Speaker 1: It's in the news today, but it was actually on
Speaker 1: TV Reload, the podcast past to deep that line. Welcome back,
Speaker 1: guys to TV Reload. My name is Benjamin Norris and
Speaker 1: this is your podcast to get all the inside goss
Speaker 1: or the popular TV shows you may be watching from
Speaker 1: around the world. Undeniably, our TV sets are a major
Speaker 1: part of our home entertainment, and yet very little is
Speaker 1: known about how our favorite shows get made. So each episode,
Speaker 1: I've been finding guests that want to dive just that
Speaker 1: little bit deeper into the shows they are currently making,
Speaker 1: so that you can hear all their exclusive stories and
Speaker 1: gain access to the biggest names in television. I want
Speaker 1: to thank you for downloading or subscribing to this podcast
Speaker 1: however you found it. I love hearing your feedback, so
Speaker 1: make sure you leave a review or a comment on
Speaker 1: your chosen podcast platform. This chat, I am joined by
Speaker 1: Gretel Vella, who is a film television theater writer and
Speaker 1: is the mastermind behind the latest Stan original series, Totally
Speaker 1: Completely Fine. The series drops on stand Australia this week
Speaker 1: and the show is a little interesting and we will
Speaker 1: get into that straight away in the podcast, but the
Speaker 1: series is inspired by true events It is a six
Speaker 1: part dark comedy series led by Thomasin mackenzie, who you
Speaker 1: would know from the popular film Jojo Rabbit, and it
Speaker 1: explores the complexities of grief, the power of friendship, and
Speaker 1: the ways our sadness can unite us. The series examines
Speaker 1: family legacy and ultimately ask the question how many lives
Speaker 1: do we have to save before we can save ourselves.
Speaker 1: I want to pre warn you this conversation does include
Speaker 1: a lot of discussion around suicide and suicide prevention. However,
Speaker 1: as the show is a comedy drama, I want you
Speaker 1: to know that this show is not completely gazumped by
Speaker 1: the bleak subject matter and is definitely worth watching. I
Speaker 1: will ask Gretel about the origins of the story and
Speaker 1: how much of it is based on real life events.
Speaker 1: We will talk about the shows in which Gretel may
Speaker 1: have been inspired by. When you see the hero house
Speaker 1: that's in the series straight away, you'll get Love my
Speaker 1: Way vibes, and I will find out if it was
Speaker 1: the same house or if that show had influenced her.
Speaker 1: Gretel will also be talking about the casting of Thomasin
Speaker 1: and why the international actress said yes to being a
Speaker 1: part of this series, Plus we will get plenty of
Speaker 1: exclusives from behind the scenes of Totally Completely Fine, which
Speaker 1: you can now view on Stan Australia. Anyway, let's bring
Speaker 1: Gretel into the podcast, and I really hope you enjoy
Speaker 1: this episode. Hi, Gretel, how are you?
Speaker 2: I'm very good, Thank you?
Speaker 1: How are you well? I'm very excited to be talking
Speaker 1: to you about this show because I had heard about
Speaker 1: this series a while back, and I have been really
Speaker 1: interested in how you were going to weave this story together.
Speaker 2: I think, look, comedy is something that I always use
Speaker 2: in my work to tackle subjects that are really hard,
Speaker 2: and I actually think that this show probably wouldn't work
Speaker 2: if it were a straight drama. I think it tackles
Speaker 2: some really heavy ideas, but I think we cushion it
Speaker 2: in such a way that it's going to be hopefully
Speaker 2: fun also for the audience.
Speaker 1: I kept thinking while I was watching this, this could
Speaker 1: very easily be a straight drama. But then I kept
Speaker 1: thinking about if I didn't have the comedy, would it
Speaker 1: be a little bit too hectic for me as a watch.
Speaker 1: I don't know, are you surprised to hear me talking
Speaker 1: about that?
Speaker 2: I mean, we talked a lot about the tone and
Speaker 2: what was funny and what wasn't, And I guess we
Speaker 2: agreed on what was and what wasn't when we first started,
Speaker 2: and then we had a whole bunch of different suicide
Speaker 2: prevention consultation bodies come through and psychologists and a lot
Speaker 2: of people read the scripts, and so I think by
Speaker 2: the end we've come to something that is funny in
Speaker 2: a kind of healthy and good way.
Speaker 1: I mean, grief and loss is something that everyone goes through,
Speaker 1: so I mean it's very accessible to a lot of people.
Speaker 1: But what made you want to explore this territory?
