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Speaker 1: Good morning and welcome to the Daily Odds. It is Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: the second of August.

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Speaker 2: Victoria today becomes the only state in Australia to legalize.

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Speaker 1: The legislation's tassage through Tasmania's Upper House last night was

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Speaker 1: an emotional moment for the bill's.

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Speaker 2: Reassisted dying laws past South Australian Parliament, and voluntary assisted

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Speaker 2: dying has been passed into law in New South Wales.

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Speaker 1: Years of debate, campaigning, advocacy and reform have seen voluntary

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Speaker 1: assisted dying bills legalized in every state in Australia, but

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Speaker 1: not in the territories. Why well, it's not because campaigners

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Speaker 1: in the nt and Act haven't wanted to introduce voluntary

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Speaker 1: assisted dying legislation. It's because they weren't even allowed to try.

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Speaker 1: So why do territories have different rights to the states

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Speaker 1: and could that all be about to change?

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Speaker 3: We don't want to be second class citizens. The times

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Speaker 3: come for us to restore those rights to the territory.

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Speaker 1: We'll speak to u MP Luke Gosling who's trying to

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Speaker 1: make this all happen. But first, Zara the headlines.

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Speaker 2: Federal Resources Minister Madeline King has offered an ultimatum to

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Speaker 2: Australia's biggest gas companies, warning they'll face extraordinary export controls

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Speaker 2: from next year if they don't commit enough gas to

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Speaker 2: the domestic market. Nenister King said on Monday that she

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Speaker 2: would be issuing a notice of intent to retain some

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Speaker 2: volumes of gas that wouldn't be exported.

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Speaker 1: A new bill that would prevent public hospitals from stopping

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Speaker 1: doctors who provide abortions will be introduced to Victorian Parliament

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Speaker 1: this week. The bill, which will be introduced by Reason

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Speaker 1: Party leader Fiona Patton, hopes to consolidate abortion and contraceptive

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Speaker 1: rights in the state, with debate on the bill expected

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Speaker 1: to begin in a fortnight after the second reading of

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Speaker 1: the bill happens on Wednesday.

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Speaker 2: The Nuclear Submarine Pact that was announced last year by

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Speaker 2: ORCUS will be under the microscope at a United Nations

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Speaker 2: nuclear conference this week. The UN's tenth Review Conference of

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Speaker 2: the Treaty on the Non Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons will

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Speaker 2: be attended by a sixteen member Australian delegation, who's likely

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Speaker 2: to be probed on how the pact will comply with

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Speaker 2: pre existing treaties on the matter.

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Speaker 1: And Today's good news Ireland has announced new climate targets

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Speaker 1: that would form a fifty one percent cut in economy

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Speaker 1: wide emissions by twenty thirty. In its announcement, the Irish

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Speaker 1: government also set maximum limits on greenhouse gas emissions for

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Speaker 1: each sector of its economy, while making agriculture changes voluntary

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Speaker 1: for its farmers to take up.

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Speaker 2: Before we jump into this deep dive, just a heads

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Speaker 2: up that it deals with voluntary assisted dying. So if

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Speaker 2: this isn't something that you are in a headspace to

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Speaker 2: listen to today, why don't you chime in again tomorrow.

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Speaker 1: So Zara, you know how I said at the top

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Speaker 1: of the episode that every state in Australia has voluntary

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Speaker 1: assisted dying bills.

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Speaker 2: I did hear that, yes.

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Speaker 1: But neither of the territories have been able to Yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: here's a little twist in that narrative for you. Did

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Speaker 1: you know that the Northern Territory was actually the first

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Speaker 1: jurisdiction in the world to pass laws for voluntary assisted dying.

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Speaker 2: I genuinely didn't know this and found this possibly the

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Speaker 2: most fascinating part of this entire deep dive.

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Speaker 1: So it was all called the Rights of the Terminally

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Speaker 1: Ill Act in nineteen ninety five and it was introduced

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Speaker 1: by then Chief Minister Marshall Perrin. Now, as you can imagine,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't the smoothest passage, and it was amended forty

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Speaker 1: nine times before it ended up passing, and it passed

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Speaker 1: fifteen votes to ten. This bill didn't come into effect

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Speaker 1: until July nineteen ninety six, during which time there were

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Speaker 1: some amendments to the bills and some attempts to repeal it.

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Speaker 1: But by the time it came into effect, it was

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Speaker 1: an act to, in its words, confirm the right of

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Speaker 1: a terminally ill person to request assistance from a medically

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Speaker 1: qualified person to voluntary terminate his or her life in

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Speaker 1: a humane manner. There were a number of limitations on this,

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Speaker 1: checks and balances, like three medical practitioners basically had to

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Speaker 1: okay the request of the person and confirm that the

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Speaker 1: person wasn't experiencing quote treatable clinical depression.

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Speaker 2: So it seems like that legislation was ahead of the curve.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it was before I was born, and yet

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Speaker 2: was still having these conversations today.

