1
00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,679
Speaker 1: Jersey and Amanda gam Nation.

2
00:00:03,320 --> 00:00:07,240
Speaker 2: We know Tim Winton for some of our favorite books Breath, Cloud,

3
00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:10,840
Speaker 2: Street Music, to name just a few. While storytelling in

4
00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:13,920
Speaker 2: books is where we usually find his magic, this time

5
00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:16,759
Speaker 2: he has something different in store for us on the screen.

6
00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:21,799
Speaker 2: Ningolou in West Australia is a place Tim has visited,

7
00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:24,919
Speaker 2: he's loved, he's wept for, he's advocated for for over

8
00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:28,760
Speaker 2: thirty years, and through a documentary he's taking this place

9
00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:31,520
Speaker 2: to the world. He joins us now to chat about it. Tim.

10
00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:33,200
Speaker 3: Hello, oh hi.

11
00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:34,960
Speaker 1: And it's great to charge you.

12
00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:37,640
Speaker 4: I know that you don't like doing media interviews, so

13
00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:39,560
Speaker 4: it's taking you sometime to get to this point.

14
00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:41,440
Speaker 1: Where's real So it must be important.

15
00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:46,280
Speaker 3: Oh well, yeah, it is important. And you know it's

16
00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:50,880
Speaker 3: been a long journey to make this program and I'm

17
00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:52,400
Speaker 3: just glad I survived it, to be honest.

18
00:00:52,720 --> 00:00:55,600
Speaker 2: Well, some extraordinary things do happen to you on screen.

19
00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:57,600
Speaker 2: But first of all, for those of us that don't

20
00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:00,400
Speaker 2: know much about the region, tell us about it's so

21
00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:03,280
Speaker 2: special and why could be under threat?

22
00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:08,720
Speaker 3: Yeah. It's on the northwest coast of Western Australia, which

23
00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:16,280
Speaker 3: is usually better known for mining and an industrial activity.

24
00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:19,200
Speaker 3: But it's just it's the last sort of pristine part

25
00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:25,120
Speaker 3: of northern Australia, and it has three main ecosystems, Ningaloo

26
00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:28,880
Speaker 3: Reef which is a fringing coral reef, Cape Range which

27
00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:33,800
Speaker 3: is an arid mountain range, and Exmouth Gulf, which is

28
00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:38,240
Speaker 3: an enormous estuary about fifty times the size of Sydney Harbor.

29
00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:41,440
Speaker 3: It's a kind of really rare place in that it's

30
00:01:41,480 --> 00:01:46,960
Speaker 3: remote and pristine and its probably if I can describe

31
00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:48,800
Speaker 3: it this way, if you get in the water there,

32
00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:54,559
Speaker 3: you'll see more charismatic megafauna, big animals in one day

33
00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:57,800
Speaker 3: than you will anywhere else in the world, including the Serengeti.

34
00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:01,800
Speaker 3: The place is just because it's it's on the edge

35
00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:05,280
Speaker 3: the shortest part of Australia's continental shelf, so it's where

36
00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:08,320
Speaker 3: Australia hangs at the edge of the really really deep

37
00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:11,320
Speaker 3: water at the edge of the Abyss. So all these

38
00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:14,360
Speaker 3: animals are just coming in really really close to shore,

39
00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:17,040
Speaker 3: and you know, so you can be with a whale shark,

40
00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:19,960
Speaker 3: pop your head up and look at the desert and

41
00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:21,960
Speaker 3: you can see the beach and you won't see a

42
00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,679
Speaker 3: building with three hundred kilometers so it's a it's a

43
00:02:25,760 --> 00:02:28,119
Speaker 3: rare experience and that's why people come from all over

44
00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:29,600
Speaker 3: the world to visit it.

45
00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:32,280
Speaker 1: And the reef itself is fairwell off the coast, isn't it.

46
00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:36,760
Speaker 3: No, that's right, I'm sure. No, it's a great barrier

47
00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:39,280
Speaker 3: reef twenty nautical miles and you're going to go out

48
00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:41,360
Speaker 3: and a big tour and go out and see it.

49
00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:44,519
Speaker 3: At Ningaloo. You just walk off the beach, kneel down,

50
00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:46,240
Speaker 3: put your face in the water and you're in it.

