Speaker 1: Hooked, Hitched and Hung Up acknowledges the traditional custodians of
Speaker 1: country throughout Australia and their connections to land, sea and community.
Speaker 1: We pay our respect to their elders past and present
Speaker 1: and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait
Speaker 1: Islander peoples today.
Speaker 2: This episode was recorded on Wella Medical Land.
Speaker 1: Just a heads up, guys, this episode's got a bit
Speaker 1: of spicy language in it and has discussions of sexual
Speaker 1: abuse and drug abuse, so it might not be one
Speaker 1: for the little ears.
Speaker 2: I'm Brittany Hockley and I'm Laura Burn.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Hooked, Hitched and Hung Up, the show where
Speaker 1: we take you inside the spiciest celebrity relationship stories of
Speaker 1: our time. Now. Movie star Demi Moore was an absolute
Speaker 1: icon of the nineties. At one point, she was the
Speaker 1: highest paid actress of all time.
Speaker 2: I didn't know this. Can I also say what I
Speaker 2: didn't know? I always thought it was Demi Moore, not
Speaker 2: Demi Moore.
Speaker 1: So did I, And I think a lot of people
Speaker 1: around the world stay incorrectly it's Demi how she So we've.
Speaker 2: Been putting the wrong m fastest on the wrong salabile.
Speaker 1: Yes, that was very good, Laura. So today we're talking
Speaker 1: about Demi mour and her relationship with our beloved Ashton Kutcher.
Speaker 1: The reason this is so interesting is there was a
Speaker 1: fifteen year age gap, which, with dem being older by
Speaker 1: fifteen years, it.
Speaker 2: Was a bit spicy and scandalous at the time. Wasn't
Speaker 2: it very significant?
Speaker 1: And I think probably one of the biggest age gaps
Speaker 1: that we saw in Holly were definitely one of the
Speaker 1: earliest ones. I think they were in the forefront of this,
Speaker 1: like it's okay to have these big age gap, It's
Speaker 1: okay for the woman to be the older one. Fifteen
Speaker 1: years was a really, really big time. She was an
Speaker 1: og cougar. I can say that because I was a
Speaker 1: cougar myself. I dated a guy seven years younger than me,
Speaker 1: so like, but she doubled that.
Speaker 2: But you also weren't the og one. You were just
Speaker 2: like a run of the mill old cougar.
Speaker 1: No. But I just feel like I can drop the
Speaker 1: term cougar because I was a cougar.
Speaker 2: Oh all right, let's get into the episode.
Speaker 1: Well, the reason this is so interesting is we looked
Speaker 1: at this like it was this beautiful relationship we had
Speaker 1: this young heart Throb Ashton Kutscher, who married a beautiful
Speaker 1: Demi Moore, very successful actress. But there were some very
Speaker 1: very dark times that went on in that relationship that
Speaker 1: I don't think a lot of people knew about. I
Speaker 1: definitely didn't know about them. So we are going to
Speaker 1: get into them. So we're going to kickstart with Demi.
Speaker 1: She was born November eleventh, nineteen sixty two, so she's
Speaker 1: now fifty nine years old, still looks like she was
Speaker 1: thirty five. She still looks better than USI house, we're
Speaker 1: half her age, but yes, she looks amazing. But she
Speaker 1: had quite a tumultuous upbringing. Her father left her then
Speaker 1: eighteen year old mother before Demi was born, so they
Speaker 1: only had a two month marriage, so he never even
Speaker 1: met his daughter.
Speaker 2: I didn't realize until we did the deep dive in there,
Speaker 2: just how fucked up her childhood and upbringing was.
Speaker 1: Her childhood was very very dark, so her mother and
Speaker 1: her stepfather were married and divorced twice, and her stepfather
Speaker 1: ended up dying by suicide a year after the second divorce, devastating, devastating.
Speaker 1: Her mother also had a super long history of arrest,
Speaker 1: drink driving arson like. There were a lot of things
Speaker 1: going on, so it was obviously a pretty unstable home.
Speaker 1: But a real kick in the guts for Demi is
Speaker 1: that she only found out about her biological father when
Speaker 1: she was thirteen years old, and this was after inspecting
Speaker 1: a mother's marriage certificate. She was a bit confused because
Speaker 1: her mother and her stepfather were married only a year
Speaker 1: after she was born, so she always thought her stepfather
Speaker 1: was her father. She didn't know it was her stepfather. Now,
Speaker 1: something really, really horrific happened that we're going to state
Speaker 1: because Demi talks about it in her twenty nineteen memoir.
Speaker 1: At fifteen years old, she was raped and her rapist
Speaker 1: claimed that he had paid Demi's mother for access to Demi.
Speaker 1: So this is absolutely her. This has come from her memoir.
Speaker 2: There aren't any words for her. But the two people
Speaker 2: who are supposed to protect you in life, like your
Speaker 2: two foundations that give you safety, protection love, have abandoned you.
Speaker 2: Like that's what that is. You are in the world
Speaker 2: completely on your own.
Speaker 1: Well, she does say in the memoir, she says, look,
Speaker 1: it is unclear if this is true. All she is
Speaker 1: saying is that this is what the rapist had claimed
Speaker 1: that was his claim. She will not know, I guess,
Speaker 1: and she doesn't know if that is true. But whether
Speaker 1: it is or not, this doesn't make the situation better.
Speaker 1: It's absolutely horrific. But at age sixteen, she left home
Speaker 1: and she left school.
Speaker 2: She has experienced so much that she shouldn't have to
Speaker 2: experience as a sixteen year old.
Speaker 1: Child, or no one should ever have to experience.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and then she's left her home. She's left school
Speaker 2: and managed to still go on to be one of
Speaker 2: the most successful and biggest movie stars in the world.
