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Speaker 1: This episode is brought to you by under Ama Combine.

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Speaker 1: Is Lauren Jackson's return the greatest in sporting history? We

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Speaker 1: think it just might be. The four time Olympian, two

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Speaker 1: time WNBA Champion, three time WNBA MVP, seven time w

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Speaker 1: NBA All Star, Nay Smith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame

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Speaker 1: and now mother of two is returning to compete at

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Speaker 1: her fifth World Cup in Sydney from September to twenty

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Speaker 1: second after being forced to retire due to a persistent

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Speaker 1: knee injury in the lead up to the Rio Olympics

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Speaker 1: in twenty sixteen, LJ has a renewed sense of perspective

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Speaker 1: about the game and about life itself. It was an

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Speaker 1: incredible honor to have the chance to sit down and

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Speaker 1: chat with the goat. I really hope you enjoy it.

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Speaker 1: Lauren Jackson, Welcome to the Female Athlete Project.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 1: I'm very, very excited to be having a chat to

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Speaker 1: you for a number of reasons, in part because I

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Speaker 1: grew up as a kid playing basketball and sat on

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Speaker 1: the bench and did some tower waving in the WNBL

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Speaker 1: for a couple of years. But one of my one

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Speaker 1: of my biggest idols and inspirations. So my whole sporting

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Speaker 1: career has been you and the career that you have

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Speaker 1: paved the way for. So it's a very special honor.

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Speaker 1: So thank you so much for sitting down and having

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Speaker 1: a chat today.

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Speaker 2: Not a problem, thank you.

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Speaker 1: Let's start with this comeback. It's been a pretty massive

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Speaker 1: a few months for you. Now, how are you feeling

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Speaker 1: about the whole thing?

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Speaker 2: Look, I don't know how it has gotten this far.

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Speaker 2: I you know, I really wanted to play for Aubri

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Speaker 2: Wadonga in the NBA one and that was like my

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Speaker 2: first goal and then and then it just morphed into

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Speaker 2: this and now I'm in training camp with the Opens

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Speaker 2: on the Gold Coast and you know, like between training,

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Speaker 2: struggling to walk, you know, on the message table pretty much,

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Speaker 2: you know, every waking hour. But yeah, look it's I

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Speaker 2: don't know how it got to this point, but it

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Speaker 2: has and I'm truly just honored to be here. It's

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Speaker 2: such a different experience for me. Now, So how did that?

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Speaker 1: Was there kind of moments when you started playing NBL

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Speaker 1: one and You're like, hmmm, this is getting a bit tempting.

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Speaker 1: World Cup on home soil.

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Speaker 2: Look, it was really funny because I think when I

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Speaker 2: announced that I was playing NBL one, everybody just went,

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Speaker 2: She's coming back, She's making you come back. She's So

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Speaker 2: that was back in February, and that was even before

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Speaker 2: i'd put a uniform on or even had a team

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Speaker 2: training or whatever. But it was sort of in the

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Speaker 2: back of my mind like that people were talking about it,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I'd had just a few conversations around

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Speaker 2: just around work and at home with family and friends,

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Speaker 2: just joking about it, you know, like, oh, would you

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Speaker 2: do it? Would you do it? It just ribbing me

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Speaker 2: a little bit. And I think that just with that

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Speaker 2: in the back of my mind, even though it like

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Speaker 2: it was never the aim or whatever, like it was there,

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Speaker 2: like I knew it was happening. And also too because

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Speaker 2: I'm an ambassador for the Fever World Cup as well,

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Speaker 2: So I I don't know, you know, I just started

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Speaker 2: playing again and then I was playing okay, but I

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Speaker 2: didn't know if that would translate into a high level

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Speaker 2: of basketball. Once I sort of trained with the opals

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Speaker 2: and sure enough, I could still sort of mix it

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Speaker 2: with them, And you know, I didn't think i'd go

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Speaker 2: beyond the camera camp. I honestly, I said to all

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Speaker 2: the girls that I wanted to be here, so glad

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Speaker 2: to be here. I don't expect that I'll be going

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Speaker 2: to New York and next thing, you know, I'm going

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Speaker 2: to New York and then now I'm here. So it

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Speaker 2: just that's how it's happened.

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Speaker 1: I'm interested in what you touched on about, like kind

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Speaker 1: of when it gets announced, and I felt like there

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Speaker 1: was a similar thing like when Ashbarty announced her retirement.

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Speaker 1: There's kind of these discussions where people almost to make

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Speaker 1: these assumptions or feel like they're almost like making decisions

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Speaker 1: on behalf of athletes because they that's what they think

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Speaker 1: should happen. Did you feel was there part of you

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Speaker 1: it kind of felt like just let me do my thing,

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Speaker 1: like just let me play nbo one and see what happened.

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Speaker 2: That's a really good question, No, because I honestly, it

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Speaker 2: was so far away from what I thought I was

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Speaker 2: capable of achieving or even being able to get back to.

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Speaker 2: Like people forget I literally had like over fifteen operations

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Speaker 2: on my right leg, you know, like that's what ended

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Speaker 2: my career. So the fact that I was even able

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Speaker 2: to get back out on court was just in itself monumental.

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Speaker 2: So it was actually probably funny, more funny to me

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Speaker 2: than anything else because it was like, oh my god,

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Speaker 2: people actually think I could because that was before I'd

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Speaker 2: even trained, so I hadn't even Like, in the back

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Speaker 2: of my mind too, I was like, there's no way

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Speaker 2: my body's going to let me play a game. I'm

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Speaker 2: happy to sign a contract. We'll get to more memberships,

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Speaker 2: we'll raise a profile. Women's caught in Aubrey awesome. That

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Speaker 2: was like it. And then this whole process, I've been

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Speaker 2: just taking it day by day because you never know

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Speaker 2: when something's going to happen and it's over. You know,

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Speaker 2: it could be an injury, touch wood, it doesn't happen.

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Speaker 2: But in the back of my mind, I've always just had, right,

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Speaker 2: tomorrow could be your last day. Just enjoy it, just

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Speaker 2: do what you can today and go with it. And

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Speaker 2: that's what I've done. Like that's just how it's sort

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Speaker 2: of been.

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Speaker 1: It's very cool. I want to come back to the

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Speaker 1: injury piece and all of that, but we often start

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Speaker 1: the podcast and I ask, what was Lauren like as

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Speaker 1: a little kid.

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Speaker 2: That's a good question too, my eldest son. I don't

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Speaker 2: know if anyone knows him, but yet I look very

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Speaker 2: highly strung. I was very competitive. I had to win everything.

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Speaker 2: I was not overly intelligent, but I was a very

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Speaker 2: tall young lady, and I think just super competitive. So

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Speaker 2: I think off the court it was probably really self

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Speaker 2: conscious because of my height, and you know, I picked

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Speaker 2: on a little bit at school and like a lot

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Speaker 2: of kids have to go through a lot of that stuff.

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Speaker 2: But I think on the basketball court, I was a

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Speaker 2: different person. You know. That was sort of my playground

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Speaker 2: and that's where I found myself and sure enough became

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Speaker 2: who I was basically. And yeah, I mean that was

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Speaker 2: pretty much it just super competitive. How do we win everything?

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Speaker 1: Where do you think that drive came from? I feel

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Speaker 1: like if I think about like the nature verse nurture thing,

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Speaker 1: like you get asked like was it with siblings? Was

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Speaker 1: it from like for you you kind of had basketball

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Speaker 1: royalty in your blood, like or is it something that

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Speaker 1: you develop over time?

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Speaker 2: No, I think I was born with it, truly. I

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Speaker 2: think it was one of those things that because like

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Speaker 2: I've got a six foot eight brother who has the

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Speaker 2: same jeans, same DNA as I that he hates sports,

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Speaker 2: you know, and he could not give he could not

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Speaker 2: give a shit, like he would go out on a

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Speaker 2: basketball court and do trains and eerplanes. But they just

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Speaker 2: absolutely did not care about sport. So, you know, it's

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Speaker 2: sort of chalk and so I think I was born

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Speaker 2: with that real competitive, you know, instinct for basketball. And

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Speaker 2: in the last couple of days, we've been asked to

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Speaker 2: sort of get photos and things like that from when

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Speaker 2: we were kids, and all of my uniforms were all

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Speaker 2: my mums cut down, Like I had all the Austraine

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Speaker 2: uniforms cut down for me when I was like four

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Speaker 2: or five six years old. I've got like, yeah, just

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Speaker 2: wearing all of these uniforms all the time because I

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Speaker 2: was going to play for Australia. I was going to

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Speaker 2: do everything my mum did. So I really was so

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Speaker 2: lucky that I had her as my role model. And

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Speaker 2: you know, since she did it, I was going to

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Speaker 2: be better than her, you know, And that's I think

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Speaker 2: that's where it came from.

