1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:01,440 Speaker 1: Now inside Parliament. 2 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:03,960 Speaker 2: Earlier this week, we know the Territory government passed the 3 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 2: Associations and Liquor Amendment Bill for twenty twenty two. It 4 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 2: means that communities are now going to be able to 5 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,240 Speaker 2: choose well. The government says their own approach to alcohol 6 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 2: restrictions after the Commonwealth Stronger Futures legislation expires. But a 7 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 2: coalition of Territory Peak organizations for health, justice, the community 8 00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:28,320 Speaker 2: sector and others are demanding better consultation for Aboriginal communities 9 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 2: and a commitment to better process from government after that 10 00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:34,440 Speaker 2: legislation passed earlier in the week. 11 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: Now joining me on the. 12 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 2: Line to talk more about this is the CEO of AMSANT, 13 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:40,120 Speaker 2: John Patterson. 14 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:41,480 Speaker 1: Good morning to you, John. 15 00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 3: Good morning Katie mate, just too. 16 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I. 17 00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:49,239 Speaker 3: Take it you've received their joint media release from last night. 18 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:50,880 Speaker 1: I have, I have seen it. 19 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:53,559 Speaker 3: You see. Yeah, as you can see, you've mentioned a 20 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 3: couple of more few of those pre organizations that do 21 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 3: a number of community service and human service this work 22 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:03,240 Speaker 3: in our sector and our community throughout the Northern Territory. 23 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:09,399 Speaker 3: But I think the other significant partner in all of 24 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,919 Speaker 3: this is the Northern Territory Police association, so very significant, 25 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:18,880 Speaker 3: and Katie, we represent those peak bodies there represent a 26 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 3: large number of constituents, our members, our services, the work 27 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 3: we do, the people we're in contact with, the communities 28 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:32,760 Speaker 3: we work with is huge, not to be underestimated. So 29 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 3: the second thing I want to make and then we'll 30 00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 3: get on the discussion. Somebody promoted me to professor and 31 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 3: the release, but I should correct the record. I was 32 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 3: on a war to day honorary doctorate from Charles Archer 33 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 3: to read doctor John. 34 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: Oh that's all right, Oh, that's all right. Well, well 35 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 1: we like to call your pado in here. 36 00:01:56,120 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 3: We may let me open my comments bodies. First three 37 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 3: points that I want to make it clear to the 38 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 3: first one but blanket alcohol restrictions on communities and posed 39 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 3: as part of the intervention. And I might encourage everybody 40 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 3: to get a hold of the handsuard that was recorded 41 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:18,959 Speaker 3: from the other Knight's parliamentary session on this and listen 42 00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 3: and read to Robin Lamley's speech. She puts it into 43 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 3: perfect context about this, which should remind people about the 44 00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 3: history of the background to this work. So recommend getting 45 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 3: hold of Robin's speech and extended go back to my 46 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 3: point as part of the intervention that's extended by the 47 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 3: Stronger Futures legislation will cease on the sixteenth of July 48 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 3: this year, a few weeks away when the Stronger Futures 49 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:50,760 Speaker 3: legislation sunsets. Secondly, however, communities which were declared dry under 50 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:54,880 Speaker 3: the non legislation prior to the intervention will continue to 51 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:58,480 Speaker 3: be dry under the same mentee legislative provisions after Stronger 52 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 3: Future sunsets. And Thirdly, but there still means that there 53 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 3: are over four hundred communities, town camps, community living here is, 54 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 3: homelands and outstations that will suddenly be open to alcohol 55 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 3: access after a long period of prohibitions, up consultations and 56 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,880 Speaker 3: confrontation that determine the community's wishes and without measures to 57 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 3: be in place manage the impacts of alcohol. One of 58 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,040 Speaker 3: their other big concerns, Katie, is you know this could 59 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 3: also mean, you know, the priests are under resource so 60 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 3: it could well mean I can't confirm it, but the 61 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 3: pallets and other police auxiliary MECA inspectors that we see, 62 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 3: particularly Catherine Tennercreek Alla Springs at those bottlers that are 63 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 3: just double checking and you know, making sure that those 64 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:51,880 Speaker 3: that are purchasing alcohol, got the right addresses, et cetera, 65 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 3: could be removed and then what is the process, what 66 00:03:57,760 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 3: structures and other systems have we got to check? So 67 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:06,360 Speaker 3: this is where it could become very widespread consumption of alcohol, 68 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 3: even in some of those dry communities that already Yeah. 69 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 2: Well and Pado, this is something that you and I 70 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 2: spoke about a couple of weeks ago. I've also spoken 71 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 2: to the Police Association president about this on a couple 72 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 2: of occasions, and he'd raised concerns. 