1
00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:07,960
Speaker 1: This is The Happy Family's podcast with doctor Justin Pilson,

2
00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:10,480
Speaker 1: where Luc and Susie our husband and wife radio team

3
00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:12,840
Speaker 1: with three young boys. This is the podcast for the

4
00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:14,800
Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants some answers.

5
00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:17,960
Speaker 2: Now, we spend so much time trying to work out

6
00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:20,919
Speaker 2: the best way, the right way to discipline our children,

7
00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:23,480
Speaker 2: to be able to nurture them, to grow them, to

8
00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:26,200
Speaker 2: teach them to be, you know, the people that we

9
00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:28,520
Speaker 2: want them to be. But then every now and then

10
00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:34,839
Speaker 2: we come into a situation where somebody else's kids are around, yes,

11
00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:37,640
Speaker 2: and we don't feel like we have as much control,

12
00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:40,279
Speaker 2: which I feel makes us more tempted to just want

13
00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,120
Speaker 2: to want to smack them, even if that's not something

14
00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:46,920
Speaker 2: you do. Like it's weird. I feel like when it's

15
00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:49,519
Speaker 2: your kids, you've got a long history of strategy. When

16
00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:51,960
Speaker 2: it's somebody else's kids, it can be even more frustrating

17
00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:54,680
Speaker 2: because what are you allowed to do or say? And

18
00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:56,200
Speaker 2: what are you not allowed to do or say? This

19
00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:58,440
Speaker 2: is a public debate we've been having for years and

20
00:00:58,440 --> 00:00:59,640
Speaker 2: probably will never stop having.

21
00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:04,160
Speaker 1: Can you discipline other people's children? Doctor Justinkilson, help us

22
00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:06,720
Speaker 1: help us know the boundariesier the.

23
00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,440
Speaker 3: Most important thing that we need to focus on here

24
00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:12,680
Speaker 3: is what discipline is. So normally, when this debate comes up,

25
00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:14,399
Speaker 3: people are like, is it okay for me to hit

26
00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:16,319
Speaker 3: someone else's kid? Or is it okay for me to

27
00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:18,839
Speaker 3: stick someone else's child in the corner and tell them.

28
00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:21,800
Speaker 4: To just sit there and get over it? And I

29
00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:23,800
Speaker 4: think that that's unhelpful.

30
00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:27,640
Speaker 3: We have a fundamental misunderstanding in this country of what

31
00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:31,759
Speaker 3: discipline means. And I know we've talked about this more

32
00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,520
Speaker 3: than once, but it's worth rehashing discipline if well, this

33
00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:37,800
Speaker 3: is interesting. If you look disciplined up in the dictionary today,

34
00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:40,960
Speaker 3: it says punish and punish when you look that up

35
00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,000
Speaker 3: says to hurt someone because you don't like the way

36
00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:45,920
Speaker 3: they've behaved. But if you look up discipline in the

37
00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:48,240
Speaker 3: dictionary that's more than about twenty or thirty years old,

38
00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:51,200
Speaker 3: says something different. It says it comes from the root

39
00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:58,440
Speaker 3: Latin would disciplus or a disciple, which is one who follows.

40
00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:04,120
Speaker 3: So if we're going to use hitting and hurting as

41
00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:08,240
Speaker 3: our form of discipline, what exactly are we inviting children

42
00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:10,240
Speaker 3: to follow. We're inviting them to follow a model that

43
00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:12,480
Speaker 3: says mighty is right, the big person can use their

44
00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:15,280
Speaker 3: power over the weak person and make them do whatever

45
00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:18,120
Speaker 3: they want. The older versions of the dictionary tell us

46
00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:24,000
Speaker 3: that discipline actually means teach, guide, instruct, So if we

47
00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:26,560
Speaker 3: are having a conversation about whether it's okay to discipline

48
00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:29,960
Speaker 3: other people's children, the answer is absolutely, we have a

49
00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,320
Speaker 3: responsibility to teach them, guide them, and instruct them. We

50
00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:36,000
Speaker 3: just need to do it without yelling, without using our hands,

51
00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:38,639
Speaker 3: and without sticking them in corners or taking things off them.

52
00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:44,800
Speaker 2: Yes, to be honest, I find easier to do that

53
00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,000
Speaker 2: calmly with somebody else's kids. Yes.

