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Speaker 1: With her time and time again to work out fasted

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Speaker 1: in the morning as it burns more fat. But is

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Speaker 1: this really the case? On today's episode of The Nutrition Couch,

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Speaker 1: we look at the research for fasted workouts and what

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Speaker 1: you should ultimately be doing for fat loss. Hi, I'm

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Speaker 1: Susie Burrow and I'm lean Wood, and as two of

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Speaker 1: us JAS leading dieticians who specialize in evidence based nutrition,

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Speaker 1: we bring you The Nutrition Couch, a weekly chat on

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Speaker 1: everything that is new in the world of food, diets

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Speaker 1: and nutrition, as well as fasted workouts. Today we take

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Speaker 1: you through the surprising foods that you shouldn't eat before bed,

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Speaker 1: and then we talk about a media case study where

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Speaker 1: a personal trainer has actually been banned from giving out

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Speaker 1: dietary advice. And I know, Leanne, this is a topic

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Speaker 1: that has resonated with you because I think you were

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Speaker 1: recently telling me about when you would go to the

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Speaker 1: gym with David Prema, there was a pt who used

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Speaker 1: to rub out the nutrition advice on the board before

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Speaker 1: you went in. Maybe it wasn't something you'd agree with,

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Speaker 1: It was keta. It was all keta.

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Speaker 2: It was like all low carb. And then like sometimes

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Speaker 2: they do like little seminars and talks, and sometimes i'd hear,

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Speaker 2: you know, some of the ladies in the group as

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Speaker 2: I'd walk into sort of the back room, and some

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Speaker 2: of the ladies would go, oh, I just I can't

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Speaker 2: help myself, Like I'm binging on carbs because I just

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Speaker 2: really love them, but then I feel so good doing cutter.

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Speaker 2: But then they just have this like binge restrict mentality,

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Speaker 2: and like they'd be giving out nutrition advice, rinning prescriptive

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Speaker 2: meal plans up on the board, say you should be

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Speaker 2: having this, you know, only twenty percent carbs, like seventy

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Speaker 2: percent fats like whatever. It was like really prescriptive type

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Speaker 2: meal plans, getting people to track their calories and macros

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Speaker 2: and that sort of thing, and that's really out of

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Speaker 2: scope for personal trainers. So I think when they found

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Speaker 2: out that I was a dietitian, they were a lot

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Speaker 2: more cautious with sort of overly giving out that advice

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Speaker 2: to everybody in the gym. But you know, just some

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Speaker 2: of the stories that I would hear about some of

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Speaker 2: the ladies being like, I just have no energy, my

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Speaker 2: hormones are out of control, and just you know, like

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Speaker 2: male pts being like it's fine like push through, like

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Speaker 2: you got this, the goal's weight loss, like it's okay.

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Speaker 2: So I really do think there's a time and a

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Speaker 2: place for you know, qualified professionals when it comes to

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Speaker 2: dietary advice. But this media article was an interesting one,

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Speaker 2: wasn't it.

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Speaker 1: I think it's really fascinating because my experience with being

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Speaker 1: a dietitian is not dissimilar. And even were he in television,

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Speaker 1: you'll go into the hair and makeup room and know

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Speaker 1: that half of the crew are on this new wave

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Speaker 1: keto diet that the latest nutrition gurus recommending.

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Speaker 2: And I just.

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Speaker 1: Actually kind of switch off now as I get older,

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Speaker 1: because I think there's always dietary theories. I try never

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Speaker 1: to tell people when I'm at a dinner party that

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Speaker 1: I'm a dietitian because you end up answering dietary questions.

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Speaker 1: So I think it's quite nice to be off, to

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Speaker 1: step out of your role at times and not take

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Speaker 1: it on board. But this was a very pertinent example

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Speaker 1: that's come through, and there's been a similar one in

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Speaker 1: the Sydney media recently about a natural path who has

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Speaker 1: been banned for a similar reason. He was quite well

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Speaker 1: known for fast, extreme fast diets with herbal supplements, and

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Speaker 1: he actually had quite a couple of severe medical reactions

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Speaker 1: to that. I think one client, I want to say,

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Speaker 1: there was a heart issue I think associated with sixtreme fasting,

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Speaker 1: and so again he has been banned because of that.

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Speaker 1: So this specific case is I think the first I've

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Speaker 1: seen of actually a personal trainer. Now, anyone who goes

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Speaker 1: to gyms or CrossFit or lifts will know there's always

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Speaker 1: talk about diets in the space of exercise, because of

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Speaker 1: course it goes so closely together. And you know, I

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Speaker 1: guess this is the word of warning that you do

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Speaker 1: have to be careful because as soon as it's getting

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Speaker 1: to extreme advice or not applied to someone taking into

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Speaker 1: account their medical variables or medication that could impact their

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Speaker 1: response to that, it can actually be dangerous. And so

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Speaker 1: I think the thing that stood out to me in

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Speaker 1: recent weeks with Shane Warne's premature death, you would argue,

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Speaker 1: is that, yeah, you know, anecdotally, there has been some

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Speaker 1: discussion around the fact that he had been on extreme

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Speaker 1: diets and fasting diets for long periods of time, and

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Speaker 1: our concern nutritionally is whenever they're extreme, particularly low in

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Speaker 1: carbohydrate calories, is that you will inevitably have some muscle wasting,

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Speaker 1: and of course the heart's a muscle, so if you

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Speaker 1: do have underlying heart disease or a tendency to predisposition

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Speaker 1: to have heart issues, you can exast about those dehydration

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Speaker 1: of courses, again closely linked to performance and heart response.