51
00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:49,600
Speaker 3: And that's probably that's the glory of it, but it

52
00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:52,480
Speaker 3: also means it's fragile. It needs to be well managed.

53
00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:55,560
Speaker 2: When you said there's lots of big animals. What big

54
00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:56,720
Speaker 2: animals do you see?

55
00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:02,400
Speaker 3: Well, you see you hump back whales, workers whale sharks,

56
00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,679
Speaker 3: which is the biggest fish in the sea, manta rays,

57
00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:12,200
Speaker 3: four species of turtle, three species of dolphin, dewgongs. You know,

58
00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,360
Speaker 3: the list goes on and on, a huge sting rays.

59
00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:16,679
Speaker 3: You can swim with a tiger shark. If that's your thing,

60
00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:21,200
Speaker 3: it happens to be my thing. But it makes the

61
00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:23,000
Speaker 3: heart go pit a pat I can tell you, Yeah,

62
00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:25,280
Speaker 3: it's amazing.

63
00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:27,560
Speaker 4: How does that become a thing to swim and tiger

64
00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,080
Speaker 4: shots you do. You do it by accident to start with,

65
00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:32,359
Speaker 4: and then you go, oh this is cool.

66
00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:34,000
Speaker 3: Well you can you can do it. It's part of

67
00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:38,160
Speaker 3: a tour. It's it's it's a pretty lovely thing to

68
00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:40,320
Speaker 3: be in a shallow water lagoon where you know, the

69
00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:44,240
Speaker 3: world is turquoise and all the ripley bottom and the tigers,

70
00:03:44,320 --> 00:03:46,720
Speaker 3: you know, just a big mellow animals just waiting for

71
00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:48,320
Speaker 3: a sick turtle. You know, as long as you don't

72
00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:51,200
Speaker 3: look like a sick turtle. And you know, if you

73
00:03:51,240 --> 00:03:53,400
Speaker 3: haven't got a hangover and you' and you're not carrying

74
00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,120
Speaker 3: a really huge backpack, you're half a chance, you know.

75
00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:00,000
Speaker 3: They're just Yeah, there's just so many big, beautiful animal

76
00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:03,120
Speaker 3: that you can get up close to. And I think

77
00:04:03,160 --> 00:04:07,440
Speaker 3: it's good for humans to be in a pristine place

78
00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:12,440
Speaker 3: that's still intact and alive, because it reminds us what

79
00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:15,840
Speaker 3: the world is and has been. And the places like

80
00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:20,040
Speaker 3: Ningoloo are places that we've made smart decisions about, sometimes

81
00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:23,719
Speaker 3: tough and bold decisions about, in order to preserve them.

82
00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:26,440
Speaker 3: And it's a kind of a beacon of hope to

83
00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:31,120
Speaker 3: me that we can do this at other places and

84
00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:35,280
Speaker 3: save great ecosystems for our children's children. You know, I've

85
00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:39,440
Speaker 3: got four grandkids now. I want them and their kids

86
00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:42,479
Speaker 3: to be able to experience what I've had at Ningaloo

87
00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,520
Speaker 3: over thirty years, which is just bulk moments of joy.

88
00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:49,800
Speaker 3: You know, you come back to the beach, we climb

89
00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:53,000
Speaker 3: back into the boat, just talking gibberish because you can't

90
00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:54,159
Speaker 3: believe what you've just seen.

91
00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:57,360
Speaker 2: Oh, how brilliant. Tell us about the moment with tagging

92
00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:01,559
Speaker 2: the jugon, which was much harder. I imagine that sounds yeah.

93
00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:04,760
Speaker 3: I mean we were able to as part of the

94
00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:10,800
Speaker 3: Show Fund Science Expeditions, so to be able to participate

95
00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:14,760
Speaker 3: in new science and increase knowledge while we were while

96
00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:19,320
Speaker 3: we were shooting, which was great. So we helped the

97
00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:23,560
Speaker 3: first tagging expedition of Dugongs in Next Mouth Gulf. It's

98
00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:26,400
Speaker 3: a global sort of stronghold for them, and these are

99
00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:28,880
Speaker 3: you know, these are big animals. You know, they're four

100
00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:33,280
Speaker 3: hundred or four hundred and five hundred kilos, and you

101
00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,760
Speaker 3: know they're in these herds of hundreds, and you sort

102
00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,120
Speaker 3: of you have to kind of you know, it's a

