WEBVTT - TAKING RISKS IN TELEVISION. THE STUFF OF LEGENDS!

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome back to TV Reload. My name's Benjamin Norris and

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<v Speaker 1>on this podcast I'll be going behind the scenes with

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<v Speaker 1>the biggest players in television today. On the podcast, I

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<v Speaker 1>have a pretty big deal. And that's my words and

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<v Speaker 1>not his. It's CEO and MD at ITV Studios. David

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<v Speaker 1>Mott a man who has made a mark on Australian

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<v Speaker 1>television with an I for detail, partnership and friendships that

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<v Speaker 1>have seen him work at Channel seven, Channel nine and

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<v Speaker 1>Channel ten, famously stopping along the way as Head of

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<v Speaker 1>Programming and then as Chief Programming Officer at Channel ten.

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<v Speaker 1>He has danced between networks and production studios for as

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<v Speaker 1>long as I've been alive. David Mott has taken risks,

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<v Speaker 1>played it safe, mixed it up, and he never talks

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<v Speaker 1>too long without acknowledging the people who work around him.

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<v Speaker 1>He has been responsible for commissioning some of the biggest

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<v Speaker 1>Australian content and continues to make programs on Free to

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<v Speaker 1>wear that you want to watch. So let's get started

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<v Speaker 1>with some exclusive content on how these shows get made.

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<v Speaker 2>I think in a business that we're in, you certainly

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<v Speaker 2>have your moments.

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<v Speaker 1>It's time to go. Sarah Marie.

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<v Speaker 2>What was interesting about that was we actually didn't put

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<v Speaker 2>it to air.

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<v Speaker 1>I share a flat with Alex Scan. We're pretty much opposites.

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<v Speaker 2>I would like to see the Australian broadcasters take a

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<v Speaker 2>few more risks.

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<v Speaker 3>Last night on Mastership Australia.

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<v Speaker 2>Mastership was clearly one that we were very nervous about.

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<v Speaker 1>If I've paid money to see that performance, I would

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<v Speaker 1>be asking for that money.

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<v Speaker 2>But if you've got a platform of content that's working

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<v Speaker 2>really well, you can afford to kind of take a

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<v Speaker 2>few risks.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the podcast, Welcome to TV reload mate, this

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<v Speaker 1>is quite something.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm looking forward to it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, can I embarrass you just a little bit? I

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<v Speaker 1>know that you'll probably hate this, but I've been swimming

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<v Speaker 1>in some of the greatest minds of television for the

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<v Speaker 1>last month, and so many people in the industry have

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<v Speaker 1>mentioned you, But then they've paused to say, what a

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<v Speaker 1>lovely man said in such a specific way. How have

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<v Speaker 1>you managed to cultivate such a positive repute in an

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<v Speaker 1>industry that, in all intensive purposes is quite cutthroat.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh my god, they don't know me very well. First

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<v Speaker 2>of all, thank you, that's a very nice comment. And

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<v Speaker 2>I think in a business that we're in, you certainly

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<v Speaker 2>have your moments in your days, Ben, There's no question

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<v Speaker 2>about that. Probably come from great parents, great upbringing, who

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<v Speaker 2>the hell knows, but here we are and it's been

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<v Speaker 2>a fascinating journey for me and love to tell some stories.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, look, you commissioned the first Big Brother Australian idol,

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<v Speaker 1>also the first Master Chef and the project. What do

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<v Speaker 1>you look for in good television content?

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<v Speaker 2>You know, when I look back finally at some of

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<v Speaker 2>the shows that we commissioned, we took some risks back

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<v Speaker 2>in those days, and I think, if anything, if there's

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<v Speaker 2>any sort of legacy to leave behind, there's sort of

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<v Speaker 2>that notion of, you know what, you've really got to

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<v Speaker 2>take some risk. Nowadays in life they're always considered risks,

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<v Speaker 2>but if you really want to sort of change the

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<v Speaker 2>way that people think about content or really take some

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<v Speaker 2>sort of bold steps, but to do that, you've got

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<v Speaker 2>to have good people around you, and that's what it is.

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<v Speaker 2>But I think for me in the days of I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>Big Brother was extraordinary in its day, that turn Channel

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<v Speaker 2>ten around, But you know, it's an interesting cycle in

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<v Speaker 2>terms of where television was and how you know, these

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<v Speaker 2>formats come back into play again as Big Brother did,

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<v Speaker 2>and now we're seeing a third iteration of it. So

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<v Speaker 2>it just goes to show that those brands that have

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<v Speaker 2>longevity to them, they will be around for many years

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<v Speaker 2>to come because they've got something in the dna of

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<v Speaker 2>what they are. And sure, other shows come and go,

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<v Speaker 2>so you try and find that content that really puts

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<v Speaker 2>people into a great immersive position where it's not another

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<v Speaker 2>renovation show, it's not another cooking show. And hey, I

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<v Speaker 2>replaced Big Brother with Master Chefs, so I know about

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<v Speaker 2>cooking shows. I think something in there. There was Yasin's

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<v Speaker 2>getting Married, which you know, talk about it, talk about,

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<v Speaker 2>talk about it, talking about it's actually become the vernacular.

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<v Speaker 2>I think in terms of doing a Gasmin Yasmin's getting Married.

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<v Speaker 2>Could it be that lasted for a big four days

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<v Speaker 2>on television, But you know, that was all part of it.

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<v Speaker 2>It was all part of taking risks and going, you

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<v Speaker 2>know what, you've got to have an each way bet

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<v Speaker 2>on these things. Arguably Yasmin was where the Bachelor is

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<v Speaker 2>today or shows of that nature, So maybe it's sort

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<v Speaker 2>of ahead of its time in terms of that sort

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<v Speaker 2>of dating genre. And that's the way I always like

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<v Speaker 2>to look at it anyway, try to put a positive

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<v Speaker 2>sort of spin on it. But you know, then you

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<v Speaker 2>sort of look back with days of Australian I on

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<v Speaker 2>the innocence of that. I mean that show with Guy

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<v Speaker 2>and obviously we're working with Guy on The Voice now,

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<v Speaker 2>which my production company's producing. It's really funny catching up

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<v Speaker 2>with Guy and thinking back to those very very early

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<v Speaker 2>days of Australia and here we are ten years later,

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<v Speaker 2>and look at us even now we've just put in

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<v Speaker 2>with Channel seven, we've moved the so we've got Jess

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<v Speaker 2>Melboy again. It was very much a part of Australian idol.

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<v Speaker 2>So there's the beautiful things that come out of it

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<v Speaker 2>as a result, but it was also the innocence of

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<v Speaker 2>what idol present as well. No one knew what we

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<v Speaker 2>really had. There'd been pop stars and we just felt

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<v Speaker 2>that maybe there was something in Australian idol. So there's

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<v Speaker 2>nothing better than seeing a show come from what was

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<v Speaker 2>a really good idea to kind of going seeing it

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<v Speaker 2>being realized and then seeing it and then see it perform.

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<v Speaker 2>And yeah, you get the highs and lows, but they're

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<v Speaker 2>the ones that you have great memories of.

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<v Speaker 1>Is there a show that you fought really hard to

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<v Speaker 1>get made and that you still to this day feel

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<v Speaker 1>genuinely proud of.

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<v Speaker 2>Had many children that I loved throughout the time. I

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<v Speaker 2>think Marster's shift was clearly one that we were very

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<v Speaker 2>nervous about. And it wasn't just me, it was from

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<v Speaker 2>the CEO down Grant Blackly at the time as well,

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<v Speaker 2>who's now at SCA. We just felt something special about

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<v Speaker 2>food in the way that was going to present and

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<v Speaker 2>we had Jamie Oliver, we did some series with him,

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<v Speaker 2>We Didift, a local version, and so we knew there

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<v Speaker 2>was interest in food and it was a big call

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<v Speaker 2>to kind of replace Big Brother with it. It was

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<v Speaker 2>quite a shift from there, But yeah, I suppose that

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<v Speaker 2>would have to be arguably the one that was something

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<v Speaker 2>that not only did it capture the hearts and imaginations

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<v Speaker 2>of everyone and Shine Back then did a beautiful job

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<v Speaker 2>and they still do a beautiful job in Australia's First Master.

