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Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda

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Speaker 1: Bungelung Calcotin woman from Gadighl country. The Daily oz acknowledges

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Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the

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Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres

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Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the

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Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present.

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Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os. It's Friday,

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Speaker 2: the twenty seventh of October. I'm Zara Seidler.

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Speaker 3: I'm believe it's Simon's good to have you back.

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Speaker 2: Zara, good to be back. And you might be wondering

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Speaker 2: where Sam has been all this week. Well, he's actually

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Speaker 2: been in the US to cover Prime Minister Anthony Alberniesi's

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Speaker 2: state visit and he somehow managed to interview two very

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Speaker 2: senior people at the White House, one of whom is

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Speaker 2: Carin Jean Pierre. And if you don't recognize her name,

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Speaker 2: I'm sure you would recognize her face. She is the

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Speaker 2: person who stands in front of dozens and dozens of

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Speaker 2: American journalists day in and day out to speak on

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Speaker 2: behalf of the president. Before we get two tda's chats

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Speaker 2: with the White House, though, Billy. What is making headlines today?

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Speaker 3: The Australian Federal Police have accused seven people of running

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Speaker 3: a money laundering operation allegedly worth two hundred and twenty

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Speaker 3: nine million dollars. Three Australian citizens and four Chinese nationals

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Speaker 3: were charged for their alleged involvement in the money laundering syndicate,

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Speaker 3: which the AFP say was the most complex investigation in

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Speaker 3: national history and just a reminder. Money laundering is a

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Speaker 3: practice of cleaning money obtained through illegal activities to make

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Speaker 3: it appear as though it came from legitimate dealings.

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Speaker 2: A city in the US state of Maine has been

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Speaker 2: put into lockdown following a mass shooting resulting in multiple fatalities.

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Speaker 2: At least twenty two people were killed in Lewistown, Maine

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Speaker 2: on Wednesday night. US time. Police have identified a forty

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Speaker 2: year old man as a person of interest, and this

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Speaker 2: will come up in today's Deep Dive.

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Speaker 3: A twenty one year old woman has been found dead

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Speaker 3: at a school in Sydney. The woman's death is being

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Speaker 3: treated by police as a homicide. Her body was discovered

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Speaker 3: on Wednesday evening at St. Andrew's Cathedral School, where she

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Speaker 3: had been working as a water polo coach. Police are

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Speaker 3: searching for one person of.

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Speaker 2: Interest and the good news trams in Melbourne are set

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Speaker 2: to become more accessible from next year twelve additional level

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Speaker 2: access tram stops will be built in the Melbourne CBD,

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Speaker 2: which will help elderly passengers and those with young children

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Speaker 2: step onto the trams.

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Speaker 4: Good morning, it's Sam and I am in the White

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Speaker 4: House in Washington, DC to cover Prime Minister Anthony Alberesi's

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Speaker 4: US state visit. Now, Albanizi was here for a four

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Speaker 4: day visit to Washington, culminating in a state dinner at

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Speaker 4: the White House last night. Now, a state visit is

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Speaker 4: not just any leader visit to the White House. It's

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Speaker 4: almost like the whole of Washington completely shuts down. There's

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Speaker 4: another nation's flag next to the US flag across the city,

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Speaker 4: and the White House itself transforms into a place where

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Speaker 4: multiple ceremonies and functions are held over a really compact

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Speaker 4: two or three day period. It's a really big deal.

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Speaker 4: Albanizi is actually only the third Australian Prime minister in

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Speaker 4: twenty years to receive this honor. Now, when a PM

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Speaker 4: travels overseas, he almost always takes a press pack with him,

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Speaker 4: and what that means is it's a group of traveling

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Speaker 4: Australian media that follow the PM and cover his or

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Speaker 4: her movements for our audiences back home. Now, for the

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Speaker 4: first time ever, the Daily Oz was part of that

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Speaker 4: traveling Australian press pack. But you know us, we didn't

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Speaker 4: want to just be part of the pack. We wanted

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Speaker 4: to do something a bit different. So over the last

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Speaker 4: few weeks we've been working really hard at securing some