Speaker 2: Mental illness is something I've kind of had anxiety depression
Speaker 2: since I was about fourteen, so it's always kind of
Speaker 2: been in my work, but I guess I wanted to
Speaker 2: explore it in a deeper way. I kind of came
Speaker 2: to the idea jeering lockdown and I actually had a
Speaker 2: really weird experience where I was actually witnessed to two
Speaker 2: suicide attempts within the space of a week from a distance.
Speaker 2: But on the second one, my Uber driver pulled over
Speaker 2: and said to me, every day past this site, and
Speaker 2: every day there is someone else here trying to do this,
Speaker 2: so I kind of started to research guardians of places
Speaker 2: that people went to attempt suicide, and I just started
Speaker 2: to wonder what it would look like if someone who
Speaker 2: had anxiety and depression themselves was actually one of these guardians,
Speaker 2: and how would that be funny and how would that
Speaker 2: be sad? But I guess also what superpowers would that
Speaker 2: person have having walked a mile in these people's shoes,
Speaker 2: And so that's kind of how I came to the idea.
Speaker 1: I remember first reading that it's inspired on true events,
Speaker 1: you know, like how much of this story actually did occur?
Speaker 1: And I wanted to know more about that from you,
Speaker 1: like with those situations that you went through personally, and
Speaker 1: then sort of where you took it to with the
Speaker 1: writer's room. I guess.
Speaker 2: I guess the show is inspired by a whole bunch
Speaker 2: of different guardians. I kind of did my research on
Speaker 2: a few different people who looked after these places, and
Speaker 2: I guess Vivian's kind of form of anxiety is kind
Speaker 2: of quite similar to mine and a few of the
Speaker 2: people that I know. But I guess beyond the pilot,
Speaker 2: it's quite a fictionalized story that has been invented by
Speaker 2: us and it's kind of Viv's growth journey, and it's
Speaker 2: also her brother's growth journey. I think all of these
Speaker 2: three siblings are kind of dealing with the loss of
Speaker 2: their parents, and Vivian's is in more of an outward,
Speaker 2: visceral way, and I guess the brothers think that they've
Speaker 2: dealt with it as well, but as we go on,
Speaker 2: we see that they kind of start to unravel too. Well.
Speaker 1: There's a lot to be proud of in this series,
Speaker 1: and I felt like you broke a lot of ground
Speaker 1: in telling stories about siblings. You know, we often see
Speaker 1: siblings on television and they sort of get played off
Speaker 1: a certain way where I just kept thinking, Oh, I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm in a three as in I've got half siblings
Speaker 1: as well, and I just was like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: Like the dynamics between these three people, it's so it
Speaker 1: was so real because at one point you kind of
Speaker 1: feel like you're the sensible one and the other two
Speaker 1: are crazy, and then you become the crazy one, and
Speaker 1: that's really well depicted I think in this series.
Speaker 2: Yes, that was kind of a response that I got
Speaker 2: initial to the scripts, and it was actually really interesting.
Speaker 2: Initially they were all women and then I kind of
Speaker 2: gave it to my producers and they were like, we
Speaker 2: actually think it would be interesting if you gender flipped
Speaker 2: the brothers, but you didn't really do anything beyond flipping
Speaker 2: the gender. So I think they're also male characters that
Speaker 2: you maybe won't see, you haven't seen on the screens
Speaker 2: a lot before, which I'm really proud of. But yes,
Speaker 2: I am from A three three siblings as well, and
Speaker 2: it's very much modeled on that dynamic where also the
Speaker 2: kind of alliances start to change as the show goes on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's the I think you've managed to capture, you know,
Speaker 1: the love of the sibling, the jealousy and the silly
Speaker 1: things that we have not let go of from the past.
Speaker 2: Totally, and how you can love them but also hate
Speaker 2: them for the same time.
Speaker 1: No one can say anything bad about my siblings ever.
Speaker 1: I literally can't hear it. I will never hear about it,
Speaker 1: and yet I will be the first person to be
Speaker 1: sitting there just saying, oh my god, I can't believe
Speaker 1: how they get through their life.
Speaker 2: You know, as soon as your partner tries to ho in,
Speaker 2: you're like, no, no, that's not no, no, you.
Speaker 1: Cannot say a goddamn word. Sit tight. You're just there
Speaker 1: to listen, just not and agree. You know, I have
Speaker 1: to ask you about other shows that might have influenced
Speaker 1: your creative process, because I certainly was watching this and
Speaker 1: thinking I could feel some tones from shows that we've seen,
Speaker 1: particularly in Australia. Were you influenced by other scripted dramas
Speaker 1: that have been made in this country?
