WEBVTT - Dean Corll: The Candyman 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:04.120 Don't take candy from strangers. It's one of the first 0:00:04.120 --> 0:00:07.320 things you learn as a kid. What if the man 0:00:07.480 --> 0:00:12.240 handing out sweets actually made them himself. Well, families would 0:00:12.280 --> 0:00:14.520 most likely think that this is a kind of a 0:00:14.560 --> 0:00:18.200 Willy Wonka type figure who was just doing business. But 0:00:18.680 --> 0:00:22.480 as it turned out, this man was Dean Coral, a 0:00:22.520 --> 0:00:27.560 man who between nineteen seventy and nineteen seventy three killed 0:00:27.640 --> 0:00:33.160 upwards of twenty eight boys age between thirteen and twenty. 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:36.680 This is the case of Dean Coral, the candy man. 0:00:37.159 --> 0:00:38.240 Oh, the candyman. 0:00:38.680 --> 0:00:42.080 Can't hey nice one? We harmonized in a joke. 0:01:06.480 --> 0:01:10.680 We both write to start It's not welcome to not 0:01:10.760 --> 0:01:11.960 another crime podcast. 0:01:12.080 --> 0:01:14.880 I'm George Dellow, I'm Sammy Peters, I'm a journalist. I 0:01:14.920 --> 0:01:16.400 am not. But I'll tell you what if you were 0:01:16.480 --> 0:01:18.959 to skip ahead and just listen to the story, go 0:01:19.080 --> 0:01:21.880 right ahead and do that. The time code is in 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:24.440 the show notes. But can I say you're not gonna 0:01:24.440 --> 0:01:25.240 want to do it this week? 0:01:25.360 --> 0:01:26.720 No? Can I tell her? 0:01:27.319 --> 0:01:27.919 No? 0:01:28.200 --> 0:01:31.960 Can I tell the listeners what? Ol friend Taylor said? 0:01:32.319 --> 0:01:36.800 Shout out high Taylor. If you're listening and you this episode, 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:40.120 she will She's she's okay. So Taylor works with me, 0:01:40.920 --> 0:01:43.319 and she has told me that she loves our podcast, 0:01:43.720 --> 0:01:45.280 but she loves the most messed. 0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:46.720 Up stories your best. 0:01:46.800 --> 0:01:49.559 And she says sometimes the ones that don't have really 0:01:49.560 --> 0:01:50.840 gruesome details are boring. 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:53.480 Yeah, it's it's not nice to say boring. 0:01:53.600 --> 0:01:56.240 No, but what she has said. 0:01:56.640 --> 0:02:00.200 That tweet that's like imagine dying in a horrific way 0:02:00.200 --> 0:02:01.160 and someone skips over it. 0:02:02.480 --> 0:02:05.840 That episode of the podcast is boring because that is Taylor. 0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:08.280 She met Taylor. By the way, Can I just say 0:02:08.280 --> 0:02:10.720 that Taylor sent me a very funny It was like 0:02:10.760 --> 0:02:14.280 a meme of like a a survey after meeting someone, 0:02:14.360 --> 0:02:15.880 going did you like me? Or with friends? 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:18.520 Yeah, that's good bye. 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:19.480 Yeah. 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:22.760 She said that there is another crime podcast that she's 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:29.120 always loved called Morbid, which HS well and when she said, oh, 0:02:29.120 --> 0:02:30.600 I don't know if I can listen to yours, because 0:02:30.639 --> 0:02:32.400 I love Morbid so much. And she said to us 0:02:32.440 --> 0:02:37.320 the other night that now she finds the Morbid chat 0:02:37.400 --> 0:02:40.120 up top really boring because ours is so good and 0:02:40.200 --> 0:02:42.520 she loves that so much. So no offense to the 0:02:42.560 --> 0:02:44.120 girls from Morbid, but we're more. 0:02:44.080 --> 0:02:46.320 On than yeah, absolutely, well, anything else we have got 0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:48.640 attitude and energy. That's what we always bring. We bring attitude. 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:52.280 We bring energy every since goddamn week, and you. 0:02:52.280 --> 0:02:54.200 Can back I always bring attitude. I don't know if 0:02:54.200 --> 0:02:55.040 I always bring energy. 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:58.000 Well, look as we went through the story, your energy 0:02:58.120 --> 0:03:01.400 to drop off a little bit because sorry is awful. 0:03:01.840 --> 0:03:06.480 We're recording this intro straight after we recorded their story proper. 0:03:06.639 --> 0:03:11.320 And that's why I was confident the story proper story. 0:03:11.440 --> 0:03:15.240 I thought it was your new story proper like I 0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:16.679 did a hand, yes, yessay, just say no, it's like 0:03:16.680 --> 0:03:20.919 a gang story proper or I went met Taylor the 0:03:20.960 --> 0:03:22.440 other day, which was so much fun. We went to 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:23.280 and I was. 0:03:23.200 --> 0:03:27.000 Like, may I say, we're not wink talking about Taylor 0:03:27.040 --> 0:03:27.880 swift Wink. 0:03:28.120 --> 0:03:30.960 Oh yeah, we were not hanging out with Taylor swift 0:03:31.080 --> 0:03:34.639 Wink in Elwood the other day. But yeah, So I 0:03:34.720 --> 0:03:37.760 had not met Taylor before. Loved Taylor. But I said 0:03:37.760 --> 0:03:39.760 to you before because at the end of the year 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:43.720 we've had both had huge years. And I said to you, 0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:45.320 I'm only going to go for one drink. I can't. 0:03:45.640 --> 0:03:45.880 Yeah. 0:03:46.080 --> 0:03:48.600 Another mutual friend of ours was having her like annual 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:50.280 Christmas house. 0:03:50.520 --> 0:03:52.320 Yes, and I said, I can only go for one drink. 0:03:52.320 --> 0:03:56.080 I'm too tired. We stayed so much. I went in 0:03:56.120 --> 0:03:58.080 pretty hot to that party and we had a great time. 0:03:57.880 --> 0:03:59.760 In real hot. You were the one that said, I 0:03:59.800 --> 0:04:02.160 don't I can't stay longer than probably won drink. 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:02.800 I'm going to drive. 0:04:02.840 --> 0:04:03.400 I'm so tired. 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:04.920 I was like, that's fine, that's fine. 0:04:04.920 --> 0:04:06.680 Maybe you do what you want to do. And then 0:04:06.840 --> 0:04:09.160 I was the one saying to you when we were 0:04:09.240 --> 0:04:12.520 walking to a bar after our friends plays, I don't 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:13.640 think I'm want to go to the bar. I want 0:04:13.680 --> 0:04:15.920 to go home, and you were like, well, come on, one drink, 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:19.880 more drink and Taylor doesn't even remember the bar. 0:04:21.960 --> 0:04:23.840 But yeah, but so much fun. But yeah. We ended 0:04:23.920 --> 0:04:27.039 up playing this card game for a long time. Any 0:04:27.320 --> 0:04:29.479 someone brings out a card game and everyone went. 0:04:29.800 --> 0:04:32.120 No, yes, because of my calling it a card game, 0:04:32.160 --> 0:04:36.640 you're making it sound like it was like it. No, 0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:38.280 you make it sound like she brought out a deck 0:04:38.320 --> 0:04:40.360 of cards and then we're playing a game. No. The 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:44.360 card game was called Stir the Pot, and the cards 0:04:44.400 --> 0:04:46.880 are it's just a bunch of cards that have questions 0:04:46.880 --> 0:04:49.720 on them to ask the group designed to stir the pot, 0:04:49.720 --> 0:04:52.560 which is the worst idea for a game ever, and 0:04:52.560 --> 0:04:55.720 our friend whose house it was at like everyone had 0:04:55.839 --> 0:04:57.920 just arround. Everyone was stone hold sober. It was the 0:04:57.960 --> 0:05:00.200 middle of the day, it was like light sunlight, and 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:03.480 she brought out this game and started reading out questions 0:05:03.760 --> 0:05:06.599 that were things like who who in the group looks 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:09.960 the most like they need a shower. And she kept 0:05:10.000 --> 0:05:12.080 reading out these questions and I was just looking at her, 0:05:12.520 --> 0:05:14.760 like back to the whole group, saying, hey, this is 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:15.960 about idea, this is about it. 0:05:16.279 --> 0:05:17.320 We shouldn't play this. 0:05:17.320 --> 0:05:19.400 This is a bad idea, This is a bad idia, 0:05:19.480 --> 0:05:21.479 this is a bad idea, and she just kept looking 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:23.800 at and asking what questions. 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:25.560 I love that it was. It was so much fun. 0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:27.279 It was it was a real fun time. But I 0:05:27.360 --> 0:05:30.640 also went to the wrong and it was I went 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:35.200 to the wrong house. I didn't look at the numbers, 0:05:35.200 --> 0:05:37.159 and I convinced myself, I don't know what it was 0:05:37.160 --> 0:05:38.680 about me, I just because I'm not I don't think 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:41.560 I'm a very stubborn person. I was just standing outside 0:05:41.600 --> 0:05:43.479 someone else's house, going this is it. 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:46.120 And not checking the message where she had told you 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:49.920 what addressed. And then later when I looked at I 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:52.600 had a message from you going George, I can't get in. 0:05:52.640 --> 0:05:55.520 How do I get in? Like really angrily? You read 0:05:55.560 --> 0:05:57.359 the wrong fu it, house mate, I don't know what 0:05:57.440 --> 0:05:58.320 to tell you. 0:05:58.800 --> 0:06:01.479 Is not moving like maybe I should just check the numbers. 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:04.960 Real bizarre move. I don't really understand that move still 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:07.719 to this day came the strange. But also I can't 0:06:07.720 --> 0:06:11.040 say this really quickly. I had a great experience recently 0:06:11.520 --> 0:06:14.800 where I was walking the other day to you know, 0:06:15.279 --> 0:06:19.479 refill so I got my anti anxiety medication, not the 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:22.760 pro anxiety medication, but the anti anxiety medication. Where I 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:26.279 was like getting I told I told you recently a 0:06:26.320 --> 0:06:31.320 pet peeve is refilling the script because because it costs 0:06:31.360 --> 0:06:33.200 ninety dollars when you do it, and it was just 0:06:33.240 --> 0:06:35.440 a tally heal thing to get the thing. Anyway, So 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:37.040 I'm on the way to the chemist and I was 0:06:37.080 --> 0:06:39.680 thinking on the way, how great would it be if 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:42.760 I could get my six months of medication right then 0:06:42.800 --> 0:06:45.520 and there, like not not have to go every time 0:06:46.160 --> 0:06:49.880 and get my thing. So the the I was going 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:52.160 to say that the I'm not a dog. 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:55.039 The did you think you went there? 0:06:55.160 --> 0:07:00.480 Yeah? Maybe the pharmacist looks at me and goes, how annoying. 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:03.760 Is it? What do you come every every month or whatever? 0:07:03.760 --> 0:07:05.320 I'm like, yeah, I come come once a month and 0:07:05.360 --> 0:07:08.520 everything and he goes, winks at me, gives me six 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:09.400 months worth? Right then? 0:07:09.960 --> 0:07:10.080 Is that? 0:07:10.240 --> 0:07:13.480 Yeah? Is that allowed? I don't know. It was fantastic 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:17.040 and I got into that and really expensive as well. 0:07:17.560 --> 0:07:20.800 There's a redacted part of this Introy you guys why. 0:07:22.480 --> 0:07:24.800 He gave it all to me? And I was like, 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:27.000 this is you had no one? But this was like 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:28.920 this is actually pretty damn cool. 0:07:28.960 --> 0:07:31.280 I feel like there's a reason they Don'tkay, well, that's 0:07:32.880 --> 0:07:34.840 where it was lucky you just went to the Maybe 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:38.080 that's why, because the VET give you whatever they want. 0:07:38.160 --> 0:07:44.600 That's right. I got my flea medication? Have you? Yeah? 0:07:44.640 --> 0:07:44.880 Once? 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:49.160 Really what happened? I just got and one of the 0:07:49.200 --> 0:07:51.440 great stories for me to tell you that I want 0:07:51.480 --> 0:07:54.680 to tell you this really quickly. This this episode is 0:07:54.800 --> 0:07:59.160 really really full on. There's a warning in it. Any way. 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:00.920 I tried to do some fun stuff I've talked about 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:03.160 talking about lollies and stuff because it's it's called the 0:08:03.560 --> 0:08:07.480 candy Man, and when I was little, I was a huge, 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:09.200 huge lolly fan. 0:08:09.280 --> 0:08:11.600 I loved eating can Okay, we're just playing a game 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:16.640 of name things that are obvious, are we what? Every 0:08:16.720 --> 0:08:17.440 kid love Lolli. 0:08:17.600 --> 0:08:20.400 You know, I'm not a sweet tooth now, so it's like, yeah, 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:21.320 so take that back. 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:22.560 I take it back. I'm sorry. 0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:25.720 So I love Lolly so much. And there was also 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:29.000 a point where I loved them when I was a kid. 0:08:29.040 --> 0:08:31.440 And also, like, I go swimming and I was in 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:34.600 the swim squad and you used to get killer pythons 0:08:34.640 --> 0:08:36.360 and they used to like hand them to you in 0:08:36.400 --> 0:08:39.920 the pool. 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:41.760 So we should do that as a story. 0:08:41.760 --> 0:08:43.720 That'd be fun. But yeah, so I just eat them 0:08:43.760 --> 0:08:45.200 in the pool and everything and just have like the 0:08:45.240 --> 0:08:48.199 greatst day of weird times in our lives. But I 0:08:48.280 --> 0:08:49.280 used to have it. And I don't know if I've 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:51.360 talked about this on the podcast before, so please correct 0:08:51.360 --> 0:08:53.679 me if I already have. But I to have ever 0:08:53.760 --> 0:08:57.040 talked you about my dad's book that Okay. So in 0:08:57.520 --> 0:09:01.000 on Philip Island, in the place called New Haven, which 0:09:01.040 --> 0:09:04.960 is like where the high school and primary school. So 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:07.600 my dad worked at the primary school and up the 0:09:07.760 --> 0:09:10.400 road from the primary school there was just a shop. 0:09:10.800 --> 0:09:12.480 It wasn't an i ga, but it was very much 0:09:12.559 --> 0:09:16.360 like an IgA like a small grocery dependent. Yeah, they 0:09:16.400 --> 0:09:18.800 just had like a wall of Lolly's. And I found 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:20.760 out once that my dad had this thing called the 0:09:20.800 --> 0:09:24.360 book where it was just a tab where you could 0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:26.400 go and he would just not pay at the time, 0:09:26.720 --> 0:09:29.080 but just write in the book. And he would just write, 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:32.280 like you know, Harley that day and everything signed it off. 0:09:32.400 --> 0:09:33.959 At the end of the month, they would send out 0:09:33.960 --> 0:09:37.160 a little I've found he had this book then. I 0:09:37.200 --> 0:09:40.000 didn't know so, yeah, it was a tab. I didn't 0:09:40.040 --> 0:09:41.800 know that, Dad, you had to pay for the book. 0:09:42.400 --> 0:09:47.040 You just thought, well lollies, you kid. 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:49.199 You just thought. You didn't think about the fact that 0:09:49.280 --> 0:09:50.719 one day he would have to pay for it. 0:09:50.880 --> 0:09:52.599 I didn't know that, but I didn't understand what a 0:09:52.600 --> 0:09:55.960 credit card was. Mum had like a car. Yeah, I 0:09:56.000 --> 0:09:56.640 was like, what, you. 0:09:56.559 --> 0:09:57.920 Can just get get stuff. 0:09:58.120 --> 0:09:59.520 They send you things if you just ta. 0:10:00.040 --> 0:10:01.360 I didn't teach me lessons. 0:10:01.520 --> 0:10:03.960 I still think of online shopping like that, like this 0:10:04.040 --> 0:10:05.800 is amazing numbers. 0:10:07.440 --> 0:10:10.000 It doesn't make any sense to me. Your friends take 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:14.400 all my friends and we Adrian and Davin, Zach, we'd 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:16.960 all go up to the shop and I would say, 0:10:17.000 --> 0:10:20.880 whatever you want. My dad's got a book God, and 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:24.079 so we would get like Maxi bonds, so you get 0:10:24.080 --> 0:10:26.640 some ice creams, you get like you have a bag 0:10:26.720 --> 0:10:29.040 and you're basically just and you get weighed so like 0:10:29.080 --> 0:10:32.520 the way on the scales and so whatever it was, 0:10:32.880 --> 0:10:35.240 you would and I'll go, it's on me. Anyway. One 0:10:35.320 --> 0:10:38.199 time I was in the shop and there's like, I 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:40.120 also love it when someone goes and going down the shops. 0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:42.080 I think it's such an Australian thing to say, but 0:10:42.120 --> 0:10:44.360 there's like, so there's four of us kids lined up 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:49.679 and a man has a basket of groceries and it's 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:52.319 like milk, bread, whatever. He's got a full basket of 0:10:52.360 --> 0:10:55.600 his groceries. And I said, my friends are with me. 0:10:56.400 --> 0:10:59.520 And then I said to the man, put on the book. 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:04.160 The man you didn't in the book, and the and 0:11:04.240 --> 0:11:08.160 Graham at the store went, no, Sam, you can't put 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:10.920 it on the book. That's your dad's book. And he 0:11:10.960 --> 0:11:12.400 pays for it. And then I went, what do you 0:11:12.480 --> 0:11:17.520 mean I found out in that moment. Yeah, and then 0:11:17.640 --> 0:11:19.559 dad got the book because I was so nervous to 0:11:19.559 --> 0:11:21.760 tell him, even though my dad has never raised his 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:24.240 voice in his life, but if it was ever going, 0:11:24.440 --> 0:11:29.240 oh yeah, and yeah, so he showed me and it 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:33.480 just said in the court of like Zach Tyron Adrian 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:36.200 had just signed off on their own suites. It was 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:39.600 so funny. So they had to change the while Graham 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:42.520 letting you do this. I don't know, it was so funny. 