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Speaker 1: So you do have to be really careful because you're

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Speaker 1: starting to play with life in some cases when you're

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Speaker 1: on these extreme diets without taking into account some of

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Speaker 1: those medical variables that can have profound effects if it's

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Speaker 1: going or given to the wrong person in the wrong scenario.

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Speaker 2: And if you look at this, if this sort of

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Speaker 2: I guess what are we going to call it? Media

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Speaker 2: sort of peace or media article that was about that

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Speaker 2: South Australian personal trainer. So the Health and Community Service

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Speaker 2: Complaints Commissioner which they call the hc SCC, actually that

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Speaker 2: body actually sought professional advice from two independent, accredited practicing

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Speaker 2: dietitians on two different diet and nutrition plans that this

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Speaker 2: personal trainer had given out. Now, I think one of

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Speaker 2: the most concerning things Susie was he wasn't just a

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Speaker 2: personal trainer giving giving out diet advice. He was actually

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Speaker 2: posing as a fake dietitian, so he was actually calling

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Speaker 2: himself a dietitian, telling his clients he was a dietitian.

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Speaker 2: I think that in itself is quite you know concerning

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Speaker 2: let alone the fact there's so many pts out there

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Speaker 2: giving out of scope advice writing nutrition plans. So this

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Speaker 2: HCSCC professional body sought some independent advice and of the

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Speaker 2: dieticians that they sort of got to look through these plans.

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Speaker 2: One plan, the dietitian said that the amount of water

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Speaker 2: that was suggested in this plan. So you see this

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Speaker 2: pet prescribed nine point two five liters of water a

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Speaker 2: day to their client. That is insane. Like David and

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Speaker 2: I joke that I'm a cow, Well, I'm six nearly

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Speaker 2: six foot one. I can easily drink like four liters

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Speaker 2: of water a day, even four or five if it's

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Speaker 2: a hot day and I'm doing a lot of exercise.

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Speaker 2: But nine point two five liters of water is an

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Speaker 2: astronomical amount, and that can have really really detrimential effects

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Speaker 2: on terms of cardiac function and electrolyte levels as well.

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Speaker 2: When I used to work at the hospital, I remember

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Speaker 2: one of the first cases I saw in the ICU.

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Speaker 2: In the intensive care unit was this lady who again

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Speaker 2: had done this extreme diet extreme fast. She drunk I

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Speaker 2: think nine or ten liters of water a day, and

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Speaker 2: she'd actually flooded her cells with so much water that

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Speaker 2: all of her electrolytes dropped. So I guess, like hazardly

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Speaker 2: that she actually ended up in the ICU and they

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Speaker 2: had to replace all of her electrolyte. It was it

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Speaker 2: was very you know, I was kind of touching girl.

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Speaker 2: It was very dangerous because potassium is one of those

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Speaker 2: electrolytes that can actually regulate heart function, and in a

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Speaker 2: lot of clinical cases, say in extreme eating disorders, that

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Speaker 2: can actually drop so low that it can lead to

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Speaker 2: sudden cardiac arrest. So prescribing that amount of water in

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Speaker 2: a meal plan just as a blanket sort of prescription

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Speaker 2: without any you know, means or clinical reasoning for that

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Speaker 2: is absolutely seriously dangerous. And another dietitian found that one

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Speaker 2: of his other meal plans had recommended really really high

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Speaker 2: doses of fish oil and vitamin C. You know, they

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Speaker 2: can result in things like blood penning. Their personal trainer

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Speaker 2: hadn't done any sort of prior background screening in terms

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Speaker 2: of medical background, Did they have some heart issues, did

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Speaker 2: they have issues with their blood penning, so, you know,

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Speaker 2: just prescribing with the high doses of supplements as well.

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Speaker 2: And another thing that they found when looking through the

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Speaker 2: meal plans that he was writing was that they were

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Speaker 2: supposed to be for fat loss, right, and these meal

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Speaker 2: plans were actually calculated at such a high calorie load

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Speaker 2: that not only would the clients not lose weight, they

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Speaker 2: actually would potentially gain around about a kila a week

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Speaker 2: if they were to follow those plans. So again, the

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Speaker 2: only people that should be writing prescriptive nutrition advice should

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Speaker 2: be a credit to practicing dietitians because that's, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's what we're trained to do. So I think, you know,

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Speaker 2: a lot of the is you know, health coaches and

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Speaker 2: fitness influencers and personal trainers online, a lot of them

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Speaker 2: are working out of scope and really what they're allowed

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Speaker 2: to do is give out standard nutrition advice in line

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Speaker 2: with the Australian Guide to Healthy Eating, no more than

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Speaker 2: that basically. So we do know that it happens, you know,

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Speaker 2: so so so often. But I think this is just

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Speaker 2: a really good media article to highlight that there are

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Speaker 2: actually some potentially really detrimental health effects when you know,

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Speaker 2: clinicians are working out of scope.

