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Speaker 1: We know that up to one thousand healthcare support workers

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Speaker 1: they're expected to take that protected industrial action on Monday.

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Speaker 1: They say they want to increase pay and what the

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Speaker 1: union's described as better conditions. Now they're going to be striking.

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Speaker 1: From what the head of the union, Erina Early, told

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Speaker 1: us earlier in the week, they're going to be striking

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Speaker 1: on Monday at eleven am for one hour. What impact

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Speaker 1: is this going to have on our major hospitals. Well,

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Speaker 1: joining me on the show is Chris Hosking, the CEO

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Speaker 1: of MT Health. Good morning to you.

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Speaker 2: Chris, Good morning Cody, and good morning to you listeners.

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Speaker 1: Chris. What efforts are going to be made on Monday

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Speaker 1: to ensure that this protected industrial action doesn't impact patients

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Speaker 1: at our hospitals across the territory.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks Cody. In the event that the United Workers'

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Speaker 2: Union proceeds with that action on Monday, we have a

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Speaker 2: range of business continuity measures in place to ensure that

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Speaker 2: patients and the public will be able to continue to

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Speaker 2: receive services uninterrupted. And in parallel with that, the government

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Speaker 2: is continuing to negotiate in good faith with the United Workers' Union,

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Speaker 2: and I know the Commissioner for Public Employment and their

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Speaker 2: team is actively engaging with unions and there've been negotiation

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Speaker 2: meetings this week, so I'm actually hopeful that we don't

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Speaker 2: see that industrial action take place. Obviously, we respect the

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Speaker 2: rights of the unions to exercise industrial action through the

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Speaker 2: proper channels if that's the views of their members, but

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Speaker 2: I'm optimistic that that may not be necessary to move

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Speaker 2: those negotiations along, and in the event that it does,

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Speaker 2: Territorians can be well assured we've got measures in place

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Speaker 2: to deal with that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel the same crise. I hope that it

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Speaker 1: doesn't go ahead, you know, particularly after last week and

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Speaker 1: it was lifted earlier this week the Code yellows of

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Speaker 1: course at Royal Darwin and Palmerston Regional Hospital. I just,

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't feel like it's the right time.

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Speaker 1: But as you touched on, I know the unions and

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Speaker 1: the members certainly have the right to do that. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I hope that it doesn't go ahead. As I mentioned,

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Speaker 1: we know that that Code yellow has only just been

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Speaker 1: lifted at Royal Dalen and Palmerston Hospitals. It was the

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Speaker 1: first since July, but workers say the issues at the

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Speaker 1: facilities haven't changed from your perspective, what prompted that declaration

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Speaker 1: and how are things tracking?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks Cody, And certainly there's a structured process we

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Speaker 2: go through if we do call a code yellow, and

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Speaker 2: that comes to me as the chief executive, to sign

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Speaker 2: off on. In simple terms, it's really about patient numbers,

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Speaker 2: patients in versus patients out. And we had been seeing

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Speaker 2: an uptech in not so much just the volume of

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Speaker 2: presentations at the hospital, but the people who were coming

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Speaker 2: in to get treatment. We're crooker than usual, and that

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Speaker 2: led to them staying in hospital for longer in some cases,

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Speaker 2: you know, weeks not days, and that means that our

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Speaker 2: discharge rate falls away and we end up with very

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Speaker 2: large numbers on the wards and large numbers are queued

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Speaker 2: up in the ed waiting to get a bed. And

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Speaker 2: when we reach a point and we use a bunch

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Speaker 2: of metrics to calculate this, and it just reached the

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Speaker 2: point where we declare the code yellow, which does a

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Speaker 2: number of things. I guess. It sends a really strong

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Speaker 2: message to the staff that we're taking we're intervening and

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Speaker 2: taking action. But more importantly, we activate messaging to the

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Speaker 2: public to say, hey, look, we're experiencing bed pressures if

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Speaker 2: you're feeling a bit crook, and maybe think about seeing

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Speaker 2: your GP or go to the urgent care clinic. If

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Speaker 2: you're really sick and you need hospital care, you please

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Speaker 2: turn up at Rhodarwen at the ED and you will

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Speaker 2: get scene where the public health system and we take

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Speaker 2: absolutely everybody. But you know, if you've got a cold

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Speaker 2: or a flu or a minor ailment, we encourage you

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Speaker 2: perhaps not to use the ED as an alternative to

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Speaker 2: your GP, which I know is tough. It's I had

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Speaker 2: a GP appointment earlier this week, Katie, and I waited

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Speaker 2: two weeks to get it. So sometimes easier said than done.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, spot on, It can be really difficult. And probably

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Speaker 1: that you know, that brings me to the next question

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Speaker 1: I've got for you. We've been in undated by listeners

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Speaker 1: over the last week or so, some of them telling

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Speaker 1: us about some pretty shocking experiences that they've had through

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Speaker 1: the health system. And I know it can be tough,

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Speaker 1: you know, in terms of like you touched on, not

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Speaker 1: being able to get to your GP to begin with

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Speaker 1: and then sort of you know, getting to the next points.

