WEBVTT - HOW TO NOT DIE ALONE - With Logan Ury 0:00:19.120 --> 0:00:22.279 Okay, guys, ever, welcome back to another episode of Life. 0:00:22.280 --> 0:00:24.480 I'm cut, I'm Brittany, and I'm Laura. 0:00:24.520 --> 0:00:26.400 And if you were listening to this and you were 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:28.440 from New South Wales, I don't need to tell you, 0:00:28.560 --> 0:00:32.160 but yesterday it was Freedom Day and I'm sure we're 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:34.400 all very, very excited. The reason why I say I'm 0:00:34.440 --> 0:00:36.800 sure is because britt and I are actually recording this 0:00:36.880 --> 0:00:40.120 on Sunday, so it's not quite Freedom Day yet. It's 0:00:40.159 --> 0:00:42.000 three hours away. It's nine o'clock. 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:44.720 And what are you going to do with your Freedom Day? 0:00:44.800 --> 0:00:45.080 Please? 0:00:45.120 --> 0:00:47.320 Because I know a lot of my friends, everyone on 0:00:47.360 --> 0:00:50.279 my gram hair friend's booked their hair appointments, their dinners, 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:53.000 they're socializing, They've got groups of friends they're meeting up with, 0:00:53.159 --> 0:00:54.760 like people are ready to rumble. 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:56.760 What are you doing to celebrate? 0:00:56.800 --> 0:00:59.120 I have two children, if you weren't aware of that, 0:00:59.640 --> 0:01:04.520 and we are doing absolutely nothing, which sounds ridiculous about 0:01:04.520 --> 0:01:07.040 how this moment today where I guess it kind of 0:01:07.080 --> 0:01:09.080 this whole Freedom Day thing just kind of crept up 0:01:09.120 --> 0:01:12.080 really quickly. It's been a long sixteen or fifteen. 0:01:11.720 --> 0:01:14.840 Weeks, it's been two years, but it really crept up, well, 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:15.880 it kind of crept up. 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:18.679 In that, like, I hadn't thought about organizing or booking 0:01:18.680 --> 0:01:22.319 anything in but I had this real moment of anxiety today. 0:01:22.360 --> 0:01:25.080 And I was partly because I was so happy and 0:01:25.120 --> 0:01:27.319 excited that things are going back to normal, But on 0:01:27.319 --> 0:01:30.119 the flip side of that, I was also like, holy shit, 0:01:30.200 --> 0:01:31.400 I have to socialize with people. 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:33.039 Things are going back to normal. 0:01:33.120 --> 0:01:36.720 And I guess I didn't really realize how much this 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:39.360 lockdown had affected me, and it kind of all came 0:01:39.440 --> 0:01:42.399 crashing down in one big fell swoop. So as much 0:01:42.400 --> 0:01:45.360 as there's so much excitement and happiness that I get 0:01:45.360 --> 0:01:47.640 to see and touch and be around my friends again, 0:01:48.240 --> 0:01:50.360 I also and Britt like, I mean, we were just 0:01:50.400 --> 0:01:53.000 talking about this, So for anyone who's listening, this is news, 0:01:53.040 --> 0:01:55.520 but for ITT's kind of you're well aware of this. 0:01:56.040 --> 0:02:00.200 Like I genuinely feel like I have social anxiety from 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:03.440 spending so little time around other people that even sometimes 0:02:03.520 --> 0:02:06.200 during this podcast, I have to really prep myself up 0:02:06.240 --> 0:02:08.400 at the moment to mentally be in a good space 0:02:08.960 --> 0:02:11.680 to be aware that this is going out to so 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:14.240 many people when in my day to day literally the 0:02:14.240 --> 0:02:16.680 only person I speak to is Matt. And then Brittan 0:02:16.720 --> 0:02:18.160 I podcast once or twice a week. 0:02:18.400 --> 0:02:18.880 It's wild. 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:20.680 Laura's like, I don't know how to speak to one 0:02:20.720 --> 0:02:22.400 and do like I just tried to do this podcasts 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:24.880 three times and I'm like talking through what's happening. 0:02:24.919 --> 0:02:25.760 I'm like, what are you feeling? 0:02:25.800 --> 0:02:27.639 She's like, I don't know how to speak to people anymore? 0:02:28.320 --> 0:02:29.520 Just what am I feeling? 0:02:29.639 --> 0:02:32.640 Anxiety like the rest of Australia. But I think I 0:02:32.680 --> 0:02:36.520 know that people are experiencing anxiety in prolific levels at 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:39.519 the moment. There's anxiety around getting in trouble for doing 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:41.760 the wrong thing, of being caught out for doing the 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:44.079 wrong thing. Even if you're doing the right thing, even 0:02:44.120 --> 0:02:47.240 if you're obeying all the rules, there's still this feeling 0:02:47.400 --> 0:02:50.120 of like you could get into trouble. And I guess 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:52.200 also on top of that, it's just, you know, feeling 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:54.520 like not being able to see your friends and missing 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:57.360 out in some really huge life events and zoom just 0:02:57.400 --> 0:02:59.240 doesn't cut at Brittany, I am ready for you to 0:02:59.280 --> 0:03:01.840 get back in my bedroom where we can record. 0:03:01.600 --> 0:03:02.400 Face to face. 0:03:02.680 --> 0:03:05.440 But from what I've seen everyone in my life and 0:03:05.480 --> 0:03:07.680 a lot of people on the GRAM, this feeling that 0:03:07.720 --> 0:03:11.560 you're having seems to be very normal. Anxiety is high 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:14.520 right now. People have gotten used to this change. 0:03:14.560 --> 0:03:14.680 Now. 0:03:14.680 --> 0:03:16.000 I'm not saying no one wants to go. 0:03:15.960 --> 0:03:18.639 Back to normal, because everyone does, but that doesn't mean 0:03:18.680 --> 0:03:21.239 it doesn't come with some reservations. People have gotten used 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:24.160 to this sort of semi introverted life, and a lot 0:03:24.200 --> 0:03:26.800 of people talking about the fact that they don't know 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:28.440 how to go back to normal. They don't know how 0:03:28.440 --> 0:03:31.120 to go back to being comfortable in public and having 0:03:31.120 --> 0:03:31.800 all these plans. 0:03:31.840 --> 0:03:34.119 So I think basically. 0:03:33.639 --> 0:03:37.440 Anything that anyone's feeling right now is okay, and it 0:03:37.560 --> 0:03:39.920 is valid, whether you're excited about it, whether you're nervous, 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:42.560 whether you're anxious. I think that that's all okay, and 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:46.240 everyone's going through the same wave of emotions. Let's hope 0:03:46.320 --> 0:03:48.560 that the other states are not far behind us. If 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:50.960 you are from Melbourne that is still in lockdown, please 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:52.760 hang in there and we hope you are coming to 0:03:52.800 --> 0:03:54.360 freedom day very very soon. 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:58.320 One big thing that we have received so many questions 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:02.160 and emails about is just people's dating anxieties getting back 0:04:02.160 --> 0:04:04.640 into the world and going dating again, and like if 0:04:04.680 --> 0:04:06.400 you're single, trying to get it back out there. 0:04:06.440 --> 0:04:07.160 And meet people. 0:04:07.600 --> 0:04:10.640 You become so familiar with what you do in your 0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:13.080 day to day that this feeling of life going back 0:04:13.120 --> 0:04:15.400 to normal and having to put yourself out there, especially 0:04:15.440 --> 0:04:19.320 for anyone who's listening who is a typical introvert, it's 0:04:19.360 --> 0:04:22.800 a really, really daunting time. As much as it's exciting 0:04:22.800 --> 0:04:25.920 and as much as so many people are absolutely thrilled, 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:28.240 I think that there's a big group of us as 0:04:28.240 --> 0:04:31.040 well who feel a little bit scared at the moment 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:32.800 that everything's changing back so quickly. 0:04:33.160 --> 0:04:36.279 And I think one thing on that sense, nothing rings 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:39.599 truer than talking about the anxiety of dating throughout COVID 0:04:39.800 --> 0:04:42.960 when you compare life to before COVID in COVID and 0:04:43.160 --> 0:04:45.520 to what's going to happen now after COVID. For sure, 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:48.920 the dating landscape has one hundred percent changed. I think 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:51.039 dating in COVID has some positives, and I think there's 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:53.039 a lot that we've learned from it. And one big 0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:55.000 thing I think people going to do, like, oh my god, 0:04:55.000 --> 0:04:56.479 people are going to go rampant, Like the one night 0:04:56.520 --> 0:04:57.400 scene is going to be crazy. 0:04:57.400 --> 0:04:59.320 Go live your best life. I hope you guys go 0:04:59.440 --> 0:05:00.000 have some fun. 0:05:00.320 --> 0:05:02.719 But I just think the landscape has changed so much. 0:05:02.760 --> 0:05:04.919 And before we could go out no worries, and you 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:07.960 could be having one night stand, you could be physically 0:05:08.000 --> 0:05:10.880 touching people and kissing people. But now we're learning to 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:13.000 develop a bit more of a connection with someone before 0:05:13.000 --> 0:05:15.479 we meet them, because we had no other choice. People 0:05:15.480 --> 0:05:18.240 spending more time getting to know each other. And I've 0:05:18.320 --> 0:05:21.080 dated all across it. I've dated in COVID and before COVID, 0:05:21.080 --> 0:05:23.560 and I obviously met Jordan in the middle of COVID, 0:05:23.600 --> 0:05:25.960 so I know what the dating was like during that period, 0:05:26.240 --> 0:05:27.680 and I think that we can take a lot of 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:30.320 what we've learned from dating in COVID into the new 0:05:30.360 --> 0:05:32.800 world post COVID. But anyway, we talking about dating at 0:05:32.839 --> 0:05:35.080 the moment. This is the perfect segue because on today's 0:05:35.120 --> 0:05:38.360 episode we are actually speaking to Logan Yuri. She is 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:39.560 a behavioral scientist. 0:05:39.960 --> 0:05:42.240 She is the dating coach for Hinge, and she has 0:05:42.279 --> 0:05:45.279 written an awesome book called How to Not Die Alone, 0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:49.120 which we all need well. She like really unpacks the 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:52.760 importance of human connections. She unpacks like why why we 0:05:52.760 --> 0:05:55.120 would want to not die alone? And for anyone who 0:05:55.160 --> 0:05:58.320 is single, this is going to absolutely be the Gods 0:05:58.360 --> 0:06:00.280 send of an episode for you. But even if you're 0:06:00.279 --> 0:06:03.279 in a relationship, there's so much in this conversation that 0:06:03.360 --> 0:06:05.560 I think we can all take away. She is an 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:06.880 absolute wealth of wisdom. 0:06:07.240 --> 0:06:07.800 But before we. 0:06:07.760 --> 0:06:09.680 Get into the chat with Logan, of course, there are 0:06:09.720 --> 0:06:11.400 a few other things that we need to unpack. 0:06:11.480 --> 0:06:14.279 Yeah, we have something big to unpack this week, but 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:15.840 we're not going to get too in depth. But what 0:06:15.880 --> 0:06:17.880 we did want to talk about, and every single one 0:06:17.920 --> 0:06:20.760 of you, one hundred percent, you know this happened, You 0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:23.920 experienced it, You can't escape it. It was the great 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:26.680 Facebook outage of twenty twenty one. 0:06:26.800 --> 0:06:27.880 So Facebook and. 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:32.239 Everything attached to us, so Instagram and WhatsApp, everything went down. 0:06:32.320 --> 0:06:35.240 Now the world woke up, tried to log onto their 0:06:35.279 --> 0:06:37.679 Instagrams and it just said that there was no connection. 0:06:37.720 --> 0:06:39.560 But everyone just thought it was their own sort of 0:06:39.600 --> 0:06:41.760 Instagram at the time. Even in our group chat for work, 0:06:41.839 --> 0:06:44.039 producer Keisha saying, I'm trying to post some stuff, but 0:06:44.080 --> 0:06:45.839 my Instagram's down. Can you guys do it? And I 0:06:45.839 --> 0:06:47.560 was like, babe, if you check the news, like the 0:06:47.760 --> 0:06:50.680 whole world is down. But the Facebook black aut was 0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:51.360 just the start. 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:54.080 It is just the tip of the Icebergs, ladies and gentlemen, 0:06:54.279 --> 0:06:56.400 there is a whole lot more that has been happening 0:06:56.440 --> 0:06:59.080 and going down in regards to Facebook. And when I 0:06:59.080 --> 0:07:02.920 say Facebook for totality, we mean Instagram, WhatsApp, the mothership 0:07:03.000 --> 0:07:06.400 that is the Facebook organization. Now, you may have heard 0:07:06.400 --> 0:07:09.400 of something called Facebook Files, and if you have it, 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:11.600 I'll give you the brief rundown of what's been happening. 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:13.680 There is a whistleblower that has come out of Facebook. 0:07:13.720 --> 0:07:16.520 Her name is Francis Horgan, and she has released a 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:21.160 whole lot of internal research document papers, private documents that 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:23.600 Facebook doesn't want released, and she has given them up 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:25.920 to the Wall Street Journal. Now these are what have 0:07:26.000 --> 0:07:30.000 comprised the Facebook Files, and each week more documents are 0:07:30.040 --> 0:07:32.640 being released to public. There's actually an awesome podcast called 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:35.000 the Facebook Files as well that I got very deep on. 0:07:35.080 --> 0:07:36.440 You can go and have a listen to that if 0:07:36.440 --> 0:07:37.840 you're interested in it as well. 0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:40.760 Basically, what she's saying is she's come out, she's got 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:44.000 tens of thousands of documents that she has taken with her, 0:07:44.080 --> 0:07:46.440 and she's saying that there is pages and pages of 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:50.760 evidence that over and over again, Facebook chooses profits over 0:07:51.000 --> 0:07:53.480 safety and there have been so many reports on this 0:07:53.600 --> 0:07:56.400 of their internal research that they have not released for 0:07:56.440 --> 0:07:58.920 a reason. And this is why she's releasing information, because 0:07:58.920 --> 0:08:01.440 she said enough is enough. I've seen the evidence, i 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:03.960 know what is happening, and I'm going to blow the 0:08:03.960 --> 0:08:07.440 lid on this. And it is just it's so explosive, 0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:09.600 and I feel like people week by week now are 0:08:09.600 --> 0:08:11.200 on the edge of their seat to see what else 0:08:11.200 --> 0:08:13.600 she's going to release. But just in terms of the 0:08:13.640 --> 0:08:17.640 profits over safety, do you know, Laura, that they estimate 0:08:17.680 --> 0:08:20.760 that Mark Zuckerberg in that outage for that like five 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:23.160 or six hours that it was down, lost about seven 0:08:23.320 --> 0:08:26.920 billion dollars. So I think that that alone is evidence 0:08:27.000 --> 0:08:30.920 that profits are very, very prolific and very important in 0:08:30.960 --> 0:08:32.000 the Facebook industry. 0:08:32.160 --> 0:08:33.000 Isn't that crazy? 0:08:33.040 --> 0:08:35.360 Imagine not going to work for seven hours? Like how 0:08:35.440 --> 0:08:36.400 much money would you lose? 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:39.280 I'm losing seven billion dollars, I'd lessay seven dollars. 0:08:39.080 --> 0:08:43.000 Fifty wild So this whole whistleblower, like the main things 0:08:43.040 --> 0:08:45.280 that have come out from this is that there are 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:48.920 several different parts of Facebook that they have kept very secret. 0:08:49.240 --> 0:08:52.000 One of them is this thing called the VIP crosscheck, 0:08:52.280 --> 0:08:56.680 so VIP crosscheck means that any celebrities or Instagram users 0:08:56.720 --> 0:09:00.280 who have amassed millions and millions of followers to a 0:09:00.280 --> 0:09:02.840 different set of standards than what all the rest of 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:05.000 us Instagram plubs are held to. And now, when I 0:09:05.040 --> 0:09:08.360 say like big prolific Instagram users, I'm talking like you're 0:09:08.440 --> 0:09:10.760 justin Bieber's. I'm talking like your top preme de la 0:09:10.800 --> 0:09:13.480 creme of Instagram. Yeah, they get a hall pass. Essentially, 0:09:13.520 --> 0:09:14.880 Facebook gives them a hall pass. 0:09:15.000 --> 0:09:15.160 Yeah. 