WEBVTT - CONTENT KINGS - EGO: THE MICHAEL GUDINSKI STORY - BETHANY JONES 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:01.760 It's in the news today, but it was actually on 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.000 TV Reload the podcast last week Neby. 0:00:04.720 --> 0:00:06.960 Hi, guys, welcome back to TV Reload. I want to 0:00:06.960 --> 0:00:09.560 thank you for clicking and downloading on today's episode with 0:00:09.600 --> 0:00:13.119 Beth Jones, who is the Mushroom Studio's chief operating officer, 0:00:13.360 --> 0:00:17.040 along with the producer of Ego, The Michael Giddinsky Story, 0:00:17.440 --> 0:00:20.360 the feature documentary that we are talking about today follows 0:00:20.400 --> 0:00:24.480 the wild ride of Michael Gidinsky over five decades as 0:00:24.520 --> 0:00:28.480 he forged his own Maverick path. Consumed by his ambition 0:00:28.800 --> 0:00:32.839 and enduring passion for Australian music. Michael Gidinsky was a 0:00:32.960 --> 0:00:37.400 music man and a natural born hustler. He repeatedly risked 0:00:37.640 --> 0:00:43.080 everything for his one obsession, being Australian music. This documentary 0:00:43.080 --> 0:00:46.000 film will be available on Channel seven on the ninth 0:00:46.000 --> 0:00:48.239 of April and you have to check it out. It 0:00:48.320 --> 0:00:51.360 is helmed by the feature film, documentary and music video 0:00:51.400 --> 0:00:55.400 director Paul Goldman and produced by my guest today, Beth Jones. 0:00:55.800 --> 0:01:00.640 The film features personal accounts from Giddinsky himself, exclusive interviews 0:01:00.800 --> 0:01:04.840 with some of the world's most influential artists, rare archival 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:08.800 footage and electrifying soundtrack that I just say, get a 0:01:08.840 --> 0:01:11.880 beer and sit back and pretend that Michael's watching it 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:15.200 with you. There are some fabulous stories shared today from 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:18.480 Beth's relationship with Michael Giddinsky and the evolution of this 0:01:18.560 --> 0:01:22.000 documentary and how it came together. Beth talks about how 0:01:22.000 --> 0:01:24.920 the artists in Michael's story were able to get together 0:01:25.080 --> 0:01:27.039 and share their stories to be a part of this 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:30.600 We will unpack what Mushroom Studios looks like these days 0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:33.480 and have a legacy of Michael Gidinsky still continues in 0:01:33.520 --> 0:01:36.560 their day to day working life. Plus, I will find 0:01:36.560 --> 0:01:39.840 out from Beth what she learned about making this documentary 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:43.640 and what she hopes audiences will get from seeing this film. 0:01:43.959 --> 0:01:46.760 There's actually so much to unpack with Beth, and she 0:01:46.959 --> 0:01:49.559 was so delightful in the way in which she shared 0:01:49.560 --> 0:01:50.280 her stories. 0:01:50.400 --> 0:01:52.160 So sit back and relax as. 0:01:51.960 --> 0:01:54.600 We dive just that little bit deeper into the world 0:01:54.680 --> 0:01:57.120 of ego the Michael Giddinsky story. 0:01:58.480 --> 0:02:02.240 Hi Bet, Hello Ben, Hi, hi Jin, how are you. 0:02:03.000 --> 0:02:05.160 I'm very well. I'm very excited to be talking to you. 0:02:05.200 --> 0:02:07.320 It's funny. I read an article about you a few 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:08.839 years ago. I think it was when you were going 0:02:08.919 --> 0:02:13.040 from maybe match box back to mushroom, and my brain 0:02:13.200 --> 0:02:17.680 saved you in my memory as Bethany Jones, like Bridget Jones. 0:02:19.639 --> 0:02:21.720 Do you know what though I once got a Tellstonville 0:02:21.760 --> 0:02:23.720 addressed to Bridget Jones, you. 0:02:23.600 --> 0:02:24.720 Did not I did. 0:02:25.440 --> 0:02:27.400 Oh my god, did you hear that song in the 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:29.040 background playing all by myself? 0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:32.240 I totally did. I love that film film. 0:02:32.440 --> 0:02:35.360 It's so good. It's so good it stands up still. 