WEBVTT - BONUS: Beth's Dead with Elizabeth Laime 0:00:03.720 --> 0:00:07.080 Hey there, everybody. Welcome to not Another Crime podcast. 0:00:07.200 --> 0:00:08.560 I'm Georgia Love, I'm. 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:11.799 Sammy Peterson, I am a journalist, i am not and 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.720 today we are joined by someone who's absolutely incredible. We're 0:00:14.720 --> 0:00:17.400 both a big fan of this person and overjoyed. We 0:00:17.440 --> 0:00:21.160 haven't done many zooms in our time, but we are overjoyed. 0:00:20.200 --> 0:00:22.319 I'm going to. 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:27.360 Use it again. Overjoyed to be with the amazing Elizabeth Lamee. Welcome. 0:00:28.520 --> 0:00:30.840 Thank you so much for having me. I am overjoyed 0:00:30.880 --> 0:00:31.280 as well. 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:35.519 The only person who hasn't said that they're overjoyed is Georgia. 0:00:35.680 --> 0:00:37.720 No, because now it will sound like I've made it up. 0:00:37.720 --> 0:00:39.760 But I'm going to wait for the moment where i 0:00:39.840 --> 0:00:42.920 feel overwhelmed with joy and I'm going to drop it out. 0:00:43.040 --> 0:00:45.879 Yes and well, just Sam, you and I will decide 0:00:45.920 --> 0:00:51.080 if it's authentic or well, Gradio, that's the segment. 0:00:51.159 --> 0:00:52.800 We have a buzzer where we can buzz in it. 0:00:52.840 --> 0:00:55.760 I'll go with any line. 0:00:56.960 --> 0:00:59.560 This is my first true crime podcast, which I'm so 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:03.760 excited to do and thankful that you two woke up 0:01:03.840 --> 0:01:06.160 early I think to do this with Hi. Thank you 0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:06.560 very much. 0:01:06.880 --> 0:01:08.720 We didn't need to make that such a big deal, 0:01:08.760 --> 0:01:10.720 but we did because we're very tired. 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:13.520 We've gone on and on about how early we were 0:01:14.040 --> 0:01:15.680 is really a rude way to start a podcast. 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:18.360 We've discovered there are very few people who we would 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:21.480 do that for, and you, Elizabeth, absolutely one of them. 0:01:21.959 --> 0:01:26.840 So listeners will recognize or may recognize your name from 0:01:27.240 --> 0:01:30.959 your very own podcast, which I know you have many, 0:01:31.080 --> 0:01:36.399 but one in particular has absolutely blown up recently. It's 0:01:36.480 --> 0:01:39.440 one of those ones that all of a sudden you 0:01:39.480 --> 0:01:41.840 hear it everywhere, everyone's talking about it. You're going, what 0:01:42.000 --> 0:01:47.240 what is this? Bethstead? Can you just give us your 0:01:47.360 --> 0:01:50.480 elevated pitch about this podcast? Bethstead? 0:01:51.800 --> 0:01:56.440 Yeah, thank you so much. So we my husband and 0:01:56.480 --> 0:02:01.040 I have been podcasting since twenty ten. Really the first 0:02:01.040 --> 0:02:06.680 podcast very Were. We got in real early by accident. 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:10.080 You know. We always joke about we're very good at 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:14.600 putting energy towards things that are not monetizable, So that 0:02:14.680 --> 0:02:21.480 was what it was. So we had a podcast and 0:02:21.600 --> 0:02:26.320 it developed into four different podcasts by twenty sixteen. It's 0:02:26.360 --> 0:02:34.080 when the story happened, and what happened was something crazy, 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:41.440 and it involves parasocial relationships and long story short, A 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:43.919 fan of ours was Monica Padman, who you know from 0:02:44.040 --> 0:02:49.520 Armchair Expert, and she asked us one day why we 0:02:49.600 --> 0:02:52.920 stopped podcasting in like twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen, and we 0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:55.120 told her this story and she was like, we have 0:02:55.200 --> 0:02:58.480 to make a podcast. So the podcast is her interviewing 0:02:58.560 --> 0:03:02.560 us about this story of this wild thing that happens. 