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Speaker 1: Who what that bite sized?

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Speaker 2: Were there?

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Speaker 3: What?

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Speaker 4: Helen Flanagan, star of Coronation Street, reveals that she hasn't

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Speaker 4: shared a bed with her fiance, Scott Sinclair for seven

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Speaker 4: years because she co sleeps with their three kids. Now,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to forget everything I just told you except

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Speaker 4: for the words co sleeping.

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Speaker 5: Okay, done, thank you.

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Speaker 2: That's a jump, isn't it. Well I can go into

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Speaker 2: what Scottie Sinclair I don't want to know. I don't

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Speaker 2: think anyone. I don't think anyone does.

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Speaker 5: I mean the seven years things pretty wild.

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Speaker 4: Let's just talk about So I'm about to have a baby.

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Speaker 4: And as I said before, of all the infinite issues

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Speaker 4: and contravening advice around parenting, this is the crown jewel.

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Speaker 4: This is so polarizing co sleeping that I found myself

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Speaker 4: having an argument with my partner sem without even realizing

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Speaker 4: I was having an argument, Like the instinctive response I

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Speaker 4: had to the idea of our kids sleeping next to

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Speaker 4: us in a co sleeper, so not in the bed

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Speaker 4: in a coast sleeper, which is like a bassinet style thing,

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Speaker 4: versus the kids sleeping.

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Speaker 2: In another room in a cot for example.

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Speaker 4: Or you wouldn't put him in a cot in it

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Speaker 4: immediately put him in a basinet.

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Speaker 6: So both ways, bassinette is where they sleep, but we're

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Speaker 6: either saying bassin it in the bedroom or bassinet in

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Speaker 6: their own bedroom.

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Speaker 2: Potentially.

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Speaker 4: The point is there's a million different ways to skin

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Speaker 4: the cat, but ge whizz do people or sleep the child?

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Speaker 2: But g whizz do people get up in arms about it?

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Speaker 4: And I didn't even realize that I was I was

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Speaker 4: going to get up in arms about it until Sem

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Speaker 4: and I were having this argument. I was like, look,

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Speaker 4: the kid's going to sleep in a different room and

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Speaker 4: we're going to leave it there because you and I

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Speaker 4: both need to sleep and the kid's going to have

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Speaker 4: to learn some level of independence by crying. Sure, yeah, right,

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Speaker 4: that was the lot of That was the logic, because

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Speaker 4: I was like, that's the way it's going to happen.

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Speaker 2: And then she was like, no, that's not going to happen.

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Speaker 5: What's the argument for having them in the bedroom with you?

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Speaker 2: Okay, So I'll get into that.

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Speaker 4: So I start so as soon as we started having

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Speaker 4: a big blow up, if we realize we're having an

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Speaker 4: emotional argument and there's no reason to and I realized

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Speaker 4: I was just arguing for the sake of arguing. I

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Speaker 4: was like a guttural response. I had to it and

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Speaker 4: I couldn't explain it. So I was like, hang on,

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Speaker 4: will before you enter the argument, maybe go and do

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Speaker 4: some research.

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Speaker 2: So I went and looked at up well done.

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Speaker 5: I had so hard to do it.

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Speaker 6: I had to try to put it down when you've

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Speaker 6: got your blood boiling, I had to.

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Speaker 2: I just had to realize that I was. There was

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Speaker 2: no I had no rationale. It was just like, that

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Speaker 2: doesn't seem right to me.

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Speaker 4: And I remember we had the same arguments when we

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Speaker 4: were bringing out the dog, the arguments around how you

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Speaker 4: raise something, touch something primal within you. It's like, that's

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Speaker 4: how I see the world. That's how I'm going to

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Speaker 4: bring the thing into the world.

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Speaker 5: Do you also get protective of the way that you

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Speaker 5: were brought up as well?

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Speaker 2: Exactly?