0:02:35.440 --> 0:02:37.960 You can still watch that film and relate even though 0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:40.560 they don't have mobile phones, well, not like we do now. 0:02:40.720 --> 0:02:42.640 No, I think you have to chase after you, you know, 0:02:42.960 --> 0:02:44.959 your men running down the street the snow. You couldn't 0:02:45.000 --> 0:02:45.880 just call them. 0:02:46.240 --> 0:02:48.200 That's how I live my life. That's how I'm always 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:50.760 chasing after my partner when he leaves the house. I 0:02:50.800 --> 0:02:54.120 want to congratulate you on this documentary because you must 0:02:54.200 --> 0:02:56.320 be so proud of this film. 0:02:56.360 --> 0:02:56.600 You know. 0:02:56.960 --> 0:03:00.400 I think what's been really exciting is just to see 0:03:00.600 --> 0:03:02.000 how it's resonated with people. 0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:05.440 You know, you always make things hoping. 0:03:05.480 --> 0:03:08.400 That it hits the audience, but you never quite know 0:03:08.680 --> 0:03:11.679 until it's released. So yeah, when you start to get 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:15.079 the feedback, it's yeah, it's been it's been quite incredible. 0:03:15.120 --> 0:03:15.280 You know. 0:03:15.520 --> 0:03:18.760 We had obviously such great feedback from the cinema release, 0:03:19.040 --> 0:03:21.720 and then it's been unconscious for the last couple of months, 0:03:21.760 --> 0:03:23.920 and the amount of people that have seen it as 0:03:23.919 --> 0:03:26.120 they've been traveling and dropped us a note or we're 0:03:26.120 --> 0:03:28.799 for advis someone else. It's been really exciting because I think, 0:03:28.919 --> 0:03:31.600 you know, you make it to celebrate the person you're 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:34.840 making the documentary about, So I kind of feel really 0:03:35.000 --> 0:03:37.480 happy that Michael I think would be really proud of it. 0:03:37.680 --> 0:03:38.040 He would. 0:03:38.160 --> 0:03:40.800 I mean, this is a real hero's journey story, you know, 0:03:40.920 --> 0:03:43.000 for people that don't even know that much about him, 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:45.000 to people that are super fan of you know, there's 0:03:45.000 --> 0:03:48.480 something in this for everyone. It's very inspiring. I think 0:03:48.480 --> 0:03:50.880 it's heartwarming in a way as well, and it does 0:03:50.880 --> 0:03:53.120 what I think documentaries need to do and teaches you 0:03:53.160 --> 0:03:56.040 about the subject matter about something you don't know about them. 0:03:56.240 --> 0:03:58.720 And even if you are a super fan of Michael, 0:03:58.960 --> 0:04:00.320 there's still so much to learn. 0:04:00.600 --> 0:04:03.800 That's it like, particularly for someone I can't really say 0:04:03.800 --> 0:04:06.360 it was behind the scenes because Michael loved the limelight, 0:04:06.480 --> 0:04:09.400 but you know, for someone who was so instrumental in 0:04:09.880 --> 0:04:10.520 so many. 0:04:10.360 --> 0:04:11.880 Other artists' careers. 0:04:12.200 --> 0:04:15.400 The feedback we've also received is that people didn't realize 0:04:15.640 --> 0:04:18.520 how many artists he was behind and how that's kind 0:04:18.560 --> 0:04:21.880 of formed the soundtrack to the nation. I think that's 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:24.839 like a real surprising factor for people when they start 0:04:24.880 --> 0:04:27.279 to just hear all the different artists and all the 0:04:27.279 --> 0:04:29.400 different tracks that are featuring in the doco. 0:04:29.720 --> 0:04:30.920 Yeah, becomes alive. 0:04:31.000 --> 0:04:33.240 I mean, you are watching this documentary and for me, 0:04:33.600 --> 0:04:37.159 I can smell the scaffolding, the pubs. I can smell 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:39.839 all of that about five minutes into the movie, Like 0:04:39.880 --> 0:04:41.239 it's so visceral. 