Speaker 1: Just before nine o'clock last night, the jury returned guilty
Speaker 1: verdicts against all three defendants.
Speaker 2: It was absolute shambles, to tell you the truth, just
Speaker 2: absolutely really.
Speaker 1: Put the blood on who's clothing the day after the
Speaker 1: alleged to Tonahallow mud bank and it fits through a river.
Speaker 2: Basically, I think most of the people are used to
Speaker 2: me are good people.
Speaker 1: I think a really important question we need to ask
Speaker 1: is how many Indigenous prisoners in Australia are innocent.
Speaker 2: This is Curtain, a podcast where we pull back the
Speaker 2: blinds to shine a light on the darkest parts of
Speaker 2: our justice system and ask who are the victims. I'm
Speaker 2: Amy Maguire and.
Speaker 1: I'm Martin Hodgson, a senior advocate for the Foreign Prisoner
Speaker 1: Support Service. And a warning this series contains the names
Speaker 1: of deceased peoples and has distressing content that might upset
Speaker 1: some listeners.
Speaker 2: Welcome to a special episode of Curtin the podcast. This week,
Speaker 2: we're going to be providing vital information about the coronavirus virus,
Speaker 2: particularly as it relates to those in prison, people who
Speaker 2: work in prison, and the drastic need to immediately get
Speaker 2: as many people out of the prison system as possible,
Speaker 2: Those who don't need to be in there need to
Speaker 2: be bailed out immediately. As many of our listeners will
Speaker 2: be aware, a huge percentage of the prison population in
Speaker 2: Australia are on remand that means they have not been
Speaker 2: convicted of a crime. And as many doctors and human
Speaker 2: rights organizations are pointing out, being in prison during a
Speaker 2: pandemic like the coronavirus is literally a death sentence. The
Speaker 2: people who are under a misapprehension that a prison might
Speaker 2: be an isolated place to be that's completely incorrect. Not
Speaker 2: only are the conditions very poor in almost every prison
Speaker 2: in the world, and I should say just today in
Speaker 2: the United Kingdom, a prisoner has died of coronavirus. There
Speaker 2: is people and staff going in and out of prisons
Speaker 2: every day with no control over who could or could
Speaker 2: not be taking the virus inside the prisons. There's also
Speaker 2: very poor hygiene standards in the prisons. This is not
Speaker 2: because of the prisoner's lack of trying, but because of
Speaker 2: basic lack of soap and running water. They can't even
Speaker 2: wash their hands. It's also impossible in a prison environment
Speaker 2: to reduce contact and do what the rest of us
Speaker 2: are calling social isolation, people are in close quarters, and
Speaker 2: as we've seen on cruise ships, this is a recipe
Speaker 2: for disaster. Now, not only should people who don't need
Speaker 2: to be in prison not be there and not be
Speaker 2: subject to a huge increase of risk of contracting the
Speaker 2: deadly coronavirus as we've seen cruise ships, these petri dishes
Speaker 2: of this virus where it is allowed to congregate and spread,
Speaker 2: become deadly for the entire community. You cannot simply shut
Speaker 2: up a cruise ship, and you can't do the same
Speaker 2: with a prison. It will get out and it will spread.
Speaker 2: So the better we control this, the better it is
Speaker 2: for the entire community. This affects absolutely everyone and so
Speaker 2: we all need to be invested now. The Coalition for
Speaker 2: the Human Rights of Imprisoned People in Australia have put
Speaker 2: out a lengthy press release about this issue. That coalition
Speaker 2: includes Sisters inside Flat Out Ink, Fitzroy Legal Service and
Speaker 2: Prisoner's Legal Service in Queensland. Amanda George from Flat Out Ink,
Speaker 2: an advocacy in housing service for women leaving prison in Victoria,
Speaker 2: says it's not a matter of if, but when there'll
Speaker 2: be an outbreak of COVID nineteen in Australian prisons, but
Speaker 2: she says locking out visitors will not prevent it. Thousands
Speaker 2: of correctional staff, healthcare workers, contractors and others go in
Speaker 2: and out of prisons every day. She points out family
Speaker 2: visitors are essential to the mental and physical health of prisoners,
Speaker 2: but we do need to get as many prisoners out
Speaker 2: of Australia's overcrowded prisons as possible. People who don't need
Speaker 2: to be incarcerated shouldn't be there during this epidemic. Everyone
Speaker 2: who can be bailed should be bailed. Everyone who can
Speaker 2: be paroled should be paroled. Everyone who can get medical
Speaker 2: or compassionate leave should be granted leave. They also need
Speaker 2: homes to go to so they can protect themselves and
Speaker 2: their families. Seventy seven percent of people being sent to
Speaker 2: prisons today are not even sentenced, she said. They are
Speaker 2: waiting for their day in court, and with this pandemic,
Speaker 2: who knows when they will get that And that's a
Speaker 2: really important point that's being raised there with courts being
Speaker 2: shut down and so many people in our prison system
Speaker 2: not having been found guilty yet, these are innocent people.
