Speaker 1: Okay, I have actually been dying for an update.
Speaker 2: You've been talking earlier in the week about how your
Speaker 2: smallest daughter, Lola or I fondly call her Lola Derby.
Speaker 2: You've been talking about her being an absolute nightmare in
Speaker 2: your bed.
Speaker 3: No, nothing's changed. So Lola's four for anyone who's not familiar.
Speaker 3: So at nighttime she gets into my bed every night.
Speaker 3: We're at the point now where I say good night
Speaker 3: to her and I'll be like, see you in the
Speaker 3: morning's sweetheart, and I give your a little kiss, and
Speaker 3: she goes na, mummy, see you soon, and she just
Speaker 3: she gets up at midnight, wanders through the dark, climbs
Speaker 3: into my bed and then she sleeps horizontally across it.
Speaker 3: And to the point now where Matt gets out and
Speaker 3: he goes and sleeps in.
Speaker 4: The spare room.
Speaker 2: It also sounds so calculated and evil, like see you soon,
Speaker 2: Like she knows. She's like, I'm not gonna wait for
Speaker 2: a nightmare or I'm not gonna wait to wake up.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna literally like I'll pretend to go to
Speaker 1: sleep for ten minutes.
Speaker 3: And it's every single night clockwork. My child's body clock
Speaker 3: is midnight mum's room.
Speaker 1: Well, you have been talking about this.
Speaker 2: I mean you and I have been friends for a
Speaker 2: very long time, and this has been an.
Speaker 1: Issue from as long as I can remember.
Speaker 2: And recently I saw a pediatrician online.
Speaker 1: His name is doctor Gollye, and he was going pretty
Speaker 1: viral for his sleep technique.
Speaker 2: He says he's a sleep expert for like unsettled babies
Speaker 2: and really helping distraught families like yourself.
Speaker 4: I'm not restraught, I'm just tired.
Speaker 2: So I've got him on the phone because I figure
Speaker 2: doctor Gollie is going to be able to help you
Speaker 2: where I can't.
Speaker 1: Doctor Gollie, welcome to the pickup.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2: Now you're going viral for this camp out method, can
Speaker 2: you explain.
Speaker 1: What this is?
Speaker 5: It's really, to say, not a rip off the band
Speaker 5: aid method. It's a slow way of getting kids to
Speaker 5: sleep through the night in their own room. If the
Speaker 5: issue is they have created a little bit of a
Speaker 5: shall we say, unhealthy or unwarranted in Laura's case, attachment.
Speaker 3: To mum or dad or both, I mean feeling personally
Speaker 3: victimized here unhealthy also, But okay, how does this work?
Speaker 4: Because we've tried.
Speaker 3: We've tried a few different things, and like, what do
Speaker 3: you tried, Laura telling her to stay in her own bed.
Speaker 1: Locking her in there the pad lot, She just finds.
Speaker 4: A way back.
Speaker 3: It doesn't matter where I am, because like, I'll move.
Speaker 3: I don't always sleep in my own bed. Sometimes I
Speaker 3: sleep in the spare room. She's just like I find you,
Speaker 3: and she comes through the night and then I hear
Speaker 3: a little footsteps down the hallway and there she is,
Speaker 3: like a dementor, next to the bed in the dark.
Speaker 5: I think the really important thing to note is that
Speaker 5: if it's not a problem for you, it's the problem.
Speaker 5: You don't want this, But for all your listeners, if
Speaker 5: it's not a problem, and if you kind of like it,
Speaker 5: and there a lot of parents you say to me,
Speaker 5: you know, this is such a short period of time
Speaker 5: when the kids know they're young, and they're cute and
Speaker 5: cuddly and their little koalas, and I really want that,
Speaker 5: I love that. Then there's absolutely nothing I'm healthy about it.
Speaker 5: It's not I don't want anyone to feel like they
Speaker 5: have to make this change if they're really happy with
Speaker 5: co sleeping or kids coming into your night in the
Speaker 5: middle of the night. It's absolutely totally fine. It's healthy,
Speaker 5: not an issue. But if you, Madie, want your own bed,
Speaker 5: your own space without kids coming in the middle of
Speaker 5: the night, it is definitely something you can fix.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say when she was younger, because she
Speaker 3: used to be a really good sleeper, and so when
Speaker 3: she was younger, it didn't bother us, like we were
Speaker 3: quite happy to have her climb in the bed and
Speaker 3: she'd sleep between us. But now that she's older, she
Speaker 3: just kind of motors around and so someone ends up
Speaker 3: getting kicked in the back or kicked in the side.