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Speaker 1: But one man waiting three years for a rehab follow

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Speaker 1: up appointment, a parent waiting hours for an X ray

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Speaker 1: for their child and then having to return another day,

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Speaker 1: and tragically, a wife who lost her husband after what

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Speaker 1: she says was a lack of diagnosis, and still waiting

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Speaker 1: on a final report on what happened. Now, many have

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Speaker 1: lodged complaints and they say they don't hear from anyone,

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Speaker 1: or they don't hear from anyone after a very long time.

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Speaker 1: What assurances, if any, can you provide to residents. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know that those complaints are being processed and that

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Speaker 1: there are improvements being made following those complaints.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, thank you, Katie. Look, I would say a

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Speaker 2: couple of things in response to that. First and foremost,

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Speaker 2: as a health provider, we absolutely welcome feedback from the public,

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Speaker 2: whether it's good, bad, or somewhere in between. So if

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Speaker 2: people have had a negative experience, we strongly encourage them

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Speaker 2: to report that through the reporting channels, and we've got

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Speaker 2: established channels for that, which you can find on our

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Speaker 2: websit or our social media footprint or any of those

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Speaker 2: places where we have a public presence. And I would

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Speaker 2: also say we're absolutely committed to providing the best care

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Speaker 2: we can to patients. I'm very sure. We don't get

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Speaker 2: it right every single time. And that example you used

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Speaker 2: of a fellow who'd been waiting a very long time

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Speaker 2: for a particular procedure. I am having that matter looked

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Speaker 2: into it at the moment and will certainly be responding to

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Speaker 2: that family once I've got all the facts in front

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Speaker 2: of me. But we have a number of established channels

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Speaker 2: and if people feel that they're not getting listened to

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Speaker 2: by the Health Department and by the existing complaint handling channels.

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Speaker 2: I mean, we have a complaints team who works centrally

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Speaker 2: in the Health Department across all of our health services

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Speaker 2: and handle this and the interaction with patients every day,

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Speaker 2: and there is an independent Health Complaints Commission that people

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Speaker 2: can escalate their concerns too. I'm not necessarily encouraging people

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Speaker 2: in that direction. That's generally when you can't get your

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Speaker 2: matter resolved through the proper channels, But there is an

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Speaker 2: escalation process there. But I do, I guess make the point.

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Speaker 2: We look into each and every one of those and

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Speaker 2: we do get back to people. Sometimes it takes a

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Speaker 2: bit of time, particularly if it's a clinically complex matter.

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Speaker 2: Now that the three year example sounds dreadful at face value,

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Speaker 2: and we'll certainly look into that one very carefully. But

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Speaker 2: I guess the message I would send to Territorians is

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Speaker 2: we do have a hospital system here in the territory

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Speaker 2: that is at capacity. It's no secret I've been very

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Speaker 2: publicly vocal about the fact that we don't get a

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Speaker 2: fair funding deal from the Commonwealth and we're advocating very

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Speaker 2: strongly to try and rectify that structural budget deficit and

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Speaker 2: to improve our infrastructure footprint. Unfortunately, we have of health

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Speaker 2: infrastructure and facilities here, most of which are were built

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Speaker 2: pre self government and pre cyclone Tracy, and we've pretty

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Speaker 2: much outgrown them. And we need a fairer deal in

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Speaker 2: funding from our Commonwealth partners, and we are going to

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Speaker 2: need in the next five to ten years a new

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Speaker 2: tertiary hospital in the top end. Royal Owen's was commissioned

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Speaker 2: not long after Cyclone Tracy, and it really is an

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Speaker 2: end of life. It's not an appropriate design for the

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Speaker 2: tropics and it's an old building.

