1 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:05,160 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Dunda 2 00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: Bungelung Calcuttin woman from Gadighl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 3 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:12,440 Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 4 00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 5 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:18,960 Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 6 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:21,759 Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present. 7 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os. It's Tuesday, 8 00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:33,680 Speaker 2: the thirteenth of December. Sam, Happy birthday. 9 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 3: Thank you, Zarah heank Youlyn Good, I'm feeling twenty eight 10 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 3: and happy birthday. That's Taylor Swift as well. 11 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:44,680 Speaker 2: Now, we heard earlier this month that the Bruce Lhermon 12 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,640 Speaker 2: retrial had been dropped due to concerns it would pose 13 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 2: a significant risk to Britney Higgins's life. So what happens 14 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 2: from here, Well, a criminal trial is off the table, 15 00:00:55,040 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 2: but reports have indicated that civil cases could still be 16 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 2: brought by both Higgins and Lherman. There have also been 17 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 2: calls for an investigation into the role of the police 18 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:07,040 Speaker 2: in the trial. So in today's deep dive, we're going 19 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 2: to look at what's happened so far and what could 20 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:11,960 Speaker 2: happen next, But first sam the headlines. 21 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 3: The federal government will cut the number of subsidized psychology 22 00:01:19,640 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 3: visits in half next year, after it was raised to 23 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:25,720 Speaker 3: twenty sessions in twenty twenty. It came after the release 24 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 3: of an independent evaluation that found many of the additional 25 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 3: sessions were being unused. Shadow Health Minister Anne Rustin called 26 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 3: the timing of the cuts staggering, while Health Minister Mark 27 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 3: Butler said the cuts would help more Australians get the 28 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 3: mental health care and support they need. 29 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 2: The new South Wales government has said it'll make rent 30 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 2: bidding illegal. Premio Dominic Pairite said the change would give 31 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 2: more people security and certainty so that they can plan 32 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 2: for their future. The change will apply from Saturday. 33 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 3: Bari's governor has said tourists don't need to worry about 34 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 3: a new Indonesian criminal code that will ban sex outside 35 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:05,120 Speaker 3: of marriage. He said his government wouldn't be checking the 36 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 3: marital status of incoming tourists and that you could only 37 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 3: be prosecuted if a complaint was received by a family relative. 38 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:14,720 Speaker 3: The new code will come into effect in twenty twenty five. 39 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 2: And the good news an electric yacht will be entered 40 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:22,400 Speaker 2: into the Sydney to Hobart Race for the very first 41 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:25,639 Speaker 2: time ever. This year, the Jbird will make history when 42 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:28,560 Speaker 2: it launches from Sydney Harbor on Boxing Day, and it'll 43 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 2: be powered by six twenty two kilogram batteries in the 44 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 2: center of the yacht. Before we go any further, a 45 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 2: quick trigger warning on this deep dive. It does deal 46 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 2: with sexual assault. Support is available twenty four to seven 47 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:46,280 Speaker 2: at one eight hundred respect one eight hundred seven three 48 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:47,520 Speaker 2: seven seven three to two. 49 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 3: So there's been a lot of news over the last 50 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 3: few weeks about the Bruce Lehman case, and just because 51 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 3: the retrial has been called off, as you said, doesn't 52 00:02:56,280 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 3: mean we've seen the end of this story. It feels 53 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 3: like an appropriate time to look at what's going to 54 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:03,760 Speaker 3: happen next. But perhaps to start, Zarah, can you go 55 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 3: back and give us some background on what's happened up 56 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 3: to this point. 57 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:11,200 Speaker 2: Okay, So, Brittany Higgins alleged that Bruce Lehman sexually assaulted 58 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 2: her in an office in Parliament House back in twenty nineteen. 59 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 2: At the time, both were working as staffers for the 60 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 2: Liberal Party. A criminal trial was then held in the 61 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 2: Act Supreme Court, and that began on October fourth this year. 62 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 2: Lherman has consistently denied the allegations and he pled not 63 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:30,680 Speaker 2: guilty in that criminal trial. 64 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:33,840 Speaker 3: And the trial didn't reach a conclusion why not. 65 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 2: So the jury had been deliberating for a couple of 66 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:40,320 Speaker 2: days when on October twenty seventh, a mistrial was declared, 67 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:43,080 Speaker 2: and that was because a member of the jury brought 68 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 2: unauthorized materials into the jury room and they were discovered 69 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 2: in a routine tidying of the room by a Supreme 70 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:55,080 Speaker 2: Court security officer. Jurors had been repeatedly instructed not to 71 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 2: conduct independent research beyond the evidence presented at the trial, 72 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:02,120 Speaker 2: and this was really labored by the judge because of 73 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:06,120 Speaker 2: how much publicity this trial had attracted. At the time, 74 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 