1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:04,880 Speaker 1: If you want something done right, do it yourself, or 2 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:09,280 Speaker 1: at least that's the approach Patrick like body takes. After 3 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:13,640 Speaker 1: years of wrestling with different physical planners and calendar apps, 4 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:17,639 Speaker 1: Patrick decided to make his own and co founded the 5 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: very successful calendar software company Reclaim. So how does someone 6 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 1: who designs calendar apps actually use them himself? Well, it 7 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:37,880 Speaker 1: all begins with the past. My name is doctor amanthe Imbert. 8 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 1: I'm an organizational psychologist and the founder of behavioral science 9 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: consultancy Inventium, And this is how I work a show 10 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:49,239 Speaker 1: about how to help you do your best work. On 11 00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 1: today's my Favorite Tip episode, will you go back to 12 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,120 Speaker 1: an interview from the past and I pick up my 13 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:57,440 Speaker 1: favorite tip from the interview. In today's show, I speak 14 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 1: with Patrick and we start with Patrick talking about how 15 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 1: he used to manage his calendar before he built the 16 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 1: calendar app Reclaim. 17 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:10,479 Speaker 2: The two main techniques was a mixture of some amount 18 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 2: of time blocking and I'd just call it calendar orientation, 19 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 2: where you know, even if I wasn't putting blocks of 20 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 2: time down on my calendar, I was consulting with my 21 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:23,200 Speaker 2: calendar a lot. And the key thing here is I 22 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:26,559 Speaker 2: was looking at it both past and future. I wasn't 23 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:31,319 Speaker 2: just looking forward, because once you get sufficiently busy, you 24 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 2: start to forget what the hell you did the day 25 00:01:33,520 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 2: before or earlier that day. And I developed a philosophy 26 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:42,320 Speaker 2: that you can't possibly tell if you're oriented towards what 27 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 2: matters to you if you're not constantly looking backwards, and 28 00:01:46,360 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 2: kind of say and kind of just giving it a 29 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 2: reality check, like, Okay, these three objectives are important in 30 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 2: my life or in my work. Am I spending time 31 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:58,240 Speaker 2: on those things? So there's a little bit of calendar orientation, 32 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 2: but I didn't have the tooling to automate all of that. 33 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 2: So the kind of pen and paper counterpart to that, 34 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:07,000 Speaker 2: so to speak, was just a ritual. And I still 35 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:09,120 Speaker 2: do this to in a version of this, which is 36 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:14,640 Speaker 2: like a ritual weekly planning session where hopefully it's only 37 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:16,880 Speaker 2: fifteen or twenty minutes. I hopefully it don't have to 38 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:19,360 Speaker 2: take longer than that. And it was a habit that 39 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 2: was actually kind of drilled into my head early on 40 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 2: in my career by one of my managers right out 41 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:28,520 Speaker 2: of college, and it was just like, do the three 42 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 2: p's style status report. You know your plans, your progress, 43 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 2: your priorities or problems. There's different versions of it. 44 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: I did. 45 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 2: I always did four p's, Plans, problems, priorities, What am 46 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 2: I missing? Plans, progress, priorities, and problems four p's and 47 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 2: then some metrics, and they were meant to be really lightweight, 48 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,120 Speaker 2: like key stats, just stuff that like could ground me. 49 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 2: So it might be like customer contacts, you know, how 50 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 2: many customers did I talk to in the last week, 51 00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 2: Because if that number zero three weeks in a row, 52 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:06,799 Speaker 2: I'm probably losing sight of the market. You know, number 53 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 2: of sales support calls. You know, if that number zero, 54 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:13,639 Speaker 2: I'm also probably not helping the business get its deals done. 55 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:16,320 Speaker 2: But if that number is fifteen each week, I'm also 56 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:19,160 Speaker 2: probably you know, over tilting in one direction. So it'd 57 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:22,120 Speaker 2: be some basic stats like that, which often resulted in 58 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 2: me looking at the calendar and kind of counting some 59 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 2: of these things up. And then the rest of it 60 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:28,760 Speaker 2: was plans, what are you going to do this week? 61 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:31,200 Speaker 2: And I tried a little trick that I learned from 62 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 2: my manager that I think is really nice is try 63 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 2: to write it the bullets and one try to keep 64 00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 2: the bullets low. Don't go and do fifteen twenty bullets 65 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 2: of things you're trying to accomplish, like what are like 66 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 2: the three or four big items that if you got 67 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 2: those three or four things done by the time the 68 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 2: week is over, you'd be proud of your week. Like 69 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 2: it doesn't have to be the forever list. You're not 70 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 2: trying to brag to your coworkers or your boss about 71 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 2: all the shit you're getting done, but it's like, these 72 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 2: are the things that matter. And then can you write 73 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 2: it in a way where you can just change like 74 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 2: one or two letters to take it from the past 75 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 2: the future tests to the past tests. Because what's cool 76 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:10,160 Speaker 2: about that is if you could do that, you can 77 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 2: take those three bullets, bring them right down into the 78 00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 2: progress for the next week and like delete one vowel 79 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 2: and like now it's like in the past tests and 80 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:21,080 Speaker 2: you're like yes, And it starts to just get you 81 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 2: into this mindset of thinking about the future as if 82 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 2: it's the past. And so that technique helped a lot 83 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 2: where I'd kind of, you know, just stage these three 84 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 2: or four bullets each week through and then I'd constantly 85 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 2: go and also compare that against my priorities, like what 86 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 2: am I broadly trying to get done? Over the next 87 00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 2: few months, and is it you know, are are all 88 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 2: of these bullets aligned with those priorities? So that was 89 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,760 Speaker 2: kind of the basic pen and paper system, and what 90 00:04:47,760 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 2: we're trying to build with your claim is is something 91 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 2: that is akin to that, where it's you know, intentionally 92 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 2: helping you get ahead of your calendar and we hope 93 00:04:57,520 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 2: where if we can get the product to where we 94 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,640 Speaker 2: want it to go over the next few years, helps 95 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 2: you align your time with the things that matter most 96 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:06,160 Speaker 2: to you, you know, personally and professionally. 