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Speaker 1: Joining me on the line right now to talk a

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Speaker 1: little bit more about the growing number of flu cases

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Speaker 1: in the Northern Territory, which, as we heard just a

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Speaker 1: short time ago from the Australasian College of Emergency Medicine,

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Speaker 1: was putting pressure on the Northern Territories health system and

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Speaker 1: in particular highlighted the critical staffing shortages. Joining me on

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Speaker 1: the line right now is the Australian Nursing and Midwiffre

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Speaker 1: Federation NT Branch Secretary Kath Hatcher. Good morning to you, Cath.

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Speaker 2: Oh, good morning, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Good to hear from you. I haven't spoken to you

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Speaker 1: for a little while, Cath. I know you've been very busy.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's probably been about three months, Katie.

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Speaker 1: I think, yeah, it has been a little while. And Kath,

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Speaker 1: I know that you know that our staff at Territory

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Speaker 1: hospitals are always incredibly busy, but we know that certainly

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Speaker 1: the surge in flu cases or influenza cases having a

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Speaker 1: big impact right now. We spoke a bit earlier this

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Speaker 1: morning to the Australasian College of Emergency Medicine and they'd

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Speaker 1: said that it's it is having an impact on our

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Speaker 1: emergency wards at the moment.

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Speaker 2: Yes, if it's not impact with patients coming into the hospital,

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Speaker 2: it's actually staff being furloughed or sick with the flu.

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Speaker 2: So now we're kind of almost over the COVID and

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Speaker 2: the staff and patients coming in with COVID. Now there's

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Speaker 2: no rest for the wicked, so to speak. And now

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Speaker 2: the flu season is up and running and we're in

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Speaker 2: the thick of it, and with the staff very very

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Speaker 2: busy in those areas and on the wards with flucases

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Speaker 2: also COVID patients still, and with the nurses and midwives

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Speaker 2: and other stuff off sick with the flu as well.

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Speaker 1: So just how you know, like how tough is it

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Speaker 1: in the hospitals at the moment, Cass.

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Speaker 2: I don't think it's been has eased at all since

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Speaker 2: the COVID pandemic gets started. I mean, we were certainly

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Speaker 2: under the pump before COVID started, being quite huge and

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Speaker 2: almost in crisis space at times throughout the COVID and

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Speaker 2: now we've seen some little eaves and then something else

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Speaker 2: comes around the corner. So I am sorry for those nurses, midwives,

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Speaker 2: doctors and adellied health that are working clinically on the

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Speaker 2: floor and they aren't getting any rest at all. They've

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Speaker 2: got huge workloads and they're tired and fatigued.

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Speaker 1: And then we also heard last week throughout the estimates

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Speaker 1: process that there had been fourteen hundred odd staff leave

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Speaker 1: the Health Department over the last over the last year.

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Speaker 1: I believe it was, so it's quite a large number.

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Speaker 1: I know that some of those were indeed based out

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Speaker 1: at Howard Springs. Some of those though within our hospitals

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Speaker 1: and Allied Health systems CAS are we seeing a lot

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Speaker 1: of nurses leaving the territory at the moment.

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Speaker 2: With our member numbers with the Australian Nursing and with

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Speaker 2: wire free federations, definitely there is more increase being transferred

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Speaker 2: into state to other unions within our counterparts. But also

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Speaker 2: there's a bigger number that are canceling their membership and

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Speaker 2: compared to what are coming back into the territory from

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Speaker 2: other states, So we've got a bit of movement within

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Speaker 2: the states. I think the nurses and midwives are exhausted

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Speaker 2: and they're just needing some downtime. And while they're having

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Speaker 2: some maybe three or six or twelve months away from

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Speaker 2: their profession, they're not wanting to keep their membership going

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Speaker 2: because it's an extra added cost. So that is probably

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Speaker 2: more happening because there's a lot of nurses and midwives

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Speaker 2: that are not members with us in the Union and

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Speaker 2: the territory.

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Speaker 1: Yeah right, Kat, Do you have any idea, like on

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Speaker 1: the numbers when you talk about those that are you know,

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Speaker 1: are no longer registering or are transferring into state.

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Speaker 2: I would, but I don't have that number at the

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Speaker 2: tip of my fingers. At the moment. It's definitely more

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Speaker 2: going out or canceling or transferring into state than what's

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Speaker 2: actually coming in. But the overall numbers, so to speak,

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Speaker 2: aren't going down. We're getting new members that are currently

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Speaker 2: in the Northern Territory itself, so we're still maintaining our numbers.