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Speaker 1: That's pretty cool. Did that part of it ever impact

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Speaker 1: the enjoyment that you had for the sport.

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Speaker 2: Well, I funnily enough, I actually wasn't as great as

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Speaker 2: I thought I was. You know, when I was a

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Speaker 2: kid and I missed out on a lot of teams,

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Speaker 2: you know, and a lot of people. Yeah, especially in

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Speaker 2: New South Wales, there's an there's mom and I often

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Speaker 2: talk about it because when we have to go to

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Speaker 2: basketball in New South Wales, functions and things like that,

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Speaker 2: there's just memories from back when people were like, oh,

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Speaker 2: that Laurence, she'll never make it, She'll never do what

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Speaker 2: her mom did, She'll never be tough enough for you know,

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Speaker 2: this is they're talking about a ten, eleven, twelve year

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Speaker 2: old kid. So it's kind of brutal, you know, that

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Speaker 2: that culture and that inherent what's a tall poppy syndrome.

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Speaker 2: I mean I was a baby when that was happening,

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Speaker 2: So I missed out on a lot of teams. But

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Speaker 2: then I don't know if someone saw me, someone said

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Speaker 2: she needs to be at the camp. And then from

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Speaker 2: there it was just up. You know, you just sort

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Speaker 2: of got a break through that first level of bureaucracy

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Speaker 2: sometimes and the right person sees you and you're on

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Speaker 2: your way. You know, was there a part of you

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Speaker 2: that thought about giving it up? Nah? I loved it.

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Speaker 2: It was I you know, my first day at high school,

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Speaker 2: I remember someone said to me, what are you going

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Speaker 2: to do when you leave school, And I was like,

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Speaker 2: I'm out of here in year ten, I'm going to

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Speaker 2: as I'm gonna be playing basketball. So I had like

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Speaker 2: in my mind, I had this pathway. It was all set,

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Speaker 2: and I sort of it was a dream. I suppose

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Speaker 2: you would call it that. It wasn't you know. I'd

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Speaker 2: go into the basketball stadium and I'd see a picture

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Speaker 2: of the Aos women's team or that I was ninety

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Speaker 2: four women's opals team, and I just knew that that's

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Speaker 2: where I was going to be. And yeah, I guess

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Speaker 2: I just I don't know, it's that belief. But I

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Speaker 2: think to also having my mum, who'd done it all before,

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Speaker 2: who was a captain, and who was looked at as

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Speaker 2: someone that was really important in that in that history

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Speaker 2: of the opals. Having her made me realize I can

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Speaker 2: do that as well. And I got bigger than my mother,

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Speaker 2: Like I was taller than by the time I was twelve.

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Speaker 2: Well you know, she was a post player as well,

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Speaker 2: so that's how big I was.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, how's your relationship with your mum progressed throughout

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Speaker 1: your different stages of your life.

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Speaker 2: That's another good question. Well, look, I was a real

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Speaker 2: mummies girl growing up, and I used to get massive

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Speaker 2: anxiety leaving it. So we used to get billeted out

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Speaker 2: on road trips and things like that, and I couldn't function,

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Speaker 2: Like I literally could not breathe when I wasn't with her,

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Speaker 2: Like if I if I was in someone else's house

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Speaker 2: then I had real panic attacks. Anyway, I got through

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Speaker 2: that once. Once I got selected on the Austrange junior team,

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Speaker 2: I pretty much had to grow up super quickly. So

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Speaker 2: it didn't matter what sort of issues I was dealing with.

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Speaker 2: You just get thrown into it and you have to

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Speaker 2: go and do it. I mean, if that's what you

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Speaker 2: want to do, you do it right. And I think

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Speaker 2: I learned from a young age, no matter how I

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Speaker 2: felt off the court, as soon as I got on

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Speaker 2: the court like that, you leave it all behind. You

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Speaker 2: just go out there and unconscious and you just play.

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Speaker 2: And I think that really sort of helped me through.

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Speaker 2: I mean that got me to where I got to

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Speaker 2: in my whole career, because you know, we all go

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Speaker 2: through ups and downs and stuff. And I really did

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Speaker 2: hate being away from home, but yeah, just as soon

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Speaker 2: as I got on the court, I was home again.

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Speaker 2: So there was that. But you know, I think once

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Speaker 2: I left home, it was a real struggle. I think

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Speaker 2: for mum, you know, her baby was growing up and

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Speaker 2: she looked like I left home at fifteen, and I

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Speaker 2: think there was a few years there where, you know,

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Speaker 2: it was hard for her to sort of see me

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Speaker 2: morph into a young woman and go through all the

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Speaker 2: you know, ups and downs and life. And I think

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Speaker 2: to this date she says, oh, you left home too young.

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Speaker 2: But if I didn't leave home, man, I you know,

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Speaker 2: I would never have achieved what I did in the sports.

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Speaker 2: So I was really lucky in that sense. But then

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Speaker 2: now she's just throughout my career. If I've ever needed anything,

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Speaker 2: she's been on the first flight. You know, she's never

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Speaker 2: ever she's just dropped everything and come to be with me.

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Speaker 2: And she's still the same. She's just incredible. And I mean,

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Speaker 2: even on this journey now with two little boys and stuff,

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Speaker 2: my parents have been the biggest support system for me,

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Speaker 2: just looking after the kids and just sort of saying, right,

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Speaker 2: we'll do whatever we can to help you get to

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Speaker 2: the world, how you know. And they've picked up so

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Speaker 2: much of the load and it's just remarkable what they've

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Speaker 2: done for me, so I'll be forever thankful.

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Speaker 1: It's very special. I'm interested in what you touched on

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Speaker 1: around the mental health space, like even as a young person,

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Speaker 1: like with the panic attacks and stuff like if you

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Speaker 1: look at sport now in general, and even your involvement

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Speaker 1: with the administrative side, like the access to mental health

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Speaker 1: services is like such a high priority now in elite sport.

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Speaker 1: But I imagine back then it was kind of just like

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Speaker 1: you just got to suck.

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Speaker 2: It up, you want to play, like about it, go

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Speaker 2: for it. Yeah, back then it was it was a

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Speaker 2: lot different. You know, I definitely had issues. I've spoken

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Speaker 2: about them quite you know, candidly and openly. But when

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Speaker 2: I was younger, yeah, it was I guess I thought

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Speaker 2: that people would see as a vulnerability in me, and

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Speaker 2: I did not want to be seen to have any vulnerability.

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Speaker 2: And I think as an athlete, that's just sort of

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Speaker 2: how I went about it. But I think in the end,

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Speaker 2: you know, along with my injury, that was the mental

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Speaker 2: part of my game. It got me, like I was

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Speaker 2: both by the time I retired, I was completely just

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Speaker 2: you know, I was on any depressants, any anxiety, like

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Speaker 2: just struggling through life. You know, injuries, painkillers. It was

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Speaker 2: just a really bad cycle. And when it ended, when

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Speaker 2: it finally ended, it was I want to say, it

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Speaker 2: was such a relief to walk away from the game

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Speaker 2: and walk away from all of that stuff and then

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Speaker 2: be finally in a safe space that I could control

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Speaker 2: that and then I could make my life the way

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Speaker 2: I wanted it to be. And sure enough, you know,

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Speaker 2: within six months, I got my life together. I got

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Speaker 2: off all the medication. I you know, I felt pregnant,

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Speaker 2: I had a job, and my whole life changed. I

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Speaker 2: was able to really just get well and that it

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Speaker 2: was probably the best year of my life, to be honest.

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Speaker 1: So that's really cool. Yeah, how were you when you

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Speaker 1: made your debut for the Opals?

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Speaker 2: How old was I? I sixteen? Maybe I was a baby.

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Speaker 1: Do you remember your first game?

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Speaker 2: I think I do. I think we played America in

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Speaker 2: uh I want to say it was Colorado Springs. If

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Speaker 2: that's where they have their like American Institute of Sport

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Speaker 2: or something similar to that. I can't remember. They have

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Speaker 2: like something similar to the AIS in America, And we

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Speaker 2: played the national team there and I came out on

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Speaker 2: the court and shot a three pointer and it went

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Speaker 2: in and that was my first shot of the game.

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Speaker 1: Who does that happen to? Not many people?