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Speaker 4: So it's exactly it's attacking your integrity, you know, this

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Speaker 4: is how I was brought up.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So I went away and I looked up online co

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Speaker 4: sleeping and I did a whole bunch of research, and

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Speaker 4: there was it was fascinating.

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Speaker 2: It really was fascinating.

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Speaker 4: One of the most interesting things I found about it

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Speaker 4: was that people in lower socioeconomic communities in New York

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Speaker 4: obviously live in smaller apartments, smaller flats, and hence the

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Speaker 4: kid has to sleep in the bedroom because I've only

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Speaker 4: got one room, which led to a massive decrease in SIDS,

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Speaker 4: which is sudden infant death syndrome.

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Speaker 5: Ah, that is so interesting.

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Speaker 4: They're not in the bed with the parents, they're sleeping

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Speaker 4: in a close sleep part, right, but the kid's not

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Speaker 4: left alone in another room and you're more aware of it.

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Speaker 5: Incredible.

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Speaker 4: So that was one of the studies I found. But

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Speaker 4: then there were always other studies arguing in the other

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Speaker 4: way about the child's independence. It was very in vogue

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Speaker 4: a little while ago to leave a kid in another

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Speaker 4: room and let them cry, because that's how we get independence,

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Speaker 4: and that's how a child should.

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Speaker 2: Be brought up.

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Speaker 5: So where if you're landed, you'd love to know, of

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Speaker 5: course I would.

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Speaker 4: I want to take some calls on this. Oh yeah, nice,

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Speaker 4: so third and one six five?

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Speaker 5: Sorry have you say?

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Speaker 2: What did you have landed on? I ended up talking

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Speaker 2: to my psychologists about it. Wow yeah, wow, yeah, because

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Speaker 2: my parents were very much one way, and I was.

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Speaker 4: Like, well, I spoke to my dad about it, and

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Speaker 4: you know, yeah, he was very much one way, and

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Speaker 4: I yeah, I just wanted to broaden as much, like

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Speaker 4: because it it felt like such an important decision.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, can.

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Speaker 5: You little bit of both? Can you go one night

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Speaker 5: you're with us?

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Speaker 4: Well, I think once we figure out how the kids sleeps,

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Speaker 4: will probably just go with that.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, perfectly, don't change it up.

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Speaker 2: I better we can go into it with a plan.

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Speaker 2: But that's my plan for all parenting. Going with a plan,

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Speaker 2: but make the plan very flexible. Yeah. Yeah, So here's

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Speaker 2: what I'm going to do.

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Speaker 4: Here's what I'm going to do. Thir and one and

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Speaker 4: six five. I want to take some calls. I know

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Speaker 4: this is very polarizing. I know people think very hard

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Speaker 4: or they believe very firmly one way or the other

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Speaker 4: in this debate.

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Speaker 2: It is an intense debate. Sure, third and one and

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Speaker 2: six five. Co sleeping?

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Speaker 4: Oh my goodness, Yeah, let's burn in the flames of

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Speaker 4: opinion woods And they've already made They blocked the phone

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Speaker 4: lines thirty seconds ago. Oh my, can't believe we are

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Speaker 4: talking about co sleeping co sleeping with kids. As I

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Speaker 4: said before, I think of all the contravening issues and

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Speaker 4: debates that you have to have with your partner in

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Speaker 4: and around parenting. This one for me and Sam was like, yeah,

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Speaker 4: it went straight to Defcon three. Well, it just immediately

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Speaker 4: dropped into that space. We both had an instinctive gutural

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Speaker 4: response to it where I felt like, you know, the

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Speaker 4: children to leap in another room. And then I went

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Speaker 4: away and did some research and we actually had a

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Speaker 4: really informed, great chat about it. I ended up talking

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Speaker 4: to my psychologist about it. I spoke to Sim's dad

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Speaker 4: about it, who's also a psych probably didn't come to

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Speaker 4: me about it.

