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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families Podcast.

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Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the time poor parent who just

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Speaker 2: on answers me Now. Hello, This is doctor Justin Coulson,

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Speaker 2: the founder of Happy Families dot com, dot you, the

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Speaker 2: author of six books that to six Kids, and the

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Speaker 2: parenting expert co host on Channel Line's Parentphical Guidance. I'm

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Speaker 2: really excited today to have a conversation with somebody who

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Speaker 2: I respect enormously and who does great work for helping

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Speaker 2: us to understand more about what's going on with kids,

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Speaker 2: their behavior, and the way that we live our lives

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Speaker 2: in our families. Doctor Anthea Rhodes is a pediatrician, researcher

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Speaker 2: and child health advocate. She also runs the Royal Children's

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Speaker 2: Hospital Children's Health Poll out of Melbourne. She's been there

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Speaker 2: since two thousand and four as a pediatrician and Anthea

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Speaker 2: joins me today to talk about the latest Royal Children's

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Speaker 2: Health Poll. Anthea, thanks for being on the Happy Family Podcast.

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Speaker 1: Great to be here, Justin.

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Speaker 2: The latest poll is about a topic that we don't

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Speaker 2: usually cover off on the Happy Families podcast, and it's

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Speaker 2: maybe because I'm not quite sure what to say about it,

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Speaker 2: but I know that I've got opinions. It's just one

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Speaker 2: of those topics that creates for some parents a little

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Speaker 2: bit of shame, a little bit of worry, a little

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Speaker 2: bit of oh, my goodness, another thing that I'm not

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Speaker 2: doing well enough. So I want to be really careful

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Speaker 2: in the way that we talk about what you've discovered. Here.

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Speaker 2: We're talking about baby and toddler foods, the stuff that

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Speaker 2: you buy prepackaged, the quick simple solutions to give the

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Speaker 2: kids a squeezy pack because you've got to get them

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Speaker 2: to eat something before you run out the door in

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Speaker 2: the morning, and everything's gone wrong in the morning. So

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Speaker 2: where should we start this national child health pole about

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Speaker 2: ready made baby foods? How much do parents really know

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Speaker 2: about what's in these foods? And do we need to

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Speaker 2: be worried?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I think I think you've hit the nail

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Speaker 3: on the head. They're justin in saying it's really important

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Speaker 3: that this conversation is.

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Speaker 1: Not about parents blaming or guilt.

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Speaker 3: What we really wanted to find out is, you know,

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Speaker 3: just how common is the use of ready.

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Speaker 1: Made baby foods in an average.

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Speaker 3: Famili's diet for the young kids, and what do parents

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Speaker 3: know about the facts when it comes to these foods,

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Speaker 3: how they're produced, how they regulated, what sort of contents

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Speaker 3: go into them, and how they market it towards you

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Speaker 3: when you walk down the supermarket aisle and you're bombarded

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Speaker 3: with choice. And the first thing we learned is that

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Speaker 3: it's really really common for ozzie babies and toddlers to

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Speaker 3: have ready made foods as part of their diet. So

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Speaker 3: around half of kids under five have some of these

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Speaker 3: foods at least once a week, with some children having

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Speaker 3: these make up most of their diet. Wow, So part

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Speaker 3: of what we are doing as a society, and it's

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Speaker 3: usually for convenience. So the most common reason parents gave

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Speaker 3: for why they choose these products. You know, as you've said,

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Speaker 3: we're busy, you're trying to get out the door, you

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Speaker 3: might be running around in the car after school, you know,

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Speaker 3: dropping kids off to different things, and convenience tops the

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Speaker 3: list as to why parents choose ready made food products.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I've got to jump in there and highlight. So

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Speaker 2: when we first had our children and parents of six,

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Speaker 2: the first few kids that we had, Kighly was amazing

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Speaker 2: in terms of she'd use the ice cube trays and

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Speaker 2: mash up all the vegetables and put the vegetables into

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Speaker 2: the ice cube trays and then freeze them, and she

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Speaker 2: could just defrost them in bite sized chunks for the

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Speaker 2: kids so that they were getting the right amount of food.

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Speaker 2: Kylie would pre prepare everything and have it in the

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Speaker 2: fridge and the topp ofware containers and so good. By

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Speaker 2: the time we got the children four, five, and six,

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Speaker 2: were just exhausted. Granted it was mostly Kylie doing it.

