1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:03,080 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Aarunda 2 00:00:03,320 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: Bungelung Calcotin woman from Gadighl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 3 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 4 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 5 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:16,880 Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 6 00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present. 7 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os It's Wednesday, 8 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:29,840 Speaker 2: the twenty fourth of January. 9 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 3: I'm Zara, I'm Emma Gillespie. 10 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 4: I genuinely thought I was going to die, but we 11 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:38,120 Speaker 4: went to the doctor and he was very dismissive of 12 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:38,560 Speaker 4: my pain. 13 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 3: The pain that I felt was predominantly put down to 14 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 3: the fact that maybe I have low pain thresholds, but 15 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:46,440 Speaker 3: obviously that's not the case. 16 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 5: I paid four hundred and fifty dollars to sit in 17 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 5: a chair for twenty minutes and be told that quote unquote, 18 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 5: I am probably allergic to my own cycle and that 19 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 5: I bet you're looking forward to menopause. 20 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:03,960 Speaker 3: Van's pain is real and regularly overlooked. That's the verdict 21 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 3: from the Victorian government after a survey. It conducted revealed 22 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:10,199 Speaker 3: what's known as a gender pain gap. 23 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:12,960 Speaker 2: This gap is real. You don't have to tell women 24 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 2: about it. 25 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: They already know. 26 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 3: Later this month, the Victorian government will launch a review 27 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:20,399 Speaker 3: into how the state's healthcare responds to women's pain. We're 28 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 3: going to tell you what that means in today's Deep Dive, 29 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 3: But first, Sarah, what's making headlines. 30 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 2: Former Prime Minister Scott Morrison will officially retire from politics 31 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:32,720 Speaker 2: at the end of next month after sixteen years in parliament. 32 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:36,320 Speaker 2: In a statement that was shared by the former PM yesterday, 33 00:01:36,560 --> 00:01:38,680 Speaker 2: he said that he wants to take on new challenges 34 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 2: and spend more time with his family and church community. 35 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 2: Morrison was, of course Prime Minister from twenty eighteen through 36 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:48,480 Speaker 2: to twenty twenty two, and has sat as a backbencher 37 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 2: ever since his defeat at the twenty twenty two federal election. 38 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 3: Labor politicians will meet in Canberra today to discuss cost 39 00:01:55,800 --> 00:02:00,000 Speaker 3: of living relief measures amid ongoing inflation pressures across the country. 40 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 3: The Labour Caucus, which means MPs and senators, is expected 41 00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 3: to address supermarket and energy prices and the Stage three 42 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,560 Speaker 3: tax cuts, which are due to come into effect in July. 43 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 3: Other politicians aren't due back in Canberra until the sixth. 44 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 2: Of feb At least eleven people have been killed while 45 00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 2: forty seven are trapped in a landslide in China. The 46 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:26,360 Speaker 2: landslide occurred in freezing conditions in a city in the 47 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:30,760 Speaker 2: Yunnan province of China. President chi Jingping has ordered rescue 48 00:02:30,760 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 2: efforts for those trapped. State media reported the landslide resulted 49 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:35,960 Speaker 2: from a collapse in a steep cliff. 50 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,959 Speaker 3: And the good news, Cameroon has become the first country 51 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 3: in the world to launch a national malaria vaccine program. 52 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:48,839 Speaker 3: Malaria is a disease caused by certain species of parasite 53 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:52,280 Speaker 3: infected mosquitoes, and the African country is one of the 54 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:56,880 Speaker 3: world's worst affected regions for malaria. Cameroon received more than 55 00:02:56,919 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 3: three hundred thousand doses of the life saving vaccine late 56 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 3: Life last year, with stock expected to increase in the 57 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 3: coming weeks. Okay, so Zara, We've had some news come 58 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 3: out of Victoria this week, which is probably not actually 59 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 3: news to many of us, that women are experiencing pain 60 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:23,720 Speaker 3: for evolutionary you are your first ding dig breaking views, 61 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 3: period pain, pregnancy pain, pain from endometriosis, but The reason 62 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 3: that this is coming up is that the Victorian government 63 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 3: conducted this survey which found that the healthcare system in 64 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 3: the state isn't always well equipped to handle this pain. 65 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 2: You just alluded to it there that it's not anything new. 66 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 2: I think that lots of people have lived experience when 67 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 2: it comes to pain not being treated properly or perhaps 68 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 2: not being taken seriously. Given that this is such a 69 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 2: widespread experience, why are we only talking about it today? 70 00:03:56,840 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 3: So it has to do with this survey that we've 71 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:02,360 Speaker 3: touched on, and last year the state government in Victoria 72 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 3: set up this study and they asked more than seventeen 73 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 3: hundred and seventy people to take part to talk about 74 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:12,400 Speaker 3: their experience with pain. Now, it's important to mention that 75 00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 3: this survey did include transgender, non binary and gender diverse 76 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 3: people who quote may experience gender based discrepancies in care. 77 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 2: Okay, so it was an inclusive survey there of the 78 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:30,560 Speaker 2: lived experience. And what did it actually find? What did 79 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 2: the survey say? 80 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 3: So about half of those who were surveyed said pain 81 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,839 Speaker 3: linked to their periods affected their health and well being. 