0:11:42.679 --> 0:11:46.560 The other great thing about this shop once that I 0:11:46.640 --> 0:11:50.440 there was a some sort of promotional thing going for 0:11:50.480 --> 0:11:54.400 a while with like pizza shapes, and it was like 0:11:54.400 --> 0:11:55.280 you get a free. 0:11:55.040 --> 0:11:56.880 One Australian. 0:11:58.040 --> 0:12:01.560 Astralian, Yeah, barbecue definitely, but I do wonder if pizza 0:12:01.640 --> 0:12:04.439 shapes are different. Yeah, but yeah, so you would basically 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:06.760 in that you could win a free pack at And 0:12:06.960 --> 0:12:09.760 what they shop didn't know is that all of them 0:12:09.800 --> 0:12:13.840 were free because they got a bad bunch and every 0:12:13.840 --> 0:12:16.000 single one. So we would go in and get one, 0:12:16.080 --> 0:12:18.520 open it, take it back in, get another one. With 0:12:18.559 --> 0:12:21.920 thirty boxes of pizza, it was a pretty good. 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:25.360 Day, young boys. You just would have eaten them all 0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:28.319 rather than going, oh, how like we can have. 0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:31.360 These not all at once. But we also had to 0:12:31.400 --> 0:12:34.200 open the bag to get the foil bags. It was 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:38.200 like you could even save it because it was we 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:41.640 opened all these bags of pizza, Shank and the Sacon 0:12:41.720 --> 0:12:45.760 our place. It was a great time. That's so good. 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:50.480 I think that Graham from the shop down the road 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:54.320 in New Haven needs to have a stain talking allowing 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:54.800 kids to. 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:56.720 Put things on the book on the book, I know 0:12:57.120 --> 0:12:58.520 the rules definitely changed after that. 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:02.920 It's very cute that you tried to get some random 0:13:02.920 --> 0:13:03.600 man's grocery. 0:13:06.240 --> 0:13:08.160 Before we get into this week's episode, I want you 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:10.760 to tell a little story about recently when we were 0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:13.960 at a night out and you met a very rude 0:13:14.160 --> 0:13:16.679 lady at the night out when you said hello to 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:17.240 Sam Pang. 0:13:17.920 --> 0:13:22.720 That's right. So we were seeing the comedian Alan Davies, 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:27.520 a British comedian, and at interval of the show, I 0:13:27.640 --> 0:13:32.600 was lining up for the ladies. I had Padermner and 0:13:33.760 --> 0:13:38.240 Sam Pang, who is a very popular, very beloved TV 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:40.920 presenter and comedian and radio host in Australia. 0:13:41.040 --> 0:13:41.520 Does it all. 0:13:41.880 --> 0:13:45.520 He does it all. He walked past and I saw 0:13:45.600 --> 0:13:47.360 him and said hello. We've met each other a number 0:13:47.360 --> 0:13:50.679 of times before, so Sam and he went, oh hi, 0:13:50.840 --> 0:13:52.480 how are you? Came up and gave me a hug 0:13:52.520 --> 0:13:55.120 and kept walking. And then the lady in front of 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:58.600 me in the line for the toilets, goes, mister Pang 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:01.560 like this, and he turned around to look at her 0:14:01.600 --> 0:14:04.000 with a look on his face as if he were 0:14:04.160 --> 0:14:07.520 going to recognize her, and then realized he didn't, so 0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:11.000 his face changed and he just went hello, you know, 0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:16.040 very politely, He's so lovely. But he was kind of 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:18.080 looking like, oh that George must be with someone I 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:20.760 know as well. Oh no she's not. Oh yeah, just 0:14:20.840 --> 0:14:25.040 very polite hello. And then she goes, how's your night, 0:14:25.320 --> 0:14:28.040 and he goes, yeah, good, thanks, and kind of was 0:14:28.040 --> 0:14:32.560 polite and then walking yeah, kept walking. And then this 0:14:32.680 --> 0:14:37.920 lady turned to me with this look of disgust and 0:14:38.080 --> 0:14:44.000 disdain and looked at me, clearly having thought I didn't 0:14:44.080 --> 0:14:46.640 know him. So how he was so friendly and came 0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:49.040 up and gave me a hug. If she called out 0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:51.160 his name, he would do the same to her. When 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:54.200 then she realized that wasn't the case, she turned to 0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:56.720 me with this look on her face, like turned her 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.760 nose up at me and goes, well, should I know 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:00.440 who you are? 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:03.400 Like really angry. 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:06.760 With me that I knew Sampang. It was so funny 0:15:06.800 --> 0:15:08.480 and so bizarre, and I. 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:09.760 Think that we're all doing it now. 0:15:09.960 --> 0:15:11.760 Now everyone's look at me? Should I know? 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:15.480 I know who you are? It's so funny. I love that. 0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:18.680 I like time Sampang. Next time I see you, I 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:20.520 may not say look. So I'm scared of the ladies 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:20.920 around me. 0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:26.400 Ladies around me. This week's episode is a very very 0:15:26.440 --> 0:15:28.960 hard listen. But we would like to also say thank 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:33.280 you for all of your wonderful, wonderful support. We love 0:15:33.360 --> 0:15:36.320 hearing from you. If you want to write in Sami 0:15:36.360 --> 0:15:38.800 at chulsinother coompany dot com dot au, you can leave 0:15:38.880 --> 0:15:42.240 us a voicemail. Links are below in the show notes. 0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:44.920 We'll do that at the end. In the mailbags, you. 0:15:44.680 --> 0:15:48.000 Must leave us a five star review and a five 0:15:48.040 --> 0:15:51.720 star rating. If you didn't like a particular episode, that's 0:15:51.720 --> 0:15:55.320 fine for you to tell us about that, Taylor, if 0:15:55.360 --> 0:15:56.920 you didn't like it's fine for you to tell us 0:15:56.920 --> 0:16:01.240 about that. But dear listeners, if you like the podcast 0:16:01.640 --> 0:16:04.880 but not a particular episode, just tell us and just 0:16:04.960 --> 0:16:06.440 leave us a five star review anyway. 0:16:06.680 --> 0:16:09.160 Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, keep it to yourself. 0:16:09.880 --> 0:16:11.920 I just know, always leave a five star reviews I do. 0:16:12.080 --> 0:16:14.280 I mean, if you didn't like it, keep to yourself. 0:16:14.280 --> 0:16:17.440 But we would love you to help us build this podcast. 0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:19.600 We love doing it, so the more you support it, 0:16:19.680 --> 0:16:22.040 the algorithm works like that if you leave more reviews, 0:16:22.080 --> 0:16:24.360 more ratings and pushes it out to more people. 0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:24.880 That's right. 0:16:24.920 --> 0:16:26.240 You would absolutely love that as well. 0:16:26.760 --> 0:16:28.120 And we love you and you can follow us on 0:16:28.200 --> 0:16:32.280 Instagram and TikTok at. Not another crime podcast, that's right? 0:16:33.320 --> 0:16:35.760 And is there anything else that we want them to know? 0:16:36.480 --> 0:16:40.240 I am doing a I'm doing a show a little 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:43.560 bit trying out new jokes and filming jokes. Are on 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:48.120 the seventeenth of January at two pm in Melbourne St Kilda. 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:51.480 So if you want to come along fun, say like that, 0:16:51.560 --> 0:16:54.680 so killder Melbourne? Is that better? Way? Better? Ten dollar 0:16:54.720 --> 0:16:57.720 tickets the Saint Kilda tap House. 0:16:59.400 --> 0:16:59.640 Six. 0:16:59.720 --> 0:17:01.960 Yeah, it's gonna be great. It's gonna be so much time. 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:04.879 You're planning things for the goddamn future. 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:08.359 Yeah, get your little tikies come along. It's gonna be 0:17:08.359 --> 0:17:10.359 a lot of fun. Come and say hello. I'd love that. 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:12.280 I don't know anything that I'm doing next to you 0:17:12.600 --> 0:17:13.520 have zero plans? 0:17:13.760 --> 0:17:17.640 Yep, Well you'll be there. Ticket links that is below. Okay, 0:17:17.800 --> 0:17:19.360 this is the week's episode of Real. 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:19.760 Thank You. 0:17:21.440 --> 0:17:25.760 Wed Like Goodbye Boddy should I know who you are. 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:37.320 This case is truly disturbing. Before we get into today's episode, 0:17:37.359 --> 0:17:41.159 I'd like to warn listeners with a rather massive, massive warning. 0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:45.600 This case involves the abuse of children, torture, rape, and 0:17:45.760 --> 0:17:51.040 more extremely heavy themes. This is also a brief version 0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:53.720 of the case. There is a lot of further reading 0:17:53.760 --> 0:17:57.119 that I've actually chosen not to talk about here. But 0:17:57.119 --> 0:17:59.840 if anyone wants to read anything further about Dean co 0:18:00.280 --> 0:18:04.920 and that's c o r r l ol r r 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:06.399 l chral. 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:10.120 No other vows. There's only one Valain yeh, chorl lor 0:18:10.320 --> 0:18:11.720 sounds a bit like our pigeon. 0:18:13.040 --> 0:18:16.480 Chral. It's how Americans say Carl Chral. 0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:19.719 Oh yeah, Chral. 0:18:20.080 --> 0:18:22.159 I was just getting confused about what the night it 0:18:22.240 --> 0:18:23.960 really has only got one Valina. 0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:26.560 It's either one, I know, it's one r and two. 0:18:26.640 --> 0:18:30.600 Ls choral coral chral. Yeah, it's like in love. Actually, 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:34.320 when Laurel is coral coral. 0:18:34.400 --> 0:18:35.879 Let me just double check that's how you spell his 0:18:35.920 --> 0:18:40.640 name there, Dean Chral be very funny. Yeah, Dean Chral 0:18:41.280 --> 0:18:43.359 c o r l ol. 0:18:43.520 --> 0:18:46.160 That's really strange. I feel like that started him out 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:46.960 poorly in life. 0:18:47.000 --> 0:19:01.080 Absolutely chorl awesome. It's awesome. Today, Syrial is often referred 0:19:01.080 --> 0:19:03.560 to as the candy man or the pied Piper. 0:19:03.880 --> 0:19:06.800 I don't like either of those. I don't like the candyman, 0:19:06.920 --> 0:19:09.040 especially because I really desperately want to sing. 0:19:09.480 --> 0:19:11.840 Yeah. Maybe at the end you could sing term sing 0:19:11.920 --> 0:19:14.560 us out if you feel like. The Pied Piper of 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:17.760 Hamlet is a legendary figure from a German folk tale 0:19:18.080 --> 0:19:21.640 about a piper in colorful clothes who rids the town 0:19:21.760 --> 0:19:25.320 of rats by luring them away with music. But when 0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:28.840 the townsfolk refuse to pay him, he takes revenge by 0:19:28.960 --> 0:19:32.440 charming their children away, leading them in to a mountain 0:19:32.520 --> 0:19:36.159 where they disappear. I'd also like to go into the 0:19:36.280 --> 0:19:40.240 term candy. Candy is an American term. In the UK, 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:44.200 they're referred to as sloes or confectionery, and in Australia 0:19:44.200 --> 0:19:45.360 we often call them lollies. 0:19:45.480 --> 0:19:48.399 You know that in the UK they call so what 0:19:48.520 --> 0:19:52.480 we call in Australia our term lollies yeap refers to 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:56.760 like hard boiled sweets, like jelly lollies, like in snakes 0:19:56.760 --> 0:20:00.600 stuff the jelly lollies. In the UK they're called harribo Harrabo, 0:20:00.680 --> 0:20:03.720 which Harabo is a brand, but they just call all 0:20:03.760 --> 0:20:05.920 like jelly sweets, harrabos. 0:20:05.320 --> 0:20:08.080 Oh harrabos, they call it yeah, and they just say 0:20:08.119 --> 0:20:09.880 sweets as well. That's a big thing in the UK 0:20:09.960 --> 0:20:13.560 they say sweets. Lolli's is kind of my favorite australianism. 0:20:13.720 --> 0:20:16.000 I used to be absolutely obsessed with lollies. And here's 0:20:16.080 --> 0:20:19.199 a quick definition I found of lollies. Lollies is the 0:20:19.240 --> 0:20:22.000 common term for what Americans call candy and British people 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:26.800 call sweets, referring to any sugar based confectionery like chocolates, gummies, 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:31.080 or hard candies. It's a general term for treats when 0:20:31.080 --> 0:20:34.760 a lolly when a lolly singular is often just one piece, 0:20:34.880 --> 0:20:38.080 though a lollipop sweet on a stick is still called 0:20:38.119 --> 0:20:42.040 a lollipop. The word has been around since the eighteen fifties, 0:20:42.200 --> 0:20:46.040 and in slang, lolly can also mean money or losing 0:20:46.160 --> 0:20:50.240 your temper. Do your lolly, Yeah, it's a British term, 0:20:50.280 --> 0:20:50.720 do your lolly. 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:52.560 I'm also obsessed with the fact that when we sat 0:20:52.600 --> 0:20:54.280 down to record this, you said, if you need to 0:20:54.320 --> 0:20:56.000 break anytime, let me know, because it's a really long 0:20:56.080 --> 0:20:58.680 episode and you've gone into a deep. 0:20:58.760 --> 0:21:03.000 Deep dove. I looked into the phrase don't take candy 0:21:03.040 --> 0:21:07.360 from strangers. It likely originated from the famous eighteen seventy 0:21:07.480 --> 0:21:13.119 four kidnapping of Charles Charlie Ross, America's first recorded ransom kidnapping, 0:21:13.240 --> 0:21:15.280 Oh My God, with a young boy was lured into 0:21:15.320 --> 0:21:19.399 a carriage by men offering candy and fireworks, Charlie and 0:21:19.480 --> 0:21:21.960 the lollly factor. Charlie the loly factor, that's right, leading 0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:25.119 to his disappearance and creating a powerful cautionary tale that 0:21:25.240 --> 0:21:30.120 became a common saying that is very very relevant here. 0:21:30.560 --> 0:21:34.920 The case captured nation national attention and highlighted the dangers 0:21:34.960 --> 0:21:40.119 of trusting unknown individuals, solidifying the warning in popular culture today. 0:21:40.520 --> 0:21:43.040 You've just realized your iPad was upside down. I've been 0:21:43.040 --> 0:21:43.880 looking at it the whole time. 0:21:43.960 --> 0:21:44.560 It's embarrassed. 0:21:44.600 --> 0:21:46.840 I wasn't going to say anything. I'm glad you noticed. 0:21:47.320 --> 0:21:50.720 So this case was in America in the America's seventies. Yes, 0:21:50.720 --> 0:21:53.400 that's correct in that it's not called the lolly Man. 0:21:53.520 --> 0:21:57.760 That's correct. In nineteen seventy three Houston, Texas, a boy 0:21:57.920 --> 0:22:01.919 by the name of Alma Wayne Lee, who often was 0:22:01.960 --> 0:22:05.680 referred to as just. Wayne led detectives to a series 0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:09.760 of industrial boat storage units and walked to number eleven. 0:22:10.520 --> 0:22:13.920 Detectives removed the padlock with bolt cutters after getting permission 0:22:13.960 --> 0:22:18.200 from the owner of the storage units. There they found 0:22:18.440 --> 0:22:23.680 sacks of lime, a car boxes, water, garbage containers, carpet, 0:22:24.000 --> 0:22:27.560 and a child's yellow bicycle, a bag with children's clothing, 0:22:28.000 --> 0:22:32.080 an unconnected telephone, and lots and lots of bits and pieces. 0:22:32.680 --> 0:22:36.080 Alma Wayne Henley was the first to walk into the shed. 0:22:36.840 --> 0:22:39.840 He took a step inside and his face turned ashen. 0:22:40.720 --> 0:22:44.639 He tried to get himself together. There was something inside 0:22:44.680 --> 0:22:48.720 this shed that they hadn't seen already. Two more detectives 0:22:48.760 --> 0:22:52.560 soon arrived. Detectives at this point had no idea that 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:55.480 this boy was leading them to the dumping ground of 0:22:55.560 --> 0:23:00.840 one of America's most notorious serial killers, Dean Coral. Digging 0:23:00.920 --> 0:23:04.800 began body after body close to midnight. They discovered a 0:23:04.840 --> 0:23:08.960 mass grave and would soon discover over twenty eight victims. 0:23:09.000 --> 0:23:14.040 Oh my god, so who was Dean Coral? Dean Arnold 0:23:14.080 --> 0:23:17.600 Corral was born on Christmas Eve in nineteen thirty nine 0:23:17.640 --> 0:23:20.479 in Indiana. Just down the road was that avan. 0:23:20.560 --> 0:23:22.760 This story when you were christ was. 0:23:22.960 --> 0:23:27.280 Yeah, he was the eldest son of Mary Roberson, which 0:23:27.359 --> 0:23:30.600 is Robo. M It's not Robinson. 0:23:30.640 --> 0:23:32.880 So many missing letters in these people's names. 0:23:32.920 --> 0:23:36.880 And Arnold Edwin Corel. His mother was described as very 0:23:36.960 --> 0:23:39.679 loving and very kind to Dean, but the father was 0:23:39.720 --> 0:23:42.639 the distant one in the household. He later went on 0:23:42.680 --> 0:23:45.720 to state that he never even liked children. He was 0:23:45.760 --> 0:23:48.639 incredibly strict with his son, and he wasn't so loving 0:23:48.800 --> 0:23:52.199 or nurturing with either of their children. They later had 0:23:52.200 --> 0:23:56.000 a boy by the name of Stanley. For the smallest infraction, 0:23:56.160 --> 0:23:58.919 Arnold will beat the children, and this drove a huge 0:23:59.080 --> 0:24:03.080 wedge between me and Arnold. They started arguing and finding 0:24:03.119 --> 0:24:06.960 more and more when Mary, you know, just became extremely 0:24:07.000 --> 0:24:10.520 protective of her two sons. Good. The parents ended up 0:24:10.520 --> 0:24:15.480 divorcing after living an extremely fractured and volatile situation, in 0:24:15.600 --> 0:24:18.840 nineteen forty six, when Dean was seven and his younger brother, 0:24:18.880 --> 0:24:22.520 Stanley was only four years old. Now I've also read 0:24:22.560 --> 0:24:26.400 that they divorced in nineteen forty two, but for math's purposes, 0:24:26.480 --> 0:24:28.639 I think nineteen forty six makes more sense to me. 0:24:28.880 --> 0:24:30.640 Okay, I'm really good at mass. 0:24:30.680 --> 0:24:33.320 I know you are your to step in. Do any 0:24:33.359 --> 0:24:34.760 of them, I'll call you in quite bad. 0:24:35.160 --> 0:24:36.360 I couldn't even think of the word of quite. 