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Speaker 1: It was kind of treated like a test case by

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Speaker 1: the rest of the world.

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Speaker 2: So tell us what happened the.

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Speaker 1: Rights of the Terminally Ill Act was in place for

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Speaker 1: nine months, during which four people died by medically assisted suicide.

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Speaker 1: Robert Dent, a terminally ill sixty six year old cancer pation,

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Speaker 1: was the first person to die under this law, and

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Speaker 1: Zara it was definitely contentious. The first two deaths were

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Speaker 1: administered by a computerized lethal injection and this became known

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Speaker 1: as the death machine. The Australian Medical Association expressed their

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Speaker 1: concerns and the Vatican condemned the deaths as a revolt

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Speaker 1: against God. And then what happened enter Kevin Andrews. What

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Speaker 1: do you know about Kevin Andrews?

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Speaker 2: Zara. Funnily enough, I did a hole for eject on

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Speaker 2: the Father of the House. It's the person that has

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Speaker 2: spent the longest period of time uninterrupted in Federal Parliament.

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Speaker 2: Kevin Andrews was a federal member of the Liberal Party.

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Speaker 2: He was Conservative. He was a member of the House

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Speaker 2: of Representatives for the seat of Menzies, which is in Victoria.

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Speaker 2: As I said before, was the longest continually serving member

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Speaker 2: of the Federal Parliament. That was until he lost his

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Speaker 2: seat last year in a pre selection.

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Speaker 1: Back in nineteen ninety six, John Howard's the Prime Minister

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Speaker 1: Andrews has only been in Parliament for four or five

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Speaker 1: years and he looks at what's happening in the NT

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Speaker 1: with their Voluntary Assisted Dying Bill and he decides to

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Speaker 1: stop it. He tells Parliament that the Voluntary Assisted Bill

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Speaker 1: in the NT sought to allow quote the use of

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Speaker 1: a lethal injection to bring about the immediate death of another,

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Speaker 1: and that the Commonwealth couldn't quote wash its hands of

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Speaker 1: the decision. So he introduces the Euthanasia Laws Act in

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Speaker 1: nineteen ninety seven, which is now sometimes referred to as

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Speaker 1: the Andrews' Bill.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so talk to me about this Andrew's Bill. What

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Speaker 2: did it do?

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Speaker 1: Basically, it's said that territories don't have the legal jurisdiction,

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Speaker 1: which means the legal permission to permit quote intentional killing

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Speaker 1: or euthanasia. Not only did the Act ban the territories

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Speaker 1: from legalizing voluntary assisted dying, it specifically stated the following,

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Speaker 1: for the avoidance of doubt, the enactment of the Legislative

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Speaker 1: Assembly called the Rights of the Terminally Ill Acts nineteen

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Speaker 1: ninety five has no force or effect as a law

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Speaker 1: of the territory.

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Speaker 2: Okay, So the Andrews Bild said that the territories couldn't

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Speaker 2: legislate on assisted dying. But I think that this could

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Speaker 2: be confusing to people, and it certainly was to me

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Speaker 2: when I first started thinking about this concept. How does

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Speaker 2: a federal government tell the Northern territory government, which for

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Speaker 2: all intents and purposes can govern itself, what they can

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Speaker 2: and cannot legislate.

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Speaker 1: Let me go full constitutional law nerd on you. The

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Speaker 1: territories work a little differently from the states because they

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Speaker 1: don't have the same legal status. There's actually a reason

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Speaker 1: why they're called states and territories, and it's all because

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Speaker 1: of a constitutional power which enables the federal parliament to

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Speaker 1: overturn territory laws, but they can't do that with states.

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Speaker 2: We heard that the NT was ahead of the curve.

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Speaker 2: It introduced voluntary assisted dying laws years and years before

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Speaker 2: anyone else did, and yet now it's one of only

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Speaker 2: two jurisdictions in the country without it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but the first Australian state to allow voluntary assisted dying,

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Speaker 1: which was Victoria, only pass their legislation in twenty seventeen.

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Speaker 1: New South Wales only passed a bill through state parliament

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Speaker 1: this year in May. So in other parts of the country.

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Speaker 1: It's all pretty fresh, okay.

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Speaker 2: And where are the territories at with all of this,

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Speaker 2: given how far ahead the NT was over a decade ago.

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Speaker 1: Well, they have this massive barrier in place with the

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Speaker 1: Andrews Bill, and there's been a few attempts in the

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Speaker 1: Federal Parliament to overturn it, but they've all been unsuccessful.

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Speaker 1: But yesterday, and this is why we're talking about it

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Speaker 1: today on the podcast, there was a big new development.

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Speaker 4: For too long, Australians living in the territories have been

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Speaker 4: treated as second class citizens when it comes to legislating

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Speaker 4: on matters that impact their own lives, and it's well

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Speaker 4: past time for that to end. It is called the

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Speaker 4: Restoring Territory Rights Bill because that is all it seeks

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Speaker 4: to do, to level the democratic playing field and restore

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Speaker 4: legislative rights to our territories.