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Speaker 2: I was doing the PhD, or I was working or whatever,

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Speaker 2: but eventually we got to the point where the kids

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Speaker 2: were eating these things all the time. Our youngest kids

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Speaker 2: ate so much of this pre prepared baby and toddler food,

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Speaker 2: the ready made stuff, because it was just so convenient

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Speaker 2: and we were just so exhausted. So I'm not surprised

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Speaker 2: to hear you say that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, And look, being fired is what matters, right,

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Speaker 3: You know, you don't want your kids going hungry, And

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Speaker 3: you can totally understand that parents need a solution where

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Speaker 3: they can have convenience and it doesn't have to come

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Speaker 3: at the cost of healthiness for their kids. And that's

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Speaker 3: where the really important thing here is. I guess in

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Speaker 3: our study, most parents didn't know that there are really

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Speaker 3: no regulations in Australia for toddler food products, so anything

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Speaker 3: can be put into these products and they can be

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Speaker 3: marketed really in any way that the companies like. And

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Speaker 3: as a consumer, as a buyer of these products, you

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Speaker 3: can really be misled as to how healthy some of

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Speaker 3: these choices are. And they're not all created equal, so

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Speaker 3: there are some healthier options and there's some less healthy options.

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Speaker 3: So what we really would like to do is help

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Speaker 3: parents to understand a bit more about how they choose

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Speaker 3: the better product when they're making a decision. And the

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Speaker 3: other big, real sort of outcome for us from this

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Speaker 3: study is actually not about parents doing things differently, but

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Speaker 3: about the government doing things differently. We want to see

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Speaker 3: regulations at a government level but ensure that these products

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Speaker 3: are healthy for kids and that they are clearly labeled

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Speaker 3: and that they're not confusing for parents.

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Speaker 1: Because these products are here to stay, we absolutely.

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Speaker 3: Understand why parents choose to use them, and we need

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Speaker 3: to make it easy for them to make healthier choices.

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Speaker 2: I'm just thinking about our experience with these foods as

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Speaker 2: the kids have grown, and I mean, even though we

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Speaker 2: don't have babies and toddlers anymore, we still from time

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Speaker 2: to time have prepackaged food in the fridge like that's

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Speaker 2: just life. We all do it. But the kids from

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Speaker 2: the youngest age, they always prefer the stuff that's in

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Speaker 2: the packages. And as I think about what you're describing,

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Speaker 2: I reckon. I can hazard to guess as to why

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Speaker 2: if there are no regulations around what goes into these packages,

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Speaker 2: then the really healthy stuff that's been cooked at home

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Speaker 2: is probably not going to taste quite the same as

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Speaker 2: the stuff that's coming out of the packages, the stuff

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Speaker 2: with the preservatives or the sugars or the additives that

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Speaker 2: are designed to make kids really like this stuff, and

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Speaker 2: that's why they only want to eat what's in the

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Speaker 2: squeeze package. Is that a fair core?

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Speaker 1: It absolutely is.

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Speaker 3: So the biggest product of concern that goes into these

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Speaker 3: ready made foods is sugar, so particularly high concentrated amounts

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Speaker 3: of sugar, which maybe from natural sauces. So often the

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Speaker 3: products might be labeled as all natural sugars or no

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Speaker 3: added sugars. But what has happened is fruit is basically

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Speaker 3: concentrated right down because fruit is very sweet, but it's

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Speaker 3: a natural product, right, and fruit we think fruit's healthy,

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Speaker 3: So as a buyer. If you see that something's got

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Speaker 3: fruit in it, you think, oh, that's going to be

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Speaker 3: a healthy choice. But in fact, if the way that

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Speaker 3: fruit has been processed makes it very, very concentrated, what

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Speaker 3: it really means is it's a sneaky way for companies

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Speaker 3: to add a lot of sugar.

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Speaker 1: And we know that kids like sugar, I mean adults.

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Speaker 3: Like sugar, and the more young children eat food products

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Speaker 3: that are sweetened, they actually develop a preference where their

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Speaker 3: palette wants more sweet food and that can really set

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Speaker 3: them up for you know, not just a short term issue,

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Speaker 3: but even sometimes a lifelong preference for sweetened foods. And

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Speaker 3: they do have health implications. Obviously there's weight gain and

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Speaker 3: unhealthy diet down the track can lead to that, and

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Speaker 3: then for younger kids there's also a lot of issues

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Speaker 3: with teeth and you know, cavities that can come from

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Speaker 3: too much sugar in foods.

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Speaker 2: Hearing you say that really resonates for me as we've

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Speaker 2: watched the different ways that our kids, literally the oldest

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Speaker 2: three versus the youngest three, approach food and diets. And

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Speaker 2: I'm sure that we can't draw a direct straight line

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Speaker 2: from the squeeze packs through to what they choose to

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Speaker 2: do now, but there has to be some sort of correlation.