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<v Speaker 2>Jeff has to have that kind of genius that sometimes

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<v Speaker 2>fails and sometimes succeeds amazing letter. But here's another format

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<v Speaker 2>that's ten years on and it's lived through many iterations.

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<v Speaker 2>We've had Junior, you've had Celebrity and the All Stars. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and the core premise of what that show represents it's

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<v Speaker 2>still here ten years later, so I think there's something

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<v Speaker 2>quite special on that. Even thank God you're here and

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<v Speaker 2>Rode back in the day and the biggest those that

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<v Speaker 2>did a fantastic job for the network. We tried to

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<v Speaker 2>position ourselves at the time of sort of playing in

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<v Speaker 2>a different place where seven and nine wouldn't play, I suppose,

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<v Speaker 2>and with that comes as risk. Even Offspring was fantastic

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<v Speaker 2>sleect Life of Us, some sort of bold dramas that

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<v Speaker 2>the others wouldn't play in. I'll be perfectly honest with you,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think I could go back to the broadcast

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<v Speaker 2>business now because I don't know if I'd be any

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<v Speaker 2>good at it, because it's shifted so much from back

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<v Speaker 2>in those days when you happily had five chattels to

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<v Speaker 2>deal with, there were no streaming services and what have you.

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<v Speaker 2>So I do go. My god, I have nothing but

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<v Speaker 2>respect for those that are working in that side of

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<v Speaker 2>it now. I'm very happy to be going in there

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<v Speaker 2>going hey, by my show.

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<v Speaker 1>How did you feel in regard to the response of

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<v Speaker 1>I'm a celebrity. It's rated so well. Did you think

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<v Speaker 1>that this show was going to work being filmed here

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<v Speaker 1>in Australia.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we found that we were coming off a very

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<v Speaker 2>strong base. Aguly, the show could have been done from

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<v Speaker 2>Australia from day one, but it's that fish out of water,

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<v Speaker 2>that cultural clash that I think it was probably a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit easier once you've established what the brand is

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<v Speaker 2>to go, hey, now we're in Australia. It seemed like

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<v Speaker 2>an easy shift from South Africa to Australia. Well, it wasn't.

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<v Speaker 2>From a business point of view, it was quite challenging,

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<v Speaker 2>but there was nothing but support from ten in wanting

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<v Speaker 2>to and also I think the viewer has got it.

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<v Speaker 2>Clearly you can't go overseas, so clearly it has to

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<v Speaker 2>be in Australia. So I think that gave us the

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<v Speaker 2>license to do that and we're very happy with the result.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think Channel ten have been great supporters of

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<v Speaker 2>the show right from the start and got even when

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<v Speaker 2>I was at Channel ten, we were very close to

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<v Speaker 2>commissioning it never did though. It was a risky proposition.

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<v Speaker 2>It's not a cheap show to produce, so therefore it's

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<v Speaker 2>not a cheap show for Channel ten to license. So

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<v Speaker 2>it's a big commitment from them, And probably in its

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<v Speaker 2>early days it was up against MKR. And when Beverly

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<v Speaker 2>and I had a conversation around the brand, particularly when

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<v Speaker 2>she lost the sport, and she said, look, I've been

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<v Speaker 2>thinking about Celebrity being playing it in January, and I said,

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<v Speaker 2>I think that's a brilliant move. No one was really

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<v Speaker 2>expecting it to go. My god, why can't you put

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<v Speaker 2>a big show, an investing content in January? And oh,

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<v Speaker 2>the official rating season don't start in February. Well, you

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<v Speaker 2>know what, And there's a term that I use in space.

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<v Speaker 2>No one can hear you scream. If you don't have

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<v Speaker 2>decent content on, no one's going to be able to

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<v Speaker 2>see your schedule, your primos and all those sort of things.

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<v Speaker 2>And quite frankly, it was a brilliant strategic move. Obviously

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<v Speaker 2>going to say that now it's worked, but it was.

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<v Speaker 2>And so here we are sort of six seasons on

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<v Speaker 2>and we're now talking about season seven.

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<v Speaker 1>What do you think about these shows being rebooted overlooking

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<v Speaker 1>for new concepts.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, first of all, it says the strength of those

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<v Speaker 2>brands with the reboot, it says just how great they

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<v Speaker 2>as we're talking about before the fact that Big Brothers

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<v Speaker 2>back again, and I mean they're kind of evergreen shows

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<v Speaker 2>that will be around for years to come. And you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I think Celebrity is going to be around for a

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<v Speaker 2>long time now. It will have a moment and then

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<v Speaker 2>it will come back. The voice will have a moment

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<v Speaker 2>and then you know, it'll come back. So you've got

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<v Speaker 2>those brands that just have something quite special about them

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<v Speaker 2>and so unique. You know, I can understand the broadcasters

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<v Speaker 2>sort of going, you know what, it's improven brand, we

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<v Speaker 2>know how it works. It's time for a reboot, or

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<v Speaker 2>it's time to sort of bring it back because there's

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<v Speaker 2>always an audience with it because the basic bones and

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<v Speaker 2>principle of the show can still work today in today's environment,

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<v Speaker 2>even though you've got s good players and what have you,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think certainly a place that the freeedomares need

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<v Speaker 2>to play them from a free to air point of view.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, we could talk about scripted and those areas

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<v Speaker 2>a bit more challenged from a free to air point

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<v Speaker 2>of view, but certainly big entertainment shows, we certainly are

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<v Speaker 2>not moving away from strip reality anytime soon you can

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<v Speaker 2>see that whether you like it or not, it's what

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<v Speaker 2>the audience are wanting. So it's all about finding what

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<v Speaker 2>that new world could be that you can mine and

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<v Speaker 2>you can kind of create, and it might be a

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<v Speaker 2>little show that we have at ITV to go my god,

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<v Speaker 2>could you actually build that out to be a multi

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<v Speaker 2>four night week series. So we're always looking for the

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<v Speaker 2>what that looks like and then mash it in and

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<v Speaker 2>then kind of build something out of it. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>you know when we did Biggest Loser, that was only

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<v Speaker 2>a ninety minute show on NBC on Tuesday nights, and

0:11:37.160 --> 0:11:39.760
<v Speaker 2>we're running the US version and that kind of workdayk

0:11:40.280 --> 0:11:44.320
<v Speaker 2>do it? Could that become five hours a week? And

0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:47.440
<v Speaker 2>you know how much weight can people lose? Well a

0:11:47.480 --> 0:11:51.520
<v Speaker 2>fair bit. So even now you're talking to the UK

0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:56.400
<v Speaker 2>and how we as broadcast as promote shows compared to

0:11:56.440 --> 0:11:59.240
<v Speaker 2>the UK, and I said, look, you've got to talk

0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:02.760
<v Speaker 2>about shows just for the Australian market and they go, oh, yeah,

0:12:02.800 --> 0:12:04.080
<v Speaker 2>we know Australia. I said, no, I don't think you

0:12:04.120 --> 0:12:07.640
<v Speaker 2>do know the Australian market. I don't know the strip

0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:10.840
<v Speaker 2>sensibility and what are married at first sight? Looks like

0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:13.840
<v Speaker 2>and what a Lego Master's or a voice is stripped,

0:12:13.880 --> 0:12:17.280
<v Speaker 2>and you know Survivor is stripped and everything's about this

0:12:17.360 --> 0:12:20.880
<v Speaker 2>strip mentality. So what I did by Head of Development MICHAEH.

0:12:20.960 --> 0:12:23.760
<v Speaker 2>Houston and I we went to a conference pre COVID

0:12:23.760 --> 0:12:26.360
<v Speaker 2>of course, and we sat down, we showed them some

0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:28.439
<v Speaker 2>of the pro boats and you know, in the year

0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:32.080
<v Speaker 2>car to be if if you really don't mind, would

0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:34.600
<v Speaker 2>you mind watching our show Sunday night at seven o'clock.

0:12:34.800 --> 0:12:37.160
<v Speaker 2>Jolly good, thank you very much, it'd be nice.