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Speaker 4: interviews while we were at the White House. From when

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Speaker 4: we started the conversations with the White House to when

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Speaker 4: we actually were in DC this week, the news agenda

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Speaker 4: and therefore what we want us to talk about in

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Speaker 4: the interviews totally shifted. Though major news events like the

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Speaker 4: growing conflict in Israel and Gaza or the leadership dramas

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Speaker 4: on Capitol Hill may not directly affect the US Australia relationship,

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Speaker 4: it undoubtedly forms a context that is impossible to ignore

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Speaker 4: when you're visiting arguably the most powerful leader in the

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Speaker 4: most powerful building in the world. So when I got

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Speaker 4: the opportunity to sit down with two of President Joe

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Speaker 4: Biden's most important White House officials. That's Press Secretary Kaurin

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Speaker 4: John Pierre and National Security Council spokesperson John Kirby. I

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Speaker 4: wanted to ensure that I didn't just ask them about

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Speaker 4: the US Australia relationship, but about that wider context now,

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Speaker 4: to be honest, and I haven't seen this anywhere else,

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Speaker 4: so I'm comfortable ish making this claim. These are the

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Speaker 4: only one on one interviews secured by an Australian outlet

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Speaker 4: during this state visit. That is pretty cool and that's

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Speaker 4: something we're really proud of, and I think it's a

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Speaker 4: testament to the journalism TDA works so hard to bring

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Speaker 4: you every single day. First, I sat down with Admiral

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Speaker 4: John Kirby. He's the spokesperson for the National Security Council.

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Speaker 4: In other words, it's his job to convey the views

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Speaker 4: of President Biden and the White House on all things

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Speaker 4: foreign policy, global and domestic security and the military. My

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Speaker 4: focus with him for this interview was on the Israel

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Speaker 4: Gaza conflicts. Here's that chat. Admiral Kraby, thank you for

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Speaker 4: joining us at the Daily OS.

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Speaker 5: You bet glad to be here.

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Speaker 4: I was really interested to hear in your press briefing today,

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Speaker 4: you explore the differences between a ceasefire and humanitarian pause.

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Speaker 4: Can you explain the difference between the two and what

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Speaker 4: you're advocating for at the moment.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, what we're talking about with the humanitarian pause is

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Speaker 5: temporary lapses in localized places to allow assistance to get

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Speaker 5: in or for people to leave. It's really a question

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Speaker 5: of duration and scale and size and localized temporary for

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Speaker 5: discreete purposes to again allow people to get access to

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Speaker 5: them life saving medical care, or food and water, or

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Speaker 5: a chance to leave.

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Speaker 6: A ceasefire is.

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Speaker 5: You know, basically just everybody putting their arms down for

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Speaker 5: a little bit and stop in the fighting. And I

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Speaker 5: understand the attractiveness of that idea, we all do. But

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Speaker 5: right now, a ceasefire only benefits hamas it gives them

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Speaker 5: the time and the space to do more preparation to

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Speaker 5: conduct more attacks. It gives them exactly what they what

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Speaker 5: they've been asking for.

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Speaker 4: Wouldn't also benefit the Palestinian people who are getting rockets

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Speaker 4: to them as well?

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Speaker 5: If the purpose of this operation in this campaign is

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Speaker 5: to go after hamas leadership, to disable and defeat their

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Speaker 5: ability to do the kinds of things that they did

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Speaker 5: on October seventh. Then we don't believe now is the

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Speaker 5: time to lighten up and to give them breathing, breathing

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Speaker 5: space and time. We just don't.

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Speaker 4: The thing that I've been thinking about over the last

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Speaker 4: couple of weeks is just how far back this has

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Speaker 4: set the world in terms of finding a peaceful solution

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Speaker 4: to Israel, Gaza Palestine.

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Speaker 5: And that's why the President's been working so hard to

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Speaker 5: get to a two state solution. And if we can

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Speaker 5: get to a two state solution so that the Palestinians

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Speaker 5: can live in equal justice, peace, security and independence as

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Speaker 5: their Israeli neighbors, then that is an achievablelocome that maybe, okay,

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Speaker 5: maybe you're right. Maybe this generation of babies being born

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Speaker 5: now won't know anything different.

