Speaker 1: It's in the news today, but it was actually on
Speaker 1: TV Reload the podcast last week. Hey guys, welcome back
Speaker 1: to TV Reload. Thank you for clicking and downloading on
Speaker 1: today's episode with Phil Lloyd, Creator, showrunner, executive producer from
Speaker 1: the latest stand original series Population eleven, which is now
Speaker 1: out on Stan Australia. Phil Lloyd is an Australian actor
Speaker 1: and scriptwriter and partner in the production company Jungle Boys.
Speaker 1: He is best known for his acting roles as Miles
Speaker 1: Barlow in the Australian TV series Review with Miles Barlow
Speaker 1: and the comedy series At Home with Julia, where he
Speaker 1: played Tim Matheson, the partner of Prime Minister Julia Gillard.
Speaker 1: I personally love his work on The Moodies and The
Speaker 1: Moodies Christmas series, and I'll ask him a little bit
Speaker 1: about that in our chat today. Population eleven is inspired
Speaker 1: by true events the missing case of Paddy Moriarty, which
Speaker 1: was the focus of the Netflix documentary series The Last
Speaker 1: Stop of Larimer. Population eleven is about a man who
Speaker 1: goes missing from a tiny town of only twelve residents,
Speaker 1: and he's a strange son who journeys from the US
Speaker 1: to find him. The series is very funny and it
Speaker 1: gives you a chance to disappear into its world over
Speaker 1: twelve episodes. I will say it has a bit of
Speaker 1: a darker twist to it as well, so bear that
Speaker 1: in mind. I will ask Phil about his thoughts on
Speaker 1: the documentary that shares the same premise, and his answer
Speaker 1: for that is actually really surprising. We will unpack how
Speaker 1: to write for global audiences and if he's writing changes
Speaker 1: from writing on shows made for Australian audiences. Phil will
Speaker 1: share his casting decisions on the lead and why Ben
Speaker 1: Feldman was right for this role. Plus we will get
Speaker 1: some insights into his collaborators who had worked with Geen
Speaker 1: Smart and Andy Sandberg on previous roles for Stan Australia.
Speaker 1: There's actually so much to unpack with Phil and his
Speaker 1: really fun to talk to. So sit back and relax
Speaker 1: as we dive just that little bit deeper into the
Speaker 1: world of Population eleven. Phil, could I just say I
Speaker 1: went and got a cup of coffee to start this
Speaker 1: because not that I don't like these shows, but I'm
Speaker 1: covering Survival, I married at first Sight and Australian idol
Speaker 1: at the moment, and so what a fricking delight it
Speaker 1: is to sit here with you today, who is a
Speaker 1: genius content creator.
Speaker 2: You're so kind, Thank you. Papa.
Speaker 3: Evan's a little bit of a hall cleanser compared to
Speaker 3: those shows, for sure.
Speaker 1: I also want to start by talking to you about
Speaker 1: how much I loved The Moodies. My partner will walk
Speaker 1: into the room and see that I'm rewatching it for
Speaker 1: like the hundredth time, and he's like, what is it
Speaker 1: about this show? You're obsessed? I just loved it.
Speaker 3: I'm so excited when people text me at Christmas time
Speaker 3: every year, you know it comes around it's that seasonal show,
Speaker 3: so and you know what, I particularly love it when
Speaker 3: people haven't seen it before.
Speaker 2: So people see it for the first time.
Speaker 1: But it doesn't matter who you are. It's such an
Speaker 1: accessible story because it's so accurate about Australian Christmas. Is
Speaker 1: just so accurate about Aussie's you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I think it's an amalgamation of a lot of people's
Speaker 3: families really, certainly from me and Tryin. It was sort
Speaker 3: of a compositive various people in our lives and relatives
Speaker 3: and those kind of awkward Christmas dinners and stuff. I
Speaker 3: think that's probably why it's relatable. People have been there.
