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Speaker 1: Well, as you heard on the show yesterday, there's been

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Speaker 1: a fresh bid from developers to build thousands of homes

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Speaker 1: on undeveloped land in Darwin's rural area after a similar

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Speaker 1: proposal was rejected in twenty twenty due to opposition from locals.

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Speaker 1: Now Melbourne based developer Intrapac Property has written to the

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Speaker 1: Planning Minister Josh Burgoyne asking for an amendment to the

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Speaker 1: Northern Territories Planning Scheme to make way for the project,

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Speaker 1: set to be named Lloyd Creek Rural Village. The proposal

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Speaker 1: would see four thousand homes built south of Humptydo in

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Speaker 1: an area which was zoned for rural living. Now, yesterday

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Speaker 1: we heard from the former member for Goiter Kezi Epiic.

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Speaker 1: She is one of those who is opposed to this project,

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Speaker 1: along with several others and joining me on the show

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Speaker 1: though to answer some further questions is Intrapac's chief executive

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Speaker 1: Max Schiffman. Good morning to you, Max, Good morning Katie,

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much for your time this morning. Now, Max,

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Speaker 1: what exactly is being proposed this time round?

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Speaker 2: Sure? So, look what we're trying to do at the

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Speaker 2: moment is a mend the planning scheme to create what's

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Speaker 2: called an area plan, and that basically sets the framework

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Speaker 2: for the long term vision of the development that we're

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Speaker 2: posing out durylloid crete. Essentially, we're talking about a thirty

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Speaker 2: plus year horizon to deliver in the order of four

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Speaker 2: thousand homes plus a village center across that site, which

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Speaker 2: is twenty eight hundred hectares in size. So it's an

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Speaker 2: enormous site. It's already zoned for rural living, and what

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Speaker 2: we're trying to do is really create a more robust

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Speaker 2: framework to make sure that it rolls out in a

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Speaker 2: more well designed, well planned way, so don't have the

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Speaker 2: issues we do we have in some parts of the

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Speaker 2: Royal Area. You're lacking some of those infrastructure bits and

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Speaker 2: amenities over the longer term.

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Speaker 1: Now, in terms of the number of blocks, well, I mean,

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Speaker 1: we know it's going to be from what I can

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Speaker 1: see that proposal flag four thousand homes. How many of

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Speaker 1: those blocks will be four thousand square meters? How many

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Speaker 1: are going to be a hectare, how many are going

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Speaker 1: to be two hectare?

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Speaker 2: Sure, So what we're saying is, you know, some of

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Speaker 2: that detail has to go through a more standard planning

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Speaker 2: process after an area plan is approved. But what we've

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Speaker 2: committed to is essentially density caps across different zones of

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Speaker 2: the site. So you've got the village center area, and

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Speaker 2: that's a relatively small area of the total site, but

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Speaker 2: that's where you'd have blocks on the slightly smaller ends.

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Speaker 2: They're still very large blocks, but slightly smaller than what

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Speaker 2: you might have in rural area currently. Then the block

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Speaker 2: sides get larger as you get away from those village centers,

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Speaker 2: So ultimately at the very edge of the site you're

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Speaker 2: ending up with lots that are entirely consistent with the

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Speaker 2: development that's already in place there in the area. So

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Speaker 2: across the total site, we've got a maximum density of

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Speaker 2: one point five lots per hectare, and that's how you

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Speaker 2: get to that four thousand figure.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So there will obviously, by the sounds of it,

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Speaker 1: some of them will be the smaller size, some of

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Speaker 1: them are going to be large. But you're still working

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Speaker 1: through sort of how many of what I spies?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. I mean that you need to respond to

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Speaker 2: the specifics of the land in a particular zone that

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Speaker 2: you're working with, because you've got different topography you'll have

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Speaker 2: different constraints around some of the biodiversity corridors we want

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Speaker 2: to retain. You've got water courses that we have to

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Speaker 2: protect and work around, So there's still a level of

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Speaker 2: detailed design that has to happen before we actually develop anything.

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Speaker 2: What this area plan is really about is setting the

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Speaker 2: broad principles, the broad framework in the way that everyone

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Speaker 2: can work towards in terms of delivering the project over

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Speaker 2: the longer term. And I should say that one of

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Speaker 2: the things that we set out to do is really

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Speaker 2: understand better what the attitudes of the Dalin community are

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Speaker 2: and what are community is towards rural development and the

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Speaker 2: sorts of things they would like to see. So we

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Speaker 2: conducted some pretty substantial research with focus groups to understand

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Speaker 2: what people want, and one of the clear messages was

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Speaker 2: that people want that sort of rural lifestyle. They want

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Speaker 2: to have the room to move and grow, but they

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Speaker 2: also don't necessarily have the large blocks that people used

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Speaker 2: to the two HEC deal lots or the eight HEC

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Speaker 2: deal lots, because they do come with a lot of maintenance.

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Speaker 2: And so what we're trying to deliver here is something

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Speaker 2: that hasn't really been done before, hasn't been planned in

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Speaker 2: this lay before, but ultimately still gives you that perfect

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Speaker 2: mix of the more rural lifestyle, but maybe in a

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Speaker 2: more attainable way for more people.

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Speaker 1: Now, I know there's been quite a few people raising

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Speaker 1: concerns around water, you know, like how is that going

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Speaker 1: to work?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so look, when we went through a previous process,

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Speaker 2: one of the in fact the biggest issue, I would say,

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Speaker 2: was that we're proposing to use groundwater from the aquifer.

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Speaker 2: And one of the key things that's changed now is

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Speaker 2: that you've got the strous water treatment plant project that's

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Speaker 2: up and running and Doe to bit completed next year

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Speaker 2: as part of the Mantan Dam project. So what that

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Speaker 2: means is we can actually can connect all of the

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Speaker 2: new lots to reticulated water instead, so there's no impact

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Speaker 2: on the aquifer, no impact on the groundwater. We're going

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Speaker 2: to be using town water connecting all the lots to it.