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:16.960 And what it means is like, if you were to 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:21.160 post nudity or something that went against Facebook's rules, you 0:09:21.200 --> 0:09:24.120 would very quickly have that content taken down. You would 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:26.400 either be issued a warning or if it was damning enough, 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:29.480 they would remove your profile altogether. Now, those same rules 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:33.000 don't apply to celebrities. The reason that they removed this 0:09:33.240 --> 0:09:35.400 originally did I went deep, guys, I'll tell you that 0:09:35.640 --> 0:09:37.720 the reason why they removed this was because back in 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:41.960 twenty fourteen, Rihanna had her whole entire Instagram taken down 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:45.160 because she posted a cover photo from a magazine that 0:09:45.320 --> 0:09:49.120 the algorithm thought was too rude. And so Rihanna's entire 0:09:49.160 --> 0:09:52.160 Instagram account was taken down, like millions and millions of followers, 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:56.240 and so many other similar variations if this has had happened. So, 0:09:56.400 --> 0:09:59.760 instead of dealing with the pr backlash that Facebook was 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:03.480 rect they basically brought in a new blanket algorithm that 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:07.520 meant that celebrities and people with huge followers were exempt 0:10:07.520 --> 0:10:11.160 from these rules. Now, there's so many issues with this, 0:10:11.320 --> 0:10:13.360 and the big issue with this is the fact that 0:10:13.400 --> 0:10:16.480 people who have huge followings also have the biggest level 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:20.239 of accountability, and if somebody who has millions of followers 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:23.920 is spreading misinformation, then they're not held to the same 0:10:24.080 --> 0:10:27.360 level of accountability. And that misinformation can spread far, and 0:10:27.400 --> 0:10:30.680 it can spread wide, and it doesn't get taken down 0:10:30.720 --> 0:10:32.840 like it would if it was just a general Joe 0:10:32.880 --> 0:10:35.240 blow putting it out there to the universe. The other 0:10:35.240 --> 0:10:37.600 two points just quickly that came out in these Facebook 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:41.400 files are human trafficking and just how prolific human trafficking 0:10:41.679 --> 0:10:45.560 is across the network, so across Instagram, across Facebook, and 0:10:45.600 --> 0:10:49.680 across WhatsApp, and how people have been trafficked in developing countries, 0:10:50.320 --> 0:10:52.439 and that Facebook's very very much aware of this, and 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:54.840 how little they've done to try and combat the issue. 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:56.840 And lastly, one of the things that have come out 0:10:57.120 --> 0:10:59.800 is the huge and profound impact that Facebook and in 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:02.600 ist is having on teenagers when it comes to their 0:11:02.640 --> 0:11:05.880 self confidence in their body image. And I know that 0:11:05.960 --> 0:11:08.440 this is something that we're also aware of, Like everybody 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:11.720 knows how rife comparison culture is, and everybody knows that 0:11:11.800 --> 0:11:15.080 there is some toxicity when it comes to body image 0:11:15.120 --> 0:11:18.080 on the platform of Instagram. But this is research that 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:22.480 has been done internally within Facebook, hard research that says 0:11:22.760 --> 0:11:24.840 that they're very much aware of it, but they're not 0:11:24.880 --> 0:11:27.400 doing anything about it or not doing enough about it. 0:11:27.440 --> 0:11:28.120 I should say. 0:11:28.360 --> 0:11:30.480 The documents that have been released in the Facebook file 0:11:30.679 --> 0:11:35.240 literally show that Instagram is completely aware of the detrimental 0:11:35.240 --> 0:11:38.680 effects that it is having on teenagers and young children. 0:11:38.960 --> 0:11:42.040 So there was a PowerPoint slide created by Facebook research 0:11:42.160 --> 0:11:45.720 themselves in twenty nineteen and it states that Instagram made 0:11:45.760 --> 0:11:49.160 body image issues worse for one in three teenage girls, 0:11:49.160 --> 0:11:51.760 so they know that they've done the research. There was 0:11:51.840 --> 0:11:55.360 another research presentation from twenty twenty, so one year later, 0:11:55.840 --> 0:11:59.320 which was published on Facebook's internal messaging board, so again 0:11:59.360 --> 0:12:03.040 it wasn't really publicly, but it stated that thirty two 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:06.160 percent of teenage girls said that when they felt bad 0:12:06.200 --> 0:12:10.800 about their bodies, Instagram only made it worse. So here 0:12:10.960 --> 0:12:14.120 Instagram is with this knowledge. Facebook and Instagram they have 0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:16.360 this knowledge, They've done their own research, they know how 0:12:16.400 --> 0:12:20.079 detrimental it can be, and then they've decided, Hey, now 0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:22.640 that we have this information, I have a good idea, 0:12:23.240 --> 0:12:24.640 let's make Instagram for kids. 0:12:25.040 --> 0:12:27.040 And this has sort of had a lot. 0:12:26.840 --> 0:12:29.120 Of people in the world up in arms because they're saying, well, 0:12:29.120 --> 0:12:31.760 hang on, we already know that this isn't a good 0:12:31.800 --> 0:12:35.040 place for many adults and many people that are old 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:37.120 enough to know the effects and take control of their 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:42.280 life and the information that they're seeing online. What part 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:45.720 of knowing this information makes you think, hmm, maybe we 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:48.320 should get our kids involved. So for me, I have 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:50.240 my feelings on this, But Laura, what do you think 0:12:50.240 --> 0:12:50.600 about this? 0:12:51.040 --> 0:12:54.079 Well, for anyone who doesn't know what Instagram for kids is, basically, 0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:56.640 the minimum age for Instagram at the moment is thirteen, 0:12:57.160 --> 0:12:59.720 So they're wanting to create a platform that caters towards 0:12:59.760 --> 0:13:02.440 the ten to twelve demographic. Now, there's two camps of 0:13:02.480 --> 0:13:05.200 thoughts when it comes to this. The first one is 0:13:05.240 --> 0:13:08.600 that children are already using Instagram nine year old's. Ten 0:13:08.640 --> 0:13:11.200 year olds are already using Instagram, but they're just using 0:13:11.200 --> 0:13:13.600 it under an alias of being over thirteen. You know, 0:13:13.640 --> 0:13:15.559 they just lie, They check the box, and then they 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:18.720 create their platforms and their profiles anyway, So creating a 0:13:19.040 --> 0:13:22.640 kid's only a retrofitted kids only Instagram is a place 0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:25.079 that would be safer, as in the content would be 0:13:25.160 --> 0:13:29.520 tailored towards age appropriate content, they wouldn't have ads on there, 0:13:29.720 --> 0:13:32.240 and there's a whole other lot of parental restrictions and 0:13:32.280 --> 0:13:35.640 parental guidance that would be embedded within that app. The 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:38.840 flip side to this argument, and what so many people 0:13:38.920 --> 0:13:42.960 are calling bullshit on I guess is that the idea 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:46.160 is if you can cook these young kids, if you 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:48.480 can hook a ten year old on an app, if 0:13:48.480 --> 0:13:51.120 you can make it become so ingrained in their culture, 0:13:51.480 --> 0:13:54.080 so ingrained in their behavior, then of course they're going 0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:57.000 to migrate to the adult app when the time is right. 0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:59.959 And at the moment, there's so much competition in this space. 0:14:00.559 --> 0:14:03.360 Most young kids are getting onto TikTok, and so many 0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:05.680 of the kids these days, I sound so old saying 0:14:05.720 --> 0:14:06.680 that that I am kids. 0:14:06.760 --> 0:14:07.440 We're so old. 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:10.560 They're not using Instagram in the same way that we did, 0:14:10.640 --> 0:14:13.920 and their uptake for them using Instagram is declining. So 0:14:14.040 --> 0:14:16.720 getting them onto Instagram Kids is a very very clever 0:14:16.800 --> 0:14:20.640 way of ensuring that the next generation is already signed 0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:23.760 up for Instagram before they've even had time to think 0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:24.240 about it. 0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:26.280 And look, we do want to present both sides. Whilst 0:14:26.320 --> 0:14:28.680 I just said there was research saying that it was detrimental, 0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:32.600 Facebook's head of research and Zuckerberg himself have both come 0:14:32.640 --> 0:14:35.520 out saying there is also research to say that it 0:14:35.640 --> 0:14:38.560 is beneficial for kids, especially in the pandemic, to have 0:14:38.640 --> 0:14:41.520 stayed connected. And I guess we can't argue that when 0:14:41.520 --> 0:14:43.520 all of a sudden the world has said, hey, to 0:14:43.560 --> 0:14:45.520 all these kids, you can't play with your friends anymore, 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:47.840 you can't go to the park, you can't go to school. 0:14:48.120 --> 0:14:50.720 Everything's online, school on learning is online. Of course, there 0:14:50.760 --> 0:14:52.680 is an aspect of that to say, hey, of course 0:14:52.680 --> 0:14:55.600 they're going to benefit because they can still stay connected, 0:14:55.920 --> 0:14:58.040 and I don't think we can argue that part. But 0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:00.360 that's not what this is. We're not going to in 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:02.640 a pandemic in lockdown for the rest of our life. 0:15:02.680 --> 0:15:05.320 Life is going to go back to normal and personally, 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:10.160 I don't think a child from age ten to twelve, 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:12.400 I know I wouldn't let my child. I don't think 0:15:12.440 --> 0:15:15.200 they need to be on Instagram. I think the interweb 0:15:15.240 --> 0:15:19.280 can be a very dark and scary place. Anything can 0:15:19.320 --> 0:15:22.640 go on on Instagram, absolutely anything. And I have no 0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:25.440 doubt that Instagram and Facebook are going to be putting 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:28.960 procedures in place to ensure safety and security. Otherwise they're 0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:30.600 not going to do it like there are one hundred 0:15:30.680 --> 0:15:33.000 billion dollar company. Of course they're going to have that, 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:35.800 but I just don't think that's enough to stop people 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:36.840 from doing the wrong thing. 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:38.880 The big thing about this is that the creation of 0:15:38.920 --> 0:15:42.000 Instagram Kids has been put on hold. They've not stopped it. 0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:44.040 It's just been kind of halted, and it has been 0:15:44.080 --> 0:15:46.640 halted as a cause and effect because of the Facebook 0:15:46.680 --> 0:15:48.840 files and because of this research that's come out. 0:15:49.080 --> 0:15:49.240 Now. 0:15:49.280 --> 0:15:51.560 Adam Massuri, who's the head of Instagram, has come out 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:53.880 and put a quote, if you google Instagram kids, this 0:15:53.960 --> 0:15:56.760 is what comes up. We wanted to provide an update 0:15:56.800 --> 0:15:59.080 on our work to build an Instagram experience for people 0:15:59.200 --> 0:16:02.360 under the age of thirty, often referred to as Instagram Kids. 0:16:02.600 --> 0:16:05.440 We started this project to address an important problem seen 0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:08.960 across our industry. Kids are getting phones younger and younger, 0:16:09.160 --> 0:16:12.120 misrepresenting their age, and downloading apps that are meant for 0:16:12.160 --> 0:16:15.280 those thirteen or older. We firmly believe that it's better 0:16:15.280 --> 0:16:17.680 for parents to have the option to give their children 0:16:17.800 --> 0:16:20.480 access to a version of Instagram that is designed for them, 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:24.160 where parents can supervise and control their experiences, rather than 0:16:24.240 --> 0:16:27.200 relying on apps ability to verify the age of kids 0:16:27.320 --> 0:16:30.200 who are too young to have an ID. Okay, So 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:32.560 the reason why I find this so alarming that this 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:36.480 is the main response from Instagram is that imagine if 0:16:36.480 --> 0:16:40.240 an alcohol brand came out and said, hey, guys, look, 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:42.440 we know that there are sixteen year olds out there 0:16:42.440 --> 0:16:45.440 who are drinking booze. Come on, you know it, I 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:48.160 know it. We know that they're lying. So instead of 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:50.760 trying to make sure that we have more restrictions in place, 0:16:50.880 --> 0:16:54.400 age appropriate restrictions in place that mean ordered for them 0:16:54.440 --> 0:16:56.920 to buy alcohol, they have to show ID, they have 0:16:57.000 --> 0:16:59.960 to have double verification, whatever it is, We'll just make 0:17:00.000 --> 0:17:02.200 a beverage that's more appealing to them, Like, we'll just 0:17:02.280 --> 0:17:05.040 lower the bar. So I just think it's so wild 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:08.760 that instead of trying to counter the problem by increasing 0:17:08.800 --> 0:17:11.199 the age to an age where they can verify it 0:17:11.240 --> 0:17:14.480 by someone's ID. The solution to this is to decrease 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:16.760 the age and try and retro fit the app to 0:17:16.840 --> 0:17:20.119 cater for young kids. Now, the other issue to this 0:17:20.280 --> 0:17:24.639 is that, yes, parental supervision is so important, but no 0:17:24.840 --> 0:17:28.879 parent can supervise comparison culture. The app of Instagram is 0:17:28.920 --> 0:17:32.080 based on comparison. It's based on putting up your best photos, 0:17:32.280 --> 0:17:35.400 it's based on curating your life. There is this element 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:37.400 of fomo which kids are going to have when they're 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:40.480 looking at these apps. No amount of parental supervision can 0:17:40.520 --> 0:17:43.640 stop a child from feeling those feelings. And I think 0:17:43.680 --> 0:17:47.120 that that is the big thing, Even without the whole cybersecurity, 0:17:47.160 --> 0:17:50.200 even without worrying about adults getting on there and pretending 0:17:50.240 --> 0:17:53.400 to be kids, just being able to monitor what your 0:17:53.440 --> 0:17:56.399 children see and how that makes them feel is an 0:17:56.440 --> 0:17:58.560 impossibly huge task for parents to do. 0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:00.600 And I think it's hard enough to be a child 0:18:00.640 --> 0:18:03.800 these days anyway, let alone throwing in this extra stress 0:18:03.800 --> 0:18:06.800 and extra comparison. And imagine being a child and just 0:18:06.840 --> 0:18:09.520 seeing every day all your other friends going out and 0:18:09.520 --> 0:18:11.640 doing things and tagging each other and having fun. Whether 0:18:11.640 --> 0:18:13.640 they're doing that or not, you don't know. They could 0:18:13.680 --> 0:18:15.879 be pretending they're they're having a great time, you don't know. 0:18:16.000 --> 0:18:20.119 But the isolation and the increase in buoying I think 0:18:20.200 --> 0:18:24.639 will take place if Instagram Kids goes ahead. I personally 0:18:25.280 --> 0:18:28.160 am going to vote against it. That's where I'm sitting 0:18:28.200 --> 0:18:30.159 at the moment, until I can see some more research 0:18:30.240 --> 0:18:30.960 that's positive. 0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:33.760 It's a no from me. Yeah, I totally agree. 0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:36.240 I think the only thing that creating something like Instagram 0:18:36.359 --> 0:18:39.080 Kids is going to do is create another thing for 0:18:39.160 --> 0:18:41.320 parents to have to battle their children on to tell 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:42.760 them that they can't have it. You know, if you 0:18:42.760 --> 0:18:44.360 don't want your child to have it when they're ten 0:18:44.400 --> 0:18:48.320 years old, you're now faced with such a bigger hurdle 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:50.359 to try and explain to your child why they can't 0:18:50.400 --> 0:18:53.320 have it when there's an app that's been created saying hey, 0:18:53.320 --> 0:18:57.639 it's specifically for you. I feel like we have covered 0:18:57.840 --> 0:19:00.640 so much of this, but there is I mean, honestly, 0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:03.640 Facebook and Instagram take up so much of our lives now. 0:19:03.680 --> 0:19:05.919 They are so ingrained in our culture, They are so 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:08.960 ingrained in our every day that we could genuinely talk 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:11.960 about this forever, and as more of this whole Facebook 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:14.280 files thing unpacks, I think we probably will touch on 0:19:14.320 --> 0:19:16.840 it again in the future. But before we get into 0:19:16.880 --> 0:19:19.439 the chat with Logan, let's do our favorite part of 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:23.360 every episode, and that is accidentally unfiltered but also confessionals. 