Speaker 2: Who knows when they will get that day in court?
Speaker 2: And inside they are sitting ducks. They do not need
Speaker 2: to be there for their own health, for the health
Speaker 2: of their family, for the health of all the workers
Speaker 2: in the prison system, and for the well being and
Speaker 2: health of the general community. Most Australian prisons are operating
Speaker 2: above their capacity, which Miss George says Western Australian prisons
Speaker 2: are more than thirty percent over capacity. This means two
Speaker 2: or three prisoners in cells designed for one, overstretched health
Speaker 2: and medical service and a tinderbox environment. So we have
Speaker 2: to act now. Many other countries, including China, Italy and Iran,
Speaker 2: have scrambled to address this threat. Many have acted too
Speaker 2: late and it is caused the worsening of this pandemic.
Speaker 2: As I say, this affects absolutely everyone. The elderly and
Speaker 2: immunocompromised prisoners should be given medical leave immediately. About six
Speaker 2: percent of the prison population are over the age of sixty.
Speaker 2: The older prison population is among the most vulnerable to
Speaker 2: severe complications from COVID nineteen. Aging people who are released
Speaker 2: after serving long sentences have a recidivism rate close to zero.
Speaker 2: Miss George points out now what this Coalition for the
Speaker 2: Human Rights of Imprisoned People in Australia. Are call are
Speaker 2: a list and I will run through them now. And
Speaker 2: this is pointing out what would drastically improve this situation.
Speaker 2: All people living and working in prisons must have access
Speaker 2: to health and medical services. Symptoms need to be addressed quickly,
Speaker 2: not once a week or twice a week. They must
Speaker 2: have access to soap and running water to wash their hands.
Speaker 2: Soap should be provided at no cost, i e. It
Speaker 2: should be taken off the list of items only available
Speaker 2: for purchase from prison canteens. And hand sanitizer must be
Speaker 2: removed from contraband lists and made readily available to all bathrooms. Laundry,
Speaker 2: eating and all common areas must be cleaned after each use.
Speaker 2: Prisoners must have access to accommodation that enables them to
Speaker 2: selfide if they so choose accommodation, and facilities with poor
Speaker 2: air circulation need to be improved immediately. Access to fresh
Speaker 2: air and exercise is vital to health. Ban on family
Speaker 2: visits and reductions in prison programs will be counterproductive. All
Speaker 2: efforts must be made to keep prisoners connected with family, community,
Speaker 2: and engaged in activity that promotes mental and physical health. Finally,
Speaker 2: phone calls to friends and family should be free. They
Speaker 2: are very expensive in austral prisons and inaccessible to prisoners
Speaker 2: without money, and video conferencing facilities should be made available
Speaker 2: for remote visits, especially to prisoners with children and elderly
Speaker 2: or vulnerable relatives that they're worried about. And for more
Speaker 2: information on what I've just discussed, you can contact Amanda
Speaker 2: George at Flat Out Ink on two one seven nine
Speaker 2: one eight zero three, that is two one seven nine
Speaker 2: one eight zero three and this information will also be
Speaker 2: added to the curtain of the podcast website. Now that
Speaker 2: goes to the next question of what can actually be done.
Speaker 2: As we're seeing there's many people on social media and
Speaker 2: in the news right around the globe pointing out this
Speaker 2: issue and that people need to be released immediately, but
Speaker 2: simply calling for it won't make it happen. So this
Speaker 2: is where we need people to step up and make
Speaker 2: it possible. Luckily, in Australia, two such organizations are doing
Speaker 2: exactly that, their Prisoner's Legal Service in Queensland and Sisters Inside.