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Speaker 1: What is Luke Gosling. He's an MP from the Northern

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Speaker 1: Territory and he was tabling the Restoring Territory Rights Bill

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Speaker 1: to Parliament.

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Speaker 3: Hello, I'm Luke Gosling. I'm the Federal Member for Solomon,

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Speaker 3: which is Darwin and Palmerston, the capital of Northern Australia.

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Speaker 1: We spoke to him just after he tabled the bill

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Speaker 1: about what he's trying to achieve here.

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Speaker 3: Today, I introduced a private members bill which seeks to

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Speaker 3: restore the rights of the territories the NT and the Act,

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Speaker 3: because we haven't had the same rights to legislate on

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Speaker 3: certain issues, including voluntary assisted dying, as the States have.

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Speaker 1: Luke Gosling is focused here on the rights of the territories,

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Speaker 1: not necessarily about legislating assisted dying.

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Speaker 3: I have reservations around voluntary assisted dying, and it basically

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Speaker 3: goes to the need for safeguards for vulnerable people. I

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Speaker 3: really appreciate that for people, end of life issues matters

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Speaker 3: of conscience are really important to them. A lot of

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Speaker 3: people have had personal experiences and had the personal responsibility

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Speaker 3: of loved ones going through the end of life and

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Speaker 3: wondering what is the right thing to do. And all

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Speaker 3: we are trying to say as territorians is we understand

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Speaker 3: that we respect that these are issues for the territories

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Speaker 3: to decide for themselves, as the states have, and we

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Speaker 3: ask for their support to restore the rights of territorians.

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Speaker 3: We don't want to be second class citizens. The times

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Speaker 3: come for us to restore those rights to the territory.

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Speaker 2: Do we know what would happen if the bill passed.

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Speaker 2: Would the territory automatically revert back to having the rights

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Speaker 2: of the terminally Ill Act that we saw in nineteen

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Speaker 2: ninety five.

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Speaker 3: It absolutely will not. That bill, the original bill under

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Speaker 3: the martial pair and government of nineteen ninety five ninety

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Speaker 3: six is null and void. It will not come alive again.

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Speaker 3: It is part of history. It's a part of the

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Speaker 3: history of this struggle for rights for the territories. But

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Speaker 3: what will happen if we are successful in getting this

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Speaker 3: private members bill passed the Northern Territory Legisative Assembly or

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Speaker 3: Parliament and the Act Legislative Assembly. And we heard from

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Speaker 3: the Chief Minister of the Act today who is there

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Speaker 3: watching it, is that they'll go through a deliberative process,

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Speaker 3: a long consultative process, to work this through and arrive

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Speaker 3: at some draft legislation if they choose to do so.

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Speaker 3: But they are decisions for the legislative assemblies, informed by

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Speaker 3: the constituents that vote them into those legislative assemblies. So

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Speaker 3: I look forward to being part of that debate as

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Speaker 3: a citizen of the Northern Territory.

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Speaker 2: And does he think this bill is likely to get

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Speaker 2: off the ground.

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Speaker 1: So when a similar bill was introduced in twenty eighteen,

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Speaker 1: it was only narrowly voted down, but there's no guarantee

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Speaker 1: here that it will pass or even be close.

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Speaker 3: However, in the previous two parliament, the Coalition was the

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Speaker 3: government and they stop that bill from coming forward to

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Speaker 3: be debated. Litt alone voted on. The difference now is

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Speaker 3: that the Prime Minister Anthony Albanet has said that restoring

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Speaker 3: the rights of the territory is an important issue to

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Speaker 3: territorians and therefore we will allow a conscience vote to

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Speaker 3: go forward and be debated. And it is right now

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Speaker 3: in the Federal Parliament, so we'll go from the House

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Speaker 3: of Reps into the Senate. Hopefully it passes both houses

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Speaker 3: and the rights of territorians in this regard will be restored.

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Speaker 2: Does he have any thoughts about larger scale reform to

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Speaker 2: change how the Commonwealth can intervene in territory legislation That goes.

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Speaker 3: To the issue of statehood, and it is an issue

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Speaker 3: that the Northern Territory has looked on numerous occasions, even

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Speaker 3: voted on once. But at that point in time, the

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Speaker 3: people of the Northern Territory are voted to stay a territory.

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Speaker 3: I think becoming a state is still some time away. However,

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Speaker 3: I think it is something that is important to Northern

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Speaker 3: Territorians and I won't speak of the Act because I

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Speaker 3: think they will continue to have a really special role

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Speaker 3: in the life of the nation as Australia's capital territory.

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Speaker 1: We'll definitely keep you posted on what happens next.

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Speaker 2: If you liked what you heard on today's episode, please

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Speaker 2: leave us five stars wherever you do your listening. It

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Speaker 2: helps a little independent media company like ours grow and

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Speaker 2: we so appreciate your support. Thanks for listening and have

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Speaker 2: a fabulous Tuesday.