Speaker 1: It's so relatable. I feel like it's like a porthole
Speaker 1: into time really. But you know, Ian Meadows, Patrick Brammel
Speaker 1: and Jane Harbor, just to name a few. Everybody's so
Speaker 1: fantastic in it. That's crazy.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah they are. They're brilliant. It was such a treat,
Speaker 2: such a joy to work with them, and you know
Speaker 2: when you shot that. So we had this house Moody Christmas.
Speaker 3: We had the house for about three months and so
Speaker 3: we kind of moved in and just hung out there.
Speaker 3: We actually became kind of like a family because we
Speaker 3: were just rehearsed there. We'd hang out there all the time,
Speaker 3: even when people weren't shooting on set.
Speaker 2: They just go and hang out. The landron on the
Speaker 2: couch is and that.
Speaker 3: So it kind of felt like we were kind of
Speaker 3: a mini family living in this house.
Speaker 1: You know what. I have to admit, though, this is
Speaker 1: going to sound really strange from someone who's watched the
Speaker 1: Australian version of the Moodies, I have not seen the
Speaker 1: US version.
Speaker 3: Well, I'll be interested to hear what you think. Obviously
Speaker 3: I'm biased. It's different, it's not quite the same, but
Speaker 3: that happens with remakes. I mean, it's so hard to
Speaker 3: get a remake right. Obviously, the Office, the US Office
Speaker 3: did it very well. I think that's only because they
Speaker 3: ended up making their own show.
Speaker 1: I was just curious, how does that translate though, particularly
Speaker 1: with that particular show, which felt so Australian centric, you know,
Speaker 1: hard to translate that to the US it was.
Speaker 3: I mean, Trent and I didn't end up ended up
Speaker 3: not being the writers on that. We were EPs. But
Speaker 3: in the end it's sort of had a few go
Speaker 3: rounds and like it took about six years to finally
Speaker 3: get up, and by that stage we kind of moved
Speaker 3: on to other things. So it was actually some US
Speaker 3: writers that sort of took it over. And it's kind
Speaker 3: of like it uses the framework of the Australian one
Speaker 3: and you know, the same characters and rough storyline and stuff,
Speaker 3: but definitely different.
Speaker 1: I'll hit you up on socials and give you the
Speaker 1: I'll give you the debrief on what I alas do.
Speaker 1: This is not what we're talking about today though, we're
Speaker 1: talking about Population eleven. But I just what an opportunity
Speaker 1: to talk to you about that particular show. You know,
Speaker 1: what's interesting about what's happening with streaming services, particularly with
Speaker 1: STAN Australia is you know, we're seeing a lot more
Speaker 1: content that's global based. And I mean, you grew up
Speaker 1: writing on things like Home and Away When and Losers.
Speaker 1: There's so much to your back catalog. What is it
Speaker 1: like now that you're writing for global audiences versus what
Speaker 1: you had been doing writing for assis A couple of things.
Speaker 2: I think times have changed.
Speaker 3: I think there was a time ten twenty years ago
Speaker 3: where it was quite like Americans, specially I use the
Speaker 3: example of America's they're the biggest market, I guess, but
Speaker 3: in general international audiences there's pretty bit less of an
Speaker 3: appetite to see shows from other places on TV. Like
Speaker 3: I think it would have been to get an Australian
Speaker 3: show up on a network in America was pretty hard
Speaker 3: because there wasn't really a It just didn't sort of
Speaker 3: translate over there. But I feel like now with the
Speaker 3: onslaught of all the streaming, all the streamers and that
Speaker 3: it has kind of opened the world up, It made
Speaker 3: it much more accessible and sound. Now audiences all over
Speaker 3: the world are exposed to shows from all over the world,
Speaker 3: and I think that has really helped, so you can now.
