disaster immin it. I mean, that's an option. But the

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Speaker 3: reality is the further you move out of a center

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Speaker 3: like Darwin or our Springs, the more remote you are,

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Speaker 3: the less you get of anything, let alone communication. These

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Speaker 3: old people were they do they have a mobile phone?

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Speaker 3: Are they used to texting. Yeah, all those factors have

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Speaker 3: to be taken into account.

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Speaker 1: And that's I think the point that is really worth

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Speaker 1: making is that not everybody gets their information from me

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Speaker 1: or from you know, the ABC, or from the NT

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Speaker 1: news or you know, from a press release that goes

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Speaker 1: up on the secure NT website or on their Facebook page.

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Speaker 1: So I guess all bases need to be covered when

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Speaker 1: you're talking about an emergency.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely. I think you know, the most reliable source to

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Speaker 5: get information out, Katie is what people older people call

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Speaker 5: the wireless, you know, the airwaves. I mean, that's you

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Speaker 5: can rely on that. And I think the only real

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Speaker 5: criticism that I've had to the government is, you know,

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Speaker 5: particularly when we're talking about the remote settings, is use

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Speaker 5: Aboriginal media to communicate it in the language, because it's

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Speaker 5: sometimes the fifth language group.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 5: Like I mean, when you drive through the territory, you

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Speaker 5: see these signs saying this is the frequency you can

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Speaker 5: tune into to hear an emergency message. So I think, yeah,

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Speaker 5: how do we move forward that. I'm really keen to

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Speaker 5: see some form of inquiry or process in which people

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Speaker 5: can put their submissions in so we can hear what

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Speaker 5: they felt worked and what didn't So is.

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Speaker 1: That something Josh, that the government might look at, whether

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Speaker 1: there could be you know, whether it is something that

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Speaker 1: might go to the Public Accounts Committee for a of you.

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Speaker 4: Actually, I feel like that's a pretty sensible sort of suggestion.

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Speaker 2: I think there's a number of things you've raised this morning,

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Speaker 2: Katie the Buereer of Meteorology. Absolutely, in regards to Tenant Creek,

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Speaker 2: the radar has been an absolute joke. I've been talking

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Speaker 2: about that since I was a Senate candidate for years,

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Speaker 2: years and years and years.

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Speaker 3: Place to twenty years.

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Speaker 2: They had a site located, they got nearly for the

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Speaker 2: wrong site. I've heard this week from the Bureau of

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Speaker 2: Meteorology who's managing it, that they're just going to go

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Speaker 2: back to the airport because that's locked in and just

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Speaker 2: get it done. Happy days. As far as I'm concerned,

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Speaker 2: we just need a rain radar in the Barkley so

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Speaker 2: that we can actually see what's happening. In regards to

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Speaker 2: flood mitigation, aalyis absolutely sat there on the table for

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Speaker 2: eight years. In the last twelve months there's been a

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Speaker 2: million there's been a million bucks spent, and that was

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Speaker 2: now going to start rolling out because this is the reality.

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Speaker 2: I had to go out get up pertificates and all

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Speaker 2: the rest of it. So we've done the work so

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Speaker 2: it can happen.

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Speaker 5: The money for the Catherine Water levee the north.

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Speaker 2: No, no, no, this is the other part of this.

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Speaker 2: This is really important in regards to Catherine. We saw

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Speaker 2: the levee. We saw the levee that worked until it didn't.

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Speaker 2: And that is the harsh reality is that even in

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Speaker 2: our springs there have been proposals to put banks along

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Speaker 2: the river so we can reduce the flooding. But it's about,

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Speaker 2: you know, how does that then look for our community

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Speaker 2: and all the rest of it. So we'll absolutely look

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Speaker 2: into the future about the flood mitigation, what we can

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Speaker 2: do into the future to mitigate against some of these things.

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Speaker 2: There will always be events that are just unprecedented that unfortunately,

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Speaker 2: you can have as much mitigation as you want, it's

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Speaker 2: going to flood over.

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Speaker 5: I think the one thing I think we can't lose

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Speaker 5: sight of as well, and that is our amazing pastoral community.

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Speaker 5: With these floods, they've potentially lost agricultural crops that are

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Speaker 5: going to have a significant impact on their bottom line

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Speaker 5: and their livelihoods. So yep, we've got to get in.

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Speaker 5: We've got to do the repair. We've got to get

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Speaker 5: people back to country. We've got to get people back

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Speaker 5: into their homes and patron and Darwin, but we've got

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Speaker 5: to do work for the pastoral community because they're potentially

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Speaker 5: going to have a hard season when they've lost crops.

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Speaker 1: So a review, I mean, do we need to have

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Speaker 1: a review into the communication and like there's so many

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Speaker 1: different facets here, and I get it right, like after

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Speaker 1: a flood or a cyclone or a weather event, it's

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Speaker 1: not that sexy to be spending money on it, you know,

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Speaker 1: when you're coming into a political campaign, understand that. But

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Speaker 1: we do need to make sure that we're planning for

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Speaker 1: the future. And don't even get me started then about

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Speaker 1: our highways and making sure that their future proofed as well,

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Speaker 1: because that's another bit.