103
00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:41,159
Speaker 3: little bit like you know, it's a little bit like

104
00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:44,039
Speaker 3: rounding out cattle. You pick one off the edge and

105
00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:46,920
Speaker 3: then you have to They swim pretty fast for a

106
00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:49,400
Speaker 3: mallow animal, and you jump off a jet ski onto it,

107
00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:52,400
Speaker 3: and then a whole team of scientists join you and

108
00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:54,800
Speaker 3: you're trying to hold the animal and you swim back

109
00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:56,680
Speaker 3: to the boat. You have to do it in very

110
00:05:56,680 --> 00:06:00,760
Speaker 3: shallow water. It'll drown you because everyone's wearing ash helmets,

111
00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:04,360
Speaker 3: because it's you know, it's a big, strong animal. It's

112
00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:07,400
Speaker 3: it's understandably trying to rub you off against the bottom

113
00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:10,000
Speaker 3: the way a horse will rub you off against a tree.

114
00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:14,960
Speaker 3: And then you get it into a sling, get it calm.

115
00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:17,159
Speaker 3: We sort of reassure it that you're not going to

116
00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:19,200
Speaker 3: eat it or do anything you know, weird to it,

117
00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:22,000
Speaker 3: although you actually do some weird things to it because

118
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:25,880
Speaker 3: you're you're kidnapping it for science, right, it feels like

119
00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:29,640
Speaker 3: it's been kidnapped by aliens, And sadly it does involve

120
00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:36,000
Speaker 3: the probe, so you have to sex it's DNA and

121
00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:38,960
Speaker 3: we put satellite tags on and do all this stuff.

122
00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:43,039
Speaker 3: But honestly, to hold a four hundred and fifty kilo

123
00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:47,800
Speaker 3: mammal in your arms, which is not normally illegal but

124
00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:50,560
Speaker 3: you know you're doing this under scientific permit. It's a

125
00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:53,680
Speaker 3: it's a pretty rare and amazing experience. And this animal

126
00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,200
Speaker 3: is just looking at you thinking, dude, you know all

127
00:06:56,200 --> 00:07:01,160
Speaker 3: I was doing was eating seagrass. What this about? Yeah?

128
00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,120
Speaker 1: The gets the hand out of my ba goes home

129
00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,040
Speaker 1: to the family. You won't believe the day I had today.

130
00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:11,040
Speaker 3: That's right, Marge, because they abducted me.

131
00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:14,920
Speaker 4: They took me, and the pro didn't in the old days,

132
00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:18,120
Speaker 4: the old sailors didn't. They think the jugongs were mermaids.

133
00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:21,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, and look they do have They're different to a

134
00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,720
Speaker 3: dolphin or a whale, you know, because they you know,

135
00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:28,400
Speaker 3: dolphins and wales have a single spiracle, a single blowhole.

136
00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:32,160
Speaker 3: These guys have two nostrils, a bit like Dino out

137
00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:35,840
Speaker 3: of the Flintstones, which is a generational obviously a generational

138
00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:40,080
Speaker 3: reference that half the listeners won't get. But they have

139
00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:41,880
Speaker 3: a face. I mean, it's a face that only a

140
00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:46,600
Speaker 3: mother would love, let's be honest, But they really do.

141
00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:49,080
Speaker 3: You know, you can feel where they used to have shoulders,

142
00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:51,560
Speaker 3: like I can. I guess if you're at sea for

143
00:07:51,640 --> 00:07:55,800
Speaker 3: two years and you know, unless you're the cabin boy,

144
00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:59,720
Speaker 3: you haven't had any action. You Yeah, you could probably

145
00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:02,720
Speaker 3: that these were these were mermaids, but.

146
00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:08,560
Speaker 2: You were you weren't tempted, tim No, put it this way.

147
00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:11,200
Speaker 3: They eat sea grass and you're right up in their face,

148
00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,160
Speaker 3: and they've they've got they've got sort of vegan breath,

149
00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:17,000
Speaker 3: you know, you know, fasting vegan breath that's just come

150
00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:21,920
Speaker 3: out of the gym. No, it wasn't, wasn't wasn't tempted.

151
00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,520
Speaker 1: You know, it's not for me. You'd rather swim in

152
00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:26,120
Speaker 1: a crevice.