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Speaker 1: Chris, how are we going to get that? Like, how

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Speaker 1: are we ever going to get the funding for that

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Speaker 1: when we can't even get the thirty five million that

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Speaker 1: you guys requested for maternity services. Do you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean? Like, it's going to be a real stretch.

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Speaker 2: It's going to be a battle, Katie, but it's one

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Speaker 2: we're up for and we have started the work there already.

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Speaker 2: So we've already done some initial analysis with our Infrastructure

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Speaker 2: Department and we have opened that discussion with our federal colleagues.

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Speaker 2: I mean, obviously, a new hospital for the top end

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Speaker 2: is a five to ten year journey, but it's also

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Speaker 2: one that would be measured in billions, not millions, and

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Speaker 2: hence we need a lot of help from the Commonwealth

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Speaker 2: to be able to get there. But what people may

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Speaker 2: not realize is Cyclone Tracy was being built. Sorry, Broad

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Speaker 2: Oarwen was being constructed prior to Cyclone Tracy. The cyclone

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Speaker 2: obviously derailed that a bit, but the construction was finished

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Speaker 2: off in the seventies and it's really at the end

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Speaker 2: of its life and it's time we stopped tacking bits

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Speaker 2: on the side and took a really measured, strategic approach

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Speaker 2: to this. And it's on my list of top five

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Speaker 2: things that I'm working through my Minister to progress and

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Speaker 2: I'm absolutely committed to providing something better for Territorians over

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Speaker 2: the longer term.

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Speaker 1: Well, look, I think a lot of people would agree.

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Speaker 1: We know that the infrastructure there at the hospital is

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Speaker 1: it's old. There is no other way to put it. Chris,

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Speaker 1: just going back to some of those issues that our

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Speaker 1: listeners have told us about, I do want to say

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Speaker 1: that I know that our hospital staff do an incredible

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Speaker 1: job under really what can be really difficult circumstances. We

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Speaker 1: know that we've got one of the busiest hospitals I

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Speaker 1: would imagine in Australia. I guess the thing that I

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Speaker 1: hear from those listeners though, when we do have them

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Speaker 1: contact us about these issues, is what they really want

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Speaker 1: is for nobody else to have to go through the

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Speaker 1: same thing that they've gone through. So, you know, without

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Speaker 1: going into specific details on each of those incidents, but

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Speaker 1: when a complaint is received by the department, are there

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Speaker 1: different ways that you then look into it to go

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Speaker 1: how can we make sure that we don't have this

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Speaker 1: happen again? Or you know that we we don't have

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Speaker 1: people rocking up for appointments and sending them home to

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Speaker 1: come back two weeks later. You know, for something that

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Speaker 1: they should be able to get in there and be

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Speaker 1: seen for.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, we certainly do, Katie. We when we investigate

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Speaker 2: these matters, we will make a set of findings and

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Speaker 2: we'll always report that back those to the clinical units

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Speaker 2: who administer the care, and quite often that might be

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Speaker 2: you know, generally, when something doesn't go smoothly in an

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Speaker 2: episode of care, there's not one key mistake you can

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Speaker 2: point to. It's usually a series of actions, and sometimes

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Speaker 2: it involves multiple teams. So we'll bring those teams together,

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Speaker 2: whether it's doctors, nurses, or administrative stuff, and we'll look

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Speaker 2: at what went wrong, what lessons we can take away

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Speaker 2: from that, and how we can modify our standard procedures

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Speaker 2: and protocols to try and do better. Are mindful, you know,

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Speaker 2: human beings can always make a human error, and we

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Speaker 2: all understand that. I think we probably all make one

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Speaker 2: of those every now and then, and that's to be expected.

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Speaker 2: But where it's an issue in terms of clinical protocols

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Speaker 2: or procedural practices, we do the work to ensure that

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Speaker 2: we codify into that. I'm not saying we get it

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Speaker 2: one hundred percent right one hundred percent of the time,

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Speaker 2: but I know our teams do a cracking job of

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Speaker 2: trying to make sure that doesn't happen again. And I

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Speaker 2: often underquite trying circumstances, as you've mentioned.

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Speaker 1: Chris, a couple of quick ones before I let you go.

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Speaker 1: This morning, we know the Acacia computer system. It's being

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Speaker 1: rolled out again across facilities after it was suspended. What's changed,

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Speaker 1: and you know, do you have assurances for those stuff

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Speaker 1: that it's going to not cause havoc for them when

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Speaker 1: trying to use it.

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Speaker 2: Well, I certainly hope so, Katie, because it went live

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Speaker 2: in the emergency department at about ten to seven this morning.

