1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,360 Speaker 1: Yesterday we heard the COLP plans to scrap Labour's portable 2 00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: long service leave laws for the community services sector. Now. 3 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:12,320 Speaker 1: The scheme would have allowed employees in sectors including childcare, 4 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 1: aged care and disability services to accumulate long service leave 5 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:22,439 Speaker 1: benefits without having to maintain continuous employment with a single employer. 6 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:26,240 Speaker 1: The Minister for Public Service, Joe Hersey said the scheme 7 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: was not properly budgeted for, with set up costs alone 8 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:33,839 Speaker 1: estimated to be between four to twelve million dollars, and 9 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:37,120 Speaker 1: the Northern Territory government would have borne the brunt. The 10 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:41,559 Speaker 1: Australian Services Union slammed the colp's decision, warning that it's 11 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:46,479 Speaker 1: going to exasperate workforce retention issues and send the Northern 12 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,839 Speaker 1: Territory backwards. Now joining me on the line is the 13 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:54,880 Speaker 1: union's organizing lead for the Northern Territory branch, Dan Spencer. 14 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 2: Good morning, Dan, Good morning Katie. Thanks for having me. 15 00:00:58,240 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much for your time. 16 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:00,279 Speaker 2: Dan. 17 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 1: Firstly, can you explain how the portable long service scheme works? 18 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:08,960 Speaker 2: Yeah? Absolutely so. Where As a union and our members 19 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 2: across the territory are really concerned about this decision to 20 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 2: scrap portable long service leave. It's something that workers throughout 21 00:01:15,480 --> 00:01:19,280 Speaker 2: the community and disability services sector we're really actually looking 22 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 2: forward to being able to take, and now it's being 23 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 2: taken away. So the way it would work is, you know, 24 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:28,119 Speaker 2: workers in this sector move around a lot often because 25 00:01:28,160 --> 00:01:31,680 Speaker 2: of government changes. They might be doing the exact same 26 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:35,920 Speaker 2: job working, for example, in a domestic violence shelter. Employer changes. 27 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 2: This would mean that they'd carry over their long service 28 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 2: leave with them be paid through a central authority with 29 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 2: a small levee on employers, rather than the employers holding 30 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 2: onto the long service leave entitlement on their balance book. 31 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 1: Yeah. Right, So I mean I understand, like I understand 32 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:55,680 Speaker 1: that it would also see those employers pay that levy 33 00:01:55,720 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: to a central funder each quarter and employees would have 34 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:03,320 Speaker 1: access their long servicely from that fund. I mean it 35 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:06,280 Speaker 1: sort of sounds like it sounds a little bit complex, 36 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 1: I guess, you know, for people listening. 37 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:12,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think it's important to remember that schemes 38 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 2: like this have existed in the Northern Territory and across 39 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:19,240 Speaker 2: Australia for a very long time. Portable long service leave 40 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 2: already exists in the construction industry and in community and 41 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 2: disability Services Victoria, Queensland. The Act have had this for years. 42 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,400 Speaker 2: It's about to start in South Australia and New South 43 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:35,919 Speaker 2: Wales this July. So this is actually taking territory workers backwards. 44 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,080 Speaker 2: We already see from our membership people often come to 45 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:42,359 Speaker 2: the territory or if they're from there, they consider moving 46 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:45,160 Speaker 2: to other states anyway because the working conditions are better. 47 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 2: So we need to be doing all we can to 48 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 2: retain these essential workers. And you know, if you're looking 49 00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:53,760 Speaker 2: to move to Queensland, for example, as a community worker, 50 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 2: you're going to get better entitlements than you're doing the territory. 51 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I mean the last thing we want is 52 00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:00,040 Speaker 1: for them to be moving to other states or to 53 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 1: not be able to you know, to entice people to 54 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: the Northern Territory. I guess the difficult part is, you know, 55 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 1: the government is well and truly in debt, but how 56 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 1: big an impact do you think this could potentially have 57 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:12,040 Speaker 1: on the workforce. 58 00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:15,520 Speaker 2: This is a huge impact. It's going to impact tens 59 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:18,639 Speaker 2: of thousands of workers across the territory. Just to give 60 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 2: an example, we know some members who've worked in the 61 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 2: sector for going on twenty years, but they've never been 62 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 2: able to take long service ly before, they've never been 63 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 2: able to take a break. This is a workforce that's 64 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 2: historically relatively low paid, it's female dominated, and we already 65 00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 2: struggle to keep people in these essential frontline roles. We're 66 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 2: talking about some really difficult jobs, things like family domestic violence, 67 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 2: things like supporting some of the most vulnerable young people 68 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 2: in the state. Every workplace we visit, people are really 69 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 2: excited and looking forward to actually being able to take 70 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:54,720 Speaker 2: a break so they can stay in the sector and 71 00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 2: not burn out. And so this is going to be 72 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 2: a real kick in the guts for those workers. 73 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, right, And in addition to all of those fundamental workers, 74 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 1: it's also it is also childcare workers and those working 75 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:08,040 Speaker 1: in aged care and those kinds of areas as well, 76 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: isn't it. 77 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. So the territory scheme will apply to 78 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:15,880 Speaker 2: it was going to apply to a range of different industries, 79 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:19,159 Speaker 2: but they all have in common that they're relatively well paid, 80 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:23,840 Speaker 2: not always the most secure forms of work, and female 81 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:24,839 Speaker 2: dominated sectors. 