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:07.960 And it was so crazy that we got the lapd involved. 0:03:07.960 --> 0:03:11.840 At the time we stopped all of our podcasts, we 0:03:13.080 --> 0:03:17.480 like lived with a new level of kind of distrust 0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:21.079 for a long time, and then in doing this podcast, 0:03:21.360 --> 0:03:24.000 Monica got involved and became kind of a Nancy Drew 0:03:24.240 --> 0:03:28.960 and the twists and turns continued. So it's a ride. 0:03:29.120 --> 0:03:34.000 I think it absolutely is. When when you stopped podcasting 0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:36.520 for a while, was that just you know, was it 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:38.520 hard to kind of get back in and want to 0:03:38.520 --> 0:03:40.480 tell this story? If that was something that made you 0:03:40.840 --> 0:03:42.840 want to stop podcasting in general. 0:03:44.360 --> 0:03:48.960 Yeah, And actually yes it was. We were like moths 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:51.040 to a flame. And so Andy and I started our 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:54.240 podcast back up again, and I think twenty twenty two 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:57.040 it's called Nobody's Listening, right, and it's just him and I, 0:03:58.200 --> 0:04:01.000 but we have safety kind of at some place where 0:04:01.000 --> 0:04:06.200 we're not interacting with listeners. Really, we changed the format 0:04:06.240 --> 0:04:10.320 a little bit to feel better about things, but we 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:14.200 have also learned we can't not podcast. As you guys know, 0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:19.400 it's a it's a it's an intense drug. So but 0:04:19.560 --> 0:04:21.680 in the making of this podcast, we made it over 0:04:21.720 --> 0:04:25.799 two years, and all three of us at different times 0:04:26.560 --> 0:04:30.640 brought to the group, I don't know if we should 0:04:30.640 --> 0:04:32.280 do this, Like, I don't know if we should put 0:04:32.279 --> 0:04:39.159 it out. It feels dangerous, and so that was definitely 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:41.520 a big part of the conversation. I think you'll hear 0:04:41.560 --> 0:04:45.560 it on the podcast, to us debating if what we're 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:52.039 doing is so stupid still still might be. We you know, 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:53.680 have yet to know. 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:58.120 So for people who haven't listened to it, where we 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:00.919 might be sounding really vague, we're going to do a 0:05:00.920 --> 0:05:02.920 bit of a spoilers section later on for anyone who 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:04.280 wants to hear it. But that's why we're being a 0:05:04.320 --> 0:05:05.719 bit vague about this story. 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:07.520 But it sounds like we haven't listened to it. 0:05:07.640 --> 0:05:10.919 Yeah, yeah, it sounds like we're those those terrible interviewers 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:14.440 who go, so, just tell us what it's about and 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:15.279 then we'll no. 0:05:15.360 --> 0:05:17.920 I appreciate I appreciate that. Actually, I can give a 0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:21.440 little more detail When you said elevator pitch just for anyone. 0:05:21.920 --> 0:05:24.200 The thing that happened is that people would write into 0:05:24.279 --> 0:05:27.440 our podcast for our very unqualified advice. Andy and I 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:31.640 had no business giving anyone advice, but we did. And 0:05:32.279 --> 0:05:34.440 at the time, I was a brand new mom to 0:05:34.520 --> 0:05:40.280 two tiny humans and working through some stuff, and I 0:05:40.360 --> 0:05:45.680 developed relationships with especially young women who needed help. And 0:05:45.720 --> 0:05:49.239 one of those young women for the title, was named Beth, 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:56.799 and that relationship took on. It's a life of its own, 0:05:57.600 --> 0:06:02.800 and lessons were learned. But yeah, so that's kind of 0:06:02.839 --> 0:06:06.200 the jumping off point for the story with no spoilers. 