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Speaker 1: My name is Lily Madden and I'm a proud Arunda

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Speaker 1: Bunjelung Cargoton woman from Gadighl country. The Daily oz acknowledges

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Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the

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Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres

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Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the

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Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present.

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Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os. It's Friday,

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Speaker 2: the sixteenth of June. I'm sam, i'm zara. A campaign

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Speaker 2: launch this week is calling on the Federal government to

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Speaker 2: lower the legal voting age to sixteen. It's being led

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Speaker 2: by a group called Make It Sixteen, who are saying

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Speaker 2: that the change would strengthen our democracy.

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Speaker 3: Our goal is to lower the voting age to sixteen

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Speaker 3: and have young people be able to participate in our

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Speaker 3: democracy in a much more real way.

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Speaker 2: It's a surprisingly divisive subject and we're going to hear

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Speaker 2: more about it in the Deep Dive. But before we

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Speaker 2: get there, a big day in Federal Parliament yesterday.

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Speaker 4: It was we had Senator David Van removed from the

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Speaker 4: Parliamentary Liberal Party. That followed allegations made by Independent Senator

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Speaker 4: Lydia Thorpe yesterday, who claimed she'd been sexually assaulted by Van.

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Speaker 4: Van has denied these allegations. Opposition leader Peter Dudden said

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Speaker 4: the decision was made after further allegations against Van were

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Speaker 4: relayed to him. Dudden said he wasn't making quote any

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Speaker 4: judgment on the veracity of the allegations and anyone's guilt

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Speaker 4: or innocence.

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Speaker 2: PwC will be suspended from any new tax contracts with

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Speaker 2: the New South Wales government for the next three months.

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Speaker 2: It comes on the back of allegations that consultants at

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Speaker 2: PwC used confidential federal government information for their client's interests.

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Speaker 2: PwC will also be required to ensure that any staff

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Speaker 2: members who breached confidentiality agreements at a federal level aren't

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Speaker 2: involved in those new South Wales government contracts.

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Speaker 4: Our friends over the Ditch, New Zealand have entered a recession.

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Speaker 4: That's according to the latest national data, gross to MESSI

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Speaker 4: product was down point one percent in the March quarter,

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Speaker 4: after falling point seven percent in the three months to

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Speaker 4: December twenty twenty two. Tropical cyclones in January and February

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Speaker 4: were among the reasons listed for the downturn in economic activity.

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Speaker 2: And today's good news. You can say goodbye to all

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Speaker 2: cricket fans for the next little while because they'll be

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Speaker 2: distracted by the men's Ashes cricket Test series between Australia

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Speaker 2: and England that kicks off tonight. The five match series

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Speaker 2: will begin in Birmingham and be played across five different

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Speaker 2: venues across the UK. Australia are the reigning champs. They

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Speaker 2: won the last men's and women's Ashes series.

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Speaker 4: Sam. Today, I want to talk about the voting age

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Speaker 4: because there's been a lot of news recently about a

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Speaker 4: campaign that is pushing to lower it to sixteen. Turns

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Speaker 4: out it's quite a divisive.

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Speaker 2: Topic, yeah, and it's really split our audience down the middle.

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Speaker 2: We launched a poll on Instagram this week asking our

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Speaker 2: audience whether they would support lowering the voting age, and

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Speaker 2: that pole is still live. There's a link in the

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Speaker 2: show notes and it's pretty much half and half. I mean,

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Speaker 2: we've got fifty point two percent of respondents saying yes

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Speaker 2: they think it should be lowered, Forty eight point three

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Speaker 2: percent of people are voting no, and there's a very

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Speaker 2: small fraction who are in the middle.

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Speaker 4: I'm keen to hear what you think about this, but

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Speaker 4: I think that before we go there, I want to

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Speaker 4: just set up a bit of context here. So firstly,

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Speaker 4: voting is compulsory in Australia and the way that that

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Speaker 4: is policed per se is that you are fined if

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Speaker 4: you failed to vote and if you're enrolled. But all

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Speaker 4: of this only applies for people who are eighteen and over.

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Speaker 4: But that's not always been the case.

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Speaker 2: No, it was only in nineteen seventy three that the

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Speaker 2: voting age was lowered from twenty one to eighteen. To

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Speaker 2: change the voting age, you really just need one act

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Speaker 2: to change and that's the Commonwealth Electoral Act of nineteen eighteen,

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Speaker 2: and that only needs majority support in Parliament like any

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Speaker 2: other bill. Now, the last time it was changed, there'd

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Speaker 2: been a few wars with significant numbers of eighteen to

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Speaker 2: twenty one year olds who had lost their lives or

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Speaker 2: been seriously injured, and so it was on that context

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Speaker 2: that it was decided that asking people to give their

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Speaker 2: life for the country but not allowing them to vote

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Speaker 2: was not okay. In more recent times, supporters of this

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Speaker 2: recent push to lower the voting age down to sixteen,

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Speaker 2: are pointing out kind of similar arguments that if sixteen

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Speaker 2: and seventeen year olds can pay tax, if they can drive,

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Speaker 2: and if they can join the army, then they should

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Speaker 2: also have the right to vote.