Speaker 2: I actually look, most of my tonal references were quite
Speaker 2: international in the flavor, and that was kind of my goal,
Speaker 2: was to I was particularly inspired by things like Fleeback
Speaker 2: and I May Destroy You, things that kind of dealt
Speaker 2: with really hard topics, but they kind of walked that
Speaker 2: line between comedy and drama. And it was kind of
Speaker 2: my goal to make a show that was really distinctly
Speaker 2: Australian but could sit alongside those shows, as you know,
Speaker 2: of equal worth, and that looked as visually interesting.
Speaker 1: I mean Love my Way for me, this is going
Speaker 1: to be a funny story. Did you ever watch Love
Speaker 1: My Way?
Speaker 2: Oh? Yes, Love My Way was one of our references,
Speaker 2: particularly the Hero House.
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, yeah, so that Hero House. That's not the
Speaker 1: same house though from Love My Way? Is it?
Speaker 2: No? I think we did look at the Love my
Speaker 2: Way house, but we went with something different.
Speaker 1: But it still had some was there sets or anything.
Speaker 1: I just remember the bedroom looked a lot like Frankie's
Speaker 1: bedroom Claudia Carvin's bedroom in that house. Maybe the house
Speaker 1: has just looked quite similar, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, definitely not Love my Way. We really wanted to,
Speaker 2: but we thought people will probably go they'd used to
Speaker 2: Love my White House.
Speaker 1: Haha. But you want to have that sort of feeling
Speaker 1: because you know what's really funny about that show is
Speaker 1: Love My Way is written basically to be a very
Speaker 1: serious drama without comedy. But I think if that show
Speaker 1: as being quite comical. And I'll tell you one day
Speaker 1: we had, like you know, when you have a group
Speaker 1: of friends over to watch YouTube of your favorite clips
Speaker 1: and funny comedians and things like that. I started bringing
Speaker 1: up these clips from Love my Way that were really dark,
Speaker 1: and I was laughing, thinking, oh my god, it's hilarious,
Speaker 1: and everyone's like, Ben, this is not really funny. This
Speaker 1: is and I'm like, oh, I find dark subject matter
Speaker 1: to be quite comical. And I think that's why when
Speaker 1: while watching your show, I just found myself laughing so
Speaker 1: easily in a good way.
Speaker 2: And do you think you were laughing at things that
Speaker 2: were intended to be jokes or you just have a
Speaker 2: taste that's a little darker than other people.
Speaker 1: I've always liked black comedies. I don't know there's something
Speaker 1: wrong with me. I mean, I need to go back
Speaker 1: to my therapist on that. But I think that if
Speaker 1: people are listening to this too and they love dark comedy,
Speaker 1: they're going to just eat this with a spoon.
Speaker 2: Yes, And I do feel like it's kind of a
Speaker 2: tonal journey. I think it does definitely get a little
Speaker 2: bit darker as it goes on.
Speaker 1: Sometimes I'm watching things and I'm laughing, and I think,
Speaker 1: am I the only person that's going to laugh at this?
Speaker 1: And when we don't watch things in a big theater
Speaker 1: with everyone else, we don't get that verification that it's
Speaker 1: okay to laugh. But I certainly, yeah, I definitely found
Speaker 1: this to be quite funny. But you know, we know
Speaker 1: the best way to deal with the darkest emotions that
Speaker 1: we have is to talk about them. Do you think
Speaker 1: that this show will help people have more open conversations
Speaker 1: about maybe their personal struggles or their dark things that
Speaker 1: are happening in their lives.
Speaker 2: I really hope. So I think that that was like
Speaker 2: my number one intention. I think that the way that
Speaker 2: we depict mental illness on screens is still quite surface
Speaker 2: level or tropy, and I think that this really delves
Speaker 2: into it in a really big way. And Yeah, my
Speaker 2: biggest intention was that you get to the end of
Speaker 2: it and you feel like you can talk to someone
Speaker 2: who you suspect might not be in a great place,
Speaker 2: or you can talk to other people about your experiences.
Speaker 2: I think most of the suicide prevention training we had
Speaker 2: said to us that if you start the conversation and
Speaker 2: you show the person that you're not afraid, it immediately
Speaker 2: kind of takes away all the tension in fear than
Speaker 2: anyone feels, and people are more inclined to get help.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's quite interesting, you know. I was asked to
Speaker 1: do a charity once and I turned up and the
Speaker 1: charity was quite I don't want to say what it is,
Speaker 1: but it was quite a difficult subject matter. And I
Speaker 1: turned up and they had to do like a photo
Speaker 1: and they asked me to do this photo where they
Speaker 1: asked me to sort of do this symbol that they
Speaker 1: all do for this particular charity. And I smiled while
Speaker 1: I was doing it, and they said to me, oh no,
Speaker 1: maybe don't smile. And it was funny because they then
Speaker 1: use the photo of me smiling and it had the
Speaker 1: most amount of traction, It had the most amount of
Speaker 1: interaction of people feeling comfortable to talk about it. And
Speaker 1: I thought that is a really interesting way of getting
Speaker 1: people to have a conversation when the subject matter is
Speaker 1: quite dark, is to it doesn't have to be exactly
Speaker 1: how you think the tone has to be, do you
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like it needs to be inviting
Speaker 1: to have a good conversation.