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Speaker 6: I'll concede that.

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Speaker 5: But maybe the generation after them, or the one after them,

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Speaker 5: there could be a different future.

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Speaker 6: And it would be criminal if negligent if.

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Speaker 5: International foreign leaders, now including President Biden, didn't try to

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Speaker 5: keep working to.

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Speaker 4: That outcome is the US and its allies including Australia,

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Speaker 4: about to go to war in the Middle East. Nobody

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Speaker 4: wants to see that happen.

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Speaker 5: And everything that President Biden is doing, and I mean

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Speaker 5: everything is to try to prevent that outcome. We do

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Speaker 5: not want to see this conflict widen or escalator. We

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Speaker 5: have sent that message loud and clear to everybody in

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Speaker 5: the region and to those parties who might think that

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Speaker 5: there might be advantage in trying to escalate here, and

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Speaker 5: we've backed that up with additional military capabilities.

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Speaker 4: So you're ready but holding back.

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Speaker 5: The message is if you're thinking about jumping in and

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Speaker 5: widening and escalating this, don't do it. As one two,

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Speaker 5: we have serious national security interests in the region and

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Speaker 5: we mean to protect them and defend them, and we will.

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Speaker 4: Admiral Kirby, thank you for joining the Daily Odds.

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Speaker 7: My pleasure.

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Speaker 4: Thank you now. After speaking with Admiral Kirby, I then

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Speaker 4: sat down with Carin John Pierre. She's the White House

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Speaker 4: Press Secretary and her job is to be the mouthpiece

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Speaker 4: for the president. You'd probably recognize her if you search

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Speaker 4: her online. She's the one who stands in front of

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Speaker 4: the media every single day at the White House Press briefing.

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Speaker 4: This is one of the toughest jobs I think in politics.

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Speaker 4: She's grilled by a pack of American journalists for sometimes

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Speaker 4: after two hours on everything on the President's agenda. When

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Speaker 4: I sat down with her one on one, I wanted

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Speaker 4: to ask her not just about the reason for our visit,

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Speaker 4: but about the big issues facing Americans. Press Secretary, thank

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Speaker 4: you for joining the Daily Arts.

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Speaker 6: Thanks Sam, thanks for having me, and welcome, Welcome to the.

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Speaker 4: Way, Thank you, thanks for having me at the White House.

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Speaker 6: Is this your first time here?

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Speaker 4: First time at the White House? I've stood outside the

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Speaker 4: gates once before looking in, but now it's very cool

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Speaker 4: to beach.

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Speaker 6: As a visitor or protest.

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Speaker 4: Visitor. You have one of the hardest jobs, I think

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Speaker 4: in the building or the press secretary for the president.

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Speaker 4: What's your metric of success? How do you know you're

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Speaker 4: doing a good job.

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Speaker 7: Well, first, let me just say it is an honor

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Speaker 7: and a privilege to have this job and a stone

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Speaker 7: throw away from the Oval Office. It's never lost on

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Speaker 7: me and how big the job is and how important

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Speaker 7: it is to be the voice for the president, to

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Speaker 7: be the press secretary, to be able to speak to

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Speaker 7: what he's trying to do or how he's trying to

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Speaker 7: deliver for the American people every day. And so I

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Speaker 7: measure it in the way of making sure that I

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Speaker 7: communicate effectively with the people in front of me, right,

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Speaker 7: the people in the press briefing room, but also to

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Speaker 7: the American people.

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Speaker 6: I always look at it beyond beyond.

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Speaker 7: The press briefing room, because that's important and so that's

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Speaker 7: how I measure it. How are people getting that information,

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Speaker 7: if they're hearing us, and if we're communicating that effectively.

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Speaker 4: I want to go through a couple of topics. Yeah, today,

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Speaker 4: I want to start with the US Australia relationship.

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Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, which is important, important to the press.

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Speaker 4: But there's been some pushback from Republicans against some elements

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Speaker 4: of the aucust steal. Do you and the President anticipate

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Speaker 4: that's going to continue to be pushbacks at every step

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Speaker 4: in the process.