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Speaker 2: I know as a baby, I was a baby, and yeah,

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Speaker 2: never actually, I won't ever forget that. I'm not one

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Speaker 2: hundred percent sure that was our first game, but that's

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Speaker 2: like the only thing that I can remember, because I

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Speaker 2: think that was my first trip with an with the

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Speaker 2: senior team. So and then from there everything was fine.

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Speaker 2: I mean the national team, the Opals when I got

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Speaker 2: on that team were such a great group of women

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Speaker 2: to be around. You know, they literally all took me

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Speaker 2: under their wing and just like their little sister, you know.

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Speaker 2: So it was a really great environment. I felt super safe.

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Speaker 2: I had just some great team managers and yeah, it

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Speaker 2: was just an awesome environment to be in.

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Speaker 1: The Opoles are probably they probably had one of the

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Speaker 1: strongest legacies in terms of our national teams. What do

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Speaker 1: you think has been a part of creating such a

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Speaker 1: strong legacy within that group.

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Speaker 2: I think just the history of the Opals. You know,

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Speaker 2: it's we only a couple of weeks ago lost you know,

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Speaker 2: the godmother of women's basketball, Betty Watson, she passed away.

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Speaker 2: I think she was well and truly into her nineties.

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Speaker 2: That was sad, but she was the one that really

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Speaker 2: pushed to get women's basketball in Australia, I think in

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Speaker 2: the fifties, and then the legacy that those women that

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Speaker 2: you know went through those first ten twenty years and

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Speaker 2: really managed the sport. They were the athletes, they were

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Speaker 2: the coaches, they were the administrators, and they were the

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Speaker 2: ones pushing the men behind the scenes, like the Lindsay Gays, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: Ken Watsons and all of them to make sure that

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Speaker 2: women had access to sort of what the men had

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Speaker 2: access to. Not definitely wasn't anything like that, but they

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Speaker 2: got a little bit of some of it, you know.

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Speaker 2: But I think and a lot of those women are

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Speaker 2: still around today, Like my Annie Elaine was my mum's manager.

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Speaker 2: She played in the fifties with the national team. It's

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Speaker 2: just such a tight group of women. So at the

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Speaker 2: World Cup in a week and a half, all of

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Speaker 2: these people are going to be there, you know, cheering

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Speaker 2: for us, supporting us, and they're still a part of

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Speaker 2: who we are today. And I hope and I'm pretty

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Speaker 2: sure that the other girls feel the same way. But

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Speaker 2: you know, your Timsy's, your Robin Mars. The people that

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Speaker 2: really paved the way for us to have what we have.

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Speaker 2: There's still a huge part of what we do and

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Speaker 2: we're trying to include them in all of that, so

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Speaker 2: it's pretty special.

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Speaker 1: I got to have a chat with some of those

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Speaker 1: icons at one of the events before the Opals recently

340
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Speaker 1: played against Japan, and I found it so interesting. We

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Speaker 1: kind of had a spectrum of Opals from different generations

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Speaker 1: in a way. And I think it was Jenny Screen

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Speaker 1: who touched on getting paid seven grand for one of

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Speaker 1: her first WNBL contracts, and Robin kind of chipped in

345
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Speaker 1: and made a comment like, gosh, I would have loved

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Speaker 1: to get paid something. Where do you think that's It's

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Speaker 1: I'm always interested in this balance of these incredible women

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Speaker 1: who've paved the way and this level of like gratitude

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Speaker 1: that you often almost feel like you should feel a

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Speaker 1: female athlete because you get something that's better than the

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Speaker 1: generation that has come before you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, That's it's interesting, isn't it. That's funny because like

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Speaker 2: even now for me, I watched the WNBA and they're

354
00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:15,359
Speaker 2: earning so much more than what I am when I

355
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Speaker 2: was over there, and I'm just like wish I was

356
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Speaker 2: this generation, you know, what I mean, like a mister,

357
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Speaker 2: but I think the recognition that the women that have

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Speaker 2: been here before us, that have paid the way, paved

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Speaker 2: the way for us to actually get what we get now.

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Speaker 2: I mean, even like what the opals get now compared

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Speaker 2: to when I played ten years ago, is so much greater.

362
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Speaker 2: And I think that sometimes, you know, that can go unrecognized,

363
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Speaker 2: and you know, you're as an athlete, you're in the moment,

364
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Speaker 2: you're just thinking about what's right, what's wrong right now,

365
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Speaker 2: and not where we've come from. And I think sometimes

366
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Speaker 2: it's really humbling just to listen to what people had

367
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Speaker 2: ten years ago as opposed to what they've got now

368
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Speaker 2: and then maybe ask about how it got to this point,

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Speaker 2: maybe talk about it. I mean, I don't think that.

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Speaker 2: I think women, you know, we are very empathetic, and

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Speaker 2: we have this natural you know, want the gratitude, you know,

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Speaker 2: and we want to that's who we are, right so

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Speaker 2: to be able to just have the conversation and acknowledge,

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Speaker 2: you know, where we came from, how we got here

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Speaker 2: and everything, I think that's really important. Men don't have

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Speaker 2: to do it, that's fine, But I think as women

377
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Speaker 2: we're very different and the way that we function and

378
00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:34,359
Speaker 2: the way that we work is, you know, we have

379
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Speaker 2: to sort of talk about these things. So I think

380
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Speaker 2: that's sort of I don't know if that makes sense,

381
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Speaker 2: but no.

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Speaker 1: It does. It definitely does. You touched on the WNBA there,

383
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Speaker 1: So it was two thousand and one, you went as

384
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Speaker 1: the first first draft fee to the Seattle Storm. What

385
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Speaker 1: was what was the experience like from kind of this

386
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Speaker 1: kid who was sounded like you didn't really like leaving

387
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Speaker 1: home to moving to the other side of the world. Look,

388
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Speaker 1: got over there, and I wasn't old enough to drink

389
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Speaker 1: and anyone knows me, anyone who knows me knows I

390
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Speaker 1: love a veino.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, so that was like the first issue that

392
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Speaker 2: I had, because you know, that was a real problem.

393
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Speaker 2: We lived on top of this convenience store and yeah,

394
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Speaker 2: but look, I think I was really nervous. I was

395
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Speaker 2: super scared, and pretty much through any new experience in

396
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Speaker 2: my life, you'll hear me say I was scared, I

397
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:31,920
Speaker 2: was worried. I was you know, fitting myself, which still

398
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:34,800
Speaker 2: am like to this day, it happens, but it literally

399
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:36,440
Speaker 2: is about putting one foot in front of the other,

400
00:20:36,680 --> 00:20:39,400
Speaker 2: like you've just got to take the step like, and

401
00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:41,760
Speaker 2: they're not big steps. You've just got to get in

402
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:44,160
Speaker 2: the car, You've just got to walk into the training facility,

403
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:46,439
Speaker 2: just got to get on the court, you know. And

404
00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,959
Speaker 2: it's it's for me. It's just that process that almost

405
00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,679
Speaker 2: like and being in the moment, you know, breathing your

406
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:56,119
Speaker 2: way through it. And I've learned to do that that

407
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Speaker 2: When I was younger, I really I struggled with all

408
00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:04,280
Speaker 2: of that stuff. But looking back, I I think, Wow,

409
00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:06,240
Speaker 2: he was so strong because I didn't have the tools

410
00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:07,800
Speaker 2: to deal with all of that stuff and I was

411
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Speaker 2: just sort of winging it and highly strong, very highly

412
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Speaker 2: struggle all the time, always looking for a ways to

413
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:19,080
Speaker 2: forget about it and do fun stuff and you know,

414
00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:22,840
Speaker 2: not have to really face any issues. But I think

415
00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:25,280
Speaker 2: the fact that I got through it and I'm here

416
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Speaker 2: today and I know how to really deal with that,

417
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:30,040
Speaker 2: it's you know, deestinate to young me who didn't ask

418
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Speaker 2: for any help.

419
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Speaker 1: Wow. Do you feel like this dream that you had

420
00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:38,919
Speaker 1: to be so good at what you did contributed to

421
00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:41,320
Speaker 1: being highly strong and on edge and feeling like you

422
00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,080
Speaker 1: needed to find fun stuff outside of it.