Speaker 1: Leaving home at sixteen after that childhood and then becoming
Speaker 1: the highest paid actress, they're well done. So she's moved
Speaker 1: home and she signed with a modeling agency and started
Speaker 1: to take acting classes at sixteen. She was super inspired
Speaker 1: by her next door neighbor who was sort of doing
Speaker 1: that kind of a thing. She appeared on the cover
Speaker 1: of a French adult magazine we in nineteen eighty one,
Speaker 1: but she lied about She alied about her age because
Speaker 1: she was only sixteen, so you're not allowed to do that.
Speaker 1: You still have to have like parental supervision, I guess.
Speaker 1: So she said she was eighteen, which I think is
Speaker 1: a common theme back then. I think a lot of
Speaker 1: people will lying about their age too.
Speaker 2: For all the episodes that we've done now, it is
Speaker 2: certainly a common theme. Like I was a child star.
Speaker 2: I was pretending like I was twenty when I was
Speaker 2: really fourteen. I mean, this one seems a.
Speaker 1: Little bit standard Hollywood.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a little bit more believable. She was only aging
Speaker 2: herself up by two years.
Speaker 1: Usually they're like, I was five, but I told them
Speaker 1: I was eighteen and they said it was like kept going.
Speaker 1: So her first film debut was nineteen eighty one, a
Speaker 1: teen drama called Choices that didn't really do it for her,
Speaker 1: Like that was where she Yeah, it was her debut,
Speaker 1: but nothing really happened with that. But she started to
Speaker 1: gain some serious traction after starring some Elmo's Fire in
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five. So that was the movie that sort
Speaker 1: of put her on the map.
Speaker 2: What a name. It just makes me think of like
Speaker 2: Sesame Street after dark.
Speaker 1: Okay, so she's only just made her debut, but it's
Speaker 1: come out later. She has said that this is a
Speaker 1: time she was actually suffering from a drug addiction. So
Speaker 1: she came out and said that she was addicted to cocaine.
Speaker 1: At this time, right before filming sent Almost Fire, she'd
Speaker 1: actually checked into a two week rehab program. She had
Speaker 1: to have a sobriety companion with her all through filming.
Speaker 1: So she's only just been thrust into the world and
Speaker 1: she's already doing rehab. She's already got a twenty four
Speaker 1: seven sobriety companion. She does credit the director forgetting her sober.
Speaker 1: So she's already imagine being that age, that young, and
Speaker 1: you've already gone through so much life.
Speaker 2: And when you're eighteen, it's pretty fucking hard to know
Speaker 2: that you have a problem with substance abuse, right Like,
Speaker 2: even if you do having that self awareness of going, okay,
Speaker 2: this is no longer just me being fun having a
Speaker 2: fun party, to being like, okay, no, this is me
Speaker 2: with a problem, and then being able to have that
Speaker 2: conversation with someone who you respect, who's older than you.
Speaker 1: He could afflicted to the side and was like, two
Speaker 1: hard basket, let's get another actress. But he didn't, And
Speaker 1: I think that that's probably a rarity in Hollywood, especially
Speaker 1: back then. But what really solidified her as the most
Speaker 1: promising new actress was in nineteen ninety she starred alongside
Speaker 1: Patrick Swayze, who we all love in Ghosts and that
Speaker 1: is still to this day. Her most successful film role
Speaker 1: is this.
Speaker 2: This is the one where they're like making the pottery
Speaker 2: and he's like rubbing her arms and the clay and it's.
Speaker 1: Very famous scene.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, still the scene.
Speaker 1: She wanted to do a bunch of movies. A Few
Speaker 1: Good Men in Decent Proposal nineteen ninety three, Disclosure nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety four, all of her movies were opening at number
Speaker 1: one in the box office, like everything she was touching
Speaker 1: was turning to golds. So nineteen ninety five, she was
Speaker 1: already the highest paid actress in Hollywood. There were literally
Speaker 1: people fighting over her. There were bitting moors.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was the highest paid female actress. That she
Speaker 2: wasn't the highest paid actor just in general, but there
Speaker 2: were still plenty of men paid more than her.
Speaker 1: She was deemed a bit of a pioneer for equal
Speaker 1: salary for women in Hollywood. She was starting the good fight. Okay,
Speaker 1: so we do know that Demi ends up with Ashton Kutcher.
Speaker 1: We love Ashton Kutcher, very handsome man. I definitely like
Speaker 1: him less after I did the deep dive on this
Speaker 1: because there's a lot that went down that I had
Speaker 1: no idea about. I know, the shiny golden boy Ashton
Speaker 1: Kutcher that the publicers have presented to us for our generation,
Speaker 1: that's what I know. He's with Millicuners. He has this
Speaker 1: bitiful relationship, but so much stuff went down with him
Speaker 1: and Demi, and I'm going to tell you about it.
Speaker 1: A lot of the information we have is quite one sided.
Speaker 1: A lot of it is coming from Demi. She released
Speaker 1: a book, She's done a lot of interviews about it,
Speaker 1: she speaks a lot about it, so a lot of
Speaker 1: it it's coming from her side of the story, whereas
Speaker 1: Ashton has always been and still is quite private. So
Speaker 1: I want to really drive that home that we are
Speaker 1: telling you the facts. We've done the due diligence, but
Speaker 1: a lot of them are coming from one side.
Speaker 2: So Demi ends up with Ashton, but she also has
Speaker 2: a few marriages and serious relationships before him, doesn't she.
Speaker 1: Demi was married at only eighteen years old. She married
Speaker 1: a musician called Freddymore.
Speaker 2: She was married at eighteen eighteen.
Speaker 1: Yep, she got married.
Speaker 2: There you go.
Speaker 1: He's a musician. He was twelve years older than her
Speaker 1: and that's where she got her surname from. More, she
Speaker 1: took his surname, but they separated in nineteen eighty three.
Speaker 1: The divorce was said in nineteen eighty five, but she
Speaker 1: kept his surname.
Speaker 2: Isn't it interesting that such a formative part of her identity,
Speaker 2: which is her name, actually came from a marriage that
Speaker 2: she has nothing to do with anymore.