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Speaker 1: And I think the other area we've seen it in

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Speaker 1: recent weeks is social media having a crackdown around influencers

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Speaker 1: recommending specific multi vitamins and therapeutic approaches to diet nutrition,

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Speaker 1: which I think is actually a fantastic step because these

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Speaker 1: people do have massive amounts of power with no scientific

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Speaker 1: qualifications in some instances, and so the products or vitamins

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Speaker 1: in the case of supplementation that maybe being recommended, are

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Speaker 1: highly content indicated. And I was just thinking about this

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Speaker 1: when we were talking. I see it a lot in

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Speaker 1: prescriptions for multivitamins, just extreme over prescription of nutrients and

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Speaker 1: things like that soluble vitamins Vitamin D, vitamin E, vitamin A,

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Speaker 1: and also some of the minerals things like our ion zinc.

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Speaker 1: You can absolutely have too much and more is not better,

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Speaker 1: So when you're having them in a really, really concentrated form,

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Speaker 1: they can be dangerous. You know, it really isn't the

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Speaker 1: case of in the same example as water, I have

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Speaker 1: more and more and more, and when you don't have

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Speaker 1: that understanding of biochemistry and physiology and applied nutrition, you

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Speaker 1: are completely oblivious to those follow on effects, let alone

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Speaker 1: if someone's on medication or has actual medical issues. So

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Speaker 1: one hundred percent. I have said it before on the

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Speaker 1: podcast and I will say it again. The only people

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Speaker 1: who should be giving prescriptive dietary advice and in particular

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Speaker 1: meal plans and diets should be a crediting practicing dietitians.

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Speaker 1: They are the profession who are qualified to be matching

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Speaker 1: individuals medical and dietary requirements to food prescription and supplements prescription.

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Speaker 1: So I'm always very very cautious whenever things are coming

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Speaker 1: through a gym or through a Natchurpath clinic, simply because

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Speaker 1: you know, it's often not written by someone who has

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Speaker 1: that appropriate qualification. And this is an example of something

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Speaker 1: out there quite dangerous, and if this one's out there,

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Speaker 1: there will be many many more. So the more we

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Speaker 1: talk about it, the better it is. And you know,

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Speaker 1: of course nine leaders of water is highly dangerous. You

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Speaker 1: can kill someone with that, you know, in terms of

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Speaker 1: sodium balance in the body, So it really really is

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Speaker 1: quite important. And just get your nutrition advice and meal

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Speaker 1: plans and dietary advice from someone who's qualified, and you

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Speaker 1: know it's not difficult pts. In the past, or gyms

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Speaker 1: have approached me and asked me to check over their

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Speaker 1: content or write stuff for them, and that's great. You know,

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Speaker 1: I don't need my name all over it, but I'm

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Speaker 1: happy to check it for them. And that's absolutely what

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Speaker 1: they should be doing, so they can create the supportive

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Speaker 1: environment and make sure the information that's being transferred to

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Speaker 1: members and their clients is sound. But it's imperative that

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Speaker 1: that is the case because you know, you can see

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Speaker 1: there's lucky there hasn't been dire consequences, but in the

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Speaker 1: case of some of the fasting regimes, you know, people

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Speaker 1: got really sick from really inappropriate herbal prescriptions and dehydration,

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Speaker 1: so you know, it can be a matter of life

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Speaker 1: or death. So we do need to highlight it and

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Speaker 1: take it a lot more seriously.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, And that, I guess brings us to another media

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Speaker 2: article that I thought was quite interesting this week for

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Speaker 2: our case studies. Susie and I was just having a

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Speaker 2: look through, you know, some of the news articles online

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Speaker 2: in terms of trending nutrition topics, and I thought I

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Speaker 2: found this one which I thought I really quite liked.

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Speaker 2: It was the surprising foods that you shouldn't eat before bed,

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Speaker 2: and so many of us really do struggle with fatigue,

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Speaker 2: and I think sleep or quality sleep is one of

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Speaker 2: those issues that we've talked about on the potty before,

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Speaker 2: and it's something that we really need to focus on

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Speaker 2: in terms of getting our energy and decreasing our fatigue

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Speaker 2: levels over time. So there are a couple of surprising

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Speaker 2: foods that we probably wouldn't recommend before bed for a

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Speaker 2: range of different sort of health conditions or different people.

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Speaker 2: But what are some of the ones that spring to

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Speaker 2: mind for you, Susie.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think everyone wants more sleep and better quality sleep,

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Speaker 1: so it's really pertinent and particularly those who do really

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Speaker 1: struggle getting to sleep or with even insomnia. You know,

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Speaker 1: always interested in some of these recommendations because I think

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Speaker 1: in the old days we would talk about a glass

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Speaker 1: of warm milk before better And indeed there is scientific

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Speaker 1: evidence to suggest that food sitting en hunts trip to

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Speaker 1: feane levels will potentially help relax the body and lead

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Speaker 1: into better quality sleep. But you write a few that

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Speaker 1: perhaps we don't think is commonly about in that space.