54
00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:49,400
Speaker 3: It's so funny when people are saying to me, I

55
00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:51,880
Speaker 3: keep on losing the plot. My kids, they're driving me insane.

56
00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:53,799
Speaker 3: I just want to stop hitting them. I say, well,

57
00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:59,000
Speaker 3: just pretend they's somebody else's although then they might say, fine,

58
00:02:59,080 --> 00:02:59,600
Speaker 3: go home.

59
00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:07,919
Speaker 2: So when someone let's just say, you've got somebody else's

60
00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:10,280
Speaker 2: kids in your care, and your kid and their kid

61
00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:13,800
Speaker 2: doing the wrong thing, whatever it might be. So, what's

62
00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:16,240
Speaker 2: what's the strategy. Where's the line of what's okay and

63
00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:16,840
Speaker 2: what's not okay?

64
00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,560
Speaker 4: Oh that's so. Let me share a couple of examples here.

65
00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:24,120
Speaker 3: One of my friends had was in the kitchen with

66
00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:27,440
Speaker 3: her husband and their teenage son. He was about sixteen

67
00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:29,560
Speaker 3: years old, and the teenage son had one of his

68
00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:30,120
Speaker 3: buddies over.

69
00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:33,519
Speaker 4: Let's call him Buddy, okay, just because he was the budget.

70
00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:34,240
Speaker 3: He was the buddy.

71
00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:36,360
Speaker 2: I see how you connected you.

72
00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:40,600
Speaker 3: Right, So Buddy starts dropping a couple of words, some

73
00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:44,680
Speaker 3: course language, the kind of language that my friends don't

74
00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:46,960
Speaker 3: use in their home under any circumstances.

75
00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,000
Speaker 4: Ever, and so this is.

76
00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:55,080
Speaker 3: An opportunity for some discipline my friend's husband. She watched

77
00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:56,760
Speaker 3: him as he just walked out of the room after

78
00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,880
Speaker 3: he had dropped the third or fourth swear word, and

79
00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:02,440
Speaker 3: a moment later he said, hey, and he called out

80
00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:03,680
Speaker 3: to his son, I just need to chat with you

81
00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:06,080
Speaker 3: for a sec And so she was left with Buddy

82
00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:09,280
Speaker 3: in the kitchen and in the living room, he quietly

83
00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:12,000
Speaker 3: whispered to his son and he said, that's the fourth

84
00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:15,520
Speaker 3: time your friend Buddy has said this. Would you like

85
00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:17,240
Speaker 3: to let Buddy know what our rules are or would

86
00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:19,800
Speaker 3: you prefer that I do? And I love the way

87
00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,400
Speaker 3: he did that. He actually gave his son the opportunity

88
00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:23,560
Speaker 3: to do you want me to?

89
00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:24,159
Speaker 4: Do you want to do?

90
00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,160
Speaker 3: It could be embarrassing for you. Would you rather do it?

91
00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:28,560
Speaker 3: And his son said, I've got it.

92
00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:30,080
Speaker 4: I've got it. So they walked back into the kitchen.

93
00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:32,800
Speaker 3: In about thirty seconds later, the son said, hey, buddy,

94
00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:35,200
Speaker 3: let's go and do this, and so they disappeared out

95
00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:35,600
Speaker 3: of the kitchen.

96
00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:36,479
Speaker 4: It was the perfect.

97
00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:38,880
Speaker 3: Opportunity and while they were out of the kitchen, they

98
00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:41,320
Speaker 3: had the conversation and they never had that problem again.

99
00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:44,080
Speaker 3: If the children are younger and you don't have that option,

100
00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:46,000
Speaker 3: and by the way, you do, you can say to

101
00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,800
Speaker 3: your seven year old, you know, this is what's been

102
00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:50,760
Speaker 3: going on. You know what the expectation is. Would you

103
00:04:50,839 --> 00:04:52,200
Speaker 3: like me to talk to your friend or would you

104
00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:54,480
Speaker 3: prefer to do it yourself. I think it's a really

105
00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:56,839
Speaker 3: soft way and it helps the kids to be responsible.