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Speaker 7: So we think there's been great success and great progress

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Speaker 7: with AUCUS. The President, as you know, has asked for

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Speaker 7: three point two billion dollars through Congress to continue that relationship,

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Speaker 7: continue building on AUCUS, and so looks we think it's

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Speaker 7: been successful. We think there's continued to progress to be made.

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Speaker 7: If you think about a free and open Indo Pacific,

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Speaker 7: that is incredibly important and that's what you're going to

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Speaker 7: see while the Prime Minister is here these next day

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Speaker 7: or two. But look, Aucus is important. We've seen progress

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Speaker 7: and success in Aucus. The President's going to continue to

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Speaker 7: push that forward, and we're hoping that we can get

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Speaker 7: Republicans on board and get some biparties to support on

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Speaker 7: this and.

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Speaker 4: Some of the plans around the orchest agreement multi decade Yeah,

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Speaker 4: you know were they're on even going to be executed

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Speaker 4: in twenty fifteen.

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Speaker 6: Beyond us, yeah, beyond us.

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Speaker 4: Is there faith that the orchestraal will survive a change

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Speaker 4: in government?

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Speaker 6: We get that conversation.

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Speaker 7: Even on domestic domestic legislation that we've gotten past and

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Speaker 7: the President has signed it to law.

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Speaker 6: Do we do?

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Speaker 7: We feel that that's going to continue within with other administration, right.

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Speaker 7: And I think that's why it's so important to implement

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Speaker 7: these now and start the process on these on these

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Speaker 7: types of agreements or deals or domestic legislation, because one,

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Speaker 7: once they get implemented, and once the American people see

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Speaker 7: the value and legislators see the value in them and

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Speaker 7: how it changes people's lives or protects our national security

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Speaker 7: or really make it into Pacific free and open.

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Speaker 6: I think it's hard to pull back on it.

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Speaker 4: We thought it was hard to pull back from major

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Speaker 4: climate agreements and all that kind of thing in the

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Speaker 4: previous administration should otherwise. So yeah, well, I guess we

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Speaker 4: can't take that for granted.

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Speaker 7: We can't take it for granted. You're a thousand percent correct.

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Speaker 7: We can't take it for granted. But that's why we

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Speaker 7: have to implement and do the work so people can

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Speaker 7: see the value in what the president's trying to do.

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Speaker 4: I get the sense that the US government is dealing

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Speaker 4: with a number of crises on the number of fronts,

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Speaker 4: whether they're economic or as we've seen in the last

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Speaker 4: couple of weeks, in fact, you know, geopolitical and international.

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Speaker 4: Is there any bandwidth for the Biden administration to continue

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Speaker 4: focusing on climate. Oh, absolutely, even though there's all of

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Speaker 4: these other distractions that perhaps more urgent.

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Speaker 7: Sam I say this all the time. This is the

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Speaker 7: President of the United States. He is a commander. He

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Speaker 7: has to do multiple things at once. That is the job,

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Speaker 7: to do multiple things at once, whether he's doing commander

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Speaker 7: in chief work like meeting with the Prime Minister of

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Speaker 7: Australia this week, dealing with what's happening in Israel, dealing

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Speaker 7: with what's happening in Ukraine and much more or domestically,

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Speaker 7: and he has been from day one has called climate

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Speaker 7: change an existential threat, an existential threat, and so he

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Speaker 7: is absolutely committed to continuing to do that work.

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Speaker 6: But you're right, there.

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Speaker 7: Are so many crisis sadly that we have to deal with.

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Speaker 7: But that's the job, that is literally the job of

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Speaker 7: the president.

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Speaker 4: And I think young people especially feel the existential nature

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Speaker 4: of the climate threat absolutely. How do you, as the

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Speaker 4: president's chief communicator, try and overcome that helplessness and that

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Speaker 4: lack of hope in a climate context.

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Speaker 7: And it's a great question, which is why we want

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Speaker 7: to hear from young people. It is important for us

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Speaker 7: to continue to hear from young people, continue to make

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Speaker 7: sure that they feel that they have a space or

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Speaker 7: a eat around the table. And look, I think when

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Speaker 7: you look at the president, I don't think any other

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Speaker 7: president has had this type of record, has had this type.