Speaker 3: So you know, when we were talking about population eleven
Speaker 3: with Lionsgate in the US, that was much more of
Speaker 3: an open conversation, which was great. So there's that, And
Speaker 3: I think in terms of writing, I think you just
Speaker 3: sort of I mean, at Jungle, we always try to
Speaker 3: do ideas that can travel. It's one of our things
Speaker 3: we want to focus on. Is this this show going
Speaker 3: to be enjoyed by people overseas? Is it an idea
Speaker 3: that's universal? Has it got universal themes? Is this sense
Speaker 3: of humor? Translate all that sort of stuff. So we
Speaker 3: sort of go into it with our eyes open, trying
Speaker 3: to make shows like that.
Speaker 2: I think that's definitely been my mindset.
Speaker 1: I found myself laughing a lot, but I found myself
Speaker 1: laughing a lot while watching this because it felt very accessible.
Speaker 1: Being Australian feels less colloquial. Like I think what had
Speaker 1: happened for a long time where in Australia we were
Speaker 1: sort of just writing either, you know, like very dark
Speaker 1: themed shows. We've now moved and sort of progressed to
Speaker 1: telling more of a broader story that I think is
Speaker 1: a little bit more accessible.
Speaker 3: I agree with that, and I think that's some Yeah,
Speaker 3: I guess in many ways, I think TV in Australia
Speaker 3: and TV writers and that have sort of matured and
Speaker 3: style and taste and everything, so that hopefully shows are.
Speaker 1: I mentioned Home Away before, and I was thinking, when
Speaker 1: I have you today, I want to ask you this
Speaker 1: question because you wrote on that for I mean, you
Speaker 1: were in and out of jobs on Home and Away
Speaker 1: for a while. Did you have a favorite character that
Speaker 1: you wrote for while you were there? Do you end
Speaker 1: up liking a particular character more than the others?
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure, the USO your favorites you write for.
Speaker 3: For sure, there's always particularly a show like that. I
Speaker 3: mean that you get so used to them and and
Speaker 3: you know, some characters you can be better at than others,
Speaker 3: Like you can you can write that dialogue a bit
Speaker 3: better than others. I found the trickiest thing on Home
Speaker 3: Away was, you know, writing teenager dialogue without trying to
Speaker 3: sound like and all the white guy trying to.
Speaker 2: Talk how the kids would talk. It's something I found
Speaker 2: that the biggest challenge.
Speaker 3: But probably it doesn't sound like a cliche, But I
Speaker 3: loved Alf.
Speaker 2: I mean I love Alf just because he was he
Speaker 2: just is that show and He's iconic.
Speaker 3: He's that character. And I love Ray, Like, Ray's just
Speaker 3: so lovely, Rama's so awesome. Yeah, he's being able to
Speaker 3: write stuff and hear him just come out of his mouth.
Speaker 2: It was really fast.
Speaker 1: How often? How tempted are you to put flaming hooligan
Speaker 1: or whatever it is, you know into his mouth? Like
Speaker 1: is it too much of a crutch?
Speaker 2: It can, but you got you can't.
Speaker 3: You can't do too much because you know he'll just
Speaker 3: take it out of it's it's too much, that's that's
Speaker 3: too many firemens in a row.
Speaker 2: There, I'll get to that kind of get to find
Speaker 2: where the level Isn't that? But yeah, he's great. Well.
Speaker 1: Population eleven is inspired by true events the Missing Case
Speaker 1: of Patty Moriarty, which you know was the focus of
Speaker 1: that Netflix documentary Last Stop at Larima, which by the way,
Speaker 1: was such a bonkers documentary.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I haven't seen it yet.
Speaker 3: Oh I know all about obviously, I know all the
Speaker 3: stories because I've read, you know, I got the audi
Speaker 3: for Population eleven to reading you know, original newspaper headlines
Speaker 3: and that. You know, I started watching and then I
Speaker 3: stopped and when you know what, I'm not going to
Speaker 3: watch this yet because I'm still in the middle of
Speaker 3: making our show and I don't want to. I just
Speaker 3: don't want to be mentally comparing it or be influenced
Speaker 3: in any way. So I'm kind of waiting until our
Speaker 3: show drops and then I'll go back and watch it.
Speaker 1: I feel like I want to watch that with you.
