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Speaker 1: Well as we know, Australians voted and the Voice referendum

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Speaker 1: was rejected by a majority of voters in every state

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Speaker 1: after millions of Australians backed the no vote, rejecting a

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Speaker 1: constitutionally enshrined Indigenous advisory body.

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Speaker 2: Now here in the Northern Territory.

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Speaker 1: As of early this morning, sixty three point four percent

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Speaker 1: of those votes had been counted, sixty point five percent

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Speaker 1: had voted No, thirty nine point five percent had voted yes.

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Speaker 1: Interestingly supporting some of our more remote areas, Indigenous communities

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Speaker 1: did vote yes. So across more than eleven thousand votes

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Speaker 1: cast in of the in the twenty AEC remote location

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Speaker 1: polling teams in the Northern Territory, we'll support for the

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Speaker 1: Yes campaign was seventy four percent, so interesting numbers. Now

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Speaker 1: joining me on the line is Labour's member for Lingiari,

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Speaker 1: Marian Scrimjaw. Good morning to you, Marion.

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Speaker 3: Good morning Katie. How are you not bad?

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Speaker 1: How are you feeling today as you reflect on the

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Speaker 1: referendum results.

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Speaker 3: Oh look a bit tired, but I also feel, you know,

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Speaker 3: when we look at those percentages across the bush and

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Speaker 3: the regions, I think, including you know, Alice Springs Catherine,

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Speaker 3: you know, all of those areas within Linkiari whilst there

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Speaker 3: was you know, a no vote that came into some

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Speaker 3: of the regional areas. More importantly in the Bush there

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Speaker 3: was a strong push for yes and that what that

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Speaker 3: was was Aboriginal people saying we want recognition, but we

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Speaker 3: want governments to listen to what is happening in our

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Speaker 3: remote communities. And you know, I've had a number of

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Speaker 3: conversations with a number of people since that day night

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Speaker 3: and the result nationally, but what does this mean for

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Speaker 3: the territory and how do we continue that journey to

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Speaker 3: fix up you know, some of those intractable issues that

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Speaker 3: we see on the ground in our community because our

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Speaker 3: communities want change. You know, a number of women were saying,

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Speaker 3: we don't want to see our young people in Darwin,

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Speaker 3: Catherine Tennant, Alice running a muck. We want them back

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Speaker 3: home and engaged in our rebuilding our communities. We want

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Speaker 3: them to be good people. We don't want them to be,

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Speaker 3: you know, in trouble. So you know, communities want to

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Speaker 3: be part of that solution, Katie, and that you know

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Speaker 3: I'm going to whilst you know, the rest of Australia

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Speaker 3: there's been a clean novos. I'm going to use the

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Speaker 3: opportunity for the Bush to at least look at We've

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Speaker 3: got to stop weaponizing our Bush communities for political gain.

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Speaker 3: So how do we all work together to try and

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Speaker 3: get and make sure that Aboriginal people what they want.

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Speaker 3: Let's let's put our collective effort towards fixing us, you know,

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Speaker 3: some of those issues rather than taking rabbit down rabbit

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Speaker 3: holes and you know, playing politics with you know, whether

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Speaker 3: it's child sexual abuse, whether it's you know, land council.

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Speaker 3: Let's work together to fix our health, education, housing, let's

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Speaker 3: give young people a job. That's what That's what communities

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Speaker 3: were saying to us that, Marian.

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Speaker 2: Do we really need a voice?

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Speaker 1: So, you know, like the thing is, do we really

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Speaker 1: need a voice to be able to make that happen?

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Speaker 1: I mean, we've got people like you on the ground.

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Speaker 1: We have got indigenous politicians with incredibly loud and strong

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Speaker 1: voices out there representing their community. And I guess what

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Speaker 1: we saw over the weekend is a lot of people

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Speaker 1: around Australia saying that no, they didn't feel we needed that.

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Speaker 2: So like we're to from here from your perspective.

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Speaker 3: No, I think what what everyone was saying was they

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Speaker 3: voted no because they just felt that there was no

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Speaker 3: there was very little information about what this all meant.

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Speaker 3: I think what I heard from a lot of people

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Speaker 3: was we absolutely support recognition and that's what Aboriginal people wanted.

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Speaker 3: But the listening part, I think, you know, breaking that

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Speaker 3: down so that people understood. Now Aboriginal people understood that, Katie,

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Speaker 3: we didn't put words in Aboriginal people's mounds because this

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Speaker 3: has been a long journey of Aboriginal people talking about

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Speaker 3: and I get and a lot of people have said,

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Speaker 3: but you're their voice in Canberra, absolutely, but I also

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Speaker 3: need their voices to say to both governments, the Northern

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Speaker 3: Charity and the Commonwealth government, we're sick of looking at

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Speaker 3: you know, and being blamed for the bad outcomes when

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Speaker 3: really ninety percent of the services and the funding into

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Speaker 3: our communities come from government to send me, isn't it

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Speaker 3: making a mark here?