82 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:41,919 Speaker 3: One in three said that they have a health condition 83 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 3: something like cramping or persistent migraines that has affected their 84 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 3: ability to work and keep a job. So basically a 85 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 3: third of this study who said that pain holds them 86 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 3: back in big parts of their lives, in their everyday life. 87 00:04:56,680 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 2: Isn't that interesting? Because I feel like might have been. 88 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 2: Last year there was a conversation that the union's brought 89 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 2: forward about taking paid periodly menstrually menstrually and I thought 90 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:10,920 Speaker 2: that was a really interesting discussion at the time that 91 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:14,719 Speaker 2: people who have experienced immense pain were in favor of it. 92 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: You know, obviously employers weren't necessarily in favor of it, 93 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 2: and it was a really interesting discussion. 94 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, what was interesting about that discussion, which I think 95 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 3: some of the headlines may be limited, it down to 96 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:30,400 Speaker 3: this idea that people who experienced period pain needed all 97 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 3: this extra annual leave. It was more about, you know, 98 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 3: how can work places become more flexible? What about shifting 99 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:40,279 Speaker 3: hours or you know, when if someone experiences pain and 100 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 3: they can kind of predict patterns based on their cycle, 101 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 3: how can work places accommodate that. 102 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 2: So sorry I took you off course there, but I 103 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:52,039 Speaker 2: thought that that's what came to mind when talking about 104 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 2: the impact it's having on people in the workplace. 105 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 3: Definitely, it's something that we're talking more and more about. 106 00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:01,919 Speaker 3: And back to these figures from Victoria, while they have 107 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 3: been really revealing about the state of play for women 108 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:10,280 Speaker 3: and people who experience pain there, statistics can only obviously 109 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 3: tell us so much. So this survey, while it compiled 110 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:18,120 Speaker 3: this data, also asked women to share their stories about 111 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 3: going to a doctor, you know, to get treatment for pain, 112 00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 3: to share what their experiences were in that space. And 113 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 3: we wanted to know what our listeners thought, what they've 114 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,039 Speaker 3: experienced too, so we put a call out and we 115 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 3: got messages like this. 116 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:35,480 Speaker 4: So when I was twelve, I first experienced really really 117 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,039 Speaker 4: bad period pain where I genuinely thought I was going 118 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:41,159 Speaker 4: to die. It wasn't the kind of pain that I'd 119 00:06:41,160 --> 00:06:44,320 Speaker 4: ever experienced before. It was excruciating. I ended up throwing 120 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:46,760 Speaker 4: up because of it. But we went to the doctor 121 00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:48,799 Speaker 4: and it was a male doctor, and he was very 122 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:52,039 Speaker 4: dismissive of my pain. He was just kind of prescribed me, 123 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:55,040 Speaker 4: you know, neuropan and just kind of sent me on 124 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 4: my way. And so then for the next four or 125 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 4: five years, I just dealt with this excruciating pain. I 126 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 4: missed school, I miss sport because I'd just be rolling 127 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 4: around on my floor in my bedroom, just screaming and 128 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 4: crying until I would throw up, and it lasted about 129 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 4: two hours every time. And now I'm starting to put 130 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 4: the pieces together and realize that it could be endometriosis 131 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:16,920 Speaker 4: and it could very well affect my fertility, which is 132 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 4: a very scary thing that ten years later, I really 133 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 4: wish that someone had to pick that up a lot earlier. 134 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 2: I know that we heard a lot from the TBA 135 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 2: audience and even when you looked at the comment section 136 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 2: about endometriosis and about how the healthcare system has responded 137 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,679 Speaker 2: to that. Can you just take us through what endometriosis 138 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:36,440 Speaker 2: actually is. 139 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, as you mentioned, we hear a lot from our 140 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:44,160 Speaker 3: audience and online in the media, this disease, endometriosis that's 141 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 3: been spoken about, you know, more and more. 142 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 2: Over the last few years. 143 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 3: Basically, endometriosis is when tissue grows outside the uterus, so 144 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 3: tissue similar to the lining of the uterus, and essentially 145 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 3: it grows where it's not in inverted commas meant to 146 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:05,600 Speaker 3: so it can lead to inflammation, the development of scar 147 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 3: tissue around the pelvis. We've heard stories of people who've 148 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 3: had endometriosis growing around their bowels, around their bladder. It 149 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 3: can cause extreme pain and discomfort for people who live 150 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 3: with it, and there are certainly still issues in the 151 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 3: healthcare system. While we talk more and more about endometriosis 152 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 3: these days, there are still clear issues in the healthcare 153 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 3: system when it comes to treating and diagnosing it. So 154 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 3: to give you a sense of how ENDO can go 155 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 3: undiagnosed and untreated, because there are a lot of people 156 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:40,839 Speaker 3: who suspect they have it, but they never really find 157 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:44,280 Speaker 3: out for certain, because perhaps that involves a surgical. 