0:24:37.160 --> 0:24:40.680 After divorcing, the family home was sold so the pair 0:24:40.720 --> 0:24:43.600 could properly split and start new lives without each other. 0:24:44.200 --> 0:24:48.119 Mary was extremely happy to be away from her abusive partner, Arnold. 0:24:48.880 --> 0:24:52.840 Mary Stanley and Arlold moved to Memphis, Tennessee. Arnold was 0:24:52.920 --> 0:24:55.159 drafted into the Air Force, and they moved so they 0:24:55.200 --> 0:24:57.840 could stay closer to their father. So decided to be 0:24:57.880 --> 0:25:01.120 stationed there basically so they could still be close to Arnold, 0:25:01.119 --> 0:25:04.560 even though he didn't really like or want children. Mary 0:25:04.640 --> 0:25:06.679 had custody of the kids, but she wanted them to 0:25:06.680 --> 0:25:10.200 have some kind of relationship with Arnold. I don't know why, 0:25:10.320 --> 0:25:12.480 since he always said he didn't like kids, but Mary 0:25:12.520 --> 0:25:16.280 and Arnold did try and reconcile their marriage, but the 0:25:16.359 --> 0:25:21.720 pair rarely got along. Dean was shy, anxious, and quiet 0:25:21.800 --> 0:25:24.160 as a kid. He didn't go out of his way 0:25:24.160 --> 0:25:26.919 to talk to people and didn't enjoy being in the spotlight. 0:25:27.720 --> 0:25:30.520 He was not ever known to socialize with other children 0:25:30.600 --> 0:25:32.879 at all as a child. Who was also known as 0:25:32.960 --> 0:25:36.399 really sensitive who would look at and had empathy for others, 0:25:36.520 --> 0:25:38.359 something that is hard to believe. As we get into 0:25:38.400 --> 0:25:43.000 the story. At the age of seven, Dean contracted rheumatic fever. 0:25:43.680 --> 0:25:47.760 Rheumatic fever known as ARF, is a serious inflammatory illness 0:25:48.040 --> 0:25:51.800 and can develop after an untreated strep, throat or skin infection, 0:25:52.359 --> 0:25:55.680 causing the immune system to mistakenly attack the body, particularly 0:25:55.680 --> 0:26:00.600 the heart, joints, brain, and skin. I got into the 0:26:00.680 --> 0:26:04.199 key symptoms here, but basically, if it's not diagnosed, you 0:26:04.240 --> 0:26:08.080 can have massive, massive repercussions of that. And he ended 0:26:08.160 --> 0:26:10.639 up having a heart murmur for life because he was 0:26:10.760 --> 0:26:13.960 neglected to have this treated, so he didn't find out 0:26:13.960 --> 0:26:15.639 for four years. So we had this for four years. 0:26:16.800 --> 0:26:19.320 So he started treatment when he was eleven years old. 0:26:19.760 --> 0:26:21.800 The way they found out was Dean had now had 0:26:21.800 --> 0:26:24.520 a heart condition and a heart murmur, which was from 0:26:25.040 --> 0:26:27.800 a long time of neglect. Because of this condition, he 0:26:27.800 --> 0:26:30.280 couldn't join in with a lot of activities with the kids, 0:26:30.400 --> 0:26:33.160 especially sports. Well, the rest of the kids were playing 0:26:33.200 --> 0:26:36.400 and having fun, Dean had to watch from the sidelines. 0:26:36.920 --> 0:26:38.600 I watched from the sidelines, but not for the last. 0:26:38.600 --> 0:26:44.200 I choice, my choice, choice, You just did cheerleader. 0:26:44.000 --> 0:26:44.480 Cheer leader. 0:26:45.320 --> 0:26:46.240 I just wanted cheers. 0:26:46.280 --> 0:26:48.440 I just want to cheer. In nineteen fifty Marry and 0:26:48.560 --> 0:26:51.640 Arnold tried to get back together again and moved to California, 0:26:52.160 --> 0:26:55.080 but it only lasted another three years, falling apart again. 0:26:55.240 --> 0:26:59.600 In nineteen fifty three, they divorced again. The divorce was 0:26:59.600 --> 0:27:02.880 amic so that actually remarried, and they remarried each time. 0:27:03.560 --> 0:27:07.040 That's interesting. I feel like, if you got divorced once, 0:27:08.440 --> 0:27:11.680 maybe remind yourself of why exactly. 0:27:11.720 --> 0:27:13.720 But they kept trying to get back together, and I 0:27:13.760 --> 0:27:15.919 feel like maybe in that time they would always go 0:27:16.080 --> 0:27:16.560 for the kids. 0:27:16.880 --> 0:27:17.280 Oh of course. 0:27:17.280 --> 0:27:19.480 I mean you say that now as well, And you 0:27:19.520 --> 0:27:22.280 know that can be an admirable thing if you're trying 0:27:22.280 --> 0:27:25.320 to make it work for the kids. If Arnold had, 0:27:25.400 --> 0:27:28.160 you know, changed his ways and become better, it could 0:27:28.200 --> 0:27:31.639 be seen as admirable. But sure, I know, maybe I 0:27:31.680 --> 0:27:34.119 find it even more interesting in those days that because 0:27:34.200 --> 0:27:36.679 I think divorce was a bigger thing in terms of 0:27:36.680 --> 0:27:39.800 it wasn't as common to divorce, but then get actually 0:27:39.920 --> 0:27:40.480 married again. 0:27:42.080 --> 0:27:44.159 The divorce was amicable this time, so the boys were 0:27:44.200 --> 0:27:46.960 able to still have contact with Arnold. Now. The weird 0:27:46.960 --> 0:27:49.120 thing about this is there's not a lot of information 0:27:49.160 --> 0:27:51.320 about Arnold. I don't know what happened to him, but 0:27:51.400 --> 0:27:53.320 I don't think there was a lot of contact. Dean 0:27:53.400 --> 0:27:55.760 certainly didn't have contact with him as he grew older, 0:27:55.800 --> 0:27:58.960 and you don't really hear about Stanley at all. Mary 0:27:59.080 --> 0:28:03.960 moved the boys then to vid Or, Texas vid vital 0:28:04.880 --> 0:28:07.879 v I d O R A minu. 0:28:07.880 --> 0:28:08.960 At least there's two vows. 0:28:09.640 --> 0:28:11.639 You're happy with that one, remember with that one, except 0:28:11.760 --> 0:28:19.240 please proceed with caution anytime like I does, anytime I'd 0:28:19.240 --> 0:28:20.840 like to be driving. She was teaching me how to 0:28:20.880 --> 0:28:25.880 drive and to go proceed caution, Texas, where she met 0:28:25.920 --> 0:28:30.200 a traveling clock salesman by the name of James West. 0:28:30.400 --> 0:28:34.480 This is all something Jake West, traveling clock salesman. It 0:28:34.560 --> 0:28:36.280 feels very willy wonka, it does. 0:28:36.400 --> 0:28:39.000 It's a very very different time. It feels unreal, doesn't it. 0:28:39.480 --> 0:28:41.760 They married soon after and had a baby girl by 0:28:41.800 --> 0:28:46.240 the name of Joyce. Mary and Jake, the X clock salesman, 0:28:46.680 --> 0:28:50.760 decided to venture out with their own business, p com Prince, 0:28:51.880 --> 0:28:53.040 a candy making company. 0:28:53.320 --> 0:28:54.400 Oh. 0:28:54.560 --> 0:28:57.640 Dean and his brother Stanley would operate the machinery and 0:28:57.680 --> 0:28:58.680 help make candy. 0:28:58.800 --> 0:29:01.400 Oh, this feels like yucky foreshadowing foreshadowing. 0:29:01.480 --> 0:29:05.080 Yeah, in high school, Dean's only interest that I could 0:29:05.080 --> 0:29:08.480 find was the brass band. He played in instrument? 0:29:08.520 --> 0:29:09.080 Did he play? 0:29:10.720 --> 0:29:14.640 Oh, come on, he plays in brass? Was it a. 0:29:14.560 --> 0:29:15.960 Brass band you were? 0:29:16.000 --> 0:29:16.640 What did you play? 0:29:16.840 --> 0:29:20.959 Well? I started out playing the euphonium, which is like 0:29:21.000 --> 0:29:25.200 a smaller tuber and if this is this sums me 0:29:25.280 --> 0:29:28.440 up better than anything else. So when I started at 0:29:28.440 --> 0:29:31.680 a new school in grade five, I'd gone to like 0:29:32.040 --> 0:29:34.640 a public primary school, and then in grade five I 0:29:34.720 --> 0:29:36.640 went to a private school and they had a music 0:29:36.680 --> 0:29:38.280 school as part of it. So when I was doing 0:29:38.280 --> 0:29:40.520 the tour on the first day, I was like, what 0:29:40.560 --> 0:29:43.480 do you mean a music school and they said, well, 0:29:43.520 --> 0:29:46.160 you can choose an instrument like any of the instruments 0:29:46.200 --> 0:29:49.480 we've got, and you can learn instrum. And I was 0:29:49.520 --> 0:29:53.920 like what, And I said, in grade five, is there 0:29:53.960 --> 0:29:58.200 any is there any instrument that no one in the school? Yeah, 0:29:58.200 --> 0:30:03.160 from prep to your twelve play and the music teacher said, yes, 0:30:03.200 --> 0:30:06.080 the euphonium, And I said, I'll do that one like that, 0:30:06.440 --> 0:30:08.480 but that's not a brass Like it's a brass instrument, 0:30:08.600 --> 0:30:10.880 but it's not a very brass band. Instrument that one 0:30:10.880 --> 0:30:14.320 I played in this symphony orchestra, the school's symphony orchestra, 0:30:14.480 --> 0:30:17.840 not like the Melbourne Symphony Orchestra. But then I decided 0:30:17.840 --> 0:30:20.720 in grade ten the euphonium wasn't cool, so I upgraded 0:30:20.720 --> 0:30:21.640 to the traumbone. 0:30:21.760 --> 0:30:23.480 Oh, very very. 0:30:23.400 --> 0:30:25.920 Cool, and that's what I played in the brass band. Continue, 0:30:25.920 --> 0:30:26.960 please with caution. 0:30:26.920 --> 0:30:30.520 Proceed with cautioned. He never socialized as he grew older, 0:30:30.680 --> 0:30:33.400 but he maintained really good grades. He continued to make 0:30:33.520 --> 0:30:35.520 no friends and was always a bit of a loner, 0:30:35.920 --> 0:30:38.720 spending his time helping his mum and stepfather with their 0:30:38.760 --> 0:30:39.360 candy store. 0:30:39.480 --> 0:30:42.240 He must have played the euphonium if I reckon. 0:30:42.680 --> 0:30:46.520 After his graduation, his family moved to Houston, Texas. They 0:30:46.560 --> 0:30:50.720 moved their candy operations into a new shop. His stepdad 0:30:50.720 --> 0:30:54.000 would go out selling the money, changing from clocks to candy, 0:30:54.480 --> 0:30:56.640 and his mum would make the candy in the store, 0:30:56.880 --> 0:30:59.080 selling the money. 0:30:59.280 --> 0:31:01.280 You said he'd go selling the money. 0:31:01.120 --> 0:31:04.120 Changing from clocks to candy. Yeah, I don't say selling 0:31:04.120 --> 0:31:08.240 the money. I did, yeah, candy, selling the making the money. 0:31:08.680 --> 0:31:09.200 I got it. 0:31:09.360 --> 0:31:12.120 A couple of years out of high school, Dean moved 0:31:12.120 --> 0:31:14.360 to Indiana, to live with his grandmother. 0:31:14.560 --> 0:31:17.360 Gosh, there's a lot of movement, a movement by this age. 0:31:17.520 --> 0:31:19.760 He stayed there for around two years. He met a 0:31:19.800 --> 0:31:23.080 girl and soon they were in a relationship. It fell 0:31:23.120 --> 0:31:25.600 apart pretty quickly and she asked him to marry her, 0:31:26.120 --> 0:31:28.880 but he said no. Oh oh wow, he said no. 0:31:29.880 --> 0:31:32.240 He ended up moving back to Houston after a couple 0:31:32.240 --> 0:31:35.200 of years. He started helping with the family candy business 0:31:35.560 --> 0:31:38.360 and took it a bit more seriously in nineteen sixty two, 0:31:38.480 --> 0:31:41.960 seeing this as a career pathway. He lived with them 0:31:41.960 --> 0:31:44.760 briefly and then ended up living with his mum and 0:31:44.800 --> 0:31:47.520 stepdad Jake, and then ended up renting his own apartment 0:31:47.640 --> 0:31:51.960 above the candy shop. His stepfather, Jake at one point 0:31:52.200 --> 0:31:55.360 noticed some things about Dean and took Mary aside to 0:31:55.360 --> 0:31:58.840 tell her that he suspected Dean was gay. She got 0:31:58.840 --> 0:32:03.320 offended and insisted he wasn't. Mary was extremely homophobic and 0:32:03.440 --> 0:32:06.560 thought that gay people were disgusting. There was her words, disgusting. 0:32:06.920 --> 0:32:11.320 You know who's disgusting, Mary, Mary, Yeah, Robertson, Mary Roberson, 0:32:11.480 --> 0:32:13.000 get an inn in your name. For once. 0:32:13.400 --> 0:32:16.440 She thought of her son as loyal, obedient, helpful, loving 0:32:16.760 --> 0:32:19.120 and a good and normal. Boy. That's how she is. 0:32:19.360 --> 0:32:23.360 He's all of those things, those things. Knowing this from 0:32:23.440 --> 0:32:25.280 the intro, I don't think he is those things. 0:32:25.480 --> 0:32:27.840 But that's not no, no, no, I think we're describing a 0:32:27.880 --> 0:32:28.400 gay person. 0:32:28.800 --> 0:32:30.880 Yes, no, that's I was like, yeah, yes he was. 0:32:31.800 --> 0:32:33.600 They did do with that, But then I remembered we're 0:32:33.600 --> 0:32:35.480 talking about a serial mener. 0:32:36.440 --> 0:32:39.440 Knowing this about his mum, Dean never felt comfortable enough 0:32:39.480 --> 0:32:42.760 to talk about his sexuality with his mum or his stepfather. 0:32:43.080 --> 0:32:46.680 It's unclear really what this relationship was with his biological father, 0:32:46.840 --> 0:32:50.440 Arnold as well, But at this point all we really know, 0:32:50.560 --> 0:32:52.080 and I don't. I don't really think there was a 0:32:52.080 --> 0:32:56.560 relationship salvaged there at all. In nineteen sixty three, his 0:32:56.720 --> 0:32:59.720 mother divorced her husband and then opened up her own 0:32:59.800 --> 0:33:03.800 care business, the Coral Candy Company, and made Dean the 0:33:03.880 --> 0:33:06.200 vice president. Now it was a store. I found it 0:33:06.280 --> 0:33:08.760 very funny that he was a vice president still just 0:33:08.800 --> 0:33:12.840 for a store. And also at this time I did 0:33:12.880 --> 0:33:15.520 read something that was like they were still living together 0:33:15.560 --> 0:33:17.280 at the time she started the store. So there was 0:33:17.320 --> 0:33:20.400 two candy companies running out. 0:33:20.240 --> 0:33:20.960 Of the same place. 0:33:21.640 --> 0:33:24.480 Oh dear, okay, yeap Not long into the business, a 0:33:24.560 --> 0:33:28.720 teen male employee came forward and accused Dean of trying 0:33:28.760 --> 0:33:32.400 to proposition him. Nothing happened, The young boy was just fired. 0:33:33.360 --> 0:33:35.960 Sorry, so he was to have a conversation. 0:33:36.040 --> 0:33:38.680 They said, no, you know, oh God, and no one 0:33:38.720 --> 0:33:40.520 took the time to investigate and. 0:33:40.440 --> 0:33:43.320 Howld was Dean now like twenties. 0:33:42.920 --> 0:33:45.960 Twenties Yeah, Mary did not believe that her son would 0:33:46.000 --> 0:33:50.720 do something like that. Dean was drafted into the US 0:33:50.920 --> 0:33:56.480 Army in August nineteen sixty four. US operations in Vietnam 0:33:56.520 --> 0:33:59.000 were expanding at the time, and Dean was sent to 0:33:59.240 --> 0:34:03.480 Louisiana for basic training, then on to Georgia. Hey that's 0:34:03.520 --> 0:34:05.840 my name, it's your name, and then a permanent assignment 0:34:05.920 --> 0:34:09.640 in Texas. He worked as a radio repairman. During this time. 0:34:09.719 --> 0:34:14.680 He absolutely hated military training and applied for a hardship discharge, 0:34:14.960 --> 0:34:16.920 using the excuse that he had to be home with 0:34:17.000 --> 0:34:20.600 his family to run the family business vice president. Of course, 0:34:20.680 --> 0:34:22.879 of course, he was only in there for about ten 0:34:22.920 --> 0:34:25.120 months and got out in nineteen sixty five. 0:34:25.239 --> 0:34:27.920 Well that's a long time to be doing something, you really. 0:34:27.680 --> 0:34:30.960 Have Absolutely during this time in the army, Dean first 0:34:31.120 --> 0:34:34.960 realized that he was homosexual. He actually told people in 0:34:35.000 --> 0:34:36.839 the army that he thought that he was. He got 0:34:36.840 --> 0:34:39.520 out of the army and resumed his position as vice president. 0:34:40.360 --> 0:34:43.839 As vice president at the Coral Candy Company, the main 0:34:43.920 --> 0:34:47.400 competition at this point was Dean's stepdad, Jake's candy. 0:34:47.160 --> 0:34:48.960 Business That's so Weird. 0:34:48.800 --> 0:34:52.360 So Weird. Dean was working crazy hours at this point, 0:34:52.719 --> 0:34:55.239 and they were trying hard to make it work and 0:34:55.320 --> 0:34:58.880 meet the supplier and demand the supply and demand of 0:34:58.600 --> 0:35:03.040 the local huston. Late in nineteen sixty five, the family 0:35:03.080 --> 0:35:06.239 business moved the location of the company across the road 0:35:06.360 --> 0:35:10.560 from Helms Elementary School. A lot of the kids would 0:35:10.560 --> 0:35:13.600 obviously stop by the store, and Dean would hand out 0:35:13.640 --> 0:35:16.440 a lot of free sweets to the kids, luring them 0:35:16.440 --> 0:35:19.640 into the shop to entice them to buy more. This 0:35:19.800 --> 0:35:22.759 is where he started to earn the nickname the candy Man. 0:35:24.120 --> 0:35:28.479 Never say it three times. Some people started calling Dean 0:35:28.640 --> 0:35:30.920 the Pied Piper. He was giving out free candy to 0:35:30.960 --> 0:35:35.720 local children and luring them away from their school. While 0:35:35.800 --> 0:35:38.800 all of this seemed innocent on the outside, there was 0:35:38.840 --> 0:35:42.160 a very dark part of Dean's mind that was brewing away. 0:35:42.840 --> 0:35:46.080 He favored teen boys, and there happened to be quite 0:35:46.120 --> 0:35:49.640 a few now working for the candy company. Many of 0:35:49.680 --> 0:35:53.160 the boys found him to be incredibly creepy. Nobody did 0:35:53.200 --> 0:35:56.400 anything about his behavior time and time again. He was 0:35:56.480 --> 0:36:00.400 also known to bury defective candy at night outside side, 0:36:01.000 --> 0:36:04.560 not in the bins. He bury it. He'd actually dig 0:36:04.640 --> 0:36:05.920 up and bury candy. 0:36:06.040 --> 0:36:08.560 That's so weird. Also, what is defective candy? 0:36:08.719 --> 0:36:12.200 Well, I guess candy that doesn't look perfect guessing. But 0:36:12.360 --> 0:36:15.279 some have speculated that his killings could have become a 0:36:15.320 --> 0:36:16.680 lot earlier. 0:36:17.000 --> 0:36:18.359 Because of digging up thing. 0:36:18.560 --> 0:36:21.920 Yeah, oh yeah, So he said he was just bearing 0:36:21.920 --> 0:36:24.040 candy out at night, so he had an excuse. But 0:36:24.400 --> 0:36:27.720 people have since said, there's his victim count was actually 0:36:27.760 --> 0:36:30.560 a lot higher Jesus, and he started a lot earlier. 0:36:31.560 --> 0:36:34.840 Like there's nothing funny about this, But for want of 0:36:34.840 --> 0:36:36.960 a better term, it is a bit funny to me 0:36:37.480 --> 0:36:42.000 to think that he said, oh, there's candy that that 0:36:42.080 --> 0:36:44.360 can't be sold, so I've just been burying in my 0:36:44.400 --> 0:36:48.160 garden and the people go, okay. 0:36:47.840 --> 0:36:53.160 Yes, also going I could have it look Dean cleared 0:36:53.200 --> 0:36:55.040 out of back room of the store and installed a 0:36:55.080 --> 0:36:57.359 pool table so boys would want to come and hang 0:36:57.440 --> 0:36:59.919 out with him. What sad This is when he made 0:37:00.040 --> 0:37:02.200 friends with a twelve year old boy and a very 0:37:02.239 --> 0:37:05.480 important person in this case, a boy by the name 0:37:05.600 --> 0:37:08.719 of David Brooks. He was one of the kids who 0:37:08.760 --> 0:37:12.360 would show up, get free candy and play Paul. He 0:37:12.360 --> 0:37:16.360 would give that he would give more free candy to 0:37:16.440 --> 0:37:19.839 the boys around around the neighborhood and bring them into 0:37:19.840 --> 0:37:23.640 the store. This would become a very important hangout spot, 0:37:23.719 --> 0:37:26.480 free candy and Paul for everyone who wanted to come in. 0:37:26.960 --> 0:37:41.680 This is exactly what Dean wanted. David said at the 0:37:41.719 --> 0:37:44.680 time that Dean was the only person who didn't make 0:37:44.719 --> 0:37:47.120 fun of his glasses, and that's sad. He had big 0:37:47.160 --> 0:37:49.160 glasses and Dean with young didn't make fun of him. 0:37:49.719 --> 0:37:52.879 He had a friend in Dean, and he treated him well. 0:37:53.160 --> 0:37:55.880 David Brooks started to see Dean as somewhat of a 0:37:55.960 --> 0:37:59.040 surrogate dad. Dean would give him money and take him 0:37:59.120 --> 0:38:04.560 everywhere with him. David would come home or David came 0:38:04.600 --> 0:38:06.920 from a home sorry where his parents weren't together and 0:38:06.960 --> 0:38:09.240 seemed like he was seeking some kind of big brother, 0:38:09.480 --> 0:38:13.240 big sister vibe. David saw the factory as his second home. 0:38:14.120 --> 0:38:16.640 Anytime he needed money, he would walk over and get 0:38:16.680 --> 0:38:18.279 some from Dean. So Dean would just give him money 0:38:18.280 --> 0:38:20.840 anytime we want it. Dean would take some of the 0:38:20.840 --> 0:38:24.359 boys on trips. He'd take them to the beach all 0:38:24.400 --> 0:38:26.840 the time, and it didn't seem to raise any suspicion 0:38:27.000 --> 0:38:30.000 at the time. Dean was a big, friendly, kookie Willy 0:38:30.040 --> 0:38:32.680 Wonka type figure who seemed to be kind of a 0:38:32.680 --> 0:38:36.560 big kid himself. Often Dean would ride his motorcycle with 0:38:36.640 --> 0:38:39.320 David on the back, and would even let David drive 0:38:39.400 --> 0:38:43.960 it when they were alone together. In nineteen sixty six, 0:38:44.160 --> 0:38:47.839 Mary got married a third time. The name was suppressed, 0:38:48.280 --> 0:38:53.120 so I'll call him Merchant Seamen because that was his job. 0:38:53.640 --> 0:38:55.880 Jesus Christ, why was the name suppressed. 