Speaker 1: This is crazy. I was like wanting to ask you
Speaker 1: about you know, what did you think of this documentary?
Speaker 1: I remember watching I stumbled across it and it felt
Speaker 1: very like Australian Tiger King, Do you know what I mean? Which,
Speaker 1: you know that genre at the moment is really fascinating
Speaker 1: to me. There's something quite comedic about the story, but
Speaker 1: the fact that they're all true stories is also kind
Speaker 1: of disturbing.
Speaker 3: The thing about that struck and like, I get all
Speaker 3: that you don't have to have seen the documentary to
Speaker 3: get and that was the thing that attracted me to
Speaker 3: this idea is actually not that someone went missing, like
Speaker 3: the whole people living in a tiny town and someone
Speaker 3: goes missing obviously shocking and harrowing and horrifying and just
Speaker 3: an incredible mystery because he's still missing and no one
Speaker 3: knows what happened. I mean it's just bonkers and.
Speaker 2: How could no one know anything? I find that incredible.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like the Missing plane, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no one knows anything?
Speaker 1: How can know?
Speaker 2: No one knows nothing?
Speaker 3: It's the big thing that hit me was like the
Speaker 3: characters and like, what kind of person chooses to go
Speaker 3: and live in a place like this in the middle
Speaker 3: of nowhere in a really hot, harsh environment.
Speaker 2: Not particularly beautiful.
Speaker 3: I mean it is, it's got its own rugged beauty,
Speaker 3: but come on, like it's so isolated. It takes a
Speaker 3: particular kind of person to do that. And that's what
Speaker 3: fascinated me. And the kind of people that go and
Speaker 3: live in these places. Often they're just they're running away
Speaker 3: from something, or they're trying to dis appeared themselves or whatever.
Speaker 3: So that that whole thing is really what I wanted
Speaker 3: to capture and Popo eve them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it reminds me of that Radiohead song how to
Speaker 1: Disappear Completely? You know. But the story, I guess was
Speaker 1: begging to be mined for a limited series in my opinion,
Speaker 1: But how did you decide to take the comedic group
Speaker 1: with this? I mean, not that this is a strict comedy,
Speaker 1: Like I don't want to say that, but straight away
Speaker 1: we've got Katrina very funny in your opening sequence, it's
Speaker 1: very funny, but here we are laughing at something that's
Speaker 1: kind of a little bit disturbing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's we always wanted that to be the tone,
Speaker 3: which was it's kind of like dark but comedic, sort
Speaker 3: of dangerous, dangerous and dramatic, but funny, like with comedic edges.
Speaker 3: We like that, you know, that's that's the stuff we
Speaker 3: like to make, and that felt like the best way
Speaker 3: to tell the story. But also I didn't want to
Speaker 3: make like another like you know, like Mystery Road, those
Speaker 3: kind of shows. You know, I love Ministry Road. It's
Speaker 3: such a I feel like, such a masterpiece in many ways.
Speaker 3: But that's that's that thing.
Speaker 2: I didn't want to make that thing.
Speaker 3: I didn't want to make like an outback noir or
Speaker 3: really slow moving, sort of moody kind of I really
Speaker 3: wanted it to be sort of pasty and a bit
Speaker 3: nuts and crazy, and really with these funny, weird.
Speaker 2: Edges to it.
Speaker 3: I feel like that's just a different way to tell
Speaker 3: a story in the outback, because I feel like we've
Speaker 3: seen a lot of outback shows obviously in Australia. But
Speaker 3: Tom even with the music and that the choice of music,
Speaker 3: it's a bit punk, it's a bit sitt of out
Speaker 3: there and it's a bit off pudding at times, and
Speaker 3: that's the kind of vibe we wanted to go for,
Speaker 3: just because it felt a bit fresh to us.
Speaker 1: I always think of the desert. The outback of Australia
Speaker 1: is quite scary to me, Like it's almost like the ocean,
Speaker 1: you know, you don't know what's underneath, like there's something
Speaker 1: very mysterious and very I'm actually frightened by it. I'm
Speaker 1: frightened by the outback.