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Speaker 1: The ones that stand out to me, first of all,

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Speaker 1: if you're someone who suffers from intigestion and particularly reflux,

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Speaker 1: and as we get older, or if you're pregnant, you

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Speaker 1: may ever experienced that discomfort, and have to be honest,

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Speaker 1: never in my life have I had reflex and a

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Speaker 1: couple of times in the last year or so, I've thought, goodness,

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Speaker 1: what's happening. Obviously, as you get older and things just

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Speaker 1: change physiologically, you're much more sensitive to that. But for

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Speaker 1: many people they will experience reflexes they get older, as

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Speaker 1: perhaps they've gained weight in the abdominal area and that

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Speaker 1: will tend to push up food more readily, or if

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Speaker 1: you are eating far beyond your requirement, so we generally

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Speaker 1: need less food as we get older. And then if

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Speaker 1: you're continuing to have relatively large meals in it a

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Speaker 1: small stomach, of course, that can push the asset up

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Speaker 1: and give you quite great discomfort. But the ones that

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Speaker 1: we do see the cuisines I see in particularly, and

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Speaker 1: can be the Asian cuisine or anything that may have

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Speaker 1: a relatively high level of MSG, whether it's added MSG,

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Speaker 1: which may be the case in Chinese or Asian cuisine,

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Speaker 1: or foods that are just naturally high and glutamate, so

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Speaker 1: Italian food with a lot of tomatoes and cheese or

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Speaker 1: even pizza can have some natural MSG, which again people

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Speaker 1: can be very very sensitive to, and that's that feeling.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes you might wake up at one am after having

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Speaker 1: a big pizza and you're just so thirsty and unsettled.

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Speaker 1: Some people will have very vivid dreams as a result

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Speaker 1: of it. Myself, I get really itchy skin, which is awful,

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Speaker 1: and I know that I've had a meal that's too

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Speaker 1: high in glutamates or added MSG. So just be mindful

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Speaker 1: that those cuisines are notorious for disrupting sleep in those

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Speaker 1: who are sensitive to it. I think the other one

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Speaker 1: that always stands out to me is the chocolate, because

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Speaker 1: we think that chocolate after bed is okay, but we

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Speaker 1: forget very very coqui that it does contain caffeine. And

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Speaker 1: if you're sensitive to caffeine or trying to be healthy,

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Speaker 1: and perhaps she's dark chocolate with a cup of green tea,

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Speaker 1: you're actually giving yourself quite a heavy dose of caffeine

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Speaker 1: just before bed, and absolutely you will have a follow

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Speaker 1: and effective at least a couple of hours, depending on

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Speaker 1: how sensitive you are to caffeine. And I think one

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Speaker 1: of the ones that I don't think about so much.

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Speaker 1: But we brought up in this media story was things

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Speaker 1: like onions and garlic, particularly for people who are sensitive

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Speaker 1: to them, that can really exacerbate those feelings of reflex

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Speaker 1: and indigestion and be quite unsettling before we go to sleep.

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Speaker 1: So certainly if you're someone who is more sensitive to

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Speaker 1: those foods, that really does make a difference how we eat.

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Speaker 1: And I think the standout thing to me is not

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Speaker 1: only the foods leand but how close to bed we eat.

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Speaker 1: Often I see my clients who are getting home from

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Speaker 1: work at six, seven, even eight, and then they'll have

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Speaker 1: a relatively large meal. They might order some tie takeaway,

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Speaker 1: or they might get a quick burrito on the way home,

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Speaker 1: and then go to bed within an hour or so.

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Speaker 1: And that is the worst thing you can do, because

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Speaker 1: you are not only giving quite a significant bulk to

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Speaker 1: your stomach late at night, you're not going to be

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Speaker 1: up upright to allow them natural digestive process to occur.

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Speaker 1: And then potentially you're having some of these things like

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Speaker 1: glutamates or MSG which are again going to be making

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Speaker 1: that natural sleep progression more challenging. So timing and size

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Speaker 1: of the meal of your last meal at night is

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Speaker 1: very very important, and I encourage my clients to have

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Speaker 1: at least two hours between when they've eaten and when

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Speaker 1: they got to sleep. And I really also try and

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Speaker 1: get my clients to do some sort of movement, even

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Speaker 1: if it's doing some housework or quick walk around the

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Speaker 1: block or hang some washing out, just to try and

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Speaker 1: aid that natural digestion and gravity to move the food

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Speaker 1: down and the reduction in the stomach acid that happens

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Speaker 1: as part of just normal digestion.

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Speaker 2: I agree, Yeah, I think having a large meal at

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Speaker 2: dinner and then lying down on the couch and watching

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Speaker 2: Netflix is potentially one of the worst things you can

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Speaker 2: do for digest in which so many people do, don't they.

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Speaker 1: I think that most people do it in modern life.

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Speaker 1: I know in Sydney. You know it's really the traffic

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Speaker 1: is big. People have got kids at sport or they

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Speaker 1: maybe going to the gym, and so they're not getting

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Speaker 1: home till seven or eight. Then you've got to cook dinner,

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Speaker 1: and they were so exhausted from such big days that

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Speaker 1: inevitably we have our largest meal. We might have a

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Speaker 1: glass of wine, which is notorious for causing digestive distress

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Speaker 1: in those who are sensitive to it. And then if

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Speaker 1: we reward ourselves with treats, whether it's corn chips or

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Speaker 1: chocolate biscuits or whatever, you know, it's those again foods

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Speaker 1: that can be stimulants. But the bulk a volume of

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Speaker 1: food going through your stomach late at night is just

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Speaker 1: way too much. So wherever you can put more food

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Speaker 1: in the day and lighten that last meal, particularly if

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Speaker 1: you're prone to sleep issues or abdominal discomfort, is going

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Speaker 1: to make a massive difference.