Speaker 2: And I mean I think people I was, certainly before
Speaker 2: I started the consultation experience, really scared to well. I
Speaker 2: just didn't know what to do in those situations. And
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people think that if they
Speaker 2: bring it up there, they'll say the wrong thing or
Speaker 2: they'll trigger the person. And I mean, we did a
Speaker 2: lot of training with Living Works, and it's actually in
Speaker 2: episode two, vivd some training herself on suicide prevention, and
Speaker 2: in this montage, the number one thing I want to
Speaker 2: people to take away is you can ask someone are
Speaker 2: you thinking about suicide? You just directly ask them if
Speaker 2: you suspect someone is suffering, And I can't believe how
Speaker 2: effective that phrase is. It immediately removes the tension people
Speaker 2: will talk to you about it.
Speaker 1: Isn't that strange? I mean, it's just strange. It seems
Speaker 1: like that's a weird thing to.
Speaker 2: Save it, you know, even weird.
Speaker 1: And also after COVID than ever we're all acting and
Speaker 1: maybe I should speak on my own behalf. We're all
Speaker 1: acting way weirder than we ever did before. We've got
Speaker 1: way more internalized emotion than you realize because we got
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm from Melbourne, so we got very locked down.
Speaker 1: And then what you really need for people to ask
Speaker 1: you is those really bold questions. You know, are you okay?
Speaker 1: And you know, are you thinking about suicide? Are you
Speaker 1: worried that people might turn away from this series being
Speaker 1: thinking it's a bit bleak.
Speaker 2: Potentially that's a worry. But hopefully if people even just
Speaker 2: watch a little bit of the pilot, they'll see that
Speaker 2: it's so much all and just go about suicide. It
Speaker 2: is also a body comedy, a family drama that has
Speaker 2: some real lass in there, and so I think people
Speaker 2: will actually really enjoy it. And the pilot's quite silly
Speaker 2: and fun. So I think that feel like it.
Speaker 1: And I also relate to the underdog character. You know,
Speaker 1: anyone that's really flawed, anyone that's almost awful, like it's funny,
Speaker 1: I really relate to them, and like Vivian, to me,
Speaker 1: I just was like, I'm relating so hard to this person.
Speaker 1: What sort of inspiration did you have for this person?
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think we've ever seen anyone like
Speaker 1: Vivian before.
Speaker 2: I think it was really important to me because I
Speaker 2: think when we depict mental illness, often the journeys are
Speaker 2: quite linear, and someone will have a conversation with someone
Speaker 2: or something will happen to them and they'll be like,
Speaker 2: I feel better, I am healed now. But I think
Speaker 2: Vivian's journey, I mean you've watched it, is so up
Speaker 2: and down, and you know, even when we get to
Speaker 2: the end, she's not a perfect person or healed by
Speaker 2: any means. But I think the show is saying that
Speaker 2: even if you're mess as most of the characters are,
Speaker 2: you still deserve to be there. And I think Tom
Speaker 2: thomasin McKenzie, who plays Vivian, I think it would be
Speaker 2: really easy to kind of play Vivian one note that is,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm a really selfish person who doesn't care
Speaker 2: about anyone else. But I think the thing about Viv
Speaker 2: is that she cares so deeply, and I think that's
Speaker 2: why she stuffs up so much. And she has such
Speaker 2: a warmth and wit underneath that, I think, But I
Speaker 2: think she avoids connecting with other people because she feels
Speaker 2: like she doesn't deserve to. And Tom straight away understood
Speaker 2: all of those things about her, and I think that
Speaker 2: an audience, you watch it and you just go I
Speaker 2: can see all of that underneath. I know you want
Speaker 2: to be better, and so I kind of love you
Speaker 2: for that.
Speaker 1: As an actress, Thomasin is just brilliant in this like
Speaker 1: and it would be such a hard role to try
Speaker 1: and undertake, you know, and to try and navigate throughout
Speaker 1: sort of making these words come on screen. You know,
Speaker 1: how did you come across her? I mean, how did
Speaker 1: you get her interested in this project?