0:19:23.400 --> 0:19:25.440 Now we've got a whole new segment for you guys. 0:19:25.720 --> 0:19:28.240 Now, I just thought this one was so innocent and 0:19:28.280 --> 0:19:30.159 it's got nothing to do with poop. So this is 0:19:30.160 --> 0:19:31.120 why I've brote. 0:19:31.000 --> 0:19:32.560 Thanks you so much've chosen it today. 0:19:32.760 --> 0:19:35.080 I feel like so many people are like, ladies, enough 0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:35.840 enough with that. 0:19:35.920 --> 0:19:37.760 Yet, But I just want to highlight the fact that 0:19:37.800 --> 0:19:40.119 we don't go looking for the poop. Eight out of 0:19:40.160 --> 0:19:42.679 ten of you get right in is about poop, Like 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:46.560 the poop stories are just so prevalent that we don't 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:48.399 really have a choice. We have to sift through the 0:19:48.520 --> 0:19:50.560 poop to get to the non poop anyway. 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:53.040 Doesn't it also just make you realize, if you're listening 0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:55.160 to this, that everybody has a poop story, Like. 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:56.359 You all have a story. 0:19:56.560 --> 0:19:58.960 Anybody who has an issue with us talking about it, 0:19:59.160 --> 0:20:01.280 I get it. You know, it's not for everyone, but 0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:03.760 even you have a story that you haven't told us, 0:20:04.240 --> 0:20:05.920 so just keep that in mind for next time. 0:20:06.000 --> 0:20:06.359 Okay. 0:20:07.040 --> 0:20:09.360 So my sister and I were heading home last night 0:20:09.440 --> 0:20:12.320 behind our parents' car after a very long and sad 0:20:12.440 --> 0:20:15.600 day at the hospital spending time with our sick nana. 0:20:16.200 --> 0:20:20.119 Earlier that day, I had started listening to Tuesday's Manifestation episode. 0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:22.800 Next thing you know, we're getting a call from my 0:20:22.960 --> 0:20:25.600 dad and I'm like, that's weird. I just left him 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:28.280 and he's right in front of us. Why the fuck 0:20:28.359 --> 0:20:30.880 am I listening to two girls talk about what creams 0:20:30.880 --> 0:20:35.240 you can use on your didos and vibrates? Little did 0:20:35.280 --> 0:20:37.760 I know my phone had connected to my bluetoothing mom 0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:40.480 and dad's car. As they're sad going home from the hospital, 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:42.359 they're listening to what you guys would put on your 0:20:42.440 --> 0:20:45.880 dialdo dead. I absolutely lost it. It actually made all 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:46.760 of our day. 0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:52.359 Coconut oil, just just coconut oil, nothing else or actual loop. 0:20:52.400 --> 0:20:54.800 Imagine driving home from the hospital and like you're so 0:20:55.040 --> 0:20:56.520 down and out and you're in the car and then 0:20:56.560 --> 0:20:59.359 all of a sudden, our voices come on talking about 0:20:59.359 --> 0:21:02.000 what products you can put on your dial nos. 0:21:02.440 --> 0:21:04.919 Vagina's the dad, Just like, what the fuck am I listening? 0:21:04.960 --> 0:21:06.960 To hit the sisters just lost it. Fuck. 0:21:07.160 --> 0:21:09.240 It started off really dark and really grim, and then 0:21:09.280 --> 0:21:12.400 it got there in the end, really brought it home. 0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:14.359 Brittany, What have you got for me today? 0:21:14.480 --> 0:21:16.840 These Confessionals? I just want to say, guys, it's a 0:21:16.880 --> 0:21:20.080 new segment. Like we said last week, we didn't really 0:21:20.320 --> 0:21:22.840 know where we were going with it. Like, I'll be honest, 0:21:22.880 --> 0:21:25.880 we were like, we were like, we're just gonna throw. 0:21:25.680 --> 0:21:26.160 It out there. 0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:28.640 We want to know you're deepest, darkest secrets, and we're 0:21:28.640 --> 0:21:32.040 gonna share them anonymously with all of you. Now, I 0:21:32.119 --> 0:21:34.040 know that there was some chatter in the Facebook grouping 0:21:34.200 --> 0:21:36.600 about Confessionals, and I just want to say one thing. 0:21:37.119 --> 0:21:40.760 We don't condone any of this. We're not here saying like, yes, 0:21:40.920 --> 0:21:43.520 this comes with no judgment. We're not here saying yes 0:21:43.680 --> 0:21:47.320 or no, don't shoot the messenger. We are literally just 0:21:47.359 --> 0:21:50.040 sharing with you guys some of the cookshit that comes 0:21:50.040 --> 0:21:52.840 over Instagram. So please don't think that just because we 0:21:52.920 --> 0:21:55.359 share this with you, that that's us saying we would 0:21:55.359 --> 0:21:56.080 do the same thing. 0:21:56.440 --> 0:21:58.840 We probably wouldn't do any of these things. Nah, we 0:21:58.880 --> 0:22:00.440 probably would. They could laugh. 0:22:00.480 --> 0:22:02.440 All right, So I'm gonna hit you with my top three. 0:22:02.520 --> 0:22:03.960 I think that this is how we're gonna do it. 0:22:04.000 --> 0:22:06.320 We're gonna do like one accidently unfiltered in three quick 0:22:06.320 --> 0:22:07.480 confessionals each week. 0:22:07.680 --> 0:22:09.040 Well, let's see, I think so. 0:22:09.119 --> 0:22:11.639 But I mean, we have to really control ourselves not 0:22:11.680 --> 0:22:13.720 to do like twenty five confessionals because they're so good. 0:22:13.840 --> 0:22:15.479 So I think we need to like stock them up. 0:22:16.359 --> 0:22:18.800 Okay, strap yourself in, ladies and gentlemen, here we go. 0:22:19.080 --> 0:22:21.400 My sister moved out a few months ago and left 0:22:21.440 --> 0:22:24.320 her electric toothbrush in our shared bathroom, and I've been 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:26.159 using it as a vibrator ever since. 0:22:26.760 --> 0:22:31.880 Ha ha. Just buy your own. Just get your own 0:22:31.960 --> 0:22:34.639 fin not that expensive, get yourself a little rabbit. 0:22:34.760 --> 0:22:37.320 To be fair, you're definitely gonna save money. My problem 0:22:37.359 --> 0:22:39.560 is not that you have improvised my problems, that you've 0:22:39.560 --> 0:22:41.400 improvised with someone else's toothbrush. 0:22:41.440 --> 0:22:42.600 Like, just go and buy your own. 0:22:42.480 --> 0:22:44.200 Dude brush. 0:22:44.560 --> 0:22:47.000 Have you ever Okay, you're gonna say no to this 0:22:47.040 --> 0:22:50.400 because you never shit use someone else's toothbrush to masturbate. 0:22:50.480 --> 0:22:52.119 I can handle my heart say that. 0:22:53.400 --> 0:22:55.439 I was gonna say, have you ever used anything that 0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:59.840 wasn't something that was purposefully built for mass? Thirty with 0:23:00.160 --> 0:23:02.399 it wasn't a dildo, or it wasn't a vibrator, and 0:23:02.440 --> 0:23:04.320 you're gonna say no because you won't share it with 0:23:04.359 --> 0:23:06.399 the Daily Mail because we all know that will end 0:23:06.480 --> 0:23:07.159 up in an article. 0:23:07.200 --> 0:23:10.399 Oh yeah, because I'm very filtered on this podcast. I 0:23:10.480 --> 0:23:14.240 actually haven't our hands down. Cannot think of one thing 0:23:14.240 --> 0:23:15.000 that I would have used. 0:23:15.240 --> 0:23:17.840 Have you no, But but we have received a lot 0:23:17.840 --> 0:23:20.119 of people writing and saying that they've used their phone, 0:23:20.400 --> 0:23:23.720 which I get it, but it's weird to hold it 0:23:23.800 --> 0:23:25.320 and then other people touch it. 0:23:25.240 --> 0:23:27.480 And it's an awkward shade. 0:23:27.520 --> 0:23:29.719 I don't think they're shoving the whole thing inside them 0:23:29.760 --> 0:23:31.639 for it. I think they just might be using a 0:23:31.720 --> 0:23:33.960 vibrate function. Do they just put it on there and 0:23:33.960 --> 0:23:37.800 wait for a text? Like what if you don't have 0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:41.720 any friends? What if no one messages your call? Someone 0:23:41.760 --> 0:23:44.560 keeps calling and you're like, You're like, why aren't you answering? 0:23:44.600 --> 0:23:49.280 You're like just calling, I can't talk right now? 0:23:49.359 --> 0:23:49.920 Calling back? 0:23:50.920 --> 0:23:53.920 Okay, all right, Well we did say we're going to 0:23:53.960 --> 0:23:55.720 stay away from shit, but then I lied because this 0:23:55.760 --> 0:23:58.520 one is definitely about poop. Okay, my poo wouldn't flush 0:23:58.520 --> 0:23:59.879 at work, so I had to get it out with 0:24:00.200 --> 0:24:01.960 hands and put it in the sanitary bin. 0:24:04.080 --> 0:24:05.560 Is at the end of the confessional. 0:24:06.359 --> 0:24:08.119 I'll give you guys one more before we go and 0:24:08.200 --> 0:24:10.840 jump into this chat with Logan, my now boyfriend of 0:24:10.880 --> 0:24:13.040 four years was ignoring me when we were in that 0:24:13.200 --> 0:24:16.960 situationship stage of our relationship. He went radio silence on 0:24:17.040 --> 0:24:20.440 me with absolutely no explanation. So naturally I was pretty 0:24:20.440 --> 0:24:23.400 pissed off and confused, so I attached his work phone 0:24:23.480 --> 0:24:26.800 number to a gum Tree ad for free baby Angora rabbits. 0:24:27.080 --> 0:24:29.320 He said he got over one hundred calls in the 0:24:29.359 --> 0:24:32.399 first hour and couldn't even decline them because he was 0:24:32.440 --> 0:24:34.720 waiting for a call from a new work related job. 0:24:35.080 --> 0:24:37.439 I've never told him that it was me, and. 0:24:37.520 --> 0:24:38.480 So she's still with him. 0:24:38.560 --> 0:24:43.120 She's how do you I would never that would never 0:24:43.160 --> 0:24:45.119 cross my mind. But I tell you what, I'm getting 0:24:45.160 --> 0:24:47.840 a lot of ideas from you guys. Jud never bring 0:24:47.920 --> 0:24:48.240 up with me. 0:24:48.720 --> 0:24:50.840 It would never cross my mind either. But I also 0:24:50.920 --> 0:24:53.040 love it. It's like really clean payback. 0:24:53.119 --> 0:24:54.600 It is do you know what? Actually? Do you want 0:24:54.600 --> 0:24:55.720 to know something really funny? 0:24:56.960 --> 0:24:59.440 This is just really quick. I was seming but not 0:24:59.480 --> 0:25:01.240 really involved it. When I found out that my ex 0:25:01.280 --> 0:25:03.640 had a double life, right, Lo, cute. 0:25:03.480 --> 0:25:05.359 I don't want to know what you did. It wasn't me. 0:25:05.560 --> 0:25:07.880 But when we both found out, obviously we both left him. 0:25:07.920 --> 0:25:10.959 But she, the other woman, ended up telling me what 0:25:11.000 --> 0:25:13.439 she did. She's like, I was just so mad, and 0:25:13.480 --> 0:25:14.840 I was like, oh my god, what did you do? 0:25:14.960 --> 0:25:17.160 So she went back to the house so like once 0:25:17.200 --> 0:25:20.240 and four, we'll take all her stuff. And she just 0:25:20.240 --> 0:25:22.320 thought this was hilarious. She just went around and took 0:25:22.440 --> 0:25:26.040 every tissue paper and toilet paper in the whole house, 0:25:26.040 --> 0:25:27.480 so that next time you did a shitty had nothing 0:25:27.480 --> 0:25:28.240 to wipe his butt with. 0:25:28.280 --> 0:25:30.480 And I was like, that is not payback for someone 0:25:30.520 --> 0:25:31.679 having a double life. 0:25:32.440 --> 0:25:34.679 I'm like, you need to you need to listen to 0:25:34.680 --> 0:25:36.919 this podcast to get some ideas. I'm like, cute, but 0:25:36.960 --> 0:25:38.760 I don't think that's gonna cut it, mate. She needs 0:25:38.800 --> 0:25:40.480 to get out more. I feel like you could just 0:25:40.520 --> 0:25:43.240 have a shower once again. Live through a global pandemic 0:25:43.240 --> 0:25:46.000 where there's been no toilet paper, it's fine, just have 0:25:46.080 --> 0:25:49.399 a shower. Keep those coming in, keep the accidental unfiltereds, 0:25:49.400 --> 0:25:51.959 the ass gun carts, the confessionals. I can't believe they 0:25:52.000 --> 0:25:54.240 said that anything fucked up that happens in your life. 0:25:54.240 --> 0:25:57.360 Basically keep that coming into our Instagram Life on Cut podcast. 0:25:57.480 --> 0:25:58.760 But now it's time to get ino. The chat with 0:25:58.920 --> 0:26:02.280 Logan Uri. He was so interesting. I absolutely love this chat. 0:26:02.320 --> 0:26:04.480 I really did. I had the greatest time. We had 0:26:04.520 --> 0:26:06.480 so much fun recording it, and I think everyone's going 0:26:06.520 --> 0:26:16.680 to benefit from it. Logan your is a behavioral scientist 0:26:16.800 --> 0:26:18.879 turned dating coach, and let's be real, that is exactly 0:26:18.960 --> 0:26:21.080 what we need here at Life Uncut. It is definitely 0:26:21.160 --> 0:26:23.760 what I know I needed in my twenties. But Logan 0:26:23.840 --> 0:26:26.240 is also the author of best selling book How To 0:26:26.359 --> 0:26:29.120 Not Die Alone, and I absolutely love that title. We're 0:26:29.119 --> 0:26:31.640 definitely going to get into that. But on top of that, 0:26:31.840 --> 0:26:34.720 Logan is the director of Relationship Science at HINGE and 0:26:34.760 --> 0:26:38.080 she leads a research team dedicated to helping people find love. 0:26:38.119 --> 0:26:40.919 So what better person to have on Life Uncut today? 0:26:41.040 --> 0:26:43.960 Logan from America. Welcome to Life Uncut. 0:26:44.119 --> 0:26:45.760 Yeah, I'm so happy to be here. 0:26:45.880 --> 0:26:47.600 Now, Logan, we have a section that we do with 0:26:47.680 --> 0:26:50.040 every single guest who comes on the podcast, and it's 0:26:50.080 --> 0:26:53.440 called Accidentally Unfiltered, and it's where you share with us 0:26:53.760 --> 0:26:56.280 your most embarrassing story and I know you've been prepped 0:26:56.320 --> 0:26:59.160 on this, so I am I cannot wait to hear 0:27:00.280 --> 0:27:02.960 the wildest, most embarrassing thing that's ever happened to you is. 0:27:03.080 --> 0:27:06.199 I know, I know. I definitely considered not sharing this, 0:27:06.320 --> 0:27:07.960 but I'll tell you the story. 0:27:08.040 --> 0:27:09.520 So have you ever heard. 0:27:09.320 --> 0:27:10.520 Of a book called The Giver? 0:27:11.119 --> 0:27:12.160 NOI noie. 0:27:12.240 --> 0:27:15.639 Okay, I'm not sure if this is huge internationally, but basically, 0:27:15.760 --> 0:27:18.040 when I was in sixth grade, I read this book 0:27:18.040 --> 0:27:20.880 called The Giver and it was just like this first 0:27:20.920 --> 0:27:22.439 time in my life where I was like, I'm a 0:27:22.480 --> 0:27:26.200 conscious person with deep thoughts and wow, the world is 0:27:26.240 --> 0:27:28.639 a big, scary place. And it just was a very 0:27:28.640 --> 0:27:32.359 meaningful book for me in terms of my intellectual development. 0:27:32.440 --> 0:27:34.199 And I read it in one night and it just 0:27:34.320 --> 0:27:36.600 it always stuck with me. It was this really deep book. 0:27:37.000 --> 0:27:40.520 So then when I was a sophomore in college, I 0:27:40.720 --> 0:27:44.320 found out that Lois Lowry, who had written The Giver, 0:27:44.600 --> 0:27:47.480 was coming to speak to my class. And they said 0:27:48.080 --> 0:27:50.680 a couple students will be chosen at random to go 0:27:50.760 --> 0:27:53.280 have lunch with Lois Lowry, and I went out to 0:27:53.359 --> 0:27:56.119 the teacher afterwards and I was like, I will not 0:27:56.200 --> 0:27:58.840 be waiting around to see if I'm chosen, I will 0:27:58.920 --> 0:28:01.440 be at this lunch with Lois Lowry, like I need 0:28:01.440 --> 0:28:03.960 to meet Lois Lowry. I was like, I will be there, 0:28:03.960 --> 0:28:06.080 and she's like okay, like sounds like you really like her. 0:28:06.119 --> 0:28:08.119 So we went to this lunch with her, and I 0:28:08.200 --> 0:28:10.880 was like sitting next to her and telling her all 0:28:10.880 --> 0:28:12.639 these things about how much I loved her, like probably 0:28:12.640 --> 0:28:16.919 coming on really strong. And then I brought at the 0:28:17.000 --> 0:28:19.399 time was you know, a digital camera. I was like 0:28:19.480 --> 0:28:24.680 pre iPhone, and I had the waiter take two photos 0:28:24.680 --> 0:28:26.440 of us, and I like put my arm around Lois 0:28:26.440 --> 0:28:29.600 Lowry and I was so proud, and so then I 0:28:29.680 --> 0:28:31.280 asked her like, oh, you know, I'd love to send 0:28:31.320 --> 0:28:33.359 you the picture. So she wrote her email address on 0:28:33.359 --> 0:28:37.040 a napkin, which was something like Lois at Lowry dot 0:28:37.080 --> 0:28:39.280 com or something like that. So I went home that 0:28:39.440 --> 0:28:43.200 night and I uploaded the photos and then I sent 0:28:43.240 --> 0:28:45.600 her an email saying like hey Lois, like so nice 0:28:45.640 --> 0:28:49.040 to meet you, Thanks for a great day, like here 0:28:49.040 --> 0:28:51.360 are the photos. And I bcced like all my friends 0:28:51.400 --> 0:28:53.000 and family to be like, you know how much I 0:28:53.000 --> 0:28:57.240 love Lois Lowry, like look at this. And then my sister, 0:28:58.240 --> 0:29:00.800 who's very sassy. It called me and she's like, I 0:29:00.840 --> 0:29:04.120 think you should check the pictures that you sent in 0:29:04.200 --> 0:29:09.560 that email. And so basically I had taken two photos 0:29:09.600 --> 0:29:12.840 at lunch, and so I attached two photos. But instead 0:29:12.880 --> 0:29:16.000 of attaching the two photos from lunch, one photo was 0:29:16.040 --> 0:29:20.240 from lunch and one photo was from right after lunch, 0:29:20.280 --> 0:29:22.080 which was that like I lived in a dorm room 0:29:22.360 --> 0:29:24.360 and I would hand wash my underwear and then like 0:29:25.280 --> 0:29:28.480 stroke threw it throughout the room. So I was like 0:29:28.640 --> 0:29:31.160 hanging like in all these different directions on my room, 0:29:31.400 --> 0:29:33.520 and I thought it looked really funny. So I took 0:29:33.520 --> 0:29:35.440 a picture by underwear. 0:29:35.040 --> 0:29:36.520 Hanging, and that's what you sent it to. 0:29:38.240 --> 0:29:41.200 So instead of sending two pictures to lunch, it was 0:29:41.520 --> 0:29:43.240 one from the lunch and one. 0:29:43.080 --> 0:29:44.400 Of all of my underwear. 0:29:45.560 --> 0:29:49.840 Like you're a super fan, but I s yes, exactly. 0:29:49.920 --> 0:29:51.760 So it was like I had come on so strong, 0:29:51.800 --> 0:29:55.440 and then I sent my favorite author a picture by underwear. 0:29:56.400 --> 0:29:57.760 At least you didn't send her a nude. 0:29:57.840 --> 0:30:00.360 I have done this, Logan actually more time, and I 0:30:00.360 --> 0:30:01.280 can to admit. 