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Speaker 2: At the end of anything an issue emergency management situation,

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Speaker 2: there will be reviews about what worked more times, and

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Speaker 2: I think that's really important to let the experts who

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Speaker 2: have literally been dealing with this twenty four to seven

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Speaker 2: over the last month, to look back at what worked

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Speaker 2: well and what they could have done better.

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Speaker 5: I'm not disagreeing. I'm not disagreeing that the Public Service

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Speaker 5: will do their review. And yes, they are experts, but

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Speaker 5: the community are experts as well because they've lived through it,

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Speaker 5: they've had experiences. They can give us insight that no

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Speaker 5: one else can give us. And look, I'm really hoping that,

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Speaker 5: you know I'm saying right now, I'll be on that

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Speaker 5: committee because I think we need a bipartisan approach to

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Speaker 5: this issue. And this is more about planning for the future,

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Speaker 5: around communication, around infrastructure. I mean, Robin and I are

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Speaker 5: going to pull our hair out right now, but you know,

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Speaker 5: Catherine Hospital is built on the bank of a river

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Speaker 5: at floods all the time. We want Alice Springs new

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Speaker 5: hospital and we want to die on new hospital, but

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Speaker 5: the reality is Catherine puts people at risk every time

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Speaker 5: that river is going to rise. So you know, I

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Speaker 5: think we need a committee or an inquiry to be

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Speaker 5: stood up to hear directly from Territorians because they are

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Speaker 5: the experts. They have the lived Dick spirit.

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Speaker 4: Well, look we've just got a message from Rob now.

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Speaker 4: Rob said, good morning, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Everyone should be warned on disaster matters by SMS. I

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Speaker 1: always get SMS from Telstra if there's an interruption to services.

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Speaker 1: It's a very good point, right and I actually I

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Speaker 1: know it's not going to solve everything. I'm not suggesting

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Speaker 1: that it will, but I just think if there is

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Speaker 1: you know, if there is an alert, if it can

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Speaker 1: go out, if we're concerned about flash flooding, you know,

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Speaker 1: for the people of you know, the daily I know

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Speaker 1: that the large majority have been evacuated, for the people

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Speaker 1: of Darwin River, you know, the situation that they lived

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Speaker 1: through earlier in the week, if there was a message

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Speaker 1: that went out that said you need to be aware

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Speaker 1: that this is happening. I know that the normal channels

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Speaker 1: have obviously, you know, been gone, like the authorities have

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Speaker 1: gone through those. But if there is that second tier

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Speaker 1: that we're able to implement, I do think it would

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Speaker 1: make a difference, no brainer. Yeah, let's take a bit

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Speaker 1: of a break. There's a lot on the agenda this morning,

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Speaker 1: and it's not just the weather. There's plenty happening in

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Speaker 1: Parlia as well. You are listening to Mix one oh

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Speaker 1: four nines, three sixtyties the week that was. You are

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Speaker 1: listening to Mix one oh four nines three sixty eighties

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Speaker 1: the week that was. Now, if you've just joined us

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Speaker 1: in the studio today we've got Josh Burgoyne, Robin Lamley

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Speaker 1: and Chancey Paig. Now, it has been a busy week.

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Speaker 1: It's been a busy week of course with all of

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Speaker 1: the emergency concerns that we've had around flooding, but it's

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Speaker 1: also been a busy week of parliament.

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Speaker 5: Now.

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Speaker 1: Earlier in the week, the Independent Member for Johnston, Justine Davis,

438
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Speaker 1: joined us on the show after moving a motion in

439
00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:37,600
Speaker 1: the Northern Territory Legislative Assembly calling for stronger standards of

440
00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:41,800
Speaker 1: behavior in parliament. The Member for Johnson pushing for amendments

441
00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:45,159
Speaker 1: to the existing Members Code of Conduct to introduce a

442
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:49,520
Speaker 1: clearer behavior code for MPs. The motion will it note

443
00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:54,240
Speaker 1: at the importance of safe, respectful and professional parliamentary workplaces

444
00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:59,000
Speaker 1: and stated that bullying, harassment, discrimination and intimidation have no

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00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:02,199
Speaker 1: place in the terror trees Parliament. Now I know that

446
00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:05,480
Speaker 1: well as I understand it's some parts of this past,

447
00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:10,119
Speaker 1: but with some big amendments, I mean, do we need

448
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:13,919
Speaker 1: to expect higher standards from our politicians in parliament? You know,

449
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:17,200
Speaker 1: I think for most of us we've been either watching

450
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:21,040
Speaker 1: or part of the Northern Territory Parliament for a long time, Robin.

451
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:23,040
Speaker 4: You've been in there for how long.

452
00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:25,840
Speaker 3: Now, onmost sixteen years?

453
00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:27,960
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you what over those sixteen years, I

454
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:30,960
Speaker 1: don't know about you, but I've seen some very memorable things.

455
00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:31,199
Speaker 4: You know.

456
00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:34,639
Speaker 3: Well, ironically, I think things have improved. Do you know

457
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,479
Speaker 3: what when I first began. When I first began in

458
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:41,760
Speaker 3: twenty ten, the standards were pretty damn low levels of

459
00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:46,640
Speaker 3: aggression and what you might call bullying behavior. It's pretty outrageous.