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Speaker 2: And you untouched on red wine. Alcohol is a big

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Speaker 2: one that a lot of people forget about. So I've

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Speaker 2: had many clients, Susie, who will use alcohol, and particularly

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Speaker 2: I've had family members as well, without mentioning anything. You know,

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Speaker 2: I will I'll say my dad, my dad, you know,

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Speaker 2: typically will have a glass of wine or something to

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Speaker 2: make him sleepy and you know, help him sleep. Forgetting

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Speaker 2: that alcohol actually does the opposite. What you think causes

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Speaker 2: you to sort of feel sleepy and help you drift off,

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Speaker 2: actually impacts the quality of your sleep. So even just

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Speaker 2: a glass or just a small amount of alcohol can

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Speaker 2: actually prevent your body from going into that really am

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Speaker 2: sleep that we want, which makes us feel nice and rested. So,

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Speaker 2: particularly if you're someone who struggles with sleep or you're

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Speaker 2: constantly waking up tide, really be wary of any alcohol intake.

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Speaker 2: Spicy food is another one, Susie. So spicy food can

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Speaker 2: not only lead to reflux or heartburn, and those are

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Speaker 2: a little bit more sensitive, but if you're eating really

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Speaker 2: spicy meals, the heat from those meals can actually raise

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Speaker 2: your core body temperature. And one of the best things

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Speaker 2: we can do for a really you know, sound night's

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Speaker 2: sleep is actually to have a lower core body temperature.

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Speaker 2: They actually say a lot of people who talk about

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Speaker 2: sleep hygiene, a sort of sleep experts, say that you

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Speaker 2: should have a really nice cool room because that coolness

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Speaker 2: helps you to have a more RESTful night sleep. So

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Speaker 2: if you're having a super hot spicy meal right before bed,

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Speaker 2: that might actually impact on someone your sleep as well.

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Speaker 2: And then the final thing I found, Susie, was when

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Speaker 2: I was having a little hunt around the literature, was

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Speaker 2: that they did this study a few years ago from

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Speaker 2: the University of Queensland. It had let me just double

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Speaker 2: check that one hundred and seventy five thousand students across

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Speaker 2: sixty four countries so it was a really really big study,

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Speaker 2: and what they were looking at is whether junk food

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Speaker 2: in processed food had an impact on teenagers or and

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Speaker 2: if it kept them up at night and prevented them

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Speaker 2: from having a RESTful sleep. And surprise, surprise, Susie, teenagers

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Speaker 2: who had more soft drink and more junk food had

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Speaker 2: an increase of fifty five percent of interrupted sleep compared

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Speaker 2: to those who only had, you know, a small amount

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Speaker 2: of soft drink or a small amount of process food.

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Speaker 2: So if you've got kids at home, and I'm ninety percent,

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Speaker 2: you know, maybe of ninety nine percent sure that this

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Speaker 2: research would translate over to adults as well as Susie,

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Speaker 2: I think that the more processed foods and the more

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Speaker 2: soft drinks that we have, the sort of worse quality

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Speaker 2: our sleep will be, because it's going to give us

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Speaker 2: some sort of you know, digestive issues as well. It's

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Speaker 2: not to say that you can't have a little bit

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Speaker 2: of chocolate a little bit of ice cream after dinner,

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Speaker 2: but if you're sitting there munching and snacking all night long,

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Speaker 2: right up until the moment that you go to bed,

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Speaker 2: I think you're probably going to have some issues with

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Speaker 2: the quality of your sleep, and we've got some good

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Speaker 2: research that supports that, particularly in our teenagers and our

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Speaker 2: young adults.

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Speaker 1: And I think we should also mention people will often

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Speaker 1: have a cup of tea before bed, so they sort

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Speaker 1: of have the message of coffees not great because it

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Speaker 1: stimulates you, but tea does have some but it's the

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Speaker 1: diuretic effective tea that can be severely disruptive because I

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Speaker 1: don't know myself if I have a tea, which I

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Speaker 1: love a cup of tea, but I have to just

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Speaker 1: go to the toilet three or four times a night,

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Speaker 1: which has certainly got worse as I've got older and

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Speaker 1: posed to having two children. So definitely you want to

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Speaker 1: make sure that you're having the caffeine free varieties of

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Speaker 1: tea or even tea in general is a diuretic, and

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Speaker 1: some of the herbal teas, so you've got to be

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Speaker 1: careful with that because of course, needing to go to

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Speaker 1: the bathroom because your blood is not as strong as

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Speaker 1: you get older, is highly highly disruptive. So you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot to be said for a bit of

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Speaker 1: warm milk and a little bit of you know, cocoa

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Speaker 1: plain powder, you know, as opposed to the teas because

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Speaker 1: we often think we're doing the right thing with a