Speaker 2: We got really lucky that she'd been I mean, she
Speaker 2: was traveling a lot and doing a lot of film
Speaker 2: and television. I think she was just back in New
Speaker 2: Zealand for a few months, and I think she was
Speaker 2: looking for a TV project if it was the right thing,
Speaker 2: and we sent her the first few scripts and she
Speaker 2: really liked them and really responded to Vivian, And so
Speaker 2: then we got on the phone and had a conversation
Speaker 2: and as I said, she just understood her and understood
Speaker 2: her want to do better. And I think there was
Speaker 2: just kind of myself, our director, Lucy Gaffi and Tom
Speaker 2: all really connected on that and this character, and she
Speaker 2: wanted to do it. I was so grateful to her.
Speaker 1: Do you think that we're able to tell stories that
Speaker 1: can be a little bit more niche these days? You
Speaker 1: know now that streaming services like stan Australia around. You know,
Speaker 1: are you as a creator able to quite you know,
Speaker 1: dream big and look outside of the constructs of what
Speaker 1: we used to see on television on our free away networks?
Speaker 2: Oh? One hundred percent. I definitely feel like things are changing.
Speaker 2: And I've definitely had this show, I mean different iterations
Speaker 2: kind of in my back pocket for a while, and
Speaker 2: I feel like now people are so much more open
Speaker 2: to things like that, and it's really interesting. Other ideas
Speaker 2: that I've had, You can get laughed out of rooms.
Speaker 2: Years ago, I would get laughed out of rooms, and
Speaker 2: now people are like yeah, that sounds great. I think
Speaker 2: we're changing, and particularly in Australia, I think there's a
Speaker 2: whole host of shows that are about to be released
Speaker 2: that are really just changing the game and what we
Speaker 2: see ourselves as capable of doing.
Speaker 1: But did you grow up liking flawed characters? I don't
Speaker 1: know if this is a strange question to ask you,
Speaker 1: because I did, Like, I think of so many different shows.
Speaker 1: I mean even I remember The Gray's Anatomy has now
Speaker 1: been on television for like a hundred years, but I
Speaker 1: remember when Meredith Gray was on that show to start with,
Speaker 1: I was like, you're awful, but I love you. Do
Speaker 1: you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't think I write any characters that
Speaker 2: are on flawed. I'm really interested in outcasts and lonely people,
Speaker 2: and I think you can make people these days as
Speaker 2: unlikable as you want, as long as you show the
Speaker 2: audience they're wound and why they're like that. I think that,
Speaker 2: and they're really interesting stories to tell.
Speaker 1: Is there a point where characters can be too dark?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: Is there a tipping point which you guys might have
Speaker 1: had in the writer's room where you were like, oh no,
Speaker 1: hang on a sec that might turn people away.
Speaker 2: I mean, definitely, but I think the kind of the
Speaker 2: barometer for that in every show is different. I think
Speaker 2: that in this show, all the characters are actually quite warm,
Speaker 2: and so Viv really had to exist in that world
Speaker 2: and kind of if she went too far, I was
Speaker 2: often trying to protect her. But I think if we
Speaker 2: look at shows like White Lotus, for example, those characters
Speaker 2: are all us is a shit.
Speaker 1: I'm They're awful, horrible, people can stop watching them.
Speaker 2: Yes, I feel like our tolerance level for that kind
Speaker 2: of thing is really increasing.
Speaker 1: It's interesting. I was talking only just recently, and it
Speaker 1: was in one of the offcuts of the podcast, and
Speaker 1: so I didn't get to use it. But when they
Speaker 1: were making Muriel's wedding, Muriel was a big talking point.
Speaker 1: They shot it where she was more awful than what
Speaker 1: we got to see in the final edit, and so
Speaker 1: when they were doing the editing process they pulled back.
Speaker 1: They actually cut very small clips out of that story
Speaker 1: to make sure that audiences in nineteen ninety four didn't
Speaker 1: hate her. And I thought that was really interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh my goodness, I would love to see that
Speaker 2: other cut.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Joe Bilcock, I think would be the person to ask,
Speaker 1: who's an editor. But yeah, and she's got a documentary
Speaker 1: that's out of people are listening to this. I think
Speaker 1: it's dancing in the edit. Might have got that wrong,
Speaker 1: but she does openly talk about having to edit around
Speaker 1: Muriel and being concerned that audiences might turn away because
Speaker 1: she made terrible decisions and they thought that people might
Speaker 1: be polarized by her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really difficult. There really is a balance that
Speaker 2: you need to find. But I think, yeah, it's show dependent.
Speaker 1: Yeah, very true. I just was wondering whether or not
Speaker 1: you guys were sitting there going, oh, look, we want
Speaker 1: to do this with her, and they'd be like, oh,
Speaker 1: we've already done this, so we kind of, you know,
Speaker 1: have to try and balance it out.
