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Speaker 1: Jumps with Jones and Amanda.

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Speaker 2: Well, what a big twenty four hours in America and

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Speaker 2: across the world. Voting is now closed, counting underway. Frightening

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Speaker 2: speech by President Trump last night. He's not going to

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Speaker 2: let this go if he doesn't win, he said, he

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Speaker 2: claimed victory. Well at the same time denouncing the whole

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Speaker 2: thing is a fraud.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 2: Hugh Rimington, who's the National Affairs editor and are US correspondent? Hugh, Hello, Hello, Amanda,

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Speaker 2: Oh crikey, where do we even start? Well, actually, let's

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Speaker 2: start with where we are in the counting. Who's doing

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Speaker 2: what and who's winning.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's a knife edge, it still is. So they've

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Speaker 1: just declared Wisconsin for Biden and that brings his electoral

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Speaker 1: vote numbers up to two hundred and forty eight. Of

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Speaker 1: course two seventy being the magic number if you They've

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Speaker 1: still got North Carolina and Georgia are still declared as

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Speaker 1: too close to call, but they're leaning pretty solidly to Trump.

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Speaker 1: So you add in those onto the Trump column and

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Speaker 1: you've got Biden at two forty eight and trumpet two

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Speaker 1: forty five. So it's it. Really there's Michigan in play

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Speaker 1: that will probably go to Biden. That would take him

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Speaker 1: up to two sixty four, cantializing the close. But then

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Speaker 1: you start to look around and say, what else has

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Speaker 1: he got? They could get him across the line, get

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Speaker 1: him up to two seventy. It all comes back, as

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Speaker 1: we said from the start to Pennsylvania. If he gets

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Speaker 1: that face of it right now, if you president, and

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Speaker 1: if he doesn't, he won't be Wow.

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Speaker 3: Is it true if a candidate comes within one percentage

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Speaker 3: point of the winner, they can request to recant.

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Speaker 1: That's true, and it has already been signaled by the Republican

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Speaker 1: camp that they are going to request a recount. In Wisconsin.

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Speaker 1: There's twenty thousand votes more or less just under twenty

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Speaker 1: one thousand votes that Biden has got a head there,

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Speaker 1: so that's within the margin. But they can't formally begin

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Speaker 1: the recount until ten days after the poll, so you know,

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Speaker 1: even if that gets resolved or overturned, it'll still be

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Speaker 1: something which will we'll leave us up in the air. Normally,

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Speaker 1: these recounts on prior history in a state of the size,

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Speaker 1: generally it's votes in the hundreds, not in the tens

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Speaker 1: of thousands, So probably that would with stand and recount,

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Speaker 1: But there's also just been announced by the Republicans a

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Speaker 1: plan to or that there's taking legal action right now

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Speaker 1: excuse me, to to stop the vote count in Michigan.

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Speaker 1: Their argument is is that voting has been done without

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Speaker 1: them having the equivalent of what we would call scrutineers

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Speaker 1: in there, so with all this talk of fraud, and

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Speaker 1: so they want the vote counted, and they want all

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Speaker 1: the votes that were counted when they weren't in there

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Speaker 1: to be scrutineers to be put aside and then to

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Speaker 1: be recounted again. So the lawyers are going at it.

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Speaker 1: I have to say one thing. Donald Trump said in

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Speaker 1: the small hours of the morning that he was going

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Speaker 1: to go to the Supreme Court today to challenge the

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Speaker 1: whole thing because of all the frauds, etc. Well, they're

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Speaker 1: not in the Supreme Court today, so that was a set.

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Speaker 1: They are taking their picking up using electoral law at

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Speaker 1: state level. There are some challenges coming to recount the

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Speaker 1: Michigan matter. There may be others yet to come, but

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Speaker 1: there's certainly no kind of stampeding lawyers going into the

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Speaker 1: Supreme Court saying the whole thing is a fraud.

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Speaker 3: Call it off because I thought for a minute when

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Speaker 3: Donald Trump made his announcement, when he I thought he

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Speaker 3: was going to concede for a moment there, then he

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Speaker 3: just went the other way, kind of went the other way.

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Speaker 1: Did he's not the conceding type. I don't think what.

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Speaker 3: I just thought it was.