0:30:01.200 --> 0:30:03.400 Logan, tell us a little bit about how you became 0:30:03.480 --> 0:30:07.080 a behavioral scientist, what your background is there, and how 0:30:07.320 --> 0:30:10.280 you morphed that career into becoming a dating guru. 0:30:10.680 --> 0:30:15.880 So my background is in psychology. I studied psychology at Harvard, 0:30:15.920 --> 0:30:18.560 and I've always just been so interested in human behavior. 0:30:19.080 --> 0:30:21.440 It's really interesting to look at why do people do 0:30:21.480 --> 0:30:23.760 the things they do, Why do we make the decisions 0:30:23.800 --> 0:30:26.640 we make, why do we often act out of our 0:30:26.680 --> 0:30:28.760 own best interest? And so I've always just been so 0:30:28.880 --> 0:30:32.280 fascinated by the way that people act. And so I 0:30:32.400 --> 0:30:35.719 was able to turn that interest in psychology into this 0:30:35.880 --> 0:30:39.320 role at Google running the behavioral science team. And so 0:30:39.600 --> 0:30:41.840 what that team did is it says, all right, there's 0:30:41.840 --> 0:30:44.360 this field called behavioral science, which is a fancy way 0:30:44.360 --> 0:30:47.120 of saying how do people make decisions? And if you 0:30:47.320 --> 0:30:51.120 understand how people make decisions, you can change their behavior. 0:30:51.520 --> 0:30:53.560 And so let's say it's something like, if I send 0:30:53.560 --> 0:30:56.719 you an email that says, brit fill out this survey, 0:30:56.760 --> 0:30:59.120 it'll take twenty minutes, versus if I send you an 0:30:59.160 --> 0:31:01.560 email that says, brit fill out the survey, it'll take 0:31:01.600 --> 0:31:04.400 two minutes. You're much more likely to do it if 0:31:04.400 --> 0:31:06.360 it's two minutes, right, because you're like, that's no big 0:31:06.400 --> 0:31:08.160 deal versus twenty minutes is so big. 0:31:08.240 --> 0:31:10.000 Then I feel like I'd complain when it takes me 0:31:10.040 --> 0:31:10.640 twenty minutes. 0:31:10.960 --> 0:31:12.760 I'd feel like she said it was something two minutes. 0:31:13.040 --> 0:31:14.280 No, that's true, that's true. 0:31:14.400 --> 0:31:14.840 You can't. 0:31:15.040 --> 0:31:16.640 I don't think you should lie about how long the 0:31:16.640 --> 0:31:18.800 survey is, but I think you should understand, like what 0:31:18.920 --> 0:31:20.720 is the amount of time in which someone will take 0:31:20.760 --> 0:31:24.200 action or not? And so with behavioral science, I was 0:31:24.280 --> 0:31:27.680 really able to apply all these cool academic theories to 0:31:28.360 --> 0:31:32.120 designing Google products, designing Google marketing, changing the behavior of 0:31:32.120 --> 0:31:34.840 people who work at Google, like in this corporate environment. 0:31:35.240 --> 0:31:37.440 But while I was there, I was like, I'm single, 0:31:38.720 --> 0:31:42.040 I am using dating apps, and I'm having a hard time. 0:31:42.280 --> 0:31:46.200 And all these genius wizards at Google who invented the Internet, 0:31:46.400 --> 0:31:48.280 all these people are having a hard time, and what 0:31:48.320 --> 0:31:50.760 can I do about it? And so I started this 0:31:50.920 --> 0:31:54.240 series called Toxic Google Modern Romance, where I would bring 0:31:54.280 --> 0:31:57.040 in experts to come talk to me about how do 0:31:57.080 --> 0:31:59.800 you communicate in a digital world, what is the deal 0:31:59.840 --> 0:32:04.240 with non monogamy, how do you overcome the paradox of 0:32:04.320 --> 0:32:06.320 choice and online dating? And I talk to them about 0:32:06.360 --> 0:32:08.480 all these things, and through that I was like, this 0:32:08.560 --> 0:32:11.280 is really my purpose, Like I am on Earth to 0:32:11.320 --> 0:32:14.400 help people find love, to help people answer these questions. 0:32:14.680 --> 0:32:16.920 And the unique way that I'm going to do it 0:32:16.960 --> 0:32:19.920 is taking what I know about psychology and decision making 0:32:20.360 --> 0:32:23.240 and applying it to dating. And so I do that 0:32:23.360 --> 0:32:25.880 one on one. I do dating coaching with people where 0:32:25.880 --> 0:32:28.320 I'm like, this is your blind spot, this is what's 0:32:28.320 --> 0:32:30.360 holding you back. Here's how we're going to change it. 0:32:30.440 --> 0:32:33.040 But then I also did it through my book in 0:32:33.160 --> 0:32:36.440 terms of saying to anyone reading this, like, these are 0:32:36.440 --> 0:32:38.479 the common mistakes that people make, and here's how to 0:32:38.520 --> 0:32:40.320 overcome them. And then I get to do it at 0:32:40.360 --> 0:32:43.680 an even larger scale at Hinge with millions of people 0:32:43.760 --> 0:32:46.720 using the app and really saying like, let's help people 0:32:46.760 --> 0:32:50.840 stop ghosting, let's help people date safely during COVID, Let's 0:32:50.880 --> 0:32:53.800 help people video date as a low pressure vibe check. 0:32:53.840 --> 0:32:56.200 And so for me, it's all about my goal is 0:32:56.240 --> 0:32:58.880 to help people find love. But what I can add 0:32:58.920 --> 0:33:01.400 to the space is saying, let's break it down to 0:33:01.440 --> 0:33:04.520 these micro moments and help you make better decisions along 0:33:04.560 --> 0:33:04.840 the way. 0:33:04.920 --> 0:33:07.240 Which one came first? How did you get your job 0:33:07.280 --> 0:33:09.200 at Hinge? Did the book come first? And all your 0:33:09.200 --> 0:33:11.320 other interests in research? And then Hinge was like, hey, 0:33:11.600 --> 0:33:14.200 we could really add her to our team. Or did 0:33:14.200 --> 0:33:15.920 the book come after? Did you go to Hinge and 0:33:15.960 --> 0:33:18.440 just say I love love, I want to fix the world. 0:33:18.480 --> 0:33:20.040 I want to help the world. Following love, give me 0:33:20.080 --> 0:33:20.440 a job. 0:33:20.600 --> 0:33:23.080 Yeah, it's an interesting question for anyone who's listening and 0:33:23.200 --> 0:33:26.240 is thinking about making a career change, because for me, 0:33:26.360 --> 0:33:29.280 I was just like, not everyone's finds their passion, but 0:33:29.360 --> 0:33:31.680 I had really found mine. It was all about dating 0:33:31.720 --> 0:33:34.840 and navigating online dating. And so between Google and Hinge, 0:33:34.880 --> 0:33:37.880 I actually worked at Airbnb and I had an awesome job, 0:33:37.920 --> 0:33:40.680 like Airbb's a great company and I love traveling and 0:33:40.720 --> 0:33:43.720 my coworkers were great. But I was just like, I 0:33:43.880 --> 0:33:46.240 have to pursue this love thing, and so I quit 0:33:46.320 --> 0:33:48.680 my job and I just said, I'm going to figure 0:33:48.720 --> 0:33:51.040 it out. And I went step by step towards where 0:33:51.080 --> 0:33:53.560 I am now. And so one of the steps was 0:33:55.320 --> 0:33:58.200 getting a book deal, and in telling people about the 0:33:58.200 --> 0:34:01.000 book and writing the book and talking about the interviews 0:34:01.040 --> 0:34:04.440 I did. An acquaintance of mine worked at Hinge and 0:34:04.720 --> 0:34:07.360 knew about this open role on the Hinge Labs team 0:34:07.400 --> 0:34:10.400 and said, let's interview my friend Logan, And through writing 0:34:10.400 --> 0:34:12.919 the book. I kind of put my name out there 0:34:12.960 --> 0:34:15.600 as a person doing this work, and obviously a book 0:34:15.640 --> 0:34:18.040 has like gravitas. I was able to do research, I 0:34:18.080 --> 0:34:20.120 had a point of view, and then the fact that 0:34:20.160 --> 0:34:22.799 I had written this book and had this reputation is 0:34:22.840 --> 0:34:24.040 what got me the hinge job. 0:34:24.280 --> 0:34:26.279 Let's talk about your book for a second, how to 0:34:26.400 --> 0:34:28.879 Not Die Alone. I feel like the title says it all. 0:34:28.960 --> 0:34:31.319 We all need it, we all need and you know, 0:34:31.440 --> 0:34:33.160 I think that's the thing, right. One of the reasons 0:34:33.200 --> 0:34:35.239 why we got so interested in doing this podcast is 0:34:35.280 --> 0:34:39.520 because relationships are at the epicenter of what make people happy. 0:34:39.560 --> 0:34:41.719 You know, It's what we strive for, connection and love 0:34:41.719 --> 0:34:44.319 in our life. But we all seem to navigate it, 0:34:44.400 --> 0:34:45.840 or not all of us. Some of us seem to 0:34:45.920 --> 0:34:47.839 do a pretty good job, but so many of us 0:34:47.880 --> 0:34:50.360 struggle in this area, and so many of us feel 0:34:50.360 --> 0:34:52.839 like we're completely out of our depths. What was your 0:34:52.880 --> 0:34:55.600 motivator for writing How to Not Die Alone? 0:34:55.760 --> 0:34:57.920 I felt like I had something to add to the 0:34:57.960 --> 0:35:03.400 conversation because a lot of my clients are very successful people. 0:35:03.520 --> 0:35:07.360 They have a beautiful group of friends, they love their jobs, 0:35:07.480 --> 0:35:10.319 they have great relationships with their families, and so they 0:35:10.360 --> 0:35:13.359 felt very blocked. They said, dating, is this one part 0:35:13.360 --> 0:35:15.799 of my life that hasn't worked out for me. I'm 0:35:15.840 --> 0:35:18.800 willing to put in effort. What am I not getting? 0:35:18.840 --> 0:35:21.160 What am I doing wrong? And so I really felt 0:35:21.200 --> 0:35:23.560 like there was just a huge problem area people who 0:35:23.640 --> 0:35:27.560 were wonderful and could be great companions, who were desperate 0:35:27.640 --> 0:35:30.719 to find love, but they were repeating the same mistakes 0:35:30.760 --> 0:35:33.120 over and over again, and they needed somebody to come 0:35:33.160 --> 0:35:36.080 in and say, here's what you're doing wrong, here's the 0:35:36.120 --> 0:35:39.000 myths that you're following, here's how to change your behavior, 0:35:39.080 --> 0:35:42.520 here's what to do instead. And so what felt exciting 0:35:42.520 --> 0:35:45.200 for me about the book was taking everything I'd learned 0:35:45.239 --> 0:35:48.799 from my research, everything I'd learned from coaching, everything I'd 0:35:48.840 --> 0:35:51.560 learned from academics, and saying here's an a to zy 0:35:51.719 --> 0:35:53.600 guide to finding love. 0:35:53.880 --> 0:35:55.680 You touched on something just then, you said, these are 0:35:55.680 --> 0:35:57.360 the myths that you're following. What are some of the 0:35:57.400 --> 0:35:59.759 myths that you've found, And especially in your day to 0:35:59.840 --> 0:36:02.160 day when you have clients that come to you from 0:36:02.160 --> 0:36:04.080 a personal, one on one coaching, what are some of 0:36:04.120 --> 0:36:06.680 the biggest myths that you find people subscribe to when 0:36:06.680 --> 0:36:07.560 it comes to dating. 0:36:07.800 --> 0:36:10.040 So one thing that happens to me pretty often is 0:36:10.080 --> 0:36:13.000 somebody shows up for our first session and says, logan, 0:36:13.120 --> 0:36:15.920 I've been on one hundred dates in the last three years. 0:36:15.960 --> 0:36:18.239 Here's my spreadsheet of all the dates I've been on, 0:36:18.760 --> 0:36:21.239 and I want you to analyze the spreadsheet and tell 0:36:21.280 --> 0:36:23.320 me what kind of person should I be with and 0:36:23.400 --> 0:36:25.839 what should I do. And there's this feeling of like, 0:36:25.960 --> 0:36:27.919 I've been on so many dates, how hasn't it worked 0:36:27.920 --> 0:36:30.120 out yet? And what I feel sometimes with these people 0:36:30.200 --> 0:36:32.560 is that if they weren't talking to me, they could 0:36:32.600 --> 0:36:34.720 go on one hundred more dates and it also wouldn't 0:36:34.719 --> 0:36:37.920 work out. Because it's not just I haven't found him yet, 0:36:38.160 --> 0:36:41.120 or it's not just an issue of timing. That person 0:36:41.239 --> 0:36:44.400 is bringing something to dating that is holding them back. 0:36:44.880 --> 0:36:50.879 Sometimes it's their mindset, Sometimes it's their expectations. Sometimes it's 0:36:50.880 --> 0:36:53.880 an attitude of this will never work. Sometimes they're so 0:36:54.120 --> 0:36:57.200 disconnected from their body and their sexuality that they're not 0:36:57.239 --> 0:37:00.640 attracted to anyone and they're putting a wall up. And so, yes, 0:37:00.719 --> 0:37:02.640 you do need to go on dates, and effort is 0:37:02.719 --> 0:37:05.120 part of it. But if all you're doing is showing 0:37:05.239 --> 0:37:08.040 up but you're not changing your behavior. You could go 0:37:08.080 --> 0:37:10.480 on one hundred more dates and nothing would shift. 0:37:10.320 --> 0:37:12.960 Just out of curiosity for the clients that do come 0:37:12.960 --> 0:37:15.879 to see you. Is it more skewed to the women 0:37:15.960 --> 0:37:17.520 clients than men? Do you still get a lot of 0:37:17.520 --> 0:37:19.000 men that come to you for help as well? 0:37:19.200 --> 0:37:21.799 Yeah, it's been fascinating how many male clients I have. 0:37:22.000 --> 0:37:25.880 I mean, in general, the dating and relationships industry skews 0:37:26.040 --> 0:37:28.560 very female, right. Women are the ones who go to workshops, 0:37:28.600 --> 0:37:30.919 who buy the books, who care about self help, who 0:37:30.960 --> 0:37:33.400 prioritize spending money on dating. That's sort of a general 0:37:33.440 --> 0:37:36.239 trend of the industry. But I think because I use 0:37:36.360 --> 0:37:40.520 terms like sunk cost, fallacy and loss of version and 0:37:40.600 --> 0:37:44.440 status quo bias, something about grounding it in that science 0:37:44.440 --> 0:37:48.359 and research has made me feel like a safe confidant 0:37:48.480 --> 0:37:53.239 for men, and so about I wonder At any given time, 0:37:53.360 --> 0:37:57.400 probably between twenty five and thirty five percent of my 0:37:57.480 --> 0:38:01.239 clients are men. And it's been really interesting because I 0:38:01.280 --> 0:38:05.280 think it helps me get that perspective that then informs 0:38:05.320 --> 0:38:07.600 what I say to my female clients. And so obviously 0:38:07.600 --> 0:38:09.799 not all of my clients are straight, and so I 0:38:09.880 --> 0:38:14.200 have clients of different gender identities and sexual orientations in general, 0:38:14.280 --> 0:38:17.879 but among my straight clients, it's really helpful to go 0:38:18.000 --> 0:38:20.640 back to back from a forty three year old man 0:38:20.960 --> 0:38:23.279 to a forty three year old woman and see how 0:38:23.320 --> 0:38:26.799 does my advice change, how do their experiences change? And 0:38:26.880 --> 0:38:30.359 really so much of you know, what I advise people 0:38:30.400 --> 0:38:32.080 in my book and in general, is from these one 0:38:32.080 --> 0:38:34.440 to one interactions where I'm like, this person started here, 0:38:34.600 --> 0:38:37.319 I gave them this advice, they ran this experiment, this 0:38:37.360 --> 0:38:39.000 is how they found love, and now I can kind 0:38:39.000 --> 0:38:41.920 of turn that into generalized advice that hopefully a lot 0:38:41.960 --> 0:38:42.919 of people can use. 0:38:43.239 --> 0:38:46.839 Logan talk me through what are the three dating tendencies? 0:38:46.960 --> 0:38:48.880 And I know that in your book you've put them 0:38:48.880 --> 0:38:51.160 into categories that we kind of fall into and the 0:38:51.200 --> 0:38:53.680 same sort of traps that we make when we are dating. 0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:56.720 Yes, exactly. Okay, that's a perfect follow up question because 0:38:56.840 --> 0:38:59.000 when I talk about people coming to me with dating 0:38:59.080 --> 0:39:02.440 blind spots, it's often these three dating tendencies. And so 0:39:02.560 --> 0:39:05.279 for anyone listening, they can take the quiz on my website. 0:39:05.560 --> 0:39:08.160 It's logan uri dot com slash quiz, and it's all 0:39:08.200 --> 0:39:11.640 about figuring out why am I repeating the same mistakes 0:39:11.680 --> 0:39:15.160 over and over again. And so the first dating tendency 0:39:15.640 --> 0:39:20.040 is the romanticizer. And this is the person maybe you 0:39:20.239 --> 0:39:23.240 are like this, who loves love. This is the person 0:39:23.280 --> 0:39:25.880 who says, I know exactly what my soulmate is going 0:39:25.920 --> 0:39:28.040 to look like. I'm not going to use dating apps 0:39:28.040 --> 0:39:30.600 because they're not romantic. I want to have a really 0:39:30.680 --> 0:39:33.359 special how we met story. We're going to be at 0:39:33.360 --> 0:39:36.120 the farmer's market and reach for the same avocado at 0:39:36.120 --> 0:39:38.359 the same time, and we're going to fall in love. 0:39:38.440 --> 0:39:41.280 And they're very focused on the narrative and the story. 0:39:41.760 --> 0:39:44.520 They love love, and they're not really willing to be 0:39:44.600 --> 0:39:49.120 flexible because they're so focused on this one Disney rom 0:39:49.200 --> 0:39:52.880 com version of love. And the issue with the romanticizer 0:39:53.040 --> 0:39:56.160 is that they're not willing to put themselves out there 0:39:56.200 --> 0:39:58.640 because they think love will come to them and that 0:39:58.680 --> 0:40:01.319 when they do get into relationship, they expect it to 0:40:01.400 --> 0:40:05.160 be easy and effortless, which of course relationships aren't. And 0:40:05.200 --> 0:40:08.040 so the work for the romanticizer is to be more 0:40:08.080 --> 0:40:11.839 open minded about how you meet someone, what package they 0:40:11.880 --> 0:40:15.520 come in, and to also understand that love takes a 0:40:15.560 --> 0:40:16.120 lot of work. 0:40:16.480 --> 0:40:19.719 I actually did your quiz, Oh yeah, what did you get? 0:40:19.800 --> 0:40:21.920 And I have a question about it. Sure, I did 0:40:21.960 --> 0:40:25.040 the quiz, guys, and super quick background on myself logan. 0:40:25.120 --> 0:40:27.400 I am currently in a relationship that I've been in 0:40:27.520 --> 0:40:29.759 just this year, but before that, I was single for 0:40:29.800 --> 0:40:31.399 like the best part of a decade, and I had 0:40:31.719 --> 0:40:33.200 This is how this podcast came up. I had the 0:40:33.200 --> 0:40:36.600 most tumultuous, fucked up, toxic, hilarious dating life. 0:40:36.600 --> 0:40:36.840 You've it. 0:40:36.920 --> 0:40:41.200 You couldn't write it. I scored on your quiz all three. 0:40:41.520 --> 0:40:44.520 So it says that I scored very highly on all 0:40:44.520 --> 0:40:45.400 three tendencies. 