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Speaker 6: Of motivation to deal with a real.

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Speaker 7: Real threat, not just domestically but globally. And so I think,

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Speaker 7: you know, if you look at that, you look at

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Speaker 7: this president's record, you look at what he's done in

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Speaker 7: this presidency and also with the Obama Biden administration, this

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Speaker 7: is a president that cares about climate change and has

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Speaker 7: taken it incredibly seriously.

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Speaker 4: Let's flick around a couple of kind of US hot topics.

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Speaker 4: Gun control. Yeah, yeah, just wanted to quickly jump in here.

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Speaker 4: There's one important note. We recorded this interview two days ago,

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Speaker 4: and yesterday there was a major mass shooting in the

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Speaker 4: US state of Maine. Now, the Press Secretary obviously didn't

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Speaker 4: have an opportunity to address this tragedy in our interview.

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Speaker 4: And it's clear the Biden administration and future administrations on

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Speaker 4: either side of politics, has a lot of work to

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Speaker 4: do on gun reform in the US. It's unfathomable to

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Speaker 4: it's unfathomable most Australians that there's such a high level

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Speaker 4: of gun violence here twelve months ish out from the

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Speaker 4: end of President Biden's first term. Does the administration feel

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Speaker 4: like they've achieved what they wanted to achieve in terms

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Speaker 4: of gun control.

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Speaker 7: So I'll say this, and I agree with you, it's

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Speaker 7: an epidemic here. Gun violence, sadly in the US is

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Speaker 7: an epidemic. It's the number one killer of our kids,

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Speaker 7: and that's serious. The President has taken multiple actions. He

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Speaker 7: was able to sign the first major piece of legislation

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Speaker 7: in thirty years in dealing with gun violence. It was

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Speaker 7: done in bipartisanship. That was done last year. So I

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Speaker 7: think that we've seen certainly some effect there. And then

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Speaker 7: just recently we announced the first which is historic, the

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Speaker 7: first Office of to Prevent gun violence, gun Violence Prevention Office.

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Speaker 6: That is a big deal.

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Speaker 7: And so the President has taken historic action and I

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Speaker 7: think we're starting to see some of the effects of

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Speaker 7: the work that he's done and the actions that he's taken.

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Speaker 7: But it does not stop the fact that there's a

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Speaker 7: lot more work to be done.

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Speaker 4: One of the other big differences is turning. Australia and

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Speaker 4: America is compulsory voting, and in the US you have

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Speaker 4: this extra step of having to convince younger Americans to

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Speaker 4: actually turn up to the polls. How are you in

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Speaker 4: your position going to do that?

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Speaker 7: So one thing I can say is going to be careful.

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Speaker 7: Can't talk about electoral politics. I can't even talk about

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Speaker 7: voting or turnout or anything like that. But what I

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Speaker 7: can say is in twenty twenty, the president, I think

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Speaker 7: eighty one million people voted for him. He was able

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Speaker 7: to put together the most diverse electorate right to vote

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Speaker 7: for him, and that includes young people came out as well,

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Speaker 7: and so.

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Speaker 6: That matters.

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Speaker 4: Do you think voting should be compulsory.

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Speaker 7: I'm going to be super careful and not speak to

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Speaker 7: anything forthcoming in the next electoral cycle, but I can

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Speaker 7: say is that voting is incredibly important, and voting rights

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Speaker 7: is under attack in this country, and the present is

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Speaker 7: going to continue to fight for that as well.

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Speaker 4: Frien John Pierre, thank you so much for joining us,

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Speaker 4: Thank you for inviting us to the White House.

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Speaker 6: Del This was fun, I'll see so thank you so much.

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Speaker 3: This was such a special episode of the daly Os.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much for listening. If you learned something

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Speaker 3: from this episode and you're listening on Apple Podcasts, it

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Speaker 7: The word out.

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Speaker 3: Just go to our show page and tap the writer

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Speaker 3: the daly Os, and we will be back next week.