Speaker 2: I get.
Speaker 3: I get that it's have you been to the territory
Speaker 3: or wa or yeah, out back places?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Now, I mean my family we always went on
Speaker 1: family holidays and so we sort of would mix it up.
Speaker 1: But I guess it's my child brain that I'm going
Speaker 1: back to. But I was quite scared of those places,
Speaker 1: like it was uncomfortable to me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so vast, because it's so vast and there's
Speaker 3: just you can go.
Speaker 2: I mean you can drive.
Speaker 3: I've driven all around the East Kimberley in that and
Speaker 3: you can drive for an hour or two or not
Speaker 3: see another human or another car. It is kind of freaky,
Speaker 3: and so it is kind of a place where we
Speaker 3: feel like anything could happen, and we certainly.
Speaker 2: Wanted to capture that vibe. And I think that's why
Speaker 2: people do go there. I mean, when I first went to.
Speaker 3: The territory, I was really struck by how many people
Speaker 3: were from somewhere else. Like I would say fifty percent
Speaker 3: of the people I met were not from the Northern Territory.
Speaker 3: They were from all the other states of Australia and overseas,
Speaker 3: and they come there.
Speaker 2: It was a bit like the wild West. They come
Speaker 2: there just to make a go of things.
Speaker 3: And I think the speed limits back then we're still
Speaker 3: like open speed limits like one hundred and thirty.
Speaker 2: Or something like.
Speaker 1: Well, who's finding it?
Speaker 2: We go its outside the city. You could go as
Speaker 2: fast as you wanted to.
Speaker 3: It's a bit nuts, and who's going to stop you
Speaker 3: because it's so vast there's not many cops around, So
Speaker 3: it's you know what I mean, Like it's yeah.
Speaker 1: Apart from Katrina who's asking you to breathe in her face, you.
Speaker 3: Know, yeah, And that's why she is the way she is,
Speaker 3: because she's she knows that. She says, this is my
Speaker 3: little fife tone. There's no I can kind of do
Speaker 3: whatever I want here as a cop. There's no one
Speaker 3: here to really police me. I can get away with it.
Speaker 1: Having Trent's hands on this, you know, is amazing because
Speaker 1: he's had such huge success with Hacks and Brooklyn ninety nine.
Speaker 1: I guess that would open a lot of doors in
Speaker 1: terms of international audiences now checking this out. Is that
Speaker 1: why you brought him into this project?
Speaker 3: No, I've known Trent for decades, Like we went to
Speaker 3: UNI together, and you know, we're very close, and I've
Speaker 3: made a lot of stuff together, and you know, I
Speaker 3: always wanted to Trent to direct this just because he's
Speaker 3: such a great comedy director and he's you know, we
Speaker 3: work very closely.
Speaker 2: We've known each other for a very long time and
Speaker 2: have done so much stuff.
Speaker 3: Together, and we just have a we have a real
Speaker 3: shorthand together in how we make comedy. So I always
Speaker 3: wanted him to be a part of this and to
Speaker 3: direct direct the first few episode. But the fact that
Speaker 3: he's been so successful overseas is also great. I hope
Speaker 3: people do tune in because he's directed so much great.
Speaker 1: Stuff we'll put that on the poster. I mean it
Speaker 1: is on the poster. Yeah, did you get any good
Speaker 1: stuf Alreway's out of him about Gene Smart or Andy Samberg?
Speaker 2: Not really just just their total pros.
Speaker 3: I remember him saying that, you know, like on Brooklyn
Speaker 3: ninety nine, like everyone's.
Speaker 2: So good, Like all the actors are so good at
Speaker 2: their job.
Speaker 3: He said, director, he's kind of easy because you just
Speaker 3: sort of rock up and they do a take and
Speaker 3: they sort of rip and they that's all.
Speaker 2: It's really funny and it's kind of like, Okay, well
Speaker 2: that was great. Do you want to try one like this?