460
00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,760
Speaker 3: So I've probably got a fairly broad mind when it

461
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:51,440
Speaker 3: comes to this.

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00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,440
Speaker 1: I think I do as well, and I can certainly remember,

463
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,680
Speaker 1: you know, like, there's a lot of things that stand

464
00:21:57,720 --> 00:21:59,680
Speaker 1: out in my mind that I've seen over the years.

465
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:04,359
Speaker 1: And you know, I, while yes, there's maybe been some

466
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:09,320
Speaker 1: you know, some discussion or debate in recent years that

467
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 1: might not be everybody's cup of tea, I tend to

468
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 1: agree with you. It's not the worst that I've seen

469
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:15,800
Speaker 1: over the last twenty years.

470
00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:20,600
Speaker 3: There's no place for bullying and intimidation in any work context,

471
00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:25,480
Speaker 3: including the chamber, the parliamentary chamber. But I still think

472
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 3: we need to be dramatic. It's a theater. We need

473
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 3: to acknowledge that the whole scenario is about conflict. People

474
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:36,240
Speaker 3: coming in representing all different groups of people from around

475
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:42,119
Speaker 3: the territory, having different views, knocking heads, being spirited, yelling.

476
00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:44,560
Speaker 3: I don't mind volume. I mean some member I know,

477
00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,280
Speaker 3: the member for Johnston doesn't like people yelling. Doesn't bother

478
00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:50,239
Speaker 3: me at all. I think, yell if you want, if

479
00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 3: you're feeling that angry or passionate or disturbed by something,

480
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:59,280
Speaker 3: use your voice. I've always taught my kids. If you're scared, yell,

481
00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:01,480
Speaker 3: If you're angry, yell. We live out in the bush.

482
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:03,960
Speaker 3: No one gives a toss what the Lamleys are doing.

483
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,840
Speaker 3: But I sort of think, let's not kind of homogenize

484
00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:12,720
Speaker 3: it all. Let's not make it vanilla and a sort

485
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:16,760
Speaker 3: of spiritual sort of committee meeting experience, because it's not.

486
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:20,000
Speaker 3: It's not what people look for the conflict. They look

487
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:24,919
Speaker 3: for things to be resolved in a very energetic manner,

488
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 3: and I would hate to lose that. But I will

489
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:32,120
Speaker 3: say it has to be orderly. It can't be disorderly,

490
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:36,199
Speaker 3: and it can't be intimidating or bullying. But let's not

491
00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:40,640
Speaker 3: kind of rinse it all down to being best friends

492
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:41,680
Speaker 3: in singing kumbaya.

493
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:46,120
Speaker 5: Well, you know, I think Robin Lamley is now the

494
00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:49,359
Speaker 5: Mother of the House and no one messes with Mummy no,

495
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 5: so we follow her instructions very clearly. But look, I

496
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:57,879
Speaker 5: think you know, Justine, the Member for Johnson, brought forward emotion.

497
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:00,440
Speaker 5: Josh can talk a bit about it in the moment

498
00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,439
Speaker 5: why they changed the motion. I didn't think it was

499
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 5: necessary to change the motion. I thought it was clear,

500
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 5: it highlighted, you know, just reminding people that we all

501
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 5: do need to do better. I agree with Robin a

502
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 5: bit of theater. I mean, I love the little bit,

503
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:18,159
Speaker 5: so you know, I love a bit of theater and

504
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 5: I think that that is fine amongst members of Parliament

505
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 5: to do that to one another. I do think that

506
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:27,159
Speaker 5: Justine's motion was broader than that. It was reminding people

507
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 5: that we have an obligation, yeah, to be responsible and respectful.

508
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,400
Speaker 5: And you know, I think the CLP shut that motion

509
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:38,359
Speaker 5: down because they are still so terrified to talk about

510
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 5: the Member for Fong Lim and his conduct and the

511
00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:44,680
Speaker 5: allegations of bullying against him. That's essentially why I think

512
00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:47,359
Speaker 5: the CLP shut the motion down, because there's no other reason.

513
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 4: Why is that what happened?

514
00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, Katie, This one HiT's pretty pretty hard home for me.

515
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 2: So everyone deserves to work in a safe and respectful

516
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:57,919
Speaker 2: professional environment. And I was a brand new member to

517
00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,240
Speaker 2: Parliament when at nine to twenty one night I was

518
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 2: walking home after dropping off my laundry and someone tried

519
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 2: to intimidate me outside Parliament House, swear at me, try

520
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:09,360
Speaker 2: to impact on the things that I'd said in Parliament

521
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:11,640
Speaker 2: that day. And I tell you what, that's still now,

522
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 2: even hearing members of Labor talk about how everyone should

523
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,000
Speaker 2: feel safe in their environment and all the rest of it,

524
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 2: it still impacts me now because I go to work

525
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:22,280
Speaker 2: every day and I see a blake right across the

526
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:24,880
Speaker 2: chamber that tried to intimidate me at nine to twenty

527
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:26,399
Speaker 2: at night. Now, what right did you have to do

528
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,120
Speaker 2: that to me? This motion that a Member for Johnson's

529
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 2: brought in absolutely the Speaker, Robin Lamley spoken about this today.