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Speaker 5: I'm pretty good in there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, surprising. Maybe one day I will maybe one

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Speaker 2: day we'll have that chat.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely, my friend.

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Speaker 4: So it is a really interesting about and I know

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Speaker 4: everybody thinks very strongly about this, but we're going to

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Speaker 4: open the phone lines because I'm interested in it.

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Speaker 2: I am interested. We have decided one way.

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Speaker 5: Are you going to reveal that week?

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Speaker 6: I can tell you now sure you don't have to

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Speaker 6: because you know, I don't even death threats and stuff like.

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Speaker 4: As long as the security guard follows me home tonight, yeah,

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Speaker 4: I can tell you.

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Speaker 5: No one attack will come up. Please land Land.

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Speaker 2: We bought a co sleeper to have in the bedroom.

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Speaker 4: With us, oh, dear for six months?

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Speaker 2: Six for six months.

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Speaker 5: Terrible decision.

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Speaker 4: And to be honest, I had this chat with well,

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Speaker 4: let's let's go to Holly and I'll show you more

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Speaker 4: about it in a second.

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Speaker 2: Holy Holly, what are your thoughts?

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Speaker 7: Hey?

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Speaker 1: Yes to co sleeping?

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Speaker 2: Okay, okay?

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Speaker 5: So why did you land on co sleeping? Holly?

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Speaker 4: Sorry?

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Speaker 5: And have you done it before you've experienced it?

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Speaker 1: Yes, I've only got one child. He is one and

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Speaker 1: a half. Now I'm been a single parent though, which

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Speaker 1: is a bit different for you guys. So I have

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Speaker 1: been co sleeping ever since he was born. So I

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Speaker 1: just want to mention, you know, your partner might not

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Speaker 1: have the best birth and she's gonna, you know, be

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Speaker 1: in a lot of pain, So why would she want

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Speaker 1: to get out of bed all.

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Speaker 3: The way.

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Speaker 7: Check on the child?

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Speaker 1: If you guys are going to take it in.

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Speaker 2: Te it's easy for her, isn't it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, she's the one who's going to be feeding all night.

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Speaker 4: And that was part of the discussion we had and

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Speaker 4: Sam said that very very well.

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Speaker 2: She was right.

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Speaker 4: She was like, look, mate, if I'm going to be

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Speaker 4: the one who's going to be breast feeding it. I

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Speaker 4: would like to be in a position where I can

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Speaker 4: just roll over and breastfeed the child, yeah, and then

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Speaker 4: put the child back in the CoA sleeper.

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Speaker 6: And I know you were saying you were worried about

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Speaker 6: sleep with the co sleeping arrangement, but like, surely it's

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Speaker 6: a less abrupt process. There will probably be occasions where

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Speaker 6: she can just wake up, breastfeed and put the baye

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Speaker 6: back and you can keep sleeping.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but that's not the priority here was I'm just

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Speaker 4: saying you were worried about sleep.

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Speaker 2: I don't think I didn't say I was worried about sleep,

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Speaker 2: didn't you. No, No, that'll be my service man, it's

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Speaker 2: my child. I'll be up. I'll be ready.

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Speaker 4: She's carried the child for nine months, you know I'll

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Speaker 4: be It'll be me. And if I had a burd

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Speaker 4: bud feed it myself. Let's get to damny armed.

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Speaker 2: I'm six.

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Speaker 4: But it's funny though, because that's a big part of it.

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Speaker 4: Like when I spoke to my dad, you know, the

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Speaker 4: first it's a very old school way. It's like he

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Speaker 4: was like, well, look, I needed my sleep, because you know,

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Speaker 4: I was at the hospital at six am the next morning.

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Speaker 4: So there's no way that I could stand with the

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Speaker 4: child in the room for all that long. Yeah right, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: it's like there's merit to that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know, but it's it's it's all. That's

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Speaker 2: why this is such a polarizing topic.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely, And here we are right in the middle of

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Speaker 5: it in the cool room. I's got a Damien here.