Speaker 2: He said? It's pretty pretty easy because they're also good.
Speaker 1: I watched SNL for Andy Samberg's era of SNL. I
Speaker 1: tapped back in. I think it was like series forty
Speaker 1: or something when he came on and watched like a
Speaker 1: good six years of that SNL just for him so funny.
Speaker 2: So yeah, he's so good.
Speaker 1: How did you secure Ben for this for this role?
Speaker 1: And what made him right for this role? Like what
Speaker 1: was what was the journey with finding your protagonist?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 3: Ben, I mean I've always liked Ben. I've always liked
Speaker 3: the characters that he's played. I first came across him
Speaker 3: in mad Men. I know he's one a lot of
Speaker 3: other stuff, but that was when I first saw him
Speaker 3: in Madmen, and I don't know, I just kind of liked,
Speaker 3: liked his performance and his character. And then he was
Speaker 3: also in Silicon Valley, which I really liked him in that,
Speaker 3: and then yeah, other like A then Superstore, and I
Speaker 3: just felt like he's a andy really had to be
Speaker 3: someone who you could really sympathize with and want to
Speaker 3: go on this journey with it, Like even though he's
Speaker 3: doing he's made some bad choices in his life, He's
Speaker 3: he's got flaws, he hasn't always done the right thing,
Speaker 3: but still I still wanted someone who could make him
Speaker 3: likable and sympathetic and make you want to go on
Speaker 3: this journey with him. And I feel like Ben.
Speaker 2: Really captures that. He's a really good actor. He's done
Speaker 2: some beautiful.
Speaker 3: Performances dramatically, but he's also got a great sense of humor,
Speaker 3: really funny, and it feels very organic and natural, so
Speaker 3: he can sort of blow between the two quite easily.
Speaker 3: So Yeah, I was so thrilled when sent him the
Speaker 3: script and he read it and he said yeah, I
Speaker 3: was looking for reasons to turn this down, but I
Speaker 3: really like it.
Speaker 2: I really want to do it.
Speaker 1: And I was like, yes, when people say that sort
Speaker 1: of stuff, I always get like, is that insulting? I'm
Speaker 1: looking for things that are you know, to turn this down.
Speaker 3: Well, I think I think the prospect of coming to
Speaker 3: Australia for a few months was like a big obviously,
Speaker 3: that's a big ordeal to leave his family for a
Speaker 3: few months and come over here and had all these
Speaker 3: plans and that. But Tom ultimately he said, oh, I
Speaker 3: just can't. I've been waiting for something like this and
Speaker 3: I don't think I can turn it down. So he
Speaker 3: creatively really wanted to do it, which was awesome, and
Speaker 3: he was a really great creative partner. He was like
Speaker 3: right into it, the whole thing.
Speaker 1: So, well, it's a lot of heavy lifting. You know.
Speaker 1: He's in nearly every scene, so it's all about him.
Speaker 1: I always find it's really strange with him. He's exactly
Speaker 1: the same age as me. I tapped him with him
Speaker 1: with Mad Men as well, and I remember looking him
Speaker 1: up and reading about his backstory. At that point, I'm
Speaker 1: exactly the same age as him, but he looks ten
Speaker 1: years younger than me, it's crazy.
Speaker 2: Well, you don't live in Hollywood.
Speaker 1: I guess imagine what I would look like if I
Speaker 1: lived there. Actually I did live in Los Angeles and.
Speaker 3: Did obviously not long enough. I guess during that twelve
Speaker 3: months you would look fantastic. Need to go back down now,
Speaker 3: by the way.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I was going to say, you know, with
Speaker 1: so many of these brilliant comedians that are in this
Speaker 1: we mentioned Katrina but for but also Stephen Curry so fantastic,
Speaker 1: when you're shooting a comedy, is it hard not to laugh?
Speaker 1: Like have You've got a lot of crew with gags
Speaker 1: and gags in their mouth because these guys are so funny.
Speaker 1: If the smallest things, how do you keep the laugh
Speaker 1: track out of out of production?