Speaker 1: A surname you need to, you not need to, but
Speaker 1: generally you have a connection to. It's something that you
Speaker 1: want to carry on into the future. And as we
Speaker 1: know about her past, I don't imagine she had much
Speaker 1: of a connection or wanted to take that into a future.
Speaker 1: Something she wanted to leave behind. So that relationship ended.
Speaker 1: And then she got engaged to her our favorite movies
Speaker 1: and Elmos Fire set to Street on Ruth. She got
Speaker 1: engaged to her sent almost fire cost Emilio Estevez. I
Speaker 1: absolutely love that name. Now, did you know Amelio Estevez
Speaker 1: was Charlie Sheen's brother, Because I didn't know.
Speaker 2: That, don't dull anyway.
Speaker 1: I got you excited about that, but they called off
Speaker 1: the engagement pretty soon after, pretty negible. Let's just scoop
Speaker 1: past that relationship. In nineteen eighty seven, the year I
Speaker 1: was born, a great year. Indeed, Demi married Die Hard
Speaker 1: star Bruce Willis.
Speaker 2: That was a nice like their little relationship with their
Speaker 2: beautiful kids like that was so wholesome and lovely.
Speaker 1: They went on to have three daughters that we see
Speaker 1: in the media a lot at the moment, Ruema, Scout
Speaker 1: and Tulula. But they separated in nineteen ninety eight, filing
Speaker 1: for divorce in two thousand. While in Rolling Stone in
Speaker 1: two thousand, Bruce Willis said.
Speaker 3: I still loved Demi. We're very close.
Speaker 1: We have three children whom we will continue to raise together.
Speaker 1: We're probably as close now as we ever were. We
Speaker 1: realized we have a lifelong commitment to our kids.
Speaker 3: Our friendship continues. The institution has been set aside. It's
Speaker 3: difficult to live your life and marriage under a magnifying glass,
Speaker 3: which is what happens to a movie star couples. It
Speaker 3: was hard to maintain a marriage while the whole world
Speaker 3: was looking on, and we see that so much in Hollywood.
Speaker 2: I heard and let me know if this is right.
Speaker 2: After Demi broke up with Bruce and they separated, that
Speaker 2: she went on to have not before Ashton Kutcher, which
Speaker 2: we all obviously know about. But there was another relationship
Speaker 2: and she dated like a martial arts instructor.
Speaker 1: Yes, so she must like the action hero.
Speaker 2: Not a famous person, just a martial arts instructor. Yep.
Speaker 1: His name was Oliver Wickham. And this is a relationship
Speaker 1: that I think went really under the radar. They were
Speaker 1: together for three years, so it was quite serious. But yeah,
Speaker 1: he was just a martial arts instructor.
Speaker 2: It must have been smoking hot.
Speaker 1: They probably a lot of wrestling. Anyway, Mama, that lasted
Speaker 1: three years. It didn't work out. And this is where
Speaker 1: we meet Hollywood's hunk slash semi bad boy, Ashton Kutcher.
Speaker 2: I don't think this is a good idea, Ashton Quiet.
Speaker 1: It'll be fine in and out two minutes.
Speaker 2: It's just now that we're here, I'm realizing all the
Speaker 2: reasons that this is a really dumb heist.
Speaker 1: To Paul, don't call it a heist where let's say
Speaker 1: liberating misallocated funds.
Speaker 2: Okay, but we go to this school, so what so
Speaker 2: if anyone sees us, then they're going to know who
Speaker 2: you are straight away.
Speaker 1: I'll probably just think I'm pulling an all nighter in
Speaker 1: the library, cramming for finals or something.
Speaker 2: The library is closed.
Speaker 1: They won't know that, and you're carrying bolt cutters. Look
Speaker 1: you're being paranoid.
Speaker 2: Damn it.
Speaker 1: So here we have it. Hollywood actor, venture capitalist sitcom
Speaker 1: star Ashton Kutcher was arrested for trying to steal money
Speaker 1: from his own school in the dead of night. He
Speaker 1: is not the clean cut, golden boy that we all thought.
Speaker 2: What I want to know, was he trying to steal
Speaker 2: money for himself? Like, was this like he was liberating
Speaker 2: funds he knows where it was going. When you say that,
Speaker 2: it makes it sound like it's like some sort of charity,
Speaker 2: like he's some sort of vigilante. But really, was he
Speaker 2: just being like a delinquent little shit.
Speaker 1: Yes, he probably just wanted to go party.
Speaker 2: But also at the time, he was actually quite a
Speaker 2: like he was quite a good student, as in, like academically,
Speaker 2: he was quite a gifted student. So he was in
Speaker 2: line for getting scholarships. There was almost like a sure
Speaker 2: pathway for him into university and he fuckd.
Speaker 1: It our help? Well? Yes, now let's get into Ashton's backstory.
Speaker 1: He was born February seventh, nineteen seventy eight. Born in Iowa,
Speaker 1: and his real name, like everyone else in Hollywood, is
Speaker 1: not Ashton. It is Christopher Ashton, so he swapped out
Speaker 1: the middle name for the first name. His mother was
Speaker 1: a procter and gamble employee, father was a factory worker,
Speaker 1: and he actually has a fraternal twin brother called Michael. Now,
Speaker 1: Michael has cerebral palsy and cardiomyopathy. So cartiam myopathy. It's
Speaker 1: just so you guys know, is a group of diseases
Speaker 1: that affect the heart. So Ashton is in high school,
Speaker 1: this is where he starts acting. He develops a real
Speaker 1: interest in it. But his reputation was ruined completely when
Speaker 1: he broke into that school at midnight to steal money.
Speaker 1: Because they were arrested. He was convicted of third degree burglary.