0:04:40.839 --> 0:04:42.760 And I think of the th real credit to our 0:04:42.880 --> 0:04:47.400 editor Sarah Edwards. So Sarah also cut the Mark Hartley's 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:50.040 Not Quite Hollywood documentary, and it was kind of one 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:52.520 of the reasons why we were really attracted to Sarah 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:56.040 to cut this, because we knew that this needed a 0:04:56.200 --> 0:04:59.159 high pace, high energy, like we really had to try 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:02.800 to capture my but also the times and as you 0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:06.080 kind of say, you know those sweaty, sticky carpet kind 0:05:06.120 --> 0:05:08.719 of pubs of the eighties right into them, the you know, 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:11.720 the more kind of big stadium tours of the edge 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:14.440 shearings and things like that, and Sarah's just got such 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:18.200 an incredible way to cut, to really make you feel 0:05:18.520 --> 0:05:20.200 that energy and that you know. 0:05:20.440 --> 0:05:22.480 She we had very. 0:05:22.040 --> 0:05:25.000 Close people to Michael come back and just say to 0:05:25.120 --> 0:05:25.599 us how. 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:27.320 We'd really captured his spirit. 0:05:27.560 --> 0:05:30.719 I can't speak highly enough of Sarah. She's just so incredible. 0:05:30.880 --> 0:05:33.400 I think the backstory with his family and his parents 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:36.400 was also stuff that I didn't necessarily know. Even he 0:05:36.480 --> 0:05:39.200 struggles along the way, is captured really well. Because we 0:05:39.240 --> 0:05:42.440 always think that stories happen in a straight line, you know, 0:05:42.520 --> 0:05:44.680 but that's not really the case. And it's not his 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:48.240 story either, because he certainly had these tremendous highs and 0:05:48.240 --> 0:05:52.360 tremendous loads at times, but they're still believed in these artists, 0:05:52.440 --> 0:05:55.440 you know, and and enough even at low points to 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:58.120 build them up to be incredible stars. 0:05:58.400 --> 0:06:00.479 And yeah, it was really you know. So I thought 0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:02.599 that I knew Michael's story before I kind of headed 0:06:02.640 --> 0:06:05.840 into this, but I learned so much. And I think 0:06:06.000 --> 0:06:11.279 the real moment where I started to understand the highs 0:06:11.279 --> 0:06:15.680 and lows perhaps was the when he sold Mushroom Yeah 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:18.839 to Murdock. And it was a thing that I suppose 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:21.080 from the outside, you're like, oh, how amazing. 0:06:21.160 --> 0:06:23.680 You know, that's an incredible feat. 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:26.080 To be able to spell the company for you know, 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:29.280 the rumor amount that he had, but you didn't quite 0:06:29.320 --> 0:06:32.400 realize until we're doing this documentary, until people were speaking 0:06:32.480 --> 0:06:35.880 quite candidly, like his wife Sue and Philip Jacobson, his 0:06:35.960 --> 0:06:40.559 business partner, how much of an impact that had on him. Yeah, 0:06:40.560 --> 0:06:42.000 that was a real surprising moment. 0:06:42.200 --> 0:06:42.559 I think. 0:06:42.839 --> 0:06:44.520 I mean, you've I want to go back into you 0:06:44.600 --> 0:06:46.040 just a little bit as well, because I mean you've 0:06:46.040 --> 0:06:49.000 got a long history with Mushroom yourself, and like a 0:06:49.040 --> 0:06:51.640 lot of people, they've come and gone with this company 0:06:51.680 --> 0:06:53.919 and they come back again. What is it about this 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:56.920 company that draws you well, that drew you back? 0:06:57.680 --> 0:06:59.120 Something special about it? Actually? 0:06:59.160 --> 0:07:04.360 And Michael he was Yeah, you know obviously you knew Michael, 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:09.040 and he just had this infectious nature that somehow just 0:07:09.160 --> 0:07:11.680 threw you in. And I think it was you kind 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:13.920 of get swept up in the passion and the energy 0:07:13.960 --> 0:07:17.040 and the vision and you can kind of see what's possible. 