Speaker 1: If you get interviewed by Kevin Kelly, sensible footwear is
Speaker 1: a must. No, seriously, the Wired co founder says taking
Speaker 1: a walk with a potential employee or teammate is essential
Speaker 1: for any recruitment process. So what does Kevin ask about
Speaker 1: on this walk? Why is going for a walk so important?
Speaker 1: And what are the key things that Kevin is listening
Speaker 1: out for. My name is doctor Ramantha Imber. I'm an
Speaker 1: organizational psychologist the founder of behavioral science consultancy Inventium, and
Speaker 1: this is how I work, a show about how to
Speaker 1: help you do your best work. On today is my
Speaker 1: favorite Tip episode, we go back to an interview from
Speaker 1: the past and I pick out my favorite tip from
Speaker 1: the interview. So in today's show, I've got an extract
Speaker 1: from my chat with Kevin about how he decides who
Speaker 1: to work with.
Speaker 2: I wish it collaborated even more than I do. I'm
Speaker 2: kind of like more like a solo performer rather than
Speaker 2: a big band. Wired was a big band and it
Speaker 2: was really a lot of fun. Wholwarth was a big band.
Speaker 2: I kind of miss that kind of collaboration with a
Speaker 2: big band. I've done a couple other projects where there
Speaker 2: was more than one person involved in I miss that
Speaker 2: I should be doing more of it. But that's the
Speaker 2: question I keep asking myself. Okay, you know, now that
Speaker 2: I'm sixty eight and a half, what do I want
Speaker 2: to do when I grow up? And do I want to,
Speaker 2: you know, still work with a duet, a small solo performers,
Speaker 2: or do I want to have a band again? And
Speaker 2: then to answer your question of how do I decide, well,
Speaker 2: number one for me is do I really enjoy spending
Speaker 2: a lot of time with these other person or persons
Speaker 2: because we're going to spend a lot of time with them,
Speaker 2: and so that you know, compatibility friendy thing is hugely important.
Speaker 2: And I just simply don't work with people that I
Speaker 2: don't like. It's like no amount of talent is enough
Speaker 2: for me. Life is way too short. So I tend
Speaker 2: to want to work with people that I want to
Speaker 2: be around with and hopefully they're smarter than me, and
Speaker 2: they're always more talented than me, and that makes it fun.
Speaker 1: What else did you think about, like when you were
Speaker 1: recruiting your personal research assistance?
Speaker 2: Well, I one of the things I did when I
Speaker 2: was evaluating them was I gave them and actually paid
Speaker 2: for real work that would be the type that they
Speaker 2: would be doing, so we could evaluate their work. And
Speaker 2: to somebody you said, which is we're hiring for attitude,
Speaker 2: not for skills. That was a motto at Wired, hire
Speaker 2: for attitude, training for skills, because like we were inventing
Speaker 2: the web, there're nobody out of the experience and design
Speaker 2: your programming the web. Because we were inventing it, it didn't exist.
Speaker 2: So the only thing we could really hire for was
Speaker 2: attitude skill, I mean attitude and character and things like that.
Speaker 2: And so that's sort of what I really look for.
Speaker 2: I'd like to go for a long walk with the
Speaker 2: candidates and you know, two things, to work with him,
Speaker 2: to do work, have him do something with us for us,
Speaker 2: and that's work. And then two take a long walk
Speaker 2: with them and just you know, try to get a
Speaker 2: beat on their character. And that covers it.
Speaker 1: What are you talking about on that walk? What are
Speaker 1: some of the questions that you're asking.
Speaker 2: Well, anything except for work. With their hobbies are how
Speaker 2: they how they spend the free time, cosmological questions, what's
Speaker 2: their favorite movie? Just anything except for the work.
Speaker 1: That's an interesting thing that I feel like so few
Speaker 1: people do when they're recruiting new people into a tame Yeah.
Speaker 2: I guess the older I get, the more important it
Speaker 2: is to me for the character. I'm using it loosely
Speaker 2: of people as we work, because in a certain sense,
Speaker 2: it's not that hard to make things. It's hard to
Speaker 2: make things really really great, and there I find that
Speaker 2: extra ten percent or extra one hundred percent, whatever it is.
Speaker 2: It really does come down to character and enjoying the
Speaker 2: time that you're working with other people, because you're going
Speaker 2: to be in overtime and having to work hard, and
Speaker 2: so it wants to be for with people that you
Speaker 2: respect and admire, and those kind of things are to
Speaker 2: me crucial. I think money, even lots of money, is
Speaker 2: way overrated, and making money is sort of actually not difficult,
Speaker 2: but making something that you're proud of and doing it
Speaker 2: better each time is difficult. And so the character, the
Speaker 2: experience that we have, the human relationships that we have,
Speaker 2: all we're doing it to me become more and more
Speaker 2: important than just the achievement of At the end, it's
Speaker 2: kind of like, you know, the old thing about the
Speaker 2: journey is more impressive, more important than the destiny. And
Speaker 2: you know, like thinking back to Wired or whatever. We're
Speaker 2: very proud of those issues, but I have to tell
Speaker 2: you some of those issues I've completely forgotten even what
Speaker 2: we said, but I have not forgotten the people and
Speaker 2: the interactions that we had while we were doing it.
Speaker 1: How I Work is produced by Inventingum with production support
Speaker 1: from Dead Set Studios and a big thank you to
Speaker 1: Martin Nimber, who does the audio mix for every episode.
Speaker 1: That is it for today's show, and I'll see you
Speaker 1: next time.