0:38:56.320 --> 0:38:58.200 I don't know him. He was quite a violent and 0:38:58.239 --> 0:39:02.960 awful person, so I think let's protect his Merchant Seamen. 0:39:03.000 --> 0:39:05.160 I don't know why. They met on some kind of 0:39:05.200 --> 0:39:07.640 matchmaking service back then. Don't know what it was, but 0:39:07.719 --> 0:39:12.120 some sort of you know. Sixty eight they met on 0:39:12.160 --> 0:39:14.400 some kind of matchmaking service and rushed to get married. 0:39:15.360 --> 0:39:18.799 Mary was at the time fifty years old. On their honeymoon, 0:39:19.040 --> 0:39:22.160 Mary was shocked to see how violent and angry. Her 0:39:22.160 --> 0:39:26.120 new husband was at a taxi driver what's her husband's. 0:39:25.760 --> 0:39:27.600 Name, Merchant Seamen wrecked. 0:39:28.280 --> 0:39:31.919 He bragged how crewmen would actually walk off his ship 0:39:31.960 --> 0:39:35.480 if they found out he was working. Oh my god, awful. 0:39:36.680 --> 0:39:40.080 He was not a nice man. Merchant's ex wife actually 0:39:40.120 --> 0:39:43.200 took her own life, but Mary was suspicious about this 0:39:43.320 --> 0:39:45.560 when he told her about it, Oh my god, she 0:39:45.640 --> 0:39:48.280 went to see the coroner's report to actually see how 0:39:48.320 --> 0:39:48.960 she died. 0:39:49.320 --> 0:39:50.160 Oh dear. 0:39:50.440 --> 0:39:53.959 Soon after, they annulled the marriage. A few weeks later, 0:39:54.000 --> 0:39:55.400 they remarried and moved in together. 0:39:55.480 --> 0:39:56.640 Stopped doing this Mary. 0:39:57.360 --> 0:40:00.960 He was an extremely jealous person. Went offshore. He phoned Mary, 0:40:01.000 --> 0:40:02.919 but if she didn't pick up, he would fly straight 0:40:02.960 --> 0:40:05.080 back to Houston to see if she'd fallen. 0:40:04.840 --> 0:40:07.080 In love with another man Jesus Christ. 0:40:07.400 --> 0:40:10.440 One time, he pretended he was away and staked outside 0:40:10.440 --> 0:40:12.319 her house for two nights to keep an eye on her. 0:40:12.440 --> 0:40:17.960 Oh gross. Merchant Seamen never liked Dean, much like Mary's 0:40:18.000 --> 0:40:21.799 ex husband, Jake West. The friction between Merchant and Dean 0:40:21.960 --> 0:40:25.400 grew and grew that were not involved in each other's 0:40:25.440 --> 0:40:29.600 lives at all. Mary and Merchant would continually fight, break up, 0:40:29.640 --> 0:40:33.000 and then move back in together. One time, he bought 0:40:33.000 --> 0:40:35.640 her the most beautiful flowers and told her that if 0:40:35.680 --> 0:40:38.879 she died, he would throw the most beautiful funeral for her. 0:40:39.080 --> 0:40:41.640 That is so fucked up, especially if he killed her. 0:40:42.080 --> 0:40:45.120 He said that, Yep, it's lovely. 0:40:46.440 --> 0:40:48.640 She says. Not many good people in this story so far. 0:40:49.160 --> 0:40:51.600 Merchant would also openly cheat on Mary. 0:40:52.040 --> 0:40:54.200 Yeah, we no shit. The jealous ones was due. 0:40:54.239 --> 0:40:57.680 In nineteen sixty seven, Dean was still handing out candy 0:40:57.719 --> 0:41:00.360 to all the kids, and the relationship between him and 0:41:00.480 --> 0:41:04.320 David Brooks was growing. More trips to the beach, more 0:41:04.440 --> 0:41:09.360 riding on his motorcycle. The Coral Family Candy Company closed 0:41:09.400 --> 0:41:13.560 in nineteen sixty eight. Dean's mother couldn't run the store anymore. 0:41:13.560 --> 0:41:15.800 It just wasn't making any money. 0:41:16.040 --> 0:41:19.160 Because the VP was giving away everything and then burying 0:41:19.280 --> 0:41:19.919 the rest of it. 0:41:20.080 --> 0:41:22.680 Is he we don't know. And of course, Merchant and 0:41:22.760 --> 0:41:25.239 Mary began threatening to have each other committed to a 0:41:25.280 --> 0:41:30.759 psychiatric facility. A Merchant was actually committed. He was, of 0:41:30.800 --> 0:41:36.280 course relationship in this relationship. I think he was released 0:41:36.280 --> 0:41:39.480 after being under surveillance for twenty four hours. He then 0:41:39.520 --> 0:41:41.560 went on to threaten Mary to commit her that he 0:41:41.600 --> 0:41:44.240 was going to commit her permanently and that he would 0:41:44.239 --> 0:41:46.800 pay to do so, making sure that she would undergo 0:41:46.960 --> 0:41:52.000 intense shock therapy. Mary was terrified and slept in her 0:41:52.000 --> 0:41:54.800 office for six weeks and ended up getting a restraining 0:41:54.920 --> 0:41:58.760 order against Merchant, but he didn't listen. Merchant would continually 0:41:58.800 --> 0:42:01.719 break into the factory and make threats, calling Dean a 0:42:01.880 --> 0:42:06.120 derogatory name for homosexual. Mary encouraged Dean to go out 0:42:06.160 --> 0:42:07.560 and kill Merchants when he. 0:42:07.520 --> 0:42:09.480 Was as family man. 0:42:09.640 --> 0:42:11.680 Dean instead gave her some bricks to throw at him 0:42:11.680 --> 0:42:13.200 out the window, and she did. 0:42:13.480 --> 0:42:13.880 Okay. 0:42:14.239 --> 0:42:18.640 Mary later said about Dean, so how could people say 0:42:18.719 --> 0:42:22.160 now that Dean is a murderer. Why if Dean was 0:42:22.200 --> 0:42:24.520 ever going to be a problem to anyone, it would 0:42:24.520 --> 0:42:25.840 have been a merchant. 0:42:26.640 --> 0:42:30.480 Oh okay, So yeah, no, that totally checks out. I 0:42:30.680 --> 0:42:32.640 asked him to anyone. If it was going to kill anyone, 0:42:32.640 --> 0:42:34.440 it would have been my ex husband. But he didn't 0:42:34.440 --> 0:42:36.399 do that. So all of these bodies that have been 0:42:36.440 --> 0:42:39.920 found that are linked to definitely can't be him. I 0:42:39.960 --> 0:42:41.520 don't like Mary, I'm sorry. 0:42:42.000 --> 0:42:45.279 Mary was, of course, completely blind to what Dean was 0:42:45.360 --> 0:42:51.520 actually doing. Mary eventually divorced merchant seamen. She and her 0:42:51.560 --> 0:42:54.560 thirteen year old Joyce ended up moving away, while Dean 0:42:54.600 --> 0:42:57.719 decided to stay in Houston, Texas. This would be the 0:42:57.800 --> 0:43:00.600 last time he would ever see his mother, but continued 0:43:00.680 --> 0:43:03.480 talking to her over the phone. By night he would 0:43:03.520 --> 0:43:05.600 make candy to keep up with a few orders they 0:43:05.600 --> 0:43:06.160 still had. 0:43:06.640 --> 0:43:07.520 Wasn't the business dead? 0:43:07.760 --> 0:43:09.879 The business was dead, but there was a couple of orders, 0:43:09.920 --> 0:43:11.479 and he did that for a little bit of time 0:43:11.600 --> 0:43:12.359 right then, He. 0:43:12.400 --> 0:43:14.440 Just maybe the business was kind of still going, but 0:43:14.480 --> 0:43:15.200 the shop was at. 0:43:15.120 --> 0:43:18.960 Shop, wasn't Yeah. Mary Robertson eventually set up a new 0:43:19.000 --> 0:43:21.399 candy factory in a new hometown. Oh my god, Oh 0:43:21.400 --> 0:43:25.600 while just even how many, how many different companies they 0:43:25.600 --> 0:43:26.800 had in this short amount of time. 0:43:26.640 --> 0:43:30.280 And moving a lot for them actually in those days 0:43:30.320 --> 0:43:32.920 as well, I know it was in the earlier days, 0:43:32.920 --> 0:43:35.440 moving across the country so often, like so many times, 0:43:35.440 --> 0:43:37.560 as I know, it was like that was more rare 0:43:37.640 --> 0:43:38.040 as well. 0:43:38.120 --> 0:43:41.880 Absolutely, But with no job and no finances, Dean got 0:43:41.880 --> 0:43:44.600 a job as an electrician at the Houston Lighting and 0:43:44.840 --> 0:43:48.400 Power Company. He'd experienced. He had experience in the Armies. 0:43:48.840 --> 0:43:51.759 In the Armies. Experience in the Army, not all of 0:43:51.800 --> 0:43:54.520 the Armies. He stayed in his apartment above the candy 0:43:54.560 --> 0:43:58.880 store and ended up meeting a single mother named Betty Hawkins. 0:43:58.200 --> 0:44:00.280 He was such a sixties. 0:44:01.680 --> 0:44:05.400 He also formed a much closer relationship now with David Brooks. 0:44:06.280 --> 0:44:08.239 With his mother out of town, he was able to 0:44:08.239 --> 0:44:10.680 meet people his own age as well, so that he 0:44:10.760 --> 0:44:14.080 was sexually attracted to and without having to keep up 0:44:14.080 --> 0:44:16.840 the facade of being an innocent and good candy maker. 0:44:17.200 --> 0:44:20.479 More people found him creepy and quick to completely change 0:44:20.520 --> 0:44:21.120 his demeanor. 0:44:21.320 --> 0:44:23.800 Hey, I'm sorry, So what was the relationship with Betty Hawkins? 0:44:23.840 --> 0:44:26.880 So there was his girlfriend, but while he was with 0:44:26.920 --> 0:44:29.359 the girlfriend, he found it was easier. 0:44:29.000 --> 0:44:31.680 To so it was a lot more than him. Yes, yep, 0:44:31.960 --> 0:44:32.719 did she know that? 0:44:33.080 --> 0:44:36.200 No, she was unaware of all this. When David was 0:44:36.200 --> 0:44:38.799 fifteen years old, he dropped out of his David Brooks sorry, 0:44:38.800 --> 0:44:40.759 he dropped out of high school and went to live 0:44:40.800 --> 0:44:43.839 with his mother. So she and her husband split. She 0:44:43.960 --> 0:44:45.800 moved away, I think to a place called Boumont or 0:44:45.840 --> 0:44:47.960 something still in Texas. And then he would go back 0:44:48.000 --> 0:44:51.400 and forth from his dad and his mum. Okay, anytime 0:44:51.480 --> 0:44:54.040 he would come back to visit his dad in Houston, 0:44:54.239 --> 0:44:57.200 he would visit Dean at his apartment. Dean would bring 0:44:57.280 --> 0:45:00.440 David on his dates with his girlfriend Oh and told 0:45:00.520 --> 0:45:02.440 him that he ever needed a place to stay, that 0:45:02.480 --> 0:45:06.040 he could just stay with him. One time, when David 0:45:06.080 --> 0:45:08.960 was staying with Dean, Dean started urging him to experiment 0:45:09.040 --> 0:45:12.799 with his sexuality. It didn't take long to convince him. 0:45:12.920 --> 0:45:15.640 Dean paid him some money to let Dean perform for 0:45:15.760 --> 0:45:17.080 Latio on it and. 0:45:17.480 --> 0:45:22.160 It was like fifteen, yeah. 0:45:20.880 --> 0:45:25.720 I think thirteen actually yeah what Yeah. On September twenty fifth, 0:45:25.800 --> 0:45:29.600 nineteen seventy, Jeffrey Conan had been hitchhiking with a friend 0:45:29.640 --> 0:45:33.719 of his. The driver dropped them off in Houston. This 0:45:33.880 --> 0:45:36.959 was the last time he was ever seen alive. Dean 0:45:37.040 --> 0:45:40.399 lived in his apartment and likely spotted him offering him 0:45:40.440 --> 0:45:42.799 a ride to his parents' house. So he was kind 0:45:42.800 --> 0:45:45.160 of I think on it like an intersection sort of place. 0:45:44.920 --> 0:45:47.080 And he saw he could see so it just saw 0:45:47.080 --> 0:45:48.160 someone being dropped off. 0:45:48.200 --> 0:45:53.840 Yeah, to get Jeffrey. Jeffrey was I think Jeffrey was 0:45:53.880 --> 0:45:58.040 eighteen years old on September twenty fifth, Sorry, I won't 0:45:58.080 --> 0:46:02.160 do that again. Him then bound and gagged Jeffrey before 0:46:02.200 --> 0:46:04.520 taking him to an undisclosed location to rape him. 0:46:04.719 --> 0:46:06.840 Oh God, Saman, when you I thought you were going 0:46:06.920 --> 0:46:09.360 to say, like, they don't know what happened, though it 0:46:09.400 --> 0:46:11.400 was never seen again, and we don't really know what happened. 0:46:11.520 --> 0:46:13.839 I wasn't expecting details. 0:46:14.000 --> 0:46:16.400 When he was through, he placed his hands around Jeffrey's 0:46:16.400 --> 0:46:17.919 neck and manually strangled him. 0:46:18.120 --> 0:46:21.239 So this seemingly has come out of nowhere. Well, we 0:46:21.320 --> 0:46:23.719 don't really know, but this is the first victims. 0:46:24.080 --> 0:46:27.720 It's known. Yes, he wrapped Jeffrey's body in plastic sheets, 0:46:27.800 --> 0:46:30.000 drove him out to a beach, and buried him in 0:46:30.040 --> 0:46:34.360 a shallow grave. Before he buried him, he dumped limes 0:46:34.400 --> 0:46:36.200 in with him to try and hide the smell. 0:46:36.440 --> 0:46:38.960 Ah, okay, I was wondering, why Lyne, he's a bag 0:46:39.000 --> 0:46:39.400 of limes? 0:46:39.400 --> 0:46:42.600 At the start, it got worse and worse. One night, 0:46:42.640 --> 0:46:46.399 when David Brooks was stopping by Dean's apartment, he heard 0:46:46.440 --> 0:46:50.239 strange noises coming from inside. When he walked in the door, 0:46:50.360 --> 0:46:53.520 he spotted Dean assaulting two boys strapped to his bed. 0:46:54.360 --> 0:46:57.160 Dean jumped up and said, I'm just having some fun. 0:46:58.080 --> 0:47:00.600 Dean had made a device himself to trapped them there. 0:47:00.760 --> 0:47:02.560 Known later as the torture board. 0:47:02.719 --> 0:47:03.520 Oh Jesus. 0:47:03.680 --> 0:47:05.800 It was a slab of plywood that he drilled holes 0:47:05.800 --> 0:47:08.960 into so he could tie them there. He used this 0:47:09.040 --> 0:47:12.160 device in almost all of his murders and rapes. He 0:47:12.200 --> 0:47:15.240 would tie them up, sometimes leaving them there for days 0:47:15.360 --> 0:47:18.680 at a time. He would always gag them so they 0:47:18.680 --> 0:47:22.560 wouldn't be heard in his apartment. David Brooks later said, 0:47:23.040 --> 0:47:25.600 once they were on the board, they were as good 0:47:25.680 --> 0:47:29.480 as dead. It was all over, but the shouting and crying. 0:47:29.920 --> 0:47:34.480 Oh so David wooked in on him with two victims 0:47:34.520 --> 0:47:37.560 once yes, and seemingly said nothing at the time to 0:47:37.600 --> 0:47:38.160 anyone else. 0:47:39.320 --> 0:47:42.920 And it gets worse. I don't want it to David 0:47:42.960 --> 0:47:47.640 wasn't sure if he was disgusted or intrigued. Dean ran 0:47:47.760 --> 0:47:51.200 over to David and bribed him with a car in 0:47:51.280 --> 0:47:55.240 exchange for silence about what he saw. Oh God, David agreed. 0:47:56.200 --> 0:48:00.480 Soon after, Dean brought David a green Chevy Corvette and 0:48:00.520 --> 0:48:03.359 told him that he ended up killing the boys that night. 0:48:03.719 --> 0:48:07.080 Oh but here's a car, so a car, get. 0:48:06.920 --> 0:48:09.560 Over it well. Dean then promised David two hundred dollars 0:48:09.800 --> 0:48:13.200 for every boy he could bring to him. David immediately 0:48:13.239 --> 0:48:13.839 got to work. 0:48:14.040 --> 0:48:14.759 Oh No. 0:48:15.840 --> 0:48:19.520 On December fifteenth, nineteen seventy, David lured two fourteen year 0:48:19.560 --> 0:48:23.239 old boys, James Glass and Danny Yates, to the apartment. 0:48:24.120 --> 0:48:25.960 He promised it was just to hang out and have 0:48:26.080 --> 0:48:29.359 a few beers. Both fourteen year old boys were tied 0:48:29.360 --> 0:48:33.279 to the bed and the same thing happened again, raped, strangled, 0:48:33.520 --> 0:48:35.399 and then taken to the place where we were burying 0:48:35.480 --> 0:48:38.880 most of his bodies, a boat shed the he had 0:48:39.000 --> 0:48:43.399 hired exactly for that purpose. He then waited for six 0:48:43.440 --> 0:48:48.680 weeks to attack again. The age range of boys was 0:48:48.800 --> 0:48:53.320 thirteen to twenty years old. He had a very specific target. 0:48:53.800 --> 0:48:56.399 All these victims would come from the town that Dean 0:48:56.480 --> 0:49:00.600 lived in, Houston Heights. It was a low socioeconomic neighborhood. 0:49:01.719 --> 0:49:04.120 Dean liked to get his victims into his car by 0:49:04.120 --> 0:49:07.360 telling them that there was a party. He would also 0:49:07.480 --> 0:49:09.279 get them into his car by telling them that he 0:49:09.320 --> 0:49:11.560 would give them a lift home or take them wherever 0:49:11.680 --> 0:49:14.319 they needed to go. He would pump the kids full 0:49:14.320 --> 0:49:16.640 of drugs and alcohol, or play a game with them 0:49:16.680 --> 0:49:20.120 involving handcuffs designed to get these in place so that 0:49:20.120 --> 0:49:24.320 they were restricted. Other times, he would forcibly put handcuffs 0:49:24.320 --> 0:49:26.040 on them. He would then tie them to his bed 0:49:26.120 --> 0:49:29.160 or tortureboard, and that he hung up on the wall. 0:49:29.320 --> 0:49:31.640 He would violate his victims and then he would strangle 0:49:31.680 --> 0:49:35.560 them or shoot them with his twenty two caliber. He 0:49:35.640 --> 0:49:38.160 put a lot of these bodies in plastic sheets and 0:49:38.239 --> 0:49:41.600 place them in the rented boat shed or bury them 0:49:41.719 --> 0:49:44.359 on the beach. He would also get his victims to 0:49:44.360 --> 0:49:46.759 call or write to their parents to let them know 0:49:46.880 --> 0:49:48.640 that they were Okay, Oh, that's. 0:49:48.440 --> 0:49:51.000 So like that. Obviously all of this is messed up, 0:49:51.040 --> 0:49:52.280 but that is just next. 0:49:52.920 --> 0:49:56.319 That's what Dad and Catherine Bernie. Yeah, remember, just so 0:49:56.400 --> 0:50:00.200 nobody would be getting suspicious knowing that he would then 0:50:00.280 --> 0:50:02.480 he would kill them. Like a lot of serial killers. 0:50:02.680 --> 0:50:06.200 He would collect trophies, often the keys from the victims, 0:50:06.280 --> 0:50:09.480 so the set of keys for the house. Now, of course, 0:50:09.520 --> 0:50:11.640 if a man was pulling up to you in his 0:50:11.719 --> 0:50:15.560 van offering you candy, you would run away screaming stranger, danger. 0:50:16.040 --> 0:50:20.360 But because of another kid kind of their age, David Brooks, 0:50:20.360 --> 0:50:23.800 he was able to gain their trust. On January thirty, 0:50:23.880 --> 0:50:28.000 nineteen seventy one, Dean and David spotted two boys fifteen 0:50:28.080 --> 0:50:32.720 year old Donnie and thirteen year old Jerry Waldrop walking 0:50:32.760 --> 0:50:33.480 from church. 0:50:33.320 --> 0:50:34.800 To the Bawling Alley Brothers. 