0:40:46.239 --> 0:40:46.839 What does that mean? 0:40:46.880 --> 0:40:48.120 Does that mean I don't know what the hell is 0:40:48.120 --> 0:40:48.960 going on in my head? 0:40:49.120 --> 0:40:49.239 No? 0:40:49.400 --> 0:40:52.120 I mean some people do score highly on all of them, 0:40:52.160 --> 0:40:54.360 and then it really becomes a question of which is 0:40:54.360 --> 0:40:56.919 the one that's most dominant for you. And so there's 0:40:56.920 --> 0:40:58.879 nothing wrong with you if you scored highly on all 0:40:58.880 --> 0:41:00.680 three of them, but it is helped to know, like, 0:41:00.800 --> 0:41:03.160 here's my dominant one. So I'll explain the other two 0:41:03.320 --> 0:41:05.239 and then let's try to figure out for you which 0:41:05.280 --> 0:41:07.759 one is your big tendency. So I talked about the 0:41:07.840 --> 0:41:11.880 romanticizer and the next one is the maximizer, and so 0:41:12.000 --> 0:41:14.799 this is the person who says, uh, you know, the 0:41:14.840 --> 0:41:17.480 person I'm dating is fine, but couldn't there be somebody 0:41:17.520 --> 0:41:19.759 better out there? Or I like my boyfriend, but I 0:41:19.800 --> 0:41:23.640 wish you were ten percent more ambitious, or five percent hotter, 0:41:24.120 --> 0:41:27.120 or twenty percent got along better with my family. And 0:41:27.120 --> 0:41:29.040 it's like there's this image in their mind if they 0:41:29.040 --> 0:41:33.960 can put this Frankenstein person together and have this ideal partner. 0:41:34.000 --> 0:41:36.480 And the issue with the maximizer is that they always 0:41:37.320 --> 0:41:39.600 they don't look at the person in front of them 0:41:39.640 --> 0:41:42.440 and invest in the relationship and build. They always think, 0:41:42.680 --> 0:41:45.200 I'll keep swiping or I'll keep dating because there'll be 0:41:45.239 --> 0:41:48.000 somebody else out there. And so the advice from me 0:41:48.120 --> 0:41:51.880 to the maximizer is, relationships are about finding somebody great, 0:41:52.120 --> 0:41:55.160 investing in them, and building it. It's not about looking 0:41:55.200 --> 0:41:58.640 around for the perfect person, because nobody's perfect. It's about 0:41:58.640 --> 0:41:59.920 the relationship that you build. 0:42:00.600 --> 0:42:01.600 And what is number three? 0:42:01.880 --> 0:42:04.719 The third one is the hesitator, which is somebody who 0:42:05.800 --> 0:42:08.400 doesn't put themselves out there at all. They think, oh, 0:42:08.920 --> 0:42:11.480 I'll be lovable if I lose ten pounds, I'll be 0:42:11.520 --> 0:42:14.160 lovable if I get a more impressive job. I need 0:42:14.200 --> 0:42:16.360 to clean my apartment, I need more money in the bank, 0:42:16.400 --> 0:42:19.120 whatever it is, and so they're actually afraid of dating 0:42:19.160 --> 0:42:21.080 because they feel like, oh, I'm just not ready for 0:42:21.200 --> 0:42:24.200 dating yet. And so the thing about the hesitator is 0:42:24.239 --> 0:42:27.000 that you can only get better at dating by actually dating, 0:42:27.560 --> 0:42:29.600 and you can only figure out what kind of person 0:42:29.640 --> 0:42:31.799 you want to be with by going on dates with 0:42:31.840 --> 0:42:34.200 different types of people. And so the advice for the 0:42:34.239 --> 0:42:38.520 hesitator is to actually stop hesitating, stop waiting, and start dating. 0:42:38.960 --> 0:42:40.919 I think that that's a really important point too, before 0:42:40.960 --> 0:42:42.560 we get into what's wrong with me. 0:42:45.640 --> 0:42:48.520 I'm happy with my personal trolla that can weigh, that 0:42:48.600 --> 0:42:49.000 can wait. 0:42:49.160 --> 0:42:50.799 Yeah, I think it's a really important point that what 0:42:50.800 --> 0:42:53.160 you said. It's like anything else in life. You don't 0:42:53.320 --> 0:42:55.759 wake up and become a psychologist. You don't become good 0:42:55.800 --> 0:42:57.799 at something. You don't wake up and say I'm going 0:42:57.880 --> 0:43:00.120 to start surfing tomorrow, go out into the ocean. All 0:43:00.120 --> 0:43:03.160 of a sudden you're a professional surfar. Things take time, 0:43:03.200 --> 0:43:05.279 and things take practice, and things take effort and work. 0:43:05.320 --> 0:43:08.520 And dating is no different. And I know how much 0:43:08.560 --> 0:43:10.920 better I was such a killer data by the end 0:43:10.960 --> 0:43:13.000 of the ten years, I was like snapping through days. 0:43:13.040 --> 0:43:15.239 I knew what was what I never got nerves. I 0:43:15.280 --> 0:43:17.480 was so confident, but it's because I did so much effort. 0:43:17.560 --> 0:43:19.880 So I think that's something to reiterate to everybody, is like, 0:43:20.160 --> 0:43:22.120 you're only going to get better and more comfortable if 0:43:22.160 --> 0:43:25.160 you actually go out and do the job exactly. 0:43:25.520 --> 0:43:27.399 I also think on that as well. Brett like this 0:43:27.600 --> 0:43:30.040 idea of we should just be good at dating, like 0:43:30.080 --> 0:43:32.600 we should just be able to find someone and love 0:43:32.600 --> 0:43:35.719 should just happen. But like the reality is, so many 0:43:35.719 --> 0:43:38.600 people find it so challenging. It is so difficult to 0:43:38.680 --> 0:43:40.799 have a great relationship with someone and to be able 0:43:40.840 --> 0:43:43.480 to build good communication skills. And you know, we get 0:43:43.480 --> 0:43:46.799 taught everything in school. We get taught fucking Pythagoras's theorem, 0:43:46.840 --> 0:43:49.719 which we never use in life, but nobody teaches us 0:43:50.239 --> 0:43:53.600 how to really communicate with our partners and to build 0:43:53.640 --> 0:43:56.560 a strong and lasting relationship. And if you don't have 0:43:56.640 --> 0:43:58.320 that role model in your own home, like if you 0:43:58.360 --> 0:43:59.920 don't have that from your parents, or you don't have 0:44:00.080 --> 0:44:03.400 it from other people to see what is a healthy relationship, 0:44:03.920 --> 0:44:04.799 then what do you have? 0:44:04.840 --> 0:44:06.440 What TV? You have shows? 0:44:06.480 --> 0:44:08.960 Like I don't think that we necessarily have been brought up, 0:44:09.040 --> 0:44:12.839 especially our generation, with great conversations around how to find 0:44:12.840 --> 0:44:14.960 a partner, how to keep a partner, and how to 0:44:14.960 --> 0:44:16.279 build on that relationship. 0:44:16.560 --> 0:44:20.080 Now do you see logan? Which tendency do you see 0:44:20.080 --> 0:44:21.960 the most? Like after just I'm just reading them as 0:44:22.000 --> 0:44:24.840 we're talking now, and I definitely think the maximizers not me. 0:44:24.960 --> 0:44:26.840 I think I'm more of a even though I scored 0:44:26.880 --> 0:44:28.879 high on all of them. I think I'm the romanticizer 0:44:28.880 --> 0:44:31.239 and a hesitator for a long time, and I know 0:44:31.280 --> 0:44:31.640 a lot of. 0:44:31.560 --> 0:44:32.439 Our listeners are too. 0:44:32.520 --> 0:44:36.520 I was definitely a hesitator in terms of I really wanted, 0:44:36.640 --> 0:44:38.680 Like our tagline on this show is we love love 0:44:38.880 --> 0:44:41.480 like that is our tagline. So definitely the romanticizer and 0:44:41.520 --> 0:44:43.360 I do love love and it's all I've ever wanted. 0:44:44.040 --> 0:44:45.960 But for the best part of I don't know, five 0:44:46.080 --> 0:44:49.200 or six seven years, I was a hesitator and I 0:44:49.320 --> 0:44:51.680 wanted to love so badly, but I never thought I 0:44:51.760 --> 0:44:53.799 was good enough and I never thought I was deserving enough. 0:44:53.840 --> 0:44:56.080 And I was almost embarrassed to go on a date 0:44:56.120 --> 0:44:58.000 with someone because I thought that they would look at 0:44:58.000 --> 0:45:00.960 me and be like, oh, you're so disappointing, Like You're 0:45:01.000 --> 0:45:03.680 not what I thought. And I had this comparison sing drum, 0:45:03.719 --> 0:45:05.600 and so I think for me and for a lot 0:45:05.600 --> 0:45:07.600 of our listeners, I feel like the hesitator would be 0:45:07.640 --> 0:45:08.439 a really big one. 0:45:08.520 --> 0:45:09.120 Is that what you. 0:45:09.120 --> 0:45:11.920 Find would be the strongest tendency from people that come 0:45:11.960 --> 0:45:12.400 to see you. 0:45:12.840 --> 0:45:14.719 Yeah, it's a great question. I was going to guess 0:45:14.719 --> 0:45:17.960 that you are a romanticizer, partially because you have this podcast, 0:45:18.000 --> 0:45:20.080 but also just the way that you present yourself. And 0:45:20.120 --> 0:45:22.719 so I would say, like baseline, I figured you weren't 0:45:22.719 --> 0:45:25.520 a hesitator right now because you are in a relationship. 0:45:25.520 --> 0:45:28.279 And so if you are listening and you're wondering which 0:45:28.320 --> 0:45:30.239 one you are, if you're just not putting yourself out 0:45:30.239 --> 0:45:33.600 there at all, the hesitator tendency is probably strongest for you. 0:45:34.000 --> 0:45:37.040 And if not the maximizer, I would really say, it's 0:45:37.120 --> 0:45:39.239 are you someone who says what else is out there? 0:45:39.320 --> 0:45:42.600 And then for the romanticizer, it's are you someone who's 0:45:43.520 --> 0:45:46.279 very anchored on a specific way that love will look 0:45:46.440 --> 0:45:51.560 and feel. For my clients, actually, before my book came out, 0:45:51.640 --> 0:45:55.720 I would say a lot of my clients were romanticizers 0:45:55.840 --> 0:45:59.399 or maximizers. So the romanticizers were often people who came 0:45:59.520 --> 0:46:02.520 and said, my parents have this beautiful relationship and I'll 0:46:02.560 --> 0:46:05.160 never have something like that, and a lot of kind 0:46:05.160 --> 0:46:09.760 of disappointment around not having this Disney fairy tale love story. 0:46:10.120 --> 0:46:12.839 And then because I live in Silicon Valley in California, 0:46:12.920 --> 0:46:15.280 I had a lot of engineers people who were saying, 0:46:15.520 --> 0:46:18.120 I want to optimize my relationship, I want to find 0:46:18.120 --> 0:46:20.520 the perfect one, I want to research my way to it. 0:46:20.920 --> 0:46:24.160 And hesitators didn't find me because they weren't putting themselves 0:46:24.160 --> 0:46:26.040 out there enough to work with me. But I knew 0:46:26.040 --> 0:46:29.239 that they were there. Now, since my book has come out, 0:46:29.280 --> 0:46:32.080 and since we're eighteen months into the pandemic, so many 0:46:32.120 --> 0:46:34.920 people are hesitators because this has been the perfect moment 0:46:34.960 --> 0:46:38.040 for people to say, I'll date when coronavirus is over, 0:46:38.480 --> 0:46:41.200 I'll date when I know where I'm living, and people 0:46:41.280 --> 0:46:43.319 are making a lot of excuses, and a lot of 0:46:43.360 --> 0:46:45.440 people have taken this time off from dating, and then 0:46:45.520 --> 0:46:47.760 unfortunately now many people feel behind. 0:46:49.640 --> 0:46:51.279 Do you find as well that there's a bit of 0:46:51.280 --> 0:46:54.320 a conversation that happens where there's a pendulum that swings 0:46:54.360 --> 0:46:56.439 and we get this question that comes in all the time. 0:46:56.480 --> 0:46:58.719 We do a section called osk on cot and it's 0:46:58.760 --> 0:47:02.719 between this fear of settling, but also this fear of 0:47:02.760 --> 0:47:06.160 feeling like their expectations are too high. Where is that 0:47:06.239 --> 0:47:08.680 sweet spot? How does somebody know if they're settling in 0:47:08.719 --> 0:47:11.359 a relationship, or how does on the flip side of that, 0:47:11.400 --> 0:47:13.680 someone know if the bar that they're expecting in a 0:47:13.719 --> 0:47:16.719 partner is just way too high for what's realistic in 0:47:16.719 --> 0:47:17.520 someone You. 0:47:17.520 --> 0:47:19.640 Really nailed it. That's one of the main questions that 0:47:19.719 --> 0:47:21.920 people ask me. They come in, They say, am I 0:47:22.040 --> 0:47:26.120 too picky? Or am I not picky enough? And my 0:47:26.320 --> 0:47:29.560 response is that you are allowed to be picky, but 0:47:29.640 --> 0:47:32.399 about the things that matter. And so if you are 0:47:32.440 --> 0:47:35.759 rejecting guys who are not tall enough or don't make 0:47:35.880 --> 0:47:38.799 enough money, you're making a lot of assumptions around what 0:47:38.920 --> 0:47:41.040 you need and what will make you happy, long term 0:47:41.160 --> 0:47:44.960 assumptions that we are often wrong about. But where I 0:47:44.960 --> 0:47:47.440 think you can be less picky, Oh sorry, that's where 0:47:47.480 --> 0:47:53.439 I think you can be less picky around superficial resume qualities, height, income, etc. 0:47:53.800 --> 0:47:56.960 Where I want you to be pickier is in terms 0:47:57.000 --> 0:48:00.200 of is this person reliable? Is this person honest? Does 0:48:00.200 --> 0:48:03.120 this person treat you with respect? Do you admire them? 0:48:03.160 --> 0:48:06.439 Do you respect them? Can you make hard decisions with them. 0:48:07.200 --> 0:48:09.400 Do you feel like this is a person who you 0:48:09.440 --> 0:48:11.759 can build a life with. And so it's about being 0:48:11.920 --> 0:48:16.360 picky on the things that matter long term and giving 0:48:16.480 --> 0:48:18.920 up on the things that are not as important some 0:48:18.960 --> 0:48:20.600 of the superficial traits like hate. 0:48:20.920 --> 0:48:22.279 Yeah, and this is how I knew that I was 0:48:22.280 --> 0:48:24.839 a really big hesitator, and Laura really liked to point 0:48:24.840 --> 0:48:26.840 that out to me. Often. I would go on dates 0:48:26.840 --> 0:48:29.200 and that the guy would be great, the talk had 0:48:29.200 --> 0:48:30.920 been great, the banter had been great. On paper, they 0:48:30.920 --> 0:48:32.880 were fantastic, and I'd come back and Laura was like, 0:48:33.120 --> 0:48:34.600 how was it? And I was like, oh, can't see 0:48:34.640 --> 0:48:36.840 him again. She's like why not. I was like, oh, 0:48:36.880 --> 0:48:39.360 he wore a salmon shirt, or he wore socks and sandals, 0:48:39.440 --> 0:48:41.120 or like it's a no. And I would just try 0:48:41.120 --> 0:48:44.440 and find any any fault that I could. That was ridiculous, 0:48:44.440 --> 0:48:46.560 because I mean, you can change socks and sandals. You 0:48:46.640 --> 0:48:48.440 just take the socks off, don't buy them socks anymore, 0:48:48.480 --> 0:48:49.279 Like you can change that. 0:48:50.400 --> 0:48:52.480 I feel like the common and reoccurring theme with you, 0:48:52.480 --> 0:48:54.319 Britt was like you were always like, oh, he likes 0:48:54.360 --> 0:48:57.080 me too much now, and it's all too much too quickly, 0:48:57.200 --> 0:48:59.440 like I can't handle a guy who actually likes me. 0:48:59.480 --> 0:49:00.560 I want him to be mained me. 0:49:00.640 --> 0:49:04.120 To start with, we did an episode very recently around attraction, 0:49:04.239 --> 0:49:05.920 and I think you kind of just touched on it 0:49:05.960 --> 0:49:08.480 a little bit, but I'd love to get your opinions 0:49:08.520 --> 0:49:11.840 on this. We discussed whether attraction is essential in a 0:49:11.880 --> 0:49:14.760 relationship to start with, whether it's something that can build. 0:49:15.160 --> 0:49:17.440 How important do you think it is that there is 0:49:17.440 --> 0:49:21.239 that initial spark or chemistry with someone in order to 0:49:21.600 --> 0:49:25.640 continue a relationship, and at what point does attraction actually 0:49:25.680 --> 0:49:27.479 need to be in a relationship for it to last 0:49:27.560 --> 0:49:28.000 as well. 0:49:28.320 --> 0:49:30.200 This is one of the big points from my book 0:49:30.239 --> 0:49:32.400 that has really taken off, and I've been happy to 0:49:32.400 --> 0:49:34.440 have a little bit of a tagline, which is f 0:49:34.520 --> 0:49:39.080 the spark and so what that means is that almost 0:49:39.320 --> 0:49:41.719 word for word what Britney said. I used to have 0:49:41.760 --> 0:49:43.799 these coaching clients who would go on dates and they 0:49:43.800 --> 0:49:47.600 would say, Logan, I met this woman. She was beautiful 0:49:47.760 --> 0:49:50.600 and engaging and we had a great conversation. It was 0:49:50.640 --> 0:49:53.400 a really good date. Dot dot dot, I'm not going 0:49:53.480 --> 0:49:55.600 to see her again. I would say, what are you 0:49:55.600 --> 0:49:57.720 talking about? And they would say, I just didn't feel 0:49:57.760 --> 0:50:01.239 the spark, and so the spark has become this all 0:50:01.320 --> 0:50:07.879 encompassing word that means instant chemistry, initial attraction, fireworks, butterflies, unicorns, 0:50:08.000 --> 0:50:10.799 and I believe that we've been fed this lie from 0:50:10.920 --> 0:50:14.719 society that we expect to feel this instant chemistry and 0:50:14.760 --> 0:50:17.600 that if not, it's not the right match for us. 0:50:17.640 --> 0:50:19.520 And so a lot of what I'm putting out into 0:50:19.560 --> 0:50:22.479 the universe is this idea that the spark is nice, 0:50:22.480 --> 0:50:25.800 and it definitely exists, but there are many myths around 0:50:25.800 --> 0:50:29.080 the spark, and that attraction can absolutely grow over time. 0:50:29.440 --> 0:50:31.440 I think as well, we can often fall into the 0:50:31.480 --> 0:50:34.680 trap of comparison, but not just comparison with what other 0:50:34.719 --> 0:50:38.279 people have, but comparison with past relationships. I know that 0:50:38.760 --> 0:50:42.239 for a lot of our listeners who have struggled with this, 0:50:42.440 --> 0:50:44.440 once you've gone through a breakup and then you go 0:50:44.520 --> 0:50:47.320 back into the dating world and being having this feeling 0:50:47.400 --> 0:50:49.839 of like, oh, I'm never going to find someone who 0:50:49.840 --> 0:50:52.000 I love as much as my ex. And one of 0:50:52.000 --> 0:50:54.759 the big things with this is this reminder that, like, 0:50:54.920 --> 0:50:57.440 you can't compare dating someone new who you don't have 0:50:57.480 --> 0:51:00.520 a relationship with, who you've never met before, who you're 0:51:00.600 --> 0:51:03.360 just figuring out who they are as a person. You 0:51:03.400 --> 0:51:06.359 can't compare that spark to what you have formed with 0:51:06.400 --> 0:51:09.120 someone over X amount of years, like nobody's ever going 0:51:09.160 --> 0:51:11.120 to live up to that. Do you find that that 0:51:11.320 --> 0:51:14.080 is a common thing and a common theme that you 0:51:14.200 --> 0:51:17.120 find with people who are struggling getting back into dating. 