1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:02,880 Speaker 1: Do you want to get more out of everything that 2 00:00:02,920 --> 00:00:06,480 Speaker 1: you read, will join the club, or you could join 3 00:00:06,559 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: book Topia's CEO Tony Nash and start listening to more 4 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:14,760 Speaker 1: audio books instead. Tony is someone who doesn't stress about 5 00:00:14,800 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 1: taking notes while he's listening to audiobooks and instead prefers 6 00:00:19,160 --> 00:00:23,600 Speaker 1: to absorb the information into his mental data bank. So 7 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:27,480 Speaker 1: if you have ever felt guilty or stupid for not 8 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: retaining everything you've learned in books or training programs or 9 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:34,160 Speaker 1: podcasts like this one, then I think that you will 10 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 1: love hearing about how Tony thinks about making learning automatic. 11 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:47,120 Speaker 1: My name is doctor Amantha Imba. I'm an organizational psychologist 12 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: and the founder of behavioral science consultancy Inventium. And this 13 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,520 Speaker 1: is how I work a show about how to help 14 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: you do your best work. On Today is my Favorite 15 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 1: Tip episode, where you go back to an interview from 16 00:00:59,880 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 1: the past and I pick out my favorite tip from 17 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:07,160 Speaker 1: the interview. This extract starts with Tony describing the impact 18 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 1: that some first aid training had for him as a. 19 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 2: Leader at Booktopia. And I don't have to do it anymore. 20 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 2: I've got other people who do this, but I've done 21 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,680 Speaker 2: first aid training at book Toopia, right so you go 22 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 2: on and you do the one day course, and you 23 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 2: give the dummy all the pumps and do all the 24 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 2: things he's supposed to do. Lie them on the side, 25 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 2: talk about this injury and what you've got to do. 26 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 2: Are playing pressure there all the things that are required 27 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:35,440 Speaker 2: to do first aid. My mate, my next door neighbor, 28 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 2: was working in the garden and he was using a 29 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 2: pickaxe to get rid of some sugarcane that was growing 30 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:43,560 Speaker 2: in his garden, and he fell two meters down onto 31 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:46,959 Speaker 2: the bed below him, and then rolled and fell another 32 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 2: two meters onto the concrete driveway next to that. So 33 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 2: with hit his head and blood and unconscious, and so 34 00:01:54,960 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 2: I'm reversing out and as a lady standing over him, 35 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:59,560 Speaker 2: I'm going, what's going on? And there's there he is 36 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 2: lying in the in the driveway. And why did I 37 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 2: know what to do? I couldn't remember. And luckily for him, 38 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 2: a doctor was driving past. He's an op themologist, so 39 00:02:11,200 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 2: you know, an eye surgeon with his wife, and they 40 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 2: stopped and he came out. He knew what questions to ask. 41 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 2: He's the doctor, he's trained. He knew exactly how to 42 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 2: ask this and do that and be in this position 43 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,360 Speaker 2: and then finally the ambulance arrived. And the thing for 44 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 2: me about business and about these books and everything else 45 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 2: that you're reading and consuming, it's got to be automatic 46 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:33,080 Speaker 2: in a similar kind of way. So when when I 47 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 2: talk about someone resigning and my reaction automatic reaction. 48 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:39,640 Speaker 3: Is like wow, Wow, where a you're going next? 49 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 2: That's so exciting. It's like that's automatic for me. But 50 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 2: if someone had to go, Now, what did Tony say again? 51 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 2: Did he say we had to do this or you 52 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:49,320 Speaker 2: have to? Like, then it's not automatic. Then you're you're 53 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 2: learning the skill. It's still at that. You know, learning 54 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 2: how to ride a bike or drive a car. You're 55 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:57,240 Speaker 2: learning all the skills and it's not automatic. And so 56 00:02:57,320 --> 00:03:00,240 Speaker 2: it's really about the automation of that when you say 57 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: what you just said to me in terms of you're 58 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 2: reading these things and then. 59 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 3: You want to you want to stop. 60 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:08,000 Speaker 2: It's like you want to put the book on pause 61 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 2: because you want to make notes and you want to 62 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:11,320 Speaker 2: think about that and you want to you want to 63 00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:13,639 Speaker 2: mull over it and then work out how you can 64 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 2: use it. I've just set that up that I'm going 65 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 2: to do that through listening and that whatever I take 66 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:24,080 Speaker 2: and I take in and is adding to my data 67 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:27,400 Speaker 2: bank of knowledge and information that is automatic. 