0:12:37.040 --> 0:12:41.840
<v Speaker 4>Whereas whereas literally in Australia, it's this piece of Lego

0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:47.640
<v Speaker 4>will change your life, good global phenomena.

0:12:51.720 --> 0:13:01.080
<v Speaker 2>Sorry to an incredible Newhi Lego Masters and after the

0:13:01.160 --> 0:13:05.760
<v Speaker 2>break the biggest show ever is about to happen, and

0:13:06.400 --> 0:13:09.079
<v Speaker 2>they kind of got it and went, oh my god,

0:13:09.280 --> 0:13:12.640
<v Speaker 2>I want to watch that now. And that's the way

0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:15.640
<v Speaker 2>we produce shows is very different to a lot of

0:13:15.679 --> 0:13:19.080
<v Speaker 2>other territories, so to get their mindset around, oh okay,

0:13:19.120 --> 0:13:21.520
<v Speaker 2>we get it now. But you know, but having said

0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:25.080
<v Speaker 2>that too, there's definitely room for other content. And I

0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:29.240
<v Speaker 2>do look at shows that we're producing the Cube at

0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:33.800
<v Speaker 2>the moment, and we've secured Andy Lee, which is absolutely

0:13:33.880 --> 0:13:35.920
<v Speaker 2>the right show for him, and I'm so pleased that

0:13:36.000 --> 0:13:39.480
<v Speaker 2>he has agreed to do it because he brings something

0:13:39.640 --> 0:13:42.160
<v Speaker 2>very unique to the format and I know that he

0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:45.120
<v Speaker 2>was a fan of the show, and of course I've

0:13:45.160 --> 0:13:47.599
<v Speaker 2>known him for years when we did the Caravan a

0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:50.160
<v Speaker 2>Courage and had them on segments a row, and so

0:13:50.280 --> 0:13:53.000
<v Speaker 2>I was looking for the right project for him and

0:13:53.800 --> 0:13:56.400
<v Speaker 2>he just loves it. So we've just finished filming. At

0:13:56.400 --> 0:13:59.200
<v Speaker 2>the moment, the format is great in its own right.

0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:03.240
<v Speaker 2>People are playing these sort of parlor games, if you will,

0:14:03.520 --> 0:14:06.120
<v Speaker 2>within the confines of a four x fourmut of cube,

0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:08.599
<v Speaker 2>but under the pressure of the cube, under pressure of

0:14:08.640 --> 0:14:11.280
<v Speaker 2>a lot of prize money. But then it's a great

0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:13.800
<v Speaker 2>format in its own right, and so we secured the

0:14:13.840 --> 0:14:18.560
<v Speaker 2>format for Australia. But then adding Andy's elements to it

0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:22.120
<v Speaker 2>and what he brings to it is really quite something special.

0:14:22.920 --> 0:14:25.920
<v Speaker 2>The games might look simple, but with the whole of

0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:30.400
<v Speaker 2>Australia watching and a quarter a million dollars in the line,

0:14:31.560 --> 0:14:34.560
<v Speaker 2>it's not that simple, is it. That launches on ten?

0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:36.880
<v Speaker 2>But now that's not a strip that's going to be

0:14:36.960 --> 0:14:41.120
<v Speaker 2>a weekly standalone show. I'm not quite sure We're ten

0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:42.680
<v Speaker 2>of running it yet, I've got a bit of an idea,

0:14:42.760 --> 0:14:45.000
<v Speaker 2>but I don't think it's locked in yet. So that's

0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:48.840
<v Speaker 2>kind of got to stand above everything else. And that's

0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:51.240
<v Speaker 2>what I love about it because you know what it does,

0:14:51.320 --> 0:14:53.840
<v Speaker 2>because it's a very different show to anything else.

0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.040
<v Speaker 1>I think it already has good buzz like I think

0:14:57.040 --> 0:14:59.840
<v Speaker 1>that's what you need as well. You need the groundswell

0:15:00.080 --> 0:15:02.480
<v Speaker 1>of that sort of surfacing. What sort of notes do

0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:04.760
<v Speaker 1>you hand over about casting? Do you have a brief

0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:06.880
<v Speaker 1>that you come in and say, look, this is what

0:15:06.920 --> 0:15:09.240
<v Speaker 1>I kind of want at the groundset?

0:15:10.200 --> 0:15:13.120
<v Speaker 2>I think always feel that you know the way. I'll

0:15:13.200 --> 0:15:16.320
<v Speaker 2>leaders lead with the team and we work with the broadcasters.

0:15:16.360 --> 0:15:19.000
<v Speaker 2>Obviously from a casting point of view, we've got a

0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:22.680
<v Speaker 2>great cast of the blinds for the voice that we're

0:15:22.720 --> 0:15:25.560
<v Speaker 2>recording soon. In terms of artists, you don't really know

0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:28.200
<v Speaker 2>what's going to happen after that, but you'll depending on

0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:32.960
<v Speaker 2>the coaches certainly. The casting on celebrity is a very

0:15:33.000 --> 0:15:36.960
<v Speaker 2>detailed process that we go through with the broadcaster, and

0:15:37.400 --> 0:15:40.000
<v Speaker 2>it's just all done in conjunction. You know, what are

0:15:40.000 --> 0:15:43.920
<v Speaker 2>we missing? What do we need again? Alex Is at

0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:46.920
<v Speaker 2>nine or ten. We'll always sort of look at and

0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:49.280
<v Speaker 2>he's very good from that point of view and understanding

0:15:49.280 --> 0:15:52.000
<v Speaker 2>what he thinks the show needs. So there's a lot

0:15:52.040 --> 0:15:55.240
<v Speaker 2>of work that goes into that casting process. So I

0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:59.080
<v Speaker 2>think we're all hands in knowing that by and large,

0:15:59.400 --> 0:16:01.760
<v Speaker 2>you need a it's going to engage an audience. You

0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:03.760
<v Speaker 2>need a cast that's going to put their bags down,

0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:07.840
<v Speaker 2>make a shitloader noise and maybe not last a distance.

0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:10.120
<v Speaker 2>And then you need those ones that are going to

0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:12.120
<v Speaker 2>sort of be the ones that will start to shine

0:16:12.120 --> 0:16:16.640
<v Speaker 2>and come through a week or so later. Introverts, extroverts.

0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.520
<v Speaker 2>You really need an element of that with all your casting.

0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:22.880
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's a process. You work very closy from

0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:24.560
<v Speaker 2>production to broadcast.

0:16:24.440 --> 0:16:27.400
<v Speaker 1>One hundred percent. You know, after working in such integral

0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:29.840
<v Speaker 1>roles right across the country with all of the Freeedoware

0:16:29.880 --> 0:16:31.800
<v Speaker 1>networks at some point or another, you know some of

0:16:31.800 --> 0:16:34.680
<v Speaker 1>them for seventeen years. What do you think nine, seven,

0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:37.480
<v Speaker 1>and ten are doing right moving into twenty twenty one.

0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:43.520
<v Speaker 5>I would say that there's certainly when you look at

0:16:43.760 --> 0:16:48.000
<v Speaker 5>the schedules, they're very competitive schedules now in terms of

0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:49.520
<v Speaker 5>what their offerings are.

0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:54.040
<v Speaker 2>I think seven have made a shift away from I

0:16:54.080 --> 0:16:55.760
<v Speaker 2>think that was the right but that had to be

0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:58.720
<v Speaker 2>the right move to make, and that was a tough

0:16:58.840 --> 0:17:03.800
<v Speaker 2>call for for James and Angus and backers to make

0:17:04.160 --> 0:17:08.639
<v Speaker 2>because they had some of their own content MKR and

0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:10.840
<v Speaker 2>they are always doing a job for them. But you

0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:14.120
<v Speaker 2>could clearly see that again that needed the pause, that

0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:17.200
<v Speaker 2>needed the break, and I think there were too reliant

0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:19.560
<v Speaker 2>on shows coming out of their own back out. I

0:17:19.600 --> 0:17:23.040
<v Speaker 2>think they wanted to be a very strong publisher broadcaster

0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:27.359
<v Speaker 2>and what I mean by that is they wanted to create, own, distribute,

0:17:27.680 --> 0:17:31.199
<v Speaker 2>do the whole lot. Now, that's fantastic if you can

0:17:31.240 --> 0:17:33.400
<v Speaker 2>achieve that, but I've got to tell you, having been

0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:35.679
<v Speaker 2>on this side of the business, it ain't easy. And

0:17:35.760 --> 0:17:37.919
<v Speaker 2>I think seven of them learned and you look at

0:17:37.960 --> 0:17:40.720
<v Speaker 2>the success of what they've now done by going, you

0:17:40.760 --> 0:17:42.920
<v Speaker 2>know what, we just need the best shows in the market.