106
00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:01,080
Speaker 2: We underestimate them, and we experienced this recent without. He

107
00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,800
Speaker 2: was seven at the time, about to turn eight, when

108
00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,360
Speaker 2: a child in his class, who had been told all

109
00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:09,159
Speaker 2: year he was going to come to his birthday party,

110
00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:15,600
Speaker 2: had recently had an encounter of bullying, an official allegation

111
00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,360
Speaker 2: and mediation at the school with one of our son's

112
00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,320
Speaker 2: friend and as it turns out, when we had the

113
00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:23,440
Speaker 2: conversation with our son as well, But the mediation was

114
00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:25,560
Speaker 2: about the friend. And so he had this friend who

115
00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:26,840
Speaker 2: was going to come to his party, and then the

116
00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:30,480
Speaker 2: kid who had been mean, who was also in theory

117
00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:33,120
Speaker 2: coming to the party, and Susie you started the conversation.

118
00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:35,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I said to him, I hope you understand what.

119
00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:38,040
Speaker 1: We're not going to have this person at our party

120
00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,839
Speaker 1: now because because of the way he's been with your friend.

121
00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:43,040
Speaker 1: Your friend is already RSVP. They've been your friend for

122
00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:45,520
Speaker 1: three years now, and I don't want them to feel

123
00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:47,920
Speaker 1: uncomfortable in our home. Does that make sense?

124
00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:48,360
Speaker 4: Is that okay?

125
00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:49,839
Speaker 1: And he said, yeah, that's okay. I just don't know

126
00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:52,120
Speaker 1: how I'm going to tell him. And so we came

127
00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:55,200
Speaker 1: back to the conversation a little bit later, and I'd

128
00:05:55,200 --> 00:05:56,800
Speaker 1: found out a bit more, and that's when I'd found

129
00:05:56,800 --> 00:06:00,200
Speaker 1: out that our son had also had some difficult he's

130
00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:02,800
Speaker 1: with this same child. And I said, well, you know what,

131
00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:05,320
Speaker 1: I'm making the call here, so I'm happy for you

132
00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:07,920
Speaker 1: if you need to to say to this boy that

133
00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:09,840
Speaker 1: he can't come to the party, because I made the

134
00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:13,880
Speaker 1: call that there's already a lot of children and I've

135
00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:15,800
Speaker 1: said that he's not allowed to come. I gave him

136
00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:17,560
Speaker 1: an out, and his response was, no, I'm going to

137
00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:19,240
Speaker 1: tell him he can't come to my party because he's

138
00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:21,320
Speaker 1: been mean to me and my friend and that's not okay.

139
00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:25,440
Speaker 1: And the next day and that's what he said, he said,

140
00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:26,640
Speaker 1: I'm not going to tell him it's your fault. I'm

141
00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:28,800
Speaker 1: going to tell him it's his fault. And he came

142
00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:30,359
Speaker 1: back to me the next day and he'd had that

143
00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:33,680
Speaker 1: conversation with him, and the other child's first reaction was, well,

144
00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:35,919
Speaker 1: you can't come to my party either. But there's not

145
00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:38,640
Speaker 1: been an incident with that boy ever since, with either

146
00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:40,880
Speaker 1: of the children, with either my son or his other

147
00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,120
Speaker 1: good friend. And in fact, he said to me the

148
00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:44,760
Speaker 1: other day, you know what, I think we're kind of friends.

149
00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:45,000
Speaker 4: Now.

150
00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:49,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's amazing what happens when we have these clean conversations.

151
00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:50,839
Speaker 4: And I want to say clean, I mean, we just

152
00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:51,800
Speaker 4: get straight to it.

153
00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:54,920
Speaker 3: And so to go back to Luke's initial question, if

154
00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:56,840
Speaker 3: there are a couple of kids that are messing around

155
00:06:56,880 --> 00:06:59,000
Speaker 3: and they're doing the wrong thing and they're not your kids,

156
00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:01,560
Speaker 3: I think it's very simple for us to step in

157
00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:03,320
Speaker 3: and say I need to talk to you for it

158
00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:08,039
Speaker 3: just a minute Isabelle or Caleb or whoever it is, buddy, buddy,

159
00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:13,000
Speaker 3: we want to say what's happening here is not how

160
00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:14,960
Speaker 3: we do things in our home. It might be okay

161
00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:17,000
Speaker 3: for you to do it at your place, but that's

162
00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:17,960
Speaker 3: not how we do it here.

163
00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:20,840
Speaker 4: What we do here is this, this, and this, and.

164
00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:22,760
Speaker 3: If you want to extend the conversation for just a moment,

165
00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:25,840
Speaker 3: you might say, can you think of any reasons why

166
00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:27,480
Speaker 3: we might not like that here?