153
00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,360
Speaker 3: Oh god, you know I've done some Yeah, I've done

154
00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,120
Speaker 3: some weird things for the show, you know, having to

155
00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:34,880
Speaker 3: having to go twenty meters underground.

156
00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:37,440
Speaker 1: To see that. I couldn't do that.

157
00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know I probably wouldn't have done it unless

158
00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:43,280
Speaker 3: I was made to do it, you know. Yeah. Look

159
00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:47,240
Speaker 3: it's you know, I had some exciting, exciting experiences. I

160
00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,199
Speaker 3: got to I got to hang off the front of

161
00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:54,800
Speaker 3: a whale shark, which is also illegal, and take parasites

162
00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:57,040
Speaker 3: off its lips as part of a part of a

163
00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,760
Speaker 3: scientific program. You can, you can. It's it's like it's

164
00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:04,880
Speaker 3: like hypnotizing a chicken if you pick the except it's

165
00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:09,520
Speaker 3: nineteen thousand killers animal. But yeah, scientists have found a

166
00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,600
Speaker 3: way of stopping the whale shark in the water by

167
00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,840
Speaker 3: picking parasites off its face and the thing just slows

168
00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:19,280
Speaker 3: down in the water. It's pushing your backwards. You know,

169
00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:20,920
Speaker 3: you've you've got to get in front of it and

170
00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:23,959
Speaker 3: scratch its face and it comes over all funny and

171
00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,040
Speaker 3: then it slows down and then it goes vertical pushes

172
00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:30,280
Speaker 3: you up to the surface, which is nice because you're

173
00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:33,400
Speaker 3: holding your breath and you're hoping that it will otherwise

174
00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:36,640
Speaker 3: you're going to you're going to drown. And it just

175
00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:40,080
Speaker 3: stops dead in the water and let's lets you clean

176
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:42,400
Speaker 3: it like the way the cleaner fish does. And then

177
00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:44,960
Speaker 3: the scientists come in and put their put all their

178
00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,640
Speaker 3: instruments on it and take take DNA, put the ultrasound

179
00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:52,000
Speaker 3: on it to check it to organs. Yeah, it's pretty wild.

180
00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:55,839
Speaker 3: I mean, otherwise you'd have to kill it to study it. No,

181
00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:59,679
Speaker 3: I mean half the population sort of disappeared in the

182
00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:02,960
Speaker 3: last seventy years. So they're they're in bad at Ningaloo.

183
00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:05,079
Speaker 3: That's it's a haven for them. As soon as they

184
00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:07,880
Speaker 3: leave the safety of the of the marine park, they're

185
00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:09,559
Speaker 3: in trouble. In the world's oceans.

186
00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:11,719
Speaker 1: What people still kill wold sharks.

187
00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know there's there's poor people in the Pacific,

188
00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:20,720
Speaker 3: in the Asian areas that will either kill it because

189
00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:22,960
Speaker 3: they're afraid of it or kill it because it's you know,

190
00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:27,480
Speaker 3: there's nineteen thousand kilos of meat. It'll be nineteen thousand

191
00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:30,079
Speaker 3: kilos of meat that's full of mercury. So I wouldn't

192
00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:34,080
Speaker 3: recommend it with your chips, but not everybody knows that.

193
00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:36,719
Speaker 3: And so you know, there's a lot of a lot

194
00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:39,640
Speaker 3: of animals that you know, have a haven and a

195
00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:43,760
Speaker 3: sanctuary at Ningaloo that are in trouble elsewhere just because

196
00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:47,200
Speaker 3: there aren't protections elsewhere. And you know, we're just trying

197
00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:51,000
Speaker 3: to get that story out about how precious these these

198
00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:54,280
Speaker 3: animals are. I mean, look, Ningo is a classic place

199
00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,080
Speaker 3: for recovery. When I was a kid, I lived in

200
00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:04,200
Speaker 3: the Australia's last whaling in Albany and in whaling only

201
00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:07,320
Speaker 3: stopped in Australia in nineteen seventy eight. I was eighteen

202
00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:10,680
Speaker 3: and at that time there were only three hundred humpback

203
00:11:10,720 --> 00:11:14,040
Speaker 3: whales left in the western population. So that's right on

204
00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:19,640
Speaker 3: the very brink of extinction because we made our government

205
00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:24,319
Speaker 3: stop whaling. All these years later, there are in our