0:50:35.000 --> 0:50:39.000 Brothers. They promised the two boys weed and beer if 0:50:39.000 --> 0:50:41.799 they got into the van. It was a white van, 0:50:41.960 --> 0:50:45.480 later known as a torture van. It's not very creative 0:50:45.680 --> 0:50:47.560 in all of this, like the boards called the torture board, 0:50:47.600 --> 0:50:50.799 the van's called the departments called the torture apartment, but 0:50:50.840 --> 0:50:54.200 it seemed to be where he would pick up Oh yeah, 0:50:54.200 --> 0:50:57.320 So it's not clear if the torture van was actually 0:50:57.440 --> 0:51:00.560 used to torture and kill victims, but to the yeah, 0:51:02.000 --> 0:51:04.560 that's right, but he definitely transported them in this car. 0:51:05.840 --> 0:51:08.560 David Brooks later said that Dean did go out to 0:51:08.640 --> 0:51:11.120 California quite a bit, but no one really knows what 0:51:11.200 --> 0:51:13.920 he was doing out there, so it's likely he might 0:51:13.960 --> 0:51:16.200 have picked up even more boys and tortured them in 0:51:16.239 --> 0:51:20.160 that van. This would mean that the number of boys 0:51:20.200 --> 0:51:23.600 would be even higher than what we know already. Dean 0:51:23.719 --> 0:51:25.919 drove the boys back to his new spot, a new 0:51:25.960 --> 0:51:30.080 apartment place one apartment where he raped, tortured, and strangled 0:51:30.120 --> 0:51:33.120 both boys to death. This time David watched in the 0:51:33.200 --> 0:51:37.200 corner and then David helped transport the bodies into the 0:51:37.280 --> 0:51:39.920 van and then into the boat shed where they were buried. 0:51:40.000 --> 0:51:41.480 So this is the first time we know that he's 0:51:41.520 --> 0:51:42.120 actually been here. 0:51:42.200 --> 0:51:44.000 So he has watched before, but yeah, this is the 0:51:44.000 --> 0:51:45.839 first time that he was actually involved that we know of. 0:51:46.680 --> 0:51:48.799 Even though the home was very close to where the 0:51:48.880 --> 0:51:54.560 last two boys have been abducted, the police still didn't investigate. What. Yeah, 0:51:54.760 --> 0:51:59.000 the boy's father, Everett filed two missing person reports for 0:51:59.040 --> 0:52:01.879 both of his sons. At the time, there were no 0:52:01.960 --> 0:52:04.400 missing There was not a missing person's unit in the 0:52:04.440 --> 0:52:08.799 Houston Police Department, so the paperwork was buried. Oh my god. 0:52:08.880 --> 0:52:11.719 So it was just part of normal everyday police work, 0:52:12.000 --> 0:52:16.120 is that if there was someone reported missing, just any 0:52:16.200 --> 0:52:17.600 cop on the beat, if they had time to get 0:52:17.600 --> 0:52:19.120 around to it, would look into it. 0:52:19.320 --> 0:52:22.360 I'll put on the Everett showed up to the police 0:52:22.360 --> 0:52:26.560 station every day for eight months straight, desperately urging the 0:52:26.560 --> 0:52:30.040 police to do something about his missing sons. He told 0:52:30.040 --> 0:52:33.000 the Houston Chronicle, I was there about as much as 0:52:33.040 --> 0:52:37.279 the chief was. The police continually asked him why he 0:52:37.400 --> 0:52:41.840 was there, that his two boys would just runaways. Everett 0:52:41.880 --> 0:52:43.800 even told the police that a man by the name 0:52:43.920 --> 0:52:46.320 of Dean Coral was bearing bodies at a boat shed. 0:52:46.400 --> 0:52:49.239 What police didn't seem to believe it. It was just 0:52:49.280 --> 0:52:52.640 a rumor and that all of these boys were runaways. 0:52:52.840 --> 0:52:56.120 Had they looked into this quote unquote. 0:52:55.480 --> 0:52:57.360 They had once gone there that I think I go into. 0:52:57.480 --> 0:52:59.799 But they didn't find anything, and it was just just asked, 0:53:00.160 --> 0:53:04.040 just asked him and looked outside the boat shed. Oh sorry. 0:53:04.440 --> 0:53:07.200 Police did conduct a search around the boat shed but 0:53:07.239 --> 0:53:09.160 found it was all a hoax. We don't really know 0:53:09.200 --> 0:53:12.279 what happened now. Dean soon realized he wasn't going to 0:53:12.280 --> 0:53:16.560 get caught. David did begin to have a guilty conscience. 0:53:17.040 --> 0:53:20.040 I was too scared to do anything about it. I'm 0:53:20.320 --> 0:53:22.880 he's very young. 0:53:21.920 --> 0:53:27.840 He's obviously been groomed. I'm not putting that aside at all. Yeah, 0:53:27.960 --> 0:53:32.680 but it is also incredibly hard to uh not be 0:53:32.800 --> 0:53:36.680 angry at someone else being involved and not doing anything 0:53:36.719 --> 0:53:37.080 about it. 0:53:37.239 --> 0:53:38.799 Also, if you're watching the YouTube right now, I've got 0:53:38.840 --> 0:53:39.800 the itchiest nose. 0:53:42.040 --> 0:53:43.960 And I have a on a cat. I have a 0:53:43.960 --> 0:53:44.680 T shirt with a cat. 0:53:46.239 --> 0:53:49.919 You've got a beautiful cat top one. David did begin 0:53:49.960 --> 0:53:51.799 to have a guilty conscience. Like I said, was too 0:53:51.840 --> 0:53:53.960 scared to do anything about it. Plus he was earning 0:53:54.000 --> 0:53:55.960 money and saw Dean as a father figure. 0:53:56.400 --> 0:54:00.960 Yeah, he's been incredibly groomed, but yeah, yeah yeah. 0:54:01.000 --> 0:54:04.640 On March ninth, nineteen seventy one, Dean and David drove 0:54:04.719 --> 0:54:08.680 around looking for their next victim. Randal Harvey was returning 0:54:08.680 --> 0:54:11.160 from his job at a gas station and was never 0:54:11.280 --> 0:54:14.920 seen again. David actually knew Randall and called out to 0:54:15.000 --> 0:54:18.080 him to give him a lift home. The same thing 0:54:18.320 --> 0:54:21.720 has happened before, but instead of strangling Randall, it turned 0:54:21.719 --> 0:54:23.520 out that he shot him in the head and buried 0:54:23.560 --> 0:54:27.920 him in the boat shed. He wasn't identified until two 0:54:27.960 --> 0:54:31.600 thousand and eight, what thirty seven years later that he 0:54:31.680 --> 0:54:33.680 was actually a victim of the candy Man. 0:54:34.040 --> 0:54:35.640 Oh my god, it. 0:54:35.600 --> 0:54:37.880 Wouldn't be too long before they were searching for their 0:54:37.880 --> 0:54:41.759 next victim. On May twenty ninth, fourteen year old David 0:54:41.840 --> 0:54:45.919 Hiltergeist and oh Hiller guys sorry, and sixteen year old 0:54:45.920 --> 0:54:48.800 Mally Winkle Malley used to work at the candy shop. 0:54:49.120 --> 0:54:52.200 Malley Winkle who worked at a candy shop. Shut up. 0:54:52.320 --> 0:54:55.399 That is a cartoon character, and I will not let 0:54:55.400 --> 0:54:57.560 you tell me anything bad happened to him. 0:54:57.640 --> 0:55:01.759 David Hilleguys had visited at the candy shop as well, 0:55:02.239 --> 0:55:04.880 and spent so long there once that his mother had 0:55:04.920 --> 0:55:07.879 to actually go and collect him. Both boys were brought 0:55:07.880 --> 0:55:10.719 back to Dean's apartment and the exact same thing laid 0:55:10.719 --> 0:55:14.719 out as before wicker Back. After the murders, officers heard 0:55:14.719 --> 0:55:16.640 that Mally had made a phone call to his mother, 0:55:16.719 --> 0:55:20.160 Selma just before he was taken, saying that he was 0:55:20.200 --> 0:55:21.320 out swimming with his friends. 0:55:21.480 --> 0:55:24.440 No and his mom's men was Selmi can't with this story. 0:55:24.800 --> 0:55:28.720 He was last seen getting into a white fan. Police 0:55:28.760 --> 0:55:32.040 again thought the boys were runaways, but their parents insisted 0:55:32.120 --> 0:55:34.080 that the police search for them and do their job. 0:55:34.680 --> 0:55:36.520 They knew that their children would not just run off 0:55:36.560 --> 0:55:40.120 without saying anything. They went searching themselves and printed off 0:55:40.160 --> 0:55:43.800 posters and a one thousand dollar reward for any information. 0:55:44.800 --> 0:55:48.399 So there's like we're talking kind of a dozen ish 0:55:48.560 --> 0:55:54.080 by my just memory calculations here, boys around the same 0:55:54.120 --> 0:55:57.400 age who've gone missing in the same the same neighborhood, 0:55:57.480 --> 0:56:00.040 not in just the same state, and the police just 0:56:00.120 --> 0:56:01.960 keep saying every single one of them is a runaway 0:56:02.000 --> 0:56:04.520 and will not look into it anymore. Yeah, Oh my god, 0:56:04.560 --> 0:56:05.960 I'm so angry. 0:56:05.680 --> 0:56:08.719 So angry, and imagine these parents, like they're coming to 0:56:08.760 --> 0:56:11.239 the police station every day. Go please look, please look, 0:56:11.360 --> 0:56:14.160 Oh God. There's also rumors about dank coral at the time. 0:56:15.120 --> 0:56:17.440 They then took out a loan to hire a private investigator, 0:56:18.640 --> 0:56:21.839 he believed, and also saying before this is a low 0:56:21.960 --> 0:56:25.759 socioeconomic so they're taking it a loan and offering up 0:56:25.800 --> 0:56:28.239 one thousand dollars of their own money. In the seventies, 0:56:28.880 --> 0:56:31.239 he believed that their boys can be taken by a 0:56:31.280 --> 0:56:35.520 man by the name of Chicken Joe. Isn't it crazy, 0:56:38.080 --> 0:56:38.680 Chicken Joe. 0:56:39.000 --> 0:56:42.080 Chicken Chicken Joe is like he was a guy they. 0:56:41.960 --> 0:56:48.000 Called cold Chicken Joe, that Chicken Joe who provided male 0:56:48.080 --> 0:56:51.279 sex workers to clients, and their son might have been 0:56:51.280 --> 0:56:54.799 sold to a sex trafficking ring. The boys' parents ended 0:56:54.880 --> 0:56:58.400 up driving out to the Montrose area and parked outside 0:56:58.440 --> 0:57:02.240 a gay bar called the Silver Dollar Saloon. They watched 0:57:02.239 --> 0:57:04.239 the door all night, hoping to see their son being 0:57:04.280 --> 0:57:09.120 taken in and out in or out. Yeah, but Chicken Joe, 0:57:09.160 --> 0:57:09.960 I don't know about. 0:57:09.719 --> 0:57:10.319 That Chicken Jo. 0:57:10.520 --> 0:57:10.840 I don't know. 0:57:12.160 --> 0:57:14.520 I don't know about that Chicken Joe. Did you look 0:57:14.560 --> 0:57:16.360 into him and that. 0:57:18.840 --> 0:57:22.200 What's your I think you just loved eat that chop? 0:57:22.920 --> 0:57:24.400 You love that chick, love that fried chok. What do 0:57:24.400 --> 0:57:24.760 you think? 0:57:25.280 --> 0:57:27.760 I think that he was a big old woose. 0:57:28.280 --> 0:57:31.960 Oh big chicken, big chip big. Let's look it up 0:57:31.960 --> 0:57:33.560 and we'll do it. In the show notes, I can 0:57:33.560 --> 0:57:34.120 find anything. 0:57:34.280 --> 0:57:37.360 Yep, chicken chicken Joe had that chicken Joe. 0:57:37.480 --> 0:57:40.600 Their parents called the police station every day, even telling 0:57:40.600 --> 0:57:44.680 the police about specific details that they should be looking into. Dorothy, 0:57:44.760 --> 0:57:48.200 one of the boys mothers, even took down a license 0:57:48.280 --> 0:57:52.040 plate t m F seven to four that had been 0:57:52.120 --> 0:57:55.479 spotted with a mysterious man sitting in the driver's signe. 0:57:55.600 --> 0:57:58.200 The parents are out doing, they're doing the detective. 0:57:58.360 --> 0:58:02.919 Yeah yeah. A fifteen year old neighborhood boy, Alma Wayne 0:58:03.000 --> 0:58:06.880 Henley Junior remember this name name yeap called by the 0:58:07.280 --> 0:58:11.120 Hiller guysed house to ask about David, who had gone missing. 0:58:12.040 --> 0:58:14.080 He was a good friend of David's and only lived 0:58:14.120 --> 0:58:14.920 a block away. 0:58:15.200 --> 0:58:17.400 Alma was friends of David Hiller geist yes. 0:58:17.280 --> 0:58:20.440 Yeah, yeah. He got some posters from his mum to 0:58:20.480 --> 0:58:24.160 hang out around town. Alma was supposed to be a victim, 0:58:24.320 --> 0:58:27.040 but Dean thought that Alma could be another person like 0:58:27.120 --> 0:58:30.720 David Brooks who would lure kids in for him. He 0:58:30.760 --> 0:58:33.320 offered him the same deal, two hundred dollars for any 0:58:33.360 --> 0:58:34.760 boy that was brought to him. 0:58:34.880 --> 0:58:36.760 And how did he come into contact with Dean? 0:58:37.360 --> 0:58:39.600 So he was friends with David Brooks as well. 0:58:39.800 --> 0:58:41.960 And David Hiller Geist Yes, okay, okay. 0:58:42.480 --> 0:58:44.320 A lot of the parents who met Dean thought he 0:58:44.360 --> 0:58:48.040 was a lovely, pleasant man. He knew how to disguise himself. 0:58:48.600 --> 0:58:51.480 When he went over to Alma's house. His mother invited 0:58:51.520 --> 0:58:53.040 him in for an Eastern lunch. 0:58:53.160 --> 0:58:54.480 Why did he go over to his house? 0:58:54.560 --> 0:58:56.800 Well, he went to fix his car, so I went 0:58:56.840 --> 0:59:00.200 to fix it. Yeah, the mum's car. Even Dean's girlfriend, Betty, 0:59:00.400 --> 0:59:04.000 who he'd been dating for three years, didn't know the 0:59:04.040 --> 0:59:04.840 real Dean. 0:59:05.240 --> 0:59:07.160 Like hope, no if she was still dating him. 0:59:07.040 --> 0:59:09.840 Yeah, oh yeah, exactly. She claimed that he was never 0:59:09.880 --> 0:59:13.560 sexually aggressive with her. The only thing she noticed out 0:59:13.560 --> 0:59:16.120 of the ordinary was once when they were having sex, 0:59:16.160 --> 0:59:19.880 he stopped because he wasn't feeling into it. To her, 0:59:19.960 --> 0:59:23.200 he was an upstanding citizen who she was intent on 0:59:23.280 --> 0:59:26.240 settling down with. She even ignored that he brought the 0:59:26.280 --> 0:59:28.600 two boys David and Alma with him on some of 0:59:28.640 --> 0:59:29.760 their dates. 0:59:29.800 --> 0:59:32.080 So creepy, Alma. 0:59:31.760 --> 0:59:35.840 Hadn't seen the real Dean by this point, only David Brooks. 0:59:36.520 --> 0:59:38.880 Dean promised Alma that if he brought boys to him 0:59:39.240 --> 0:59:42.240 that he could help him help his family with some money. 0:59:43.120 --> 0:59:46.200 He explained that he sold the boys to an underground 0:59:46.400 --> 0:59:47.520 sex trafficking ring. 0:59:47.920 --> 0:59:52.440 Sorry, who did he explain that to Alma, and Alma 0:59:52.600 --> 0:59:53.600 was like, okay, cool. 0:59:53.440 --> 0:59:57.240 Okay cool. The sex trafficking ring has been something that 0:59:57.280 --> 0:59:59.960 has come up quite a lot in researching this cave. 1:00:00.680 --> 1:00:04.360 Dean's monstrous hirade came to an end in nineteen seventy three. 1:00:04.720 --> 1:00:08.520 I found the following information about the sex trafficking of boys. 1:00:09.200 --> 1:00:13.240 In February nineteen seventy five, during a routine inquiry, the 1:00:13.280 --> 1:00:18.000 Houston Police Department uncovered an extensive collection of illegal photographs 1:00:18.000 --> 1:00:21.560 and films depicting underage boys, some as young as eight, 1:00:21.880 --> 1:00:25.800 many of whom were from the Houston Heights area where 1:00:26.000 --> 1:00:31.080 Dean Coral resided. Sixteen individuals were identifiable in the material. 1:00:31.480 --> 1:00:35.280 Eleven appeared to match victims already attributed to Dean at 1:00:35.280 --> 1:00:38.800 the time. The remaining individuals had been miners when the 1:00:38.800 --> 1:00:42.160 images were created, but were adult by the time authorities 1:00:42.160 --> 1:00:46.320 discovered the material and interviewed them, indicating that the collection 1:00:46.360 --> 1:00:51.080 had been assembled over a prolonged period. The discovery raised 1:00:51.080 --> 1:00:55.000 troubling questions about Dean's claim to both Henley and Brooks 1:00:55.360 --> 1:00:58.000 that he was connected to a Dallas based group that 1:00:58.040 --> 1:01:01.680 trafficked boys. In the art math of the Houston discovery, 1:01:01.760 --> 1:01:06.600 five individuals were arrested in Santa Clara, California, including a 1:01:06.600 --> 1:01:09.120 man by the name of Roy Ames, the owner of 1:01:09.160 --> 1:01:12.400 the warehouse whether material had been stored, and a known 1:01:12.440 --> 1:01:17.160 producer of child sexual abuse material. Ames's name was found 1:01:17.200 --> 1:01:21.400 on a card in Dean Coral's wallet. Despite this, police 1:01:21.400 --> 1:01:25.920 did not establish a direct connection between Coral and those arrested, 1:01:26.040 --> 1:01:28.240 what so they didn't know if he was actually a 1:01:28.280 --> 1:01:32.200 part of the sex trafficking ring. Police officials later stated 1:01:32.240 --> 1:01:35.880 they chose not to investigate any possible link to the murders, 1:01:36.000 --> 1:01:41.240 believing the victims' families had already endured sufficient trauma. If 1:01:41.240 --> 1:01:43.920 they were sex trafficked or not, Yep. 1:01:43.840 --> 1:01:48.200 Surely the but I don't know how to respond to that. 1:01:49.240 --> 1:01:54.040 I understand if they're going okay, the parents know that 1:01:54.120 --> 1:01:58.320 they've met a horrible, untimely death. That's enough trauma for 1:01:58.360 --> 1:01:59.240 the parents to deal with. 1:01:59.360 --> 1:01:59.600 Yep. 1:02:00.160 --> 1:02:05.360 But it also is like in the name of justice 1:02:05.600 --> 1:02:08.440 and making sure other people weren't involved, you can't just 1:02:08.480 --> 1:02:10.200 go We don't want to put the parents through any 1:02:10.400 --> 1:02:13.680 no anymore, So we just won't investigate this sex trafficking 1:02:13.760 --> 1:02:16.360 ring that there's lots of quote unquote rumors. 1:02:16.120 --> 1:02:18.560 About there's a lot in this case how the. 1:02:18.360 --> 1:02:21.520 Children involved, Like what there are other victims that that 1:02:21.680 --> 1:02:22.680 is messed up. 1:02:23.120 --> 1:02:24.520 We'll go into it later, but there's a lot in 1:02:24.520 --> 1:02:26.840 this case. Were just like what happened there? Like why 1:02:26.880 --> 1:02:30.200 did they stop at one point, they actually stopped looking 1:02:30.240 --> 1:02:32.200 for victims because they didn't want the number to go 1:02:32.280 --> 1:02:35.280 up any higher. Jesus Christ, that's why there's so many. 1:02:35.360 --> 1:02:37.640 That's why the number we're not sure what the number 1:02:37.680 --> 1:02:40.160 actually is because it would have been the biggest serial 1:02:40.240 --> 1:02:43.479 killer in Texas history, and then it would have didn't 1:02:43.600 --> 1:02:46.400 want it to be Yeah, like what the hell? Early 1:02:47.360 --> 1:02:53.000 on August fifteen, nineteen seventy three, two days after investigators 1:02:53.040 --> 1:02:56.320 located the final bodies initially associated with what they called 1:02:56.360 --> 1:03:02.520 the Houston mass murders, Dallas authorities uncovered a nationwide exploitation 1:03:02.680 --> 1:03:06.720 network opened by John David Norman. The raid resulted in 1:03:06.760 --> 1:03:11.439 the seizure of a card index containing as many as 1:03:11.520 --> 1:03:15.160 ten thousand names lots from across the country, along with 1:03:15.240 --> 1:03:20.160 detailed records of teenage boys victimized by this operation. No 1:03:20.280 --> 1:03:24.720 definitive evidence has emerged to show that Dean Core recruited 1:03:24.720 --> 1:03:29.160 his victims through such an organization. This is partly due 1:03:29.200 --> 1:03:32.360 to the department's decision not to pursue that line of inquiry, 1:03:33.400 --> 1:03:38.520 and partly because neither Brooks nor Henley ever reported encountering 1:03:38.600 --> 1:03:42.480 anyone connected to the alleged group, only Dean Coral. Both 1:03:42.600 --> 1:03:46.240 also stated they never witnessed victims being photographed, filmed, or 1:03:46.480 --> 1:03:51.000 released after being restrained. However, the Santa Clara arrests lends 1:03:51.000 --> 1:03:54.240 some credibility to David Brooks's claims that Dean had told 1:03:54.320 --> 1:03:58.680 him his earliest victims were buried in California, so now 1:03:58.800 --> 1:04:03.800 Dean had two boys luring others to him. Alma again 1:04:04.120 --> 1:04:08.600 trusted Dean like a father. In nineteen seventy two, Alma 1:04:08.680 --> 1:04:10.960 spotted a teenager and asked if they wanted to get 1:04:10.960 --> 1:04:14.480 in their van. Before long Dean was back at a 1:04:14.520 --> 1:04:18.680 new apartment he moved frequently. Alma didn't know at that 1:04:18.720 --> 1:04:22.920 point the Dean was actually torturing the boys himself. He 1:04:23.000 --> 1:04:25.360 thought he was sending them off to a sex trafficking ring, 1:04:25.400 --> 1:04:27.680 but he soon learned very different, and that. 1:04:27.760 --> 1:04:30.400 Was okay with him. Yeah, as long as my friend's 1:04:30.400 --> 1:04:34.280 not doing it, I'll help supply these victims for someone else. 1:04:34.360 --> 1:04:36.919 That's right now. I'm going to get really graphic here, 1:04:37.360 --> 1:04:40.880 so warning if you'd like to skip ahead thirty seconds 1:04:40.960 --> 1:04:44.560 to a minute here. Alma had no idea at this point. 