73 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: Paul mcceurwit raised concerns. You've raised those concerns. 74 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 2: We've spoken to John Boffer, We've spoken to lots of 75 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 2: people about the concerns being raised. 76 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,200 Speaker 1: Were you surprised ultimately that this did. 77 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 2: Pass earlier in the week without some more consultation from 78 00:04:36,279 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 2: the Northern Territory government? 79 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 3: Absolutely, Katie. Look, the Aboriginal leadership, particularly from those peak 80 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 3: organizations that are part of the media, lease are absolutely gutted. 81 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:52,599 Speaker 3: You know, we thought we had a government that was listening, 82 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:55,280 Speaker 3: a government that you know, and I've got to give 83 00:04:55,279 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 3: them credit, have introduced and implemented good alcohol measures throughout 84 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 3: you know, the last decade. But this piece of legislation 85 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 3: that was it was actually rushed through if we didn't 86 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:10,040 Speaker 3: expect it to be later in the week and then 87 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 3: we found out you know, oh it's been being debated. 88 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:16,040 Speaker 3: Tonight's sort of whenever the other nights when they went 89 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:22,720 Speaker 3: through Parliament without any due proper, open, transparent consultation with 90 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 3: those communities, those key stakeholder groups, those women groups, those 91 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 3: youth groups, those groups that are going to feel the 92 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:36,920 Speaker 3: impact of alcohol in their communities when there's no you know, 93 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 3: existing regulations. We want. What we're looking for, Kadie, is 94 00:05:41,839 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 3: the process led by government that goes in the community 95 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 3: and say, okay, you know, once they sought out where 96 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 3: we're going to go ahead for the stuff for those 97 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:52,680 Speaker 3: that want to implement alcohol, you know, licenses in their 98 00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 3: respective communities. You know, we've got to ensure there's proper regulations. 99 00:05:58,240 --> 00:05:59,920 Speaker 3: You know, is it going to be heavy beer, like, 100 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 3: is it going to be between what ours? How many 101 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:07,640 Speaker 3: times a week? Is there food and other meals going 102 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:09,840 Speaker 3: to be provioked? Because I understand that that could be 103 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:14,039 Speaker 3: a sort of a compulsory requirement for those that sell 104 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 3: alcohols they have meals, you know, John, we don't want 105 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:19,800 Speaker 3: people drinking on an empty stomach, so to speak. Yeah, John, 106 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:22,280 Speaker 3: what happens with somebody's bard? How long is they going 107 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 3: to be bad for them? What sorts of definitions around 108 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:28,039 Speaker 3: you know, being making an anuisance of being a mischief? 109 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 1: You know, are you concerned? 110 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:32,800 Speaker 2: Are you worried that you know with some of these 111 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:36,720 Speaker 2: communities now you know that the reality here could be 112 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 2: if if you know, if what you say, well, you 113 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 2: guys have basically you've got all of these groups that 114 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 2: have come out and said that there wasn't that proper consultation. 115 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:48,159 Speaker 2: So are you confident now that the government is going 116 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 2: to actually consult with those communities to make sure that 117 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 2: their concerns are heard? 118 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 3: Well, if I'm hearing it right, Katie from my informant, So, 119 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 3: I understand that a tender sort of went out for 120 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 3: organizations or run the private sector to undertake some community 121 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:13,160 Speaker 3: consultation before the sixteenth of July, and I understand a 122 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 3: few of them have pushed back or declined drawn from 123 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 3: that because the timing is just too rushed. We needed. 124 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:25,280 Speaker 3: Our position was keep the current policy legislation in place 125 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 3: for the next two years and had the flexibility of 126 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 3: the communities that went through an open, transparent process and 127 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 3: everybody gave the thumbs up for them to have the 128 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 3: sale of alcohol in their communities. That there was flexibility 129 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 3: to enable that to happen within the two years, but 130 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 3: we needed a two year period, you know, to coincide 131 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 3: or to align with those other pieces of legislation that 132 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 3: are currently there with May sunset, you know, tend of 133 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 3: two thousand and twenty three or twenty four, whatever that 134 00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 3: date was, to give us full time, enough time to 135 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 3: undertake those community consultations. You know, we've experienced there's some 136 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,840 Speaker 3: really good work done by Lean Little and Er team 137 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 3: that went around and consulted all those communities. That's the 138 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 3: sort of that's the sort of process we see seeking here, Katie. Yeah, 139 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 3: going out there genuinely sitting down working with communities, explaining, 140 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 3: providing all the relevant evidence. You know, they need to 141 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 3: understand that. You know, there's statistics and evidence around the 142 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:36,079 