206
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,439
Speaker 3: thirty or forty thousand humpback whales in the same population,

207
00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:32,839
Speaker 3: and it's just a great good news story. It's the

208
00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:37,360
Speaker 3: biggest conservation success story of my lifetime. And you can

209
00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:39,360
Speaker 3: go to Ningaloo and see them where they have their

210
00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:43,200
Speaker 3: babies and where they're resting in Exmouth Golf and it's

211
00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:45,840
Speaker 3: a you know, it's a wonderland. The problem is that

212
00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:51,520
Speaker 3: Ingoloo Reef and Cape Range, thanks to the work of

213
00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:56,280
Speaker 3: conservationists and scientists, was listed in twenty eleven on the

214
00:11:56,280 --> 00:12:01,080
Speaker 3: World Heritage List. Exmouth Golf was supposed to be part

215
00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:04,520
Speaker 3: of that listing, but it got well, there was political

216
00:12:04,559 --> 00:12:08,480
Speaker 3: interference and politics won out over the science. There were

217
00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:12,440
Speaker 3: some industrial interests at work, and that meant that the

218
00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,640
Speaker 3: golf got carved out of the World Heritage area. And

219
00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,520
Speaker 3: that means that the developer developers can still you know,

220
00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:26,040
Speaker 3: are still constantly trying to industrialize this incredible waterway, which

221
00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:30,160
Speaker 3: is you know, there's a Dugong stronghold and this you know,

222
00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:34,240
Speaker 3: the most significant back whale refuge in the country.

223
00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,880
Speaker 1: But you're bringing it to our attention to which is great,

224
00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:37,600
Speaker 1: is great.

225
00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:40,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, we're just you know, doing what we can to

226
00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:43,520
Speaker 3: to you know, to get people to take it seriously,

227
00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,120
Speaker 3: I mean thankfully. And then we've been working the past

228
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:49,720
Speaker 3: five years. The w A government is committed to making

229
00:12:50,480 --> 00:12:53,760
Speaker 3: the golf a marine park and we're trying to get

230
00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:59,560
Speaker 3: a federal environment minister to put the golf on the

231
00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:03,440
Speaker 3: a National Register of Heritage and that's a pathway to

232
00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:05,560
Speaker 3: get it back onto World Heritage and.

233
00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,319
Speaker 4: Surely tourism for it would be better than say mining

234
00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:10,240
Speaker 4: or whatever they do around it.

235
00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:12,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right, you know, it's you know, we're down

236
00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:16,120
Speaker 3: people drilling for oil or building deep water ports. There's

237
00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:17,800
Speaker 3: a mob he wanted to build a deep water port

238
00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:20,400
Speaker 3: right in the middle of the whale refuge, you know,

239
00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,760
Speaker 3: a kilometer long wharf that juts straight out, so you

240
00:13:23,760 --> 00:13:27,480
Speaker 3: can imagine the pile driving, the massive dredging, the intense

241
00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:32,719
Speaker 3: heavy shipping. That's just wrong place, you know. It's so Look,

242
00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:36,000
Speaker 3: I think people will see the sense of looking after

243
00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:39,760
Speaker 3: this place, and you know, the kind of the risks

244
00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:44,679
Speaker 3: involved in industrializing it just are irresponsible. And I think

245
00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:49,200
Speaker 3: a show like Ningoloo, you know, hopefully will help people

246
00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:52,760
Speaker 3: understand just how rich the place is, how fragile it is,

247
00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:55,040
Speaker 3: and what we've got to do to look after it.

248
00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:57,880
Speaker 2: Tim's interesting you're talking about the last whaling station. I'm

249
00:13:57,920 --> 00:13:59,760
Speaker 2: sixty one years old. And when I was a kid,

250
00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:01,480
Speaker 2: will you in Perth for two years and we went

251
00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:04,160
Speaker 2: I wasn't exactly sure where we were, but you've just

252
00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,360
Speaker 2: described where we went for a holiday and I saw

253
00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:09,679
Speaker 2: a whale being flensed and I've never gotten over it.

254
00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,199
Speaker 2: And I told people that I had a childhood memory

255
00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:14,240
Speaker 2: and no one believed me. But it would have been

256
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:15,400
Speaker 2: the very tail end of that.