530
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:38,119
Speaker 2: For the most part, the Parliament is a respectful workplace. Right.

531
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,439
Speaker 2: It's a contest of ideals. A lot of the stuff

532
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 2: that was contained in her motion is already there. If

533
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:47,760
Speaker 2: the Member for Johnson feels that something isn't coming, she

534
00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,879
Speaker 2: can move a substantial motion. She has a number of

535
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 2: things that she can to deal with that, because because

536
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:55,840
Speaker 2: we believe this is the right way to deal with

537
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 2: it in the future. And again, this is what it's important.

538
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,280
Speaker 2: If anyone feels as though something has seriously happened, there

539
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:03,879
Speaker 2: are a number of things that they can do to

540
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:05,680
Speaker 2: deal with it. And I think that's the important thing.

541
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 2: And there's something I've learned over my period of time.

542
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,520
Speaker 2: You know, I've gone to the Speaker, I've gone to

543
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,879
Speaker 2: the Clerk of the Assembly and actually sought advice on

544
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:15,840
Speaker 2: the best way to deal with things when you don't

545
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 2: feel like your workplace is safe. And there's a number

546
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 2: of things that are available to members if they feel

547
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:21,920
Speaker 2: that way.

548
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 1: And look, that is a terrible way to feel and

549
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,240
Speaker 1: nobody should feel like that at work. I don't think

550
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 1: that that is appropriate in any way, you know, And

551
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:34,040
Speaker 1: there's no doubt like it's a difficult environment, I think

552
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:36,400
Speaker 1: in a lot of ways for you guys in Parliament

553
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 1: and what some people might find sort of fun and theater,

554
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 1: others may be quite offended by. And I guess that

555
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:44,199
Speaker 1: depends on different people.

556
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,880
Speaker 5: Anyone who runs for office knows what happens in parliament

557
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 5: because you don't just decide I'm going to run for office,

558
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 5: and you have no idea how Parliament works or what

559
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 5: goes on. So you know that there is sometimes behaviors

560
00:26:56,080 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 5: of a heightened level. That's clear as day. I think,

561
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:04,680
Speaker 5: let's be clear this ELP, you know, amended the Member

562
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 5: for Johnson's motion and basically removed the second half of it.

563
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:12,919
Speaker 5: They also shut down a standing motion to move the

564
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 5: Member for fun them to privileges for a thorough investigation

565
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 5: around his alleged conduct.

566
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 1: Now that I find really interesting, and I know that

567
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,120
Speaker 1: certainly according to a report by the ABC that Will

568
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 1: that government backbencher accused of bullying has faced that bid

569
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:32,439
Speaker 1: for parliamentary inquiry into his alleged conduct. Will that bid

570
00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 1: it's not going ahead. But he did cop quite the

571
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,920
Speaker 1: berating from you, Robin Or certainly, I would say a

572
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:46,440
Speaker 1: putting in his place. You answered a question inside parliament

573
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: and you had previously said that these allegations were of

574
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:55,879
Speaker 1: a very serious nature. And in parliament, well you urged

575
00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 1: him to apologize to the staffers and withdraw his legal threats.

576
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:01,400
Speaker 1: Now you'd said the same thing to me in terms

577
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:04,480
Speaker 1: of urging him or asking him to apologize on air,

578
00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 1: with me then saying, you know, you urged him.

579
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 4: To withdraw his legal threats.

580
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:11,280
Speaker 1: I did think it was a little bit odd when

581
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,800
Speaker 1: that statement came out, and we've asked him on numerous

582
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 1: occasions to come on the show. I have always provided

583
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 1: that opportunity to the Member for Fong Limb, and whether

584
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 1: it's on other issues relating to voluntary assisted dying, the

585
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 1: you know, the committee that he was on or anything else,

586
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,679
Speaker 1: always you know, had a very sort of you know,

587
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:34,880
Speaker 1: a very open studio policy in terms of he can

588
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 1: come in and have a chat about anything. So I

589
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:39,760
Speaker 1: was sort of surprised that he didn't take up that

590
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: opportunity to come on the show as well. When these

591
00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 1: allegations have been aired.

592
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 3: Katie, there's a few different issues here. The matter involving

593
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 3: the Member for Fong Limb didn't happen in the chamber,

594
00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 3: so it's not about a code of conduct in the chamber.

595
00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 3: In fact, the Member for Fong Limb is very well

596
00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 3: behaved in the Chamber and has never bullied or intimidated

597
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 3: anyone in that forum. But it is a peculiar situation

598
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 3: where I wear a number of hats as a speaker.

599
00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:15,560
Speaker 3: I look after the Department of Legislative Assembly and the staff.

600
00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 3: I also look after what happens inside the chamber and

601
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 3: in the whole Parliament House precinct. So I was asked

602
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 3: this random question from the opposition about the matter of

603
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 3: concerning the Member for Fong Limb, and I use that

604
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 3: as an opportunity to wear both hats, and that was

605
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 3: to say, not instruct him, not to make him do anything,

606
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 3: but suggest that he put aside his intention apparent intention

607
00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 3: to litigate, to sue someone for their commentary around this issue,

608
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:52,880
Speaker 3: and simply apologize, which I think is very is a

609
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 3: small ask given what has transpired.