167
00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,160
Speaker 4: Because we want them to understand why.

168
00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:34,480
Speaker 3: It's not about being all hardcore authoritarian, it's about actually

169
00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:37,880
Speaker 3: teaching them. Maybe I can share a quick personal experience

170
00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:41,360
Speaker 3: as well. We had a situation with one of my children.

171
00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:43,240
Speaker 3: Well I'll just say which one. It was, the eldest one.

172
00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:45,640
Speaker 3: She's old enough to have boyfriends. We've told our kids,

173
00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:49,040
Speaker 3: no boy We've only got girls. Okay, so from the outset,

174
00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:51,280
Speaker 3: we've just said, you don't have a romantic interest, you

175
00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:53,800
Speaker 3: don't have a boyfriend until you finished high school, because

176
00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:55,200
Speaker 3: we want you to. You know, it messes up with

177
00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:56,880
Speaker 3: friendships and it gets in the way of your schooling.

178
00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:57,840
Speaker 4: And da da da da da.

179
00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:00,560
Speaker 3: Anyway, we got halfway through year twelve, so we think

180
00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:02,720
Speaker 3: we did okay with the first one. She's halfway three

181
00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:05,280
Speaker 3: year twelve, she's finally got a boyfriend, and we're.

182
00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:07,840
Speaker 4: Like, ah, oh, this is driving crazy.

183
00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:11,280
Speaker 3: But there's been a couple of incidents where together they

184
00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:15,000
Speaker 3: haven't acted with integrity and as a result, while they

185
00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,880
Speaker 3: haven't been up to what I would call mischief, they

186
00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:21,160
Speaker 3: haven't been honest with us. And so when the boyfriend

187
00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:24,240
Speaker 3: was visiting a little while ago at our place, I

188
00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,640
Speaker 3: said to him, we'll call him Jared because that's his name.

189
00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,480
Speaker 3: I said to him, Jared, we need to have a chat.

190
00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:34,880
Speaker 3: And he looked at me with that look of dread

191
00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:38,120
Speaker 3: and fear in his eyes that any boyfriend, you know,

192
00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:41,480
Speaker 3: with my girlfriend's father, and he knew when I pulled

193
00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:43,319
Speaker 3: the baseball bat out that.

194
00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:48,160
Speaker 4: So we went for a walk and we sat down

195
00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:49,200
Speaker 4: and I.

196
00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:51,640
Speaker 3: Said, Jared, I want to have a really clean, open

197
00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,319
Speaker 3: conversation with you. This is an expectation that I have.

198
00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:59,120
Speaker 3: How do you feel about that it hasn't been lived

199
00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,440
Speaker 3: up to at this point. And I recognize that there

200
00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:03,960
Speaker 3: are two involved in this, but I want you to

201
00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:07,200
Speaker 3: be absolutely clear on where I stand and why do

202
00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:08,880
Speaker 3: you have any quation. We had about a fifteen minute

203
00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:12,400
Speaker 3: conversation at which point I said, betray my trust and

204
00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:14,920
Speaker 3: I'll destroy you.

205
00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,200
Speaker 4: No, I didn't really say that.

206
00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:18,800
Speaker 3: I might have thought it, but I didn't say it.

207
00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:22,120
Speaker 3: And it's amazing what's happened since. You know, it's been

208
00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:27,440
Speaker 3: considerable time since, and the level of respect has remained

209
00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:29,200
Speaker 3: because it was done the right way.

210
00:09:29,280 --> 00:09:30,760
Speaker 4: He still shows up at our house, he.

211
00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:33,600
Speaker 3: Still says hi, he still shakes hands, he still engages

212
00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:37,120
Speaker 3: in conversations because it's not about getting other kids in

213
00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:40,120
Speaker 3: trouble when they do something that's inappropriate. It's not about

214
00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:42,360
Speaker 3: saying you're a rap bag, You're never coming back here,

215
00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:44,560
Speaker 3: I can't trust you, you're this, you're that again, whether

216
00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:45,600
Speaker 3: they're two or twenty two.

217
00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:47,679
Speaker 4: It's about sitting down and saying, we don't do it

218
00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:48,120
Speaker 4: like this here.

219
00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:50,920
Speaker 3: I wonder if you can tell me why, what can

220
00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,520
Speaker 3: we do about this in the future and so on.

221
00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:56,599
Speaker 3: As it turns out, you can even ask them to apologize.