257
00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:19,080
Speaker 3: Yep, Yeah, that's right. I mean, there's nothing quite like

258
00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:21,600
Speaker 3: seeing a sperm whale having its head sawn off with

259
00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:25,640
Speaker 3: a steam driven saw. You know, when I went to

260
00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:28,720
Speaker 3: high school there, I saw one live whale during my

261
00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:32,000
Speaker 3: whole high school years. And now you go to Ningaloo

262
00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:35,560
Speaker 3: and I can see fifty in the morning. Wow. But yeah, yeah,

263
00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:38,840
Speaker 3: that was a pretty amazing confronting experience. When you're a kid,

264
00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:40,720
Speaker 3: you know you would have been at the Frenchman Bay

265
00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:43,120
Speaker 3: whaling station. I bet you've still got the smell of

266
00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:43,680
Speaker 3: it in your head.

267
00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:46,000
Speaker 2: Just smell. I can still smell it. Other kids went

268
00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:47,720
Speaker 2: to Disneyland and that's where we went.

269
00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:50,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it was a tourist thing. And when

270
00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:52,040
Speaker 3: we used to we used to go out there and

271
00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:56,600
Speaker 3: watch the tourists throw up. You know, we were simple country.

272
00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:00,440
Speaker 1: You know, it's simple. That was different times.

273
00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:03,720
Speaker 3: Oh my god. Yeah, I mean it's just it was

274
00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:07,400
Speaker 3: just so Yeah. But I learned from that, you know

275
00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:10,800
Speaker 3: that these were really fundamental experiences for me. And they

276
00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:13,600
Speaker 3: made me interested in marine science. They made me interested

277
00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:16,080
Speaker 3: in them, in the in the in the natural world,

278
00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:19,960
Speaker 3: and they and they made me a defender of the environment.

279
00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:24,200
Speaker 3: You know, I love storytelling, and you know that's my caper.

280
00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:28,680
Speaker 3: I write books for a living, but I do this

281
00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:33,880
Speaker 3: other stuff in my in my other life, so that

282
00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:39,280
Speaker 3: so that our kids kids can can kind of revel

283
00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:41,640
Speaker 3: in the riches and the glory that we have here

284
00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:46,080
Speaker 3: in Australia. We've got so much diversity, so much richness,

285
00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:49,400
Speaker 3: and we take it for granted. And you know, we're

286
00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:53,040
Speaker 3: really at the risk running their risk now of passing

287
00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:57,240
Speaker 3: on to our children's children kind of an impoverished state.

288
00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:00,760
Speaker 3: You know, we're trading while insolvent in many distances, and

289
00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:05,200
Speaker 3: if we were a business in terms of our stewardship

290
00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:08,800
Speaker 3: of the natural world. You know, we'd be we'd be

291
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:10,640
Speaker 3: you know, we'd be in jail basically.

292
00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:13,720
Speaker 4: Well, maybe there's a book in a story of a

293
00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,400
Speaker 4: man and the love of a dugong And even though

294
00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:19,640
Speaker 4: she's a vegan, you can probably with terrible breath, yeah.

295
00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:24,880
Speaker 3: You can just imagine, you know, ill fated love.

296
00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:25,920
Speaker 1: Ill fated love.

297
00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:27,760
Speaker 3: Well, Tim, illegal.

298
00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:29,560
Speaker 1: Love, I think it would. I don't know what the

299
00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:31,960
Speaker 1: rule is on that. Well, it's mammals, you know.

300
00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:34,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, well there you go, and we are cousins.

301
00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:40,400
Speaker 3: But I'm sure there's a law against that. It's it's

302
00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:44,720
Speaker 3: platonic love. My love for the world is pretty passionate.

303
00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:47,440
Speaker 3: But yeah, it doesn't mean that it's not platonic.

304
00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:48,920
Speaker 2: I think you're protesting a bit too much.

305
00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:56,160
Speaker 4: There, you got me there, Just answer the questions, Tim Winton,

306
00:16:56,560 --> 00:16:57,040
Speaker 4: it's great.

307
00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:01,720
Speaker 1: Ningaloo is on right now.

308
00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,359
Speaker 4: It's streaming on the ABC and really it's such a

309
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:04,920
Speaker 4: great watch.

310
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:05,840
Speaker 1: Thank you for joining us.

311
00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:07,680
Speaker 3: Tim, God pleasure. Thanks for having me