Speaker 2: Now this is some information those two organizations working together
Speaker 2: have provided to us. They state the following categories of
Speaker 2: people in prison are particularly vulnerable to COVID nineteen, people
Speaker 2: with compromised immune systems, such as people who have cancer,
Speaker 2: elderly people, aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander, peoples who obviously
Speaker 2: have higher rates of chronic illness, and people who already
Speaker 2: have chronic medical conditions. Pair Less and Sisters Inside point
Speaker 2: out that there are four categories of people they may
Speaker 2: be able to assist during the COVID nineteen pandemic and
Speaker 2: who are particularly vulnerable. So if you have friends or
Speaker 2: family in this situation, please play close attention. Or if
Speaker 2: you're a prisoner inside and this applies to you, please
Speaker 2: listen so you can know which category you're in and
Speaker 2: how you can be helped. The first is people with
Speaker 2: parole applications lodged already, and what the PLS is saying
Speaker 2: is they can request the parole board fast tracked consideration
Speaker 2: of release, so that's what they'd be working on on
Speaker 2: your behalf. The second category are people who are eligible
Speaker 2: for parole but who have not lodged applications, so both
Speaker 2: PLS and Sisters Inside can help those people to get
Speaker 2: those applications lodged and request it be fast tracked. The
Speaker 2: third category is people with parole suspensions and cancelations. Again,
Speaker 2: PLS and Sisters Inside can request the Parole Board urgently
Speaker 2: lift suspension or cancelation. Anyone with a cancelation should immediately
Speaker 2: lodge a new application Category four people who are not
Speaker 2: eligible for parole for example future parole eligibility or cord
Speaker 2: ordered parole release dates. What PLS and Sisters Inside say
Speaker 2: is we may be able to help with lodging an
Speaker 2: exceptional circumstances parole application and request it to be fast tracked.
Speaker 2: They go on to say, it is unlikely that every
Speaker 2: person who is vulnerable to COVID nineteen will be considered
Speaker 2: suitable for a lease. However, given the unprecedented health risks
Speaker 2: particular people face, we want to hear from people who
Speaker 2: are in prison and vulnerable to COVID nineteen that's the
Speaker 2: coronavirus to assess if we can try and get them
Speaker 2: out on parole. For people in prison, the Prisoner's Legal
Speaker 2: Service can be contacted on the Prisoner URNTA phone system
Speaker 2: as follows those in Capricornia Townsville CC or Lotus Glenn
Speaker 2: CC between the times of nine am to eleven am
Speaker 2: and twelve pm to two pm on Thursday. I'll make
Speaker 2: sure All this information is on the curtain the podcast
Speaker 2: website all other centers in Queensland including BCC, AGCC, Wolston Woodford, MCC,
Speaker 2: SQCC and BWCC. The day is Tuesday and the times
Speaker 2: are nine am to eleven am and twelve pm to
Speaker 2: two pm. I'll point out that the Prisoner's Legal Service
Speaker 2: has recruited extra volunteer lawyers to assist with answering the calls,
Speaker 2: and they're particularly worried about Aboriginal and Torres Strait Island
Speaker 2: are prisoners and also as we know, women who are
Speaker 2: particularly vulnerable in the prison system, and that's where we
Speaker 2: know about the great work of Sisters Inside. And for
Speaker 2: those who don't know, you can go on to the
Speaker 2: Sisters Inside website and I'll give you the address, which
Speaker 2: is Sisters Inside dot com dot au. Or for those
Speaker 2: on Twitter, you might like to contact Debbie Kilroy at
Speaker 2: deb Kilroy. That's her Twitter handle, and that applies both
Speaker 2: to people who may be seeking further help and information
Speaker 2: or for those who wish to donate. And as many
Speaker 2: listeners will know, Debbie has a GoFundMe page that assists women,
Speaker 2: particularly vulnerable women, but all women leave prison as soon
Speaker 2: as possible, and as you will have seen in the media,
Speaker 2: that's particularly related over the last year to people in
Speaker 2: prison purely for outstanding fines, and this is an unacceptable situation.
Speaker 2: We have young mothers, old women, those who have tried
Speaker 2: to escape domestic violence and family violence, who, as we've
Speaker 2: pointed out in this podcast, have called the police for
Speaker 2: assistance and then rather than their abusive partner be arrested,
Speaker 2: they have been taken to prison for unpaid fines. Now
Speaker 2: this is disgraceful at any time, but at the height
Speaker 2: of a global pandemic the likes of which the world
Speaker 2: has not seen for more than one hundred years, this
Speaker 2: is unconscionable. So I'd also urge people to contact their
Speaker 2: local mp both state and federal, the justice ministers and
Speaker 2: attorney generals in every state and territory, and their premiers
Speaker 2: and chief ministers, and demand that the requests of organizations
Speaker 2: like Prisoner's Legal Service and Sisters Inside be listened to.
