1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,760 Speaker 1: Just a heads up. We'll be discussing distressing themes on 2 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: today's episode, including sexual abuse. Listener, discretion is advised already 3 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:12,320 Speaker 1: and this this is the Daily This is the Daily OS. 4 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:14,040 Speaker 1: Oh now it makes sense. 5 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:25,000 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily OS. It's Tuesday, 6 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:28,880 Speaker 2: the twenty eighth of October. I'm Emma Gillespie, I'm Lucy Tassel. 7 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 2: A landmark class action has been filed against the Australian 8 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:37,720 Speaker 2: Defense Force alleging widespread and systemic sexual violence, harassment and 9 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 2: discrimination over the past two decades. The legal case represents 10 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 2: potentially thousands of women who have served in the military. 11 00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:48,199 Speaker 2: And today we are going to break down everything you 12 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:51,479 Speaker 2: need to know about this case and the allegations against 13 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:52,240 Speaker 2: the ADF. 14 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: Emma, what do we need to know about these legal proceedings? 15 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 1: Who's involved? 16 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 2: So last week a class action was filed in the 17 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,720 Speaker 2: Federal Court against the Commonwealth of Australia so aka the 18 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 2: Federal Government on behalf of women who have served in 19 00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 2: the Australian Defense Force, so that includes Air Force, Navy 20 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 2: and the Army. Now, the reason that this case is 21 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:20,680 Speaker 2: against the Commonwealth of Australia is because ADF is part 22 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 2: of the Department of Defense, a government agency. Now the 23 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 2: case has been brought by a legal firm called GJA Sadler, 24 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 2: and they're representing these four lead applicants, whose names have 25 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 2: been withheld for legal reasons. But the action is open 26 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 2: to basically any woman who has experienced sexual violence, sexual harassment, 27 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 2: or discrimination while serving in the ADF between November two 28 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:46,720 Speaker 2: thousand and three and May twenty twenty five. So that 29 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 2: is a twenty one year period covering, like I said, 30 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 2: the Army, Navy, and Air Force. 31 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:54,360 Speaker 1: So we've got these four main plaintiffs, and we've got 32 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 1: this other kind of group of women who could join. 33 00:01:57,680 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: Can you just explain how that works. 34 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 2: Yes, So this is a class action, which is a 35 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 2: type of lawsuit where many people with similar claims, all 36 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:10,080 Speaker 2: against the same individual or corporation or government, are represented 37 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 2: together by one entity. So instead of each of these 38 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 2: women filing separate cases against the ADF, they've come together 39 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 2: under this one legal action. Now, this class action specifically 40 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 2: is being pursued on what's called an opt out basis, 41 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 2: which basically means all women who served in the ADF 42 00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 2: during that twenty one year period are automatically included unless 43 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 2: they specifically declare that they don't want to be part 44 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,800 Speaker 2: of the proceedings. So the lawyers representing these applicants are 45 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:40,440 Speaker 2: predicting that thousands of women will form part of the 46 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 2: class action and that many more are yet to come 47 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 2: forward with their stories of alleged abuse. 48 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:49,360 Speaker 1: What are the allegations being made against the ADF overall? 49 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 2: This class action alleges that the ADF systematically failed to 50 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 2: protect women in its ranks from sexual harassment, sexual violence, 51 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 2: and discrimination. And this lawsuit argues that the ADF has 52 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:06,080 Speaker 2: responsibilities as an employer, as any employer has responsibilities and 53 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 2: a duty of care to their staff, and therefore, the 54 00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 2: ADF should be held accountable for creating an environment where 55 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 2: this harm could occur, according to the class action. 56 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 1: We'll be back with more of today's deep dive right 57 00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 1: after this. So you mentioned there are these four lead 58 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: applicants bringing the case. What can you tell me about 59 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 1: them and their stories? Obviously we don't know their names, 60 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: but we would know other stuff, right. 