423
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Speaker 2: No, I think I was just looking for a way

424
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Speaker 2: to sort of get out, like not have to worry

425
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Speaker 2: and not have to think too much. You know, I

426
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Speaker 2: think that was for me back then, when I was

427
00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:57,800
Speaker 2: put in situations where I was really uncomfortable, where my

428
00:21:57,880 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 2: mum wasn't there just to sort of pick up the pieces,

429
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:05,919
Speaker 2: or my dad I didn't feel safe. I put myself

430
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,960
Speaker 2: in situations where I didn't think about it, and you know,

431
00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:14,199
Speaker 2: like people have their vices right for different reasons. For me,

432
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Speaker 2: it was literally about just coping. It was a coping mechanism,

433
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Speaker 2: and you know, whether it was just sometimes they were

434
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 2: not good coping mechanisms most of the time they went

435
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:28,560
Speaker 2: when I was young, but you just sort of live

436
00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:30,720
Speaker 2: and learn through them, and then you know, you sort

437
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 2: of for me, like I said, I didn't really ask

438
00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:35,640
Speaker 2: for help. The only people that knew I was going

439
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,560
Speaker 2: through it were probably, you know, my parents and potentially

440
00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:42,720
Speaker 2: the coaches that were closest to me or that coached

441
00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 2: me long enoughter sort of understand like the different behavioral

442
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,720
Speaker 2: patterns and things like that. But it's something that you

443
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:53,280
Speaker 2: just for me back then because we didn't talk about it.

444
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:55,680
Speaker 2: You just learned to deal with and I did.

445
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:01,960
Speaker 1: This episode is brought to you by UNDERRAMA Combine. UA

446
00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:05,760
Speaker 1: Combine is a new training competition open to all athletes

447
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,920
Speaker 1: wanting to test their limits. The first event is held

448
00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:12,680
Speaker 1: in Sydney on Saturday, the seventeenth of September. Register now

449
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:19,119
Speaker 1: and get your free competitor kit by visiting uacombineau dot com.

450
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,240
Speaker 1: What were the biggest differences you noticed, Because you've obviously

451
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:24,560
Speaker 1: spent so much time with the camera capitals during your

452
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:26,960
Speaker 1: WNBL career, what were the biggest differences you notice it

453
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:29,320
Speaker 1: when you headed over to the States to play in

454
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:29,880
Speaker 1: that league.

455
00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:34,200
Speaker 2: Well, there was a different level of professionalism, I think,

456
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 2: you know, even back then they had a collective bargaining agreement.

457
00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:41,480
Speaker 2: I think a lot of the resources that we had

458
00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 2: were NBA resources, So I think the WNBA was created

459
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 2: as sort of an off season to the NBA, so

460
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,879
Speaker 2: there would be basketball running year round. And our franchise

461
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:58,000
Speaker 2: was attached to the Scattle Superstomics at the time, so

462
00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,439
Speaker 2: we had the same training facilities there. You know, the

463
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:06,000
Speaker 2: locker room was incredible, you know, all of our uniforms,

464
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,000
Speaker 2: our training uniforms, everything was just immaculate. There was no

465
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:13,800
Speaker 2: shortage of anything, And I think, yeah, it was just

466
00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:17,280
Speaker 2: that level of professionalism, you know, and then also too

467
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 2: here even now with the opals, we do a lot

468
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,480
Speaker 2: more together off the court. You know. In America, it's

469
00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,160
Speaker 2: like you get here here at training at this time,

470
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:28,720
Speaker 2: and you're on the bus to go to the airport

471
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 2: at this time, you know, and you're at the game

472
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,320
Speaker 2: at this time. The rest of your time is yours, okay.

473
00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:37,359
Speaker 2: There's no sort of expectations on what you do outside

474
00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:43,320
Speaker 2: of trainings and games, so, you know, I think again,

475
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:46,359
Speaker 2: and that's another aspect of sort of growing up in

476
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 2: an environment like that. Could You've got to learn how

477
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 2: to eat when you're on the road all the time,

478
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,000
Speaker 2: You got to learn how to train, where to train,

479
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 2: You got to you know, it's sort of we didn't

480
00:24:56,840 --> 00:25:00,879
Speaker 2: have gym coaches who are sort of working with us

481
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:02,919
Speaker 2: in hotel gyms or anything. We had to sort of

482
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:04,640
Speaker 2: figure it all out on our own. So I think

483
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,800
Speaker 2: that was the difference, whereas here in Australia they tried

484
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 2: to do it. They tried to do it together collectively.

485
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 1: During your time, you won three WNBA MVPs, two titles,

486
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: had seven All stars, and then your number fifteen was

487
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: retired by the Seattle Storm. Yeah, yeah, what does it

488
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 1: like sometimes when you hear that stuff being read out,

489
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 1: Is it like something that you've had time to process

490
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 1: since you kind of retired and stepped away from the game.

491
00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 2: It seems like a dream now looking back on all

492
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 2: of it, I wouldn't say I've had time to process it.

493
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:51,439
Speaker 2: Like I I think it's like I said before, I

494
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:53,439
Speaker 2: look back and I go, well, you're a lot stronger

495
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 2: than what you thought you were, you know, to be

496
00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 2: able to get through and to deal with what I

497
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 2: dealt with and then delable to achieve what I did,

498
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:06,199
Speaker 2: I cannot believe I did it. And you know, I

499
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:10,600
Speaker 2: think that's really really special. I'm very, very lucky that

500
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,720
Speaker 2: I had the genetic ability, you know, to play basketball.

501
00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:15,880
Speaker 2: I think I was blessed, you know, in my parents,

502
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,719
Speaker 2: the best of my parents jeans, no doubt. And then

503
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 2: obviously that competitive just there's something inside of me that

504
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,160
Speaker 2: it was super comp that is super comparitive, and even

505
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:30,760
Speaker 2: I think that's why I'm here now again. But yeah,

506
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 2: I looking back on it all, it's kind of crazy.

507
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 2: I think it brought back a few memories today as

508
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:37,600
Speaker 2: well too, because I've just watched super By her final

509
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 2: game at all, and you know, obviously she's one of

510
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 2: my best friends, and just I'm so glad I got

511
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 2: to see her a couple of weeks ago, but you know,

512
00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:51,199
Speaker 2: seeing her cry literally broke my heart because what the

513
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 2: game has meant to her and what she meant to

514
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:56,239
Speaker 2: my game, you know, and even the last couple of

515
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,199
Speaker 2: months this come back, she has been one of the

516
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 2: biggest support systems for me, and just, you know, to

517
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,760
Speaker 2: think that that era is over, you know, it's sort

518
00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:09,520
Speaker 2: of it's very upsetting, So I get a bit emotional

519
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:11,639
Speaker 2: about it. But she's a very important person to me

520
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 2: and yeah, in my career.

521
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: So that's really special. What has it been like to

522
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,480
Speaker 1: play with people of that caliber?

523
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 2: Well, Sue, you know, she she was the best fool.

524
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 2: She's the best point guard in the world, and I'm

525
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 2: not sure there's going to be anyone like her. I

526
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 2: think she was just a combination of incredible leader, you know,

527
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:39,080
Speaker 2: she had that competitive fire as well, super intelligent, but

528
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,120
Speaker 2: a great teammate, like able to sort of she could

529
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:44,640
Speaker 2: sort of see what was going on on the court,

530
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:48,560
Speaker 2: she knew who to get the ball to, just very smart,

531
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:52,919
Speaker 2: you know, So to play with her, I was so lucky.

532
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,960
Speaker 2: But then in Australia to play with Chris Harrower, Michelle Tims,

533
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:00,359
Speaker 2: Kristin Velle. I've played with some great point guards and

534
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,560
Speaker 2: even now, you know on the national team we've got

535
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,320
Speaker 2: Test Magine in the Samui week when Test has been

536
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 2: like a breath of fresh air to play with her.

537
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 2: She's again such a great leader. And I think these

538
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:15,679
Speaker 2: attributes that these point guards have, they're so important, you know,

539
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:21,719
Speaker 2: for a for a winning team. So it's cool to

540
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 2: be around them and have them, because without a great

541
00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:25,560
Speaker 2: point guard, you're not going to win mine.

542
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:28,240
Speaker 1: So I read an article the other day that I

543
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 1: loved and it kind of described the LJ effect about

544
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:34,760
Speaker 1: just one of your NBO one teammates at Aubrey and

545
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: you saying, you're like, oh, what did it say? No, No,

546
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 1: it was all positive. You said to one of your

547
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 1: teammates when she had the ball in the corner, like

548
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,000
Speaker 1: shoot the three, and she's kind of like, oh, Lauren

549
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: Jackson's telling me to shoot it, I should shoot it,

550
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 1: and then it goes in. And then the next time

551
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: she gets all she shoots it and it goes in.

552
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: You look like you're waterfied at this story. But they

553
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:54,680
Speaker 1: called it the LJ effect. And I love this, like

554
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 1: the aura that you bring with you in your level

555
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:58,320
Speaker 1: of experience, but that you can actually come back and

556
00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:01,440
Speaker 1: have an impact on people playing in the NBO one.