0:17:43.320 --> 0:17:46.320
<v Speaker 2>So whether it's an ITV show, whether it's an Animal

0:17:46.359 --> 0:17:50.960
<v Speaker 2>Shine Show, Banajay, Freemantle, Warner Brothers, we just want the

0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:55.280
<v Speaker 2>best shows. And so I think with that they've taken

0:17:55.359 --> 0:17:57.760
<v Speaker 2>some risks. Now they've taken some risks that are more

0:17:57.840 --> 0:18:00.640
<v Speaker 2>risky than others, but they've taken and risks, but they've

0:18:00.680 --> 0:18:02.959
<v Speaker 2>just gone out to the market to say we are

0:18:03.000 --> 0:18:05.560
<v Speaker 2>open for business. And I remember talking to James Warburton

0:18:05.600 --> 0:18:09.200
<v Speaker 2>because we work together at ten of course, and James said,

0:18:09.560 --> 0:18:11.560
<v Speaker 2>we're open for business modey. We just want the best

0:18:11.560 --> 0:18:16.320
<v Speaker 2>shows in the market. And it's a tough game when

0:18:16.400 --> 0:18:20.000
<v Speaker 2>you've got to resource up your business and maybe that's

0:18:20.160 --> 0:18:23.040
<v Speaker 2>not the best game for you to be in lead

0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:25.840
<v Speaker 2>that to others, you know. And I do feel that

0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:29.720
<v Speaker 2>there's now proofs there that that's the right objective, particularly

0:18:29.720 --> 0:18:32.440
<v Speaker 2>when you've got some great IP. I mean, we will

0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:37.080
<v Speaker 2>spend in development, probably sometimes up to two years. I'm

0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:39.600
<v Speaker 2>going back and forward on a show. Is it right

0:18:39.640 --> 0:18:42.840
<v Speaker 2>to go to market? Is it timely now? So we

0:18:42.960 --> 0:18:45.879
<v Speaker 2>have these development meetings with our team, and then we

0:18:45.920 --> 0:18:48.680
<v Speaker 2>work with the UK, So we're in with the UK

0:18:48.920 --> 0:18:52.159
<v Speaker 2>with the US TV, and we're going back and forward

0:18:52.240 --> 0:18:57.879
<v Speaker 2>on content and trends. And broadcasters don't have that much time.

0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:02.439
<v Speaker 2>They got massive, big they got share, they've got sales clients,

0:19:02.640 --> 0:19:04.920
<v Speaker 2>they got a whole world of different things that they

0:19:05.000 --> 0:19:07.800
<v Speaker 2>need to focus on where we can take a lot

0:19:07.840 --> 0:19:10.480
<v Speaker 2>of that pain away from them. And I think James

0:19:10.480 --> 0:19:13.520
<v Speaker 2>certainly learnt that straight away to go, Yeah, you guys

0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:16.080
<v Speaker 2>have done all that and you've got proof of concept.

0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:19.600
<v Speaker 2>I would like to see the Australian broadcasters take a

0:19:19.640 --> 0:19:22.600
<v Speaker 2>few more risks at some point. We've got to sort

0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:25.120
<v Speaker 2>of step up and go, right, we're going to take

0:19:25.160 --> 0:19:27.960
<v Speaker 2>on a format that is a paper format, but it's

0:19:28.040 --> 0:19:30.280
<v Speaker 2>up to us to put the rigor and the focus

0:19:30.359 --> 0:19:33.280
<v Speaker 2>and the due diligence around to go this is worth

0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:36.359
<v Speaker 2>taking a risk on. And I feel that there's not

0:19:36.440 --> 0:19:39.399
<v Speaker 2>as much of that, I mean, but shows can still

0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:41.240
<v Speaker 2>be a risk. I mean, Marsa's Cheff was sort of

0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:44.000
<v Speaker 2>a late afternoon show in the UK, so to put

0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:46.440
<v Speaker 2>that in prime time was risky and particularly in terms

0:19:46.480 --> 0:19:48.440
<v Speaker 2>of how we built it out, but it was still

0:19:48.440 --> 0:19:52.520
<v Speaker 2>a format that existed. So I do feel sometimes we're

0:19:52.560 --> 0:19:55.439
<v Speaker 2>a bit risk averse. You know. That probably comes with

0:19:55.520 --> 0:19:58.719
<v Speaker 2>the pressure of the business as well, because you know,

0:19:59.040 --> 0:20:00.800
<v Speaker 2>I took some risk of my last year at ten

0:20:01.160 --> 0:20:03.480
<v Speaker 2>and some went well and some didn't. You know, you've

0:20:03.480 --> 0:20:06.760
<v Speaker 2>got to juggle those around and kind of that's the

0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:09.440
<v Speaker 2>tricky part of the business, I suppose. But I do

0:20:09.520 --> 0:20:12.440
<v Speaker 2>feel there's opportunities to take some of those risks if

0:20:12.440 --> 0:20:15.600
<v Speaker 2>you've got a platform of content that's working really well,

0:20:15.880 --> 0:20:17.800
<v Speaker 2>you can afford to kind of take a few risks

0:20:17.840 --> 0:20:20.439
<v Speaker 2>or some other shows and see where they go, and

0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:23.520
<v Speaker 2>even start small. Go you know what, I really think, whatdy?

0:20:23.600 --> 0:20:26.919
<v Speaker 2>This show could be a big twenty part series eventually,

0:20:27.320 --> 0:20:30.240
<v Speaker 2>but let's start small and do six or eight episodes

0:20:30.359 --> 0:20:32.880
<v Speaker 2>or something like that. And that way, you know you're

0:20:32.880 --> 0:20:35.199
<v Speaker 2>not taking on a massive, big risk. You're giving a go.

0:20:35.840 --> 0:20:38.640
<v Speaker 2>It's not necessary a format that exists, it's it's from

0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:44.040
<v Speaker 2>a great, brilliant idea that you go, yeah, we could

0:20:44.080 --> 0:20:46.199
<v Speaker 2>we take the risk of doing that show. So I

0:20:46.240 --> 0:20:49.280
<v Speaker 2>do feel sometimes that's hard, but I also get the

0:20:49.280 --> 0:20:51.280
<v Speaker 2>fact that the business is tough as well.

0:20:51.160 --> 0:20:53.440
<v Speaker 1>One hundred percent. You know, one of the biggest risks

0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:55.240
<v Speaker 1>I guess was back at Channel ten when you did

0:20:55.280 --> 0:20:58.200
<v Speaker 1>bring Big Brother to Australia. I'm assuming that was sort

0:20:58.240 --> 0:21:00.240
<v Speaker 1>of hard to get across the line at the time.

0:21:00.520 --> 0:21:02.520
<v Speaker 1>But looking at some of those headlines of where Big

0:21:02.560 --> 0:21:05.600
<v Speaker 1>Brother went, can you unpack the Turkey slab for us,

0:21:05.680 --> 0:21:08.160
<v Speaker 1>because you know, a lot was happening in the control

0:21:08.240 --> 0:21:11.119
<v Speaker 1>room that night and I've heard that you watched it

0:21:11.200 --> 0:21:14.280
<v Speaker 1>sort of as it unfolded. How was that moment for

0:21:14.359 --> 0:21:16.119
<v Speaker 1>you and what did that mean for television?