Speaker 2: Oh? Well, yeah, that's just professionalism.
Speaker 3: I mean obviously there are often the crew are sort
Speaker 3: of sicking to themselves or whatever. But Tom, but also,
Speaker 3: you know, everyone's there for work, and everyone's everyone knows
Speaker 3: what we're trying to get in that. But yeah, definitely,
Speaker 3: Like I would look over at here in our DP
Speaker 3: sometimes and he'd be like biting his lip trying not
Speaker 3: to laugh, and which was which is always a good sign.
Speaker 3: But also these things are contextual as well, so oftentimes
Speaker 3: it doesn't It's never really bothered me if if we're
Speaker 3: doing a funny bit and no one in the crews laughing,
Speaker 3: because I kind of feel like, well, I know it's
Speaker 3: going to be funny on screen and what we're trying
Speaker 3: to do with it, so it doesn't bother me hugely.
Speaker 3: But yeah, there definitely were times where people were trying
Speaker 3: not to ruin the take.
Speaker 1: What was the rationale for the length of each episode
Speaker 1: as well, because I mean it's quite a long series
Speaker 1: to what we've been used to kind of seeing on
Speaker 1: a lot of these streaming platforms. This is a little
Speaker 1: bit longer and the episodes are shorter. What was the
Speaker 1: rationale with all of that?
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I feel like very often we do six you know now,
Speaker 3: like the UK model is six, and we've sort of
Speaker 3: yes a six or eight. I'm certainly used to doing
Speaker 3: six or eight half hours. Look, I just wanted to
Speaker 3: tell a longer a mystery with a longer tail. I
Speaker 3: mean it's called Population eleven, you know, I kind of
Speaker 3: really wanted to lean into all of these characters and
Speaker 3: you know, roughly spend approximately an episode on each it
Speaker 3: needs a lot of breathing room. And I'm so glad
Speaker 3: and grateful that I got to do that, because trying
Speaker 3: to tell this story in six EPs would have been
Speaker 3: a very different prospect and would have felt much more
Speaker 3: rushed than that.
Speaker 1: So I don't think it would have allowed you to
Speaker 1: get that sense. And that's what you do. Get to
Speaker 1: kind of get lost in the outback, and that's, you know,
Speaker 1: very cleverly crafted. And I guess if you were to
Speaker 1: try and make that shorter, you'd sort of you lose
Speaker 1: that almost claustrophobic feeling. Whilst it's set in the outback,
Speaker 1: which is like an open space, do you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? It allows to create the perfect environment for
Speaker 1: the viewer.
Speaker 2: Totally, and it is that thing of like once you
Speaker 2: spend time there.
Speaker 3: I mean, it happened to me like when I would
Speaker 3: go over you know, from I live in Sydney, but
Speaker 3: when I would go over there, over to Derby, and
Speaker 3: it'd take about two or three days for my city
Speaker 3: brain to leave my head. And then now now you're
Speaker 3: sort of in the outback and everything kind of slows
Speaker 3: down and you sort of get used to the heat and
Speaker 3: the environment. And not being able to get the things
Speaker 3: you can get in the city and all that sort
Speaker 3: of stuff, and that does take time to unfold, and
Speaker 3: if you do spend long enough, you can go a
Speaker 3: bit nuts. Certainly, after shooting there for four months, it
Speaker 3: was by the end of it, Yeah, it was a
Speaker 3: bit getting cabin fever a little bit.
Speaker 1: What's your take home from making this series? Like, what
Speaker 1: did you learn while putting this together?
Speaker 3: I learned that writing mysteries is really hard but really fun.
Speaker 3: I love it, and I want to do it again
Speaker 3: because I've never done like a mystery thriller show before.
Speaker 3: Certainly want to do that again. Shooting in remote outback
Speaker 3: is hard. Love it, absolutely love it was that you know,
Speaker 3: the you know, I wouldn't have gone there otherwise and
Speaker 3: it was a real amazing experience, but really tough because like, again,
Speaker 3: you're not.