557
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, they're kids that I was playing with in Aubury.

558
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,800
Speaker 2: You know, I actually coached them. Some of my did

559
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 2: individual coaching was when they were kids, and and then

560
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 2: I coached the NBO one team I reckon twenty nineteen. Yeah, yeah,

561
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 2: I coached them for a year and that was just

562
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,720
Speaker 2: right after my second child. We did pretty well because

563
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:30,480
Speaker 2: we were in the South League then too, and for

564
00:29:30,880 --> 00:29:32,600
Speaker 2: the team that we had, we did really well actually

565
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 2: so had a few injuries and stuff, but it was

566
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 2: so much fun to play with them. And I think

567
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 2: to the confidence that they get from hearing me say

568
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 2: shoot the bloody ball, like don't people can get like

569
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,000
Speaker 2: fall into the trap of just looking and trying to

570
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 2: pass me the ball when they've got to like shoot

571
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 2: the ball themselves. And yeah, I think in our Grand

572
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 2: final game, one of the young girls, Casey, she just

573
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 2: knocked down like four threes like and they would dagget three.

574
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,800
Speaker 2: So if she didn't hit them, I know, but we

575
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 2: wouldn't have won. I don't think if she didn't hit

576
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:09,600
Speaker 2: those threes, because they were like momentum changing shots, every

577
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 2: single one of them. I was just like, oh my god,

578
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 2: and she's not known for a three question damn. Proud

579
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 2: of her, proud of that kid.

580
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,720
Speaker 1: I was just like, Casey, that's cool, that's really cool.

581
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 2: I'm proud, Mama Bear. I could be her mom. I'm

582
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 2: old enough to be her mother. Yeah, I know.

583
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 1: Well, I want to come back to I want to

584
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 1: chat about a few things in that, But Wnba, I'm

585
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:37,040
Speaker 1: trying to keep on a relatively chronological timeline. You know,

586
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 1: you've done a lot of things, so, Wnba, A big

587
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:42,520
Speaker 1: part of your career is that you weren't getting paid

588
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,080
Speaker 1: enough to just do that as you want job, so

589
00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 1: he had to play a lot of the time overseas

590
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 1: and a big part of that was your time in Russia.

591
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 1: What was your first experience like when you headed over

592
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:52,640
Speaker 1: to Russia.

593
00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 2: Well, I actually went to Russia. We played at WNBL

594
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 2: season here and Shabbi I had called me and said,

595
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 2: we want you to come over to Katerinberg for a month.

596
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 2: You know, I, we'll pay you six figures to come

597
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,280
Speaker 2: and play for a month. I got over there and

598
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 2: I might have played like sixteen minutes in three games.

599
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 2: I was on a team of superstars and I was

600
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 2: sitting on the bench. I was like, fine, absolutely no problem.

601
00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 2: Mom came with me, you know, all good. And then

602
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 2: I went straight back to America and then I reckon.

603
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 2: It was probably a couple of years later. I left

604
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 2: Camberra and went and played in South Korea, and Shabtai

605
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 2: called me up again and said, at the end of

606
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 2: the Korean season, come over here for a month. We'll

607
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:39,360
Speaker 2: pay you the same amount, just you know, sit on

608
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:41,240
Speaker 2: the bench, you know, come off. And I was like, fine,

609
00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 2: I'll do it, and then that was it. He then

610
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:47,160
Speaker 2: brought out my South Korean contract. Then I started playing

611
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:50,000
Speaker 2: in Russia for six seven months, so I guess, until

612
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 2: he got assassinated basically, which was about three or four

613
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 2: years later. So it was an interesting time in my life.

614
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 2: I definitely in terms of money, it was economically like

615
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 2: I had to do it, you know. It sort of

616
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:11,480
Speaker 2: changed the game for me a lot. But in saying that,

617
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 2: I wish that I had spent a little bit more

618
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 2: time working on my body so that it didn't end

619
00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 2: up in such a shambles. Like if I had have

620
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:21,160
Speaker 2: had sort of two months of a year, I just

621
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:25,479
Speaker 2: focused on rehab and you know, getting strong, because when

622
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:28,600
Speaker 2: you're playing year round, it's hard to get in the gym,

623
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 2: you know, when you've got sort of two days between

624
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 2: games and you're traveling and everything like that, it's really

625
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 2: hard to get in the gym and do the stuff

626
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 2: that you need to do to keep your body maintained.

627
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:43,640
Speaker 2: Whereas now, like I spent I reckon probably three or

628
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 2: four months just solid in the gym and got so

629
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:48,720
Speaker 2: strong before I started playing again. And that's the only

630
00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:52,200
Speaker 2: reason I've even got to this point. And now I like,

631
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:54,720
Speaker 2: I don't get in the gym, I don't get on court.

632
00:32:55,200 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 1: So when you were over there in Russia playing you

633
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 1: was there an element of it when you were getting

634
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 1: paid well and you were getting treated well where you

635
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: were kind of like, this is what as a female athlete,

636
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 1: I actually deserve to be, like an athlete of someone

637
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: who was at your level. I'm trying to think, like

638
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of time as a female athlete,

639
00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 1: I almost feel like I have to justify that what

640
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:22,280
Speaker 1: we do in women's sport has value and that just

641
00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:24,719
Speaker 1: when you compare it commercially to the men's game, and say,

642
00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: if you compare WNBA to NBA and all of these

643
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,680
Speaker 1: arguments around broadcast and ticketing and numbers and all of

644
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 1: those things. Was there an element of relief of like,

645
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: I'm actually getting rewarded for being a good athlete.

646
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:43,719
Speaker 2: I mean, look, there was definitely that element there, you know,

647
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:45,680
Speaker 2: in the back of my mind. It was like, Wow,

648
00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 2: this is what it's like to be a professional athlete,

649
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 2: like actually getting paid, you know, like being able to

650
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 2: pay my house off, being able to not worry about money.

651
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 2: It's incredible. But at the same time, I felt like

652
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 2: it came with a price, you know, and at a price.

653
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:04,600
Speaker 2: And I don't think, you know, guys would have been

654
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:07,920
Speaker 2: treated the way that we were treated as female athletes,

655
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,120
Speaker 2: or the way that you know, people like Steel and

656
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 2: Dine will talk about their experience a lot different to mine.

657
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 2: That I felt very Look, it got to the point

658
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 2: where I had to come home and study gender studies

659
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 2: because I did not feel I didn't understand my felt

660
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 2: so powerless. I felt, yeah, very look, there's a lot

661
00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 2: of stories and a lot of things that happened over

662
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:34,480
Speaker 2: there that I will never ever talk about publicly. But

663
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 2: like I said, it came with a price, and I yeah,

664
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:42,160
Speaker 2: I really struggled with that at the time. But you know,

665
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 2: it also made me the person that I am today,

666
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:46,719
Speaker 2: and it got me back at the school. It got

667
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,440
Speaker 2: me sort of thinking more deeply about these issues that

668
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:54,200
Speaker 2: women sort of have to face. Like I said, it economically, yeah, there,

669
00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 2: and there were moments where I was like, this is

670
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:57,759
Speaker 2: the life. You've got a credit card, We're able to

671
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 2: go around shopping in the best shops in Europe, and

672
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:04,080
Speaker 2: we're flying privately, we're getting paid. It's incredible. But it

673
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:09,520
Speaker 2: wasn't all incredible, you know, So at the you know,

674
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 2: it wasn't it wasn't a great, you know, experience, but

675
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 2: it wasn't in the same breath too. Chab Tai his

676
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 2: story was he was the next PGB spy. He was

677
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 2: in prison in Israel. He was an incredible man, could

678
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 2: speak like, I think, like six or seven languages, intelligent, Yeah,

679
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 2: just I mean you can imagine some of the stories

680
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 2: that he had. But it's a very different culture over there,

681
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 2: and the way women are treated is very very differently

682
00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:45,719
Speaker 2: in this Europe to what it is in Australia.

683
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:48,319
Speaker 1: So what's the biggest thing that you've taken out of

684
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: your gender studies.