0:51:17.200 --> 0:51:20.879 I've absolutely found that it's hard for people who are 0:51:20.920 --> 0:51:23.400 getting back out into the dating world after being in 0:51:23.400 --> 0:51:27.239 a long term relationship because they compare the intimacy and 0:51:27.280 --> 0:51:30.799 connection and comfort and familiarity that they felt at year 0:51:30.920 --> 0:51:34.439 four with their ex to essentially a stranger, a person 0:51:34.480 --> 0:51:36.680 who they've been on two dates with, and then they 0:51:36.719 --> 0:51:39.080 get very frustrated and then they say, oh, I wasn't 0:51:39.120 --> 0:51:43.359 myself or it wasn't natural, and it's like, yeah, you 0:51:43.440 --> 0:51:45.920 have to build to that. It takes time, and so 0:51:46.080 --> 0:51:48.040 I really agree with the advice you gave, which is 0:51:48.040 --> 0:51:50.280 that you need to be patient and you can't compare 0:51:50.880 --> 0:51:53.960 year four with someone to date too with someone. I 0:51:54.000 --> 0:51:57.080 even hear this with people with their friendships, where they say, 0:51:57.239 --> 0:51:59.600 I'm so comfortable with my friends, but on a date, 0:51:59.719 --> 0:52:03.960 I'm kind of like this actor, I'm totally different. It's like, yeah, well, 0:52:04.040 --> 0:52:06.239 you didn't always feel close with your friends. You had 0:52:06.280 --> 0:52:09.320 to build towards that. And so there's a sense of patience, 0:52:09.320 --> 0:52:13.880 which is that good things take time, momentum grows, you 0:52:13.920 --> 0:52:17.280 develop that intimacy. And so for anyone who's listening, who's 0:52:17.280 --> 0:52:19.520 getting out of a relationship and getting back into the 0:52:19.600 --> 0:52:22.080 dating pool, I would say, you can absolutely build that 0:52:22.160 --> 0:52:26.440 intimacy up again. But don't compare years of connection and 0:52:26.480 --> 0:52:28.959 friendship into a person who you've just met. 0:52:29.400 --> 0:52:32.839 What do you think about soulmates? Like penguins, We say 0:52:32.840 --> 0:52:35.120 penguins here at life uncut because penguins mte fall life. 0:52:35.160 --> 0:52:37.480 But do you think that that the idea of finding 0:52:37.480 --> 0:52:40.040 your soulmate, this one human out there in the whole world. 0:52:40.080 --> 0:52:41.600 Do you think that's flawed? Or do you think that 0:52:41.640 --> 0:52:43.440 there really is just this one person that we're meant 0:52:43.440 --> 0:52:43.839 to be with. 0:52:44.200 --> 0:52:47.920 I don't like to perpetuate the concept of soulmates because 0:52:47.920 --> 0:52:52.160 I think it really enforces some of those romanticizer tendencies. 0:52:52.520 --> 0:52:55.200 And so what will happen if somebody believes in soulmates 0:52:55.239 --> 0:52:58.120 is they'll meet a wonderful person, They'll go out with them, 0:52:58.520 --> 0:53:01.400 they'll have fun for a few three months in, they'll 0:53:01.400 --> 0:53:03.600 have a disagreement let's say around where to go on 0:53:03.640 --> 0:53:08.319 a trip, or COVID protocol or how they split their finances, 0:53:08.360 --> 0:53:11.160 and then instead of working through it, they'll say, well, 0:53:11.200 --> 0:53:14.040 this feels really hard and effortful. You must not be 0:53:14.160 --> 0:53:17.040 my soulmate. Let's break up and I'll keep looking. And 0:53:17.080 --> 0:53:21.040 it actually encourages people to give up on relationships and 0:53:21.080 --> 0:53:24.799 try to find someone else, versus a different mentality, which 0:53:24.880 --> 0:53:27.239 is that there are many people with whom you can 0:53:27.239 --> 0:53:30.560 build a relationship. You can write a lot of love 0:53:30.600 --> 0:53:34.480 stories with different people, and that means that it's much 0:53:34.520 --> 0:53:37.759 more about finding somebody great and committing to writing that 0:53:37.800 --> 0:53:41.320 story together versus just the act of finding your soulmate. 0:53:41.440 --> 0:53:43.400 So I'd say, I don't believe that there's a one. 0:53:43.480 --> 0:53:45.919 I don't believe that there's a soulmate. And I hope 0:53:45.920 --> 0:53:49.600 that you feel empowered that there's many people with whom 0:53:49.640 --> 0:53:51.239 you could build a great relationship. 0:53:51.760 --> 0:53:53.840 Yeah, I think we have many soul Like when we 0:53:53.880 --> 0:53:56.360 say penguins, we say penguin like, this is the person 0:53:56.360 --> 0:53:58.080 that I've chosen, and this is the person I think 0:53:58.120 --> 0:54:00.560 then I'm going to be with forever. And I spoke 0:54:00.600 --> 0:54:03.080 about it in private, we've spoken about on the podcast, 0:54:03.080 --> 0:54:04.920 and I really do think that there are so many 0:54:05.200 --> 0:54:07.480 soulmates for you at different points of your life, at 0:54:07.520 --> 0:54:10.080 different ages and when you need them, and maybe you do. 0:54:10.360 --> 0:54:11.840 You know, I've got a friend that has been with 0:54:11.840 --> 0:54:13.800 a partner since that were fifteen. They've been together forever, 0:54:13.880 --> 0:54:16.160 they'll be together forever. And I've got other friends that 0:54:16.160 --> 0:54:18.120 have never even dated and they're in their thirties. But 0:54:18.600 --> 0:54:22.040 I think people come into your life when you need them. 0:54:22.080 --> 0:54:24.800 And I completely agree with you. If we put this soulmate, 0:54:24.880 --> 0:54:27.520 this one human in the billions of people in the world, 0:54:27.640 --> 0:54:30.360 up on this pedestal and say I need to go 0:54:30.360 --> 0:54:31.719 and find this one person, I think it's going to 0:54:31.760 --> 0:54:33.640 be a really long and lonely journey. 0:54:33.800 --> 0:54:36.200 I also think as well, it subscribes to this idea 0:54:36.239 --> 0:54:38.800 that one person can give you everything in life, which 0:54:39.080 --> 0:54:41.759 we all know it's not possible, and it's such an 0:54:41.840 --> 0:54:45.040 unfair and unrealistic pressure and expectation to put on someone 0:54:45.280 --> 0:54:48.640 that they should provide for you all of this. Be 0:54:48.719 --> 0:54:51.359 your comfort, be your support person, Be the person who 0:54:51.360 --> 0:54:53.759 you find funny, like we need to have that from 0:54:53.760 --> 0:54:55.200 other people in our lives. We need to get that 0:54:55.239 --> 0:54:57.040 from friends, We need to get that from work, like 0:54:57.120 --> 0:54:58.880 we have to have other things that stimulate us. And 0:54:58.880 --> 0:55:02.080 it's just like you're setting your relationship up to fail 0:55:02.120 --> 0:55:06.200 if you expect your partner to give you absolutely everything. Logan, 0:55:06.280 --> 0:55:08.040 there was something on your Instagram which I wanted to 0:55:08.080 --> 0:55:09.680 ask you about. There was one of your posts and 0:55:09.719 --> 0:55:12.080 it said the hard work of love is finding someone 0:55:12.200 --> 0:55:15.120 and that's crossed out. Tell us what you mean by this. 0:55:15.840 --> 0:55:18.960 Yes, so I call this the Happily ever After fallacy, 0:55:19.200 --> 0:55:22.120 And this is exactly what you said. It's the mistaken 0:55:22.160 --> 0:55:25.160 belief that the hard work of love is finding that person. 0:55:25.680 --> 0:55:27.960 And the truth is, yes, that is really hard. It's 0:55:27.960 --> 0:55:29.799 hard to find the person, it's hard to say yes, 0:55:29.880 --> 0:55:31.840 it's hard to commit, it's hard to say no to 0:55:31.880 --> 0:55:34.960 other options. But that's only when the hard work begins. 0:55:35.520 --> 0:55:40.240 The hard work continues. It takes effort to stay connected 0:55:40.280 --> 0:55:43.279 to your partner, it takes effort to invest in your 0:55:43.280 --> 0:55:46.120 relationship after a long day of work. It takes effort 0:55:46.239 --> 0:55:49.160 to keep the love and sex and passion alive. And 0:55:49.200 --> 0:55:52.040 so the Happily ever After fallacy is this idea that 0:55:52.080 --> 0:55:54.759 at the end of the Disney movie or the rom 0:55:54.800 --> 0:55:58.000 com we're just supposed to believe they overcame all of 0:55:58.040 --> 0:56:00.920 the trials and tribulations, they found each other, they wound 0:56:00.960 --> 0:56:04.480 up together, and now they live happily ever after, No, 0:56:04.920 --> 0:56:07.160 there's no assumption to that they have to either keep 0:56:07.200 --> 0:56:09.759 putting in the work and they'll live together well, or 0:56:09.800 --> 0:56:11.960 they choose not to. And so what I'm trying to 0:56:12.000 --> 0:56:14.920 do with posts like that is help orient people on 0:56:14.960 --> 0:56:16.880 the fact that if you're in a relationship and it 0:56:16.920 --> 0:56:20.239 feels like work, you're doing it right, not wrong. A 0:56:20.280 --> 0:56:22.239 lot of people come to me with the grass as 0:56:22.239 --> 0:56:26.480 always greener mentality, and that's really what informs the maximizer. 0:56:26.600 --> 0:56:30.439 They believe, should I commit to this person and get 0:56:30.480 --> 0:56:32.359 married or have a child, or be in a long 0:56:32.440 --> 0:56:34.640 term relationship, or should I break up with them and 0:56:34.680 --> 0:56:36.920 see if there's somebody better out there. And so that 0:56:37.239 --> 0:56:40.640 is a pretty modern phenomenon, this idea that I can 0:56:40.760 --> 0:56:43.440 just keep going and find more people. In the past, 0:56:43.840 --> 0:56:45.799 you would date within your village, you would date within 0:56:45.840 --> 0:56:48.880 your apartment building, within your high school, and you said, 0:56:49.160 --> 0:56:51.719 all right, I've Bill and Belinda on my street, and 0:56:51.760 --> 0:56:53.920 those are my choices, and I'm going to be with 0:56:54.000 --> 0:56:55.880 one of them, and now it feels like there's a 0:56:55.920 --> 0:56:59.239 lot of choices. Some of the other cultural factors that 0:56:59.280 --> 0:57:02.040 are at play. One is that a lot of us 0:57:02.120 --> 0:57:07.640 have divorced parents, and we don't have a blueprint for relationships, 0:57:07.680 --> 0:57:12.799 and either our parents were divorced or unhappily married. And 0:57:12.840 --> 0:57:14.880 many people say, I don't know what it looks like 0:57:15.000 --> 0:57:17.680 to build a relationship. I don't know what it looks 0:57:17.720 --> 0:57:20.040 like to fight and make up. So that's one factor. 0:57:20.520 --> 0:57:24.080 Another factor is what Laura talked about, which is increasing 0:57:24.200 --> 0:57:27.640 expectations of what to get out of a relationship. In 0:57:27.680 --> 0:57:29.760 the past, you might have said, this is a person 0:57:29.840 --> 0:57:33.200 who I build a house with, raise a family with, 0:57:33.960 --> 0:57:36.200 raise a farm with, and we keep a roof over 0:57:36.240 --> 0:57:38.280 our heads and food in our mouths. You weren't expecting 0:57:38.360 --> 0:57:41.880 to self actualize. And now we expect our partner to 0:57:42.360 --> 0:57:45.640 be so many things to us. And those rising expectations 0:57:45.640 --> 0:57:48.800 are sometimes good because sometimes when you ask for a lot, 0:57:48.840 --> 0:57:51.840 you get a lot, but also means many people are disappointed. 0:57:52.000 --> 0:57:56.560 And the Northwestern professor Eli Finkel, he wrote this great 0:57:56.600 --> 0:57:59.360 book called the All or Nothing Marriage, which is the 0:57:59.400 --> 0:58:03.320 best relationships of today are better than the best relationships 0:58:03.320 --> 0:58:06.600 in the past, but many people now get divorced for 0:58:06.720 --> 0:58:10.200 reasons that our grandparents or even parents could never have imagined. 0:58:10.800 --> 0:58:13.040 So in saying that the flip side of this is 0:58:13.280 --> 0:58:15.959 in a relationship, when do you know to tap out? 0:58:16.000 --> 0:58:18.640 Like what is the baseline for when we should be 0:58:18.680 --> 0:58:21.360 saying Okay, I'm not I'm not happy in this anymore. 0:58:21.400 --> 0:58:23.360 I don't want to work through this. Like how does 0:58:23.360 --> 0:58:26.920 someone know if the way that they're feeling is valid 0:58:27.000 --> 0:58:30.880 enough or strong enough to go this is the reason 0:58:30.920 --> 0:58:34.600 why I should break up with my partner versus going okay, 0:58:34.960 --> 0:58:37.520 I really need to kind of dig deep and see 0:58:37.560 --> 0:58:39.360 where we're at in six months time and put some 0:58:39.400 --> 0:58:39.760 effort in. 0:58:40.040 --> 0:58:42.560 So one of the interesting parts of my job is 0:58:42.600 --> 0:58:45.160 I do this thing on the side called breakup consulting, 0:58:45.720 --> 0:58:47.880 which is just a funny way of saying that people 0:58:47.920 --> 0:58:49.920 call me and say should I stay or should I go? 0:58:50.880 --> 0:58:53.120 Like flip a coin, Yeah, I mean, I take this 0:58:53.200 --> 0:58:56.240 role so seriously because I'm holding their relationship future in 0:58:56.280 --> 0:58:59.120 my hands, and there's this other person whose feelings need 0:58:59.200 --> 0:59:01.280 to be considered even though they're not on the call. 0:59:01.320 --> 0:59:05.040 And I really take this as a a big spiritual 0:59:05.280 --> 0:59:09.200 and emotional ask and I have a series of questions 0:59:09.200 --> 0:59:12.280 that I asked them to help them understand is this 0:59:12.320 --> 0:59:15.320 the right relationship for them? And so one is I 0:59:15.360 --> 0:59:18.600 think some people are hitchers, people who stay in relationships 0:59:18.680 --> 0:59:21.919 for too long, who get into relationship and say, well, 0:59:22.000 --> 0:59:23.880 I've already been in this for five years. I don't 0:59:23.880 --> 0:59:26.760 want to start over. And some people are ditchers and 0:59:26.800 --> 0:59:30.160 they stay in relationships too short. They give up after 0:59:30.240 --> 0:59:33.080 five months. They say we had the spark, but it fizzled, 0:59:33.360 --> 0:59:35.680 or I want to meet someone new. And so one 0:59:35.720 --> 0:59:39.840 thing is just do they have a historical trend of 0:59:39.880 --> 0:59:43.320 being a hitcher or a ditcher. Another thing I asked them, 0:59:43.600 --> 0:59:47.560 which I called the wardrobe test question, is if your 0:59:47.680 --> 0:59:51.480 partner were a piece of clothing in your closet, what 0:59:51.720 --> 0:59:55.480 piece of clothing would they be. This is good and 0:59:55.480 --> 0:59:58.880 this question is super random and abstract. But here I'll 0:59:58.920 --> 1:00:01.160 ask I love it, Brittany, that's your answer, like gut 1:00:01.160 --> 1:00:02.560 reaction to that question. 1:00:02.440 --> 1:00:05.680 I would say, my partner is a plane, what tea 1:00:05.880 --> 1:00:08.440 or dmim cut off shorts, And that's because I. 1:00:08.400 --> 1:00:09.240 Wear that every day. 1:00:09.360 --> 1:00:11.760 That's like my go to It's what I'm comfortable, and 1:00:11.800 --> 1:00:14.720 it's what I just feel like my true self in. 1:00:15.040 --> 1:00:18.000 I think that's a beautiful answer. And so I've asked 1:00:18.000 --> 1:00:20.240 this question to dozens of people, and sometimes I hear 1:00:20.360 --> 1:00:24.960 answers like yours, where it's the go to pair of leggings, 1:00:25.040 --> 1:00:27.840 favorite T shirt, favorite jacket, the thing that makes you 1:00:27.880 --> 1:00:31.560 feel comfortable, warm, like yourself. But I've also heard very 1:00:31.600 --> 1:00:34.960 bad answers. I've heard my boyfriend is a wool sweater 1:00:35.040 --> 1:00:37.520 who keeps me warm, but it's itchy, so I take 1:00:37.560 --> 1:00:41.720 it off, or my girlfriend is a scrubby shirt. I 1:00:41.800 --> 1:00:44.080 wear it to the gym, but I hope nobody sees me. 1:00:44.400 --> 1:00:46.160 I don't always smells, and I use it to wipe 1:00:46.160 --> 1:00:47.080 out my sweat. 1:00:47.160 --> 1:00:49.560 Exactly, and I should have thrown it out three years ago. 1:00:49.600 --> 1:00:51.960 And so it's because this question is abstract and sort 1:00:52.000 --> 1:00:55.160 of bizarre, people give their gut reactions, and in giving 1:00:55.160 --> 1:00:57.880 their gut reactions, they say, damn, I really need to 1:00:57.960 --> 1:00:59.040 leave this relationship. 1:00:59.160 --> 1:01:01.720 Well, I was gonna that's interesting, Laura, what do you 1:01:01.720 --> 1:01:04.040 think Matt is to you? Straight off the top of 1:01:04.080 --> 1:01:04.439 your head. 1:01:04.560 --> 1:01:06.960 I was gonna say he's like my favorite warm jumper, 1:01:07.120 --> 1:01:08.920 but then when you said it was it's not the 1:01:08.960 --> 1:01:10.040 one I want to take off. It's the one I 1:01:10.040 --> 1:01:11.800 want to slap in the couch and like around the 1:01:11.800 --> 1:01:13.320 house and never ever take off. 1:01:13.680 --> 1:01:15.840 Oh, I think it's is this an item you like? 1:01:16.040 --> 1:01:18.760 Is this an item that represents you? I do ask 1:01:18.800 --> 1:01:21.600 them all these questions, but sometimes that's the most provocative one, 1:01:21.600 --> 1:01:24.479 because when they hear themselves saying something like the pair 1:01:24.520 --> 1:01:26.760 of genes that I should have gotten rid of because 1:01:26.760 --> 1:01:29.400 they're too tight and they don't fit anymore, They're like, M, 1:01:29.560 --> 1:01:31.120 I think I've outgrown the relationship. 1:01:31.600 --> 1:01:33.280 I really love this because I know that this is 1:01:33.320 --> 1:01:35.680 something that so many people struggle with, and I think 1:01:35.720 --> 1:01:38.840 a lot of people check out of relationships based on 1:01:39.240 --> 1:01:39.880 a feeling. 1:01:39.920 --> 1:01:40.640 We talk a lot. 1:01:40.480 --> 1:01:43.760 About the ick and we like the amount of questions 1:01:43.800 --> 1:01:45.760 that we have come in around breakups. It's so hard 1:01:45.800 --> 1:01:48.000 because we can't just say to someone and I'm sure 1:01:48.040 --> 1:01:50.160 you feel the exact same way, yes you. 1:01:50.120 --> 1:01:52.520 Should break up with them. No, you shouldn't break. 1:01:52.320 --> 1:01:54.960 Up with them, because you don't know the nuances around 1:01:54.960 --> 1:01:58.080 that person's relationship, especially when I mean sometimes it's very 1:01:58.080 --> 1:02:00.280 black and white. If there's something that's happened, or if 1:02:00.280 --> 1:02:03.360 there's disrespect, or if there's bigger things at play. Sometimes 1:02:03.360 --> 1:02:06.840 it can be black and white, but mostly it's people 1:02:06.840 --> 1:02:08.840 who have been with their partners and maybe have gotten 1:02:08.880 --> 1:02:11.400 past the honeymoon. They're in a really comfortable phase of 1:02:11.440 --> 1:02:14.400 the relationship and they're a bit bored. And I guess 1:02:14.800 --> 1:02:17.440 we kind of expect that our partners should always excite 1:02:17.520 --> 1:02:19.680 us and should always be bringing something new to the 1:02:19.720 --> 1:02:22.600 table to keep us interesting and interested. But we also 1:02:22.680 --> 1:02:24.800 have to be that person as well. We also have 1:02:24.880 --> 1:02:27.000 to be the ones putting the effort into the relationship. 1:02:27.200 --> 1:02:29.680 Yeah, Laura, I agree with everything you're saying, and it's 1:02:29.680 --> 1:02:31.760 actually a great segue from what we were just talking 1:02:31.800 --> 1:02:34.920 about with the wardrobe test, because sometimes I'll say to 1:02:34.960 --> 1:02:37.920 someone how do you want your partner to make you feel? 1:02:37.920 --> 1:02:40.280 And they'll say, I want to find someone who's like 1:02:40.360 --> 1:02:44.480 my favorite hooded sweatshirt with little holes for the thumb, 1:02:44.480 --> 1:02:47.120 where it's my running sweatshirt, and I feel safe and 1:02:47.160 --> 1:02:50.560 I feel warm and I can go anywhere. And it's like, Okay, well, 1:02:50.960 --> 1:02:52.720 who are you going to be? How are you going 1:02:52.800 --> 1:02:55.000 to show up in the relationship? And so a lot 1:02:55.040 --> 1:02:57.520 of my book and my work is advising people on 1:02:57.600 --> 1:02:59.680 who to choose, but how do you get somebody to 1:02:59.760 --> 1:03:04.240 choose you? And the answer there is have your actions, 1:03:04.280 --> 1:03:06.720 follow your words, do what you say you're gonna do, 1:03:06.920 --> 1:03:11.360 Be reliable, be thoughtful, put the other person first, Surprise them, 1:03:11.520 --> 1:03:15.200 delight them, learn about their sexual desires and how to 1:03:15.200 --> 1:03:17.640 make them happy and so. Yeah. So a big part 1:03:17.680 --> 1:03:20.440 of modern dating is choosing who to be with. But 1:03:20.480 --> 1:03:23.000 you also want to be the type of person who 1:03:23.040 --> 1:03:23.880 will get chosen. 