Speaker 2: Yes, I'm trying to think of specific instances, but there
Speaker 2: were definitely well, I was about to give away a
Speaker 2: huge spoiler, there were definitely additions to things that she
Speaker 2: did that we thought we should full back for those reasons.
Speaker 1: For sure, do you have a favorite scene? You know?
Speaker 1: That's what I was wanting to ask you the most
Speaker 1: out of all of these questions I've asking you, because
Speaker 1: there are so many great moments in this show and
Speaker 1: for you finally getting to see it realized and see
Speaker 1: it just ready before you know, audiences can digest it.
Speaker 1: You know when you think about it, is there a
Speaker 1: scene that you go, wow? I'm just this is what
Speaker 1: summarizes the show.
Speaker 2: Am I allowed to pick two?
Speaker 1: Yeah, go for it. Pick three. As long as I
Speaker 1: can stalk to you for the rest of my life,
Speaker 1: keep telling me everything.
Speaker 2: Okay. So there's a scene in the pilot where Vivian
Speaker 2: takes out the bins. I'm not sure am I allowed
Speaker 2: to give away spoilers on this? I think it's probably fine.
Speaker 2: Vivian has a coping mechanism where she takes out bins
Speaker 2: and then later on she shares that with someone else
Speaker 2: who is in crisis, and it's kind of a grounding
Speaker 2: technique that she uses to come back into the moment.
Speaker 2: And that was actually something that we took from one
Speaker 2: of the consultants that came into the room with us.
Speaker 2: This person was talking about when they had very active
Speaker 2: suicidal ideation, they needed a small grounding practice to get
Speaker 2: back into their own body and back into the present.
Speaker 2: And I just felt like it really kind of summarized
Speaker 2: what the show was trying to do. It was kind
Speaker 2: of these huge life changing moments juxtaposed with something so
Speaker 2: small and kind of ridiculous, and I think it plays
Speaker 2: really beautifully in the show. My second would be episode three.
Speaker 2: There is a particular how would I describe it, two
Speaker 2: of our characters get really sick and vomit after a
Speaker 2: night of drinking. But it is kind of this really
Speaker 2: earsty scene between them where kind of starting to fall
Speaker 2: in love or like each other in amongst both of
Speaker 2: them vomiting. And I think that too, really brilliantly summarizes
Speaker 2: the show. I was really fun to shoot and to
Speaker 2: plot in the room.
Speaker 1: Vomit to me can be very hard. I'm a sympathetic spewer,
Speaker 1: so anytime this spew I'm like, well, but I have
Speaker 1: to circle back on the first one. And I think
Speaker 1: we all have stuff in our lives that we use
Speaker 1: and we do go back to. I know that if
Speaker 1: I do something really stupid in my life, I've worked
Speaker 1: out over time that I will come home and I
Speaker 1: will miss Machine my house. This might sound really Mistachine,
Speaker 1: you remember those ads, but I will just clean to
Speaker 1: just you know, I've done something stupid, and it's a
Speaker 1: real reset for me. To feel better about myself. I'm like,
Speaker 1: it's okay that I did that because my house is tidy.
Speaker 1: So I think we all have those sort of resets
Speaker 1: in our minds, like taking the bins out.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, I love the mister Sheining. I'm going
Speaker 2: to steal out for season two.
Speaker 1: If I watched season two and mister Sheen's in there,
Speaker 1: I want the wrong. I owe you some money, I promise,
Speaker 1: not at all, not at all. It's actually cry it
Speaker 1: quite funny. I retold a story to a friend of
Speaker 1: mine from my best friend, just to an acquaintance. And
Speaker 1: then for some reason that friend became an author and
Speaker 1: she wrote a book anyway that she sent a copy
Speaker 1: of the book to my best friend, even though they
Speaker 1: didn't really know each other, and I was like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, why have you sent this book is so
Speaker 1: random to my friend Carrie. And then my friend Carry
Speaker 1: was reading it on a plane to Los Angeles and
Speaker 1: there was like a whole story in there that was
Speaker 1: completely ripped from her life. She was the person I retold, like,
Speaker 1: I'll quickly tell you this really quickly. So my best
Speaker 1: friend she has to do presentations a lot. She's an engineer,
Speaker 1: so an engineer not typically likes to talk in front
Speaker 1: of people, so her anxiety felt that she would always
Speaker 1: she always worried when she'd start to talk in front
Speaker 1: of people her head would roll off, and so she'd
Speaker 1: start to like feel really like loose in the head,
Speaker 1: and she'd be like, Oh my god, what happens in
Speaker 1: my head while I'm talking? And it became a real paranoia. Anyway,
Speaker 1: my friend Cassie, Cassie Lane, she stole that story and
Speaker 1: used it in her book, and the character had that
Speaker 1: situation where she would get anxious and think her head
Speaker 1: was going to roll on.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, and that's a very distinct.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I didn't know that I told this story.