0:06:06.440 --> 0:06:09.280 And also, like you know, this was a very different 0:06:09.360 --> 0:06:11.359 kind of podcast for you. So you said before that 0:06:11.680 --> 0:06:14.760 this is your first true crime podcast, is as being, 0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:17.400 you know, doing a more documentary series. I don't know 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:19.400 why I said that so strangely, it is very early. 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:21.839 I will say it again, I am ever joyed to 0:06:21.839 --> 0:06:28.960 be here, Elizabeth, But the joy the documentary style. You know, 0:06:29.000 --> 0:06:32.000 it's a conversation between you three. But was that something 0:06:32.320 --> 0:06:34.320 you know that you've always wanted to do or was 0:06:34.360 --> 0:06:37.200 this a completely new avenue where you never kind of 0:06:37.200 --> 0:06:40.320 thought that you would. It's like true crime, kind of 0:06:40.480 --> 0:06:43.120 a vein of a true crime story, really it is. 0:06:44.360 --> 0:06:47.240 Yeah, no, never would have one or two. 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:49.000 I am. 0:06:49.400 --> 0:06:52.760 I'm a TV writer, so I do write shows, and 0:06:53.680 --> 0:06:55.480 I did. I was on a show called A Million 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:59.280 Low Things for a few years and one of the 0:06:59.320 --> 0:07:04.040 episodes that I wrote in that show for like our 0:07:04.080 --> 0:07:08.560 beloved younger female character played by Lizzie Green, She's Incredible, 0:07:09.960 --> 0:07:12.760 was based on something that happened to me. And the 0:07:12.800 --> 0:07:15.720 way we told the story was very similar to the 0:07:15.760 --> 0:07:21.360 way we crafted the story for this, where the audience 0:07:21.600 --> 0:07:25.280 is learning what's happening at the same time that the 0:07:25.440 --> 0:07:31.400 character is. So I think I had I think I 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:34.600 love to tell stories obviously, and you know that's my 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:39.760 my jam. So it was exciting for me and all 0:07:39.800 --> 0:07:42.080 of us. It was really a collaboration, but to figure 0:07:42.080 --> 0:07:44.320 out the best way to lay out the story to 0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:47.160 tell it, and also the three of us just have 0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:50.920 fun chemistry, and so I feel like, I mean, it's 0:07:50.920 --> 0:07:54.760 a creepy story. It's not like all fun and games 0:07:54.840 --> 0:07:59.840 or anybody any stretch, But we I think brought kind 0:07:59.880 --> 0:08:05.400 of of just our own style to it and didn't 0:08:05.440 --> 0:08:07.800 want we wanted that to definitely be in place, so 0:08:07.880 --> 0:08:12.080 a lot of thought was given to how it's coming across, 0:08:12.200 --> 0:08:15.320 and it took a long time to make, and it 0:08:15.360 --> 0:08:20.680 definitely flexed muscles I didn't have or didn't feel like 0:08:20.720 --> 0:08:24.480 I needed to have. But yeah, but now I'm like, 0:08:25.120 --> 0:08:28.160 it was really fulfilling. And there were some choices we made, 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:30.920 like episode eight, I don't know if you remember what 0:08:31.000 --> 0:08:35.040 that one was, the crafting of something where you know, 0:08:35.120 --> 0:08:38.160 we made the choice to keep it very like it's 0:08:38.200 --> 0:08:44.520 all there, very lightly edited, if at all. So those 0:08:44.520 --> 0:08:49.960 were choices that we knew like some people wouldn't like 0:08:50.000 --> 0:08:51.720 and some people would, but we got to make it 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:54.720 the way we wanted it, which was unlike in TV, 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:59.120 also so fulfilling because you just get to make the 0:08:59.160 --> 0:09:00.680 thing and put it out, which is so cool. 0:09:01.360 --> 0:09:03.680 When you when you started