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Speaker 1: cup of tea. But if you're quite sensitive to getting

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Speaker 1: up and going to the bathroom, certainly I wouldn't be

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Speaker 1: suggesting you have a cup of tea at night, because

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Speaker 1: you'll find yourself up at least once or twice through

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Speaker 1: through the night, which is extremely disruptive. But yeah, and

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Speaker 1: the other little point about snack food and teenagers is

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Speaker 1: just do that quick scan and make sure that if

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Speaker 1: you're buying, you know, snack foods or rice crackers or

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Speaker 1: two minute noodles, all those kind of processed foods that

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Speaker 1: we tend to fill busy teenagers up with, they do

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Speaker 1: often contain out of MSG in the flavoring anything that's

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Speaker 1: cheese or chicken if you see additive six two one

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Speaker 1: six three five. The flavor enhancers are notorious for causing

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Speaker 1: those kind of reactions which are quite stimulatory. We know

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Speaker 1: they encourage the overeating and over consumption of those foods

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Speaker 1: by that Moorish flavor. But if you ask sort of

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Speaker 1: stocking your pantry with snack food for the teenagers, I

435
00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:25,520
Speaker 1: would just encourage you to look for options that have

436
00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:29,160
Speaker 1: natural flavors only because the less of those flavor enhancers

437
00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:31,840
Speaker 1: in the diet and in particular for sleep, the better

438
00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:33,320
Speaker 1: for all of us. So keep that in mind if

439
00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:35,960
Speaker 1: you're someone who does stock that kind of flavored snack

440
00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:38,800
Speaker 1: food at home for perhaps late night munches who are

441
00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:41,760
Speaker 1: all right and well. For our final segment of the show,

442
00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:44,560
Speaker 1: a really good question. Actually, I really like this one

443
00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:46,120
Speaker 1: because it comes up all the time and we haven't

444
00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 1: covered it before. It was asked to us on Instagram,

445
00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:50,240
Speaker 1: and we love to get your feedback in questions. We

446
00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:52,200
Speaker 1: keep a record of all of them, so keep sending

447
00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:56,240
Speaker 1: them through. And the question was should when you work out,

448
00:19:57,000 --> 00:19:59,159
Speaker 1: should you be doing it fast in the morning. And

449
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,119
Speaker 1: I know that certainly when I was younger, there was

450
00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:04,280
Speaker 1: always that idea that you should certainly not eat before

451
00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:06,080
Speaker 1: you go to the gym if you can, it was

452
00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:09,240
Speaker 1: better to extend the overnight fast or burn more fat

453
00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,040
Speaker 1: because you didn't have any active fuel on board. And

454
00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:14,119
Speaker 1: you know, there are some studies out there. You've had

455
00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,160
Speaker 1: to look at the research to show that that eight

456
00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:20,960
Speaker 1: to twelve hours overnight may specifically help increase the percentage

457
00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,480
Speaker 1: of fat being burnt, which would would make sense. You know,

458
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,639
Speaker 1: if you're going into a high intensity workout. I'm not

459
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:28,679
Speaker 1: talking about a slow walk around the block here to

460
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,080
Speaker 1: get the coffee. I'm talking about, you know, going to

461
00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:33,000
Speaker 1: a hit class or going to the gym or going

462
00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:35,800
Speaker 1: for a run, something that's really elevating heart rate. That

463
00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:38,320
Speaker 1: you would burn a higher proportion of fat simply because

464
00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:41,840
Speaker 1: you would be depleting your glycogen stores more quickly, and

465
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:43,520
Speaker 1: you'd also been doing it off the back of an

466
00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:46,360
Speaker 1: overnight fast and perhaps a lower carbohydrate intake at night.

467
00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:49,520
Speaker 1: But leam, let's be honest, there's also plenty of studies

468
00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:51,960
Speaker 1: that show it doesn't make a huge difference overall to

469
00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,000
Speaker 1: fat loss in terms of calorie balance through the day.

470
00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,880
Speaker 1: So what are your thoughts If someone asked me about

471
00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:02,600
Speaker 1: when they should exercise, My answer is inevitably, you should

472
00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:05,199
Speaker 1: exercise when you're going to do it. So if you

473
00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:08,199
Speaker 1: ultimately know that you feel groggy in the morning and

474
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:10,080
Speaker 1: you're not going to actually get up very many days

475
00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:12,080
Speaker 1: at all, you're probably better to eat breakfast and go

476
00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:15,120
Speaker 1: at nine o'clock. So it's not for me a defining

477
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,320
Speaker 1: factor on whether people should exercise or do it, whether

478
00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 1: without breakfast or not. And indeed, with some of my

479
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:23,960
Speaker 1: clients who are insulin resistance or have fluctuating bloo glucose levels,

480
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,720
Speaker 1: I don't like them exercising fasted because it tends to

481
00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:30,160
Speaker 1: leave them in a hyperglycemic state and then they overeat

482
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:32,440
Speaker 1: in an attempt to come back and bring their glucose

483
00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,439
Speaker 1: levels back to normal. But what I will do, Leande

484
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:38,000
Speaker 1: is try and time their carbohydrate to not be too

485
00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:40,600
Speaker 1: much so they're peaking at carbohydrate and perhaps not getting