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Speaker 2: But that just some more leaving or transferring out.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it is. It must be difficult. You know, our

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Speaker 1: healthcare professionals do a tremendous job, and there is no

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Speaker 1: doubt that then there is a lot of stress over

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Speaker 1: the last couple of years and it continues to be

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Speaker 1: the case. Kat, How tough is it at the moment

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Speaker 1: for our nurse inside our hospitals. I know that we've

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Speaker 1: heard in some cases we're seeing patients in corridors. It

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Speaker 1: must be pretty busy.

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Speaker 2: Definitely, and a huge colhor of the nurses and midwives

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Speaker 2: across the territory are in the novice or the learning mode.

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Speaker 2: They're coming out of Charles Dalwin University. They're doing their

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Speaker 2: grad year or in that first couple of years of

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Speaker 2: doing their grad year. The ones that tend to be

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Speaker 2: leaving or transferring out or having some furlough because they

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Speaker 2: want some downtime and they're fatigued, are more of the

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Speaker 2: mid range to the well sorry company in the right

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Speaker 2: name at the moment. So the ones that have been

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Speaker 2: you know, maybe seven or plus years in nursing or

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Speaker 2: midwire free, you're very experienced, and they're you know, having

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Speaker 2: to look after and help the graduate nurses and midwives.

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Speaker 2: So they are extra pressure. Not that that's a great strain,

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Speaker 2: but they do need help and assistance. They might not

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Speaker 2: make the layout of that ward or that particular unit,

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Speaker 2: and there's extra stress. So that the wards on their

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Speaker 2: rosters have more novice nurses and midwives just puts extra strain.

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Speaker 2: But I do know that majority there coming out of

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Speaker 2: Charles dal And University are getting employment within the territory.

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Speaker 1: Well that is good. To hear, and I think the

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Speaker 1: more of those you know, of those graduates that we

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Speaker 1: can keep in the Northern Territory, obviously, the better KAS

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Speaker 1: we did. Also when we spoke to doctor Stephen Gorley,

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Speaker 1: the NT Chair of the Australasian College for Emergency Medicine

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Speaker 1: a bit earlier this morning, he said that there does

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Speaker 1: need to be some workforce strategies put in place, maybe

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Speaker 1: a review of recruitment and retention when it comes to

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Speaker 1: our healthcare staff. Do you feel that it is the

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Speaker 1: same when it comes to our nurses.

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Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, and I've recently spoke to the Health Minister

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Speaker 2: about this, that we need to know to grow our

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Speaker 2: own in the territory. We need to be able to

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Speaker 2: retain those more experienced nurses that we already have here,

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Speaker 2: and we need to look at the ratios or the

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Speaker 2: nursing ours per patient day, per nurse per patience and

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Speaker 2: making sure that they haven't got that huge pressures on

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Speaker 2: each staff member with the number of patients that they have,

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Speaker 2: so we don't burn our staff out, and that we

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Speaker 2: keep them happy and that their rostering are happy and

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Speaker 2: therefore you'll overall keep and retain stuff.

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Speaker 1: And kat Any response from the Health Minister about that

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Speaker 1: or any commitment.

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Speaker 2: She's fully aware of what's going on, but I've probably

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Speaker 2: enlightened her to a few more areas. But she knows

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Speaker 2: that the nurses and midwifree union members don't want the

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Speaker 2: wage frees and that we're looking at more of a

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Speaker 2: percentage rather than the wage frees and the ten percent

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Speaker 2: sorry ten thousand dollar bonus compared to other states, compared

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Speaker 2: to within the territory with non government organizations are giving

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Speaker 2: their enterprise agreements a percentage wage increase. So she fully

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Speaker 2: realizes that we need to also look at the nursing

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Speaker 2: hours per patient day to make sure it's safe workloads,

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Speaker 2: to making sure that everyone is safe, the patients are

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Speaker 2: getting the due care that is required, and that the

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Speaker 2: pressures on the staff are better and not huge amounts,

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Speaker 2: and that we're able to retain them not having them

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Speaker 2: leave the territory.

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Speaker 1: Well, otherwise it's going to be really difficult, isn't it

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Speaker 1: for us to actually attract people from other states if

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Speaker 1: the working conditions and you know, the pay is better

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Speaker 1: in other locations.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, and you know we can't compete with New South Wales.

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Speaker 2: They recently gave their staff a three thousand dollars bonus

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Speaker 2: retention bonus. I don't know that the NT government can

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Speaker 2: compete with that, but we do. We need need some

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Speaker 2: more flexible job share, flexible working arrangements and to keep

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Speaker 2: our staff happy and then they'll stay here, but also

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Speaker 2: at the same time growing our own here in the

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Speaker 2: territory and hopefully that impacts with a better working, safe,

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Speaker 2: more experienced nurses in the next five years. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, Hatcher, it is always good to catch up with you.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate you having a chat with me this morning.

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Speaker 2: You're very welcome, Katie, and thank you listeners.

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Speaker 1: Thank you