610
00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 5: Ok, I'm really again interested. We are weeks, if not

611
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:06,720
Speaker 5: months now into these allegations surfacing. We have not had

612
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 5: the member himself confirm or deny whether these allegations are

613
00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:15,640
Speaker 5: true or not. And you know, Katie, it's poor form

614
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 5: when you put out a statement that doesn't really address

615
00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 5: the issue on International Women's Day is just disgraceful. And

616
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:25,760
Speaker 5: I think you know, we can't afford to see members

617
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:29,400
Speaker 5: of Parliament, you know, hiding in corners and refusing to

618
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,200
Speaker 5: talk to media about any subject. At some point you

619
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 5: have to stand up and face the music and at

620
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 5: some point you have to clearly say whether it did

621
00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:40,239
Speaker 5: or didn't happen, not just for yourself but for your

622
00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 5: own teammates, because as long as the member for fong

623
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 5: Limb is silent, his cabinet colleagues are going to have

624
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,320
Speaker 5: to carry the burden of people asking like they're going

625
00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 5: to be asking, Josh, do you know if this is

626
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 5: true or not?

627
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: And Josh, I mean, I know you spoke a moment

628
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:56,040
Speaker 1: ago about the situation that you'd been involved in where

629
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 1: you certainly felt intimidated and you felt as though you

630
00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 1: know it was she would say, you know, a former

631
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:06,920
Speaker 1: bullying that person as I understand it, apologize.

632
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 4: Was that correct?

633
00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 5: That was?

634
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 2: That was through the then minister Selena Ruber, who actually

635
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,200
Speaker 2: came out and read out an apology. I've never had

636
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 2: a form I think, yeah, right, focusing on focusing on

637
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:20,720
Speaker 2: the member for fong lim because I don't want to

638
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:21,520
Speaker 2: make this about me.

639
00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 3: Josh, you have made it about yourself.

640
00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:26,960
Speaker 2: What I have said is your experience, that is my experience.

641
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 2: Really difficult to stand that way. I find it really

642
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:33,920
Speaker 2: hard to stand here and listen to Selena Ubo and

643
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:36,640
Speaker 2: Darren Young talk about people having the right to feel

644
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 2: safe in their own work environment. When that when that

645
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 2: all happened, that's what I'm referencing. So in regards to

646
00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 2: the Member for Fong Lim this was something that happened

647
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 2: in the committee. I'm not a part of that committee.

648
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 2: I don't believe anyone here is on that committee. Are

649
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 2: we No, No, So we don't know what happened in

650
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 2: that way.

651
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 3: I know what happened because I was involved in speaking.

652
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:55,240
Speaker 3: I know exactly.

653
00:31:55,480 --> 00:32:00,200
Speaker 5: Step back. Parliament is a workplace. Staff go there to

654
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:04,760
Speaker 5: work free from alleged bullying and swearing and mispropriate conduct.

655
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:08,320
Speaker 5: We are members of the Legislative Assembly. We interact daily

656
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:11,720
Speaker 5: with staff in that agency. When people say that they

657
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,960
Speaker 5: don't feel comfortable and there's alleged issue, we all have

658
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 5: a responsibility to make sure that action is taken. And

659
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 5: I respect that the Speaker has done her part. I'm

660
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 5: asking the question to the Member for fong limb, which

661
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 5: is getting radio silence? Is it or isn't it true?

662
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:29,920
Speaker 5: Because the longer you are quiet, the more you are

663
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 5: putting yourself in a corner. And as we know, fear

664
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:37,520
Speaker 5: breeds fear. People will just start labeling that individual and

665
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 5: he has an opportunity to come out, correct the record

666
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:41,880
Speaker 5: and say what really happened. It's not that hard.

667
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,400
Speaker 2: Has this not now been politicized where we don't know

668
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:46,720
Speaker 2: what's actually happened, whether the staff's come for, whether the

669
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:47,960
Speaker 2: matter has been with the.

670
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,280
Speaker 5: Member can stand up, man up and say whether it

671
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 5: did or didn't happen.

672
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 3: Easy for it's enough on the public record that was

673
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 3: provided by someone, leaked by someone.

674
00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 4: To the ABC, to Matt Garrick to confirm that.

675
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 3: There has been an incident and that's been confirmed.

676
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 1: Look, we might take a bit of a break because

677
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 1: there is plenty of other things to discuss this morning,

678
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 1: including this threatened industrial action, will industrial action by correctional officers,

679
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 1: as well as those fuel prices and plenty more. You

680
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 1: are listening to Mix one O four nine's three sixty

681
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:21,960
Speaker 1: if if you have just joined us in the studio, Chancey, Paike,

682
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:25,760
Speaker 1: Robin Lamley and Josh Burgoyne. Now, just a really quick

683
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: call out from the Catherine Mayor Joanna Holden. She wanted

684
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 1: us to just let people know to call out for

685
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 1: volunteers in Catherine. Ben Hockey is short on people and

686
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:40,120
Speaker 1: with the water dropping significantly, those impacted the hardest people

687
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 1: can finally get in there and start cleaning up. So

688
00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 1: if you're in Catherine and can lend a hand, please

689
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 1: jump on the Facebook page and look for Ben Hockey

690
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 1: on the Everything Catherine facebook page. He's details of the

691
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,680
Speaker 1: they're doing shifts from nine until twelve thirty and one

692
00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:58,440
Speaker 1: until four. Or you can just rock up to the

693
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:02,040
Speaker 1: NLC office from one pm today. So that call out

694
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,080
Speaker 1: there for Catherine residents to help with the flooding clean

695
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 1: up and those impacted the hardest.