68 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: So with making things automatic, what are some other habits 69 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 1: or things that you do in your working life that 70 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 1: just happen automatically that you feel like serve you really well, 71 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: like your reaction to when someone resigns, So. 72 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 2: When something comes out of left field and it's not 73 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 2: necessarily something resigning, so extra cost is on certain things 74 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 2: projects next to six hundred thousand dollars here that you 75 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 2: weren't expecting, or one hundred thousand here. When we were 76 00:03:55,280 --> 00:04:00,280 Speaker 2: moving from Lane Cove to Lidcom or to the Regent 77 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 2: where we are now near Olympic Stadium and where the 78 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 2: big Australia Post hub is, which is where we wanted 79 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 2: to move to. We had spent a year trying to 80 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:12,400 Speaker 2: find a place. Found a place, paid out ten thousand dollar. 81 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 2: It's not a deposit, it's like a heads of agreement 82 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:17,839 Speaker 2: kind of holding money so that you go, yep, we're 83 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:19,840 Speaker 2: taking this property and. 84 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 3: Sign the heads of agreement. 85 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:23,400 Speaker 2: And then I got a call from the real estate 86 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 2: agent to say, Tony, I've got the worst possible news. 87 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:31,000 Speaker 2: The CEO of a large multinational who rents from your 88 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:35,080 Speaker 2: landlord that you want to take the building from. Once 89 00:04:35,120 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 2: the property that you've taken has rung the CEO of 90 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:41,000 Speaker 2: that company and demanded that they get it because they 91 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,119 Speaker 2: rent all over the country and doesn't matter they've signed 92 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 2: something else forget it. And so he was just like, 93 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 2: I had to make this call to me and just 94 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:52,800 Speaker 2: say how you know, like apparently he was sweating bullets 95 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:54,840 Speaker 2: before making the call because it was Christmas, even we'd 96 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:57,159 Speaker 2: worked all year, and he just like he was just 97 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:00,799 Speaker 2: gutted to have to do this, and I let him speak, 98 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:03,479 Speaker 2: and then at the end of it, I said, Sean, relax, 99 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:06,159 Speaker 2: the only reason you're telling me is there's a better 100 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:09,280 Speaker 2: property waiting for us around the corner. And because I 101 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 2: wasn't so angry and pissed off and kicking the bucket 102 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:17,279 Speaker 2: and whatever else, and you did this because I was 103 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:21,160 Speaker 2: so amenable. We got a bigger property for an amazing 104 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 2: price because we really helped them out. They were under 105 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 2: pressure and so they did what they could to really 106 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 2: support how supportive we were. 107 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:32,599 Speaker 3: And that's happened. 108 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 2: Many, many times in various things where something comes out 109 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 2: of left field, and when you're in business, things come 110 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:39,440 Speaker 2: out of left field. 111 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 3: You cannot be. 112 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 2: Running a company, even as the appointed CEO or a 113 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,839 Speaker 2: leader in your company, doesn't matter what's going on, even 114 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:47,760 Speaker 2: in your team, something will come out of left field, 115 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 2: and you've got to be able to say. 116 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 3: Bring it on. Oh, I wasn't expecting that. 117 00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:55,719 Speaker 2: I mean last night it is like my son, seventeen 118 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 2: year old doing is hsc silly kids, right, He takes 119 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 2: his computer up stairs, He gets a glass of water 120 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 2: out of the fridge, turns around and because I've been 121 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:07,840 Speaker 2: doing the dishes, the computer felt into the tub that 122 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 2: I was washing dishes in. You know, like there's no 123 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 2: point in just kicking and screaming. It's like, okay, how 124 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:15,640 Speaker 2: are we going to resolve this? What needs to happen? 125 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 2: And you just got to get it done. But I 126 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 2: think that's an important skill. You want to be able 127 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:24,000 Speaker 2: to be as stable as you can in any situation. 128 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 2: Because you've got to, you'll be more resourceful, you'll be 129 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,280 Speaker 2: more available to listen to others, you'll think of options. 