222
00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,040
Speaker 3: You can even say what happened was wrong. And I

223
00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:01,560
Speaker 3: think that you need to appologize to this person for

224
00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:03,840
Speaker 3: that and walk them through that.

225
00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:06,040
Speaker 1: And better to have that conversation while he's Jared and

226
00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:07,320
Speaker 1: not when you start calling him son.

227
00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:19,720
Speaker 2: Because couldn't you hear the tenson pulling up? You can't

228
00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:21,360
Speaker 2: face then.

229
00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,400
Speaker 4: My daughter actually total total tangent. My daughter said to

230
00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:27,640
Speaker 4: him the other day do you like him? Do you

231
00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:28,400
Speaker 4: like him?

232
00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,120
Speaker 3: And I said to her, right now, it doesn't matter

233
00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:34,280
Speaker 3: whether I like him or not. If it ever gets

234
00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:36,120
Speaker 3: to a point where you're a few years older and

235
00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:38,240
Speaker 3: things are still going, and you know things are getting

236
00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:39,640
Speaker 3: serious enough that you want to talk about a long

237
00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:42,200
Speaker 3: term relationship, then we'll talk about whether I like him

238
00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:42,480
Speaker 3: or not.

239
00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:45,120
Speaker 4: I'm going to get you might.

240
00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:49,400
Speaker 1: Not like my answer, Doctor Justin Kilson, Is it okay

241
00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:51,720
Speaker 1: to discipline others? Well, if it's the right thing, the

242
00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:52,200
Speaker 1: answer is.

243
00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:54,120
Speaker 2: Yett, I've got I've got to I can't let him

244
00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:58,000
Speaker 2: go your share, because there's one scenario we have, there's

245
00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:02,080
Speaker 2: one scenario we haven't come and that is you've talked about.

246
00:11:02,200 --> 00:11:04,600
Speaker 2: It's your turf, it's your home, it's your rules, it's

247
00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:07,560
Speaker 2: people that you know. We're at a playground, we're at

248
00:11:07,559 --> 00:11:11,480
Speaker 2: a public place. It's not someone we know. Another child

249
00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:13,880
Speaker 2: is misbehaving, maybe being a little bit rough, maybe being

250
00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:15,960
Speaker 2: a little bit mean, maybe using language that you're not

251
00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:20,200
Speaker 2: happy with. How do you go about that scenario, we've

252
00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:21,000
Speaker 2: got no ground.

253
00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:24,440
Speaker 3: Three quick things. Number one, you need to call it out.

254
00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:26,120
Speaker 3: Number two, you need to do it in a way

255
00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,440
Speaker 3: that is non threatening. And number three, you need to

256
00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:31,720
Speaker 3: look for the parents. Now, every now and again, parents

257
00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:35,120
Speaker 3: can become quite defensive and so and even aggressive, So

258
00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:36,600
Speaker 3: you want to be careful in the way that you

259
00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:39,640
Speaker 3: invite other parents in. You might walk up to a

260
00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:41,760
Speaker 3: parent and say, your son just called my son a

261
00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:43,600
Speaker 3: name and then he pushed him over, and your son's

262
00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:45,400
Speaker 3: being a bully, and that's probably not a good way

263
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:50,040
Speaker 3: to start a conversation. Instead, you might say where's your dad,

264
00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:51,959
Speaker 3: where's your mum? And then you walk over to that

265
00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:54,240
Speaker 3: person say I'm not sure if you've noticed or not,

266
00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:57,800
Speaker 3: but your son and my son have been a little altercation.

267
00:11:58,320 --> 00:11:59,960
Speaker 3: Just thought i'd come and get you. I'm having a

268
00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:01,280
Speaker 3: chat with my son, but I thought you might want

269
00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:01,880
Speaker 3: to have a chat.

270
00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:03,600
Speaker 4: With yours as well. And so you want to do

271
00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:04,959
Speaker 4: it softly, You want to do it gently.

272
00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:08,080
Speaker 3: Harsh startups lead to harsh outcomes more often than not.

273
00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:10,880
Speaker 3: The other thing that you want to bear in mind

274
00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:14,559
Speaker 3: a story from a friend of mine. He was at

275
00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:18,839
Speaker 3: a fine dining restaurant where you can take your children,

276
00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:20,200
Speaker 3: you know, the one with the golden arches and the

277
00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:20,559
Speaker 3: one with.