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Speaker 2: One hundred percent?

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Speaker 1: I absolutely agree with you on that, you know, and

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Speaker 1: I think that so many people feel the same, that

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Speaker 1: there is so much money being poured into different services

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Speaker 1: and making a difference, but it doesn't seem to be

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Speaker 1: doing what it's supposed to do.

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Speaker 2: So do we need an audit.

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Speaker 3: Well, we need to have a look at So I've

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Speaker 3: been able to you know, what this referendum has done

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Speaker 3: is allowed us to really peel back what's been happening

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Speaker 3: and what is you know, transpiring on the ground and

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Speaker 3: whil you know. I've had numerous conversations with common Wealth ministers,

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Speaker 3: with anti ministers. We've got to get faired income about this, Katie.

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Speaker 3: We can't keep saying, you know. And my fear is

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Speaker 3: if we have another audit, if we have another Royal commission,

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Speaker 3: the money that goes into these things, that's the money

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Speaker 3: that we should be better targeting of those services and

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Speaker 3: remote communities. Communities know what they want and it's up

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Speaker 3: to government to listen to that. So I'm going to

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Speaker 3: make sure that my voice is heard loud and clear

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Speaker 3: and will take those messages of the hopes that Aboriginal

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Speaker 3: people want to change the trajectory of their young people,

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Speaker 3: including young people who voted for the first time. Katie. Yep,

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Speaker 3: that's what I got said about Saturday night. I had

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Speaker 3: a lot of conversations with young people, young Aboriginal people

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Speaker 3: who had a lot of aspirations and what they want

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Speaker 3: to do. I don't want to lose that. I want

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Speaker 3: to make sure that I don't want to see those

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Speaker 3: young people ending up in Darwin and then ending up

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Speaker 3: in jail or anywhere else. I want them to become

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Speaker 3: productive citizens in their community and they become the next

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Speaker 3: leaders to be able to turn our communities around. And

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Speaker 3: we can do this now using what happened with this

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Speaker 3: referendum to turn that in a positive way, not in

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Speaker 3: a negative way, but to continue a journey with our

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Speaker 3: mom and you know I always said we need, you know,

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Speaker 3: non Aboriginal Australians to continue this journey with us, because

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Speaker 3: it's an important journey and it's one that's the only

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Speaker 3: way we're going to rebuild our community's cases.

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Speaker 1: Marion, it is a disastrous result for the Prime Minister.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the no vote has claimed majority support in

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Speaker 1: every state by the look of things, aside from the Act.

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Speaker 1: I've no doubt that there'll be more up to date

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Speaker 1: figures today.

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Speaker 2: But do you.

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Speaker 1: Regret that this wasn't sort of separated so that you know,

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Speaker 1: the referendum wasn't just a question or could have been

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Speaker 1: just a question about constitutional recognition and then maybe working

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Speaker 1: through an Advisory Body rather than putting both of those

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Speaker 1: two things together.

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Speaker 3: Katie, can I you know, like the Yularu statement of

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Speaker 3: the Heart and what was given to the Prime Minister

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Speaker 3: was from Aboriginal people. That statement and that sentiment comes

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Speaker 3: from us. It didn't. It wasn't something that the Prime

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Speaker 3: Minister or the government just decided to go with. So

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Speaker 3: you know, as I said yesterday, I am proud to

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Speaker 3: stand with the Prime Minister and with Minister Bernie and

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Speaker 3: all of my colleagues in the Federal Parliament. I think

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Speaker 3: the Prime Minister's conviction in terms of that is unquestionable.

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Speaker 3: And I know that there are many people who will

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Speaker 3: unpack over the next couple of days. Everyone needs to

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Speaker 3: blame somebody, and I think at the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: he was courageous, he was brave. He could have said,

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Speaker 3: the polls are going in the wrong direction, let's stop this,

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Speaker 3: but he didn't because Aboriginal people and those voices kept

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Speaker 3: telling and I heard it in all the travels throughout

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Speaker 3: the Northern Arity. People kept saying, we need to keep going,

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Speaker 3: Let's try and push through that. And that's what I think.

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Speaker 3: We thought that it was going to be okay. We

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Speaker 3: were up against a campaign that you know, in a

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Speaker 3: lot of these areas, I think it's like the perfect

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Speaker 3: Tom came, you know, the cost of living. There were

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Speaker 3: always some of these other issues that impacted on people,

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Speaker 3: and this was just another way to send a message

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Speaker 3: to government that people were not happy. And I think

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Speaker 3: it was unfortunate because the very people who and I'm

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Speaker 3: hearing this a lot from Aboriginal people that I'm talking to,

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Speaker 3: they just feel that once again they've been weaponized and

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Speaker 3: news because you know, people didn't feel good, and people

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Speaker 3: didn't understand, and people didn't know, you know, we are

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Speaker 3: running three percent of the population. There should have been

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Speaker 3: more talking with and I think, you know, if you

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Speaker 3: look at the campaign, you know, yes, twenty three. I

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Speaker 3: think all of those campaigns, people did some fantastic work

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Speaker 3: and conversations with people.