0:21:16.560 --> 0:21:20.760
<v Speaker 2>It was clearly unfortunate. What was interesting about that was

0:21:21.000 --> 0:21:25.040
<v Speaker 2>we actually didn't put it to air, so it sort

0:21:25.080 --> 0:21:28.199
<v Speaker 2>of ran on the sort of premium service streaming that

0:21:28.600 --> 0:21:32.359
<v Speaker 2>never actually went to air. But obviously the horse had bolted,

0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:34.879
<v Speaker 2>as I say, and away it went. And it was

0:21:34.920 --> 0:21:37.920
<v Speaker 2>sort of one of those moments that he went, Oh

0:21:37.960 --> 0:21:41.960
<v Speaker 2>my god, what does this actually mean? And Tim Kluchus,

0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:43.880
<v Speaker 2>who was the EP for me at the time, called

0:21:43.880 --> 0:21:48.200
<v Speaker 2>me up. I was actually literally jumping on a plane

0:21:48.680 --> 0:21:50.479
<v Speaker 2>to go on a mid year break with the family

0:21:50.520 --> 0:21:53.480
<v Speaker 2>for a week in Fiji, and the doors were about

0:21:53.480 --> 0:21:56.480
<v Speaker 2>to close, and he said, I've got something to tell you,

0:21:57.200 --> 0:22:00.760
<v Speaker 2>and I said, I've just got one question before the

0:22:00.800 --> 0:22:04.720
<v Speaker 2>door closes. What the hell's a turkey flat? And because

0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:07.600
<v Speaker 2>I had I had no idea, But you know, we

0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:10.359
<v Speaker 2>shouldn't laugh about it, but it was. It was clearly

0:22:10.480 --> 0:22:12.919
<v Speaker 2>very serious at the time, and I think it was

0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:16.399
<v Speaker 2>probably one of those moments that was possibly a turning

0:22:16.440 --> 0:22:22.119
<v Speaker 2>point for the series. It was frustrating because other networks

0:22:22.160 --> 0:22:24.760
<v Speaker 2>grabbed onto it, so you had current affair, you had

0:22:24.760 --> 0:22:27.680
<v Speaker 2>a think today tonight it was running and I think

0:22:27.720 --> 0:22:30.000
<v Speaker 2>for memory that was sort of they was sort of

0:22:30.000 --> 0:22:32.199
<v Speaker 2>showing the footage or elements of the footage, and we

0:22:32.200 --> 0:22:34.359
<v Speaker 2>didn't even show the footage, but it was a channel

0:22:34.359 --> 0:22:37.600
<v Speaker 2>to that was very hard. Normally, normally in television, when

0:22:37.640 --> 0:22:40.160
<v Speaker 2>a lot of things happened, they happen and they can

0:22:40.400 --> 0:22:42.760
<v Speaker 2>be a benefit. That clearly was a bit. It was

0:22:42.760 --> 0:22:46.600
<v Speaker 2>wrong on every level, and we acted appropriately with those

0:22:47.119 --> 0:22:50.480
<v Speaker 2>that were subjected to it, those that were involved in

0:22:50.520 --> 0:22:55.560
<v Speaker 2>the incident, and we acted in an appropriate way. It's

0:22:55.600 --> 0:22:58.879
<v Speaker 2>just not something that we could ever support, and we

0:22:58.920 --> 0:22:59.760
<v Speaker 2>were quite shocked.

0:23:00.560 --> 0:23:03.760
<v Speaker 3>The incident didn't make it to television screens, nor will it.

0:23:04.160 --> 0:23:07.359
<v Speaker 3>The controversy has prompted calls for the show to be axed,

0:23:07.640 --> 0:23:11.720
<v Speaker 3>but Network ten and the program's producers so they remain

0:23:11.840 --> 0:23:13.160
<v Speaker 3>committed to the series.

0:23:14.040 --> 0:23:17.040
<v Speaker 2>You know, from there on in it sort of became

0:23:17.240 --> 0:23:21.640
<v Speaker 2>harder with Big Brother, I think because of that moment

0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:23.800
<v Speaker 2>and then the way we went from there. But yeah,

0:23:23.880 --> 0:23:31.240
<v Speaker 2>there are moments that you feel quite sad and also

0:23:31.920 --> 0:23:36.320
<v Speaker 2>empowerless really because it happened and you can't take back

0:23:36.400 --> 0:23:39.480
<v Speaker 2>what happened. But we did certainly shut it down as

0:23:39.520 --> 0:23:42.320
<v Speaker 2>best we can. But then there are question marks about

0:23:42.400 --> 0:23:45.600
<v Speaker 2>streaming service, you know, the streaming, the content going forward

0:23:45.880 --> 0:23:47.960
<v Speaker 2>and what have you. But yeah, it was. It was

0:23:48.000 --> 0:23:49.520
<v Speaker 2>extremely unfortunate and.

0:23:49.480 --> 0:23:52.160
<v Speaker 1>In some ways, you know, the brand was sort of refixed.

0:23:52.160 --> 0:23:54.720
<v Speaker 1>I mean, Alex Mavererdicks, you know, fixed the tarnish brand

0:23:54.760 --> 0:23:57.919
<v Speaker 1>and brought it back for a family friendly Channel nine version.

0:23:58.000 --> 0:24:00.480
<v Speaker 1>And now we're seeing it on Channel seven in such

0:24:00.480 --> 0:24:04.560
<v Speaker 1>a really different incarnation of that program. Do you think

0:24:04.560 --> 0:24:06.720
<v Speaker 1>that they should have called it Big brother Coming Back?

0:24:06.760 --> 0:24:11.720
<v Speaker 1>Considering that it had become so different to its original essence, we.

0:24:11.920 --> 0:24:13.800
<v Speaker 2>Call it another name. Yeah.

0:24:13.800 --> 0:24:15.480
<v Speaker 1>A lot of people were saying, you know, it's Survivor

0:24:15.480 --> 0:24:16.160
<v Speaker 1>in a warehouse.

0:24:16.640 --> 0:24:18.320
<v Speaker 2>If you had to call it Survivor in a warehouse

0:24:18.320 --> 0:24:20.639
<v Speaker 2>and it wouldn't arrat it, probably, I mean there's something

0:24:20.720 --> 0:24:25.240
<v Speaker 2>really the brand, no matter what it what it evolved

0:24:25.240 --> 0:24:28.080
<v Speaker 2>into being, you know, Big Brothers Back.

0:24:28.920 --> 0:24:29.159
<v Speaker 4>It was.

0:24:29.560 --> 0:24:31.359
<v Speaker 2>It was a great version of the show. Yeah, had

0:24:31.359 --> 0:24:34.840
<v Speaker 2>it evolved? Yeah, has it evolved? And yeah, I mean

0:24:34.880 --> 0:24:38.600
<v Speaker 2>it wasn't live. It didn't have the live eliminations as

0:24:38.640 --> 0:24:42.160
<v Speaker 2>such in all of those moments, but it was still

0:24:42.160 --> 0:24:43.119
<v Speaker 2>a well produced show.

0:24:43.480 --> 0:24:46.159
<v Speaker 1>Well, it definitely works. I mean, it's Survivor and people

0:24:46.200 --> 0:24:49.520
<v Speaker 1>love Survivor. I mean, Survivor is an amazing show, and

0:24:49.560 --> 0:24:51.320
<v Speaker 1>I think it's a tried and tested format.

0:24:51.880 --> 0:24:54.280
<v Speaker 2>All shows need to evolve. They were of a time

0:24:54.320 --> 0:24:56.760
<v Speaker 2>in a moment. This is what I was saying earlier,

0:24:56.840 --> 0:25:00.359
<v Speaker 2>that the basic bones of what that show is still

0:25:00.359 --> 0:25:04.280
<v Speaker 2>a damn good format. So you know that there are

0:25:04.320 --> 0:25:07.160
<v Speaker 2>elements of which you protect and I say, you know what,

0:25:07.359 --> 0:25:09.840
<v Speaker 2>you can kind of shift it over here, because it's

0:25:09.880 --> 0:25:12.960
<v Speaker 2>not necessary to do that way anymore. So it would

0:25:12.960 --> 0:25:16.760
<v Speaker 2>have been a more cost effective model, arguably, clearly, but

0:25:17.040 --> 0:25:20.720
<v Speaker 2>it doesn't mean that it wasn't less engaging. You absolutely

0:25:20.760 --> 0:25:23.840
<v Speaker 2>would always call it Big Brother because that's that's the

0:25:23.880 --> 0:25:26.320
<v Speaker 2>heritage of it, and that was the affection of it.