as well, did you kind 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:06.439 of know where you were going to go with it? 0:09:06.520 --> 0:09:08.200 Was it just you know, the germ of the idea 0:09:08.360 --> 0:09:11.000 was like, we're just going to see what happens, or 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:13.439 you know, like, were you kind of because you sound 0:09:13.520 --> 0:09:16.360 quite a terrified of where it's going to go? Is 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:18.920 that is that something where you thought, oh no, if 0:09:18.920 --> 0:09:21.200 we get two years into this, because I kind of 0:09:21.200 --> 0:09:24.240 wonder with ending sometimes is that, you know, sometimes you 0:09:24.240 --> 0:09:27.120 can I've made documentaries in the past where you know, 0:09:27.200 --> 0:09:30.080 you get to a certain point and then you go, oh, no, 0:09:30.120 --> 0:09:33.520 there's no ending, like you know, unless for something. Yeah, yeah, 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:35.600 like you know you're kind of going, what's the ending. 0:09:35.640 --> 0:09:38.240 Did you kind of worry at some point that it 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:42.000 would just be well, that was good in a good 0:09:42.000 --> 0:09:42.480 two years? 0:09:43.600 --> 0:09:46.640 Yes, yeah, I mean I think that I think that 0:09:46.800 --> 0:09:49.760 was definitely concern. It still felt like a story that 0:09:50.000 --> 0:09:56.040 was worthy of telling. And but setting out I had 0:09:56.120 --> 0:09:58.839 like I created a rough outliner and everyone we'd in 0:09:59.040 --> 0:10:03.280 and it honestly staged pretty true to it until it 0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:05.000 took on a life of its own, and then the 0:10:05.000 --> 0:10:10.000 outline kind of evolved as we went. So, but we 0:10:10.120 --> 0:10:13.319 kind of we had a very loose framework and then 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:16.240 in each episode, like we kind of knew that the 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:19.760 general direction we were heading, and I think Monica did 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:23.000 such a great job of like leading us through that 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:27.520 each episode. But the framework was pretty adhered to, and 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:29.240 it kind of had to be because there was so 0:10:29.480 --> 0:10:34.240 much information to get out and if you would believe it, 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:36.800 like that wasn't even all of the inform, you know, 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:41.480 it's we still had to be discerning and but yeah, 0:10:41.800 --> 0:10:47.040 that but there was definitely like we had alternative endings 0:10:47.280 --> 0:10:54.040 that were options, I guess for us to kind of 0:10:54.320 --> 0:10:58.080 explore and talk about things, but the ending then just 0:10:58.360 --> 0:10:59.440 happened to us. 0:10:59.720 --> 0:11:01.760 Yeah. I believe one of the endings was a dance, 0:11:01.880 --> 0:11:05.599 a dance between you three. 0:11:05.880 --> 0:11:08.880 I would have been overjoyed to see that. However, it is. 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:15.520 Genuine, I don't know, harder to see the dance. 0:11:15.800 --> 0:11:18.120 And that's why we brought you here today. Elizabeth on 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:19.520 camera five six. 0:11:21.240 --> 0:11:23.640 For you, I am wearing my Bob Fossy like all 0:11:23.679 --> 0:11:24.800 black perfect. 0:11:25.200 --> 0:11:26.160 She's one of mine. 0:11:27.360 --> 0:11:31.839 For parasocial relationships, that's a big theme in the podcast. 0:11:31.880 --> 0:11:36.920 Has it kind of changed the way you post on Instagram? 0:11:37.000 --> 0:11:39.600 Has it changed the way that you kind of you know, 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:42.800 live your life in a way online. 