97 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: So before reclaim and I know that some of these 98 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 1: features are sort of in progress, how then do you 99 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:17,720 Speaker 1: take that weekly planning ritual or four piece ritual and 100 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: translate that into what is digitally appearing in your calendar 101 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:22,679 Speaker 1: for the next week. 102 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:25,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, So that'd be a case where, you know, if 103 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 2: I looked backwards and I saw I didn't get any 104 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 2: of my stuff done that I wanted to get done, 105 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:33,400 Speaker 2: and I saw that, you know, perhaps my key metrics 106 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:35,200 Speaker 2: showed that I was like on a whole bunch of 107 00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:39,360 Speaker 2: sales calls and no customer research calls, then that would 108 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 2: be where I'd look forward and I'd say, oh, okay, 109 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:45,960 Speaker 2: how many sales calls am I on this week and 110 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 2: possibly decline or delegate more likely some of them to 111 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 2: get it into some sort of reasonable volume. But more importantly, 112 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:58,840 Speaker 2: also like set the reminder in my brain stops stop 113 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 2: trying to please everybody, stop saying yes to every sales 114 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:05,320 Speaker 2: rep that reaches out to you, and be more defensive 115 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 2: of your time. That's one step. Second thing would be 116 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:10,040 Speaker 2: to do a little bit of time blocking where if 117 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:12,559 Speaker 2: I saw there was only three or four hours free 118 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 2: in the given week and one of my top priorities 119 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 2: was developing next year's strategy, it's time to now, you know, 120 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 2: like I can't say yes to any more sales calls, 121 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 2: I can't say yes to any other meetings. I needed 122 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 2: to block that time out and make it available for 123 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:30,280 Speaker 2: that intentional work. And so that's kind of where I'd 124 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 2: say the manual version of reclaims, habits and tasks features 125 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:38,600 Speaker 2: would come into play. The thing I learned though, that 126 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:43,720 Speaker 2: made that a difficult scenario is reschedules happen when you're 127 00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 2: doing fifteen to twenty meetings a week. People say hey, 128 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:49,720 Speaker 2: can you do another time? Or if you're if these 129 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 2: are internal meetings, then people are just looking and they're 130 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 2: kind of doing the find a time and if your 131 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:59,039 Speaker 2: calendar has no free time, then you know, they don't 132 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:01,000 Speaker 2: not try to meet with you. Instead they just bug 133 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 2: you in different ways and they start slacking you, texting 134 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:05,840 Speaker 2: you and calling you and trying to get something scheduled. 135 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 2: And so that was where I also learned that that 136 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:12,280 Speaker 2: time blocking could be rigid, and that was some of 137 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:15,400 Speaker 2: the inspiration for what went into reclaim is can we 138 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:18,480 Speaker 2: do time blocking but in a way that's actually like 139 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 2: better than what mere mortals can do because humans can't 140 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 2: be on their calendar all the time and be offering 141 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 2: up availability and then moving it or moving those blocks 142 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 2: around as their schedule changes. But a robot's pretty good 143 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 2: at doing that, and so that was some of the 144 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 2: early inspiration for that feature. 145 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 1: If you enjoyed this extract from my chat with Patrick, 146 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 1: you might want to go back and listen to the 147 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 1: whole interview, which you can find a link to in 148 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: the show notes. If you're looking for more tips to 149 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:53,560 Speaker 1: improve the way that you worked, I write a short 150 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:57,239 Speaker 1: fortnightly newsletter that contains three cool things that I've discovered 151 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 1: that helped me work better, ranging from software and gadgets 152 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: that I'm loving through the interesting research findings. You can 153 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 1: sign up for that at Howiwork dot co. That's how 154 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: I Work dot co. Thank you for sharing part of 155 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:13,840 Speaker 1: your day with me by listening to How I Work. 156 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: If you're keen for more tips on how to work better, 157 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 1: connect with me via LinkedIn or Instagram. I'm very easy 158 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:25,520 Speaker 1: to find. Just search for Amantha Imba. How I Work 159 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 1: was recorded on the traditional land of the Warrangery People's 160 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 1: part of the Koln Nation. I am so grateful for 161 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 1: being able to work and live on this beautiful land, 162 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: and I want to pay my respects to elders, past, 163 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:42,079 Speaker 1: present and emerging. How I Work is produced by inventing 164 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:45,240 Speaker 1: with production support from Dead Set Studios, and thank you 165 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:47,560 Speaker 1: to Martin Nimba who did the audio mix and makes 166 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 1: everything sound better than it would have otherwise.