278
00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:23,400
Speaker 1: The oh yes, another one and it's golden, so it

279
00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:24,320
Speaker 1: must be high class.

280
00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:24,640
Speaker 4: Yes.

281
00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:28,959
Speaker 3: And he had his kids playing on the playground and

282
00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:32,200
Speaker 3: there was an altercation and he went in there and

283
00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:34,760
Speaker 3: started to deal with it, but he was probably a

284
00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:37,360
Speaker 3: little stern and the focus of his attention was on

285
00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:40,000
Speaker 3: somebody else's child. And the parents of that child came

286
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:41,880
Speaker 3: in and they were very upset with the way things

287
00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:44,520
Speaker 3: were going. So we do need to call it out.

288
00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:46,080
Speaker 3: We do need to point out, hang on, that's not

289
00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:47,880
Speaker 3: how we do things. You might do it like that

290
00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:49,840
Speaker 3: in your family, we don't do that in public. That's

291
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,280
Speaker 3: not okay. Where are your parents. Let's see if we

292
00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:55,000
Speaker 3: can work this out and involve the parents as much

293
00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:56,960
Speaker 3: as you can. If the parents don't care, if the

294
00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:59,600
Speaker 3: parents are on their phone playing Candy Crush, being busy

295
00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:02,400
Speaker 3: doing wortant things, then just call it or remove your

296
00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:03,640
Speaker 3: kids or go somewhere else.

297
00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:08,160
Speaker 2: It's a confronting, but it's important thing. And I guess

298
00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:11,800
Speaker 2: there was a time where I've seen it wasn't me involved,

299
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,679
Speaker 2: where one parent I think appropriately went up to the

300
00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:16,480
Speaker 2: other set of parents, and there's been a bit of

301
00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:20,560
Speaker 2: an issue here, and those parents got upset with their

302
00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:28,600
Speaker 2: kid and had public discipline in the modern interpretationism flogging,

303
00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:31,200
Speaker 2: and it was almost like they went, I regret actually,

304
00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:35,880
Speaker 2: because now that kid is getting really in physical trouble

305
00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:39,280
Speaker 2: because of the don't we don't get to control. We

306
00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:42,760
Speaker 2: don't understand what the nuances are with other parents and

307
00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:43,280
Speaker 2: other kids.

308
00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:45,160
Speaker 3: But it's no surprise to me that if the kid's

309
00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:47,000
Speaker 3: being a bully and then they get bullied by their parents,

310
00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:49,040
Speaker 3: that's why that kid's being a bully. That's what they've

311
00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:50,560
Speaker 3: been taught at time. So we need to be better

312
00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,319
Speaker 3: than that. But yeah, we can't control it. One thing

313
00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:55,400
Speaker 3: that I have done in public at one point, very quickly,

314
00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:58,080
Speaker 3: was I approached a parents said I don't want you

315
00:13:58,120 --> 00:13:59,679
Speaker 3: to I don't want you to get cranky at them,

316
00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:01,520
Speaker 3: but I just wanted to let you know I've sorted

317
00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:03,600
Speaker 3: it out at this time. But there's been a little

318
00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:06,280
Speaker 3: bit of friction between these two. If it keeps going,

319
00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:08,000
Speaker 3: we can just go somewhere else or whatever.

320
00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:08,920
Speaker 4: But I just point it.

321
00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:12,280
Speaker 3: Out and and most of the time most parents will,

322
00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:14,160
Speaker 3: you know, most parents want to do the right thing.

323
00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:17,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. I like true. That's something to be

324
00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:20,240
Speaker 2: that's a great little thing to put in the toolkit.

325
00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:23,440
Speaker 1: Beautiful, very very good, doctor Justin Coulson, Thank you so much.

326
00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:24,600
Speaker 4: It's a pleasure. Thanks.

327
00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:27,480
Speaker 1: And of course there are loads of resources available, lots

328
00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,680
Speaker 1: of information, books, podcasts, and programs. You can find them

329
00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:34,080
Speaker 1: all that happy families dot com dot au. But if

330
00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:36,680
Speaker 1: listening to doctor Justin Coulson makes you think that people

331
00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:39,520
Speaker 1: in your organization or school could benefit from hearing him

332
00:14:39,520 --> 00:14:41,760
Speaker 1: as well, you can find out how to have Justin

333
00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:45,040
Speaker 1: speak for your school or organization at Justin Coulson dot

334
00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:52,080
Speaker 1: com