0:11:43.360 --> 0:11:50.319 Absolutely, and doing this just validated that so much, this 0:11:50.559 --> 0:11:56.280 thing happening. I scribed my kids from Instagram. I'm like 0:11:56.520 --> 0:12:02.720 very careful about being like not really sharing where we 0:12:02.760 --> 0:12:07.560 live exactly, and if we go somewhere, like I don't 0:12:07.600 --> 0:12:10.800 post about it until we're not there, you know, things 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:16.000 like that. So and especially being a parent, I think. 0:12:16.360 --> 0:12:19.000 You know, we had a fellow Aussie on as like 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:22.160 an expert speaking to us in the podcast, and she 0:12:22.280 --> 0:12:29.840 was so great and she just really kind of validated 0:12:30.200 --> 0:12:33.079 my need to protect my kids. And it's hard as 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:37.319 podcasters because it's they are our life. And even on Instagram, 0:12:37.360 --> 0:12:40.240 I feel bad sometimes because I'm like, they're the main 0:12:40.280 --> 0:12:42.040 thing in my life. But if you looked at my 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:46.959 Instagram you would think I'm like just about cleavage and no, 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:47.600 I'm just kidding. 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:50.320 You can follow Elizabeth. 0:12:56.040 --> 0:12:58.800 Actually I think it's probably like coffee and I don't 0:12:58.800 --> 0:13:03.480 know what, but but that's not it's important actually still coffees, yes, 0:13:05.800 --> 0:13:08.640 but yeah, I just am really And now with AI, 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:11.800 we didn't even get into that. But the stuff with 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:14.800 AI where they can like take someone's face and basically 0:13:14.880 --> 0:13:18.800 have them doing anything, yeah, makes me very fearful for 0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:27.120 like adolescence, you know, coming up, and so I'm very 0:13:27.559 --> 0:13:29.760 I'm not glad this happened, but i am glad for 0:13:29.800 --> 0:13:32.640 that lesson where I don't think I would you know, 0:13:32.679 --> 0:13:36.880 I don't think that I would have taken those precautions 0:13:36.920 --> 0:13:37.880 if it work so. 0:13:38.320 --> 0:13:42.679 Well, because parent social relationships are like you know, Monica 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:44.960 Padman Kind of had one with you two, like you know, 0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:47.360 the it is even though she'd met you. It is 0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:51.600 weird that, like, I had a parasocial relationship with you 0:13:52.200 --> 0:13:53.959 through listening to the podcast, and I was like, I'll 0:13:54.000 --> 0:13:55.760 just reach out and ask her on the podcast, and 0:13:55.960 --> 0:13:59.840 you know, you kind of do something else. Yeah, yeah, No, 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:02.560 you're a little bit worried, Elizabeth. As the end of 0:14:02.559 --> 0:14:05.360 the culp No, but there is a there is a 0:14:05.400 --> 0:14:08.120 part where I'm a fan of podcasts and being you know, 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:10.199 I do stand up and being in the comedy world. 0:14:10.240 --> 0:14:13.320 I know the people that do the podcast and I 0:14:13.320 --> 0:14:16.520 listen to mostly. But what I find weird is sometimes 0:14:16.559 --> 0:14:19.280 I'm having a conversation knowing a fact about them that 0:14:19.320 --> 0:14:22.080 they've just said that week on a podcast, And you 0:14:22.160 --> 0:14:24.840 kind of do have a more intimate relationship with people 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:27.240 sometimes that you think you do. 0:14:27.240 --> 0:14:29.520 You think you do the relationship you actually have. 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:31.880 Yeah, did you notice that in the in the wild 0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:34.480 when when you tour about, Like, did you notice that 0:14:34.520 --> 0:14:38.040 people like kind of had this parasocial relationship with you. 0:14:38.160 --> 0:14:40.160 Was that something that that kind of came up a. 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:41.760 Bit with me. 0:14:42.160 --> 0:14:44.320 Yeah, yeah, when you're doing the podcast. 