Speaker 2: This is being done for everybody's well being, as has
Speaker 2: been pointed out by doctors around the globe during a
Speaker 2: global pandemic, we are all in this together, and if
Speaker 2: we place the most vulnerable at further risk. Not only
Speaker 2: are we dressed breaching their human rights. Prison in Australia,
Speaker 2: prison anywhere is not supposed to be a death sentence,
Speaker 2: but we're also placing our community at greater risk. As
Speaker 2: I've pointed out, the cruise ships have been one of
Speaker 2: the largest causes of the spread of this virus. So
Speaker 2: too of events like weddings where people are in close
Speaker 2: proximity and in large groups in a single building. Now
Speaker 2: imagine a prison that's overcrowded, without any hand sanitizer, and
Speaker 2: with many prisoners unable to access even the most basic
Speaker 2: thing like soap and running water. So once again, to
Speaker 2: contact Sisters Inside. That's Sisters Inside dot com dot Au.
Speaker 2: I'll also give you their phone number, which is zero
Speaker 2: seven three eight four four five zero six six. Now,
Speaker 2: for Aboriginal and Terres Strait Islander people right around the country,
Speaker 2: if these organizations are not operating in your area, please
Speaker 2: contact your local als your Aboriginal legal service. For all
Speaker 2: other people, please contact Legal Aid. So each state will
Speaker 2: have a phone number. If you just put Legal Aid
Speaker 2: and your state or territory into Google, those phone numbers
Speaker 2: will come up. If for whatever reason, you are not
Speaker 2: treated appropriately by either Legal Aid, the Aboriginal Legal Service,
Speaker 2: or by your Attorney General or Justice Minister, or by
Speaker 2: corrective services. Then please contact me at curtainthe Podcast at
Speaker 2: gmail dot com. That's Curtainthepodcast at gmail dot com. You
Speaker 2: can also contact me via twet at Martin g Hodgson. Now,
Speaker 2: I'll make sure all this information is available on the
Speaker 2: Curtain the Podcast website and will also be sharing it
Speaker 2: on Twitter and it should be relatively easy for you
Speaker 2: to find. Now for those who are specifically mentioned in
Speaker 2: what I laid out as to what Prisoner's Legal Service
Speaker 2: can assist with, remembering that's the four parole categories, I
Speaker 2: have some email addresses that you can contact directly at
Speaker 2: Prisoner's Legal Service. That will be Katrina Davidson. Her email
Speaker 2: address is Katrina at pls QLD for Queensland dot com.
Speaker 2: For Sisters Inside, that's Katie Katie at Sisters Inside dot
Speaker 2: com dot AU. For people who'd like to contact Prisoner's
Speaker 2: Legal Service, they can do that through their wind site
Speaker 2: as well at www dot pls QLD dot com. Now,
Speaker 2: I'd like to mention that all the organizations I've mentioned
Speaker 2: today except donations, and they need your financial support. This
Speaker 2: work simply cannot be done without it. So if you're
Speaker 2: not someone who has a family member you can be assisting.
Speaker 2: If you're someone who's not able to assist in the
Speaker 2: legal aspects of these cases or assisting in the parole process,
Speaker 2: then what you can do, and what is most beneficial
Speaker 2: above all, is to donate to these organizations. There's donate
Speaker 2: buttons on all their websites as I've listed, and again
Speaker 2: they will be on Curtain thepodcast dot com and you
Speaker 2: can support their vital work. Also, remember that at DeBie
Speaker 2: Kilroy on Twitter has a link to the go fundme
Speaker 2: page that helps women ride around Australia, particularly vulnerable women,
Speaker 2: and we've seen tragic stories highlighted one time after another
Speaker 2: by deb and her workers of women who have been
Speaker 2: victims of all kinds of horrific abuse, domestic and family violence,
Speaker 2: shocking treatment by police, shocking treatment by corrective services. They've
Speaker 2: been successfully released by Sisters Inside through their programming that
Speaker 2: you can help fund through their go Fundme page. The
Speaker 2: Prisoner's Legal Service is a fantastic organization. Solicitor Helen Blaber
Speaker 2: is one of the most experienced and exceptional legal operators
Speaker 2: in this country and she is able to help all
Speaker 2: those who fit into the categories we've mentioned with their
Speaker 2: parole applications with her team of staff, and once again
Speaker 2: she's had enormous success throughout the years and very recently
Speaker 2: on helping the most vulnerable people and right now, in
Speaker 2: a global pandemic that means almost everybody in the prison system.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: One thing I would like to also add. In Australia,
Speaker 2: we have a large migrant population and we also have
Speaker 2: a large population of people who travel around the globe.