Speaker 1: So she was on the plane, she was like, why
Speaker 1: the fuck is this Cassie Lane sent me this book,
Speaker 1: and why is my story in this book?
Speaker 2: You know? Oh my god? Was she mad at you?
Speaker 2: Or was she like, it's.
Speaker 1: Fine, she's gonna be upset about that. She would have
Speaker 1: left me years ago.
Speaker 2: Okay, Oh my god, that is that. The head rolling
Speaker 2: is so great? I think, yeah, I think that's gonna
Speaker 2: be what's great about the show. People will watch it
Speaker 2: and be like, I think that when you're experiencing these
Speaker 2: things are alone. You're like, this is so unique to me.
Speaker 2: No one else has these strange things that they do,
Speaker 2: and we all have something.
Speaker 1: And we all do and we all do, and you
Speaker 1: do summarize that so well. You know, just before I
Speaker 1: let you go, ask everyone this question on the podcast,
Speaker 1: what's something from behind the scenes, something that you know
Speaker 1: we we won't see as an audience that we might
Speaker 1: appreciate as a bit of a behind the scenes tidbit
Speaker 1: from making this series.
Speaker 2: Well, we had there is a Brolga in the show,
Speaker 2: and we had kind of one day. Her name I
Speaker 2: think was Hulga the Brolger, and she was kind of
Speaker 2: this and initially it was actually written as a bush turkey,
Speaker 2: but they're very protected. I didn't know this, so we
Speaker 2: had to get this vulgarim and she was very temperamental.
Speaker 2: Would only we thought that maybe she could do more
Speaker 2: than she could and she ate like basically was just
Speaker 2: corn motivated. But they were like, to us, there's only
Speaker 2: she can only eat a cup of corn and then
Speaker 2: she will be full and then she will no longer
Speaker 2: have any motivation to do anything. All of the scenes
Speaker 2: that you see, we I think we may be shot
Speaker 2: in like a couple of hours with this Brolga. Who
Speaker 2: but I mean, she looks stunning in the show, but
Speaker 2: that was just something very funny. And I think in
Speaker 2: all of the seeds she's just eating the corn very obviously.
Speaker 2: But if you read the scripts, they're like, and then
Speaker 2: the Brolga, we'll look at her and make a noise
Speaker 2: and I was very specific, but look, she's still great.
Speaker 1: I thought the Broga was amazing. There's the one scene
Speaker 1: where that she's running outside the house and the Broger
Speaker 1: does something that interacted with her with Vivian very well.
Speaker 1: Now I can't remember what which scene that was.
Speaker 2: She like box at her at one point. We did
Speaker 2: get some great don't get me wrong. She's beautiful, and
Speaker 2: I mean, who can train a Brolger. What they could
Speaker 2: do with her was insane. But our poor director Lucy
Speaker 2: was like, can she walk across this.
Speaker 1: Draft or not? Mind you, I can't. I can't do
Speaker 1: a goddamn thing. After I've been fed, once I've had
Speaker 1: my dinner, I'm done for the day. I'm like, the
Speaker 1: only thing I'm doing is going to bed. So I'm
Speaker 1: with the Broger.
Speaker 2: I know, I like, I didn't blame her good on her.
Speaker 2: It was very funny. And then I think, like she
Speaker 2: had a hotel room. At the end of the day,
Speaker 2: she was really great. She had a priority set.
Speaker 1: Sounds amazing. That's the Broga goes back to the other
Speaker 1: brog of friends and gets to gloat about it. I
Speaker 1: have got to stay in this beautiful Hilton hotel. Actually,
Speaker 1: just another question I was going to ask you, which
Speaker 1: I've been thinking about this week, was when I first
Speaker 1: heard about the production. I remember hearing that it was
Speaker 1: named something different. Was it called The Great or the
Speaker 1: Brave or it was called The Jump the Jump?
Speaker 2: But yes, we felt as though it just didn't feel
Speaker 2: right as our title, and I think we needed something
Speaker 2: a little bit gentler. So we think totally completely and
Speaker 2: I think totally completely fine actually speaks to the kind
Speaker 2: of thesis of the show in a better way. It's
Speaker 2: kind of a bunch of people who are really masking
Speaker 2: how they're feeling, and it kind of all it comes
Speaker 2: to the surface at the end. And kind of a
Speaker 2: pattern we had with all our consultants, particularly the psychologist
Speaker 2: we spoke to, is that when people normally sit down
Speaker 2: for therapy, it's like, how are you and they're like,
Speaker 2: I am so fine, I'm really good, and then it
Speaker 2: all come out lowstat.