Speaker 1: He served three years probation and one hundred and eighty
Speaker 1: hours of community service. He lost his girlfriend, he lost
Speaker 1: college scholarships, He lost a lot because of that liberating
Speaker 1: of funds, as he likes to call it, like he did,
Speaker 1: he lost. He paid the price for that. But isn't
Speaker 1: it interesting? I just feel like so many people in
Speaker 1: Hollywood have this story. Everyone's like, oh, I was arrested
Speaker 1: but look where I am Now.
Speaker 2: People don't just buy into an actor, they buy into
Speaker 2: the person, you know, and they and that's how that
Speaker 2: you become like a mega superfan. And I think that
Speaker 2: that's been something that's so true of all the stories
Speaker 2: that we've covered on this podcast. Every single one of
Speaker 2: them has had this like overcoming adversity in their childhood.
Speaker 2: What's funny because he does really hone in on that
Speaker 2: he ended up going to university. Isn't it funny you
Speaker 2: say this? You're like, oh, yeah, he had this really
Speaker 2: like huge thing that happened to him where he broke
Speaker 2: into a school and he did probation, he lost all
Speaker 2: his scholarships.
Speaker 1: He went to Union. He still went to fucking Uni.
Speaker 2: The guy's fine, you know, stop him, No, exactly.
Speaker 1: He went to Union. This is really sweet. He went
Speaker 1: to major in biochemical engineering. And the whole point of
Speaker 1: that was that he hoped to one day q I
Speaker 1: Michael is twin brothers, Heart ailments. This is what he
Speaker 1: wanted to do. But he also worked as a model
Speaker 1: in New York. And I'm talking like the model that
Speaker 1: really gets the body out Calvin Klein.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so he was a really struggling university student.
Speaker 1: It was hard times, Laura so hard being a model,
Speaker 1: and he was super hot, Like we all know how
Speaker 1: hot Ashton Kutch was.
Speaker 2: When did he start that seventies show? That was his
Speaker 2: big break, wasn't it?
Speaker 1: What was it? Was his first job and literally the
Speaker 1: biggest show. Well, that was the seventy Show nineteen ninety
Speaker 1: eight to two thousand and six, so he was on
Speaker 1: that show for a pretty big chunk of time.
Speaker 2: Like that was obviously like the sitcom that got him
Speaker 2: onto and into everyone's homes. But his big break was
Speaker 2: the stupidest movie in the high World that sometimes I
Speaker 2: still repeat lines off, which was Dude Wears My.
Speaker 1: Car, which is if you watched that back now, it's
Speaker 1: not funny now, oh it's so bad, But it was
Speaker 1: so funny when we were teenagers. Yep. I'm sure you
Speaker 1: had a poster of him that used to make out
Speaker 1: with as well from that period.
Speaker 2: Dude, where's your car? Where's your car?
Speaker 1: Dude?
Speaker 2: I don't know, dude, where's my car?
Speaker 1: That was an hour and a half. That was it.
Speaker 1: That was absolutely incredible, But back then that was what
Speaker 1: was popular, and that, like you're right, that really skyrocketed
Speaker 1: him and that somehow took him as like a freally
Speaker 1: respected actor. He's pretty smart, Ashton. We do know that
Speaker 1: because you went to you need to do bio chemical engineering.
Speaker 1: But he was also a TV in his spare time.
Speaker 1: He produced and I don't know if you remember, Yeah,
Speaker 1: do you remember the show Punked? Do you remember that
Speaker 1: prank show where he used to run around? That was it.
Speaker 1: He's just the prank.
Speaker 2: People and it was wild. It was so wildly popular.
Speaker 2: But then he was also behind the scenes on that
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 1: He executive produced, but he hosted it, and I guess
Speaker 1: that was like his little baby.
Speaker 2: It truly was the dumbest time for comedy though, like
Speaker 2: even Punked. Wow.
Speaker 1: But he also produced Beauty and the Geek Ad Benches
Speaker 1: in Hollywood, The Real Wedding Crashes, Opportunity Knocks Like. He
Speaker 1: was doing a lot of things behind the scenes. And
Speaker 1: the reason he was doing this This is something he
Speaker 1: said to an interviewer in two thousand and four. If anything,
Speaker 1: I'm a trier. I think more than anything, it comes
Speaker 1: from the fact that my father always had several irons
Speaker 1: in the fire. Also, I don't want to fail if
Speaker 1: something doesn't work out. If that seventy show got canceled
Speaker 1: or if I wasn't going to have a film career,
Speaker 1: I always wanted to have a backup contingency plan, so
Speaker 1: I just started doing.
Speaker 2: Other things well, speaking of backup contingency plans. And this
Speaker 2: is like obviously Ashton Kutchen now is obviously known for
Speaker 2: his acting. That's his very public facing profile. People might
Speaker 2: not know, but he does. He has hundreds of millions
Speaker 2: of dollars, like two hundred and fifty million in a
Speaker 2: whole lot of tech companies and some of the big
Speaker 2: ones are like Uber Airbnb.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's he's super behind the scenes. He's a secret
Speaker 1: investor and I think investor. He's made a lot of
Speaker 1: money on it. But this is something that I find
Speaker 1: really interesting. So in twenty eleven, he replaced Charlie Sheen
Speaker 1: on the sitcom Two and a Half Men, And you
Speaker 1: remember that, to me was engaged to Charlie's brother, Emilio
Speaker 1: West of It. So this is all happening like before
Speaker 1: the time, she was engaged to Charlie Sheen's brother without
Speaker 1: knowing that she was going to marry the man that
Speaker 1: took Charlie Shane's job.
Speaker 2: What a weird little like synchronicity, and it also just
Speaker 2: makes you think like Hollywood's actually just very small.
Speaker 1: And he was earning seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars
Speaker 1: an episode, one.
Speaker 2: Hundred and fifty thousand.