0:25:27.200 --> 0:25:30.240
<v Speaker 2>But you can always tweak and evolve and pivot in

0:25:30.359 --> 0:25:33.720
<v Speaker 2>certain directions with any format, but you wouldn't certainly change

0:25:33.720 --> 0:25:34.000
<v Speaker 2>the name.

0:25:34.840 --> 0:25:37.040
<v Speaker 1>Why do you think digital is now so important? You know,

0:25:37.040 --> 0:25:39.959
<v Speaker 1>if you're looking in the landscape of programming nowadays, you know,

0:25:40.280 --> 0:25:43.480
<v Speaker 1>look at Love Island for an example. People are looking

0:25:43.520 --> 0:25:45.760
<v Speaker 1>for content in different ways. So yeah, why do you

0:25:45.800 --> 0:25:47.640
<v Speaker 1>think that digital is so important.

0:25:47.600 --> 0:25:51.880
<v Speaker 2>Fundamental now to the success of any broadcaster. I mean,

0:25:51.880 --> 0:25:56.480
<v Speaker 2>at the moment you're seeing some extraordinary numbers on VVOD.

0:25:56.680 --> 0:25:59.359
<v Speaker 2>I mean we're seeing some numbers through on a celebrity

0:25:59.359 --> 0:26:02.040
<v Speaker 2>and they're the live streaming is now up some one

0:26:02.119 --> 0:26:04.520
<v Speaker 2>hundred and twenty percent or whatever it is year on year.

0:26:05.080 --> 0:26:08.400
<v Speaker 2>Arguably probably a small base, but it's just growing. It's

0:26:08.480 --> 0:26:13.520
<v Speaker 2>now all about how you can still find content that

0:26:13.760 --> 0:26:17.000
<v Speaker 2>provides you oblity to get those big numbers on free

0:26:17.040 --> 0:26:20.080
<v Speaker 2>to air but then can also have a major play

0:26:20.119 --> 0:26:23.080
<v Speaker 2>in VIVO and building that business. I'm not on the

0:26:23.119 --> 0:26:26.679
<v Speaker 2>broadcast side anymore, but arguably the conversations that you know

0:26:26.800 --> 0:26:29.520
<v Speaker 2>I've had with the broadcast is that that's just of

0:26:29.640 --> 0:26:32.800
<v Speaker 2>equal value. Now. The revenue is not there yet, but

0:26:32.920 --> 0:26:36.040
<v Speaker 2>through vos and with those ten down what they're developing up,

0:26:36.400 --> 0:26:38.640
<v Speaker 2>you're going to see how they all about to monetize

0:26:38.680 --> 0:26:41.960
<v Speaker 2>that side of the business. Really well, what we've done

0:26:41.960 --> 0:26:46.120
<v Speaker 2>at ITV in the UK is actually changed the very

0:26:46.600 --> 0:26:51.359
<v Speaker 2>business model or the model of how ITV operates, and

0:26:51.400 --> 0:26:54.679
<v Speaker 2>it's very much sort of an on demand lead that

0:26:54.840 --> 0:26:58.040
<v Speaker 2>is multifaceted, so it's not just free to air. First

0:26:58.440 --> 0:27:01.280
<v Speaker 2>it could be on demand lead, the free to wear portal,

0:27:01.320 --> 0:27:04.280
<v Speaker 2>and then a hub portal and then whatever it is.

0:27:04.760 --> 0:27:08.680
<v Speaker 2>So it's the way we create content now that doesn't

0:27:08.720 --> 0:27:11.400
<v Speaker 2>necessarily just have a free to wear lens through it,

0:27:11.960 --> 0:27:14.760
<v Speaker 2>and that might be from a scripted point of view

0:27:14.960 --> 0:27:17.399
<v Speaker 2>or even from a nonscripted point of view. It's the

0:27:17.520 --> 0:27:20.439
<v Speaker 2>term that Kevinligo in the in the UK, who is

0:27:20.440 --> 0:27:24.080
<v Speaker 2>the director of content at ITV, it's that I've got

0:27:24.080 --> 0:27:26.800
<v Speaker 2>to know what's underneath the floorboards. So you leave that

0:27:26.920 --> 0:27:29.680
<v Speaker 2>moment where you go, what's under the floorboards. I've got

0:27:29.720 --> 0:27:33.320
<v Speaker 2>to find out because in the streaming world that's what's

0:27:33.400 --> 0:27:37.199
<v Speaker 2>expected now with the way they produce content in ten seconds,

0:27:37.280 --> 0:27:39.400
<v Speaker 2>in eight seconds and seven seconds, you're about to see

0:27:39.400 --> 0:27:41.600
<v Speaker 2>the next episode. I muzzle hang around and what's the

0:27:41.600 --> 0:27:44.240
<v Speaker 2>next episode? To see what's under the floorboards?

0:27:44.400 --> 0:27:45.560
<v Speaker 1>Yes, people are obsessed with that.

0:27:46.520 --> 0:27:50.400
<v Speaker 2>So there's a there's a conversation now around the way

0:27:50.480 --> 0:27:53.560
<v Speaker 2>you produce the content that doesn't necessarily just speak to

0:27:54.280 --> 0:27:58.240
<v Speaker 2>self contained. I'm talking about scripted now self contained one

0:27:58.280 --> 0:28:00.840
<v Speaker 2>hour a week, you've got to waken wait another week

0:28:00.880 --> 0:28:04.760
<v Speaker 2>to see that episode. That's not the shape anymore. Even

0:28:04.800 --> 0:28:08.160
<v Speaker 2>ITV in the UK they will strip series across three

0:28:08.240 --> 0:28:11.959
<v Speaker 2>or four days like strip dramas, and that's quite unique

0:28:12.080 --> 0:28:15.000
<v Speaker 2>and they're having some great success. I mean, I don't

0:28:15.000 --> 0:28:17.199
<v Speaker 2>know about you, but I'd be enormously frustrated when you

0:28:17.240 --> 0:28:19.440
<v Speaker 2>know Billions comes up on stand, I've got to wait

0:28:19.440 --> 0:28:21.439
<v Speaker 2>a week to see the next episode. I want to

0:28:21.440 --> 0:28:27.080
<v Speaker 2>watch it now. And so for the broadcast is now

0:28:27.280 --> 0:28:30.359
<v Speaker 2>it's about okay, we've got to protect the free to

0:28:30.359 --> 0:28:34.160
<v Speaker 2>wear business. We've got to build the beaver business because look,

0:28:34.359 --> 0:28:37.359
<v Speaker 2>I've got kids, and I've got a grandchild. And my

0:28:37.600 --> 0:28:40.800
<v Speaker 2>kids now are in there from their mid thirties down

0:28:40.840 --> 0:28:44.280
<v Speaker 2>to mid twenties plus a grandchild. It's hard to get

0:28:44.320 --> 0:28:45.800
<v Speaker 2>them to go what are you watching on free to

0:28:45.840 --> 0:28:49.360
<v Speaker 2>wear nowadays? So they will thankfully, thankfully, they like I'm

0:28:49.360 --> 0:28:51.440
<v Speaker 2>a Celebrity, and I like mad as Hell and a

0:28:51.480 --> 0:28:54.320
<v Speaker 2>few shows that Dad makes, but not always it's hard

0:28:54.360 --> 0:28:57.040
<v Speaker 2>to find their way through or they'll catch it up later.

0:28:57.280 --> 0:28:59.600
<v Speaker 2>So that it's then a shift of how do you

0:28:59.640 --> 0:29:03.840
<v Speaker 2>correct content that fits in that model as well? So

0:29:04.000 --> 0:29:07.240
<v Speaker 2>it's a combination of both. So and when we talk

0:29:07.360 --> 0:29:11.720
<v Speaker 2>to the broadcasts at the moment, they absolutely look at

0:29:11.720 --> 0:29:14.720
<v Speaker 2>the BVOD play will this have a BVOD number? Will

0:29:14.760 --> 0:29:17.800
<v Speaker 2>it connect with those younger audiences. There's a great show

0:29:17.800 --> 0:29:19.960
<v Speaker 2>that we've just launched in the UK called the Cabins,

0:29:20.120 --> 0:29:23.400
<v Speaker 2>which is another dating format. It came from the Netherlands

0:29:23.440 --> 0:29:25.840
<v Speaker 2>called Let Love Rule. In the UK it's called the Cabins.