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:20.200 The amazing thing about Michael for me was that he 0:07:21.040 --> 0:07:23.360 would have you back. You know, you could kind of 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:25.360 go oh, kind of wanting to take a bit of 0:07:25.360 --> 0:07:28.440 a risk, here and he would have you back and 0:07:28.600 --> 0:07:30.800 it didn't really matter if it worked or it didn't 0:07:30.880 --> 0:07:33.320 quite work. You know, it'd just be like, Okay, get up, 0:07:33.400 --> 0:07:36.320 go again. And having that kind of energy and that 0:07:36.440 --> 0:07:40.600 belief behind you is a really powerful thing and the 0:07:40.640 --> 0:07:43.960 people that work here. I think it's so hilariously because 0:07:43.960 --> 0:07:45.840 I heard it so much during the documentary and I 0:07:45.960 --> 0:07:48.320 was like, Oh, it's like the Mushroom family kind of thing, 0:07:48.360 --> 0:07:50.000 and you're like, oh yeah. And I think there's a 0:07:50.040 --> 0:07:53.480 great line in the documentary from Paul Kelly about it, 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:55.520 but it kind of feels like a bit of a cliche, 0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:59.040 but it's also quite true that you know, it's a 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:03.040 very supportive of a supportive environment to work in, and 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:05.160 I think there's also a lot of a lot of 0:08:05.160 --> 0:08:07.440 freedom to try because I think the people that come 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:10.480 here and work at Mushrooms are also really passionate themselves 0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:14.080 about music and that entertainment, about culture, about really wanting 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:17.600 to take Australian artists, you know, to the world as well, 0:08:17.640 --> 0:08:19.480 and that's why we all do what we do. So 0:08:19.520 --> 0:08:23.280 I think, you know, Michael and Matt have really created 0:08:23.320 --> 0:08:27.160 an environment where you do feel really supported. Yeah, you 0:08:27.560 --> 0:08:30.320 can have ambition, you know, and it's great to have 0:08:30.400 --> 0:08:34.280 that ambition. So yeah, it's a pretty great company, I think. 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:34.520 To work for. 0:08:34.840 --> 0:08:37.720 What does the power of the late Michael Goitinski look like, 0:08:38.040 --> 0:08:40.680 you know, only a few years after he's passing, working 0:08:40.720 --> 0:08:41.280 there day to. 0:08:41.320 --> 0:08:45.400 Day it feels in a way like, obviously we miss Michael, 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:48.760 you know, a lot, but Matt's also just been amazing 0:08:48.800 --> 0:08:51.200 to pick up and also run, you know what I mean. 0:08:51.559 --> 0:08:54.720 There's still the same drive and the same ambition and things. 0:08:54.760 --> 0:08:58.360 So yeah, I feel like in a way things have changed, 0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:00.400 but they haven't changed, if that may make sense. 0:09:01.000 --> 0:09:02.480 It does, so yeah, day to. 0:09:02.520 --> 0:09:05.040 Day, I think it's always a really great thing. Like 0:09:05.080 --> 0:09:06.720 there's a lot of people in the mushroom that work 0:09:06.840 --> 0:09:09.360 really really hard. But day to day you also just 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:12.600 remember how privileged you are to be doing what you're doing. 