Speaker 1: I don't know, and this is back then. I don't
Speaker 1: know why he was worrying about contingency backup plans, like
Speaker 1: the man's doing fine. You're listening to Hooked, Hitched, and
Speaker 1: hung Up, And this episode is all about the iconic
Speaker 1: early two thousands love story between Ashton Kutcher and Demimur.
Speaker 2: How did the two of them actually come to be together?
Speaker 1: Ashton and Demi meet by mutual friends. There's a dinner
Speaker 1: in New York City. According to the UK Mirror newspaper,
Speaker 1: they hit it off instantly. They went back to Demi's
Speaker 1: place afterwards, they talked all night, falling asleep together, very romantic.
Speaker 1: They I mean, that's they definitely had sex, That's what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. But the way that it's reported is like
Speaker 1: we just went back and talked and cuddled.
Speaker 2: I gazed into each other's eyes.
Speaker 1: I would not be cuddling if I was laying next
Speaker 1: to Ashton Kutcha in bed. But that's just me. I'm
Speaker 1: just saying. In two thousand and three, at the premiere
Speaker 1: of Charlie's Angels Full Throttle, Demean Ashton walk the red
Speaker 1: carpet together for the first time, So this is the
Speaker 1: first time. To the world, they were like, here we are.
Speaker 2: I remember how it came out, and everyone was just like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I can't believe they're dating. That's crazy.
Speaker 2: She's so much older than him, even though they literally
Speaker 2: look the same age. If you look at the photos, like,
Speaker 2: it's not that, it's not like this big weird age gap,
Speaker 2: it doesn't look like that by any means. But I
Speaker 2: think it's always so interesting when the woman is older
Speaker 2: than the man. It's such a cliche narrative that it's
Speaker 2: just so much more shocking. If a famous man walked
Speaker 2: down a red carpet with a girl who's fifteen years younger,
Speaker 2: we would think it's normal.
Speaker 1: Just show you how serious they were about each other.
Speaker 1: Ashton had actually converted to Kabbala, which is a form
Speaker 1: of Judaism, and that is something that Demi had been
Speaker 1: practicing for a while. So I mean, to convert religion,
Speaker 1: you're very serious about your relationship. So they were pretty
Speaker 1: serious from the get go, Demi's daughter, Rumor happened she
Speaker 1: had a huge crush on Weird. So Ashton was like,
Speaker 1: because they're closing, get it, momyre closer.
Speaker 2: She's like, tap that girl.
Speaker 1: Then all of a sudden, your mom brings home your crush.
Speaker 1: You'd be like, have you brought him home for me?
Speaker 2: Mum? Or But also imagine they then get married and
Speaker 2: you're like, hey daddy, hey step daddy, this is weird
Speaker 2: for everybody.
Speaker 1: She says, it wasn't weird. She's like, at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, the second you know your mother is
Speaker 1: dating someone, you don't see them like that anymore. Because
Speaker 1: there are a lot of you know, those late night
Speaker 1: talk shows, a lot of people tried to get some
Speaker 1: some of the pull these awkwardness out of rumor. But
Speaker 1: she was like, it wasn't awkward anymore. Yeah, I had
Speaker 1: to crush on him, The whole world had to crush
Speaker 1: on him. But when he's banging your mom, you definitely
Speaker 1: don't look at him like that anymore.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: If there's one way to be turned off, it's thinking
Speaker 2: about anyone banging your mom.
Speaker 1: In two thousand and five to me tells half as
Speaker 1: bizarre I feel that we are married and that we
Speaker 1: don't need something formal, so to do so isn't a
Speaker 1: big deal one way or the other. It's not like
Speaker 1: we're holding out. People of his saying are you gonna
Speaker 1: get married where you guys at She's like, nah, we
Speaker 1: feel like we are anyway. But then surprise they get
Speaker 1: married at the same year.
Speaker 2: I mean, you gotta love it when people play it cool,
Speaker 2: because like, you know, maybe he hadn't composed yet, and
Speaker 2: maybe she was really just like, yeah, yeah, we're taking
Speaker 2: it slow. We're taking it slow, but like obviously not
Speaker 2: the end of the day. You always just want to
Speaker 2: get proposed to. Like so many people say, oh yeah,
Speaker 2: we're just like seeing what happens. I can't cook girl.
Speaker 1: I don't think she was playing it cool. I think
Speaker 1: she was trying to divert the media attention.
Speaker 3: Oh.
Speaker 1: I think she's trying to be like, oh, we might
Speaker 1: knowing that they're going to get married. So they got
Speaker 1: married the same year, as she said, I don't know
Speaker 1: if we'll get married. We're pretty happy. They had like
Speaker 1: a secret Beverly Hills wedding with one hundred guests, including
Speaker 1: her ex Bruce Willis, because they are best friends, they
Speaker 1: are happy families. All the kids were there, and this
Speaker 1: is where for the next five years or so, we
Speaker 1: see loads of appearances like with the whole blended family.
Speaker 1: We see Bruce, we see Ashton, the kids to me,
Speaker 1: like photos together at a bens.
Speaker 2: I remember this time. I remember the time of like
Speaker 2: the happy family of like six of them just going
Speaker 2: out and having family photos. And it's an amazing thing
Speaker 2: to see such a great example of what a blended family,
Speaker 2: a modern family can look like.
Speaker 1: So when Demi and Ashton were together, they were really
Speaker 1: passionate activists. They did start a foundation in twenty ten
Speaker 1: that seeks to protect children from being forced into sexual slavery.
Speaker 1: So they were doing really really good things in that world.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's amazing. The specific type of charity that they created.
Speaker 2: It makes me think back to how that might have
Speaker 2: been a tie in to Demi's childhood, you know, like
Speaker 2: knowing that she never wants anybody else to go through
Speaker 2: what she went through or potentially went through. That that's
Speaker 2: where this real drive for creating this charity may have
Speaker 2: come from. This story it does cast a pretty dark
Speaker 2: bad light on Ashton, and as we said, this is
Speaker 2: a lot of the stories coming from Deme's side, But
Speaker 2: I think it is really important here to really hone
Speaker 2: in on the work that Ashton did in a really
Speaker 2: important space. He puts a lot of energy and time
Speaker 2: and money into it, So I really want to drive
Speaker 2: that point home to the guy is very, very young,
Speaker 2: and who you are in your mid tis twenties is
Speaker 2: not who you are when you're in your late.