82 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: Dan, do you have any idea how many Territorians are 83 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 1: going to be impacted by this? 84 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:35,600 Speaker 2: So we estimate those north of ten thousand workers just 85 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:40,040 Speaker 2: in the social and community services sector within the Northern Territory. 86 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 2: So we're talking tens of thousands at some really major employers. 87 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:48,160 Speaker 2: The community services sector is a major industry and major 88 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 2: employer in the territory, and there's a lot of unmet 89 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:54,719 Speaker 2: need in the territory. We don't want to see services 90 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 2: armed as a result of this because workers are going 91 00:04:57,160 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 2: to leave the sector. 92 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 1: The Northern Territory government had seen that the scheme would 93 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 1: see costs increase, you know, childcare centers, for example, an 94 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: extra fifty thousand dollars a year which was going to 95 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:10,320 Speaker 1: then have to be passed on to families. I mean, 96 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:11,600 Speaker 1: what's your take on that. 97 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 2: I think that's a bit of a faur fee. To 98 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:18,040 Speaker 2: be honest, employers already need to be budgeting for a 99 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:21,480 Speaker 2: worker's long service leave entitlement. What we're talking about is 100 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 2: a small change in how that would operate, being a 101 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:27,279 Speaker 2: levee that would be paid into this central fund rather 102 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:32,040 Speaker 2: than the childcare center or the MNGO employer whoever it is, 103 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:36,640 Speaker 2: keeping those money set aside on their balance sheet to 104 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,440 Speaker 2: be able to pay their long long term staff long 105 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 2: service leave. So they should already have. 106 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 1: The money and so I mean where too from here? 107 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 1: Are you going to catch up with the minister if 108 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:48,039 Speaker 1: you put in a request to speak with her to 109 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:50,080 Speaker 1: try and talk these through, or do you think it's 110 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 1: done and dust it. 111 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 2: We're going to be doing all we can as a 112 00:05:53,839 --> 00:05:57,160 Speaker 2: union with our members across the territory to try and 113 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 2: get the CLP to reverse this decision. Only be asking 114 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 2: for urgent meetings to get them to try and get 115 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 2: them to change their minds. But yeah, this is a real, 116 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 2: really outrageous attack on workers, right, I'm not the territory. 117 00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 1: Look, I know some people listening this morning might be saying, 118 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 1: you know, if I if I stay in the same sector, 119 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:19,839 Speaker 1: but I change jobs, so I'm not entitled to long service. 120 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 1: Even quite often when people look at these decisions, you know, 121 00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:25,760 Speaker 1: they think about their own situation. But I know for me, 122 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:28,719 Speaker 1: you know, the childcare center where my kids went to 123 00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:30,800 Speaker 1: its many years ago now, but there was women who 124 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:33,280 Speaker 1: work there and have worked there for years and years. 125 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:36,000 Speaker 1: And you know, I know that a lot of the 126 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 1: time in these sectors as well as you've touched on 127 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:43,680 Speaker 1: a lot of these wonderful people really aren't paid as 128 00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:46,120 Speaker 1: well as they should be, you know, to help care 129 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,040 Speaker 1: for our seniors, to help care for our children, and 130 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: then in those roles within the domestic violence sector, for example, 131 00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 1: they are absolutely critical roles. So you know, what would 132 00:06:58,200 --> 00:07:00,479 Speaker 1: you say to anybody listening this morning that you know 133 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: that sort of feels as though they don't deserve to 134 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 1: have this portable long service slave. 135 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think. I think the difference in this sector 136 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 2: that's quite unique is that, and it's similar to construction, 137 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 2: where portable long service leave already exists. These workers often 138 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 2: aren't the ones choosing to move employers. It's a result 139 00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 2: of government funding decisions. For example, one employer might be 140 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 2: organization might be operating a homelessness shelter or domestic violence service. 141 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 2: The funding tender changes and that same service operates, but 142 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:36,960 Speaker 2: it's being run by a different employer. The worker transitions 143 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 2: to the new employer. They're doing the same job, they're 144 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:42,320 Speaker 2: working in the same sector, but because of the government 145 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 2: funding decision, they've just lost all their long service leave entitlements. 146 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 2: So it's not like the employers are shopping around for 147 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 2: a better job. They're doing the same job. They're just 148 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:53,880 Speaker 2: being they're just losing out on their long service leave, 149 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 2: and then they're burning out. You know, there's a lot 150 00:07:56,520 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 2: of trauma, there's a lot of difficulty in doing these jobs, 151 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 2: so there's high rates of burnout. So people need to 152 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 2: be able to take a break and if they don't 153 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 2: get their long service ly, they just can't do that well. 154 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 1: Australian Services Union organizing lead for the Northern Territory branch, 155 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,520 Speaker 1: Dan Spencer, really great to speak with you this morning. 156 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 1: Thank you for having a chat with us. 157 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 2: Thanks very much. 158 00:08:18,520 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: Thank you.