696
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,319
Speaker 5: That's the territory we know and love exactly how volunteers

697
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 5: and I'm sure bullies will come far.

698
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: And will I'll end up with a heap of people there,

699
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:16,879
Speaker 1: I hope. So anyway, hey, I want to talk about corrections.

700
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 1: We know that the Northern Territory Department of Corrections has

701
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 1: received a formal notice from the United Workers Union of

702
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:26,240
Speaker 1: a twelve hour work stoppage at correctional facilities in Alice Springs.

703
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 1: Now it comes after the Office of the Commissioner for

704
00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:33,360
Speaker 1: Public Employment released an improved enterprise offer to correctional officers

705
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 1: to replace the former agreement that expired in December last year. Now,

706
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:40,440
Speaker 1: this work stoppage is planned for Friday next week. It's

707
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:43,320
Speaker 1: going to force the Olla Springs prison into full lockdown

708
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 1: and significantly disrupt essential correctional services. Now I want to say,

709
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:51,239
Speaker 1: I've got no issue with the workers having the right

710
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,520
Speaker 1: to strike or to have a work stoppage, but I

711
00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:57,719
Speaker 1: do not think that this is the right time. Basically,

712
00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:00,640
Speaker 1: the commissioner saying that twelve hours strike at a prison

713
00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 1: is not a symbolic action. He said, it means a

714
00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:07,400
Speaker 1: full lockdown of conditions the night before through to Saturday,

715
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 1: which is going to see those prisoners confined to their cells.

716
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 1: But also he says, corrections is an essential service and

717
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:17,320
Speaker 1: when prison officers walk off the job, the entire system

718
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:21,719
Speaker 1: is forced into emergency role, into emergency mode. Now they're

719
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:26,040
Speaker 1: currently supporting Corrections, is currently supporting evacuation centers in Darwin,

720
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 1: and was planning to deploy community support work parties to

721
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,920
Speaker 1: assist flood affected communities in Catherine with a cleanup and

722
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 1: recovery effort this weekend, but that is now going to

723
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 1: be disrupted. Now, I would say, come on, Union, put

724
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:42,680
Speaker 1: it off for a little while, because now is not

725
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,120
Speaker 1: the right time. In my opinion, those you know, if

726
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 1: Corrections that they're not able to assist people that are

727
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:49,439
Speaker 1: in need.

728
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, Minister Melee touched on this during the week. I

729
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 2: thought he spoke very well. We completely respect the right

730
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 2: of union members to go on strike. Absolutely, it's sort

731
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:00,239
Speaker 2: of that timing now and Alice Springs is a that's

732
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 2: an example. I want to thank the correctional staff who

733
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 2: got out there with the prisoners. We're actually helping all

734
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:09,319
Speaker 2: Springstown Council clean up after our most recent floods. They've

735
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:11,799
Speaker 2: been doing an incredible job from what I understand up here,

736
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:14,839
Speaker 2: and Minister Malie is organizing for some of those staff

737
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 2: to head down to Catherine. So completely respect what's happening.

738
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,920
Speaker 2: There's a three percent annual increase over four years on

739
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 2: the table there.

740
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:24,719
Speaker 3: What does that look like in total? Like? What will

741
00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:26,759
Speaker 3: that cost? A three percent increase? Do you know?

742
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 2: No, I don't off the top of your head, but

743
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 2: I guess that's the thing. It's whenever we're looking across

744
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:35,359
Speaker 2: the government we have everyone knows like we've got ten

745
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:37,479
Speaker 2: twelve billion dollars worth of debt that have been left.

746
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 2: We're trying to make the budget books balance and absolutely

747
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:45,200
Speaker 2: we respect and appreciate all all the public servants that

748
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 2: are out there that keep the territory ticking. And what

749
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 2: we're trying to do is be able to off everyone

750
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 2: that pay rise whilst continue to ensure that we can

751
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 2: keep the lights on.

752
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:56,000
Speaker 1: They want six percent, an annual increase of six percent.

753
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:57,759
Speaker 4: I don't know if we can afford it.

754
00:36:57,960 --> 00:36:59,960
Speaker 3: No, it's a bit march, but you know you've got

755
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:04,800
Speaker 3: way it up, as you say, twelve hours of helping

756
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:11,160
Speaker 3: out all the communities. Maybe maybe there's an argument negotiate, like.

757
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 5: Let's bring it back a step. I mean, I've been

758
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:17,399
Speaker 5: the corrections minister. I've worked you know in the kind

759
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:20,200
Speaker 5: of area of the public service, and I've you know,

760
00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 5: I've done that, and I'm a proud union member. I

761
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:26,799
Speaker 5: think you know there's still time. There's still time to

762
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:30,319
Speaker 5: resolve this. The government has the ability to resolve.