0:14:43.960 --> 0:14:45.680 You know, it's funny I feel like the only times 0:14:45.760 --> 0:14:51.920 I'm ever like recognized is when I'm with Monica. Yeah right, 0:14:53.320 --> 0:14:56.160 something is like oh podcasting, and you know, I think 0:14:56.200 --> 0:14:58.800 she experiences that all the time. I do have some 0:14:58.800 --> 0:15:00.920 friends who are so sweet to listen to our show, 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:04.600 and so sometimes something will slip in and I'm like, oh, right, 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:07.280 you know, and I think, as you two probably know 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:11.720 it will actually you're still young and have neurons firing 0:15:11.760 --> 0:15:14.520 and stuff. But I forget what we talked about, like 0:15:14.600 --> 0:15:18.640 the second it's out of my mouth. So sometimes someone 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:22.040 will bring something up and I'm like, when did I 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:24.520 tell you that? You know that sort of thing where? 0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:28.560 But I too, I listen to podcasts. One of my 0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:32.440 friends podcasts, June Dian Raphael and Jessica Saint Clair have 0:15:32.480 --> 0:15:37.280 a great podcast called The Deep Dive. And my issue 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:41.239 as someone who has both a real and parasocial relationship 0:15:41.280 --> 0:15:44.760 is I'm I cannot resist like live texting them as 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:47.880 I'm listening, and they're like, oh my god, we recorded 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:49.800 that like three weeks ago, Like I don't need to 0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:55.040 relive it with you, but it is. It is very interesting, 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:58.080 and I do think because it's such an intimate medium, 0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:00.800 I understand because I'm on the other end of it, 0:16:01.480 --> 0:16:06.520 feeling like you know the person and almost like if 0:16:06.520 --> 0:16:08.920 they say something you don't agree with, you're disappointed in 0:16:09.240 --> 0:16:12.240 or we got we were talking about speaking of dancing, 0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:15.360 Andy and I spoke about dancing recently in a way 0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:18.840 that you know, we can be a little snarky sometimes 0:16:18.920 --> 0:16:22.360 and we're giving people shit, the people who basically like 0:16:22.400 --> 0:16:24.280 go out on the dance floor first and just go 0:16:24.480 --> 0:16:28.000 big yep. And the truth is like in my real life, 0:16:28.040 --> 0:16:30.240 I don't really care like everyone should dance, that they 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:34.280 want to dance, but I think because people have expectations 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:37.080 of us, some people were really upset that we were 0:16:37.200 --> 0:16:42.120 like dissing dancing the big dances. 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:44.720 Well you can know exactly who was upset about that 0:16:44.800 --> 0:16:45.720 was the big dances. 0:16:45.920 --> 0:16:48.280 Yeah, we saw you busting some moves on the coldest before. 0:16:49.320 --> 0:16:53.080 Yeah, So I in that sense, I'm like, you probably 0:16:53.120 --> 0:16:55.640 wouldn't be that upset. I mean, in a way, it's flattering. 0:16:55.680 --> 0:16:58.080 It's like you care enough or like think of us 0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:00.760 a certain way enough to feel the need to take 0:17:00.760 --> 0:17:05.119 to your keyboard, you know, which I appreciate. But also 0:17:06.080 --> 0:17:10.680 it's like it's like they're your cousin or something they're 0:17:10.720 --> 0:17:15.240 like disappointed in you. But also they have the anonymity 0:17:15.440 --> 0:17:18.880 of the Internet, so it's just very interesting. And then 0:17:18.920 --> 0:17:22.960 of course, by and large, our fans are incredible, which 0:17:22.960 --> 0:17:26.159 is also why when all of this happened, it was 0:17:27.560 --> 0:17:35.040 really not expected at all. And unlike people like Monica 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:39.280 and people have massive platforms, we have like a very 0:17:39.800 --> 0:17:43.640 you know, proud of it, but not like a huge, massive, 0:17:44.480 --> 0:17:52.000 popular podcast. It's medium small, I'd say, youth medium large. 