685
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:59,279
Speaker 2: God, that's a that's a deep question. Uh. Look, I

686
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 2: think at the time when I was studying it, I

687
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:05,280
Speaker 2: really started to understand a lot of like the issues

688
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:08,279
Speaker 2: that I had. I probably I may not have been

689
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 2: able to articulate a lot of them, but I started

690
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 2: to understand myself a lot better. And I think I

691
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:18,960
Speaker 2: was also able to start recognizing where power inequity was,

692
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:24,040
Speaker 2: particularly in relationships, you know, between men and women in sport,

693
00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 2: in work, in life, and then also just you know,

694
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:33,640
Speaker 2: starting to piece together myself like and feelings that I

695
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:37,080
Speaker 2: was having around this stuff. So yeah, I think that

696
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,919
Speaker 2: was that was it. And then I was fortunate enough

697
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:43,880
Speaker 2: to you know, get my degree and then sort of

698
00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 2: do postgraduate work as well and put myself in a

699
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:50,040
Speaker 2: situation that I could actually get a job. So I

700
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 2: don't think I wouldn't I wouldn't have had any experience

701
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:54,600
Speaker 2: whatsoever when I retired if I didn't do that. So

702
00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 2: it's kind of lucky I did.

703
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,799
Speaker 1: That worked out quite well. I'm just thinking out, Yeah,

704
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 1: having good reflection, I like reflecting on podcasts. A big

705
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 1: part of the reason I started the Female Athlete Project

706
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 1: was I was an ambassador for our Watch, the organization

707
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 1: that's all about the prevention of domestic violence, and similar

708
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:14,480
Speaker 1: to what you were touching on there, just when I

709
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:17,520
Speaker 1: actually went through the training course and got an understanding

710
00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:22,239
Speaker 1: of such a big underlying cause is that power imbalance.

711
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:25,560
Speaker 1: It exists between men and women in relationships and also

712
00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:28,239
Speaker 1: the role that the huge role that sport plays in

713
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 1: Australian culture and being able to shift attitudes. And I

714
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 1: feel like I've been on this really interesting journey where

715
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 1: I kind of take the weight of that on and

716
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,279
Speaker 1: feel like a lot of the time that what I'm

717
00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 1: doing as a female athlete, I hope helps to change

718
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,920
Speaker 1: perceptions about women in society and where we belong and

719
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 1: that we're strong and that we can perform at that level.

720
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 1: Does that exist in two separate spheres for you or

721
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:55,360
Speaker 1: do you do you have a similar thing where you

722
00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:58,160
Speaker 1: kind of carry that with you as you compete as well.

723
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 2: No. Absolutely, I think sports plays such an important role

724
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:09,839
Speaker 2: in changing you know, that sort of underlying culture that

725
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:15,440
Speaker 2: has kept women really you know, in the box basically,

726
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:19,319
Speaker 2: And I mean you look at what the WNBA has done,

727
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:21,520
Speaker 2: for instance, in the last sort of five or six years,

728
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:25,239
Speaker 2: and the work in social change, Black Lives Matter, like

729
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 2: conder equality, you know, dealing with homophobia in sport, things

730
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:36,319
Speaker 2: like that. Our place in sport definitely has a role

731
00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:40,920
Speaker 2: to play in changing attitudes, masculine attitudes, particularly in sport

732
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:43,480
Speaker 2: and the way that we are perceived. And I think,

733
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,400
Speaker 2: and you know what it's working, it really is. You

734
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:50,799
Speaker 2: can see I think the push particularly you know with

735
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:53,759
Speaker 2: the seth of the afl W and the cricket and

736
00:38:55,120 --> 00:38:58,800
Speaker 2: in Matilda's like the work that's being done around women's

737
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:01,600
Speaker 2: sport at the moment, and you're starting to see more

738
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:05,600
Speaker 2: organizations investing in the sport because of the value that

739
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:10,720
Speaker 2: it holds. It's it's really exciting and it's a great time,

740
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:12,919
Speaker 2: you know, but I think still there's a long way

741
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:17,200
Speaker 2: to go in terms of investment and profiling women. And

742
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:19,200
Speaker 2: I mean every day you see stuff on the news

743
00:39:19,239 --> 00:39:22,560
Speaker 2: around male athletes and some of the ridiculous things that

744
00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:26,440
Speaker 2: they're doing. Yet they still seem to get the endorsements

745
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:30,360
Speaker 2: and the media attention and the jobs and the roles

746
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:32,360
Speaker 2: and the things that they're getting and then you know

747
00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:37,399
Speaker 2: they get so it's it's actually quite funny these last

748
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 2: couple of days watching the news. But I'm not even

749
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 2: going to elaborate on that. But yeah, look, I think

750
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 2: there's a long way to go, but I think we're

751
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:46,799
Speaker 2: definitely changing at a stay by day.

752
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:51,360
Speaker 1: So I think cold on heading into the Rio twenty

753
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 1: sixteen Olympics, hoping to go to your these Olympic Games. Yeah,

754
00:39:56,760 --> 00:40:01,320
Speaker 1: that press conference where you had to announce that your

755
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:03,920
Speaker 1: body couldn't do it? What was What were the emotions

756
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:04,440
Speaker 1: that came with that?

757
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:10,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh, relief. That was a hard day. So so

758
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 2: I had like about fourteen or fifteen operations on my

759
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:18,000
Speaker 2: knee in the lead up to that point, and because

760
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:21,399
Speaker 2: I was just trying to rush back for different organizations,

761
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 2: different club different themes, just everything, I kept during juring

762
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:31,600
Speaker 2: myself and I wasn't rehabbing it properly because I well,

763
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 2: I mean I was trying to, but obviously it wasn't working,

764
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 2: and I probably, yeah, I just I don't think I

765
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 2: had the right people around me at that point in time.

766
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 2: And that's not a knock on anybody. It's literally I

767
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,160
Speaker 2: was where I had to be to get back for

768
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:49,960
Speaker 2: the next tournament or the next team, and no one

769
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:52,359
Speaker 2: was really thinking about long term, Lauren, or I was,

770
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:56,480
Speaker 2: you know, in two years, Lauren. So it was a

771
00:40:56,520 --> 00:40:59,240
Speaker 2: bit of a downward spiral for a couple of years,

772
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:04,280
Speaker 2: and then I had like one last shot of getting

773
00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 2: on the court for the Cambra Capital, so I, you know,

774
00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 2: sort of got ready for training, went to the Ais

775
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,120
Speaker 2: to train with the girls, hoping that i'd get back

776
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:15,440
Speaker 2: out on court for the game before Christmas in twenty fifteen,

777
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,240
Speaker 2: and I remember I was on court for about twenty

778
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 2: minutes and my knee got so swallen and it was burning,

779
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:26,000
Speaker 2: and I don't remember a specific injury, but I just

780
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:29,200
Speaker 2: finished and I just walked over to the sideline and

781
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 2: started crying because I knew that, you know, I couldn't

782
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 2: do it anyway. I ended up going and seeing a

783
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:38,600
Speaker 2: couple of different doctors and they were like, no, you

784
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 2: just let it settle down because of all the the

785
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:45,239
Speaker 2: issues that I had had with it. And then I

786
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 2: went back to my doctor and he said, look, you've

787
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 2: got some lateral stuff. We can maybe fix that. We'll

788
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:51,480
Speaker 2: go in there have a look at it. And I'd

789
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:55,520
Speaker 2: actually torn my ACL, so I'd ruptured my ACL, and

790
00:41:55,600 --> 00:42:00,840
Speaker 2: so that happened and then BA was still bust. Australia

791
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 2: was still right behind me and supporting me to try

792
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:07,200
Speaker 2: and get back. So I just had to sort of

793
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:11,200
Speaker 2: go home and you know, obviously get through the first

794
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:13,560
Speaker 2: couple of weeks of rehab and everything, and I went

795
00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:15,320
Speaker 2: and got my leg wax and I got a staff

796
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:20,040
Speaker 2: infection in my knee joint and that was it. That

797
00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 2: was the end of it. After that, I was in

798
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:26,239
Speaker 2: hospital for two weeks because I left it. I just

799
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 2: thought that my knee was always so I didn't like

800
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:31,600
Speaker 2: rush to hospital or anything. I was on the stuff coast.

801
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,880
Speaker 2: I didn't really think too much about it. I just

802
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 2: thought it was just having a bad day or whatever.

803
00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 2: And I probably left it twenty four hours too long,

804
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:43,560
Speaker 2: and yeah, the staff infection got pretty bad. So I

805
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:45,520
Speaker 2: was in hospital for two weeks. And that was basically

806
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:47,439
Speaker 2: that was when I found out I'd have to anee

807
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:52,799
Speaker 2: replacement or halfnee replacement and falling it a day, that

808
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:55,319
Speaker 2: was when it was. Yeah, I spoke to my team

809
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:58,399
Speaker 2: doctors and people I'd been working with, and I just said, look,

810
00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,279
Speaker 2: you know, because I think they were waiting for me

811
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,239
Speaker 2: to say this is it. But I was just like,

812
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 2: I can't say it, so you have to say it

813
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:07,279
Speaker 2: for me, and they were like, right, well we will.