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:16.719 The really interesting thing is having that kind of independence 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.560 behind you. I mean, you know, Michael like set up 0:09:19.559 --> 0:09:23.000 this company, always is his own money, putting his own 0:09:23.120 --> 0:09:25.200 kind of time and energy into it, And I think 0:09:25.360 --> 0:09:28.080 that's always something to really remember that as an independent company, 0:09:28.160 --> 0:09:30.679 we don't have shareholders, you know, we don't have those 0:09:30.760 --> 0:09:33.400 kind of overseas money coming in, but it does mean 0:09:33.400 --> 0:09:35.480 that you can be a lot more agile, you can 0:09:35.520 --> 0:09:38.880 take a lot of more risks and yeah, really know 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:41.360 what's happening on the ground and see where different trends 0:09:41.360 --> 0:09:43.520 are happening. And that was one of the Michaels things 0:09:43.520 --> 0:09:45.520 that he always loved saying about be a leader, not 0:09:45.640 --> 0:09:49.280 or follower. You know, you don't really know what frend 0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:51.080 is going to come. You've kind of got to predict 0:09:51.120 --> 0:09:53.160 it or make it happen, you know. And there's a 0:09:53.240 --> 0:09:56.880 really kind of a low key lessons that when looking 0:09:57.360 --> 0:10:00.440 back over those fifty years of Michael's career that still 0:10:00.440 --> 0:10:02.800 apply to you know, and you can really pull out 0:10:02.800 --> 0:10:04.200 from the documentary. 0:10:03.679 --> 0:10:05.160 I think absolutely. 0:10:05.240 --> 0:10:08.160 I mean when you're watching this documentary, I mean you 0:10:08.240 --> 0:10:11.839 just keep being reminded of some of his methodology and 0:10:11.360 --> 0:10:15.079 that just has you know, passed around the group because 0:10:15.200 --> 0:10:18.280 any interaction I've ever had, I've always found that there's 0:10:18.320 --> 0:10:23.080 some commonality amongst passion and amongst entertainment and art and culture, 0:10:23.360 --> 0:10:26.079 which I think is really important, especially in your industry. 0:10:26.280 --> 0:10:29.240 I love asking people about their personal stories about Michael 0:10:29.320 --> 0:10:33.320 because people who knew him have great stories. What's the 0:10:33.400 --> 0:10:35.800 story you know with you and Michael. That sums up 0:10:35.840 --> 0:10:39.559 the relationship that you had with him, something that we 0:10:39.600 --> 0:10:40.720 can keep on the podcast. 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:44.480 I have asked so many people that question, and then yeah, 0:10:44.520 --> 0:10:46.160 when I get asked, I'm like, oh my gosh. 0:10:46.400 --> 0:10:48.600 Behind the scenes, he was super loyal. 0:10:48.920 --> 0:10:52.439 He was incredibly supportive of if you're going through hard times, 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:55.240 you know, yeah, take some time off or you know, 0:10:55.520 --> 0:10:55.840 do this. 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:57.240 And I know one of the. 0:10:57.200 --> 0:10:59.720 Things that actually didn't make the film was a story 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:05.000 from Michael's driver in fact, and Jeff, his driver's name is. 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:08.480 He told us like how often people would turn up 0:11:08.520 --> 0:11:11.720 to Michael's office and they would either need money for 0:11:11.760 --> 0:11:14.559 a funeral or someone was going through a divorce and things. 0:11:14.600 --> 0:11:17.520 And you know, Jeff had known that these people always 0:11:17.520 --> 0:11:20.520 hadn't spoken very highly of Michael, but yet they think 0:11:20.600 --> 0:11:23.040 went up to his office asking for money and Michael, 0:11:23.080 --> 0:11:25.480 would you know, there we go hands over give it 0:11:25.520 --> 0:11:28.040 to them, even though I knew, you know, And I 0:11:28.080 --> 0:11:30.319 think it was all kind of behind the scenes stuff 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:33.280 that I think was a real testament to the man. 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:36.720 It's so funny because my dad worked with him in 0:11:36.760 --> 0:11:39.160 the nineties, I guess, so my dad worked on AW 0:11:39.960 --> 0:11:42.880 So we've done some advertising campaigns with him, and I 0:11:42.920 --> 0:11:45.600 worked with Mary at Frontier touring a couple of times. 0:11:45.640 --> 0:11:47.920 I even have a certificate for working on sound relief. 0:11:48.320 --> 0:11:50.439 Oh my god, how amazing. 0:11:50.040 --> 0:11:52.920 Which I have framed in my house, which is quite amazing. 