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Speaker 1: Marion, I've got to be honest. They're sure will be,

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Speaker 1: but I tell you what, you know, one of the

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Speaker 1: one of the areas where I think that you know

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Speaker 1: that people were a bit let down, and you may

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Speaker 1: not agree with me, is I think that for a

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Speaker 1: lot of us, you know, we do believe that Indigenous

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Speaker 1: people absolutely deserve that constitutional recognition. I put it on

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Speaker 1: the table. I voted yes. But one of the things

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Speaker 1: that I was hearing from a lot of people on

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Speaker 1: this show is that that basically the government was asking

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Speaker 1: Australians to trust them. Then when it came down to

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Speaker 1: how it would all work and how that advisory body

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Speaker 1: would work when placing trust in politicians is not something

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Speaker 1: that a lot of Australians feel comfortable with.

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Speaker 3: And look, it was it was asking Australian to take

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Speaker 3: a big leap of faith. You're absolutely right, Katie. I'm

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Speaker 3: not disagreeing with you. But if you have a look

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Speaker 3: at and if any of us who look at if

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Speaker 3: you look at the Constitution, and I must have bet

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Speaker 3: I hadn't up until this, you know you're going through this.

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Speaker 3: It's a pretty boring and cut dry constant. You know.

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Speaker 3: It's a document that was drafted in nineteen oh one,

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Speaker 3: I think or nineteen and in that document, for example,

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Speaker 3: and this is what I said, you know, I said,

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Speaker 3: I have conversations with people. It allows the government to,

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Speaker 3: for example, to tax its citizens. Now in the Constitution

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Speaker 3: it doesn't go into detail about that, but it leads

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Speaker 3: that to the Parliament. And that's I think the same

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Speaker 3: as the voice while it's in the Constitution, the development

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Speaker 3: and the process and the you know, the framework in

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Speaker 3: which the voice become we'll be up to the Parliament.

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Speaker 3: Now we had had I heard the Prime Minister, I

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Speaker 3: heard Minister Bernie. There was conversations with the broader community,

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Speaker 3: but people kept running this thing. We need more information,

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Speaker 3: we need more information. Well that information was going to

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Speaker 3: come in a bipartisan way with both governments. Now, very

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Speaker 3: early in the piece, Katie, the leader of the Opposition,

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Speaker 3: was invited by the Prime Minister to have a discussion

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Speaker 3: and to talk with the referendum group. That had happened,

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Speaker 3: but still we saw, you know, the coalition walk away

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Speaker 3: from this. We can't change what's happened on Saturday night, Katie.

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Speaker 3: We can't change that, but we can change how we

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Speaker 3: go forward in the Northern Territory. And that's what I

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Speaker 3: want to do. I want to turn you know, I'm

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Speaker 3: committed to making sure that the territory gets the best

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Speaker 3: deal out of all of this, and that's what I'm

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Speaker 3: going to you know, set about making sure that happens.

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Speaker 1: The Northern Territory has been used a lot in the

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Speaker 1: debate in the lead up to the referendum, and our

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Speaker 1: issues were constantly referenced. Do you lay any blame on

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Speaker 1: the Northern Territory government and their inability to get social

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Speaker 1: and you know, crime issues under control.

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Speaker 3: Look, all of those issues were well and truly weaponized, Katie,

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Speaker 3: and that's unfortunate because people at Bush saw that and

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Speaker 3: the message to me was we want better house and

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Speaker 3: we want better health, we want better education. So I'm

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Speaker 3: going to make sure that the Northern Territory government they

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Speaker 3: aren't just going to be sitting on their laurels here.

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Speaker 3: They need to show the Northern Territory why they are

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Speaker 3: the elected government. And it's not just the federal government. Yes,

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Speaker 3: we need to resource and we need to work in

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Speaker 3: partnership with the terroratory government to get the best outcome.

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Speaker 3: But absolutely, I think the crime and there are other issues.

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Speaker 3: People were feeling pretty demoralized, and I think that vote

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Speaker 3: in Darwin. Look, I wasn't surprised Katie at the vote

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Speaker 3: in Darwin and in the rural area, I know people

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Speaker 3: were pretty cranky. But what I'm heartened by is the

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Speaker 3: vote in Nallice Springs. And whilst the no vote you

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Speaker 3: know had you know, taken and won in terms of

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Speaker 3: Ellas Springs. If you break that down, it gives your

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Speaker 3: hope that you know, there's been a lot of work

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Speaker 3: done in and around Central Australia, Nalys Springs. We need

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Speaker 3: to now do that for the rest of the territory.