Speaker 2: As a result, we see Australians imprisoned overseas. For those
Speaker 2: who have been following the podcast for the number of
Speaker 2: years that it's been on, you'll know my main area
Speaker 2: of work is with Foreign Prisoners dot com. We help
Speaker 2: not only Australians, but all people imprisoned in countries other
Speaker 2: than their own, and all people imprisoned around the globe
Speaker 2: whose human rights are being violated. If you have a
Speaker 2: family member in this situation who is at increase risk
Speaker 2: because of the coronavirus pandemic, if you have an Australian
Speaker 2: family member who is in an overseas prison who is
Speaker 2: not getting the basics that they need to keep themselves
Speaker 2: safe from this virus. You can contact me either through
Speaker 2: www dot Foreign Prisoners dot com or directly at my
Speaker 2: email address Martin dot Hodgson h O d G. S
Speaker 2: O N at Foreign Prisoners dot com. You can also
Speaker 2: find me on Twitter at Marting Hodgson. Again, I'll make
Speaker 2: all these links available. I'll also share it through the
Speaker 2: Curtain the podcast social media platforms which you can find
Speaker 2: on Twitter and Facebook, so that all this information will
Speaker 2: be at your fingertips. So not only am I encouraging
Speaker 2: you to spread this information to all vulnerable peoples, particularly
Speaker 2: the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander community and when and
Speaker 2: impacted by domestic violence and family violence, poverty, and other
Speaker 2: issues that are impacting on their lives, like serious medical
Speaker 2: conditions that make them particularly vulnerable at this time, I
Speaker 2: want you to spread this to everyone. If we're going
Speaker 2: to do what the government says and all be in
Speaker 2: it together, then we have to bring every single member
Speaker 2: of our society with us on this journey as we
Speaker 2: seek to survive this global pandemic and ensure that as
Speaker 2: few people as possible not only contract the virus, but
Speaker 2: die from the virus. Thousands of people are already dead.
Speaker 2: We need to act immediately, so please spread this information,
Speaker 2: share the podcast, and if you have any questions about
Speaker 2: what we may be able to do to help, or
Speaker 2: you need to be put in touch with an organization
Speaker 2: that can help you, please feel free to reach out
Speaker 2: on any of the platforms that I've mentioned and we
Speaker 2: will endeavor to get back to you as soon as possible. Now, finally,
Speaker 2: I do want to mention that Kurt and the podcast
Speaker 2: will be back this year, will be coming back with
Speaker 2: not only some amazing news, but more information on what
Speaker 2: is happening in Australia's prison system, on the cases that
Speaker 2: obviously you've been following, that of Kevin Henry, Derek Bromley,
Speaker 2: Miss Marr and the many others that have been raised
Speaker 2: in this podcast. But for now, we need to focus
Speaker 2: on this global pandemic. The coronavirus has to be our
Speaker 2: number one concern and I hope as you're listening this
Speaker 2: is finding you, hopefully at home safe and we want
Speaker 2: to send a special thank you to all the health
Speaker 2: and medical professionals in Australia and around the globe who
Speaker 2: are keeping us all well looked after and doing their
Speaker 2: absolute best to treat as as many people as possible,
Speaker 2: and we also want to thank all those in our
Speaker 2: community who we know always go above and beyond the
Speaker 2: call of duty at a time of crisis to look
Speaker 2: after the most vulnerable amongst us and make sure that
Speaker 2: they're safe, that they have food and water and all
Speaker 2: the essentials that we need. Not everyone has the privilege
Speaker 2: of simply sitting at home and watching Netflix. If you do,
Speaker 2: then we hope you're well and we hope you will
Speaker 2: use some of your time to share this information. That's
Speaker 2: it for this special episode of Curtain the podcast. Once again,
Speaker 2: Please share it as far and wide as you possibly can,
Speaker 2: and we'll be back with a further update and more
Speaker 2: information as this pandemic continues to unfold. Please stay safe, isolate,
Speaker 2: practice social distancing, and wash your hands. Wash your hands.
Speaker 2: Wash your hands.