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Speaker 4: I did not know until this very moment in time

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Speaker 4: that you could sign up for the army at sixteen.

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Speaker 4: So there you go, learn something new every day. So

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Speaker 4: I mean, when we think about if there's any precedent

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Speaker 4: to lowering the voting age, because that's often times what

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Speaker 4: parliamentarians will look for. We have seen it happen. It's

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Speaker 4: happened in Wales and Scotland, Brazil, Austria, Ecuador, Argentina and

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Speaker 4: Greece and Indonesia have lowered their voting age to seventeen

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Speaker 4: for at least some of the elections. What are policymakers

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Speaker 4: here in Australia thinking about this all?

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Speaker 2: Well, it's worth noting that it's not the first time

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Speaker 2: that lowering the voting age to sixteen has come up

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Speaker 2: in Australia. Back in twenty eighteen, the greenspot four a

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Speaker 2: proposal to introduce voting for sixteen and seventeen year olds,

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Speaker 2: but that it would be optional, not compulsory, like it

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Speaker 2: is for people aged eighteen and over. That was rejected,

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Speaker 2: but there were some Labor members who supported the idea

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Speaker 2: in principle, they just subjected to the voluntary component. Then,

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Speaker 2: earlier this year Green's MP Stephen Bates introduced a new

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Speaker 2: bill with compulsory voting for sixteen and seventeen year olds,

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Speaker 2: but without the fines if they failed to vote now.

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Speaker 2: At that time both major parties indicated to TDA that

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Speaker 2: they were unlikely to support the proposal, and it hasn't

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Speaker 2: yet been put to a vote. And then it kind

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Speaker 2: of brings us to this week with the Make It

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Speaker 2: sixteen campaign. And the premise of the Make It sixteen

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Speaker 2: campaign is largely similar to the one that Stephen Bates

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Speaker 2: put forward earlier this year, except I guess the key

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Speaker 2: difference is that this time it's young people putting the

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Speaker 2: campaign forward rather than a parliamentarian. The campaign is being

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Speaker 2: supported by the Greens as the previous two, as well

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Speaker 2: as a few independent MPs, but both the major parties

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Speaker 2: are still saying that it's not a priority. And earlier

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Speaker 2: this week Patrick Gorman, the Assistant Minister to the Prime Minister,

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Speaker 2: told ABC Radio that he's concerned the proposal will weaken

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Speaker 2: Australia's compulsory voting system.

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Speaker 5: Compulsory voting is what makes sure that the decisions we

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Speaker 5: make here in Canberra are decisions for the whole country

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Speaker 5: and that we have consulted the whole country in those decisions.

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Speaker 5: If we take away compulsory voting or have some sort

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Speaker 5: of know your first votes free idea, which is what

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Speaker 5: that Make It sixteen proposal is that does weaken compulsory

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Speaker 5: voting and we can't go down that path.

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Speaker 4: So let's hear more about Make It sixteen. Who Patrick

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Speaker 4: Gorman just mentioned there, who are behind the campaign that's

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Speaker 4: launched this week. Can you tell me a bit about

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Speaker 4: their arguments.

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Speaker 2: So there are youth led non partisan campaign and that

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Speaker 2: means they're not aligned with any party, and they had

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Speaker 2: a launch at Parliament House this week and it was

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Speaker 2: attended by three politicians, Green's MP Stephen Bates and Independence

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Speaker 2: doctor Monique Ryan and Andrew Wilkie. Now, at the launch,

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Speaker 2: each of those three parliamentarians gave slightly different reasons for

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Speaker 2: their support of the proposal. We had Bates who were

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Speaker 2: saying that young people deserve to have a seat at

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Speaker 2: the table on issues like climate and housing.

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Speaker 4: And he himself is a young person, so I think.

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Speaker 2: That's definitely worth acknowledging. And then we had doctor Ryan

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Speaker 2: who said that many decisions made in Parliament about the

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Speaker 2: future madam more to young people than most of the politicians.

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Speaker 2: And then Andrew Wilkie took that point even further. He

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Speaker 2: said that his sixteen year old daughter was more invested

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Speaker 2: in the future than half of his colleagues.

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Speaker 4: Look, I think listening to politicians talk about young people's

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Speaker 4: future is one thing, but I also think it's another

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Speaker 4: thing to hear directly from young people whose futures are

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Speaker 4: on the line. You sat down with Make It sixteen

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Speaker 4: co founder Tabitha stephen Jones. Let's just play a little

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Speaker 4: bit of that now.

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Speaker 2: Tabith thanks so much for joining us on the Daily OS.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me tell.