1:04:44.600 --> 1:04:47.200 The Dean would use plies to rip out the puper 1:04:47.280 --> 1:04:50.160 cares one by one. Then he would take glass rods 1:04:50.400 --> 1:04:54.000 and insert them into their urethras before shattering them while 1:04:54.000 --> 1:04:55.480 inside the victim's penises. 1:04:55.600 --> 1:04:55.880 Good. 1:04:56.320 --> 1:04:58.960 Dean would then keep a small trinket like a house key, 1:04:59.600 --> 1:05:02.280 which has stated wasn't just a trophy but a way 1:05:02.320 --> 1:05:07.200 for him to burglarize the victims and further traumatize the families. 1:05:07.720 --> 1:05:10.840 He would often also take bites of the boys' penises 1:05:10.880 --> 1:05:16.480 and testicles, sometimes ripping them off. Once Alma found out 1:05:16.520 --> 1:05:20.040 what Dean was really doing, he didn't stop. He felt 1:05:20.080 --> 1:05:24.919 protected and close to Dean while there was been there's 1:05:24.920 --> 1:05:27.160 been a lot of pointing fingers at both Alma and 1:05:27.240 --> 1:05:30.880 David Brooks for their involvement in this. And when you're 1:05:30.880 --> 1:05:33.360 a teenager, you certainly know the difference between right and wrong. 1:05:33.600 --> 1:05:36.520 I would like to make it clear how manipulative Dean 1:05:36.800 --> 1:05:39.800 was and how he could change his personality to get 1:05:39.960 --> 1:05:43.800 what he wanted. Now, not only was he a master manipulator, 1:05:44.120 --> 1:05:47.320 but he also rewarded the boys financially and told them 1:05:47.400 --> 1:05:50.880 that he would always be there for them. Dean, I find, 1:05:51.080 --> 1:05:54.240 is not too dissimilar from serial killers Dennis Nilsen and 1:05:54.320 --> 1:05:55.200 Jeffrey Dahmer. 1:05:55.440 --> 1:05:57.840 I was really thinking of it. Yeah, I've been thinking, 1:05:58.000 --> 1:06:00.560 like planning to say about Jeffrey Dahmer, why is he? 1:06:01.000 --> 1:06:03.800 And just talking about American ones as well? Why is he? 1:06:03.800 --> 1:06:08.440 He's so much more well known informers. I guess there 1:06:08.440 --> 1:06:11.520 are fewer victims, but yeah, I think the same kind 1:06:11.560 --> 1:06:12.280 of victims. 1:06:12.560 --> 1:06:15.680 I know. I think he dismembered them, and I think he. 1:06:16.200 --> 1:06:17.800 Just feels to me like this one is so much 1:06:18.560 --> 1:06:20.720 more awful that people just don't talk about it. 1:06:21.200 --> 1:06:23.400 Yeah, I think the details and everything, and there are 1:06:23.440 --> 1:06:29.200 so so many details they targeted young, vulnerable boys who 1:06:29.280 --> 1:06:32.120 were often runaways. So the idea was that no one 1:06:32.160 --> 1:06:33.120 will go looking for them. 1:06:33.280 --> 1:06:35.360 Yeah, that's that's exactly what made me think of Darma. 1:06:35.560 --> 1:06:39.360 Yeah, and Dennis Nelson as well. Frank Kageary was the 1:06:39.400 --> 1:06:43.360 next victim Alma, and he worked at Long John Silver's together. 1:06:43.880 --> 1:06:47.000 Alma waited for him after their shift to hang out. 1:06:47.320 --> 1:06:49.960 Alma led him straight to Dean and once they arrived, 1:06:50.080 --> 1:06:53.439 Dean would want to play his handcuff game. Dean would 1:06:53.440 --> 1:06:57.120 put them on someone's wrist and or his wrist and 1:06:57.200 --> 1:06:58.720 kind of show that he could get out of them, 1:06:59.120 --> 1:07:01.160 and then he would put them on them and he 1:07:01.400 --> 1:07:04.000 could have the key. Yeah, And that was basically something 1:07:04.080 --> 1:07:06.720 that maybe inspired John Wayne Gacy, because John Wyne Gacy 1:07:06.760 --> 1:07:09.080 did that exact same thing. It's possibly where he got 1:07:09.120 --> 1:07:12.240 his inspiration. Frank Kageary was engaged to be married to 1:07:12.240 --> 1:07:15.560 a woman by the name of Ronda Williams. Remember that name. 1:07:17.360 --> 1:07:19.840 I'm not going to go through all the victims here. 1:07:20.160 --> 1:07:21.800 I will read their names at the end. But the 1:07:21.840 --> 1:07:24.960 torture continued and continued, and I have not said the 1:07:24.960 --> 1:07:25.440 worst of it. 1:07:25.920 --> 1:07:26.680 Oh my god. 1:07:26.880 --> 1:07:29.520 There was a young boy who escaped a boy by 1:07:29.560 --> 1:07:34.560 the name of Billy Ryaninger Ryaning. I think he was 1:07:34.600 --> 1:07:36.960 tied to the torture board. David begged Dean to let 1:07:37.080 --> 1:07:38.200 him go, which he did. 1:07:38.520 --> 1:07:39.400 Why do we know? 1:07:39.560 --> 1:07:42.400 We don't know, We don't know why. But Billy fled 1:07:42.440 --> 1:07:44.960 the house and they worried that he was going to 1:07:45.000 --> 1:07:48.680 say something. Alma was furious that they let him go, 1:07:48.880 --> 1:07:52.240 and Alma knock David Brooks unconscious when he came back 1:07:52.280 --> 1:07:55.040 to the house. Dean then tortured him. 1:07:55.960 --> 1:07:58.080 Alma David David. 1:07:59.080 --> 1:08:00.800 David thought that he does served it. At this point, 1:08:01.760 --> 1:08:05.520 Dean now believed that Alma was even more loyal than David. 1:08:06.480 --> 1:08:08.920 Dean would move quickly from apartment apartment, like I said, 1:08:08.960 --> 1:08:11.560 apartment to apartments sorry, like I said, that was fun 1:08:11.640 --> 1:08:14.960 to say, seemingly wororthy was going to get caught each time. 1:08:15.000 --> 1:08:17.320 He'd stay in a place like for a couple of 1:08:17.320 --> 1:08:20.680 months and then move again. The trio were now a 1:08:20.680 --> 1:08:23.280 well oiled machine, and it seemed as though they would 1:08:23.280 --> 1:08:27.360 stop at nothing. One boy disappeared after the next, and 1:08:27.479 --> 1:08:31.240 police didn't seem to be investigating them, investigating them as linked. 1:08:32.000 --> 1:08:35.840 Alma and David went out on October nineteen seventy two, 1:08:36.280 --> 1:08:41.640 and they came across Wally Simminow and Richard Henry. They 1:08:41.680 --> 1:08:46.040 started walking towards Richard's house. They were able to point 1:08:46.200 --> 1:08:49.479 Oh They were able to get him into David's or 1:08:49.520 --> 1:08:52.200 both of the boys into David's corvette and take them 1:08:52.200 --> 1:08:55.160 to Dean's apartment. At some point in the night while 1:08:55.160 --> 1:08:57.759 he was able to call his mother from Dean's apartment, 1:08:58.000 --> 1:09:00.760 but it cut off very quickly. Only word he was 1:09:00.800 --> 1:09:05.559 able to get out was Mama. The next day, Alma 1:09:05.640 --> 1:09:09.840 accidentally shot Richard in the mouth. They were strangled to 1:09:09.880 --> 1:09:12.840 death and buried in the boat shed. Like the majority 1:09:12.960 --> 1:09:25.639 of the other victims, Alma had talked to a boy 1:09:25.720 --> 1:09:29.320 by the name of Timothy Curly into going over to 1:09:29.400 --> 1:09:33.640 Dean's apartment, but they weren't alone. Ronda Williams was the 1:09:33.680 --> 1:09:36.920 fiance of Frank A. Geary. She wanted to get away 1:09:36.960 --> 1:09:39.200 from home that day because her dad was drunk and 1:09:39.280 --> 1:09:43.559 hurting her. She ended up with Timothy, and when Alba 1:09:43.600 --> 1:09:46.719 was trying to get Timothy back to Dean's place, Ronda 1:09:46.760 --> 1:09:49.840 went to Alma had told them that they were just 1:09:49.880 --> 1:09:53.120 going to a party. When they arrived at his house, 1:09:53.200 --> 1:09:55.600 Dean was mad because Ronda was there too, and that 1:09:55.720 --> 1:09:58.479 wasn't part of the plan. It was going to mess 1:09:58.600 --> 1:10:03.160 up his plans. They started partying anyway. Dean was formulating 1:10:03.200 --> 1:10:07.160 a plan while the teens were partying. After a little while, 1:10:07.520 --> 1:10:11.719 the teens fell asleep. Alma woke up to find himself 1:10:11.800 --> 1:10:15.439 gagged and handcuffed as well, and so too were Tim 1:10:15.479 --> 1:10:19.120 and Ronda. He had just waited for them to fall 1:10:19.120 --> 1:10:20.519 asleep so he could bind them all. 1:10:20.720 --> 1:10:22.920 I mean, I don't think they had just fallen asleep. 1:10:22.960 --> 1:10:25.240 If he's woken up time and gagged like you'd wake 1:10:25.320 --> 1:10:27.559 up earlier than that, it feels like there was that's right. 1:10:27.960 --> 1:10:31.639 Sort of sleep. Dean told them that they were all 1:10:31.680 --> 1:10:36.479 going to diet because they brought Ronda with him with them. Yeah. 1:10:36.680 --> 1:10:40.559 Alma started pleading to let him go, saying that if 1:10:40.600 --> 1:10:43.320 Dean let him go, he would help him kill the 1:10:43.320 --> 1:10:48.360 other two. Dean agreed to that plan. They dragged Ronda 1:10:48.400 --> 1:10:50.679 and Tim to the bedroom put them on the torture board. 1:10:51.040 --> 1:10:54.479 Dean handed Alma and knife and said, you're going to 1:10:54.560 --> 1:10:57.840 cut the clothes off of Ronda. You're going to rape 1:10:57.840 --> 1:11:02.400 her and then kill her. Meanwhile, Dean was going to 1:11:02.400 --> 1:11:05.600 do the same to tim Alma asked Dean if he 1:11:05.600 --> 1:11:09.400 could take Ronda to another room. All of this escalated 1:11:09.840 --> 1:11:12.800 into Alma getting Dean's gun, pointing it at Dean and 1:11:12.840 --> 1:11:15.000 saying this is too much for me. 1:11:15.240 --> 1:11:15.479 Wow. 1:11:15.800 --> 1:11:18.000 Dean did not think he was serious and urged him 1:11:18.040 --> 1:11:21.280 to shoot him. Alma shot him in the forehead. But 1:11:21.320 --> 1:11:23.960 it does not but it did not penetrate his skull. 1:11:24.160 --> 1:11:27.679 Oh what Dean was still up shooting Dean three times 1:11:27.720 --> 1:11:32.920 in the back and killing him. Wait, so al Alma 1:11:33.000 --> 1:11:33.400 killed Dean? 1:11:33.520 --> 1:11:33.880 He did? 1:11:34.120 --> 1:11:34.360 Yep? 1:11:34.840 --> 1:11:37.360 Oh so this motherfucker's never actually had to pay for it. 1:11:37.760 --> 1:11:42.040 Oh no, no, I'm done with the story canceled. 1:11:41.760 --> 1:11:45.280 They called the police. Alma explained what happened when he 1:11:45.400 --> 1:11:47.960 woke up, saying that he and the other two were 1:11:48.000 --> 1:11:51.320 tied up. He explained that he told Dean he would 1:11:51.360 --> 1:11:54.120 help him if he let him go. Ronda later said 1:11:54.120 --> 1:11:57.439 that Alma saved her and Timothy's lives, saying he killed 1:11:57.439 --> 1:12:01.639 the devil. This is a phone call from Alma, who 1:12:01.640 --> 1:12:04.960 went by the middle name Wayne, to his mother directly 1:12:05.160 --> 1:12:07.000 after he killed Are. 1:12:06.840 --> 1:12:07.479 You gonna play it? 1:12:07.560 --> 1:12:07.720 Yeah? 1:12:07.760 --> 1:12:12.519 Oh my god, Mama's Wayne. 1:12:13.680 --> 1:12:35.280 Mama, I killed thee Yes, it's I. 1:12:31.680 --> 1:12:33.440 If that were keeps. 1:12:35.280 --> 1:12:40.880 Can I yeah, yes, she can't. 1:12:41.040 --> 1:12:44.439 Now you can't come. I'm worth the police. 1:12:44.560 --> 1:12:44.960 Mama. 1:12:46.080 --> 1:12:47.280 Oh, that's really disturbing. 1:12:47.320 --> 1:12:51.600 That's so disturbing. He did not admit right away to 1:12:51.680 --> 1:12:56.160 his role. Police found the torture board, which had handcuffed 1:12:57.160 --> 1:13:00.560 a large dildo and plastic covering the carpet. It was 1:13:00.600 --> 1:13:03.840 a room just designed for torture. They also found a 1:13:03.880 --> 1:13:07.680 crate with air holes where he would keep someone confined. 1:13:08.640 --> 1:13:10.559 Alma told his side of the story, but at some 1:13:10.640 --> 1:13:14.840 point the police became very skeptical of him. He then 1:13:14.880 --> 1:13:19.120 admitted to serving as someone that lured people for Dean. 1:13:20.040 --> 1:13:22.920 I helped him pick them, he said. He then gave 1:13:22.960 --> 1:13:26.000 the name of David Brooks, saying that he had the 1:13:26.040 --> 1:13:27.240 same role as him. 1:13:27.479 --> 1:13:29.120 Where was David in all in this? 1:13:29.760 --> 1:13:33.720 So after kind of everything happened with you know, when 1:13:33.760 --> 1:13:36.680 he was punished for what he did, he ended up 1:13:36.680 --> 1:13:41.080 moving away, like to be involved in this anymore, moved away, 1:13:41.160 --> 1:13:43.799 got a girlfriend, was going to be married. Oh yeah, 1:13:43.800 --> 1:13:46.599 So he moved on and moved further away, and Alma 1:13:46.680 --> 1:13:51.040 was then the person that Dean was relying on. Over 1:13:51.080 --> 1:13:54.320 the next few days, Alma spilt everything about his part. 1:13:54.920 --> 1:13:57.400 He would then lead police to where many of the 1:13:57.479 --> 1:14:01.479 victims were buried, the rented boat shed. In the boat shed, 1:14:01.560 --> 1:14:05.160 police recovered the bodies of seventeen boys the Dean had 1:14:05.160 --> 1:14:09.120 tortured and murdered. Ten more were found at other burial sites, 1:14:09.400 --> 1:14:12.080 some on the beach, some in the woods, always in 1:14:12.240 --> 1:14:16.240 the woods. Many believed that there were many, many more victims. 1:14:16.920 --> 1:14:21.040 This took place over just a couple of years. They 1:14:21.080 --> 1:14:23.719 would see that some of these boys had instruments inserted 1:14:23.720 --> 1:14:26.320 into them, like we spoke about before, Some were carstrated, 1:14:27.040 --> 1:14:29.920 like the torture they discovered just went on and on. 1:14:30.400 --> 1:14:33.080 I won't go on and explain everything, but these were 1:14:33.080 --> 1:14:36.479 there were many more horrific acts, and the cruelty is 1:14:36.520 --> 1:14:40.600 absolutely monstrous. This is also where I mean I was 1:14:40.640 --> 1:14:44.599 saying before that police just stopped searching at some point 1:14:44.640 --> 1:14:48.560 as well. And all these unconnected people. So if you 1:14:48.600 --> 1:14:50.559 do any more reading on Dean Coral, you'll find out 1:14:50.560 --> 1:14:53.240 there are so many unconnected people that people actually believe 1:14:54.040 --> 1:14:54.800 were people. 1:14:54.720 --> 1:14:58.719 Just they just couldn't connect like that, they couldn't link 1:14:58.800 --> 1:15:02.000 them to him directly. That's right, But it seems like 1:15:02.040 --> 1:15:02.479 it could be. 1:15:02.680 --> 1:15:06.840 Yeah. David Brooks went on trial in Houston before Judge 1:15:06.840 --> 1:15:12.439 William Hatton on February twenty seventh, nineteen seventy five. Although 1:15:12.439 --> 1:15:15.479 he had been indicted for four murders committed between nineteen 1:15:15.560 --> 1:15:20.280 seventy and June nineteen seventy three, prosecutors elected to try 1:15:20.400 --> 1:15:24.040 him solely for the June nineteen seventy three killing a 1:15:24.080 --> 1:15:28.439 fifteen year old William Ray Lawrence. Well, they couldn't. They 1:15:28.439 --> 1:15:31.600 didn't have enough on him to Let's get him on 1:15:31.640 --> 1:15:34.519 the one that we can actually prove, okay. David Brooks 1:15:34.640 --> 1:15:39.200 attorney Jim Skelton maintained that his client had not personally 1:15:39.200 --> 1:15:43.360 committed any murders, instead asserting that Dean Coral and, to 1:15:43.400 --> 1:15:47.479 a lesser extent, Henley were responsible for carrying out the killings. 1:15:47.960 --> 1:15:53.400 Assistant District Attorney Tommy Dunn forcefully rejected this argument, telling 1:15:53.439 --> 1:15:56.640 the jury at one point was he an innocent bystander? 1:15:57.479 --> 1:16:01.840 This defendant was in on this killing, this murderous rampage, 1:16:01.920 --> 1:16:05.360 from the very beginning. He tells you he was a cheerleader, 1:16:05.400 --> 1:16:08.679 if nothing else. That's what he was telling you about 1:16:08.720 --> 1:16:11.360 his presence. You know he was in on it. 1:16:11.720 --> 1:16:14.000 We've discussed this so many times before on the pod. 1:16:14.680 --> 1:16:17.280 I remember Fred and Rosemary West is one that we 1:16:17.320 --> 1:16:21.360 spoke about it because after Fred West died, Rosemary was 1:16:21.360 --> 1:16:25.200 the one, the only one on trial, and so her 1:16:25.240 --> 1:16:29.240 defense was, you know, she didn't fell them, you're just 1:16:29.320 --> 1:16:32.519 wanting to make me culpable because he's not here anymore. 1:16:32.960 --> 1:16:35.920 And I remember the judge in that actually said it 1:16:35.960 --> 1:16:38.240 does not matter who pulled the trigger or who you 1:16:38.280 --> 1:16:42.680 know cast the knife. Yeah, if you are that involved, 1:16:42.720 --> 1:16:44.360 then you are just as implics and you were just 1:16:44.400 --> 1:16:45.479 as guilty of murder. 1:16:45.640 --> 1:16:47.800 Yeah, thing exactly. 1:16:48.200 --> 1:16:51.800 Yeah, murder doesn't have to be found guilty or be 1:16:52.000 --> 1:16:54.160 guilty of murder. Doesn't mean you have to have been 1:16:54.200 --> 1:16:57.600 the one that's actually no, in died the person's life directly. 1:16:58.040 --> 1:17:01.040 You're in accomplice and you're aware of it. In his 1:17:01.160 --> 1:17:05.320 forty minute closing arguments, Skeleton stress that the prosecutions are 1:17:05.479 --> 1:17:08.879 case relied entirely on circumstantial evidence. 1:17:09.000 --> 1:17:10.719 Yeah, that doesn't mean they can't be found. 1:17:10.479 --> 1:17:13.960 Guilty No, and argue that the state had demonstrated only 1:17:14.000 --> 1:17:18.000 that Brooks was an accessory, not a principal offender. He 1:17:18.120 --> 1:17:21.679 stated the state has proven David Owen Brooks of being 1:17:21.720 --> 1:17:25.000 an accessory to murder. The state has not established a 1:17:25.080 --> 1:17:29.439 murder case. They have proved accessory to murder, not murder. 1:17:29.760 --> 1:17:33.880 Before you convict, you've got to find an act to punish. 1:17:34.160 --> 1:17:37.200 The trial concluded in under a week. After deliberating for 1:17:37.200 --> 1:17:40.960 approximately ninety minutes, the DURA returned to a guilty verdict. 1:17:41.280 --> 1:17:43.200 On March four, nineteen seventy five. 1:17:43.240 --> 1:17:44.320 That's so quick. 1:17:44.920 --> 1:17:48.439 David Brooks was convicted of Lawrence's murder and sentenced to 1:17:48.479 --> 1:17:51.920 life in prison. He displayed no visible reaction as a 1:17:52.000 --> 1:17:56.479 sentence was announced, though his wife became visibly distraught, so 1:17:56.560 --> 1:17:59.360 he was actually married at this point. David Brooks later 1:17:59.520 --> 1:18:04.040 pealed the conviction, arguing that his sign confessions had been 1:18:04.040 --> 1:18:07.800 obtained without proper advice of his legal rights. However, the 1:18:07.880 --> 1:18:09.599 appeal was rejected. 1:18:09.680 --> 1:18:13.640 Yeah late, A bit late to be, claiming. 1:18:13.280 --> 1:18:18.640 That absolutely After the trial, Alma and David were prosecuted 1:18:18.680 --> 1:18:22.840 separately for their involvement in the murders. Henley's trial began 1:18:23.080 --> 1:18:28.240 on July one, nineteen seventy four, before a judge Preston 1:18:28.320 --> 1:18:32.799 Dial in San Antonio. He was charged with six murders 1:18:33.800 --> 1:18:38.280 committed between March nineteen seventy two and July nineteen seventy three. 1:18:38.439 --> 1:18:41.920 I'm interested to know how and why they chose like 1:18:41.960 --> 1:18:44.400 the six for him and then the one for David Brooks, 1:18:44.400 --> 1:18:45.200 Like why there. 1:18:46.040 --> 1:18:47.840 I wonder if he'd be involved in so many more. 1:18:47.880 --> 1:18:50.200 I wonder how and why choose those ones. 1:18:50.479 --> 1:18:53.840 Yeah, probably he transported a few there as well. Maybe 1:18:53.840 --> 1:18:56.160 they found a little bit more evidence for him. It's 1:18:56.160 --> 1:18:59.200 hard to know. Yeah, Acting on the advice of his attorneys, 1:18:59.479 --> 1:19:03.920 Henley chose not to testify. He led counsel. His lead council, 1:19:04.000 --> 1:19:08.320 sorry William gray Cross, examined several prosecution witnesses, but did 1:19:08.360 --> 1:19:12.480 not present any witnesses or expert testimony for the defense. 1:19:13.040 --> 1:19:20.280 The prosecution presented testimony from twenty four witnesses, including Ronda Williams. 1:19:20.600 --> 1:19:23.840 So essentially, you're saying there was like no defense. The 1:19:23.920 --> 1:19:26.320 defense brought nothing. They just pleaded not guilty. 