814
00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 2: There's no way you're coming.

815
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:09,759
Speaker 1: Back from this, and we did.

816
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:11,880
Speaker 2: So it was full on.

817
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:17,799
Speaker 1: You talked earlier about the use of painkillers and all

818
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 1: of those things that you had to use to kind

819
00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: of manage that level of pain. And I know there's

820
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:27,239
Speaker 1: been discussions around the use of medicinal cannabis, which kind

821
00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:29,480
Speaker 1: of seems like it's been this taboo thing and not

822
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:31,759
Speaker 1: sure where it fits in with sport and with the

823
00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:36,200
Speaker 1: strict antidoping regulations. But I hope that it's something moving

824
00:43:36,239 --> 00:43:39,840
Speaker 1: forward that there's more research into the use of it

825
00:43:39,880 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 1: for pain and mental health and all of those things

826
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 1: and how that can actually help athletes. Is that something

827
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 1: that has been a big battle for you in that space?

828
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:53,320
Speaker 2: Look, I well, the only way that I actually started

829
00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:56,720
Speaker 2: training again was because I got on a medicinal cannabis

830
00:43:56,760 --> 00:44:01,120
Speaker 2: trial last year and it's CBD or pure CB dealer,

831
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:05,640
Speaker 2: and it just gave me the ability to recover quicker.

832
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 2: So I was able to get in the gym and

833
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:10,799
Speaker 2: then recover quick enough to get back in the gym,

834
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:13,000
Speaker 2: and just gave me some consistency and stuff, and I

835
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 2: think just the any influantry properties and it was very

836
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 2: good for me at that point in time, about a

837
00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:22,879
Speaker 2: month out from competing in the NBA, when I had

838
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 2: to go off it because of the THHD. There's HD

839
00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:32,719
Speaker 2: extracts in it, so because it's derived directly from the

840
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,680
Speaker 2: marijuana plant, so I had to get off it. But

841
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:40,520
Speaker 2: I did apply for a tue through Sport Integrity Australian

842
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:42,840
Speaker 2: and I got it and FEVER then approved it. So

843
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 2: I'm actually I've actually just started taking it again. Yeah. Wow,

844
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:48,319
Speaker 2: so I've you know, I'm allowed to go into this

845
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:53,400
Speaker 2: World Cup, yeah, using it, so hopefully, you know, because

846
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:57,279
Speaker 2: you know that it's pretty hectic the training and this

847
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:00,960
Speaker 2: level of training. So my body definitely it's starting to

848
00:45:00,960 --> 00:45:03,440
Speaker 2: feel every forty one years its age. So I'm just

849
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:06,560
Speaker 2: hoping this it's going to helpful a little bit.

850
00:45:06,800 --> 00:45:10,239
Speaker 1: So people listening to you. Therapeutic use exemption, that's right,

851
00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:11,879
Speaker 1: isn't it. So you can apply for that to get

852
00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: almost to say I need to take this medication or

853
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 1: whatever it is with doctor's support, and then you can

854
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:18,960
Speaker 1: get approval to continue taking it, so that if you

855
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,000
Speaker 1: were to get drug tested and something flags, it's like

856
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:22,960
Speaker 1: well I've actually got approval to be using.

857
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:24,319
Speaker 2: This yep, yep.

858
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:28,239
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's cool though, that's a big that's a

859
00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:28,680
Speaker 1: big win.

860
00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:32,919
Speaker 2: I know it was it took it's taken a long

861
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:37,719
Speaker 2: time though to come through. So but you know, you know,

862
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:40,480
Speaker 2: I know there's a process and it's we had to

863
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:43,880
Speaker 2: sort of go through all the you know, administrative protocols

864
00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:46,680
Speaker 2: and everything like that. But you know, it's it's been

865
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 2: good people, you know, it's it's been good. I've had

866
00:45:50,520 --> 00:45:54,239
Speaker 2: the support and yeah, I like you. I think it's

867
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:56,520
Speaker 2: one of those things where you know, you want people

868
00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 2: to start having conversations around things that are actively going

869
00:45:59,920 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 2: to be a lot safer than the more the harsher

870
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:07,719
Speaker 2: medications that you know, particularly that I was taking so.

871
00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 1: Heading into this World Cup. So September twenty second, is

872
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:18,160
Speaker 1: that right? First game? Yeah, I'm working on home soil.

873
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:19,879
Speaker 1: How are you feeling about that?

874
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:24,560
Speaker 2: I'm so nervous but so excited at the same time.

875
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 2: I think, you know, my kids are going to be there,

876
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:32,520
Speaker 2: my parents. I'm not sort of in the same situation

877
00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:35,440
Speaker 2: that I was in, you know, ten twenty years ago.

878
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:37,800
Speaker 2: I'm not sort of a starter. You know, I'll be

879
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:41,760
Speaker 2: playing a role off the bench, which again it's lovely.

880
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:43,359
Speaker 2: I'll be out there. I'll be able to go out

881
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,040
Speaker 2: there and give the girls a good you know, a

882
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:50,160
Speaker 2: good bit, a good few minutes. Then who knows. I

883
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 2: just think I'll be valuable.

884
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:55,840
Speaker 1: You know, what do you feel like in a leadership

885
00:46:55,880 --> 00:46:59,839
Speaker 1: and experience capacity you bring now versus the sixteen year

886
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:03,040
Speaker 1: old Lauren Jackson that stepped onto the court for the Opens.

887
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:07,600
Speaker 2: Probably just more of a level head I would stay,

888
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:11,400
Speaker 2: and a bit of toughness. Possibly. I'm a lot bigger

889
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:14,360
Speaker 2: and stronger than I used to be. Can't jump as high,

890
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 2: I can't run as fast, but I definitely am still

891
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:21,719
Speaker 2: the competitive beast that I used to be, So I

892
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:23,759
Speaker 2: think that, you know, I definitely give that. But I

893
00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,600
Speaker 2: think too just I bring a little bit of perspective.

894
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:28,480
Speaker 2: You know, I've been out of the game a long

895
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:31,720
Speaker 2: time and I've sort of been on the other side,

896
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:34,439
Speaker 2: you know, in administrative roles, and I think it's really

897
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:39,680
Speaker 2: useful for people to see, you know that once basketball

898
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 2: is over, you know, there's still life out there involved

899
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:45,360
Speaker 2: in sport, and you know you can still stay involved.

900
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:48,920
Speaker 2: And who knows, like in terms of what you're able

901
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:51,719
Speaker 2: to achieve. You know, it's crazy. I just still can't

902
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 2: believe I'm here, truly, It's really cool. It is so weird.

903
00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:03,440
Speaker 1: I love it. It's it's quite the have you have

904
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:05,800
Speaker 1: you felt like it's It's taken a lot from me

905
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:08,160
Speaker 1: mentally to get back to that point.

906
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:14,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it has. It's been a real head game. The

907
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:16,759
Speaker 2: first time I had to go back to Canberra and

908
00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:21,399
Speaker 2: training Canberra, I had a fall on meltdown because that's

909
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:24,239
Speaker 2: where all my rehab and training was my knee, like

910
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 2: trying to get back. So I had like I had

911
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:29,840
Speaker 2: full PTSD. I had like twenty four hours where I

912
00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:33,400
Speaker 2: did not stop crying. It was it was shocking and

913
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 2: to the point like I was driving home and I

914
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,719
Speaker 2: was talking to people from work and I was like,

915
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:43,120
Speaker 2: I've not been this upset since ever, Like I really

916
00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:48,719
Speaker 2: wouldn't deal with it. But then, you know, I had

917
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 2: a chat with mom and dad and I had, you know,

918
00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:53,480
Speaker 2: slept on it, and I woke up and I was right,

919
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:56,520
Speaker 2: like it just has to be day by day, Like

920
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:58,040
Speaker 2: you just have to take this day by day. You

921
00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:02,200
Speaker 2: can't look too far ahead, you know, And that's sort

922
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:04,240
Speaker 2: of what it's come down to, because there's been moments

923
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:07,120
Speaker 2: where it's just become so overwhelming and then all of

924
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:13,000
Speaker 2: these thoughts and feelings and everything come rushing back in it. Yeah,

925
00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:16,400
Speaker 2: it's been a real head game. Even right before the

926
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:19,680
Speaker 2: NBA one season, I ruptured my plan of Fashia in

927
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:21,960
Speaker 2: my left foot. Yeah, so that was a week before

928
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:26,279
Speaker 2: the season started, and it for two or three days.