0:29:26.320 --> 0:29:29.520
<v Speaker 2>So it launched an ITV too. It's the highest numbers

0:29:29.560 --> 0:29:33.480
<v Speaker 2>in b VOD since Love Island. Now, the linear numbers

0:29:33.520 --> 0:29:37.040
<v Speaker 2>were okay, you know, good, but where they saw the

0:29:37.120 --> 0:29:39.200
<v Speaker 2>numbers was like the b VOD point of view and

0:29:39.240 --> 0:29:43.000
<v Speaker 2>they're going, oh, this is fantastic because it's targeted. You

0:29:43.040 --> 0:29:47.760
<v Speaker 2>can watch two or three episodes fits that demographic, younger audience.

0:29:47.800 --> 0:29:51.080
<v Speaker 2>So there's definitely shows that have to and always will

0:29:51.120 --> 0:29:54.239
<v Speaker 2>be purely free to airplay. But there is those that,

0:29:54.320 --> 0:29:56.800
<v Speaker 2>in an ideal world, will be shows that can cut

0:29:56.840 --> 0:29:59.600
<v Speaker 2>across ball and I think that's kind of the golden

0:30:00.040 --> 0:30:02.880
<v Speaker 2>If you can find content that does that, then you've

0:30:02.920 --> 0:30:04.680
<v Speaker 2>got a much better chance of getting a commission.

0:30:04.760 --> 0:30:07.160
<v Speaker 1>Two quick questions about Love Island because I'm obsessed with

0:30:07.240 --> 0:30:08.880
<v Speaker 1>the show. I really like it. I've been in from

0:30:08.920 --> 0:30:11.360
<v Speaker 1>the ground floor of that, but has so few monks

0:30:11.400 --> 0:30:12.840
<v Speaker 1>said yes to doing it? Are we going to see

0:30:12.880 --> 0:30:14.640
<v Speaker 1>so few monks hosting that show again?

0:30:14.800 --> 0:30:18.240
<v Speaker 2>You know? The broadcast at nine will make that nine

0:30:18.320 --> 0:30:22.000
<v Speaker 2>will want to make that announcement. I don't. As much

0:30:22.000 --> 0:30:24.640
<v Speaker 2>as I love you, Ben, I don't plan on making

0:30:24.680 --> 0:30:27.880
<v Speaker 2>that announcement here fair enough, whatever form that looks like.

0:30:28.760 --> 0:30:31.400
<v Speaker 1>Have you found maybe the villa? As to where these

0:30:31.680 --> 0:30:33.920
<v Speaker 1>you know, should I say Lovers or Islanders are going

0:30:33.960 --> 0:30:35.479
<v Speaker 1>to be on the Gold Coast? I mean you've announced

0:30:35.520 --> 0:30:37.560
<v Speaker 1>that it's going to be on the Gold Coast here

0:30:37.560 --> 0:30:39.320
<v Speaker 1>in Australia. Have you found a location?

0:30:39.800 --> 0:30:42.600
<v Speaker 2>I'm not quite sure whether they're your words about the

0:30:42.600 --> 0:30:45.600
<v Speaker 2>Gold Coast. I can say that it will be Queensland.

0:30:46.240 --> 0:30:49.440
<v Speaker 2>I certainly can't confirm them to die the Gold Coast

0:30:49.600 --> 0:30:52.120
<v Speaker 2>look truthfully, as we haven't found the billa yet. So

0:30:52.440 --> 0:30:55.080
<v Speaker 2>we've got Wrecky's and we've got great support out of

0:30:55.120 --> 0:30:58.480
<v Speaker 2>screen Queensland as well, so we've been working with them.

0:30:58.600 --> 0:31:02.440
<v Speaker 2>They were very keen to have Love Island. There one

0:31:02.480 --> 0:31:07.640
<v Speaker 2>thing about Love Island. The Australian version has performed exceptionally

0:31:07.680 --> 0:31:12.600
<v Speaker 2>well in the UK exceptionally well, and so our version

0:31:12.960 --> 0:31:15.880
<v Speaker 2>was in excess of a million viewers on ITV too.

0:31:16.440 --> 0:31:20.120
<v Speaker 2>So to actually go to screen Queensland, it's a tourism

0:31:20.120 --> 0:31:23.240
<v Speaker 2>friend to say we can showcase how beautiful Queensland is

0:31:23.440 --> 0:31:25.920
<v Speaker 2>to the world because our version is shown in some

0:31:25.960 --> 0:31:28.800
<v Speaker 2>thirty or forty countries, so there's a lot of benefits

0:31:28.840 --> 0:31:31.720
<v Speaker 2>for it to being in Queensland. That's another big project

0:31:31.720 --> 0:31:33.480
<v Speaker 2>that needs to get his head around.

0:31:33.800 --> 0:31:37.120
<v Speaker 1>My last question for you is what is your go

0:31:37.160 --> 0:31:40.040
<v Speaker 1>to story when entertaining friends. I'm sure you've had some

0:31:40.360 --> 0:31:43.479
<v Speaker 1>fabulous dinner parties. When you look back over your career,

0:31:43.920 --> 0:31:46.400
<v Speaker 1>is there any particular story that is your go to

0:31:46.400 --> 0:31:48.200
<v Speaker 1>to make people laugh over dinner conversation?

0:31:48.480 --> 0:31:53.120
<v Speaker 2>Okay, or maybe there's a master's chef story. So literally,

0:31:53.520 --> 0:31:57.000
<v Speaker 2>it was when we decided that Big Brother had run

0:31:57.080 --> 0:32:00.360
<v Speaker 2>its cause and so we needed a new format. Wasn't

0:32:00.440 --> 0:32:03.800
<v Speaker 2>much around in terms of strip shows, strip formats five

0:32:03.880 --> 0:32:05.240
<v Speaker 2>days a week. We looked at a lot of things

0:32:05.280 --> 0:32:09.320
<v Speaker 2>we already had Biggest Loser, and I remember going into

0:32:09.320 --> 0:32:11.320
<v Speaker 2>seeing the CEO of Grant Blackley, who was such a

0:32:11.320 --> 0:32:13.640
<v Speaker 2>great supporter. He said, yeah, you know what, let's do this.

0:32:14.280 --> 0:32:16.800
<v Speaker 2>So we then s out of the negotiations with Mark

0:32:16.840 --> 0:32:20.040
<v Speaker 2>and Carl at Shine on the format, which sort of

0:32:20.280 --> 0:32:23.560
<v Speaker 2>made summer headway. But you know, like anything, it takes time.

0:32:23.600 --> 0:32:25.960
<v Speaker 2>It takes time. It takes time, and literally I was

0:32:26.000 --> 0:32:30.440
<v Speaker 2>only days away from doing the upfronts where you showcase

0:32:30.560 --> 0:32:33.520
<v Speaker 2>all your big new shows for the year. We'd canceled

0:32:33.520 --> 0:32:37.320
<v Speaker 2>Big Brother. I didn't have Master's chef and we're literally

0:32:37.360 --> 0:32:40.400
<v Speaker 2>only days away, and I'm going, oh my god, and

0:32:40.440 --> 0:32:43.120
<v Speaker 2>I remember Carl and I and Carl won't mind me

0:32:43.160 --> 0:32:46.120
<v Speaker 2>telling this story, we literally hung up the phone not

0:32:46.200 --> 0:32:48.320
<v Speaker 2>agreeing to do the show. We weren't going to get there.

0:32:48.480 --> 0:32:50.560
<v Speaker 2>And it wasn't a creative compensation. It was about the deal,

0:32:50.680 --> 0:32:52.360
<v Speaker 2>the terms and all that sort of stuff. And I

0:32:52.400 --> 0:32:54.960
<v Speaker 2>respect them enormously, don't get me wrong, But it was

0:32:55.040 --> 0:32:57.160
<v Speaker 2>just one of those conversations I have and I h

0:32:57.400 --> 0:33:01.040
<v Speaker 2>the phone, I went, holy shit, I've got two days

0:33:01.040 --> 0:33:03.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm doing these upfronts. And then I was running late.