0:11:52.920 --> 0:11:55.520 That Mary had called me when I was working in 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:59.600 radio sales and doing sales and she wanted some you know, 0:11:59.640 --> 0:12:02.000 some money to be put into advertising to get sound 0:12:02.080 --> 0:12:04.920 relief out there. And so I worked with Mary and 0:12:05.200 --> 0:12:07.000 that was my story, and I got a chance to 0:12:07.080 --> 0:12:09.000 you know, speak to Michael during that time, and I 0:12:09.160 --> 0:12:11.720 remember how proud and how much energy was going into 0:12:11.720 --> 0:12:14.840 sound relief. But I just that was my experience. And 0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:17.800 that's why when I ask people about their story, it 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:20.400 comes alive for me, because that part of my life 0:12:20.440 --> 0:12:24.080 was really important and I felt included or ordained into 0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:26.960 the family in some weird way that I felt like 0:12:27.000 --> 0:12:28.760 I was able to help and achieve. 0:12:28.920 --> 0:12:31.760 I mean, and what an incredible thing to be part of, 0:12:32.160 --> 0:12:34.400 you know, I mean that sound relief would have just 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:36.120 you know, it's kind of obviously. 0:12:36.600 --> 0:12:38.400 Again in the documentary, Michael talks. 0:12:38.200 --> 0:12:40.000 About sound Relief and saying how it was one of 0:12:40.120 --> 0:12:41.240 his most proud moments. 0:12:41.280 --> 0:12:43.360 Yeah, my tears realized when that was happening. 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:45.120 I was like, so you would have known then, you 0:12:45.160 --> 0:12:48.360 know that that kind of energy and how exciting. And 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:51.679 I remember we were doing the Molly Meldrum mini series 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:54.200 for ten seven. This is a good story about Michael, 0:12:54.320 --> 0:12:57.480 how he was so passionate about promoting you know, he 0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:01.200 was just a natural born promoters of people. That's a 0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:04.440 promoter of you know, events. And we had this call 0:13:04.520 --> 0:13:06.959 when it was being promoted on Channel seven and with 0:13:06.960 --> 0:13:09.600 a call from Channel seven publicist and she's like, I'm 0:13:09.679 --> 0:13:11.800 under the table and your boss is in here, and 0:13:11.840 --> 0:13:13.880 he's telling everyone who's got to promote more? They've got 0:13:13.920 --> 0:13:14.640 to promote more? 0:13:14.800 --> 0:13:15.600 Can you get? 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:19.600 And I could just have a picture of Michael goings 0:13:19.640 --> 0:13:22.400 with the Channel seven officers, you know, telling them that 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:25.719 they got too more to promote these minisaries. 0:13:26.360 --> 0:13:29.480 Yeah, you know this particular film, it started out as 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:31.600 a three part documentary, which I don't know if people 0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:35.000 know before him lasting and that's why you do have 0:13:35.120 --> 0:13:36.480 so much pieces to camera. 0:13:36.679 --> 0:13:40.000 Oh wow, actually anything before he died, that's all archives. 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:44.680 So the idea had started before he passed, and he 0:13:44.920 --> 0:13:47.760 had was having discussions with Paul Goldman, who he had 0:13:47.800 --> 0:13:52.080 known since nineteen seventy nine because Paul has directed over 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:55.480 two hundred music videos, and they met when Paul turned 0:13:55.559 --> 0:13:58.600 up with The Boys next Door Shiver's music video clip 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:02.320 Wow and Yes. So he'd had conversations with Paul and 0:14:02.760 --> 0:14:06.600 they had planned to do a big, you know, kind 0:14:06.600 --> 0:14:10.920 of four day interview with Michael, and then COVID happened 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:15.079 and they couldn't actually arrange that interview, and then when 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:17.719 things are starting to open up, Michael passed and so 0:14:17.920 --> 0:14:19.680 they never got that opportunity. 