929
00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:28,880
Speaker 2: I could not walk. It was so painful, and I

930
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:31,400
Speaker 2: remember speaking to my doctor and he's like, no, you know,

931
00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:32,840
Speaker 2: in two weeks, you'll be right. You'll be able to

932
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:35,000
Speaker 2: get back out on court. You'll be fine. It's a

933
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:37,279
Speaker 2: big thing that you can do because you know, once

934
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 2: it goes, it's gone. So and he was right, But

935
00:49:40,800 --> 00:49:43,040
Speaker 2: like those first two days, I was like, yes, I

936
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 2: thought I'd just done all of this for nothing, you know,

937
00:49:45,280 --> 00:49:48,640
Speaker 2: And got back to your point. And then that month

938
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:51,360
Speaker 2: after that getting back into it. Every time I drive

939
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:53,560
Speaker 2: like I was worried I was going to pop something

940
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:56,880
Speaker 2: in my foot and not like, honestly, it is a

941
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:59,160
Speaker 2: head game. Every day something comes up and I'm just

942
00:49:59,239 --> 00:50:02,680
Speaker 2: like overthinking things and but yeah, you just got to

943
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 2: breathe through it. When you like that, you like.

944
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:09,440
Speaker 1: That breeze through it. Looking back on your career, what

945
00:50:09,600 --> 00:50:13,440
Speaker 1: are you most proud of? What's still going? So you

946
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,759
Speaker 1: can't look all the way back just where you are

947
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:16,200
Speaker 1: in your.

948
00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:21,440
Speaker 2: Career now, I reckon this journey is probably what I'm

949
00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:24,840
Speaker 2: most proud of, you know. I, Like I said, I

950
00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:28,640
Speaker 2: think I was really blessed as a youngster with the

951
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:33,000
Speaker 2: gifts that my parents gave me, and you know, obviously

952
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 2: a lot of hard work and you know, in the

953
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:38,640
Speaker 2: in between as well. But I think what I've been

954
00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:40,800
Speaker 2: able to achieve at my age with two kids and

955
00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:45,560
Speaker 2: a job and yeah, with you know, a knee replacement

956
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:51,080
Speaker 2: and everything, it's just totally unheard of. And yeah, hopefully

957
00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 2: you know, it all goes off without a hitch, but

958
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:56,200
Speaker 2: I'm sure there will be hitches because that's just me.

959
00:50:57,440 --> 00:51:00,440
Speaker 2: But I think this journey has been this is it.

960
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:02,480
Speaker 2: I think this is what I'm most proud of right now.

961
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:06,520
Speaker 1: It's awesome. What has been your favorite thing about becoming

962
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 1: a mother?

963
00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:14,920
Speaker 2: I don't know everything. So I just found out actually

964
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:16,400
Speaker 2: today that mom and dad are going to bring my

965
00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:18,919
Speaker 2: kids up on Saturday to Sydney to see me, and

966
00:51:19,200 --> 00:51:23,399
Speaker 2: I started crying. I was so happy. So I think

967
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 2: it's honestly, they're my little best mate, you know. And

968
00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 2: it's just it's been hard because before this started, I

969
00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:33,640
Speaker 2: hadn't left either of them, like for a night, you know.

970
00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:36,880
Speaker 2: I would take them everywhere with work and basket Australia

971
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:39,160
Speaker 2: has been so supportive like that, make sure that if

972
00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:40,959
Speaker 2: I have to travel and stuff, the kids can come.

973
00:51:41,160 --> 00:51:44,840
Speaker 2: Like they've been super supportive. So once I started with

974
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:48,040
Speaker 2: the opals and everything, I started leaving them for a

975
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:50,080
Speaker 2: couple of days at a time. Oh, they did not

976
00:51:50,320 --> 00:51:56,280
Speaker 2: like it at all. But I think just not being

977
00:51:56,320 --> 00:52:00,520
Speaker 2: the focus of my life. I think having those two

978
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:05,280
Speaker 2: little people and making sure that they are completely fine

979
00:52:05,400 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 2: and safe and healthy is the most important thing in

980
00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:11,360
Speaker 2: my life. And I think that's that's, you know, the

981
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:13,960
Speaker 2: most incredible thing about motherhood because I don't have to

982
00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:15,640
Speaker 2: worry about myself anymore. It's about them.

983
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:19,959
Speaker 1: To wrap us up, You're you're going to do World

984
00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:22,240
Speaker 1: Cup and you've just signed on to play another season

985
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:27,320
Speaker 1: of WNBL. You're crazy. I'm so you're crazy.

986
00:52:28,239 --> 00:52:30,760
Speaker 2: I haven't done it yet. We'll see how it goes exactly.

987
00:52:31,719 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 1: What do you hope for the future of the game

988
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:37,680
Speaker 1: of women's basketball in Australia.

989
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:42,040
Speaker 2: Look, the WNBL has been around for like over forty

990
00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:45,480
Speaker 2: two years. I think, well, I think it started the

991
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:47,520
Speaker 2: year and my birth, so it's been forty still would

992
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:51,040
Speaker 2: have been forty two or forty three single, so because

993
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:53,120
Speaker 2: there was two seasons in one year. I think early

994
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:58,400
Speaker 2: in my career that we have been the longest running

995
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:02,680
Speaker 2: professional women's sport in this country, you know, and I

996
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:07,719
Speaker 2: guess you know, with the rise of AFLW and with

997
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 2: the cricket and matildas and everything, basketball sort of was

998
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:14,080
Speaker 2: left behind a little bit and the professionalism and standards

999
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:17,919
Speaker 2: like that. In the last couple of years, a lot

1000
00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:20,200
Speaker 2: has been done to get us back on TV, get

1001
00:53:20,200 --> 00:53:25,080
Speaker 2: the visibility happening again, and the league, you know, is

1002
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:28,400
Speaker 2: it's starting to get back to where it once was.

1003
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:33,839
Speaker 2: I would love to see our sport dominating women's sport.

1004
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,239
Speaker 2: I would love to see it. I think that, like

1005
00:53:36,280 --> 00:53:38,759
Speaker 2: I said, the longevity, the history is there. We've been

1006
00:53:38,800 --> 00:53:41,400
Speaker 2: around for a long time. We're not going anywhere. But

1007
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:44,799
Speaker 2: I think just in terms of what our brand is

1008
00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:49,000
Speaker 2: and who we are, I want to see that explode.

1009
00:53:49,040 --> 00:53:52,359
Speaker 2: I want to see people talking about the WNBL, knowing

1010
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:56,360
Speaker 2: our athletes and watching our game because when it is

1011
00:53:56,360 --> 00:53:59,600
Speaker 2: on Freeway TV. It is watched. You know, we get numbers,

1012
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:03,759
Speaker 2: so that's sort of the thing, you know, And I

1013
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:05,239
Speaker 2: love that. I love that I get to be a

1014
00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:05,959
Speaker 2: part of it again.

1015
00:54:06,120 --> 00:54:09,680
Speaker 1: So it's really really cool. I love it. Thank you

1016
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:13,360
Speaker 1: so much again for your time today. It's it's pretty special.

1017
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 1: I've I mentioned before what an idol you were for

1018
00:54:16,040 --> 00:54:18,720
Speaker 1: me as a kid, but my three Lauren Jackson Aims

1019
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:20,560
Speaker 1: and Kathy Freeman. I haven't had Kathy on yet, but

1020
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:22,879
Speaker 1: I got to thank Anna for everything that she did

1021
00:54:22,880 --> 00:54:25,040
Speaker 1: for me as a kid, just inspiring me. And it's

1022
00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 1: so special to have the chance to say thank you

1023
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:28,960
Speaker 1: to you and to hear your story and for you

1024
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:32,200
Speaker 1: to share so openly and honestly about everything that you've

1025
00:54:32,200 --> 00:54:34,400
Speaker 1: been through and everything that you continue to achieve. So

1026
00:54:34,440 --> 00:54:35,239
Speaker 1: thank you so much.

1027
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:38,640
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. You're doing a great job yourself.

1028
00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:42,760
Speaker 1: Thank you ver much. I appreciate that. Thank you, Thanks

1029
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 1: so much for listening. For more women's sports news, stories, highlights,

1030
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:51,520
Speaker 1: and merchandise, check out our instagram at the Female Athlete Project.

1031
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:54,480
Speaker 1: We would absolutely love if you could subscribe to the

1032
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 1: podcast and leave us a review to let us know

1033
00:54:56,719 --> 00:54:58,080
Speaker 1: what you thought. See you next.

1034
00:54:58,120 --> 00:54:58,359
Speaker 2: Time