2: Chief Justice Lucy McCallum expressed regret over what had happened, saying, quote, 75 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 2: it may be that no harm has been done, but 76 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 2: that is not a risk I can take. 77 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 3: And when we got that news, we still thought that 78 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:19,480 Speaker 3: another trial might be on the way. 79 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 2: Yeah, So that was our understanding at the time. A 80 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,400 Speaker 2: retrial was scheduled for February of next year, but then 81 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:29,840 Speaker 2: on December twod the Act Director of Public Prosecutions. His 82 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 2: name is Shane Drumgold. He announced he'd not be proceeding 83 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 2: with a planned retrial because he was concerned it would 84 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 2: present a quote significant and unacceptable risk to Britney Higgins's life. 85 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 2: That decision meant that there will be no verdict on 86 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 2: the criminal allegations made by Higgins. And again Lerman continues 87 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: to deny these claims. 88 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 3: Right, and there's another element to all of this, and 89 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 3: that's the call for an inquiry into the handling of 90 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,360 Speaker 3: the investigation. What do we know about that aspect? 91 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 2: Well, shame Drumgold hoo I meant before is the prosecutor here. 92 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:06,080 Speaker 2: He's accused the Australian Federal Police of pressuring him not 93 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:08,680 Speaker 2: to proceed with the case and trying to undermine it. 94 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 2: According to the Act's Attorney General, Shane Raddenbury, the AFP's 95 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:16,320 Speaker 2: conduct has now been referred to the Federal Law Enforcement 96 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:20,760 Speaker 2: Integrity Watchdog. The Police Union has called drum Gold's accusation 97 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 2: a smear and called for a broader legal investigation of 98 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 2: all the parties involved, including the prosecutors. 99 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:31,280 Speaker 3: So that avenue is still unfolding, but there's also been 100 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 3: some talk of more trials, this time not criminal cases, 101 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:36,760 Speaker 3: but civil ones. Before we dive into it, can you 102 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 3: give me a rundown on the difference between these two. 103 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 2: Yes, So, a criminal trial involves the prosecution of a 104 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 2: person for an alleged crime, and in this case, it 105 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:49,760 Speaker 2: was an alleged sexual assault. So that case has now 106 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 2: ended and there was no judgment made on that it 107 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 2: was a mistrial and there will be no further retrial. 108 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,720 Speaker 2: But on the other hand, civil trials are disputes between parties, 109 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 2: one party claiming to have been wronged by another, and 110 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 2: oftentimes they're seeking financial compensation or damages for the resulting 111 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 2: harm that they are alleging. While criminal convictions must be 112 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:14,480 Speaker 2: proven beyond reasonable doubt, civil matters are a bit different. 113 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 2: That threshold is different, and so that's decided on the 114 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 2: balance of probabilities. So it's basically saying it's more likely 115 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:22,880 Speaker 2: than not that the party was wronged. That is the 116 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 2: threshold that they need to meet. 117 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 3: Okay, And because the criminal trial of Lherman has been dropped, 118 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 3: what civil avenues are open? 119 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 2: Well, if we start with Lherman, it's been widely reported 120 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 2: that he's considering suing some media outlets and journalists for defamation, 121 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:42,279 Speaker 2: and that's the act of damaging somebody's reputations. So a 122 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 2: potential lawsuit could focus on coverage of Higgins's allegation or 123 00:06:47,320 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 2: on the publication of a speech that she gave outside 124 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:54,719 Speaker 2: court after that mistrial was declared. There is no suggestion, though, 125 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 2: that Lehman plans to sue Higgins herself, but it should 126 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 2: be said that any defamation trial would have to include 127 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 2: her allegations, because that is at the center of all 128 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 2: of this. She's tweeted that she'd be willing to testify 129 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:07,880 Speaker 2: that her allegations are true. 130 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:11,040 Speaker 3: And what about Brittany Higgins. What have we heard about 131 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 3: potential civil claims from her? 132 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:17,000 Speaker 2: Well? Several media outlets have reported that Higgins has pursued 133 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 2: a civil claim against the federal government and former ministers 134 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 2: Linda Reynolds and Machaylia Cash. They were, of course, both 135 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:27,320 Speaker 2: her former employers. The Nine Papers are reported that the 136 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:32,120 Speaker 2: claims include damages due to negligence. Reynolds has confirmed the 137 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:36,080 Speaker 2: existence of a civil claim. During the trials, Reynolds was 138 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 2: accused by prosecutor Shane Drumgold of seeking to assist Lehman's 139 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 2: legal team, but she has denied that she acted inappropriately. 140 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 3: I think it's important to read that helpline again. If 141 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 3: this episode has brought up anything for you. Support is 142 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 3: available twenty four to seven at one eight hundred respect 143 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 3: that's one eight hundred seven three two seven three seven. 144 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:03,080 Speaker 3: Thank you for joining us on the Daily OS this morning. 145 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 3: Will be back again tomorrow. Until then, have a great day.