61 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, all four women have detailed quite disturbing, varying 62 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 2: allegations of sexual assaults and harassment and bullying. I'm going 63 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:44,320 Speaker 2: to take you through some more specific details, but ye, 64 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 2: this is where it gets more uncomfortable. Two applicants alleged 65 00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 2: that they were subjected to frequent sexist comments during training, 66 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:57,560 Speaker 2: for example, comments about women being paid too much, women 67 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:01,000 Speaker 2: not pulling their weight in the Defense Force, one woman 68 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: in the Air Force said she was sexually assaulted on 69 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 2: a night out with her colleagues. She claims that she 70 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:09,400 Speaker 2: complained to military officials about what had happened to her, 71 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 2: but ultimately they chose not to take any action and 72 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 2: didn't provide reasons why. An applicant who served in the 73 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 2: Navy also alleges that a colleague once grabbed and forcibly 74 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:24,120 Speaker 2: kissed her. There is a particularly distressing allegation from one 75 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:26,480 Speaker 2: of the four women, who alleges she woke up the 76 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:31,119 Speaker 2: night after a party with her colleagues completely naked, disoriented, 77 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 2: in physical pain, and with bruises and scratches. She said 78 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 2: she was later told that she had left the party 79 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:40,480 Speaker 2: with four of her male colleagues and at some point 80 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 2: she was alone with one of them. Now this applicant 81 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:47,360 Speaker 2: made a complaint a formal complaint with the ADF. She 82 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 2: said that she was forced to undergo a sexual assault 83 00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 2: examination in a storage room, and that after she made 84 00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 2: the complaint, she became alienated by her colleagues in Peers 85 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 2: said that the alleged perpetrator faced no restriction while she 86 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:05,280 Speaker 2: was barred from using shared amenities and received abusive messages 87 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:09,040 Speaker 2: from servicemen in the defense forces who she was essentially living, 88 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:12,040 Speaker 2: working with, and around all day every day. 89 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, you said, this class action goes back to two 90 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:17,719 Speaker 1: thousand and three, So does that mean we're mainly looking 91 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 1: at historic incidents. 92 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 2: Well, Actually, the lawyers involved in the class action, Gja Sadler, 93 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:27,039 Speaker 2: and the director of that firm, josh Aylward, who is 94 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 2: representing some of these applicants. He specifically noted that some 95 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,280 Speaker 2: of these incidents that we're talking about actually occurred allegedly 96 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:38,480 Speaker 2: within the last twelve months, So these are not historical 97 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 2: cases only there are some very fresh allegations. But Aylward said, quote, 98 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 2: the threat of war often isn't the biggest safety fear 99 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 2: for female ADF personnel. It is the threat of sexual 100 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:52,360 Speaker 2: violence in their workplace, and he essentially is arguing that 101 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 2: that threat has persisted over multiple decades. It should also 102 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 2: be noted that this class action hasn't exactly come out 103 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 2: of nowhere. There has been this increasing focus on these 104 00:06:03,800 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 2: sorts of issues within the Defense Force in recent years, 105 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 2: including several reports and inquiries and recommendations into systematic sexual 106 00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 2: harassment within the ADF and its treatment of female staff specifically. 107 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 1: Has anything come from those inquiries we had? 108 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 2: You might remember the Royal Commission into Defense and Veteran Suicide. 109 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 2: That was a long running inquiry that handed down its 110 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:32,480 Speaker 2: final report in September last year now that recommended an external, 111 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:36,719 Speaker 2: independent inquiry into military sexual violence in the ADF after 112 00:06:36,800 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 2: finding close to eight hundred reports of sexual assaults in 113 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:43,719 Speaker 2: the ADF over a five year period. The Commission also 114 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:47,159 Speaker 2: noted that the actual number of assaults could be significantly 115 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:51,000 Speaker 2: higher than that eight hundred figure, because, according to the 116 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 2: final report, an estimated sixty percent of incidents actually go unreported. 