158 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,080 Speaker 2: Procedure and an invasive one of that. 159 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 3: Exactly, recovery, time, money, so many factors why it's hard 160 00:08:51,480 --> 00:08:54,560 Speaker 3: to get diagnosed. But Bindeo when actually came forward last 161 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:57,160 Speaker 3: year with her own story of what it's like living 162 00:08:57,160 --> 00:09:00,200 Speaker 3: with ENDO, she had it for eight years before she 163 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:03,439 Speaker 3: was diagnosed and eventually received treatment for her INDO. 164 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 2: It's a very common story, I feel more and more, 165 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 2: especially now as it's being spoken about. And so the 166 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 2: government has all of this data and all of these 167 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,719 Speaker 2: stories about women's suffering from all sorts of pain, and 168 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 2: many reporting that they're not actually having positive experiences in 169 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 2: the healthcare system. What do you actually do with this information? 170 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 2: You know, the premiere of Victoria can't clicker fingers and 171 00:09:29,280 --> 00:09:32,760 Speaker 2: tomorrow change it. What are the steps that happened from here? 172 00:09:33,520 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 3: So earlier this week, coinciding with the release of these 173 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 3: survey findings, the Victorian government said that it was setting 174 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:44,720 Speaker 3: up a review into women's pain. For too long, women's 175 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 3: health has been seen as a niche issue. 176 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 2: It has not had the attention the support that it deserves. 177 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 3: The Victorian Premier Justinto Allen said it was an important 178 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 3: step to establish a broader inquiry to what the survey 179 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 3: had found. So you know, not just stopping here with 180 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:03,840 Speaker 3: this data and saying yep, well women are in pain, 181 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 3: but actually taking practical steps towards going deeper and finding 182 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 3: out what the healthcare system can be doing to support 183 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:11,040 Speaker 3: these women. 184 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:14,240 Speaker 2: More so, how will the review actually work in practice? 185 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 3: Then yes, So from the thirtieth of January, women across Victoria, 186 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 3: so you know, Melbourne, the regions, they've been asked to 187 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 3: make submissions to the inquiry to share their experience of 188 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:29,000 Speaker 3: receiving health care when they've suffered from pain. So anyone 189 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 3: from the public can make a submission to this review. 190 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 3: The review itself will be led by the Victorian Women's 191 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:40,439 Speaker 3: Health Advisory Council. Now that's an agency responsible for improving 192 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 3: health care services for women broadly, and the council will 193 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,080 Speaker 3: go through these submissions from the public, from women's lived 194 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 3: experiences and work on a final report that will be 195 00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:54,160 Speaker 3: delivered by December this year, so they'll have almost a 196 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 3: year to kind of make sure that they feel that 197 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 3: they are understanding and examining this issue thoroughly. 198 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:02,200 Speaker 2: I guess the last one I want to pick up 199 00:11:02,200 --> 00:11:06,440 Speaker 2: on is that we are speaking very specifically about Victoria here, 200 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 2: but it doesn't just affect women in Victoria. This gender 201 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 2: pain gap, as it's being called, is something that affects 202 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 2: women across the country. What are those women do who 203 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:18,680 Speaker 2: don't have this review available to them. 204 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:21,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, we can only kind of hope. I suppose 205 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 3: that states taking this initiative, this inquiry being set up, 206 00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:29,600 Speaker 3: will put some pressure maybe on the federal government on 207 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:33,720 Speaker 3: other states and territories to respond similarly. But you know, 208 00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 3: it's absolutely not an issue that's going away, as other 209 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 3: countries even have these conversations. As the idea of you know, 210 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 3: period pain leave is implemented elsewhere and other jurisdictions. Maybe 211 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 3: we'll see a broader kind of roll out and measures 212 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:51,840 Speaker 3: and reform for sufferers of this kind of pain everywhere. 213 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 2: Thanks so much for listening to the Dahlias and to 214 00:11:55,960 --> 00:12:00,000 Speaker 2: everyone who's sent in their experiences of pain. Thank you 215 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:03,840 Speaker 2: for that. We know that it's deeply personal and from experience, 216 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 2: it's not an easy thing to talk about. It can 217 00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:09,320 Speaker 2: sometimes be hard to find the language to express how 218 00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:13,280 Speaker 2: hard it is, so thank you for sharing with us today. 219 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,680 Speaker 2: If you're listening to this episode on Spotify, there's a 220 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:19,120 Speaker 2: little question box under the show notes you can tell 221 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:21,440 Speaker 2: us what you thought. We'll be back again tomorrow, but 222 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 2: until then, have a great day. 223 00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 1: Already, and this. 224 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:29,320 Speaker 5: Is the Daily OS. 225 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 2: Oh, now it makes sense.