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:21.840 And Yeah, then. 0:14:22.080 --> 0:14:25.960 I rejoined Mushroom and we spoke about it because I 0:14:26.000 --> 0:14:28.160 think in the three part doco was going to be 0:14:28.320 --> 0:14:31.320 the focus on that Mushroom group, so all the different 0:14:31.360 --> 0:14:34.760 businesses and things, and we thought that it was maybe 0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:38.240 a better opportunity to do it as Michael's story as 0:14:38.280 --> 0:14:40.320 a feature film, because you know, I'd like to say 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:42.280 that Michael was a big personality. You needed a big 0:14:42.280 --> 0:14:46.520 screen because we didn't have all those that interview with Michael. 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:49.840 We had to go through over fifty years of archive 0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:53.480 and cut together the story from. 0:14:53.400 --> 0:14:54.080 All the archive. 0:14:54.200 --> 0:14:56.600 And one of the things that was important to us 0:14:56.800 --> 0:15:00.280 is to allow Michael to tell his own story in 0:15:00.320 --> 0:15:04.240 his own voice. So that was an incredible challenge for 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:08.080 us just in terms of getting archives to sync up 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.040 and tell the story, but then also because Michael's voice. 0:15:10.880 --> 0:15:12.840 Changed so much over the years. 0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:14.960 You can see in the early archive he's you know, 0:15:15.160 --> 0:15:18.320 very well spoken and very clear, and then as he 0:15:18.360 --> 0:15:22.840 gets older, everyone has their Giddinski impersonation. But luckily, you know, 0:15:23.120 --> 0:15:26.560 he wasn't shy of the media, and so there was 0:15:26.880 --> 0:15:29.840 a lot of radio interviews, There was a lot of 0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:31.960 television interviews that we had. 0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:34.200 Yeah, and the piece. 0:15:34.000 --> 0:15:36.480 Itself has got eight hundred and fifty pieces of archive 0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:39.920 in it that's all signed together to tell the story. 0:15:40.760 --> 0:15:42.840 But it is still we kept reflecting on what a 0:15:42.880 --> 0:15:46.200 shame it was that we couldn't actually get those key interviews. 0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:48.520 It still feels like you do though, like it still 0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:50.920 feels quiet. The tapestry of all of this is put 0:15:50.920 --> 0:15:54.720 together so well from the storytelling perspective, and having him 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:58.520 being able to layer opinions at times is brought in 0:15:58.880 --> 0:16:02.560 really clever, clever, and that jigsaw being put together must 0:16:02.560 --> 0:16:04.040 have taken a lot of time. How long does the 0:16:04.080 --> 0:16:06.880 documentary like this take to put together from go to 0:16:06.960 --> 0:16:08.760 WO from when you started on it to getting it 0:16:08.800 --> 0:16:09.280 on screen. 0:16:09.560 --> 0:16:11.720 This one was actually relatively fast in a way. 0:16:11.800 --> 0:16:15.080 I have to say. I think we came on board. 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:18.960 Maybe in October two thousand and twenty War one, I 0:16:19.200 --> 0:16:23.280 think actually like that, and we really didn't start production 0:16:23.960 --> 0:16:28.400 until I think it was July thereabouts in twenty twenty two, 0:16:28.480 --> 0:16:31.480 and obviously then we released it in August twenty three. 0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:34.680 So it was very fast paced, and I think we 0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:37.600 spent about twenty weeks or so in the edit because 0:16:37.600 --> 0:16:40.040 that was obviously where so much of the work was done. 