1:03:23.960 --> 1:03:27.040 That's such a big question. Like when you were like, 1:03:27.320 --> 1:03:28.680 people come to you and they say, how do I 1:03:28.720 --> 1:03:29.880 make people choose me? 1:03:30.640 --> 1:03:31.440 That's exactly it. 1:03:31.520 --> 1:03:33.000 But I think that you don't want to You don't 1:03:33.000 --> 1:03:35.040 want to dig too deep into that and say, well, 1:03:35.280 --> 1:03:36.920 I need to change this and this and this about 1:03:36.920 --> 1:03:39.560 myself so that people like me better, because that's going 1:03:39.640 --> 1:03:42.360 to unravel. That's not a forever plan. I think's you 1:03:42.440 --> 1:03:45.000 need to obviously be the energy and be what you 1:03:45.600 --> 1:03:48.160 want back in return, but also you need to be 1:03:48.200 --> 1:03:51.440 one hundred percent yourself because if you're not, chances are 1:03:51.640 --> 1:03:53.360 you can only keep this act up for one year 1:03:53.440 --> 1:03:55.439 or two years or three ys, and once you show 1:03:55.440 --> 1:03:57.560 you true colors, someone's like, hang on, this is not 1:03:57.600 --> 1:03:59.240 what I signed up for. I'm not quite sure who 1:03:59.240 --> 1:03:59.480 you are. 1:03:59.560 --> 1:04:02.280 Don't though that? Like, what if yourself is just lazy 1:04:02.280 --> 1:04:05.360 in relationship? Like what if you are someone who gets lazy? 1:04:05.640 --> 1:04:07.560 Like that's not good enough. Maybe you do have to 1:04:07.680 --> 1:04:10.120 kind of be somebody, not be somebody else, but you 1:04:10.160 --> 1:04:12.040 have to do some personal work to be a better 1:04:12.080 --> 1:04:15.240 person to be within relationships. I think, you know, maybe 1:04:15.280 --> 1:04:17.840 it's too easy to say, oh, like you have to 1:04:17.960 --> 1:04:20.640 just be genuinely you and you can't be anybody else. 1:04:20.640 --> 1:04:22.880 Like we can be us, but also be a good 1:04:23.000 --> 1:04:23.640 version of us. 1:04:23.760 --> 1:04:25.120 Yeah, be the best version of you. 1:04:25.280 --> 1:04:29.560 Yeah, exactly, exactly, Logan. Let's get into talking about dating profiles, 1:04:29.600 --> 1:04:33.360 which obviously you are the absolute expert. You are the 1:04:33.480 --> 1:04:36.080 queen of dating profiles and have seen many in your time. 1:04:36.760 --> 1:04:40.280 What do you think makes a good dating profile? Like 1:04:40.320 --> 1:04:42.280 what are the key things that we should be doing 1:04:42.280 --> 1:04:43.880 when we're setting up our dating apps? 1:04:44.400 --> 1:04:45.120 Like what is it? 1:04:45.240 --> 1:04:47.560 Yes, I love I would love to be your queen 1:04:47.560 --> 1:04:51.040 of dating app profile. So the first thing is understanding 1:04:51.080 --> 1:04:53.120 what's the point of a profile? And the point of 1:04:53.160 --> 1:04:57.520 a profile is to tell your story. You're really a storyteller, 1:04:57.680 --> 1:05:01.240 You're a curator, you're an editor, and you're putting forward 1:05:01.560 --> 1:05:04.440 who you are, and so you want to tell your 1:05:04.440 --> 1:05:07.720 story with variety. I was just looking at a woman's 1:05:07.760 --> 1:05:11.560 profile where every single picture was her with her big, 1:05:11.640 --> 1:05:15.360 curly blonde hair, looking over her right hand shoulder, wearing 1:05:15.360 --> 1:05:17.560 a different dress, and I was like, I get it, 1:05:17.600 --> 1:05:20.520 you have beautiful blonde, curly hair, but I'm only learning 1:05:20.600 --> 1:05:21.640 one thing about you. 1:05:21.640 --> 1:05:22.720 You look better from the lift. 1:05:22.800 --> 1:05:25.400 Yeah, yeah, exactly right. We know you're a good side 1:05:25.520 --> 1:05:28.920 and it just it lacked variety. And so here is 1:05:28.960 --> 1:05:31.200 the formula that I would use for a great profile. 1:05:31.440 --> 1:05:34.880 The first picture should be a clear headshot. This is 1:05:34.920 --> 1:05:38.400 what my face looks like, no filters, no sunglasses, nobody 1:05:38.440 --> 1:05:40.920 else in it. This is what I look like. Do 1:05:40.960 --> 1:05:43.440 you like it? Then I would have at least one 1:05:43.480 --> 1:05:45.840 photo with your full bodies that we can get a 1:05:45.920 --> 1:05:49.120 sense of what you look like. Then I would have 1:05:49.320 --> 1:05:52.160 at least one photo with some family or friends to 1:05:52.240 --> 1:05:55.720 show us that you have an active social life. One picture, 1:05:55.800 --> 1:05:59.560 ideally of you doing something that you love, so hiking, 1:06:00.240 --> 1:06:03.520 giving a talk, playing an instrument, cooking, whatever that is. 1:06:03.560 --> 1:06:05.640 I want to catch you candid and in the moment, 1:06:05.760 --> 1:06:09.320 really feeling joyful and like yourself, and then just show 1:06:09.400 --> 1:06:12.320 us different sides of your personality. If you're really goofy 1:06:12.360 --> 1:06:15.160 but all your photos are of you from different friends' weddings, 1:06:15.400 --> 1:06:17.400 we're actually going to think that you're more formal than 1:06:17.440 --> 1:06:21.360 you are. And so your photos should show variety, they 1:06:21.400 --> 1:06:24.000 should show different side of yourself, and they should really 1:06:24.000 --> 1:06:25.920 answer some of the basic questions. 1:06:25.520 --> 1:06:26.520 Like what do you look like? 1:06:27.480 --> 1:06:31.400 Then with your profile prompts, So for Hinge, obviously you 1:06:31.440 --> 1:06:33.560 can fill out prompts about. 1:06:33.240 --> 1:06:33.880 Who you are. 1:06:34.720 --> 1:06:37.920 The goal is to be specific and to spark conversation. 1:06:38.520 --> 1:06:41.120 So many profiles I look at say I'm looking for 1:06:41.200 --> 1:06:44.960 someone curious who loves adventure, or I'm looking for someone 1:06:45.240 --> 1:06:47.280 who's honest, and it's like, how is that going to 1:06:47.320 --> 1:06:49.440 spark a conversation. Nobody's going to write to you and 1:06:49.480 --> 1:06:52.560 be like, hey, Laura, we should date. I'm honest. Like, no, 1:06:52.640 --> 1:06:55.960 there's no response to that. But if you write I'm 1:06:56.040 --> 1:06:59.080 the kind of weird who dot dot dot would rather 1:06:59.120 --> 1:07:01.760 spend Friday night doing a puzzle then going to a bar, 1:07:02.240 --> 1:07:05.000 someone can be like cool, I'll bring the puzzle, you 1:07:05.000 --> 1:07:08.120 bring the pretzels or whatever it is. It's like, you 1:07:08.160 --> 1:07:10.880 want to spark an idea and someone so that they say, 1:07:11.200 --> 1:07:12.960 I know how to respond to that, and I'm going 1:07:13.000 --> 1:07:14.320 to send you a message. 1:07:14.520 --> 1:07:17.520 And what are your thoughts on women making the first move? Now, 1:07:17.560 --> 1:07:19.720 we have very strong thoughts on this, but I would 1:07:19.720 --> 1:07:21.400 love to know because we get a lot of women 1:07:21.480 --> 1:07:23.240 that are a bit scared to make the first move, 1:07:23.240 --> 1:07:25.200 a lot of women that say, you know, I'm really 1:07:25.240 --> 1:07:27.680 old fashioned, and I think they should come to me, 1:07:27.720 --> 1:07:29.000 and I think they should chase me and they should 1:07:29.000 --> 1:07:30.680 put all the effort in. What are your thoughts on that. 1:07:30.840 --> 1:07:33.000 All of the research that we've done at HINGE has 1:07:33.040 --> 1:07:35.800 shown that when women make the first move, they're really 1:07:35.840 --> 1:07:39.280 happy about it. It helps people avoid burnout because it 1:07:39.320 --> 1:07:40.920 makes you feel in control. 1:07:41.280 --> 1:07:41.960 So remember this. 1:07:42.200 --> 1:07:44.600 The more in control you feel, the more like you 1:07:44.640 --> 1:07:47.280 feel like you're in the driver's seat, the happier you 1:07:47.320 --> 1:07:49.920 are with dating, the more successful you are with dating, 1:07:50.200 --> 1:07:52.480 the more dates you go on, and the less likely 1:07:52.560 --> 1:07:54.960 you are to be burned out. And so I would 1:07:54.960 --> 1:07:59.200 say throw out your preconceived notions of playing games or waiting, 1:07:59.560 --> 1:08:01.760 because the people who go after what they want are 1:08:01.760 --> 1:08:03.200 the people who get what they want. 1:08:03.480 --> 1:08:05.760 Yeah, and there's nothing, there's like, no worse feeling. I 1:08:05.800 --> 1:08:08.160 don't know about anybody else, but I detest it. But 1:08:08.240 --> 1:08:11.560 a feeling of this limbo of whiting. Are they gonna 1:08:11.560 --> 1:08:13.680 text me? Are they gonna write back? Are they ever 1:08:13.720 --> 1:08:17.040 gonna ask me out? Like this feeling of anxiety or 1:08:17.040 --> 1:08:19.800 being unsure about what's happening. I to test that. I've 1:08:19.840 --> 1:08:22.400 always been a first move. I've always been to go 1:08:22.439 --> 1:08:24.320 after what I want. And because what's the worst thing 1:08:24.400 --> 1:08:25.840 is gonna happen, You're gonna ask them out and they 1:08:25.840 --> 1:08:27.800 say no, You're like cool. At least now I don't 1:08:27.800 --> 1:08:30.519 waste the next three weeks wondering if you're gonna ask 1:08:30.560 --> 1:08:30.880 me out. 1:08:31.000 --> 1:08:33.439 Totally shoot your shot. And honestly, we've done so much 1:08:33.479 --> 1:08:36.439 research on this at hinge. Playing games is not a 1:08:36.439 --> 1:08:39.080 good strategy. The people who get the most dates are 1:08:39.120 --> 1:08:44.599 the people who send comments, send roses, send likes, and 1:08:44.880 --> 1:08:47.280 ask people on dates, because those are the people who 1:08:47.280 --> 1:08:50.439 are actually engaging. And the people who sit back and 1:08:50.479 --> 1:08:53.280 say I'll let him come to me, or none of 1:08:53.280 --> 1:08:55.439 these people are good enough, I'll wait around. It's like 1:08:55.479 --> 1:08:58.360 they're just not getting their experience, they're not getting better 1:08:58.400 --> 1:09:00.400 at dating, and they're not doing stuff like that. So 1:09:00.720 --> 1:09:04.160 respond to messages, go on dates and stop waiting for 1:09:04.240 --> 1:09:05.639 love to just happen to you. 1:09:06.000 --> 1:09:08.519 How long do you think someone should wait? So, Like, 1:09:08.560 --> 1:09:10.840 after you've matched with someone on a dating app and 1:09:10.880 --> 1:09:14.120 you've been sending messages back and forth, how long should 1:09:14.160 --> 1:09:19.120 it take between having that initial conversation like digitally and 1:09:19.240 --> 1:09:21.160 turning that into an IRL meeting. 1:09:21.560 --> 1:09:24.000 We've done research on this, and we've found that after 1:09:24.080 --> 1:09:26.960 four to five days is this sweet spot where you've 1:09:27.000 --> 1:09:29.280 talked enough to get a sense of the person and 1:09:29.320 --> 1:09:31.920 to make sure that there's someone you're interested in. But 1:09:32.040 --> 1:09:34.439 it's not so long that the moment has passed. So 1:09:34.520 --> 1:09:36.680 after four or five days you can say something like, 1:09:37.040 --> 1:09:39.040 I'm really enjoying getting to know you on the app. 1:09:39.320 --> 1:09:41.519 Let's see if we have this much chemistry in person 1:09:41.920 --> 1:09:44.280 or I'm not a big texture. Do you want to 1:09:44.320 --> 1:09:46.800 hop on FaceTime and see if we hit it off? 1:09:46.960 --> 1:09:49.599 Do whatever you can to move from the app to texting, 1:09:50.000 --> 1:09:52.880 or from the app to a phone call, a video date, 1:09:53.000 --> 1:09:56.120 or an in person date, because what you don't want 1:09:56.160 --> 1:09:59.080 to do is get trapped in this pattern of non 1:09:59.120 --> 1:10:02.080 stop texting. And my mantra that I want you to 1:10:02.160 --> 1:10:05.160 keep in mind is you're looking for a partner not 1:10:05.360 --> 1:10:06.000 a pen pal. 1:10:06.320 --> 1:10:08.920 It's so true, and there's so many people on apps 1:10:08.920 --> 1:10:11.920 who will just penpower you to death and nothing comes 1:10:11.920 --> 1:10:14.439 of it. It's a waste of time, statue is. For 1:10:14.479 --> 1:10:17.040 a little while, it's like it's exciting and it's nice 1:10:17.080 --> 1:10:19.920 to meet someone and it's flattering, but like it truly 1:10:20.000 --> 1:10:22.920 is a waste of time, and nobody has that much time. 1:10:22.800 --> 1:10:23.720 At the moment or ever. 1:10:24.000 --> 1:10:26.040 The thing is, I mean, well, a lot of people 1:10:26.080 --> 1:10:28.760 have a lot of time at the moment, but I 1:10:28.800 --> 1:10:30.560 think something and I'm talking to a friend about this 1:10:30.680 --> 1:10:32.599 at the moment. Like one of my girlfriends has been 1:10:32.640 --> 1:10:35.120 talking to this guy. She's really into him, and she's 1:10:35.160 --> 1:10:39.120 been talking to him for a goh, probably three months, 1:10:39.160 --> 1:10:41.799 but because of lockdown, they haven't been able to meet. 1:10:42.040 --> 1:10:43.000 So she's talking on stuff. 1:10:43.040 --> 1:10:44.759 She's like, I think that he could be like something 1:10:44.800 --> 1:10:46.640 really really serious. I think he could be it. We 1:10:46.680 --> 1:10:49.320 just get along so much. We text all day and 1:10:49.360 --> 1:10:52.080 like we have some great phone conversations and I just 1:10:52.120 --> 1:10:53.360 had to say to her in the last few days, 1:10:53.400 --> 1:10:55.320 I's I just want you to be really aware that 1:10:56.120 --> 1:10:59.559 this might not be the same chemistry in real life. 1:10:59.600 --> 1:11:02.040 And I have something I have stumbled across in the past, 1:11:02.080 --> 1:11:03.600 and I just know it all too well. But you 1:11:03.600 --> 1:11:06.120 can get wrapped up in this fantasy and everything's so 1:11:06.280 --> 1:11:08.680 romantic and she's like, yeah, but he says all the 1:11:08.800 --> 1:11:11.120 right things, and he just seems so loyal, and I'm like, 1:11:11.120 --> 1:11:12.840 but you've never He's just saying what you want him 1:11:12.840 --> 1:11:15.320 to hear. Like, I think people, and I wonder if 1:11:15.400 --> 1:11:18.000 this is something you're seeing now through COVID. For the 1:11:18.080 --> 1:11:20.559 last two years, this is what dating has been. People 1:11:20.640 --> 1:11:23.720 have had to form these relationships purely online. And I 1:11:23.760 --> 1:11:25.760 know there's been a lot of success stories, but it's 1:11:25.800 --> 1:11:27.799 just something to be warial for people that set themselves 1:11:27.880 --> 1:11:31.400 up for failure when they haven't physically met absolutely. 1:11:31.840 --> 1:11:33.920 So I'll speak to it in non COVID terms, and 1:11:33.920 --> 1:11:36.360 then I'll speak to it during the pandemic in lockdown. 1:11:36.479 --> 1:11:39.280 So in general, my advice is that you should get 1:11:39.280 --> 1:11:42.240 to the data as quickly as possible, because what happens 1:11:42.280 --> 1:11:45.800 when you keep texting NonStop is you build up, as 1:11:45.840 --> 1:11:49.200 you said, a fantasy in your head. You think, oh, 1:11:49.479 --> 1:11:52.040 we get along so well, we have great texting banter, 1:11:52.800 --> 1:11:55.600 we pass memes back and forth. He's so funny, and 1:11:55.640 --> 1:11:58.720 you just imagine, oh, this is my person and that 1:11:58.800 --> 1:12:00.519 when we meet up it'll be per pft. But what 1:12:00.640 --> 1:12:03.400 happens four months in when you finally meet up and 1:12:03.439 --> 1:12:05.160 then you don't like the sound of their voice, you 1:12:05.160 --> 1:12:07.280 don't like the way they smell, you don't feel comfortable 1:12:07.320 --> 1:12:10.160 around them. Turns out all their texts were so funny 1:12:10.240 --> 1:12:12.960 because their friends as a group were writing them. And 1:12:13.000 --> 1:12:15.640 so you just wasted four months because you build up 1:12:15.640 --> 1:12:18.280 a fantasy in your head that wasn't real. And so 1:12:18.479 --> 1:12:21.040 in general, try to get to the date as soon 1:12:21.080 --> 1:12:24.479 as possible and avoid building up that fantasy in your head. 1:12:25.040 --> 1:12:29.360 That being said, we need to follow pandemic lockdown restrictions, 1:12:29.400 --> 1:12:32.320 we need to be safe, and sometimes we can't meet up, irl, 1:12:32.640 --> 1:12:34.800 And so what I would do is say, make sure 1:12:34.840 --> 1:12:37.719 you're video chatting, make sure you're talking on the phone. 1:12:37.880 --> 1:12:41.320 Text based communication can create a lot of false ideas, 1:12:41.360 --> 1:12:45.519 and so get that synchronous ongoing conversation where you can 1:12:45.600 --> 1:12:48.280 hear their voice. You can have a dynamic chat, and 1:12:48.320 --> 1:12:51.320 really that's the best proxy for how will we get along? 1:12:51.439 --> 1:12:51.919 Irl. 1:12:52.320 --> 1:12:54.519 Just going back for a moment to people who are 1:12:54.560 --> 1:12:57.160 coming out of lockdown, especially here in Australia, who are 1:12:57.200 --> 1:13:00.559 getting with their single and getting back amongst it. Talk 1:13:00.600 --> 1:13:02.799 to me a little bit about fear of dating again 1:13:02.960 --> 1:13:05.240 fota and we want to what fomo is. But like 1:13:05.320 --> 1:13:07.720 photer is a new term that you've coined. I mean, 1:13:07.760 --> 1:13:09.880 I think this is a very very real thing, and 1:13:09.920 --> 1:13:12.000 I know even from my friendship groups, and I've spoken 1:13:12.160 --> 1:13:15.679 about this to produce Akisha before, the fear of dating 1:13:15.720 --> 1:13:18.400 again when we've had so long to be able to 1:13:18.479 --> 1:13:21.760 hide away, and especially for this dating personality type that 1:13:21.800 --> 1:13:24.960 you've spoken about, what can people do who are feeling 1:13:24.960 --> 1:13:27.120 apprehensive about getting back into the dating world. 1:13:27.600 --> 1:13:30.200 Phota is, as you said, fear of dating again, and 1:13:30.240 --> 1:13:33.599 it's a really really common experience for people right now. 1:13:33.680 --> 1:13:36.280 At Hinge, we found that over fifty percent of Hinge 1:13:36.360 --> 1:13:39.600 daters are experiencing this. And it's not really that surprising. 