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Speaker 2: Let me just go over a couple of other stats

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Speaker 2: that came out of the pole. You said that one

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Speaker 2: in five kids aged under five eat ready made foods

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Speaker 2: most days of the week, which startled me. That's a

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Speaker 2: fifth of kids eating ready made foods most days. More

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Speaker 2: than half of parents think ready made baby and toddler

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Speaker 2: food contains ingredients to make sure children grow and develop well.

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Speaker 2: And fifty three percent of parents falsely believe that ready

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Speaker 2: made food products for infants and toddlers are tightly regulated

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Speaker 2: by government to ensure good nutrition. All statistics that sort

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Speaker 2: of underscore and emphasize what you've been talking about as

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Speaker 2: we've discussed things so far. Right after the break, doctor

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Speaker 2: Anthea Rhodes is going to give us some tips on

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Speaker 2: how we can make sure that we get the balance

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Speaker 2: right and that we help our children, no matter their age,

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Speaker 2: but particularly our infants and toddlers, can make sure that

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Speaker 2: they're getting their nutritional needs met in guilt free ways

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Speaker 2: that work for busy families. Your daughter just walked by,

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Speaker 2: eyes glued to her phone, expression unreadable. You ask her

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Speaker 2: to put it down, but she balks. You know it's

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Speaker 2: not good for her, but you're not sure why or

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Speaker 2: how to support better choices. In the webinar pixel perfect

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Speaker 2: I joined with psychologists and teen tech expert Jocelyn Brewer

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Speaker 2: to discuss how to set screen boundaries that work for

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Speaker 2: you and your daughter. Check out pixel perfect now on

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Speaker 2: the Happy Family's webshop. It's the Happy Families Podcast, the

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Speaker 2: podcast for the time poor parent who just wants answers. Now,

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Speaker 2: I'm speaking with the person who runs the Royal Children's

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Speaker 2: Health Poll, doctor Anthea Rhodes, a pediatrician, researcher and all

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Speaker 2: round fantastic person who's going to give us some clues

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Speaker 2: now about what we do about getting the kids off

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Speaker 2: those squeeze packs when they're addicted to them. How do

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Speaker 2: we feed our kids healthily when we are time poor.

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Speaker 2: The stuff does taste great and it's all vullia, when

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Speaker 2: the cost is actually pretty reasonable a lot of the time,

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Speaker 2: and when we actually feel like we're giving the kids

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Speaker 2: healthy choices.

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Speaker 3: Anthea, Yeah, so it's not easy justin I think that's

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Speaker 3: the first thing to say to parents. And there are

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Speaker 3: ways to still choose some of these convenient, ready made

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Speaker 3: products without having to compromise that healthy diet for your kids.

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Speaker 3: First thing to mention, of course, is everything in moderation

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Speaker 3: is always good. So ideally you don't want to be

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Speaker 3: having these food products every single meal, every single snack,

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Speaker 3: every single day. But as a small part of the diet,

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Speaker 3: then there are ways you can make choices where they're

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Speaker 3: going to be absolutely okay, and we know that the

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Speaker 3: benefits of that convenience are worth those choices on that particular.

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Speaker 1: Day or in that given moment.

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Speaker 3: If you have a look at the packet of the

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Speaker 3: food products, there's a bit of information there that can

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Speaker 3: help you to make the healthier choice. It's really hard

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Speaker 3: to do that when you're in the supermarket. You know,

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Speaker 3: I've got four kids myself. They're hanging off your leg,

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Speaker 3: or they're complaining, or they're looking at the ads on

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Speaker 3: the packets and the cartoon carriacter and then trying.

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Speaker 1: To persuade you to buy a certain product.

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Speaker 3: That's not the moment to stop and pull out, you know,

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Speaker 3: the nutrition panel and try and work out which product

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Speaker 3: to choose. The time to do it is at home later,

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Speaker 3: so buy a few different things.

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Speaker 1: Once the kids are in bed.