Speaker 1: Thirties, Like to me, actually acknowledged the age difference and
Speaker 1: that that's probably a reason she was attracted to him
Speaker 1: in the first place.
Speaker 3: She said, keep in mind, when I was twenty five,
Speaker 3: I became a mom. I skipped straight from being a
Speaker 3: young adult into motherhood and marriage. When I met Ashton,
Speaker 3: it almost.
Speaker 1: Felt like a doover, like I could just go back
Speaker 1: in time and experience what it was like to be
Speaker 1: young with him, much more so than I had ever
Speaker 1: been able to experience it when I was actually in
Speaker 1: my twenties. So I think she just felt like she
Speaker 1: missed out in a lot. Her kids have grown up,
Speaker 1: She's met this young, hot, successful actor, and she's lot.
Speaker 1: Fuck it, I'm just going to go and live my
Speaker 1: best life and live something that I feel like I
Speaker 1: had taken away a.
Speaker 2: Bit when to Me was doing that movie early on,
Speaker 2: and the director got her sober, He got her sober
Speaker 2: off everything, like she to me lives her life without drinking,
Speaker 2: without partying, without doing drugs, and this was obviously a
Speaker 2: time in Ashton's twenties where he was partying, and maybe
Speaker 2: their life to voices in a line.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and speaking of addiction, Demi actually said she was
Speaker 1: addicted to Ashton, so she got sober. Obviously, She's like,
Speaker 1: I was absolutely addicted to him, and she's like, I
Speaker 1: recognized that it was unhealthy. She thinks that that's probably
Speaker 1: what caused him to end up distancing himself, because he
Speaker 1: started lying about where he was. He was spending less
Speaker 1: time with her, and she thinks she probably ended up
Speaker 1: being too much. She probably ended up smothering him. And
Speaker 1: this becomes evident, and this is where it unravels. In
Speaker 1: twenty eleven, six years after they got together, tabloids started
Speaker 1: reporting that Ashton had cheated on to Me, including one
Speaker 1: story that started, of all places, at a bowling alley.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that is Ashton Kutcher and to me more,
Speaker 2: what's up girl? You are not going to believe this.
Speaker 2: I'm at work at the Bowling Alley right now, and
Speaker 2: Ashon Kutcher is here.
Speaker 3: I don't believe it.
Speaker 2: I'm serious. And he is with Demi Moore and one
Speaker 2: of her kids.
Speaker 3: Her lady from Ghost.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and she just keeps on like bowling strikes. God,
Speaker 2: I want to be Demi more so bad. Oh wait,
Speaker 2: wait wait I think he's coming over. Wait what queen back?
Speaker 2: Hi there you you are Ashton Kutcher. Uh yeah, from
Speaker 2: that seventies show uh uh huh and the Butterfly Effect.
Speaker 2: I love that movie.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I was actually just and that really bad Steve Jobs
Speaker 2: movie that everyone hated it then forgot about when a
Speaker 2: really good Steve Job's movie came out like two years later,
Speaker 2: and then Michael Fassbender played Steve Jobs way better that one.
Speaker 1: I just don't know how to answer that.
Speaker 2: Oh sorry, I am so sorry for staring. But you
Speaker 2: are the beautiful.
Speaker 1: Oh well, thank you, you're quite beautiful.
Speaker 2: Your soul?
Speaker 1: My god, why don't I give back these bowling shoes?
Speaker 1: And uh you give me your number? This is absolutely wild.
Speaker 1: This is where it all comes out. This is where
Speaker 1: it starts. Ashton cheats on demimor his wife with a
Speaker 1: twenty one year old woman that he met at a
Speaker 1: bowling alley.
Speaker 2: Can I say this though? You know when earlier when
Speaker 2: Demi was saying that she felt like she was smothering him, like,
Speaker 2: you know, she want to know where he was, and
Speaker 2: he was lying to a blah blah blah. It doesn't
Speaker 2: matter where he is, He's going to cheat on you
Speaker 2: when you're in the room, girlfriend, like if you kids
Speaker 2: absolutely crazy when you think about it like so, and
Speaker 2: when you think how many women would have been throwing
Speaker 2: themselves at him, to think that this is the opportunity
Speaker 2: he takes, it makes you question. I'm sure he probably
Speaker 2: took a few liberties elsewhere.
Speaker 1: Well, I think he did. Demi says, I remember the
Speaker 1: night they met. We were at a bowling alley with rumor,
Speaker 1: and when he went to switch out the shoes, she
Speaker 1: gave him her number on a napkin. Or that's what
Speaker 1: he told me at the time. When we got home
Speaker 1: that night and he had showed it to me, I said,
Speaker 1: that is just gross. We were there with our kid.
Speaker 1: I had a real visceral response. It was revulsion. So
Speaker 1: the fact that he had pursued her felt like a
Speaker 1: real fuck you This wasn't the only time Ashton Kutcher
Speaker 1: stepped out and did the wrong thing. There was a
Speaker 1: woman at the hard Rock Hotel that Ashton had apparently
Speaker 1: slept with, and this all came out by a Google
Speaker 1: alert on Demi's phone. So that is how she found
Speaker 1: out that he had just gone to the hard Rock
Speaker 1: Hotel and cheated on her.
Speaker 2: Way as in like a Google alert, like a news
Speaker 2: article came up.
Speaker 1: US Weekly, Yep, that's what happened.
Speaker 2: I would really fucking suck Neil.
Speaker 1: Notification from US Weekly. San Diego woman reveal she said
Speaker 1: with Ashton Kutcher at.