0:33:03.880 --> 0:33:07.920
<v Speaker 2>I was going to Kyle's wedding, Kyle Sandalan's wedding because

0:33:07.920 --> 0:33:10.920
<v Speaker 2>he's on Australia at the time, and so I sort

0:33:10.960 --> 0:33:13.680
<v Speaker 2>of got my wife and we ran off. Well I

0:33:13.680 --> 0:33:16.040
<v Speaker 2>could think about, with Jesus, what the hell am I

0:33:16.040 --> 0:33:17.920
<v Speaker 2>going to replace Big Brother with? And I haven't got

0:33:18.000 --> 0:33:22.080
<v Speaker 2>marstership and what have you? And then I think Mark

0:33:22.160 --> 0:33:25.480
<v Speaker 2>and I and Carl they had another conversation, so literally

0:33:25.560 --> 0:33:28.680
<v Speaker 2>then it was like the day before when we had

0:33:28.720 --> 0:33:30.560
<v Speaker 2>the deal done, and then I could go to the

0:33:30.640 --> 0:33:34.640
<v Speaker 2>upfronts and say, okay, well, big brother you've loved here's

0:33:34.640 --> 0:33:37.640
<v Speaker 2>a new show called Marstership. And then what what made

0:33:37.680 --> 0:33:41.200
<v Speaker 2>it worse was that literally we ran this little sizzle

0:33:41.240 --> 0:33:43.280
<v Speaker 2>from the UK show because we hadn't we didn't have

0:33:43.280 --> 0:33:46.480
<v Speaker 2>the Australian show to show them. And I did the

0:33:46.520 --> 0:33:48.360
<v Speaker 2>big song and dance and now it's going to be

0:33:48.400 --> 0:33:49.800
<v Speaker 2>great and it's going to be big and all that

0:33:49.800 --> 0:33:52.040
<v Speaker 2>sort of suff come along for the ride, all these

0:33:52.080 --> 0:33:56.040
<v Speaker 2>major media buyers. So I did the big song and dance, act,

0:33:56.040 --> 0:33:57.760
<v Speaker 2>the ship and glitter as I call it, did the

0:33:57.800 --> 0:34:00.920
<v Speaker 2>ship and glitter, and then literally then there was a pause.

0:34:01.440 --> 0:34:03.760
<v Speaker 2>And then normally they kind of applause or clap or

0:34:03.840 --> 0:34:07.840
<v Speaker 2>do something, there was literally nothing. There was silence and

0:34:08.280 --> 0:34:11.560
<v Speaker 2>you could hear crickets in the room and I went, oh,

0:34:11.600 --> 0:34:16.440
<v Speaker 2>well that's gone well. And no one, no one felt

0:34:16.640 --> 0:34:19.000
<v Speaker 2>that it was a good self, no one felt that

0:34:19.040 --> 0:34:22.600
<v Speaker 2>it was going to work. And media buyers and we

0:34:22.640 --> 0:34:26.240
<v Speaker 2>couldn't get a sponsor on the show. We eventually got Coals.

0:34:26.640 --> 0:34:30.600
<v Speaker 2>Cole's weren't there, and so it was like, what have

0:34:30.680 --> 0:34:34.200
<v Speaker 2>I done. I've made the biggest blunder of my career potentially,

0:34:35.640 --> 0:34:38.239
<v Speaker 2>And so there was you know, building up to it

0:34:38.719 --> 0:34:41.120
<v Speaker 2>and then going great, I've got this show. Now I'm

0:34:41.120 --> 0:34:43.279
<v Speaker 2>going to sell it into all these media buys. We're

0:34:43.280 --> 0:34:45.400
<v Speaker 2>going to spend one hundreds of millions of dollars on

0:34:45.480 --> 0:34:47.640
<v Speaker 2>Channel ten, and I go and sell it in and

0:34:47.719 --> 0:34:51.480
<v Speaker 2>then nothing. So it was one of those moments in television.

0:34:51.480 --> 0:34:53.160
<v Speaker 2>And then you know, I can tell the story now

0:34:53.200 --> 0:34:58.200
<v Speaker 2>because it then became a great success. So yeah, it was.

0:34:58.360 --> 0:35:00.200
<v Speaker 2>It was one of those moments where you start to

0:35:00.360 --> 0:35:02.600
<v Speaker 2>reconsider life in general.

0:35:03.000 --> 0:35:05.280
<v Speaker 1>Well you think about it, that show is still going

0:35:05.440 --> 0:35:08.200
<v Speaker 1>and it is back to win was a massive success

0:35:08.280 --> 0:35:11.680
<v Speaker 1>for twenty twenty for Channel ten. So that little gamble

0:35:11.719 --> 0:35:14.399
<v Speaker 1>that happens, which I think you've sort of had that

0:35:14.440 --> 0:35:17.239
<v Speaker 1>theme throughout our chat. You know, sometimes you need to

0:35:17.239 --> 0:35:19.920
<v Speaker 1>take a gamble because some of those gambles well and

0:35:19.960 --> 0:35:21.920
<v Speaker 1>truly pay off and have longevity.

0:35:22.000 --> 0:35:23.840
<v Speaker 2>And you've got to have the backing of those around

0:35:23.880 --> 0:35:25.279
<v Speaker 2>you as well, you know, and you've got to have

0:35:25.280 --> 0:35:28.000
<v Speaker 2>the great people to produce it. So it's no easy

0:35:28.440 --> 0:35:30.879
<v Speaker 2>I've often said sometimes the easy part is saying is

0:35:31.000 --> 0:35:35.279
<v Speaker 2>actually it's not. But then you've got to actually realize

0:35:35.320 --> 0:35:38.359
<v Speaker 2>it and bring it to life. And you know you've

0:35:38.880 --> 0:35:42.360
<v Speaker 2>got a tight sphincter for a long time. Shall we say,

0:35:44.080 --> 0:35:46.400
<v Speaker 2>can I say that? Is that allowed? Or is that

0:35:46.520 --> 0:35:47.120
<v Speaker 2>not allowed?

0:35:49.120 --> 0:35:52.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's always it's always allowed. Can I just say

0:35:52.080 --> 0:35:54.520
<v Speaker 1>anything on this podcast? The first one I did, Alex

0:35:54.640 --> 0:35:57.160
<v Speaker 1>kept swearing, and then I was like, in the edit

0:35:57.520 --> 0:35:59.279
<v Speaker 1>do you know looking at the swearing thing? I got

0:35:59.280 --> 0:36:02.200
<v Speaker 1>to bleep all this out, Thanks Alex, and everyone said

0:36:02.320 --> 0:36:04.560
<v Speaker 1>leave it in there. They're like, the podcast medium is

0:36:04.600 --> 0:36:08.319
<v Speaker 1>that we get to talk with authentic language. So, to

0:36:08.400 --> 0:36:10.520
<v Speaker 1>cut a long story short, the sphincters staying.

0:36:12.280 --> 0:36:16.080
<v Speaker 2>As all sphincters should, Yeah, well we need them.

0:36:16.520 --> 0:36:18.120
<v Speaker 1>Without them, we'd be in a lot of trouble.

0:36:19.960 --> 0:36:24.000
<v Speaker 2>Trouble. I love it. Anyway, Let's let's just stop it there.

0:36:24.239 --> 0:36:25.880
<v Speaker 1>We're gonna have to finish the podcast with that.

0:36:26.000 --> 0:36:26.200
<v Speaker 2>Look.

0:36:26.239 --> 0:36:28.040
<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much for being able to be so

0:36:28.160 --> 0:36:30.640
<v Speaker 1>generous with your time and have this chat. There's just

0:36:30.760 --> 0:36:32.920
<v Speaker 1>there was so much for me to unpack. It'll be

0:36:32.960 --> 0:36:35.080
<v Speaker 1>one of those episodes where I listened to it a couple.

0:36:34.840 --> 0:36:37.600
<v Speaker 2>Of times a pleasure.

0:36:37.960 --> 0:36:38.719
<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much.