Speaker 3: But this method that you're speaking of, the camp out method,
Speaker 3: I mean Bridge shown me a little bit about it,
Speaker 3: and I have my questions because I'm not convinced it's
Speaker 3: going to work in our household.
Speaker 1: What are you doing in the camp out method? Where
Speaker 1: does Laura start?
Speaker 5: So it takes anywhere from one week to four weeks,
Speaker 5: depending on how quickly you want to actually maneuver this method.
Speaker 5: But essentially you put Lolly in her bedroom, in her
Speaker 5: bed where you intend for her to sleep the way
Speaker 5: you're currently doing it. But then at the same time
Speaker 5: you go to bed in the same room, so you
Speaker 5: actually move a single mattress into her room, and you
Speaker 5: both sleep through the night together in that same room,
Speaker 5: but in separate beds. And the summary of the method
Speaker 5: is that ever so slowly you move that mattress closer
Speaker 5: and closer to the door, eventually on the other side
Speaker 5: of the door in the hallway, and then again you
Speaker 5: inch it every night or two further away until eventually
Speaker 5: it's in the corridor, and then magically just returned to
Speaker 5: your own bedroom.
Speaker 3: Okay, my fear is that this is an absolute stitch up,
Speaker 3: and we will both be sleeping in a trundle bed
Speaker 3: in the hallway. That's what I think it's gonna happen.
Speaker 3: She will just come, she will just come to me.
Speaker 3: She'll get out of her bed and walk across the room.
Speaker 1: Do you think this is a full proof method, doctor Gollie?
Speaker 2: Like, do you think obviously Laura might be at you
Speaker 2: said two to four weeks, she might be at the
Speaker 2: full week.
Speaker 1: You might edge up the hallway for a month, Laura.
Speaker 2: But do you think that this is full proof that
Speaker 2: any child, any relationship with a parent, this can.
Speaker 1: Work for them.
Speaker 5: There's no such thing as foolproof when it comes to pediatrics.
Speaker 5: But the more you set yourself up for success, the
Speaker 5: more likely you are to succeed. So we have to
Speaker 5: sort of unpick what it is with all. Is she
Speaker 5: worried about something in particular? Is there a dog barking?
Speaker 5: Is something waking her making her home settled? Is it
Speaker 5: just the temperature change that happens at midnight and that's
Speaker 5: why she's waking up? You know, we can use positive reinforcements,
Speaker 5: so it might be a reward chart that you build
Speaker 5: up towards a gift or an experience with mum and
Speaker 5: Dad and Malie, whatever it may be. It's almost like
Speaker 5: you have to have the stars aligned and then you
Speaker 5: can implement the camping out method if you need to.
Speaker 5: But she's probably just seeking that connection, that reassurance that
Speaker 5: mummy's close by, the other thing that you know, as
Speaker 5: a pediatrician, I can't help but think of is especially
Speaker 5: if you notice when she's coming into your bed at
Speaker 5: nighttime and she's tossing and turning, do we actually have
Speaker 5: a sleep problem? Like do we need to explore her
Speaker 5: sleep and maybe her airway. There's so many different parts
Speaker 5: to this puzzle.
Speaker 1: Have you actually about Laura, Like genuinely.
Speaker 2: Have you asked her why she comes in, Like, have
Speaker 2: you tried to get to the bottom of like if
Speaker 2: she's hot, is she having nightmares or terrors?
Speaker 1: Or does she just want to.
Speaker 2: Be with you?
Speaker 3: She just says she just wants to be cuddled. She
Speaker 3: wants to be in bed with us and have a cuddle.
Speaker 2: So could you get one of those huge pill like
Speaker 2: a pregnancy pillow, like one of those ones that wrap
Speaker 2: surround her or something.
Speaker 1: Well, I think that we can give this a go, Laura.
Speaker 2: I think you need to put what doctor Gollie has
Speaker 2: said into practice.
Speaker 1: This is for yourself. I'm not doing it for me.
Speaker 1: I'm not doing it for the content.
Speaker 2: I'm doing it purely because I want to help you
Speaker 2: have a better night sleep and I will.
Speaker 4: Be the sacrificial am.
Speaker 3: Oh.
Speaker 4: Look, we'll report back and see how this works.
Speaker 5: You can throw Maddie under the bus, so you can
Speaker 5: do it.
Speaker 4: Nah, she doesn't want a dad, She only wants me. Yeah.
Speaker 3: She screams at him get out of my room and
Speaker 3: time if he goes. So she's definitely got some mad
Speaker 3: parental preference happenings.
Speaker 1: Like you need to make an appointment to come and see.
Speaker 2: Me all right.
Speaker 3: Well, thank you so much for joining the show. I
Speaker 3: appreciate the help. I need all of it
Speaker 5: Anytime.