130 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 2: When you're really emotionally charged and you're angry, all of 131 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:38,239 Speaker 2: a sudden, all of that capacity to think of something 132 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 2: else is almost removed because you just don't have the 133 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 2: memory space to focus on that. That is definitely one 134 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:46,240 Speaker 2: that served me very well. 135 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: So how did you almost train yourself to have that 136 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 1: reaction become automatic? 137 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:57,080 Speaker 2: I'm not embarrassed to say, and I'll protect the people involved, 138 00:06:57,120 --> 00:07:00,919 Speaker 2: but I when I sold my recruitment company, it was 139 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:04,960 Speaker 2: sold to a listed company, and we had a dot 140 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 2: com crash and things were just it was just everything 141 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 2: just went to pieces. In the late nineties early two thousands, 142 00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 2: there was a lot of companies that went under. 143 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:15,120 Speaker 3: The whole market fell out. 144 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:17,560 Speaker 2: If you look at the Nasdaq in the early two thousands, 145 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 2: you'll see it go from like five thousand, five thousand 146 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 2: points to sixteen hundred or something. 147 00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 3: It was just really awful. 148 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 2: Anyway, the guy that was running a company that made 149 00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 2: the acquisition, he had a meeting with the head office 150 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:33,160 Speaker 2: and he. 151 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:36,920 Speaker 3: Came back and he just he was just so pissed 152 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 3: off with what. 153 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 2: Had happened at the board level that he walked to 154 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 2: his desk and just smashed the filing trays all across 155 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:47,200 Speaker 2: the room. And I was anyone in the office at 156 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:48,880 Speaker 2: the time. It was in the evening. I was working, 157 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 2: and everything just went flying everywhere. And I looked at 158 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 2: that and going is that really the best way to 159 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 2: react and manage your situation. It just didn't give me 160 00:07:59,840 --> 00:08:04,280 Speaker 2: a lot of confidence in his dealing with crisis. 161 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 3: And so that was one thing that I remember. 162 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 2: I was quite shocked, and I remember going, that's not 163 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 2: the way that I want to operate in a situation. 164 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 3: So if you ask me what happened outside of my 165 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 3: personal experience, that was one that immediately comes to mind. 166 00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 2: But when I was younger, and I remember I was 167 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:30,760 Speaker 2: coaching or managing a young basketball team of teenagers and 168 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 2: something had happened and I just lost my I lost 169 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 2: it and I just started yelling at the kids, and 170 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 2: there was parents and everyone in the stands, And I 171 00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 2: remember my mum coming up to me later and she goes, 172 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:45,560 Speaker 2: I've never been so embarrassed. 173 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:46,559 Speaker 3: In all my life. 174 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 2: Nothing could have been better for anyone to say anything 175 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:53,200 Speaker 2: at that time for me to then think about how 176 00:08:53,960 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 2: my reaction really didn't work. So I think those two 177 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 2: things was that when I think about it, when they 178 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 2: pop up, it must be some. 179 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 3: Of the core red faced experiences. 180 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:09,200 Speaker 2: One that I had done to myself and one where 181 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:12,360 Speaker 2: I was like someone else had done it to themselves 182 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 2: that I was observing that gave me reference points to shift. 183 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed my chat with Tony and got 184 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 1: something out of it. Now, if you're enjoying How I Work, 185 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,120 Speaker 1: I would be so grateful if you could take maybe 186 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:29,920 Speaker 1: five ten seconds out of your day to leave a 187 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 1: review wherever you're listening to this from. If you're listening 188 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:35,880 Speaker 1: in Apple podcasts, all you need to do is click 189 00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:38,439 Speaker 1: on a star rating, or you might even want to 190 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:41,840 Speaker 1: write some words and thank you to the hundreds of 191 00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:46,240 Speaker 1: people that have left reviews. It's so wonderful getting listener 192 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 1: feedback and it really does make my day, So thank you. 193 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 1: How I Work is produce my inventing with production support 194 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 1: from Dead Set Studios. And thank you to Martin Nimba 195 00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:58,199 Speaker 1: who does the audio mix and makes everything sound much 196 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:00,880 Speaker 1: better than it would have otherwise. See you next time.