763
00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:32,440
Speaker 4: It, so you reckon resolve it before they go on striking.

764
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:34,759
Speaker 5: I think that the government could be getting in the

765
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:39,960
Speaker 5: room with the correctional officers, with the unions and working

766
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:44,320
Speaker 5: this through to a situation, whether it's a time, whether

767
00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:46,759
Speaker 5: it's getting an outcome, or whether it's coming up with

768
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,439
Speaker 5: an alternative position. The government should be meeting with them

769
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:54,360
Speaker 5: as a priority to work this through. Look, corrections officers,

770
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:58,160
Speaker 5: you know, they're amazing. They do hard work in a

771
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,720
Speaker 5: very hard environment. They're dealing with high pressures, intense loads.

772
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 5: They're dealing with some serious violent offenders. So you know,

773
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:09,600
Speaker 5: we've given six percent increases to other areas of the

774
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 5: public service. I think, you know, it would be remiss

775
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 5: of me not to say that this needs to be

776
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 5: looked at around what is fair and what is reasonable.

777
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:20,919
Speaker 5: But I just urged the government to you know, get

778
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:22,040
Speaker 5: in the room before the.

779
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:24,920
Speaker 1: Protector actually doing this on purpose, Like is the timing

780
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 1: of this on purpose throughout this flood emergency to really

781
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: try to force the government's hand.

782
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 5: Look, I think they have to give notification of when

783
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:34,839
Speaker 5: they're taking protected actions. So I couldn't comment because I'm

784
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 5: not in government. I don't know when that well, I

785
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 5: don't know when that notice has been given. But what

786
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:42,120
Speaker 5: I would say is the government could get in the

787
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 5: room today with the correctional workers and the unions and

788
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:47,640
Speaker 5: look at addressing this situation.

789
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:48,479
Speaker 4: It look like I.

790
00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:52,160
Speaker 1: Say, I think our correctional workers do a bloody tough job.

791
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,600
Speaker 1: No one's disputing that, and I fully respect their right

792
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,160
Speaker 1: to take industrial action. I just don't think that next

793
00:38:58,239 --> 00:38:59,879
Speaker 1: week is the right time. You know, when you've got

794
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,680
Speaker 1: people that have got you know, water inside their houses

795
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:06,360
Speaker 1: they're trying to clean up. If there's an opportunity to

796
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,719
Speaker 1: have some of those corrections, you know, whether it's whether

797
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,880
Speaker 1: it's prisoners or whether it's you know, other staff support

798
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,600
Speaker 1: staff able to get down and help some of those

799
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 1: homeowners that are going through this terrible situation in Catherine,

800
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 1: in Darwin River, in other locations, that should be a

801
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: priority for next week.

802
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:28,359
Speaker 3: The corrections officers have a very strong position here, don't they,

803
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 3: with the explosion of prisons throughout the Northern Territory. Yeah,

804
00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:34,720
Speaker 3: it's top four years. With what's happening with the flooding,

805
00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:36,400
Speaker 3: they're in a very strong position.

806
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,880
Speaker 5: So well, they does need to negotiate and you know,

807
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 5: we do need to look at what their current terms

808
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 5: and conditions and pay is because you know, when I

809
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,880
Speaker 5: was in government, before I was in government, and today,

810
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 5: we have an issue here in the territory around attracting

811
00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:57,000
Speaker 5: and retaining correctional workers. So we do need to come

812
00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 5: up with a renumeration package that actually keeps people in

813
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 5: because if we're going to have more people in prison,

814
00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 5: we're going to need more hard working correctional offices to

815
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:07,400
Speaker 5: do this. So you know again, Katie, just urge the

816
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:11,759
Speaker 5: government to get around the table, have these conversations, see

817
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 5: what we can come up with.

818
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 2: And from an end to your government standpoint, we will

819
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,839
Speaker 2: continue to negotiate constructively and make sure that we can

820
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 2: get everyone around the table to get the best outcome.

821
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:20,960
Speaker 1: Here. Let's take a very quick break. You are listening

822
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:23,040
Speaker 1: to Mix one oh four nine's three sixty. It is

823
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:25,640
Speaker 1: the week that was well. If you have just joined us,

824
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:30,000
Speaker 1: it's been a very busy hour in the studio Josh Burgoyne,

825
00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:33,799
Speaker 1: Robin Lamley and Chancey Paig. Now, before I let you

826
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:37,840
Speaker 1: all go, these petrol prices, they are top of everyone's

827
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:39,440
Speaker 1: mind at the moment, I just want to take you

828
00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:43,319
Speaker 1: through the terminal gate price today for Darwin and for

829
00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:46,480
Speaker 1: your unlettered it's sitting at two dollars fourteen point three.

830
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 1: It has jumped astronomically since Monday when it was at

831
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:53,560
Speaker 1: a dollar seventy nine point six. When you go across

832
00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 1: to your diesel at the terminal gate on Monday, it

833
00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:59,319
Speaker 1: was at two dollars four point five. It's now at

834
00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 1: two dollars five fifty three point six When you go

835
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 1: to the Bowser well for your diesel, the most expensive

836
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 1: you're going to pay in the Darwin area is two

837
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 1: dollars sixty three point eight. It's an obscene amount of money.