117 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:58,839 Speaker 2: So we don't know the scale, but we know that 118 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 2: according to this find there is a concerning scale of 119 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:05,600 Speaker 2: sexual assaults. As part of that Commission into Defense and 120 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 2: Veteran Suicide, there was a workplace behavior survey now that 121 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:13,160 Speaker 2: found one in eight women in the ADF self reported 122 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 2: experiencing sexual misconduct in the previous twelve months. 123 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 1: WOW. 124 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 2: The Commission has described the impact of sexual violence on 125 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 2: serving and former members as quote nothing short of horrific. 126 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, So there is then some important context leading up 127 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 1: to this class action. The Department of Defense governs the ADF, 128 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:35,800 Speaker 1: that's part of the government. So what's been their response. 129 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 2: So a Defense spokesperson has acknowledged that there is quote 130 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 2: unquote work to be done. They said the ADF is 131 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 2: developing a comprehensive sexual misconduct prevention strategy as part of 132 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 2: the recommendation from that inquiry, and that this is a 133 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:54,400 Speaker 2: key priority area for Defense. They added, quote, all defense 134 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 2: personnel have a right to be respected and deserve to 135 00:07:56,840 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 2: have a positive workplace experience. In the ADF, no place 136 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 2: for sexual violence or misconduct in defense. We have heard 137 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 2: from the Federal Opposition leader, Susan Lee. She's commented on 138 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 2: this case saying every workplace should dedicate resources, effort, and 139 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 2: a system of reporting that allows women to confidently express 140 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 2: circumstances where they do not feel safe. 141 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 1: So then what happens next. 142 00:08:19,480 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 2: Well, the case has been filed in the Federal court 143 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 2: in Sydney, the New South Wales branch. Now it will 144 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:28,240 Speaker 2: go through the legal processes. As you know, Lucy, that 145 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 2: can take many months and even many years, because this 146 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:36,319 Speaker 2: is a class action, especially there could be a considerable 147 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: time spent working through the courts and working through all 148 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 2: of the allegations leveled at the ADF from the multiple 149 00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 2: women who will sign on as applicants who are expected 150 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 2: to GJA Sadler. The law firm are actually calling for 151 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 2: current and ex serving ADF members who believe they've been 152 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:57,319 Speaker 2: affected by these issues to register their interest. So it 153 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 2: said that all information will remain confidential, but essentially that 154 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,040 Speaker 2: law firm is in that early stage of trying to 155 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 2: put together a comprehensive analysis of what the experience of 156 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 2: women in the ADF has looked like for the last 157 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 2: twenty years, a really vast period of time. 158 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:13,840 Speaker 1: Yeah. 159 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 2: The lawyers are also calling for action, accountability, and what 160 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:20,720 Speaker 2: they describe as quote, real change for women in defense 161 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 2: who have been silenced or dismissed for too long and 162 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:28,120 Speaker 2: so inevitably that will include seeking financial compensation for the 163 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 2: women involved in this class action, depending on what unfolds 164 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,079 Speaker 2: over the coming years, that could be you know, several 165 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 2: millions of dollars in the form of a government payout. 166 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,319 Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks so much for walking us through that. Emma. 167 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:41,760 Speaker 2: Thanks Lucy, and. 168 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 1: If today's episode has raised any issues for you, help 169 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,079 Speaker 1: is always available at one eight hundred respect that's one 170 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 1: eight hundred seven three seven seven three to two. We'll 171 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 1: put some more resources in today's show notes. We'll see 172 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:57,440 Speaker 1: you this afternoon for the headlines. Until then, have a 173 00:09:57,440 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 1: great day. My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a 174 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:08,679 Speaker 1: proud Arunda Bunjelung Calgodin woman from Gadighl Country. The Daily 175 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:11,800 Speaker 1: oz acknowledges that this podcast is recorded on the lands 176 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:15,040 Speaker 1: of the Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal 177 00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:18,080 Speaker 1: and torrest Rate island and nations. We pay our respects 178 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: to the first peoples of these countries, both past and present.