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Speaker 1: Marian you said just a moment ago that the Northern

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Speaker 1: Territory government needs to show the people of the territory

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Speaker 1: why they were elected when it comes to some of

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Speaker 1: these issues. What do you think they need to do,

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Speaker 1: because you know, if you talk to a lot of

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Speaker 1: Territorians right now, they are feeling like things are out

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Speaker 1: of control. You and I have spoken about it before,

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Speaker 1: but it is a huge issue and I can't help

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Speaker 1: but think that you know, those social issues that we

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Speaker 1: are having, those criminal issues that we are having, that

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Speaker 1: they have impacted the way in which people have voted

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Speaker 1: locally where they're thinking to themselves, well, you know, we're

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Speaker 1: continuing to pour money into various different organizations, but we

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Speaker 1: are not seeing any change. In fact, many arguing that

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Speaker 1: things are getting worse on the ground.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and look, you know I've seen evidence of some

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Speaker 3: of that, Katie. I spoke to the Chief Minister and

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Speaker 3: message after the vote. After I returned from Camberra. I

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Speaker 3: am going to go to down and meet with the

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Speaker 3: Chief Minister because they have to put you know, like

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Speaker 3: there's got to be some fundamental shifts and the anti

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Speaker 3: cabinet ministers are elected to listen and to act on

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Speaker 3: behalf of territoriums and.

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Speaker 2: Do you think they're doing that.

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Speaker 3: I think that people have stopped listening and acting and

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Speaker 3: you know they they will get cranky with me for that,

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Speaker 3: but look, I think that all of us are not

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Speaker 3: above criticism and we all need to pull our weight

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Speaker 3: and to make sure that we get the best outcomfort Territoriines.

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Speaker 3: I know a lot of people in Darwin are not

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Speaker 3: happy and I've seen that, Katie. I've spoken to you

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Speaker 3: several times. You know, we've got to fix up some

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Speaker 3: of these issues. And I think if you, if I've

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Speaker 3: said this in Central Australia, if you starve the bush,

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Speaker 3: if you stop putting the funding and the resources in

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Speaker 3: the bush, the bush is going to come into town.

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Speaker 3: And that's what's happened. We saw the issues and the

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Speaker 3: fighting and the unrest in what is a lot of

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Speaker 3: those young people have moved into Darwin and that's why

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Speaker 3: we're seeing the issues that we're.

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Speaker 2: Seeing, CLARONO.

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Speaker 3: We've got to take some strong Standenrica in relation to

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Speaker 3: that and solutions and fix that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we certainly do. Before I let you go, because

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Speaker 1: we are fast running out of time. But before I

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Speaker 1: let you go. There is speculation in the Australian newspaper

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Speaker 1: today that some within the Labor Party are pushing for

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Speaker 1: Linda Bernie to stand down and Malandarie McCarthy to step

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Speaker 1: up as the Minister for Indigenous Affairs.

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Speaker 2: Is this something that you'd support happening?

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Speaker 3: Look, I support both of these women, Katie. I have

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Speaker 3: huge and a lot of respect for both Linda Bernie

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Speaker 3: and Melanderie McCarthy. Linda had an unenviable cask and I

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Speaker 3: said that to her at the outset of this referendum,

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Speaker 3: she will carry the burden of our people and not

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Speaker 3: just in the territory but across this nation. And she

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Speaker 3: has my hundred percent support, just like Melanderi McCarthy. We

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Speaker 3: went into this knowing it was going to be tough,

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Speaker 3: and both of these women were dignified and they carried

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Speaker 3: this with the dignity and with the integrity that we

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Speaker 3: knew that both of them were capable.

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Speaker 1: Of Marrion, just very quickly before I let you go

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Speaker 1: to those out there listening this morning who did vote

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Speaker 1: yes and a feeling quite disheartened. To Indigenous people who

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Speaker 1: are maybe feeling pretty disappointed and distressed today, watch your

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Speaker 1: message to them.

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Speaker 3: Look, hang in there, you know, I just have faith,

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Speaker 3: a bitch. There will be some solutions. I will be

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Speaker 3: putting out a statement soon too, all of those communities, Katie,

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Speaker 3: I just say to everyone in the territory, don't lose faith.

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Speaker 3: We will. You know, it's a long, hard slog, but

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Speaker 3: we're on a journey now and we need to we

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Speaker 3: need to make sure that we don't lose sight of

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Speaker 3: what we have to fix.

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Speaker 1: Marion Scrimjaw, I always appreciate your time, no doubt we'll

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Speaker 1: talk to you again very soon.

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Speaker 2: No worry, Thank you, thank you,