1:13:39.680 --> 1:13:42.080 If you haven't been on a date in a while, 1:13:42.160 --> 1:13:44.840 if you haven't even been at your office, you feel 1:13:44.840 --> 1:13:49.240 like your social skills are rusty, you feel nervous about 1:13:49.280 --> 1:13:51.360 being in public and are you going to be safe? 1:13:51.400 --> 1:13:54.320 And so all these people want to find love and 1:13:54.439 --> 1:13:57.640 seventy five percent of Hinge users are looking for a relationship, 1:13:57.960 --> 1:14:00.240 but they're afraid to get back out there. So the 1:14:00.280 --> 1:14:03.599 first thing to understand is that this is a really normal, 1:14:03.840 --> 1:14:07.680 common experience. This has been a really trying time. Our 1:14:07.800 --> 1:14:10.719 pool of resilience was used up a long time ago, 1:14:10.760 --> 1:14:13.280 and now we're just running on fumes. And so if 1:14:13.280 --> 1:14:16.479 you're someone listening who says I have phota, I'm afraid 1:14:16.520 --> 1:14:19.599 to date again, that is absolutely normal, and you should 1:14:19.600 --> 1:14:22.200 be compassionate with yourself because life is hard right now. 1:14:22.560 --> 1:14:25.160 So I've spoken a fair bit about dating profiles, what 1:14:25.200 --> 1:14:26.840 to do, what not to do, how to put your 1:14:26.840 --> 1:14:29.320 best foot forward. But for all of those people that 1:14:29.360 --> 1:14:32.720 are in a relationship, you talk about things like turn 1:14:32.800 --> 1:14:34.760 towards and turns away, And these are the things that 1:14:34.800 --> 1:14:36.080 you talk about your book and I've heard you talk 1:14:36.080 --> 1:14:39.200 about in a podcast about how to make and work 1:14:39.240 --> 1:14:41.479 together to make these relationships better. Can you just talk 1:14:41.479 --> 1:14:43.599 to us about the turn towards and turns away. 1:14:44.120 --> 1:14:47.600 So some of the greatest researchers and thinkers in my 1:14:47.680 --> 1:14:51.040 field of relationship science are John and Julie Gartman, and 1:14:51.080 --> 1:14:54.600 they are a married couple. He's a researcher, he's a mathematician, 1:14:54.640 --> 1:14:59.479 he's an academic, and Julie is a therapist with a PhD. 1:14:59.560 --> 1:15:03.160 And there are power Couple, and they've done really interesting 1:15:03.240 --> 1:15:07.680 research on what creates a great relationship, and so they 1:15:07.720 --> 1:15:11.640 have these terms, the relationship masters and the relationship disasters, 1:15:12.200 --> 1:15:14.920 and so what they found is that it is not 1:15:15.240 --> 1:15:18.519 about the grand gestures. It's not about once a week 1:15:18.680 --> 1:15:23.160 going on holiday or having a really romantic Valentine's Day 1:15:23.200 --> 1:15:27.120 or anniversary. It's about small things often, it's about every 1:15:27.200 --> 1:15:30.840 day really interacting with your partner. And so they have 1:15:30.920 --> 1:15:34.799 this concept called bids, and a bid is a verbal 1:15:35.080 --> 1:15:38.960 or nonverbal attempt to connect. So a bid might be 1:15:39.760 --> 1:15:43.080 I'm working on my laptop and my husband comes in 1:15:43.479 --> 1:15:47.280 and puts some cut up melon next to me at 1:15:47.280 --> 1:15:49.800 the desk, and so he doesn't say anything, but of 1:15:49.840 --> 1:15:52.360 course he wants to connect. He wants to show me love, 1:15:52.439 --> 1:15:55.360 he wants to have a conversation. And so I could 1:15:55.439 --> 1:15:58.439 just grunt and say and keep working, or I could 1:15:58.479 --> 1:16:00.920 shut down my laptop and say thank you so much, 1:16:01.000 --> 1:16:03.080 how's your day going, Where did you get the melon? 1:16:03.200 --> 1:16:05.839 What are you up to? And it's these small moments 1:16:05.880 --> 1:16:08.200 where people are saying I want to connect with you, 1:16:08.720 --> 1:16:11.840 and you have the chance to turn towards them, which 1:16:11.920 --> 1:16:14.840 is respond to the bid, ask them a question, engage, 1:16:15.320 --> 1:16:18.160 or you can turn away from them, which is ignore them, 1:16:18.600 --> 1:16:21.600 say something rude, or push back. And what the Gotment's 1:16:21.640 --> 1:16:26.479 found is that analyzing couples, the relationship masters turned towards 1:16:26.479 --> 1:16:29.960 each other eighty six percent of the time, and the 1:16:30.040 --> 1:16:34.000 relationship disasters only turn towards each other thirty three percent 1:16:34.000 --> 1:16:36.479 of the time. And so it's not about the big moments, 1:16:36.520 --> 1:16:40.120 it's about every day making bids and turning towards bids. 1:16:40.560 --> 1:16:42.519 I really love this, and I think it's so easy 1:16:42.560 --> 1:16:45.760 to get into your comfortable zone and a relationship and 1:16:46.120 --> 1:16:48.439 not that you find your partner annoying, but just be like, oh, 1:16:48.520 --> 1:16:50.280 i'll do it that later, or I'm trying to do 1:16:50.360 --> 1:16:53.000 something right now, and you're constantly in this phase of 1:16:53.040 --> 1:16:55.800 like kicking the can down the road, and it's just 1:16:55.840 --> 1:16:59.639 such a quick postract of feeling unappreciated and feeling unloved, 1:16:59.640 --> 1:17:02.000 and then when you do get to that part in 1:17:02.040 --> 1:17:05.560 a relationship, it's so hard to work back towards feeling Okay, no, 1:17:05.640 --> 1:17:08.400 my partner does appreciate me, I do feel validated and 1:17:08.479 --> 1:17:11.559 cared for. I really I love that and we've actually 1:17:11.560 --> 1:17:13.960 spoken a little bit about common before, but we've never 1:17:14.040 --> 1:17:16.840 heard that description of their research that they've done. 1:17:16.880 --> 1:17:18.960 So I really really love that logan. 1:17:19.040 --> 1:17:23.240 For anybody who is currently struggling in their relationships or 1:17:23.280 --> 1:17:26.599 feeling unlovable, or feeling like they just haven't met the one. 1:17:27.120 --> 1:17:30.080 What advice would you have to someone who's really finding 1:17:30.360 --> 1:17:33.000 just like that maybe dating isn't for them, or maybe 1:17:33.040 --> 1:17:34.400 they aren't going to find someone. 1:17:34.560 --> 1:17:36.800 The pessimist you mean, you know what I mean? 1:17:36.800 --> 1:17:38.599 The person when you get to that point where you're like, 1:17:38.720 --> 1:17:41.120 I'm never going to find someone, you know, And I 1:17:41.120 --> 1:17:43.400 think that a lot of us, if we've been single 1:17:43.439 --> 1:17:45.680 for a period of time, if we're feeling lonely, there 1:17:45.720 --> 1:17:47.880 have been periods where we've all felt like I'm never 1:17:47.880 --> 1:17:50.479 going to find someone, I'm not lovable, or there's something 1:17:50.520 --> 1:17:52.800 wrong with me. What's the advice that you would give 1:17:52.800 --> 1:17:54.880 to someone who's feeling those feelings. 1:17:55.320 --> 1:17:59.400 My advice is to take baby steps. You don't have 1:17:59.439 --> 1:18:01.519 to go from dating at all to going on five 1:18:01.640 --> 1:18:04.320 dates a week. That's probably going to be unsustainable and 1:18:04.400 --> 1:18:08.200 lead to burnout. And you may not go from years 1:18:08.240 --> 1:18:12.120 of not dating at all to finding a relationship right away. 1:18:12.200 --> 1:18:15.160 But what is something small and tangible that you can 1:18:15.200 --> 1:18:18.160 do right now that's going to make you feel like 1:18:18.200 --> 1:18:22.040 you're making progress. So it might be making a list 1:18:22.120 --> 1:18:24.559 of the people you've dated in the past. How did 1:18:24.600 --> 1:18:26.960 you meet them, how long did you date, why did 1:18:27.000 --> 1:18:28.760 you break up? What are the things that were good 1:18:28.760 --> 1:18:31.000 about the relationship, and what are the things that were bad. 1:18:31.479 --> 1:18:33.240 And you sit there and you take an audit of 1:18:33.280 --> 1:18:36.080 your past relationships and you look for patterns, and you say, 1:18:36.439 --> 1:18:38.760 I tend to break up with people after three months 1:18:38.880 --> 1:18:41.439 because I get bored. That's a bad habit that I 1:18:41.479 --> 1:18:43.800 want to break, and I'm going to move and make 1:18:43.840 --> 1:18:46.800 different decisions. That's a small step that you can take 1:18:46.840 --> 1:18:49.479 to make you feel like you're making progress. And so 1:18:49.640 --> 1:18:53.400 the summary message here is take small steps that make 1:18:53.439 --> 1:18:56.280 you feel like you're moving forward. Take breaks when you 1:18:56.320 --> 1:18:58.720 need to understand that you don't have to meet a 1:18:58.720 --> 1:19:00.960 million people that you like, just have to find one 1:19:01.000 --> 1:19:04.280 person and build a relationship with them, and that love 1:19:04.360 --> 1:19:07.360 is something that you build, not something that happens to you. 1:19:07.439 --> 1:19:09.280 Oh that was a strong finishing line logan. 1:19:12.040 --> 1:19:15.439 Okay, that's like there's a season veteran at this Logan. 1:19:15.479 --> 1:19:18.000 Thank you so much for coming on the podcast. It 1:19:18.120 --> 1:19:18.880 was so fun. 1:19:19.160 --> 1:19:22.400 Everyone I know in Australia is like the Uncooked podcast. Yeah, 1:19:22.479 --> 1:19:24.280 so I'm super happy that you. 1:19:24.400 --> 1:19:27.200 Oh really yayay yeah. 1:19:27.400 --> 1:19:30.200 Definitely have a great reputation and it was so fun 1:19:30.240 --> 1:19:31.479 to do it. Thanks for having me on. 1:19:31.800 --> 1:19:34.479 We really appreciate it. And can you please tell the 1:19:34.520 --> 1:19:36.720 listeners where they can find your book, where they can 1:19:36.760 --> 1:19:38.960 follow you if they want to find out anything more. 1:19:39.479 --> 1:19:41.759 Just give us all of the handles where you're. 1:19:41.640 --> 1:19:44.559 At absolutely so people can buy my book how to 1:19:44.600 --> 1:19:47.840 Not Die Alone wherever books are sold. And if you 1:19:47.960 --> 1:19:50.880 like the sound of my voice, I read the audiobook 1:19:50.920 --> 1:19:53.400 and if you didn't like it, then buy the kindle 1:19:53.520 --> 1:19:54.880 version or the hardcover. 1:19:55.920 --> 1:19:57.000 There's a lot of options. 1:19:57.160 --> 1:19:58.920 There's a lot of options. And then if people are 1:19:59.360 --> 1:20:02.519 interested in my quiz, they can go to loganuri dot 1:20:02.560 --> 1:20:05.880 com slash quiz or they can follow me on Instagram 1:20:05.880 --> 1:20:07.240 at logan Uri Logan. 1:20:07.320 --> 1:20:11.240 I really genuinely was enthralled that whole chat. I really 1:20:11.280 --> 1:20:13.360 really loved it, and Laura and I are so interested 1:20:13.360 --> 1:20:15.719 in this is why we started the podcast, and already 1:20:15.720 --> 1:20:17.599 I'm kicking myself a little bit I'm like, why on. 1:20:17.560 --> 1:20:18.960 Earth didn't we get you on sooner? 1:20:19.040 --> 1:20:21.559 Like that was that was a fault on our But 1:20:21.600 --> 1:20:23.840 I really really love that chat. And guys, if you're 1:20:23.880 --> 1:20:27.080 interested and you love that episode, Logan talks about so 1:20:27.120 --> 1:20:29.960 many amazing things on all her platforms, So go check 1:20:29.960 --> 1:20:31.680 her out on Instagram or give her a listen. And 1:20:31.720 --> 1:20:33.439 I hope that this helps some of you out. Even 1:20:33.479 --> 1:20:35.960 though I'm in a relationship, I just gained something from 1:20:36.000 --> 1:20:37.920 that and it helped me a lot. Say thank you 1:20:38.040 --> 1:20:39.200 for your wonderful wisdom. 1:20:39.280 --> 1:20:40.439 I had so much fun. Thank you. 1:20:40.520 --> 1:20:41.559 Great to meet both of you. 1:20:42.200 --> 1:20:42.960 Until next time. 1:20:43.800 --> 1:20:45.880 Do you know that we never finish an episode without 1:20:45.880 --> 1:20:48.400 our suck and our suite, our highlight and our lowlight 1:20:48.479 --> 1:20:51.479 of each and every week. And Brittany, you can kick 1:20:51.520 --> 1:20:53.320 it off. I know that you've been doing so much 1:20:53.360 --> 1:20:59.920 with your past week. Let me guess Cabinara is your highlight? No, right, 1:21:00.000 --> 1:21:00.920 what else have you been doing? 1:21:02.080 --> 1:21:02.400 Guys? 1:21:02.439 --> 1:21:05.320 I am in quarantine, in hotel isolation obviously in Adelaide, 1:21:05.400 --> 1:21:07.200 So I think that that is just my suck as 1:21:07.240 --> 1:21:09.559 an overall. I'm on day What am I on day? 1:21:09.600 --> 1:21:11.320 Now? I think it's day eleven. 1:21:12.080 --> 1:21:15.320 I actually lost count, So that is my suck. I'm 1:21:15.320 --> 1:21:17.840 going a little bit crazy. Obviously. I've gone from seeing 1:21:17.880 --> 1:21:20.519 Jordan every day to not seeing him at all, so 1:21:20.800 --> 1:21:22.840 that's a little bit of a suck to But I 1:21:22.920 --> 1:21:27.960 am surviving. My sweet for the week is really hard 1:21:28.000 --> 1:21:28.479 to think of. 1:21:29.560 --> 1:21:31.760 I feel like You're sweet just needs to be like 1:21:31.920 --> 1:21:34.519 all of the literal sweet food that has been sent. 1:21:34.640 --> 1:21:36.680 The amount of things that I've seen now where you're like, 1:21:37.000 --> 1:21:39.840 I have received for a roches, I have received Carbonara, 1:21:39.960 --> 1:21:43.360 I have received this like uber delivery is your sweet 1:21:43.360 --> 1:21:43.920 for this week? 1:21:44.040 --> 1:21:46.320 I have had some really nice deliveries. Actually, I had 1:21:46.320 --> 1:21:48.760 a few people in my life that gave me a 1:21:48.840 --> 1:21:51.080 thought for a hot second, Actually, no, do you know what? 1:21:51.720 --> 1:21:52.640 You know? What sweet is? 1:21:53.080 --> 1:21:54.960 I haven't taken anyone up on it yet, but so 1:21:55.120 --> 1:21:57.479 many of you guys, so many of you lifers have 1:21:57.600 --> 1:21:59.439 written to me on the on the Gram. I've seen 1:21:59.439 --> 1:22:01.320 them come in and you've said if you need anything, 1:22:01.400 --> 1:22:03.599 I will literally come and pick it up in Adelaide 1:22:03.600 --> 1:22:04.880 and I would drop it to you. And I would 1:22:04.880 --> 1:22:06.680 never make anyone do that, but I just wanted to 1:22:06.720 --> 1:22:08.960 say thank you to every person that has offered because 1:22:09.000 --> 1:22:12.280 the thought alone means more than you know. So that's 1:22:12.320 --> 1:22:14.800 my sweetish, just how much I realize there are really 1:22:14.800 --> 1:22:17.040 good people out there and people actually care. People care, 1:22:17.240 --> 1:22:19.120 people care about the food I'm eating, and that's what 1:22:19.160 --> 1:22:19.840 makes me happy. 1:22:19.880 --> 1:22:21.920 But I also think so many people now have had 1:22:22.000 --> 1:22:24.720 friends or they've done it themselves, or family members who 1:22:24.760 --> 1:22:27.400 have done quarantine. That's one of the big things about 1:22:27.439 --> 1:22:30.720 this whole period is just as much as everybody is isolated, 1:22:30.760 --> 1:22:33.200 how much people are reaching out to try and feel connection. 1:22:33.280 --> 1:22:35.799 And I think it's so amazing that we have this community. 1:22:35.840 --> 1:22:38.760 It's so amazing, you know that even through all this separation, 1:22:39.040 --> 1:22:41.880 people are so willing to go out of their way 1:22:41.920 --> 1:22:44.040 to try and be connected and to help people. It's 1:22:44.080 --> 1:22:47.519 really something that's special. So my suck for the week 1:22:47.920 --> 1:22:51.520 is my hollow fresh delivery got stolen. 1:22:51.720 --> 1:22:56.160 Why that is so shitty? I mean someone was hungry? Yeah, fuck, Like, 1:22:56.200 --> 1:22:57.800 I get it. One can get it was out in 1:22:57.840 --> 1:22:58.679 the street, Hey lord? 1:22:58.720 --> 1:23:01.640 Then why was like a rhetorical but like you can answer. 1:23:02.240 --> 1:23:02.760 I get it. 1:23:03.080 --> 1:23:04.559 There was a box of food that was left out 1:23:04.560 --> 1:23:06.400 on the street and someone took it because they were hungry. 1:23:06.439 --> 1:23:07.000 I get the why. 1:23:07.560 --> 1:23:09.920 Unfortunate for me, like Yeah, my hell of fresh is gone. 1:23:09.960 --> 1:23:11.840 And that was my week of groceries. And I mean 1:23:11.880 --> 1:23:13.200 I know that I can leave the house now and 1:23:13.200 --> 1:23:15.360 go buy groceries, but I didn't want to. 1:23:16.160 --> 1:23:18.000 Okay, that's a study of solid suck. 1:23:18.160 --> 1:23:18.880 What is your sweet? 1:23:18.920 --> 1:23:22.200 And my sweet is is that this week? So tomorrow 1:23:22.280 --> 1:23:24.479 actually when you're listening to this, we have a launch 1:23:24.560 --> 1:23:26.960 for the new collection for Tony May. It is called Alchemy, 1:23:27.000 --> 1:23:30.040 and I'm so freaking proud of it. It is like 1:23:30.080 --> 1:23:32.479 the little baby that I have been working on so 1:23:32.600 --> 1:23:34.280 hard throughout the last four months. 1:23:34.320 --> 1:23:37.759 Oh, I can't wait to get my pieces and different. 1:23:37.760 --> 1:23:40.599 It's like give me jewelry. I love what it's launch day. 1:23:40.640 --> 1:23:43.040 No, that's really exciting because you do work so hard 1:23:43.080 --> 1:23:43.400 on that. 1:23:43.520 --> 1:23:45.679 Well, it's just like I mean, I don't talk about 1:23:45.680 --> 1:23:48.040 Tony May very often on the podcast, and it's something 1:23:48.120 --> 1:23:50.519 that takes up so much of my life, Like it 1:23:50.600 --> 1:23:53.760 is my number one job essentially, you know, like we 1:23:53.840 --> 1:23:55.760 Britain and I obviously do this podcast, but like I 1:23:55.800 --> 1:23:58.120 have a whole other business that I run and I'm 1:23:58.160 --> 1:24:00.160 just so proud of this range. Like I'm really they 1:24:00.200 --> 1:24:04.000 really stoked, and I feel like when everything comes into 1:24:04.040 --> 1:24:07.000 fruition and everything comes together. You have these real moments 1:24:07.040 --> 1:24:08.840 of like, ah, this is why I'm doing it all. 1:24:08.960 --> 1:24:10.960 So yeah, I'm so so so excited for that. 1:24:10.960 --> 1:24:11.639 That's tomorrow. 1:24:11.960 --> 1:24:15.000 So yeah, that's my sweet. I guess maybe it'll be 1:24:15.080 --> 1:24:16.880 my sweet next week, but it's my sweet this week 1:24:17.000 --> 1:24:18.840 just because like all the hard work has now been 1:24:18.880 --> 1:24:20.559 done and I can kind of sit back and watch 1:24:20.600 --> 1:24:22.040 it or kind of roll out. 1:24:22.240 --> 1:24:25.080 Well, I absolutely cannot wait to see it. Laura and guys, 1:24:25.160 --> 1:24:27.960 thank you for listening. That is a wrap on today's episode. 1:24:28.040 --> 1:24:29.080 It was a big one. 1:24:29.160 --> 1:24:32.439 But as we said, keep all of your stories coming in, 1:24:32.560 --> 1:24:34.320 keep your ask on cuts coming in, And if you 1:24:34.400 --> 1:24:38.160 haven't joined the Facebook Life on Cut discussion group, where 1:24:38.200 --> 1:24:40.200 you're at, because that's where all the juicy goss goes 1:24:40.240 --> 1:24:43.120 down and some really bloody funny stories are on there. 1:24:43.240 --> 1:24:44.280 And you guys know the drill. 1:24:44.280 --> 1:24:46.320 Tell your mom, to your dad too, dog, tell your sister, 1:24:46.360 --> 1:24:48.400 your cousin, and just tell everyone and share the love 1:24:48.520 --> 1:24:50.519 because we love love. 1:25:00.040 --> 1:25:00.799 Baba cut. 1:25:02.320 --> 1:25:11.840 The Company A the b Cutter, Al They the Bay, 1:25:12.479 --> 1:25:16.679 the bas