Speaker 1: I kind of begin to tell you how many times
Speaker 1: I've accidentally said totally completely fine. I'm totally completely fine
Speaker 1: in emails in conversation over the last week since I
Speaker 1: saw the show. So it's in the vernacular for me. Now.
Speaker 2: That's good because I always get on these calls and
Speaker 2: things if people are like they accidentally call it everything everywhere,
Speaker 2: all at once, and I'm like, no, fine.
Speaker 1: You can call it whatever. You're like, it's totally completely fine, Rotell.
Speaker 1: I am obsessed with you. I think i'd love to
Speaker 1: spend a day in your head. I'd love to have
Speaker 1: a drink while I was there, because I think you've
Speaker 1: got some amazing storytelling and some really interesting perspectives. And
Speaker 1: I can't wait to see what other shows you work
Speaker 1: on after this, and I can't wait for people to
Speaker 1: watch this series.
Speaker 2: Oh, thank you so much for watching it and for
Speaker 2: taking the time to chat. I hope other people like it.
Speaker 2: I'm really excited.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for the chat. I hope people
Speaker 1: because because I just think my biggest concern with this
Speaker 1: series is people might see it. I mean to me,
Speaker 1: I'm drawn to it for that reason. But even when
Speaker 1: I was telling people about it, they're like, oh, no,
Speaker 1: that might be a little bit too dark for me,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, no, it's not. And then with all
Speaker 1: the questioning that I had for you, you know, while
Speaker 1: we're talking about it today, I wanted to make sure
Speaker 1: that it's a fun chat, you know what I mean, Like,
Speaker 1: we're not getting because we are unpacking things that are
Speaker 1: totally quite dark, but I want people to see the
Speaker 1: comedy in it. So hopefully we reflected that in our
Speaker 1: unpacking life.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Because I think as we've been
Speaker 2: talking about what we're going to say in interviews and things,
Speaker 2: I'm like, how can I really get across that people
Speaker 2: aren't just going to be assaulted with darkness for six
Speaker 2: hours of television because you just can't do that.
Speaker 1: It's no.
Speaker 2: I think it's it is so much more than a
Speaker 2: show about suicide. You kind of get to the end
Speaker 2: and you're like, I mean, that was great, but there's
Speaker 2: more there.
Speaker 1: Because that is the center point. It's interesting that you
Speaker 1: finish the series. It's so interesting that you finish it
Speaker 1: and it's not what you're thinking about. You know, you've
Speaker 1: unpacked it and you've digested it and you've struggled with it.
Speaker 1: But I have more walked away with my feelings about
Speaker 1: those three characters and that sibling relationship and how great
Speaker 1: that seemed to come together, and that seems to be
Speaker 1: more what stays with me and the fun.
Speaker 2: That's how you were thinking about the siblings when it finished.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's all I could think about was these siblings
Speaker 1: that couldn't And I rang my brother who's older than me,
Speaker 1: and we fight like cats and dogs, but we also,
Speaker 1: you know, are each other's favorite person at the same time.
Speaker 1: You know, obviously very strange relationship. But yeah, and I
Speaker 1: just thought, wow that I said to him, when this
Speaker 1: show comes out, you've got to watch it, because I
Speaker 1: want to know if you can see the similarities in
Speaker 1: our relationship.
Speaker 2: That means a lot that you relate to that it was.
Speaker 2: It was interesting. It was initially a half hour offering,
Speaker 2: and then the broadcasters were like, we think it makes
Speaker 2: more sense at commercial hour, and so that sibling story
Speaker 2: that was initially really small became such a bigger thing.
Speaker 2: And I think the show is so much better for that.
Speaker 1: Oh, it's so rich for it it's so rich for it.
Speaker 1: I think there'll be a lot of people will be
Speaker 1: thinking about that. I'm anyone that's got a sibling. We'll
Speaker 1: read into all of that stuff which we talked about
Speaker 1: in the podcast. You know, we talk about you know
Speaker 1: that love, the jealousy, and all the things you haven't
Speaker 1: left behind, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1: Anyway, I know that you're a very busy person, so
Speaker 1: I'm going to let you go, and I just want
Speaker 1: to say thank you so much for such a fun chat.
Speaker 1: And I really hope that you have a great time
Speaker 1: with this series and talking about it with lots of people, And.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. You were the best to talk to.
Speaker 2: I was nervous, so thank you.