Speaker 3: The hard Rock Hotel.
Speaker 1: This is all according to US Weekly, he was staying
Speaker 1: with friends at San Diego hard Rock Hotel. Demi was
Speaker 1: promoting a short film project, so they weren't together. It
Speaker 1: was their anniversary. The story goes that Ashton and his
Speaker 1: friends were prowling for women, that's the quote, but to
Speaker 1: no avail. They headed back to their room and at
Speaker 1: four am they met a woman named Sarah Leal. Ashton
Speaker 1: invited Lel and her friend to his room, where within
Speaker 1: five minutes they were all naked in the hotsab making out.
Speaker 1: This is on their anniversary he is having a threesome.
Speaker 1: So Demi's got this google it. She called Ashton right away,
Speaker 1: probably hoping he would say I'm not crazy, like that
Speaker 1: is crazy, but he straight up goes, Yep, it's true,
Speaker 1: which speaks volumes. I guess for maybe where he is
Speaker 1: in that relationship or where his head's at where he's like,
Speaker 1: I not, I'm gonna argue with it. Yep, you caught me.
Speaker 2: It truly says a lot, doesn't it. It's almost like
Speaker 2: it's gotten to a point where he's not like he's
Speaker 2: intentionally sabotaging it, but it's that's an easy out that
Speaker 2: seems like a coward's out, like yes, I got cheated on,
Speaker 2: please leave me nout. It's just like, how do you
Speaker 2: recover from that?
Speaker 1: Well, you're going to love his excuse, Laura. He straight
Speaker 1: up sent it to me that he was confused about
Speaker 1: the status of their relationship and what was allowed and
Speaker 1: what was okay because Demi and Ashton had had consensual
Speaker 1: threesomes in the past. They had done that, they were
Speaker 1: having a lot of fun in their relationship, so he
Speaker 1: was like, oh, it just blurred the line, like I
Speaker 1: thought that that men I could go and have other threesome,
Speaker 1: but just like not with you, but not while you're
Speaker 1: there on our anniversary, and not so that you know about.
Speaker 2: Like, so he's trying to gaslight her, as what we're saying.
Speaker 2: So he gaslighted to me more into feeling that she
Speaker 2: should feel guilty for the fact that they had a
Speaker 2: consensual threesome and that should have given him leeway to
Speaker 2: do anything. Wow. Great, Yeah, and.
Speaker 1: To me as a memoir, she says, he was looking
Speaker 1: for a way to deflect blame to maintain his perception
Speaker 1: of himself as a decent family guy. So I guess
Speaker 1: he probably convinced himself he probably actually genuinely believed that,
Speaker 1: you know, when someone tells a lie so many times
Speaker 1: that it becomes a truth. He probably really believed that, Oh,
Speaker 1: I was confused. You had three reasons before I thought
Speaker 1: it was okay.
Speaker 2: Maybe it was just a way for him to be
Speaker 2: able to like absolve himself for the guilt that he
Speaker 2: felt for doing the wrong thing. You know, it's like
Speaker 2: when you can pass a bit of that blame onto
Speaker 2: the other person, you then don't have to sit in
Speaker 2: the full immense gravity of what that guilt feels like
Speaker 2: the fact that you fucked that up and you hurt
Speaker 2: that other person, you know.
Speaker 1: Yes, And this is also where very unfortunately, Demi relapses
Speaker 1: into substance abuse. She had twenty years of sobriety, and
Speaker 1: she claims that Ashton made it pretty difficult for her
Speaker 1: to maintain that sobriety while they were together. She comes
Speaker 1: out and openly talks on Jada Pinkett Smith's podcast Red Table.
Speaker 1: You know they we all know that show. They all
Speaker 1: on the Red Table. She said that Ashton had said
Speaker 1: to her, now twenty years of sobriety, she said, Ashton
Speaker 1: said to her, I don't know if alcoholism is a thing.
Speaker 3: I just think it's about moderation.
Speaker 1: So he's taking that away from her. Here's someone that's
Speaker 1: struggling with sobriety and he's living a really good life sober,
Speaker 1: and he's saying, I don't think that's a thing. Why
Speaker 1: can't you just control yourself?
Speaker 3: So she did.
Speaker 1: She started to think that, oh, he wants someone, he
Speaker 1: wants a partner that he can sit down with and
Speaker 1: have a wine with and have a dinner with. So
Speaker 1: she started to do that. She's like, I was trying
Speaker 1: to be someone I thought he wanted me to be.
Speaker 1: He'd convinced me that that, you know, sobriety wasn't even
Speaker 1: a thing, and alcoholism wasn't a thing. So she started
Speaker 1: to have a wine here or there, and that's where
Speaker 1: it just completely unraveled and always always made her feel
Speaker 1: guilty for that. So if she had had a few
Speaker 1: and a rough night, he would then show her a
Speaker 1: photo the next day of her with her head in
Speaker 1: the toilet and sort of make her feel really really
Speaker 1: shit about it, even though he was semi encouraging of
Speaker 1: it in the first place. So it sounds like it
Speaker 1: was getting pretty toxic.
Speaker 2: We kind of need to value just how incredible it
Speaker 2: is to do twenty years of sobriety, Like that's a
Speaker 2: really amazing thing for a person to be able to achieve.
Speaker 2: To then get to a point where they're led to
Speaker 2: feel as though they're not going to be as loved
Speaker 2: by their partner unless they can have a good time
Speaker 2: and you know, just be a bit more of the
Speaker 2: cool girl and a bit more chill and have a
Speaker 2: glass of wine. Really undervalues and undermines what she has
Speaker 2: spent twenty years creating for herself a life of sobriety.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think this is where she comes to
Speaker 1: a bit of a realization. So he always used to
Speaker 1: make her feel bad. He would come home, he'd be
Speaker 1: angry at her, he'd be disappointed in her. She said,
Speaker 1: he would have no compassion for the fact that she
Speaker 1: had this problem in the first place. But then she
Speaker 1: sort of acknowledges that, you know what, maybe I put
Speaker 1: too much stress on him and there was too much
Speaker 1: maturity expected from such a young person because he was
Speaker 1: only in his twenties.