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Speaker 3: You get five minutes to yourself, hopefully have a cup

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Speaker 3: of tea, have a look at the packets, and that

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Speaker 3: you can use that information then to work out which

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Speaker 3: one's going to be a healthier choice, and you might

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Speaker 3: go for that option next time. There are two things

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Speaker 3: that I would suggest parents have a look at. The

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Speaker 3: First one is the ingredients list. So that's literally that

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Speaker 3: list where each ingredient appears in a row in a

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Speaker 3: line with a percentage behind it, and the rules that

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Speaker 3: do exist tell us that whatever's most common in that

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Speaker 3: product has to appear first. So if you're buying something

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Speaker 3: like perhaps you know, a bolonnaise, a bolonnaise product, you

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Speaker 3: would hope that the first thing on that list might

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Speaker 3: be something you expect to find in bolonnaise, amato, It

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Speaker 3: might be meat of some sort. If the first thing

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Speaker 3: on that list is apple or pair, then what you

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Speaker 3: know is that actually that product's got a lot of

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Speaker 3: added sugar in it that is actually going to be

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Speaker 3: the main part of the ingredients that your child is eating.

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Speaker 3: So I would look at that list, and particularly the

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Speaker 3: first one too, even three items on it, and if

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Speaker 3: it's not sounding like a healthy product based on that information,

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Speaker 3: choose something else.

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Speaker 1: That's the first tip.

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Speaker 3: The second is the thing called the nutrition information panel,

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Speaker 3: or sometimes we call it the NIP, and that's a

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Speaker 3: box on the back of all food products that has

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Speaker 3: a whole list of ingredients and then a whole bunch

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Speaker 3: of numbers. Sometimes we feel like you need, you know,

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Speaker 3: a science degree and a calculator to actually work.

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Speaker 1: Out what it means. Most of it I would ignore.

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Speaker 3: But the one thing that you know, if you're going

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Speaker 3: to choose something to look at, would be the sugar.

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Speaker 3: Scroll down the table, have a bit of a look

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Speaker 3: fine sugar. Look across at the aut per one hundred

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Speaker 3: grams and see how many grams.

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Speaker 1: Of sugar are in that product.

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Speaker 3: A good rule of thumb is that a teaspoon of

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Speaker 3: sugar is equal to four grams. Some of these squeezy

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Speaker 3: food products, yogurts fruits particularly, can contain a lot of sugar.

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Speaker 3: Will have thirty grams of sugar, for example, in them.

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Speaker 3: So you know, straight off the bat, that's seven teaspoons

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Speaker 3: of sugar, and if your child's going to have two

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Speaker 3: or three of those over the day, then that rapidly

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Speaker 3: adds up to way more sugar than they need for

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Speaker 3: a healthy diet.

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Speaker 2: I've just I've got to jump in here that this

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Speaker 2: has blown my mind. So I always look at that

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Speaker 2: little panel. My mum's a dietitian, She's never taught me

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Speaker 2: how to read the panel, but I do know that

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Speaker 2: under the sugars that usually says carbohydrates and sugars. And

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Speaker 2: so I'm just curious before we get two caught up

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Speaker 2: in the whole four grams per tablespoon, So twenty eight grams,

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Speaker 2: that's seven tablespoons. I mean, that's a phenomenal amount of sugar.

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Speaker 2: If one of my kids had a Milo and they

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Speaker 2: put seven spoons of sugar into that Milo, I'd be

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Speaker 2: I'd be having conniptions, I'd be losing it. So is

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Speaker 2: there a difference in the different kinds of sugars that

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Speaker 2: are in there? Or is sugars total sufficient for us

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Speaker 2: to make this decision when it comes to what's on

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Speaker 2: that nip that nutritional information panel.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So, sugar is a complex business and there are a

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Speaker 3: lot of different ways that it can be named, and

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Speaker 3: that can add to the confusion, and it can also

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Speaker 3: add to ways that companies developing these products can sneak

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Speaker 3: sugar in.

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Speaker 1: And it's not clear that it's in there.

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Speaker 3: So the easiest thing to do is actually literally use

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Speaker 3: the word that says sugars.

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Speaker 1: That will be a minimum.

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Speaker 3: There may be more than that in the product, but

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Speaker 3: that is definitely at least as much as is in

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Speaker 3: the product.

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Speaker 1: So to keep it simple, there will always.

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Speaker 3: Be a road that says sugars. That's the one to

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Speaker 3: look at and have a look at the number of grams.

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Speaker 3: And some of these products actually are great, and you know,

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Speaker 3: they might have two or four grams of sugar, which

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Speaker 3: is not an un reasonable amount for a pouch that

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Speaker 3: contains fruit or contains yogurt. There's going to be a

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Speaker 3: little bit of sugar in that. The other thing I

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Speaker 3: will say is it might surprise you which ones are

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Speaker 3: healthier and which ones are less healthy. Some that are

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Speaker 3: marketed to look really healthy in the way that their

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Speaker 3: packaging is, and they might have lots of comments on

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Speaker 3: there or claims about nothing being added, or being all

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Speaker 3: natural or being organic. Sometimes they're the ones that really

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Speaker 3: actually are the worst.