1:19:26.120 --> 1:19:26.920 It brought no. 1:19:26.840 --> 1:19:32.439 Witnesses anything, and submitted eighty two exhibits into evidence. These 1:19:32.479 --> 1:19:35.360 included Dean Coral's torture board and one of the storage 1:19:35.400 --> 1:19:41.360 boxes used to transport victims. Investigators are testified that hair 1:19:41.479 --> 1:19:44.800 recovered from the box was consistent with that of two 1:19:44.880 --> 1:19:50.200 of the victims and also Henley. The defense again declined 1:19:50.240 --> 1:19:55.840 to call any witnesses so weird. Among the prosecution witnesses 1:19:56.439 --> 1:20:00.280 was Detective David mcmullikem, who read portions of hea Ley's 1:20:00.280 --> 1:20:04.799 written statements detailing his rule in the crimes. In these statements, 1:20:04.880 --> 1:20:08.639 Henley described how he had lured two victims called Cobble 1:20:08.720 --> 1:20:13.519 and Jones, to Dean Coral's Pasadena home. He recounted that 1:20:13.640 --> 1:20:17.880 both youths were restrained following their arrival and subjected to 1:20:17.920 --> 1:20:23.160 prolonged abuse. Henley stated that Dean Coral forced the victims 1:20:23.160 --> 1:20:25.840 to fight each other under the promise that one would 1:20:25.840 --> 1:20:30.959 be spared. After several hours, Jones was restrained and compelled 1:20:31.000 --> 1:20:35.799 to witness further abuse inflicted upon Cobble, who was ultimately killed. 1:20:36.400 --> 1:20:39.960 Jones was later killed as well. Cobble and Jones were 1:20:40.040 --> 1:20:43.960 murdered on July twenty seven, nineteen seventy three, two days 1:20:44.000 --> 1:20:48.559 after being reported missing. The testimony describing these events were 1:20:48.600 --> 1:20:52.040 so distressing that several victims family members left the courtroom 1:20:52.240 --> 1:20:56.600 to regain their composure. Closing arguments were delivered on the 1:20:57.040 --> 1:21:02.200 on July fifteenth, nineteen seventy four. The prosecutions sought life imprisonment, 1:21:02.479 --> 1:21:06.240 while the defense argued for acquittal. In addressing the jury, 1:21:06.280 --> 1:21:10.840 District Attorney Carol Vans apologized for his inability to seek 1:21:10.960 --> 1:21:14.040 the death penalty, describing the case as the most extreme 1:21:14.080 --> 1:21:18.639 example of man's inhumanity to man I've ever seen. After 1:21:18.680 --> 1:21:22.719 deliberating for ninety two minutes, the jury found Henley guilty 1:21:22.880 --> 1:21:28.800 on all six counts. Formal sentencing proceedings began the following day, 1:21:29.600 --> 1:21:34.680 July sixteenth. On August eight, Judge Dial sentenced Henley to 1:21:34.760 --> 1:21:40.000 six consecutive ninety nine year prison terms totaling five hundred 1:21:40.040 --> 1:21:43.720 and ninety four years, and Henley was transferred to the 1:21:43.800 --> 1:21:46.320 Huntsville Unit to begin serving his sentence. 1:21:46.720 --> 1:21:48.799 So how old will he be when he's released? 1:21:49.640 --> 1:21:51.479 Oh, you're the one that's good at maths, Probably about 1:21:51.680 --> 1:21:54.040 nine hundred and something. That wouldn't be that much for 1:21:54.200 --> 1:21:58.479 it'd be about what six six six hundred and something years? 1:21:58.680 --> 1:22:00.680 Wow? What will that be? 1:22:00.760 --> 1:22:05.760 We should yeah, Henley, I thank you. Henley appealed both 1:22:05.800 --> 1:22:08.600 his conviction and sentence, arguing that the judge had not 1:22:08.800 --> 1:22:12.599 been sequested, that objections to media presence in the courtroom 1:22:12.600 --> 1:22:16.320 had been denied, and that the court had improperly rejected 1:22:16.360 --> 1:22:20.040 motions to move the trial from San Antonio. The appeal 1:22:20.120 --> 1:22:23.000 was successful, and a retrial was granted in December nineteen 1:22:23.040 --> 1:22:23.559 seventy eight. 1:22:24.000 --> 1:22:25.680 Poor victim's family. 1:22:25.560 --> 1:22:32.120 God but the retrial commenced on June eighteen, nineteen seventy nine, 1:22:32.600 --> 1:22:35.960 in Corpus Christi, with Henley again represented by William Gray, 1:22:36.560 --> 1:22:41.559 joined by another attorney, Edwin Pigelow. The defense renewed its 1:22:41.600 --> 1:22:45.080 efforts to suppress Henley's written statements, but Judge Noah Kennedy 1:22:45.160 --> 1:22:49.360 ruled that August nine, nineteen seventy three statements were admissible 1:22:50.640 --> 1:22:55.519 on our defense council further argued that the physical evidence 1:22:55.600 --> 1:22:58.479 introduced by the state belonged to Dean Coral, not Elma 1:22:58.520 --> 1:22:59.120 Wayne Henley. 1:22:59.280 --> 1:23:01.400 So they finally brought a defense to the table. 1:23:02.640 --> 1:23:06.960 On June twenty seven, nineteen seventy nine, and after more 1:23:07.000 --> 1:23:10.559 than two hours of deliberation, the jury once again convicted 1:23:10.560 --> 1:23:13.719 Henley on all six counts. He was sentenced to six 1:23:13.880 --> 1:23:17.040 ninety nine year prison terms, this time to be served 1:23:17.240 --> 1:23:19.200 concurrently rather than consecutively. 1:23:19.640 --> 1:23:22.200 Oh so the date's difference son He'll be out in 1:23:22.280 --> 1:23:23.680 nineteen nine years. 1:23:23.320 --> 1:23:28.200 Wow, I'm going to now read the victims. Jeffrey Alan 1:23:28.280 --> 1:23:35.000 Conan eighteen years old, James Dremahler thirteen, Timothy Lewis Curley 1:23:35.040 --> 1:23:40.000 twenty one years old, Mark Scott seventeen, Charles Odam fourteen, 1:23:40.800 --> 1:23:49.479 David Hillard thirteen, Gregory Malley seventeen, Donald Waldrop fifteen, Jerry 1:23:49.560 --> 1:23:58.120 Joe Waldrop fifteen, Richard Stirviant fourteen, Edward C. Watkins fourteen, 1:23:58.680 --> 1:24:06.040 Mark W. Tiller sixteen, Fred Sherry seventeen, James Vernon, Draymeller thirteen, 1:24:06.920 --> 1:24:13.240 Reuben Renee Gaza fifteen, Wallace Eugene Anderson nineteen, Mark Kent 1:24:13.280 --> 1:24:19.679 Scott seventeen, James Clayton Clay Henley fifteen, Stephen Mark Walldrop fifteen, 1:24:20.560 --> 1:24:25.799 Joseph Allen Lyles seventeen, Donald Glen wall Dropped fifteen, Billy 1:24:26.320 --> 1:24:34.519 Rindinger fourteen, Mark Donne seventeen, Gregory gen Malley seventeen, William 1:24:34.560 --> 1:24:42.000 Ray Lawrence fifteen, James Langham seventeen, Curtis Jones fifteen, Charles 1:24:42.040 --> 1:24:47.960 Cobble seventeen. Authorities believe at least twenty eight victims were identified, 1:24:49.000 --> 1:24:54.400 with the possibility of additional unidentified victims in twenty twenty one, 1:24:54.479 --> 1:24:58.879 police dug up the backyard of a place Dean Coral resided, 1:24:58.920 --> 1:25:01.400 as they believed he could have buried more than twenty 1:25:01.400 --> 1:25:04.639 further boys there. What year, sorry in twenty twenty one, 1:25:04.960 --> 1:25:08.240 Oh my god, what sad that the search was not successful, 1:25:08.479 --> 1:25:11.439 but they are continuing to search to this day. Dean 1:25:11.520 --> 1:25:14.880 Coral was killed in August nineteen seventy three before he 1:25:14.920 --> 1:25:18.679 could be arrested or tried for his crimes. The families 1:25:18.680 --> 1:25:22.120 of Dean Coral's victims and his accomplices have spoken out 1:25:22.160 --> 1:25:25.920 extensively over the decades, particularly during parole hearings and in 1:25:25.960 --> 1:25:28.559 recent documentaries as well. They kind of go into a 1:25:28.600 --> 1:25:32.680 lot there. Their statements highlight the enduring trauma and their 1:25:32.720 --> 1:25:37.120 fight for justice. A family member who remains anonymous of 1:25:37.120 --> 1:25:40.040 one of the victims of Dean Coral spoke out which 1:25:40.080 --> 1:25:42.800 I'd like to leave you with today. The worst part 1:25:43.000 --> 1:25:46.000 wasn't even learning how my son died. It was knowing 1:25:46.040 --> 1:25:49.960 that for years people had information and chose not to act. 1:25:50.600 --> 1:25:53.840 We lost our child once, but we were forced to 1:25:53.880 --> 1:25:57.360 relive that loss over and over again because the truth 1:25:57.560 --> 1:26:04.680 was ignored. Families of Coral's victims repeatedly emphasized institutional failure, silence, 1:26:04.840 --> 1:26:08.400 and the long lasting harm caused not by the murders themselves, 1:26:08.880 --> 1:26:13.479 but by the delayed investigations and the lack of accountability afterward. 1:26:14.080 --> 1:26:16.559 And that g is the story that the candy Man, 1:26:16.800 --> 1:26:20.000 the Pied Piper, and the monster that was Dean Coral. 1:26:21.680 --> 1:26:24.160 There was absolutely nothing that I liked about the last 1:26:24.240 --> 1:26:31.680 hour and a half. Nope, So thanks for giving me 1:26:31.800 --> 1:26:35.240 a week off writing the story. I guess. 1:26:35.280 --> 1:26:36.920 Okay, that's a positive. That's one positive. 1:26:38.000 --> 1:26:38.160 Um. 1:26:40.800 --> 1:26:42.479 And for having me at your house. 1:26:42.280 --> 1:26:44.759 Today, GiB your wine and a mango. 1:26:45.600 --> 1:26:47.360 Yeah, but I didn't finish the wine because I started 1:26:47.400 --> 1:26:50.519 feeling sick about halfway through that. I did finish the manga, 1:26:50.560 --> 1:26:55.720 but that was before I knew this story. Okay, um, 1:26:58.000 --> 1:27:03.880 it's about all I have to say. Okay, bye, oh, 1:27:03.920 --> 1:27:10.000 I just like there's there's nothing there's nothing good about 1:27:10.040 --> 1:27:15.080 that at all. Like I think that David and Alma, 1:27:15.200 --> 1:27:19.360 maybe particularly David, in my opinion, were very much groomed. 1:27:20.120 --> 1:27:20.880 Yeah, but they. 1:27:20.960 --> 1:27:27.840 Were also complicit in all of this. I don't know 1:27:28.160 --> 1:27:32.599 what the kind of how much one outweighs the other. 1:27:32.960 --> 1:27:33.040 Well. 1:27:33.040 --> 1:27:35.639 I think the sentencing is interesting because it's like, that's 1:27:36.680 --> 1:27:39.479 kind of in a way because Dean was killed. Yes, 1:27:39.560 --> 1:27:42.360 you know, I think the victims' families wanted something and 1:27:42.200 --> 1:27:45.320 that you know, that kind of makes sense. Yeah, in 1:27:45.360 --> 1:27:47.880 that sense, it's so sad that they were never able 1:27:47.960 --> 1:27:50.280 to convict Dean. 1:27:51.080 --> 1:27:54.200 Yeah, the only positive about that is that he was 1:27:54.240 --> 1:27:56.320 never able to try to argue any defense. 1:27:56.720 --> 1:27:57.120 That's true. 1:27:57.160 --> 1:27:58.000 You know, they never had. 1:27:57.920 --> 1:28:00.360 To sit through him trying to say why he wasn't 1:28:00.840 --> 1:28:05.000 guilty or you know, what their sons had done wrong 1:28:05.040 --> 1:28:08.439 in his eyes or anything like that. That's the only 1:28:08.560 --> 1:28:13.080 silver lining in a very dark cloud of that. I 1:28:13.800 --> 1:28:17.120 feel so yuck about the whole thing. I feel yuck 1:28:17.160 --> 1:28:22.320 about David and Alma's involvement, but then like as in 1:28:22.520 --> 1:28:25.640 yuck towards them about that, but then somewhat yuck for 1:28:25.880 --> 1:28:31.200 them in how groomed they were and manipulated. And it's 1:28:31.320 --> 1:28:33.600 just I really hated that. 1:28:35.040 --> 1:28:36.640 Thanks but thanks. 1:28:37.280 --> 1:28:39.360 Hey, we'll be back after this with the mailbag. 1:28:39.920 --> 1:28:40.760 Do you what do you think? 1:28:40.880 --> 1:28:40.960 Oh? 1:28:41.160 --> 1:28:42.920 I think I think it's so sad, Like you know, 1:28:42.960 --> 1:28:46.160 I read and watched so much good about it, and 1:28:46.200 --> 1:28:49.960 it is so so heartbreaking because you know, you see 1:28:50.000 --> 1:28:53.040 that he was kind of he didn't have a good life, 1:28:53.120 --> 1:28:55.120 and then you know, all of a sudden it was like, yeah, 1:28:55.120 --> 1:28:58.120 he's living with his horrible he had, you know, these 1:28:58.160 --> 1:29:01.120 horrible stepfathers as well, and and then he was just 1:29:01.160 --> 1:29:03.880 an awful, awful person that was also rejected by his mum. 1:29:04.000 --> 1:29:06.920 And you look at the whole life and you go, 1:29:07.320 --> 1:29:11.400 nothing good ever, Like there's nothing. He became a monster. 1:29:12.640 --> 1:29:15.280 Then he was grooming kids. He had an in with 1:29:15.360 --> 1:29:17.640 that through the candy shop, and it's just I don't know, 1:29:17.680 --> 1:29:20.520 there's so much in there that he's going, Oh, it's all. 1:29:20.640 --> 1:29:22.680 It did look like I want to quickly look up. 1:29:22.960 --> 1:29:28.640 Yeah, it's just it's it's all so so awful and 1:29:28.680 --> 1:29:31.280 like you said, get some vowels, Get some vowels in 1:29:31.320 --> 1:29:33.960 your name, some vowels in your name. But yeah, it 1:29:34.080 --> 1:29:37.640 was just such a such a horrendous and proper use 1:29:37.640 --> 1:29:40.920 of the word horrendous case to look into. 1:29:41.600 --> 1:29:43.680 There's not many pictures of him. This looks like a 1:29:43.760 --> 1:29:46.400 very kind of I mean generic man. 1:29:46.520 --> 1:29:51.160 Yeah, yeah, because there wasn't, Like I mean, it's it's 1:29:51.160 --> 1:29:56.040 such a such a strange case that I haven't heard 1:29:56.080 --> 1:29:56.879 of before. 1:29:57.240 --> 1:29:59.559 I've heard of the candyman like he's the killer. 1:29:59.640 --> 1:30:01.800 I've heard The Candy Man, but I haven't heard the 1:30:01.840 --> 1:30:03.280 Life of Dean Coral before. 1:30:03.720 --> 1:30:05.320 Probably why because it's so awful. 1:30:07.640 --> 1:30:10.080 But yeah, but there's so many cases like that that sadly, 1:30:10.560 --> 1:30:12.000 you know, people say, oh, it's a run away, it's 1:30:12.000 --> 1:30:13.519 a run away, and I think that was the thing. 1:30:13.880 --> 1:30:17.280 Yeah, absolutely awful. Okay, I've decided next week I'm going 1:30:17.360 --> 1:30:22.000 to do one that's more out of the box. I mean, 1:30:22.040 --> 1:30:24.720 we always do crimes, so they're always awful, but I'm 1:30:24.720 --> 1:30:29.479 gonna do something a bit more, I don't know, maybe 1:30:29.560 --> 1:30:32.240 less depressing, just for a little change. I love you 1:30:32.320 --> 1:30:34.160 and I appreciate you, and I'm being very mean and 1:30:34.280 --> 1:30:36.519 not thanking you for that story. Thank you for that story, 1:30:36.560 --> 1:30:39.599 Sammy Peterson. I just I feel really lucky. 1:30:39.800 --> 1:30:42.479 Okay, well, we'll be back after the after this little 1:30:42.479 --> 1:30:52.920 break and then a mailbag. Feel better than everybody. Thank 1:30:53.000 --> 1:30:55.160 you for listening to this week's episode. We know it's 1:30:55.200 --> 1:30:58.439 a very very heavy one. There's a lot of details. 1:30:58.439 --> 1:31:01.000 There are a lot of groupsome details. I appreciate you 1:31:01.040 --> 1:31:01.559 sticking with us. 1:31:01.640 --> 1:31:03.360 I do just want to quickly give you a Chicken 1:31:03.439 --> 1:31:06.720 Joe update. The update we have so we recorded the 1:31:06.720 --> 1:31:10.400 episode and nowhere we took a little break to cleanse 1:31:10.479 --> 1:31:12.960 our souls of that story. And I did a very 1:31:13.120 --> 1:31:16.000 quick search for Chicken Joe, as I said that I 1:31:16.040 --> 1:31:21.080 would very quick search has only resulted in pictures of 1:31:22.040 --> 1:31:26.080 a chicken character from the animated film surfs Up yep. 1:31:26.600 --> 1:31:31.479 And I then narrowed my search to Chicken Joe sex 1:31:31.520 --> 1:31:36.559 trafficking yep, and that the Surf's up chicken still just 1:31:36.560 --> 1:31:40.439 came up. So there's something very funny about that. It's 1:31:40.479 --> 1:31:43.000 also not funny. So that's the update we have for 1:31:43.040 --> 1:31:45.120 you this week. I will do some more in depth 1:31:45.200 --> 1:31:49.280 research to find out more about the Chicken Joe from Yeah, 1:31:50.680 --> 1:31:52.080 but it's quite funny to me that that. 1:31:52.560 --> 1:31:55.320 I'm also just making sure that his name was Chicken Jong. 1:31:55.560 --> 1:31:57.840 He might not have been Chicken because Chicken Joe like that. 1:31:58.000 --> 1:32:02.720 That's very funny to have that many beautiful photos of animated. 1:32:02.280 --> 1:32:08.280 Chickens like photos and someone's taken. Also, a mutual friend 1:32:08.280 --> 1:32:12.759 of ours has that chicken as his Instagram profile. 1:32:13.240 --> 1:32:16.080 Yeah, I'm really I'm really surprised about all of That's okay, 1:32:16.120 --> 1:32:18.920 so Chicken jo I don't know when Chicken Joe came 1:32:18.960 --> 1:32:22.280 into the picture. But it is such a such an 1:32:22.360 --> 1:32:23.200 interesting name. 1:32:24.120 --> 1:32:25.600 We're going to do some more research on this. 1:32:27.040 --> 1:32:28.479 We have to. We can't just leave it there. 1:32:28.479 --> 1:32:31.879 From Chicken Joe, Chicken Joe, Dean Coral. 1:32:32.120 --> 1:32:34.799 Let me write that, Chicken Joe Dean Corey. You're writing 1:32:34.800 --> 1:32:36.960 that down, sure, jam not. 1:32:36.920 --> 1:32:42.200 Writing it down in like a notebook. 1:32:40.720 --> 1:32:43.800 With a quill. Maybe you're a lot older than you 1:32:43.880 --> 1:32:44.599 are with a quill. 1:32:45.000 --> 1:32:48.840 I have a quill, do you, yes? Because I got 1:32:48.880 --> 1:32:51.640 it from the merch store at when I went and 1:32:51.640 --> 1:32:52.960 saw Hamilton on Broadway. 1:32:53.600 --> 1:32:55.920 You know what, that's pretty fun cool right now? All right, 1:32:55.920 --> 1:32:57.440 I'm going to stop doing this because. 1:32:57.160 --> 1:32:59.200 I can't find it quickly. I got to tell you 1:32:59.240 --> 1:33:00.920 about Chicken Jo another. 1:33:00.640 --> 1:33:03.080 Time about Chicken Joe real quickly. But hey, you know 1:33:03.120 --> 1:33:06.599 what this section is all about. The male bag, male bag, 1:33:06.680 --> 1:33:10.400 male bag, male balk, the chickens chicken chicken thing. 1:33:11.200 --> 1:33:13.320 This one comes of bird noises. 1:33:13.320 --> 1:33:14.599 This episode's really good. 1:33:14.479 --> 1:33:18.840 Because and then give me one more bird to round 1:33:18.840 --> 1:33:20.680 it out three for three, give me bird or make 1:33:20.720 --> 1:33:21.040 a noise? 1:33:21.120 --> 1:33:28.240 Big cock ah, that was good as well, comes big 1:33:28.240 --> 1:33:32.200 cock makes that sound. This one comes from Sandra Hi, 1:33:32.360 --> 1:33:35.800 Sammy and Georgia. Absolutely love your podcast. You both have 1:33:35.920 --> 1:33:39.599 such kindness and empathy when talking about some of the 1:33:39.640 --> 1:33:43.840 most horrific crimes, but more importantly, you both always find 1:33:43.880 --> 1:33:48.360 the joy where possible. On Sammy's recommendation, I've just finished 1:33:48.360 --> 1:33:52.560 listening to the Wise Crap podcast Unbelieved. Thanks for the 1:33:52.560 --> 1:33:56.439 recommendation and please keep bringing us your fabulous podcast, Sandy, 1:33:56.520 --> 1:33:57.280 New South Wales. 1:33:57.520 --> 1:34:02.400 Oh thanks Sandy. Yeah, a podcast shout out. I believe 1:34:02.479 --> 1:34:05.000 I've mentioned this before, but it was when I was 1:34:05.000 --> 1:34:09.080 still listening to it. Unicorn Girl. Oh yes, unicorn So 1:34:09.160 --> 1:34:12.920 it is by the same crew who did Scamander. 1:34:13.120 --> 1:34:14.400 Yeah, we've had one of where. 1:34:14.479 --> 1:34:18.080 Jackson McLennan was. We had his guest on First Treat. 1:34:18.600 --> 1:34:21.360 They've got a new one out called Unicorn Girl, and 1:34:21.600 --> 1:34:25.080 I think it is even more like I think what 1:34:25.760 --> 1:34:29.200 they investigate is even more damning than Scamander. So yeah, 1:34:29.360 --> 1:34:30.040 I recommend it. 1:34:30.040 --> 1:34:33.719 It's fascinating. Yeah, and we've got this one from Beck. Okay, 1:34:33.760 --> 1:34:36.920 So confession, I was listening to the Andrew Fraser case 1:34:36.960 --> 1:34:39.559 in the car today. Yes, I acknowledge that g had 1:34:39.600 --> 1:34:42.400 literally told us as listeners not to allow this with 1:34:42.479 --> 1:34:45.400 children in the car. Oh yeah, but my son's name 1:34:45.479 --> 1:34:48.400 is Fraser and he was getting such a kick out 1:34:48.400 --> 1:34:51.439 of hearing his name. All was fine and cute until 1:34:51.520 --> 1:34:55.439 g dropped the F bomb sweetly from the back seat. Mummy, 1:34:55.720 --> 1:34:56.720 what does fuck mean? 1:34:56.840 --> 1:34:59.880 Oh my god, Oh my god, I'm so sorry. 