Speaker 2: I think that there are people out there who aret
Speaker 2: twenty five years old can have responsible, loving, respectful relationships
Speaker 2: where monogamy is not a problem. But she is expecting
Speaker 2: too much of where he is at at twenty five.
Speaker 2: As as that specific person, you know, I think that
Speaker 2: potentially the person that Ashen is now in his late
Speaker 2: thirties verse that version of himself. I think there's probably
Speaker 2: a lot of growth that's gone into that person, you know.
Speaker 1: And she thinks that maybe what happened to her is
Speaker 1: happening to him. She realizes that, like, so she's in
Speaker 1: her forties now, and she's gone back to me with
Speaker 1: someone in her twenties because she lost her twenties. Now
Speaker 1: She's thinking, I've taken the same twenties. Yeap, is the
Speaker 1: same thing happening to Ashton? Has he lost his twenties
Speaker 1: and that's why this is unraveling.
Speaker 2: So I do remember Demi more and Ashen getting pregnant.
Speaker 1: Now, this is really sad. They already had a bit
Speaker 1: of a tumultuous relationship, but then to add to it,
Speaker 1: they were pregnant. When they got to six months, dem miscarriage.
Speaker 1: So miscarriage is hard at absolutely any stage, it's always horrific,
Speaker 1: but six months on it is so advanced and the
Speaker 1: whole world is what she knew. She really blames herself
Speaker 1: for that.
Speaker 2: Pregnancy loss so traumatic, it's so devastating. Women live with
Speaker 2: so much guilt over every small thing that they may
Speaker 2: have done wrong when something like this happens.
Speaker 1: They were facing a lot. Demi was finding her own
Speaker 1: private battles. They had a huge age gap, they had cheating,
Speaker 1: they had a miscarriage, and all of this was under
Speaker 1: public scrutiny, under the public eye. In twenty eleven, the
Speaker 1: same year that the first reports of Ashen's infidelity were noted,
Speaker 1: that they called it quits, and Demi announcing a statement
Speaker 1: to the press. It is with great sadness and a
Speaker 1: heavy heart that I have decided to end my six
Speaker 1: year marriage to Ashton. As a woman, a mother, and
Speaker 1: a wife, there are certain values and vows that I
Speaker 1: hold sacred, and it is in this spirit that I
Speaker 1: have chosen to move forward with my life. This is
Speaker 1: a trying time for me and my family, and so
Speaker 1: I would ask for some compassion and privacy that you
Speaker 1: would give to anyone going through a similar situation.
Speaker 2: That statement is not a conscious uncoupling statement. That's a
Speaker 2: I'm leaving this marriage because you didn't hold up your
Speaker 2: side of the bargain. Fuck you, That's what that is.
Speaker 2: It's a really nice way of saying, you fucked this
Speaker 2: up and I deserve better. Because this had been played
Speaker 2: out publicly across the media, people already knew that, so
Speaker 2: of course she was in some way going to allude
Speaker 2: that to the fact that that had impacted their relationship
Speaker 2: and the demise of their relationship. Well.
Speaker 1: He also made a statement, I will forever cherish the
Speaker 1: time I spent with Demi. Marriage is one of the
Speaker 1: most difficult things in the world, and unfortunately sometimes they
Speaker 1: fail because you cheat. But I guess We're never going
Speaker 1: to know if it was the tragic, tumultuous part that
Speaker 1: to me had grown up. Was it the traumas that
Speaker 1: she faced, the alcoholism, or was it the difference in age,
Speaker 1: was it his cheating?
Speaker 2: What all these compounding factors, And you know, like this
Speaker 2: story really does paint Ashton as like quite the villain
Speaker 2: in this relationship. I mean, there definitely were aspects of
Speaker 2: his behavior that were terrible, and maybe there was aspects
Speaker 2: of demeise behavior that made it incredibly hard to you know,
Speaker 2: having an addictive personality, maybe being controlling over him and
Speaker 2: of the situation, wanting to know where he was and
Speaker 2: what he was doing at all time. Not that they
Speaker 2: both necessarily contribute equally to the demise of it, but
Speaker 2: both people have contributed to that relationship equally. Maybe they
Speaker 2: met each other for a reason and at a time
Speaker 2: to help each other through some things or to go
Speaker 2: through some things.
Speaker 1: But I think that it's pretty easy to see why
Speaker 1: it didn't work out. There were just a lot of
Speaker 1: things stacked against them.
Speaker 2: When we look at where they are in their own
Speaker 2: points in life. Like Ashon's moved on, he's with Millerkunas,
Speaker 2: who was his co star from that seven year show.
Speaker 1: Demise as well. She's also moved on, which is really nice.
Speaker 1: And she's actually with a former pro cyclist, Daniel Hump,
Speaker 1: so that's cool too. She's got her own happy end, dude.
Speaker 2: Do you know what? Though, this was a bit of
Speaker 2: a sadder story, but it's nice to come full circle
Speaker 2: and to know that they're both in happy relationships, that
Speaker 2: they've both moved on with their lives and moved on
Speaker 2: to better things. Thank you for joining us for another
Speaker 2: episode of Hook, Pitch and hung Up, where we jump
Speaker 2: into some of the spiciest.
Speaker 1: And well known celebrity relationships.
Speaker 2: Hook Titch and hung Up is a podcast from iHeart
Speaker 2: Podcast Australia, dead Set Studios and the Kiss Network. Make
Speaker 2: sure you hit follow on your podcast app and listen
Speaker 2: to any of the previous episodes that you might have missed,
Speaker 2: because there are some really wild stories in there about
Speaker 2: breakups and makeups and all the spiciest celebrity relationships of
Speaker 2: all time.