486
00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:42,920
Speaker 1: to a higher proportion of that. But I may give them,

487
00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 1: you know, fifteen twenty grams to start a workout if

488
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:47,440
Speaker 1: it's a high enough intensity. But let's be honest, a

489
00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 1: lot of us are just doing a light walk. We

490
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:52,520
Speaker 1: don't need anything really, but whether it's actually going to

491
00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:54,400
Speaker 1: make you burn that much more fat or just give

492
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:56,360
Speaker 1: you a bit of a metabolic boost so you're hungrier

493
00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,400
Speaker 1: through the morning. As we said that, the evidence isn't

494
00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,080
Speaker 1: really there to show that you're getting that much of

495
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,240
Speaker 1: a profound difference when it comes to overall body weight

496
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:05,959
Speaker 1: or body weight change on the scale, is it.

497
00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:08,200
Speaker 2: I'm the same if my clients are doing low intensity

498
00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:10,680
Speaker 2: type exercise, more than happy for them to work out faster,

499
00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:12,440
Speaker 2: particularly if it's like first thing in the morning, it's

500
00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:15,359
Speaker 2: some unbearable hour like four thirty in the morning, five o'clock.

501
00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 2: I'm definitely not a morning person, Susi. But if they

502
00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:20,440
Speaker 2: are doing something that is of intensity, if the goal

503
00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:22,439
Speaker 2: is to add some muscle mass, if they need some

504
00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:25,000
Speaker 2: power or some speed, you should absolutely be doing that

505
00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:27,119
Speaker 2: with some fuel on board. You'll get the maximum benefit

506
00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:29,960
Speaker 2: not doing that workout in a faster state. So yes,

507
00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:31,919
Speaker 2: as you mentioned, there are some small studies that do

508
00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:35,160
Speaker 2: suggest that working out faster may potentially burn more fat.

509
00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:36,640
Speaker 2: But I think when you actually look at the bulk

510
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:39,040
Speaker 2: of the research, it really points to the fact that

511
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,240
Speaker 2: faster cardio only really burns fat in a calorie deficit,

512
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:44,600
Speaker 2: and you know, fat loss is sort of the same

513
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:46,240
Speaker 2: throughout the day or at the end of the week,

514
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:48,960
Speaker 2: regardless of if you're doing faster cardio or not. So

515
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,520
Speaker 2: exercise is great, do it however you want. You know,

516
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,479
Speaker 2: I'm really happy for my clients to try some faster cardio.

517
00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:56,399
Speaker 2: If say, for example, Susie, they're going out for a

518
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,439
Speaker 2: run and they have a bit of sort of gi upset.

519
00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 2: If there's someone who gets a bit of a sense

520
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:01,919
Speaker 2: tell me while they're running, I probably wouldn't want them

521
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,280
Speaker 2: to eat before they run. If they work out really

522
00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,760
Speaker 2: really early and they just have zero stomach pit anything beforehand, again,

523
00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:09,960
Speaker 2: it probably put pretty happy for them to work out fast.

524
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:11,720
Speaker 2: Or if they just say to me, like, I really

525
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:13,359
Speaker 2: love the way that I that I feel when I

526
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:15,639
Speaker 2: work out fast, and then sure, yeah, sure try fast

527
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,399
Speaker 2: cardio that's absolutely okay, or a faster workout. But I

528
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:22,880
Speaker 2: would really suggest for anybody who is looking to gain

529
00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,639
Speaker 2: muscle or gain strength or power, then you really should

530
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:27,520
Speaker 2: be eating before you work out. Not a huge meal,

531
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 2: as you said, Zuzie, fifteen twenty grams of harbohydrate about

532
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,399
Speaker 2: twenty minutes before you work out is ideal. Any activities

533
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,400
Speaker 2: that really need sort of power or speed, those high

534
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:40,960
Speaker 2: intensity type exercises, sprint sessions, those bigger, faster workouts, absolutely

535
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,120
Speaker 2: should be eating before them. If you're someone that has

536
00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:46,280
Speaker 2: low blood pressure or you feel dizzy quite often, or

537
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,040
Speaker 2: definitely if you're pregnant, and potentially even if you're breastfeeding,

538
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 2: you should probably have a little bit of fuel on

539
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:52,679
Speaker 2: board before you're working out as well, just because your

540
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 2: body's utilizing fuel at a higher rate than some other people.

541
00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:57,679
Speaker 2: As well, So there are definitely some pros and cons

542
00:23:57,680 --> 00:23:59,920
Speaker 2: for different listeners, I think, and it's really one of

543
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,600
Speaker 2: those individualized choices. It's not sort of a you know,

544
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:04,439
Speaker 2: someone says we work out fast, that it's not a

545
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 2: yes or a no answer. It's really dependent on the

546
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,119
Speaker 2: reason that you're working out, and what your lifestyle or

547
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,200
Speaker 2: what your medical conditions are as well. I think.

548
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 1: Well, I think the other thing I see it in

549
00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,159
Speaker 1: the extreme is that there's a big difference between like

550
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,200
Speaker 1: you described, going to the gym at five or six

551
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 1: am and then still having your first meal by eight.