1:35:00.200 --> 1:35:02.720 Then she writes, oh my. 1:35:02.640 --> 1:35:06.679 God, back, I'm so sorry. Also when I've like don't 1:35:06.800 --> 1:35:10.200 like keeps listening the car we talk about discussing crimes. 1:35:10.479 --> 1:35:12.599 I didn't realize I would be the one that would 1:35:12.600 --> 1:35:16.280 be corrupted the crime. 1:35:17.040 --> 1:35:20.599 You are the crimes. We have got a speak part today, 1:35:20.720 --> 1:35:22.799 Geet love that comes from Jenna. 1:35:23.560 --> 1:35:26.759 Hi, Sammy Hydrogel Love. I'm Jenna, and I'm so happy 1:35:26.840 --> 1:35:29.120 I find your guys' podcast as I just adore you 1:35:29.200 --> 1:35:31.880 to so much and I can't find myself listening to 1:35:32.040 --> 1:35:35.320 any other crime podcast now, and I'm so sad that 1:35:35.400 --> 1:35:38.439 I'm finally caught up because now I can't binge listen 1:35:38.520 --> 1:35:42.080 to you to when I'm working. But because I'm also 1:35:42.200 --> 1:35:44.680 caught up, I felt like it was only right to 1:35:44.920 --> 1:35:47.600 finally send you to a speak pipe and wanting to 1:35:47.720 --> 1:35:50.840 for a while, but just always end up wanting to 1:35:50.960 --> 1:35:52.840 reset it because I don't like how it comes out. 1:35:54.640 --> 1:35:58.200 I love your guys is for babies so much, but 1:35:58.439 --> 1:36:01.200 I want to know what party looks like. I love 1:36:01.320 --> 1:36:04.240 cats so much and I hear Podrey peaves and it's 1:36:04.280 --> 1:36:07.759 just like I want to see Poudrey. Speaking of Podrey peeves, 1:36:08.800 --> 1:36:11.479 my pottery peeve is those things in the middle of 1:36:11.560 --> 1:36:14.559 the aisles at grocery stores. Since I work up one, 1:36:14.760 --> 1:36:18.000 it's always in my way, constantly smacking myself, hurting myself 1:36:18.080 --> 1:36:21.360 when I'm already cutting myself on boxes. Those things are 1:36:21.439 --> 1:36:22.840 freaking sharp for cardboard. 1:36:24.120 --> 1:36:24.639 It sucks. 1:36:25.000 --> 1:36:29.200 They annoying me so much. Also, I would love to 1:36:29.360 --> 1:36:32.160 learn more about Australia, as I actually really want to 1:36:32.240 --> 1:36:35.360 move to Australia because I hate it here. The United 1:36:35.400 --> 1:36:37.479 States might as well be a freaking crime at this point. 1:36:39.320 --> 1:36:41.640 I would love to learn more and more of your 1:36:41.840 --> 1:36:46.680 sayings because I say Melbourne and my Australian friend makes 1:36:46.720 --> 1:36:49.320 fun of me every time I try to say something 1:36:49.880 --> 1:36:51.920 that is pronounced differently in Australia. 1:36:52.760 --> 1:36:54.080 But yeah, I love you too. 1:36:55.520 --> 1:36:57.600 I love you so much. First of all, love your 1:36:57.640 --> 1:37:02.200 Powda things like that as well. Second, or thank you 1:37:02.320 --> 1:37:05.200 so much for asking about Paudry. This is the thing 1:37:05.280 --> 1:37:08.640 right we recorded Sammy's house, so Diggs is always here. Now, 1:37:08.760 --> 1:37:11.920 Diggs is big main character energy, So Dix gets a 1:37:11.960 --> 1:37:15.320 lot of airtime on this podcast while we discuss Poudrey, 1:37:15.439 --> 1:37:17.200 or we say Poudrey's name every week because we do 1:37:17.280 --> 1:37:21.360 Powdery Pease, she doesn't get enough airtime on this podcast 1:37:21.640 --> 1:37:25.800 for how beautiful and in our lives she is. I'm 1:37:25.840 --> 1:37:30.080 bringing you into this as well. So Jenna Poudrey is 1:37:30.120 --> 1:37:35.880 a ragged or cat, so she is really fluffy. She's 1:37:36.000 --> 1:37:40.360 mostly white with a gray gray tail and brown face 1:37:40.520 --> 1:37:43.760 and ears, and she's actually the most beautiful thing that 1:37:43.800 --> 1:37:47.519 has ever watch. She has blue eyes. And my friend 1:37:47.560 --> 1:37:49.479 said to me the other day when we took a selfie. 1:37:49.680 --> 1:37:52.160 My friend looked at the picture and said, oh my god, 1:37:52.439 --> 1:37:54.880 you look like Powdery in this picture. And that was 1:37:54.960 --> 1:37:56.840 the nicest thing anyone who'd ever said to you. So 1:37:56.880 --> 1:37:59.599 if that gives you a good snippet of what Poordy 1:37:59.640 --> 1:38:01.160 looks like, and I'll post a photo. 1:38:01.240 --> 1:38:03.719 He put a photo yeah, on the Instagram because Poudrey 1:38:03.840 --> 1:38:06.040 is so beautiful. And actually we had some friends over 1:38:06.200 --> 1:38:09.200 for do you know last night who actually just wanted 1:38:09.240 --> 1:38:09.839 to meet Paudrey. 1:38:10.000 --> 1:38:11.760 We were going to go out for dinner with them, 1:38:12.120 --> 1:38:13.840 and then I said, every time we see them, they 1:38:14.000 --> 1:38:16.519 keep asking if they can meet Poudrey, so I think 1:38:16.560 --> 1:38:18.880 I need to invite them to my house. And she 1:38:19.200 --> 1:38:22.240 was a full blown celebrity. Either of us would be 1:38:22.280 --> 1:38:24.720 in the middle of a story and both of our 1:38:24.800 --> 1:38:27.160 friends were just we could tell they weren't listening, and 1:38:27.160 --> 1:38:29.759 they were like tapping each other and pointing at Pouelry 1:38:29.760 --> 1:38:32.200 because she was doing something just benign, and they. 1:38:32.200 --> 1:38:35.120 Were like, look at her, look at her, She's so beautiful. 1:38:34.680 --> 1:38:38.680 Celebrity, Jenna, I love you. So Melbourne, you've got to 1:38:38.680 --> 1:38:39.400 say Melbourne? 1:38:39.680 --> 1:38:41.960 Yeah, yeah, Why isn't Melbourne. 1:38:42.200 --> 1:38:47.160 Because we pronounced things incorrectly how they spelt. Although I 1:38:47.240 --> 1:38:49.559 mean I say Melbourne. 1:38:49.000 --> 1:38:51.200 It sounds better, it sounds more like that. It looks 1:38:51.280 --> 1:38:52.080 like it should be that. 1:38:52.520 --> 1:38:58.719 However, our language comes from England and they don't pronounce 1:38:58.800 --> 1:39:04.960 that like born. But yeah, Melbourne will get you sounding 1:39:05.040 --> 1:39:05.840 real local. 1:39:05.920 --> 1:39:07.040 If Melbourn. 1:39:07.120 --> 1:39:10.240 We've taught you in this episode all about lollies versus 1:39:10.320 --> 1:39:15.760 sweets or candies. Struth, Oh truth good, there's a good 1:39:15.760 --> 1:39:18.760 australianism for you. So that's like, maybe I should start 1:39:18.800 --> 1:39:21.880 saying that instead of the f bowl in the car again, 1:39:22.240 --> 1:39:24.599 struth like that that's rat. 1:39:24.800 --> 1:39:26.320 That's another rat. Rat. 1:39:26.400 --> 1:39:28.600 That's another way of got like. Instead of to the. 1:39:28.800 --> 1:39:33.000 Bomb, you can say rat struth. You can say, oh, 1:39:33.080 --> 1:39:34.280 this is a good one. You can say I'm not 1:39:34.320 --> 1:39:38.280 here to fuck spiders. Yes, so instead of if you're here. 1:39:38.200 --> 1:39:41.040 To mess around, I want to get to the point 1:39:41.080 --> 1:39:41.519 I want. 1:39:41.360 --> 1:39:44.519 To just I'll go, I go. Would you like a drink? Jenna? 1:39:44.880 --> 1:39:48.040 And you come to a bar and you go, not spiders. 1:39:48.280 --> 1:39:49.920 That's a great one. That's that's a great one. 1:39:50.080 --> 1:39:52.040 Yeah, well that's good. Hey Jenna, I love you. 1:39:52.360 --> 1:39:53.479 Yeah, I love you so much. 1:39:55.120 --> 1:39:59.200 Please let us know. Yeah, America doesn't seem like the 1:39:59.280 --> 1:40:02.559 best place for no, but I want to get myself. 1:40:03.360 --> 1:40:06.560 It's actually this is a very difficult place to be 1:40:06.640 --> 1:40:12.439 in someone who is perennially online, also who perennially travels 1:40:12.479 --> 1:40:14.479 to New York City and wants to again and again, 1:40:15.000 --> 1:40:19.280 and who disagrees wholeheartedly with almost everything that Trump administration 1:40:19.439 --> 1:40:22.240 is doing. Right now, they've just said that they're going 1:40:22.320 --> 1:40:27.280 to start checking the a social media history of anyone 1:40:27.360 --> 1:40:30.760 who travels to America to see if they've been well, 1:40:30.760 --> 1:40:33.320 they haven't explicitly said to see if they've been anti Trump. 1:40:33.680 --> 1:40:36.840 But I am really desperate to post about how angry 1:40:37.000 --> 1:40:39.840 I am about things like the renaming of the Kennedy Center, 1:40:40.240 --> 1:40:45.200 the redaction of the Epstein past, and I'm really battling 1:40:45.240 --> 1:40:47.800 with myself and how to do that and also maybe 1:40:47.880 --> 1:40:48.840 be able to go back to New York. 1:40:49.000 --> 1:40:51.240 Yeah, yeah, at some point. Yeah, we've got the next 1:40:51.400 --> 1:40:54.760 big pipe that comes from Vanessa. You're ready for this? 1:40:55.040 --> 1:41:01.560 Yes, Hi, Sammy and High Choice. I just wanted to 1:41:02.080 --> 1:41:06.040 drop you guys a quick speak parte and say that 1:41:06.160 --> 1:41:10.200 I absolutely love the podcast. I also thought you guys 1:41:10.280 --> 1:41:15.360 were just making up the names speak Pite because you 1:41:15.479 --> 1:41:18.240 wanted to be a bit more quirky than just saying 1:41:18.320 --> 1:41:21.360 voice Noe, but have since discovered that's. 1:41:21.240 --> 1:41:22.559 What they were actually called. 1:41:23.760 --> 1:41:27.679 I do have a request. I have just finished watching 1:41:28.160 --> 1:41:33.080 Until I Kill You, which is based on the story 1:41:33.160 --> 1:41:35.400 of Delia Obama, and I just think it would be 1:41:35.520 --> 1:41:39.479 such a fun and interesting one not really fun that 1:41:39.640 --> 1:41:44.000 seems a very poor choice of words, but a great 1:41:44.479 --> 1:41:47.240 one for you guys to do in the podcast, and 1:41:47.360 --> 1:41:52.920 I'm definitely desperate to know more about it. Thoroughly enjoying 1:41:53.920 --> 1:41:56.479 what you guys are doing and keep them coming. 1:41:57.400 --> 1:42:01.400 Oh my god, thank you, Vanessa, Dearie Obama. I've literally 1:42:01.720 --> 1:42:06.360 just written it down in my list right now. I 1:42:06.520 --> 1:42:08.960 was going to give you a little we love suggestions. Yeah, 1:42:09.000 --> 1:42:11.520 it's going to give you a little a little synopsis 1:42:11.560 --> 1:42:13.800 of what it is. But no, you guys can walk down. 1:42:14.439 --> 1:42:16.439 Yeah, thank you Vanessa. We love that and I'm so 1:42:16.560 --> 1:42:19.240 glad you love the podcast. We always absolutely love hearing 1:42:19.280 --> 1:42:23.320 from people that love the goddamn podcast. We have one 1:42:23.400 --> 1:42:28.080 more speak pipe for today that comes from anonymous. Oh okay, 1:42:28.200 --> 1:42:28.720 you ready for this. 1:42:28.800 --> 1:42:30.120 It's going to be some we know, isn't it. 1:42:30.920 --> 1:42:36.400 Hello, my beautiful Georgie and Sammy yesterday got here today. 1:42:38.400 --> 1:42:42.719 I hope I have your favorite, Scott. I've been listening 1:42:42.760 --> 1:42:45.280 to your podcast and I love it so much so 1:42:46.000 --> 1:42:50.960 that in December I exclusively am in exclusively only listen 1:42:51.080 --> 1:42:55.839 to Christmas music, and I have allowed your podcast presence 1:42:55.960 --> 1:42:59.000 in my car turn from work during this period, which 1:42:59.280 --> 1:43:04.240 you should feel very privileged. I listened to your friend 1:43:04.280 --> 1:43:09.040 and Rosemary west one the other week and I forgot 1:43:09.080 --> 1:43:12.000 the message at the time, but you were singing Donald 1:43:12.040 --> 1:43:13.840 Wear's your truisers. Yes, I thought I would give you 1:43:14.360 --> 1:43:17.080 a little bit more of a rendition of that, and 1:43:17.240 --> 1:43:20.320 here we go. It goes, let the wind blow high, 1:43:20.439 --> 1:43:24.000 let the wind low low through the streets, and oh 1:43:24.080 --> 1:43:27.520 the lassie say hello Donald version Bruisers. 1:43:28.800 --> 1:43:30.080 That is the full rendition of it. 1:43:30.640 --> 1:43:32.880 And it will help you with your Scottish accent. And 1:43:33.000 --> 1:43:36.719 if you would like some Scottish words, my favorite Scottish 1:43:36.760 --> 1:43:39.719 word is rich and if we put it into the pod, 1:43:40.400 --> 1:43:43.519 it would say it was a driech night in the 1:43:43.600 --> 1:43:48.639 woods when we found the body. So I will leave 1:43:48.680 --> 1:43:51.160 you with the word rich and see if you can 1:43:51.240 --> 1:43:55.040 guess what it actually means, and if you get it 1:43:55.120 --> 1:43:57.719 right or not, and I will let you know anyway. 1:43:57.960 --> 1:44:01.919 Love you, guys, You're the best. Shade. 1:44:01.920 --> 1:44:02.439 I love you so. 1:44:02.880 --> 1:44:05.559 Snade is one of the great loves of my life. Yes, 1:44:05.720 --> 1:44:09.240 she's I met Shade when I lived in Lawncestern. Don't 1:44:09.280 --> 1:44:11.200 if you can tell by her accent. She's not originally 1:44:11.240 --> 1:44:15.400 from there either, but we were in a production of 1:44:15.479 --> 1:44:16.880 Greece together and we met. 1:44:17.000 --> 1:44:26.080 Her voice is amazing, she's just she's yes, she's so good. 1:44:26.320 --> 1:44:27.439 So I think leaked. 1:44:28.240 --> 1:44:30.360 It was a very good leaked. Gonna I'm gonna work 1:44:30.400 --> 1:44:32.920 on that I think it means like dark. 1:44:34.080 --> 1:44:37.240 Yeah, yeah, dreary maybe dreary. 1:44:37.400 --> 1:44:42.160 It's good. I love that. Let us know if we're 1:44:42.240 --> 1:44:43.760 right or not. Probably not. 1:44:47.600 --> 1:44:50.880 I'm gonna learn the whole thing again for all of you. Hey, Jenna, 1:44:51.040 --> 1:44:58.360 you've got Australian and episode and not a lesson about 1:44:58.400 --> 1:44:58.880 chicken Joe. 1:44:58.960 --> 1:45:02.640 We will bring that or whatever chickens person was. 1:45:02.840 --> 1:45:05.840 Okay, we're gonna do our Even before we do it, 1:45:05.880 --> 1:45:08.360 I'm gonna say, Sammy, I feel in much better mood 1:45:08.400 --> 1:45:11.320 now than when. So I do want to say thank 1:45:11.360 --> 1:45:14.680 you because you did a lot of work in in 1:45:15.200 --> 1:45:19.000 pretty sorry if I made you feel like I didn't 1:45:19.000 --> 1:45:19.519 appreciate it. 1:45:19.600 --> 1:45:19.720 I do. 1:45:20.360 --> 1:45:23.679 My poor peve, do you want to tell your okay, 1:45:24.040 --> 1:45:29.800 my poor peeve. This week is when people vocalize they're 1:45:29.920 --> 1:45:32.880 coughs or sneezes, But today I want to speak specifically 1:45:32.880 --> 1:45:36.360 about coffee. So like a cough sounds like this, right, yep, 1:45:37.120 --> 1:45:40.760 So you don't use your vocal cords for that, huh. 1:45:41.080 --> 1:45:46.519 But some people use, like engage their vocal cords while coffee, 1:45:46.680 --> 1:45:46.960 so they. 1:45:46.960 --> 1:45:50.160 Go like this, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. 1:45:50.280 --> 1:45:52.519 So this has always been a poor rey peeve of mine. 1:45:52.880 --> 1:45:56.280 It has become more a There needs to be a 1:45:56.400 --> 1:45:59.760 term for something stronger than a poor repeeve, like a 1:46:00.080 --> 1:46:00.880 actual rage. 1:46:05.400 --> 1:46:05.599 Yeah. 1:46:07.479 --> 1:46:11.920 There is an old man that lives across the hall 1:46:12.040 --> 1:46:13.599 from me in my apartment building. 1:46:13.800 --> 1:46:14.599 He's a loud coffer. 1:46:15.240 --> 1:46:19.120 No, no, not a loud coffer, Sammy, he's a vocal coffer. 1:46:19.720 --> 1:46:19.840 Now. 1:46:19.920 --> 1:46:23.400 He leaves his windows open, so if I've got my 1:46:23.720 --> 1:46:26.360 windows or like the door tomain balcony open, the sound 1:46:26.479 --> 1:46:31.120 travels really directly. And I was saying, he's an old man. 1:46:31.160 --> 1:46:32.679 That makes it sound like, oh, he might be unwell. 1:46:32.720 --> 1:46:34.120 I mean, he may be unwell, but he's not like 1:46:34.720 --> 1:46:35.320 sickly at. 1:46:35.240 --> 1:46:41.559 All VOCALI he coughs like this. Yeah, I know this cough. 1:46:43.280 --> 1:46:48.439 And he does it every single day, and it always 1:46:48.520 --> 1:46:51.479 starts around the same time in the evening and goes 1:46:51.640 --> 1:46:56.679 for about maybe forty five minutes of that cough every 1:46:56.760 --> 1:47:00.720 couple of minutes, and it is driving me fucking bonkers. 1:47:00.880 --> 1:47:02.799 Yeah, And I really. 1:47:02.760 --> 1:47:05.519 Tempted to leave it like a passive aggressive note under 1:47:05.560 --> 1:47:08.640 the door, just being like, please cough normally if you 1:47:08.720 --> 1:47:11.640 need to cough or get your lungs checked out. It 1:47:11.760 --> 1:47:13.320 is driving me insane. 1:47:13.600 --> 1:47:15.160 I just need to get his lungs checked out, because 1:47:15.160 --> 1:47:17.000 that is that that is a hearty cough he's got there. 1:47:18.600 --> 1:47:22.240 I would say my poetry peat today is goddamn shopping 1:47:22.320 --> 1:47:23.280 trolleys everywhere. 1:47:23.520 --> 1:47:24.120 What do you mean? 1:47:24.479 --> 1:47:26.960 There are so many people take shopping trolleys with them 1:47:27.080 --> 1:47:30.920 from the supermarket to like around here where I live. 1:47:31.120 --> 1:47:33.200 There are so many shopping trolleys that are just like 1:47:33.360 --> 1:47:37.280 dumped everywhere. Really, yes, it's just so many shopping trolleys, 1:47:37.439 --> 1:47:40.120 like because they did in Australia anyway, they did, like 1:47:40.200 --> 1:47:43.200 the thing where you put money in it to release it, 1:47:43.360 --> 1:47:45.760 to release it, but some of them don't. So it's 1:47:45.800 --> 1:47:48.200 just all these shopping trolleys and like turned upside down, 1:47:48.479 --> 1:47:50.639 and I reckon people have big nights and they're like, oh, 1:47:50.720 --> 1:47:52.720 I take shopping have you never done that. I've never 1:47:52.800 --> 1:47:53.639 done that, You've. 1:47:53.640 --> 1:47:56.360 Never got drug with your friends. I put one of 1:47:56.400 --> 1:47:58.040 them in a shopping trolley and push them out on 1:47:58.040 --> 1:47:58.360 the street. 1:48:00.040 --> 1:48:03.640 But my pod, people that just leave shopping trolleys like 1:48:03.840 --> 1:48:07.160 upturned and everything, just like after a big night out 1:48:07.240 --> 1:48:08.280 for them to be fair. 1:48:08.600 --> 1:48:11.040 I only did that like many years ago, when I 1:48:11.160 --> 1:48:12.520 was a young, silly. 1:48:12.360 --> 1:48:15.280 Fool, young silly fool. They're an old silly fool. 1:48:15.520 --> 1:48:19.400 Oh oh my kind of fun to do. 1:48:22.240 --> 1:48:24.680 Oliver Clark as always doing the theme song. Thank you 1:48:24.760 --> 1:48:27.880 to Tams and Hayes for doing the artwork right into us. 1:48:27.880 --> 1:48:30.320 We would bloody love to hear from you, Samya junother 1:48:30.360 --> 1:48:34.200 company dot com dot au. Leave us a voicemail or confusingly, 1:48:34.280 --> 1:48:35.280 a speak post, which. 1:48:35.160 --> 1:48:37.000 Is what the website is. 1:48:37.080 --> 1:48:37.280 Cool. 1:48:37.520 --> 1:48:39.559 I also love that she thought that we were trying 1:48:39.640 --> 1:48:42.080 to be more quirky. We don't need to be more 1:48:42.160 --> 1:48:43.920 quirky where we are. 1:48:45.280 --> 1:48:46.800 So much fun. So you can leave us all of 1:48:46.880 --> 1:48:49.400 those the links are below, or just the information and. 1:48:49.439 --> 1:48:51.640 Leave us a five star ratio and five stars and 1:48:51.680 --> 1:48:55.360 instagram at another crime podcast and send us all your 1:48:55.400 --> 1:48:58.599 love and YouTube would and send us to your YouTube. 1:48:58.760 --> 1:49:02.800 You send us to your YouTube. Yeah alright, everybody, Sorry 1:49:02.840 --> 1:49:05.840 about such a heavy, heavy story this week, but we'll 1:49:05.880 --> 1:49:09.840 see you on Thursday and we can't bloody way, oh 1:49:10.040 --> 1:49:11.439 my god. Good by money