0:17:52.000 --> 0:17:57.640 I don't know. I'm doing T shirt sizing, and so 0:17:57.680 --> 0:18:00.600 it's not like I feel like the bigger. It's the 0:18:00.760 --> 0:18:07.160 more kind of I don't know, like negativity jumps into 0:18:07.160 --> 0:18:10.200 the pool, which we haven't experienced really at all. We've 0:18:10.240 --> 0:18:10.960 been really lucky. 0:18:11.960 --> 0:18:14.160 Well, before we kind of get into the spoiler section, 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:16.480 I thought it might be worth mentioning like a little 0:18:16.480 --> 0:18:19.080 bit more about the show. So, you know, one of 0:18:19.080 --> 0:18:22.000 the letters comes through with someone called Beth, and you 0:18:22.119 --> 0:18:25.160 had these letters that you were giving advice on and 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:29.359 then you get some devastating news one day after helping 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:31.600 Beth through some problems for a long time, and you 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:35.359 find out the news that that Beth is Beth is 0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:37.600 in fact dead. You hear that from someone else. 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:42.040 Oh no, spoilers, that's not written on the artwork and 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:44.760 spoiler you. 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:48.080 Yeah, you find you find that out. And and so 0:18:48.200 --> 0:18:52.359 for you that that feeling of hearing that and it 0:18:52.440 --> 0:18:55.040 was a you know, you got really invested in in 0:18:55.080 --> 0:18:59.720 this story. How how did that kind of change, you know, 0:18:59.800 --> 0:19:02.199 the way that you were giving advice and did it 0:19:02.280 --> 0:19:06.000 just kind of completely change who you were in that moment? 0:19:06.000 --> 0:19:08.600 Because I can imagine that it's such a massive thing 0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:10.960 from you know, the way you describe your podcast as 0:19:11.000 --> 0:19:13.680 a median, small kind of podcast and then all of 0:19:13.720 --> 0:19:18.359 a sudden there's this huge, devastating thing that happened. It 0:19:18.400 --> 0:19:21.120 was that something that kind of changed you right away? 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:22.760 How did you cope with with hearing that? 0:19:22.960 --> 0:19:23.120 Use? 0:19:24.480 --> 0:19:28.040 Yeah, No, it definitely did. And it was really interesting 0:19:28.119 --> 0:19:30.800 doing the podcast. I went we went back through all 0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:33.800 of my correspondence with Beth that I hadn't looked at 0:19:33.840 --> 0:19:36.600 since that time, which was like eight years prior. 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:37.080 Yeap. 0:19:39.119 --> 0:19:43.720 It definitely changed so much in I think, so this 0:19:43.840 --> 0:19:46.679 was our podcast called Totally Married, and I think you 0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:49.520 can probably hear it like we ended up staffing everything 0:19:49.560 --> 0:19:54.399 about a year later because well for multiple reasons, but 0:19:54.600 --> 0:19:59.720 I became way less confident giving advice to anyone for 0:19:59.840 --> 0:20:02.760 t regularly, like if it seemed like it was this 0:20:03.040 --> 0:20:08.719 actual situation that needed real advice. Hearing it back, I 0:20:08.840 --> 0:20:15.439 was pretty horrified at like some of the advice or 0:20:17.280 --> 0:20:19.960 this is so it's I was horrified in a way 0:20:20.119 --> 0:20:23.800 because we would give advice publicly on the podcast, and 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:26.959 sometimes especially Andy would be like, get out, get out 0:20:26.960 --> 0:20:29.240 of the relationship, right, He'd just be very black and 0:20:29.240 --> 0:20:33.840 white about things, and I'd be like, well, And in 0:20:33.880 --> 0:20:38.399 this case, though, I was corresponding with her personally, and 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:41.439 so there was like a gray area for me. But 0:20:41.480 --> 0:20:45.040 I was giving her big advice and I didn't know her. 