552
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,680
Speaker 1: But what I see with my clients is that they

553
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 1: extend this fast and don't work out until eight or nine,

554
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:26,960
Speaker 1: and then they're not eating their first meal to ten

555
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,679
Speaker 1: or eleven. And my argument is you're not getting that

556
00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:33,320
Speaker 1: metabolic hit we naturally get from already the overnight fast

557
00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:36,480
Speaker 1: and refueling and basically stoking the fire. So the other

558
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:38,639
Speaker 1: thing I would say about it is, if you've already

559
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:42,440
Speaker 1: fasted overnight for twelve hours, there is no additional benefit

560
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,879
Speaker 1: to fasting for longer and delaying your first meal of

561
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,760
Speaker 1: the day like you described, and instead you're probably better

562
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,120
Speaker 1: to have a small server of fuel, So a serve

563
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:54,480
Speaker 1: of carbohydrate, say fifteen grams, a couple of crackers, half

564
00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:56,680
Speaker 1: a banana, a slice of toast with some one hundred

565
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 1: percent nuts spread go into a really good workout because

566
00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:02,719
Speaker 1: you you've refueled and can access your fat stores more

567
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 1: efficiently because you do have some readily available glucose in available,

568
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:11,240
Speaker 1: and then eat to your appetite. Whereas a lot of

569
00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 1: people eat according to their head, so they say, right,

570
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:15,080
Speaker 1: I'm not going to eat, I'm not going to eat,

571
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 1: and then they binge because they've actually haven't eaten at

572
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 1: the right time because they're hungry. So sometimes, as I said,

573
00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:22,919
Speaker 1: you'd better to stop the fire, do the workout, but

574
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 1: then have not a whole breakfast, half a breakfast afterwards,

575
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:28,199
Speaker 1: and then you're back in balance. So getting back in

576
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 1: touch with your hunger so really really important that you

577
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 1: don't manage your appetite and your fuel intake cognitively. You

578
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:37,680
Speaker 1: also listen to what your body's telling you. And indeedly

579
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,439
Speaker 1: and if you woke up hungry even at you know,

580
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: six thirty seven, and you wanted to go and do

581
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 1: a good hour workout, you are probably better to eat

582
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,160
Speaker 1: something small as opposed to keep starving or just really

583
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,159
Speaker 1: keep in mind, are you doing a workout or are

584
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 1: you just doing a little bit of movement. There's a

585
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:54,840
Speaker 1: big difference between a twenty minute walk around the block

586
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 1: or down at the beach to stroll and going to

587
00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 1: a hit class where you're burning six eight hundred calories.

588
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:03,000
Speaker 1: Keep in mind, are you exercising or are you just

589
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 1: maintaining as well? And that's relevant, But I do I

590
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:09,639
Speaker 1: think sometimes use that fasted period before eight am to

591
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 1: try and induce the experience of hunger for a number

592
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,960
Speaker 1: of my clients. So that would be people who aren't

593
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,000
Speaker 1: doing a hit class, They're not doing high intensity CrossFit training.

594
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 1: These are recreational athletes who are just doing a little

595
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 1: bit of maintenance. I would be absolutely doing something fast

596
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 1: until you feel hungry and use that as a tool

597
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:29,639
Speaker 1: to get there rather than eating on cue, which is

598
00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:32,080
Speaker 1: what I find a lot of my clients do automatically.

599
00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,359
Speaker 2: Absolutely, so, I really think it does come down to

600
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 2: the type of workout that you're doing as well, plus

601
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 2: your background and the reason for that workout. Of your

602
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,159
Speaker 2: goal is to add muscle mass. Guess what, guys, you

603
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:43,119
Speaker 2: can't do that in a fast stat is you're just

604
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:44,720
Speaker 2: not going to get the biggest bang for your buck.

605
00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 2: So it really is dependent on quite a few factors.

606
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:49,160
Speaker 2: And I hope that we've given our listeners a little

607
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 2: bit of food for thought today, Susie in terms of

608
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 2: basted workouts or not true.

609
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,720
Speaker 1: And I guess the other thing that we just threw

610
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,320
Speaker 1: around was it's always about change, isn't it, Because it

611
00:26:57,359 --> 00:26:59,640
Speaker 1: may work initially and then you actually lose some fat

612
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:01,879
Speaker 1: and then plataus out so then you're actually better to

613
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: eat beforehand. So remember to outsmart physiology, it's always about

614
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:08,240
Speaker 1: changing up the routine. So if you're used to working

615
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 1: out fasted, you may find you get a great result

616
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 1: from swapping it around and having something to eat first,

617
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,200
Speaker 1: and vice versa. So change is the key always when

618
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: it comes to metabolism. All right, Leanne, Well, that brings

619
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:21,720
Speaker 1: us to the end of the Nutrition Couch for another week.

620
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 1: If you haven't done so already, please subscribe to have

621
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 1: us delivered every Sunday for our weekly update and our

622
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 1: Wednesday episode which drops going through products at the supermarket.

623
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:32,600
Speaker 1: We have our Instagram and Facebook sites running. That's where

624
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 1: we hear from you. We get a lot of our questions,

625
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:37,199
Speaker 1: so please keep following us and sharing with your friends

626
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,919
Speaker 1: and we will see you on Wednesday. Thanks for listening.

627
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 2: Thanks guys,