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Speaker 1: And then even some of the.

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Speaker 3: Others covered in cartoons where you think, oh, this is

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Speaker 3: really going to be bad, when you look at the numbers,

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Speaker 3: it's much better.

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Speaker 1: So take a minute end of.

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Speaker 3: The day after the kids have eaten it and decide, Okay,

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Speaker 3: next time, I'm going to go for this one.

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Speaker 2: That's fascinating. Are there any other tips that can be helpful?

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Speaker 2: Just before we wrap this up.

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Speaker 1: One other really great tip.

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Speaker 3: I mentioned teeth, and you know how problematic sugary foods

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Speaker 3: can be for teeth.

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Speaker 1: We know that with squeezy packets.

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Speaker 3: Parents listening, you know, I'm sure have handed a pouch

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Speaker 3: as I have to my kids.

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Speaker 1: And I heard a parents say.

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Speaker 3: To me in mum's group once it's parenting, varna that

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Speaker 3: moment where you can hand the pouch over and you

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Speaker 3: know your toddler can take care of it themselves. There

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Speaker 3: is no mutt mess and they're just you know, sucking

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Speaker 3: straight back from the packet and life is suddenly easy.

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Speaker 1: You can do it on the go, in the pram,

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Speaker 1: in the car.

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Speaker 3: The downside to that is that that product is getting

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Speaker 3: all around the teeth. It's not the same even as

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Speaker 3: drinking juice, because it's quite thick and it will actually

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Speaker 3: coat teeth and it can lead to problems with teeth.

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Speaker 1: So a great rule of thumb, if.

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Speaker 3: You can't avoid this all the time, is to follow

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Speaker 3: with a drink of water. So if your child's just

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Speaker 3: had a squeezy pouch of some sort, hand them water

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Speaker 3: afterwards to actually at least rinse off the mouth and

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Speaker 3: the teeth, to try and reduce that sugar sitting around.

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Speaker 3: And of course whenever you can, try squeezing these products

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Speaker 3: into a spoon, giving them into a bowl, giving them

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Speaker 3: a spoon, so that they can also have a go

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Speaker 3: at eating it in that way, because they're learning all

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Speaker 3: kinds of things.

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Speaker 1: Then about you know how to use.

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Speaker 3: Cutlery, what the food product actually looks like, smells like,

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Speaker 3: you know, in a way that they don't learn if

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Speaker 3: they're only ever sucking it straight from the pouch.

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Speaker 2: What a great conversation. And of course, as you mentioned already,

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Speaker 2: but I just want to emphasize it again, everything in moderation,

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Speaker 2: everything in moderation.

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Speaker 3: One or these things across the day is absolutely part

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Speaker 3: of the way many people manage the diet for their kids.

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Speaker 3: But it needs to be mixed up with other things,

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Speaker 3: whole foods, fresh ingredients where you can. It's not about

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Speaker 3: telling parents get back to the kitchen make everything from scratch.

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Speaker 3: It's not practical and in fact it's not even necessary

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Speaker 3: but it's about balancing things and when you are choosing

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Speaker 3: some of those ready made products, trying to choose the

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Speaker 3: best ones so that they're still healthy options. It shouldn't

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Speaker 3: be that convenience means we have to be unhealthy. Ideally

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Speaker 3: we can achieve both things.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Anthea Rhodes runs the Royal Children's Hospital National Child

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Speaker 2: Health Pole. If you'd like more information about it, Anthea,

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Speaker 2: where can people go to get all of the details

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Speaker 2: on this pole and the others?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so jump online.

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Speaker 3: We have a website rchble dot org dot au so

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Speaker 3: lots of information there, including some great tips and handouts

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Speaker 3: for parents. And we've also got a podcast justin the

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Speaker 3: RCH Kids Health Info podcast, and we've got an episode

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Speaker 3: coming up on there about fussy eating, which is another

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Speaker 3: big part of the challenge when it comes to getting

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Speaker 3: kids to eat the things you really want them to eat.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Outstanding. So we'll make sure that we link both to

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Speaker 2: the pole and of the podcast so people can find

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Speaker 2: out more information about it. I think that it's a

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Speaker 2: really nice marriage between the work we do here and

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Speaker 2: the work that you're doing there. Great to talk to you, Anthea,

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much for your time.

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Speaker 1: My pleasure. Justin great to be on.

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Speaker 2: The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rowanck from

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Speaker 2: Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer and for

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Speaker 2: more information about making your family happier, you can visit

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Speaker 2: us at happy families dot com dot au