Speaker 3: Emergency Department alcohol related admittance. That's all that sort of 143 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 3: information needs to be tabled so that people are fully 144 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:42,959 Speaker 3: aware and have a shared understanding of what they're getting 145 00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:43,680 Speaker 3: themselves into. 146 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 2: John the Northern Territory government said in a statement earlier 147 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 2: in the week when this was passed, that the legislation, 148 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 2: the previous legislation was race based policy with no engagement 149 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 2: with Aboriginal territorians or with the Aboriginal territorians that it 150 00:08:59,040 --> 00:08:59,840 Speaker 2: was targeted at. 151 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,040 Speaker 1: I mean, what would you say in response to that? 152 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 3: Now it's a florid argument. Florid argument, Codie. And this 153 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:10,319 Speaker 3: is why I want people to get hold of that 154 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:14,040 Speaker 3: transcript from Robin Lamley's speech the other night when she 155 00:09:14,120 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 3: got up and spoke, and I you know, I listened 156 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:21,720 Speaker 3: to it very very closely. She puts it into the context. 157 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:26,120 Speaker 3: This legislation came in with the Australian intervention under the 158 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 3: Howard government, a L and P government. Labor was soon 159 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:34,880 Speaker 3: after elected nationally had a Labor National government. We advocated then, 160 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:39,000 Speaker 3: the Peak bodies advocated for the Labor government to get 161 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:42,439 Speaker 3: rid of some of these Troconian measures and pieces of 162 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:46,719 Speaker 3: legislation that was part of the intervention, but they continued 163 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:49,920 Speaker 3: with it. So they're just as guilty as anybody else 164 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:55,960 Speaker 3: for maintaining this legislation and stronger future measures. If they 165 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:58,200 Speaker 3: were serious and thought it was racist, why didn't they 166 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:01,080 Speaker 3: get rid of it back then? Yeah? Well, I'm saying 167 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:03,199 Speaker 3: it's a fraud argument and it doesn't you know, it 168 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:06,200 Speaker 3: doesn't part the pub tests. As far as we're concerned, John, 169 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 3: we are. 170 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 1: Going to have to wrap up. 171 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 2: But I want to ask you what are what are 172 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 2: your real concerns now with this legislation passing and alcohol 173 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:18,200 Speaker 2: getting back into these communities. 174 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:23,679 Speaker 3: Well, Katie, put everybody on notice, every taxpayer in the 175 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 3: Northern Territory too. You're going to be bigger than any 176 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:29,800 Speaker 3: your wallop because the increase of alcohol related violence, and 177 00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:33,439 Speaker 3: you know all the impacts, all the spin offs that 178 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 3: are going to come from that. You know, the extra 179 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 3: police which are currently already under enormous train, our health workforce, 180 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:46,240 Speaker 3: you know in a very similar position. You know, the 181 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 3: the the women centers, the childcare, you know, children issues 182 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:56,559 Speaker 3: that they're going to come from this restless night. You know, 183 00:10:57,679 --> 00:10:59,880 Speaker 3: people not running up to work because they can't get 184 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 3: a decent sleep. These are you know, this is going 185 00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:06,079 Speaker 3: to come at a cost, and taxpayers are going to 186 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 3: have to pay for a Katie and I forget the 187 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 3: last figure, but my informants told me it was well 188 00:11:12,920 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 3: five hundred million dollars for you know, full the services, 189 00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:21,880 Speaker 3: the mop up from alcohol related incidences, et cetera. We're 190 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 3: just going to see an increase in that and at 191 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:25,839 Speaker 3: the end of the day, somebody's going to have to 192 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 3: pay for it. I mean that money, that money, and 193 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,760 Speaker 3: that the attention that this has been given by parliament 194 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:36,840 Speaker 3: and governments. Why aren't we getting the same sort of attention, Ktie, 195 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 3: on the urgent need for housing, addressing more women's shelters 196 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 3: and children support centers, et cetera, et cetera. While this 197 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 3: big focus, the big urgent attention that we've got to address. 198 00:11:51,679 --> 00:11:54,439 Speaker 3: It seems like every time there's you know, there's a 199 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 3: debate that's around alcohol and Aboriginal people are at the 200 00:11:57,240 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 3: forefront of it. We want some constructive, meaningful the baton 201 00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 3: discussion in this in this place, Katie. At the end 202 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 3: of the day, it's just so terrible that some of 203 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 3: the priorities that governments are wanting to have a debaiton 204 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,199 Speaker 3: passed legislation on. I want to see a similar effort 205 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:19,560 Speaker 3: around housing, education, employment, incarceration rates, etcetera, etcetera. 206 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:24,120 Speaker 2: You know, well, John Patterson, we always appreciate your time. 207 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 2: The CEO of amsatt the Aboriginal Medical Services Alliance here 208 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:31,600 Speaker 2: in the Northern territory, a doctor John Patterson, or as 209 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,319 Speaker 2: we like to call you, Pado. We really appreciate you 210 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 2: having a chat with us this morning. 211 00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 3: Good on, Thank you.