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Speaker 2: Me about Make It sixteen. Are you pushing for compulsory

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Speaker 2: voting above the age of sixteen or do you think

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Speaker 2: that there should be an optional vote until you're eighteen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So our model that make at sixteen is to

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Speaker 3: have it compulsory in the same way it is for adults,

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Speaker 3: but the finds to be waived because we know that's

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Speaker 3: a huge barrier and a huge accessibility issue, especially within

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Speaker 3: regional communities and young people, so they would be waived

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Speaker 3: until eighteen and then it would progress normally from there.

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Speaker 2: We put up a poll to the TDA audience and

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Speaker 2: we're getting some really interesting results, and some of the

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Speaker 2: interesting sentiments to come through the comments section has been

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Speaker 2: that there's not enough civic education to support compulsory voting

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Speaker 2: for sixteen to eighteen year olds. What's your feelings around that.

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Speaker 3: I think civic education and lowering the voting age definitely

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Speaker 3: go hand in hand. I think that there is definitely

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Speaker 3: greater need for better civic education. However, talking to peers

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Speaker 3: and especially like my younger siblings, their civic education is

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Speaker 3: already a lot stronger than mine. And I just finished

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Speaker 3: high school last year, and I think that because there's

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Speaker 3: such a gap between when it's taught and people actually

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Speaker 3: showing up to the polling booth, it's really hard to

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Speaker 3: kind of put that into practice. And so lowering the

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Speaker 3: voting age to sixteen would mean that there's a definitely

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Speaker 3: that more of a transferable skill and system.

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Speaker 2: Why do you think it's failed before pushes like this,

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Speaker 2: I mean, we had efforts by Aussie politicians to lower

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Speaker 2: the voting age back in twenty eighteen, there was a

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Speaker 2: big proposal from the Greens, and there was another attempt

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Speaker 2: earlier this year. What do you think is holding us back?

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Speaker 3: I think now at the moment, both major parties are

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Speaker 3: hesitant because it's not high enough on the agenda, you know,

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Speaker 3: with everything coming up about the Voice and everything from

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Speaker 3: climate change to the housing crisis, it's just not high

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Speaker 3: enough on their agenda. However, we think that that's unfair

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Speaker 3: because all of these things affect young people really strongly,

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Speaker 3: and we've heard that young people really want to vote

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Speaker 3: in the Voice, and things like the housing crisis really

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Speaker 3: affect us and the cost of education, cost of living.

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Speaker 2: The Minister to the PM, Patrick Gorman, told ABC Radio

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Speaker 2: that there are plenty of other ways for young people

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Speaker 2: to get involved and that lowering the voting age is

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Speaker 2: not a priority. Let's have a listen.

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Speaker 5: Look, I don't think that this is the priority that

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Speaker 5: we need right now. And one of the things that

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Speaker 5: I worry about with these sort of conversations is that

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Speaker 5: it implies that it starts and stops with voting. It's

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Speaker 5: so much more than that. I have young people in

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Speaker 5: my office all the time, talking to me about climate change,

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Speaker 5: talking to me about integrity issues. You don't have to

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Speaker 5: have a vote to have a say.

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Speaker 2: He also said that allowing for voluntary voting for sixteen

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Speaker 2: and seventeen year olds would weaken compulsory voting. What's your

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Speaker 2: general response to the politicians who say this is not

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Speaker 2: a good idea.

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Speaker 3: I think that we've seen, especially within the past few years,

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Speaker 3: you know, with the climate crisis worsening and all of

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Speaker 3: the different other issues that young people are really engaged with.

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Speaker 3: You know, they are fighting on the streets, they are

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Speaker 3: you know, protesting, their contacting their local MPs. They know

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Speaker 3: how they want their country to look, they know how

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Speaker 3: they want their future to look, and that really isn't

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Speaker 3: transferring into the electoral system. Young people are being impacted

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Speaker 3: by the decisions that are being made today, but they

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Speaker 3: don't have any actual say on who gets elected and

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Speaker 3: who represents them. And Minister Gorman, I think that obviously

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Speaker 3: the compulsory voting system is working because young people are

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Speaker 3: turning up and I think that that's something that definitely

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Speaker 3: needs to be continued. And so yeah, for the people

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Speaker 3: who they say is just look at how young people

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Speaker 3: are being involved and passionate already in their communities and

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Speaker 3: think about how that could translate to the ballot box.

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Speaker 2: Will be interesting to see how to make it sixteen

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Speaker 2: campaign goes Tabitha. Thanks so much for joining us on

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Speaker 2: the Daily OHS.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me.

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Speaker 4: Thanks for joining us on the Daily OS. If you

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Speaker 4: want to have your say about whether you think the

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Speaker 4: voting age should be lowered or kept as it is,

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Speaker 4: you can head to our show notes, where there is

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Speaker 4: a link to fill out a survey. It'll take you

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Speaker 4: two minutes, but it means that your voice is heard.

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Speaker 4: Have a great weekend and we'll chat to you on Monday.

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Speaker 2: Thinking appear communit