Speaker 2: In the city.
Speaker 3: You can't just oh, we need another you know, sheet
Speaker 3: of tin or whatever. You can't just go down to
Speaker 3: the local miight of ten and get it or whatever.
Speaker 1: You're going to shut it in.
Speaker 2: So there's all that stuff.
Speaker 3: All the logistics, I would say probably, and I knew
Speaker 3: there were a lot of logistics, but I think having
Speaker 3: done it and now, oh yeah, okay, I know how
Speaker 3: I'd do it differently this time.
Speaker 1: Phil, Did you get bitten by like snakes, termites or what?
Speaker 2: I think I didn't get bitten by.
Speaker 3: You know, we saw a few snakes or a lot
Speaker 3: of termites or a lot of crocs, got close to
Speaker 3: some crocs, but fortunately escaped without any injuries from other nature,
Speaker 3: which is good. Far from sunburn, fascinating place.
Speaker 1: Something I ask everyone who joins the podcast is what
Speaker 1: is something from behind the scenes, something of a story
Speaker 1: that maybe we kind of like a funny anecdote from
Speaker 1: I guess the production of this. Is there anything that
Speaker 1: happened that was a good yarn from behind the scenes?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, actually there is. I mean there's plenty, and
Speaker 3: you put me on the spot. Luckily I've thought of one.
Speaker 3: But so, the big thing in Derby is is an
Speaker 3: up around room and that people go crabbing catching crabs
Speaker 3: because I have these huge, massive, like mud crabs in
Speaker 3: that around Derby, Like they're like the size of a
Speaker 3: dinner blade, Like they're huge, and there's so many of them.
Speaker 3: One part of the storyline, we've got people catching crabs
Speaker 3: in their crab pots Anyway, we're shooting one down. Our
Speaker 3: props master Julian, he was in charge of We had
Speaker 3: two live crabs and everything. And anyway, at one point
Speaker 3: we were sort of setting for the shutt and Julian yells,
Speaker 3: out of case, I need some help over here. I
Speaker 3: looked over and said, what he says, This crab has
Speaker 3: got and the crab had its pincer like around his thumb.
Speaker 2: It had caught his thumb.
Speaker 3: And it's pincer and his pincer was pretty huge, about
Speaker 3: the size of my fingers.
Speaker 2: I was pretty massive, and it was going blue like.
Speaker 3: It was going purple like it wouldn't let go, and
Speaker 3: he was going and so he rushed over and couldn't
Speaker 3: prize it open, and eventually I had to just get up,
Speaker 3: get the pair of plies and like snip the snip
Speaker 3: the claw off the crab and then break and then
Speaker 3: break and then use them. And we still wouldn't open.
Speaker 3: We so snipped the claw off and it was hold
Speaker 3: on onto his thumb and eventually just had to like
Speaker 3: crunch the whole claw off his farm because we thought
Speaker 3: he was going to and I thought, oh my god,
Speaker 3: it's going to get snipped off. Fortunately, it didn't and
Speaker 3: it was it was well able to band advantage it
Speaker 3: off and everything. It was pretty scary there for a second.
Speaker 2: That sounds like I was being cruel to the crab.
Speaker 1: No, not at all. You know that they put.
Speaker 2: Their pincers off, they grow back.
Speaker 1: I don't think crabs have feelings, but maybe the animal
Speaker 1: cruelty people are going to come for me. I absolutely
Speaker 1: delighted chatting to you today, Like I just am so
Speaker 1: impressed with what you've been able to do with your
Speaker 1: career and this show is so fantastic. So I hope
Speaker 1: people that get a chance to listen to us talking
Speaker 1: today goes to stut Australia and watches this. It's something
Speaker 1: really fun to binge watch. And yeah, congratulations on this.
Speaker 1: I think it's really exciting.
Speaker 2: Thanks so much, Beeron. It's been an absolutely treat to
Speaker 2: talk to you, and I'm so glad you enjoy the show.