838
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:17,080
Speaker 1: Let's I can have a bit of a look at

839
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,120
Speaker 1: how it's tracking in central Australia. But you guys probably

840
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 1: have a better idea than me. Are you looking at

841
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:23,840
Speaker 1: it being more expensive?

842
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:27,279
Speaker 2: We've always two sixty it's always been pretty expensive. And

843
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:28,960
Speaker 2: I was looking the other day, Katie, because I've got

844
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:30,680
Speaker 2: to fill up the car when I get home, and yeah,

845
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:32,360
Speaker 2: it'll probably be a bit of a shock to the system.

846
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 2: So we've always dealt with higher fuel prices in remote

847
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,439
Speaker 2: areas and now I guess everyone's experiencing it due to

848
00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:40,160
Speaker 2: a number of factors. But it was good to see

849
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,400
Speaker 2: the treasure this week right at the A Triple C,

850
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:44,839
Speaker 2: right to all the fuel retailers and really remind them

851
00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:47,600
Speaker 2: that it is incumbent on you not to be gouging

852
00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:50,279
Speaker 2: at the fuel bowser, because we're not saying they are

853
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:53,080
Speaker 2: right now, but I can tell you what between what

854
00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 2: people are actually paying and what the price is at

855
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:58,799
Speaker 2: the actual import. It seems to be a little bit

856
00:41:58,840 --> 00:41:59,920
Speaker 2: unusual at can.

857
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:02,520
Speaker 5: People are taking the piece they are they are taking

858
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 5: the piece because we've not used up all of Australia's

859
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:08,200
Speaker 5: fuel reserves yet. So you know, I think there's a

860
00:42:08,200 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 5: real issue here. I mean people Yingio Guyula from Mulka

861
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:16,200
Speaker 5: said they're paying four dollars elite in ram and Guineas, Wow,

862
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 5: three dollars ninety five in Urkala. Out in my patch,

863
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 5: Doctor River, they're paying about three dollars twenty three dollars forty.

864
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:25,719
Speaker 5: So you know this is putting the strain on and

865
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:27,960
Speaker 5: for a lot of our mob, we're all central members

866
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,040
Speaker 5: on this panel today, we know that when those prices

867
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:33,160
Speaker 5: are high and people are getting paid below the poverty line,

868
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:35,800
Speaker 5: they tend to get stuck in Alice and they become

869
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,600
Speaker 5: displaced and then that puts strain on all the support

870
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 5: and infrastructure networks in Alice. So you know, we've got

871
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:45,239
Speaker 5: to have a fair income conversation about this. The a

872
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 5: Triple C has got a man up and step up

873
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:50,120
Speaker 5: and get on top of this prices. But you know,

874
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:52,399
Speaker 5: you know we've got a really look at it and.

875
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:54,799
Speaker 1: Also the other part of it, you know, isn't just

876
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:57,000
Speaker 1: for us and you and you know traveling around and

877
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:59,480
Speaker 1: our living expenses going up as a result of it

878
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: being more expensive at the bowser. But let's not forget

879
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 1: you know, if you've got if you've got those trying

880
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:06,600
Speaker 1: to export, you know, trying to get goods around to

881
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: other parts of the Northern Territory, parts in Australia, that's exactly.

882
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 5: Right, that expensive bloody stuffed into market or even you know,

883
00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:18,439
Speaker 5: build Josh and Robin and I we all know people

884
00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:21,799
Speaker 5: who have got pastor stations. They run on generators, so

885
00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:23,359
Speaker 5: lights go out quicker.

886
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:23,719
Speaker 4: It's going to be.

887
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,160
Speaker 3: But this is a national issue. It is not just

888
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:28,359
Speaker 3: for us, and I think this is the thin edge

889
00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:31,759
Speaker 3: of the wedge. I watched Federal Parliament question time yesterday

890
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:35,880
Speaker 3: and the messaging was very strained and very careful. But

891
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 3: I think we are in for a supply crisis, which

892
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:42,160
Speaker 3: means that the cost of fuel will probably increase. So

893
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:48,439
Speaker 3: get used to it. Minimize your travel, travel car vehicle.

894
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 5: Like I mean, I think Josh and I might have

895
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:53,120
Speaker 5: been Josh me and built like the video footage of

896
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:55,520
Speaker 5: people going to the pedro station and filling out a

897
00:43:55,560 --> 00:43:57,000
Speaker 5: bloody thousand.

898
00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:00,000
Speaker 3: Use has not changed. That's what they said in Federal Parliament.

899
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 3: The actual use of fuel hasn't changed, but the demand

900
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:05,400
Speaker 3: has doubled. People are stockpilot.

901
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:07,799
Speaker 4: Yeah no, please don't.

902
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:08,319
Speaker 5: Well look.

903
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:10,640
Speaker 1: Thank you all so very much for joining us in

904
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:13,600
Speaker 1: the studio this morning. Josh Burgoyne, Robin Lamley, Chancey Pig.

905
00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:14,400
Speaker 1: It's been a pleasure.

906
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:14,800
Speaker 4: Thank you.

907
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:15,320
Speaker 5: Thanks,