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Speaker 2: Damien.

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Speaker 5: You planned one way, we went the other way. Talk

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Speaker 5: us through it.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So first off, big fan boys, love your work.

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Speaker 3: So my wife, our daughter to sleep in our room.

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Speaker 3: I wanted her to sleep in her own room. Went

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Speaker 3: with that for a while. Then when she come home

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Speaker 3: and the first time she cried, she was straight in

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Speaker 3: our room. Mate, Yeah, okay, I would say, honestly, it's

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Speaker 3: an instinct thing. As soon as you knew that cry,

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Speaker 3: you're like, I want to make about it. I want

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Speaker 3: to make sure she's happy. I want to make everything.

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Speaker 3: And two years on and she's still sleeping in our room.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that. I love that.

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Speaker 5: That's so interesting. Yeah, isn't it ever you leave her

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Speaker 5: baby crying in another room, you.

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Speaker 2: Know, fascinating.

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Speaker 4: It's it's really like this is and on the crying

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Speaker 4: chat This is the chat that I have with Sim's dad.

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Speaker 4: He told me that they kept her another it was

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Speaker 4: very in vogue to do this controlled crying thing where

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Speaker 4: you left a kid in another room.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, right, to let them cry and so to build

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Speaker 2: independence in the child. And he said to me he

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Speaker 2: regretted it.

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Speaker 5: Oh, it was like it was a really because I

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Speaker 5: had much dress. He was under leaving.

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Speaker 4: He just said to me, he was like, I don't

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Speaker 4: think you can spoil a child with love.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Oh wow, that's beautiful. God, I love the Dutch.

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Speaker 2: Let's go to let's.

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Speaker 5: Expert.

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Speaker 6: You're an expert and you're you're you're a child health nurse,

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Speaker 6: so you've got a bit of a bit of kudos

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Speaker 6: behind this opinion.

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Speaker 5: What are your thoughts?

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Speaker 7: So, yeah, so that's right. I'm a Matillan child half nurse.

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Speaker 7: And so the advice that we normally give for when

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Speaker 7: babies come home with his parents is around the safe

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Speaker 7: sleeping guidelines or the Red Nose websites. That's right, correct, correct.

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Speaker 7: The recommendations are that to have babies in the room

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Speaker 7: with you up to sort of six to twelve months. Yeah,

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Speaker 7: co sleeping, So that's baby in the bed with you.

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Speaker 7: Is something that we don't normally recommend. Yeah, wherever we

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Speaker 7: do know a lot of families do that, and there

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Speaker 7: is some new information on the website around them that

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Speaker 7: choose to do that.

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Speaker 2: My terminology is not right here is it I'm talking about?

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Speaker 4: We have a coastly per which is like a bassinette

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Speaker 4: which goes next to the bed, as opposed to coastlye

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Speaker 4: ping which is the baby, which is the baby in

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Speaker 4: the bed, and that's that's where the kids comes in

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Speaker 4: with the red nose.

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Speaker 2: Yes, thank you for clearing that up. I am very

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Speaker 2: new to this so really appreciate it.

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Speaker 7: That's all right, You're welcome. Just say that you know

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Speaker 7: when you're when you've had your baby, we'll get an

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Speaker 7: notification from the hospital, and depending on where you live,

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Speaker 7: you'll get a home visit from one of the maternal

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Speaker 7: happinesses that way in Victoria.

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Speaker 1: Go through all of that.

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Speaker 2: Do you want to come yourself? You can come around.

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Speaker 7: I'd love to see you. You be very happy to

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Speaker 7: see you, but you're probably a bit star away from my.

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Speaker 4: People.

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Speaker 5: Will speak to your paper.

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Speaker 1: Don't call me, don't more of the boys on the

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Speaker 1: full podcast Just scroll up