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Speaker 2: So we are working on Acacia in our emergency department

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Speaker 2: now as for the last couple of hours, and I'm pleased

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Speaker 2: to report it's all going really smoothly. So we had

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Speaker 2: a team who worked through the night to do that

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Speaker 2: and it's been a very smooth transition. And I've been

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Speaker 2: speaking with people on the floor at the emergency department

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Speaker 2: throughout the night and this morning, and so far that's

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Speaker 2: all going really well. And we've done a comprehensive amount

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Speaker 2: of work to the system to address some of the

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Speaker 2: concerns that our emergency clinicians raised last year that were

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Speaker 2: frustrating them. The software we use here is a product

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Speaker 2: called track Care, which is used in hospitals all over

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Speaker 2: the world, but we've done a lot of work to

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Speaker 2: adapt it to the way clinical patient flows happen in

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Speaker 2: Rhodeen Hospital, and some of the concerns that our senior

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Speaker 2: doctors had about being able to examine aggregate data of

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Speaker 2: large cohorts of patients have been addressed through some really

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Speaker 2: innovative real time patient dashboards which give senior doctors far

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Speaker 2: more intuitive tools. And we've done all of that work

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Speaker 2: by our software engineering teams and our software vendor and

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Speaker 2: our doctors working side by side in what we'd call

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Speaker 2: a code of process. So we've done the work together

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Speaker 2: to make sure that those system changes are informed by

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Speaker 2: clinical practice and what works for doctors and nurses. So

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Speaker 2: we're really optimistic that that will be the end of it.

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Speaker 2: And I'm also really pleased to say that that reintroduction

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Speaker 2: in the emergency departments sees the system fully rolled out

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Speaker 2: across all of our public hospitals in the territory and

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Speaker 2: enables us to stop using our old legacy system that

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Speaker 2: was part of the reason for doing that particular project

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Speaker 2: in the first place.

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Speaker 1: Well, hopefully it all continues to run smoothly, Chris, before

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Speaker 1: I let you go, where are we at? I touched

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Speaker 1: on this before with these maternity services, we heard obviously

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Speaker 1: ten million dollars from the Health Minister as being more

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Speaker 1: the figure that we're looking at instead of thirty five

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Speaker 1: to boost maternity services at Royal Darwin Hospital. Is there

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Speaker 1: another meeting coming up or where's this that from your perspective?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So, look, we've been the active discussions with the

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Speaker 2: Commonwealth Health Department since the maternity forum that occurred in

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Speaker 2: Darwin a couple of weeks back, and we've progressed that along.

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Speaker 2: It's been made quite clear to us that the Commonwealth

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Speaker 2: is more supportive of the more moderate number or in

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Speaker 2: the ten million dollar vicinity, and we've just in recent

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Speaker 2: days provided a whole bunch of detailed information between senior

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Speaker 2: officials about how that will be deployed within rolled down.

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Speaker 2: So we don't actually have our hands on the check yet, Katie,

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Speaker 2: but we've given the Commonwealth the sort of the details

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Speaker 2: of how that will be used within the hospital and

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Speaker 2: we're optimistic that we'll be able to get our hands

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Speaker 2: on the funding very soon.

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Speaker 1: I know your press for time, as am I, but

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Speaker 1: what is that ten million dying to deliver.

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Speaker 2: Look, it will deliver a range of refurbishments to the

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Speaker 2: environment where you come to have your baby. At the

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Speaker 2: hospital I've mentioned Ardie H is old and it's a

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Speaker 2: bit run down and it's perhaps not as aesthetic and

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Speaker 2: pleasing an environment as a private hospital experience, and we

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Speaker 2: certainly can't compete with the private sector. But had we

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Speaker 2: been able to secure the thirty five million, we could

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Speaker 2: have done some internal building works and co located all

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Speaker 2: maternity services in one spot. We won't be able to

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Speaker 2: do that for ten but we will be able to

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Speaker 2: do some really, really nice refurbishment, so for mums and

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Speaker 2: families who come to Rule Darwen to have their baby,

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Speaker 2: it'll be a much more pleasant experience and a nicer

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Speaker 2: environment than it is today.

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Speaker 1: Well, Chris Hosking, the CEO of the Department of Health,

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Speaker 1: we will leave it there. Thanks so much for your

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Speaker 1: time this morning. Greatly appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: Thank you KD and thank you to your listeners.

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much.