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:48.720 And it's weird, Like it's weird saying it now. I'm 0:20:48.760 --> 0:20:51.679 looking back and going, what the fuck was I doing. 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:55.959 But I also think it's been interesting now that this 0:20:56.000 --> 0:20:59.880 has been out, Like a lot of people have waged 0:21:00.320 --> 0:21:04.760 about the fact that I was so postpartum and you're 0:21:05.080 --> 0:21:08.600 you don't have sleep, your hormones are everywhere, your you know, 0:21:09.760 --> 0:21:13.119 your sense of identity is just like it's just a 0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:16.760 crazy time. And so I almost feel like I didn't 0:21:16.760 --> 0:21:21.720 give that enough kind of credence and the I don't 0:21:21.720 --> 0:21:22.840 know if that's the right word, but you know what 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:26.879 I mean, I think it was. It was the time, 0:21:27.119 --> 0:21:30.080 it was the situation, it was that she had access 0:21:30.119 --> 0:21:33.920 to us in that way. And but yeah, it changed, 0:21:34.040 --> 0:21:35.160 I mean it changed everything. 0:21:36.000 --> 0:21:39.200 At what point did you realize there was a crime, 0:21:39.600 --> 0:21:41.200 there had had been a crime? 0:21:43.440 --> 0:21:46.240 Are we talking spoilers? Now, let's do it if you're 0:21:46.240 --> 0:21:47.560 happy to yeah, yep. 0:21:47.720 --> 0:21:49.919 So, dear listeners, turn off. 0:21:49.800 --> 0:21:51.720 Now if you if. 0:21:51.560 --> 0:21:54.640 You don't want to know, no, no, well don't turn off. Pause, 0:21:54.920 --> 0:21:57.600 go and listen to it. Ten episodes are best dead 0:21:57.800 --> 0:21:58.800 and then come back. 0:22:00.880 --> 0:22:05.760 So the we really didn't know it was a crime 0:22:06.160 --> 0:22:11.240 until we spoke with the LAPD detective. But what had 0:22:11.320 --> 0:22:18.000 happened was we got an email from Beth's account telling us, 0:22:18.080 --> 0:22:21.080 and it was from her brother Jason, that she had 0:22:21.119 --> 0:22:26.240 died by suicide. And I was devastated, and there very 0:22:26.280 --> 0:22:30.680 quickly Jason started becoming really aggressive and almost like accusing 0:22:30.720 --> 0:22:33.800 me of having some part in it and asking me 0:22:33.800 --> 0:22:37.680 if I was her therapist, which I at the time 0:22:37.720 --> 0:22:41.439 internalized as like, oh my god, I did have a 0:22:41.480 --> 0:22:45.080 part in this, Like, you know, it was really awful, 0:22:45.520 --> 0:22:51.280 and I really cared about her as well, and then 0:22:51.800 --> 0:22:55.240 in the meantime there were all these other listeners that 0:22:55.320 --> 0:22:58.520 I had also been corresponding with and dealing with. In 0:22:58.560 --> 0:23:01.359 our comment sect, we had a massive comments section. This 0:23:01.480 --> 0:23:02.840 was like back in the day when there was like 0:23:02.880 --> 0:23:07.080 live journals and people it was so it was like 0:23:08.040 --> 0:23:11.000 so much activity in her comments, and so I was 0:23:12.119 --> 0:23:16.320 getting to know people there also and moderating sometimes. And 0:23:16.760 --> 0:23:22.280 long story short, we my friend Hammy Sager. Actually it 0:23:22.320 --> 0:23:28.720 was her birthday yesterday. Yes. She pointed out that this 0:23:28.960 --> 0:23:33.440 was strange behavior from a brother whose sister just died 0:23:33.440 --> 0:23:40.600 by suicide to be going through her email, and that 0:23:40.720 --> 0:23:44.160 kind of lifted a veil to me, and I thought, oh, 0:23:44.200 --> 0:23:47.920 my gosh, is this something is something weird about this, 0:23:48.840 --> 0:23:51.119 And so what we did was we looked up Best's 0:23:51.200 --> 0:23:57.120 IP addresses linked to her comments on our website, and 0:23:57.160 --> 0:23:59.119 when you click on like it was a hyperlink, and 0:23:59.160 --> 0:24:01.680 when you click on it, all the comments she made 0:24:01.840 --> 0:24:04.560