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:43.240 That that said, we also had Page McGinley, who's archive 0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:47.040 producer and also archive producer, and since the idea had 0:16:47.080 --> 0:16:49.880 started to be discussed with Michael and Paul, she had 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:52.800 started to collect a whole lot of archives, so we 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:55.440 have a whole lot of that work already done, which 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:59.680 became so essential to the film. That was an extraordinary 0:16:59.720 --> 0:17:01.840 amount of archive, and it wasn't just about Michael, but 0:17:01.880 --> 0:17:04.520 it was all about different artists and of course you 0:17:04.560 --> 0:17:07.080 know finding all that kind of archive as well, so 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:08.560 it was very concentrate. 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:11.480 How long did it take to find the right people, 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:13.439 because there are some key people that you'd need to 0:17:13.480 --> 0:17:16.320 have in this story in terms of interview, Yeah, like 0:17:16.359 --> 0:17:18.600 even just the artist, but also family. 0:17:18.880 --> 0:17:22.440 I think we were really lucky because Michael had this 0:17:22.600 --> 0:17:26.320 ability to forge such personal relationships with people that when 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:30.640 we went out to ask people to be interviewed, everyone 0:17:31.119 --> 0:17:32.480 made time for us. 0:17:32.520 --> 0:17:32.720 You know. 0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:36.280 We remember we had to organize to catch Billy Joel 0:17:36.560 --> 0:17:39.720 when he's playing I think it was I can't remember 0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:42.399 which stadium in the US, but he just was in 0:17:42.440 --> 0:17:44.760 between sound checks or something and he came into the 0:17:44.800 --> 0:17:47.280 interview for us sting was i know, just about to 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:50.600 go on stage before he did the interview. Yeah, So 0:17:50.640 --> 0:17:54.840 we were just incredibly lucky that a lot of these artists, 0:17:55.320 --> 0:17:59.280 obviously you know, had such a personal relationship with Michael 0:17:59.359 --> 0:18:02.200 that than any issue at all in getting them, which 0:18:02.320 --> 0:18:04.760 you know is a producer's dream you've been. 0:18:05.720 --> 0:18:07.720 Yeah, so everyone would have been wanting to be a 0:18:07.720 --> 0:18:09.560 part of it as well. It's hard to sort of 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:11.760 lock people down and get them to do these sorts 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:14.240 of things, but I guess people must have been you know, 0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:16.800 it would have been like a gravitational pull to give 0:18:16.840 --> 0:18:17.919 back to Michael like this. 0:18:18.440 --> 0:18:20.840 Yeah, and the issue we really had is who to 0:18:20.920 --> 0:18:24.080 interview because there were so many people who were so 0:18:24.440 --> 0:18:27.080 important in his life. But obviously, you know, if you're 0:18:27.119 --> 0:18:29.320 covering fifty years in a doco, you've got about two 0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:32.280 minutes a year. We really had a hard time trying 0:18:32.320 --> 0:18:37.880 to establish who could tell multiple stories or multiple facets, because, yeah, 0:18:38.040 --> 0:18:40.040 had we done a three part I know that there 0:18:40.040 --> 0:18:41.600 would be in a lot more people that we would 0:18:41.600 --> 0:18:43.600 have loved to interview for it as well. 0:18:43.720 --> 0:18:46.000 So did you have set questions for them or did 0:18:46.000 --> 0:18:48.040 you just let the role? Did you let them speak, 0:18:48.160 --> 0:18:51.760 because like it would be with documentaries, sometimes you know 0:18:51.840 --> 0:18:53.880 the story that you're putting together, so you've got certain 0:18:53.960 --> 0:18:56.080 questions to try and on earth things. Or were you 0:18:56.200 --> 0:18:58.760