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Speaker 1: Interesting there too. Yeahs he said. What he was actually

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Speaker 1: constructing there was an utterly bogus conspiracy thing, because he said,

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Speaker 1: we're going to go into the Supreme Court to stop

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Speaker 1: new votes being being cast. Basically I can't remember, I

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Speaker 1: don't know exact words in front of me, So he

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Speaker 1: wasn't really saying he wanted to stop the counter but

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Speaker 1: he was stopping the voting. Now there's no one still voting,

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Speaker 1: So he was creating essentially a straw man type of

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Speaker 1: argument that there are still people they're after the polls

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Speaker 1: closed voting, And he made a reference to people you know,

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Speaker 1: you know, votes appearing out of nowhere to get across

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Speaker 1: the line, in other words, saying there's some sort of

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Speaker 1: a conspiracy machine. In fact, one of the Trump lawyers

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Speaker 1: was on Fox News overnight talking about ballot boxes being

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Speaker 1: stuffed with bogus votes. Now, there's absolutely no evidence that

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Speaker 1: any of that is going on, and electoral officials at

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Speaker 1: the state level have been saying, look, you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: making it clear, here's what we've got. We've got the

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Speaker 1: votes that have come in. Here in the laws, we

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Speaker 1: count the votes. But it was a remarkable thing for

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Speaker 1: a president to say on an election liner an the.

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Speaker 2: Other side, absolutely, and I think a lot of people

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Speaker 2: are shocked this morning that after all the four years

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Speaker 2: of Donald Trump, that America is still this is still

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Speaker 2: so close. It's horrifying to a lot of people that

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Speaker 2: this is the way it's going. No matter who wins.

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Speaker 2: This doesn't give anyone a clear mandate.

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Speaker 1: No, that's true. That the it looks like the Democrats

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Speaker 1: will hold the House. The Senate is likely to be

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Speaker 1: held still by the Republicans. Right now, the presidency'd say,

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Speaker 1: is too close to call. What we've seen is, after

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Speaker 1: this enormous effort, after the huge division that Trump represents,

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Speaker 1: he's loathed, he has loved in equal measure, is America

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Speaker 1: has got out with their shovels and confronted with this

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Speaker 1: opportunity to vote, What in fact they've done is enormous numbers.

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Speaker 1: They have dune deeper and deeper trenches from which to

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Speaker 1: gaze out over a kind of a barbei no man's

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Speaker 1: land at each other. This is a country that, given

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Speaker 1: the opportunity, has stated, hell, yes we're divided, and just

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Speaker 1: to be sure, we're more divided than ever.

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Speaker 3: It's in their DNA.

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Speaker 1: Though.

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Speaker 3: When you look at America, you're talking about a country

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Speaker 3: since its inception, has been at peace for only fifteen

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Speaker 3: years out of its whole time, and you look at

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Speaker 3: the litany of race wars, the troubles that they've had.

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Speaker 3: This is actually, I don't know, white people are surprised

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Speaker 3: about this, but.

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Speaker 2: A good politicians like a good parent, and does their

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Speaker 2: best to manage it. We've had four years of the opposite, I.

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Speaker 3: Know, but it's you know, what can you do? Where

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Speaker 3: just done the ride?

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Speaker 1: Man?

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Speaker 2: When do you think we might have a resolution here?

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean they are already talking about, you know,

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Speaker 1: the thirty I think it was thirty four days of

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Speaker 1: the Supreme Court ultimately resolving two thousand with a George

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Speaker 1: Bush al Gore election. It could well come to that

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Speaker 1: in Pennsylvania. By the way, the Trump camp is quite

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Speaker 1: confident they're going to hold Pennsylvania, and in fact their

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Speaker 1: prediction is a forty thousand vote majority their way, which

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Speaker 1: is exactly where it was when they went into this election.

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Speaker 1: It was forty four thousand when they went into the selection.

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Speaker 1: So they're confident they'll get it. And if that does

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Speaker 1: go to Trump, you know, probably there'll be less litigation

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Speaker 1: because if Trump gets his nose in front and the

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Speaker 1: numbers are there, he'll probably you know, trying to shut

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Speaker 1: all that down and own it. If it seems to

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Speaker 1: go the other way on the evidence out of Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump's mouth, he will litigate as hard as he can.

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Speaker 3: Wow, I'll tell you what, there wouldn't be those fake votes.

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Speaker 3: If there wasn't for those pesky voters.

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Speaker 1: You.

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Speaker 3: Didn't have voters, you wouldn't have fake votes.

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Speaker 1: It's on mischief, but not on the scale, not on

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Speaker 1: this girl he's talking about.

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Speaker 3: Hugh, it's great for you to talk to us. I

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Speaker 3: know you've been working twenty four hours. Thank you for joining.

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Speaker 2: You appreciate it.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Hugh, absolute pleasure, love your show.

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Speaker 2: Thank you very much.

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Speaker 1: We've joined the and Amanda