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Speaker 2: And that really was the biggest issue that we've faced previously.

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Speaker 2: Now that we've got a resolution to that, it opens

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Speaker 2: up the site.

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Speaker 1: So no need for bores. Is that correct?

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Speaker 2: That's correct? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, I suppose that is something that people

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Speaker 1: have said is a concern for them. I mean, one

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Speaker 1: of the biggest concerns that we're hearing on the tech

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Speaker 1: sne and also sort of the phone lines have lit

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Speaker 1: up now, is that people are worried it's not really

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Speaker 1: going to be rural, that the blocks are going to

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Speaker 1: be smaller and they're not going to have the services needed.

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Speaker 1: I mean, what do you say to them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, again, you've got to look at how the

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Speaker 2: rural area developed, and so what we're actually talking about

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Speaker 2: is returning to that sort of style of development that

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Speaker 2: you had thirty years ago in the rural area, where

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Speaker 2: you had a township and a village with the local

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Speaker 2: shops and the school and that sort of thing like

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Speaker 2: your Humpty dooes, and you had still very large blocks

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Speaker 2: relative to what you're seeing in the newer suburbs of Darwin.

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Speaker 2: For example, we're talking a minimum lot size that's probably

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Speaker 2: in the order of three and a half to four

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Speaker 2: times bigger than the lots of getting in areas like

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Speaker 2: Zacollie at the moment. But you're doing it in a

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Speaker 2: pattern that lets people still access those local facilities nearby.

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Speaker 2: And then as I said, you get bigger and bigger lots.

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Speaker 2: The further way you get from that infrastructure and amenity.

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Speaker 2: So the good thing about what we're doing by planning

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Speaker 2: in this holistic way is making sure that we've allowed

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Speaker 2: for all those things up front. It doesn't mean you'll

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Speaker 2: have a school day one, but it means you know

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Speaker 2: where the school's going to be and something we can

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Speaker 2: work towards it. It knows where your public transport routes

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Speaker 2: will be. It knows where you'll be able to have

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Speaker 2: your parks and gardens and buidiversity corridors. You'll know we've

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Speaker 2: got your open space network. All of that can be

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Speaker 2: designed from the outset, and then you're working within those

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Speaker 2: parameters to deliver the project over that very very long timeframe.

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Speaker 1: I mean, how many of those blocks do you sort

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Speaker 1: of have to sell though before you're in a situation

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Speaker 1: where you are able to get the you know, the

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Speaker 1: public bus network for example, to have a stop nearby.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, it's a great question, and it's going to

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Speaker 2: be an ongoing discussion that we have with the operators

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Speaker 2: with the government around when they cann new services. There

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Speaker 2: are already bus services to the site, by the way,

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Speaker 2: they probably the most frequent as everyone would like, but Obviously,

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Speaker 2: the more you have a population there that can use it,

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Speaker 2: the greater the chances you'll start to increase the frequency

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Speaker 2: of those services.

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Speaker 1: Now, someone's just messaged through Derby from the dou's message

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Speaker 1: through and said, is it going to be septic or

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Speaker 1: town sewerage? From what you were saying, it sounds like town.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if we've lost Max there, I've got you.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure whether you heard that one. Somebody questioning

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Speaker 1: whether it's going to be septic or town sewerage.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so the majority of this site will be able

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Speaker 2: to use septics. There's been a lot of change in

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Speaker 2: technology around how you can service either an individual site

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Speaker 2: or small groups of sites, and that's what we're looking

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Speaker 2: at at the moment. Plus, there's been some changes to

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Speaker 2: the waste toward management rules in the rural area, which

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Speaker 2: are very dependent on the type of soil conditions that

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Speaker 2: you have and the soil sort of ground conditions that

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Speaker 2: we have on the site themselves. To those newer rules,

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Speaker 2: so you can use a septic on a smaller lot

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Speaker 2: and perhaps what you might have been able to thirty

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Speaker 2: forty years ago.

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Speaker 1: Now we are. I mean, look, Max, there's plenty of

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Speaker 1: messages coming through people you know, wanting really to keep rural.

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Speaker 1: I guess is the most clear message I can I

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Speaker 1: can make. But what are the next steps from your

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Speaker 1: perspective in terms of you know, getting things moving?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, firstly, we agree we're trying to keep real

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Speaker 2: rule and some people are sort of imagining that you're

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Speaker 2: going to have four thousand homes built there overnight, Like

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Speaker 2: that's absolutely not the case. They said, we're talking talking

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Speaker 2: through to forty years for this project to roll out,

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Speaker 2: and just imagine what the rural area looks like thirty

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Speaker 2: years ago and da, and it's the same sort of approach.

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Speaker 2: You just got to think a bit longer term, which

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Speaker 2: is the sort of way we're approaching the site. Both procedurally,

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Speaker 2: the area plan is out for public comment at the moment.

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Speaker 2: The exhibition period ends on the sixteenth of Mates. People

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Speaker 2: should have a look online and put their submissions in.

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Speaker 2: If the area Plan is approved, then that gives us

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Speaker 2: the ability to then start making the more detailed planning applications,

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Speaker 2: and that's when they get into the nitty gritty about

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Speaker 2: specific infrastructure, timing, lot size, and that goes to a

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Speaker 2: normal develop the content process.

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, Max, we are going to have to

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Speaker 1: leave it there. Max Shifman, the CEO, of course of Intrapak,

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Speaker 1: who is looking at this development. Thank you very much

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Speaker 1: for your time. Really appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: My pleasure.

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Speaker 1: Thank you,