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Speaker 1: Towards the end of the show yesterday we learned that

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Speaker 1: the federal and territory governments signed an agreement to establish

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Speaker 1: the Defense Accommodation Precinct Darwin at Howard Springs. Now, the

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Speaker 1: agreement is going to enable the Department of Defense to

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Speaker 1: use the Howard Springs facility as an accommodation precinct from July,

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Speaker 1: so from now pretty much. And joining me in the

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Speaker 1: studio to tell us a little bit more about the

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Speaker 1: situation is the Chief Minister, Natasha Files, good morning to you.

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Speaker 2: Good morning, Katie, Good morning listeners.

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Speaker 1: Now, Chief Minister, this agreement was signed yesterday. How quickly

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Speaker 1: are we going to see defense personnel in there?

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, defense personnel, as I understand, did arrive late yesterday.

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Speaker 3: So Howard Springs the former Impacts workers camp that became

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Speaker 3: the Center for National Resilience and saw sixty thousand people

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Speaker 3: quarantined there during the COVID pandemic. And I'd like to

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Speaker 3: point out not one case snuck out of their So

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Speaker 3: that is you know, the staff that worked their, our

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Speaker 3: health professionals, credit to them. But it is a unique facility, Katie.

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Speaker 3: It's three and a half thousand rooms, it's single quarters,

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Speaker 3: so with some of the difficulties that we had during

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Speaker 3: COVID and during the recent natural disaster in terms of families.

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Speaker 3: But this partnership with defense, I think is really good

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Speaker 3: for that facility and good for the top end.

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Speaker 2: We do see when defense exercises.

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Speaker 3: Are on that they do take up hotel accommodation, but

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Speaker 3: they're not necessarily eating in our restaurants or visiting the

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Speaker 3: bars because they're here to work and to participate in

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Speaker 3: a high level defense exercise.

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Speaker 1: And so they're in there from yesterday.

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Speaker 3: So Katie, it's been a big job Northern Territory government

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Speaker 3: officials working with Commonwealth officials.

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Speaker 2: So as you're aware, we recently used it.

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Speaker 3: For the natural disaster, and it's important for your listeners

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Speaker 3: to note, Katie, if the territory needed that for some reason,

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Speaker 3: we in the contract can go back into the facility.

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Speaker 3: So if there was some natural disaster, if we saw

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Speaker 3: a massive flood, and I don't want to see that again,

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Speaker 3: but we do know that when the wet season we

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Speaker 3: have cyclones and floods, we could utilize if needed. But

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Speaker 3: I think this is a really partnership with defense.

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Speaker 1: How much will the Northern Territory government receive from Defense

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Speaker 1: to essentially lease that facility over the next five years.

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Speaker 3: So the five year lease arrangement between the Commonwealth and

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Speaker 3: the Northern Territory government is estimated to cost the Commonwealth

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Speaker 3: fifty million per year. We get eighteen million per year, Katie,

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Speaker 3: but that will.

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Speaker 1: Cover alsoly, so we don't get the full fifty So

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Speaker 1: eighteen it's so to set it up as a facility

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Speaker 1: for Defense is around fifty million a year and then eighteen.

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Speaker 2: That will go towards.

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Speaker 3: Some of it is rent, but making sure you know, water, sewerage, maintenance, pests, spray,

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Speaker 3: those types of things so that it's operational, and then

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Speaker 3: Defense will further spend to have it operationalized. So so

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Speaker 3: rent and maintenance, I guess you'd say, correct, So eighteen

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Speaker 3: million dollars per year, but it's going to cost them

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Speaker 3: fifty million obviously to continue.

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Speaker 2: To operate it.

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Speaker 1: How would it work like if you're in a situation

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Speaker 1: where you've got defense personnel in there and then you

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Speaker 1: need to evacuate flood you know, evacuees. I mean, whether

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Speaker 1: we like it or not, there was some bad behavior

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Speaker 1: that we'd seen at Howard Springs. We all know that

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Speaker 1: there was damage. Course, how would that then work when

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Speaker 1: you've got a large cohort that are there obviously to

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Speaker 1: work to get involved in exercises and then if you

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Speaker 1: ended up with people also evacuated from a community.

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Speaker 3: So I could probably answer that in two parts, Katie.

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Speaker 3: So traditionally these military exercises go during the dry season,

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Speaker 3: which is the same time as our peak tourism season,

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Speaker 3: so that is generally the timing which we have less

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Speaker 3: although we have recently had significant rains through Central Australia

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Speaker 3: this dry season, so the season's alignment. It's also a

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Speaker 3: huge facility, and as we saw during COVID, you're able

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Speaker 3: to section parts of it off. But I think it

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Speaker 3: is important that stepping forward if that was the best facility.

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Speaker 3: You know, we do have other options in terms of

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Speaker 3: responding to natural disasters, but I think this is a

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Speaker 3: really good fit for this facility. We did look, Katie,

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Speaker 3: at whether we could use it for homelessness, shelter age care,

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Speaker 3: those types of things, but it's really not appropriate. It's

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Speaker 3: got steps. It is that workers camp style accommodation. For

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Speaker 3: your listeners to have that understanding.

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Speaker 1: Now, in terms of that first cohort of over thirteen

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Speaker 1: hundred military personnel from Australia and partner nations scheduled to arrival.

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Speaker 1: It sounds as though some of them already have as

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Speaker 1: part of Exercise Talisman Saber. The facility is expected obviously

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Speaker 1: to relieve that pressure, like you touched on just a

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Speaker 1: moment ago on other accommodation around Darwin. How big an

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Speaker 1: impact has that had in previous years in terms of

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Speaker 1: defense personnel maybe staying at hotels around the place, and

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Speaker 1: they're needing those hotel rooms freely for tourists. So, Katie,

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Speaker 1: it's difficult because we want to grow tourism as a

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Speaker 1: huge part of our economy, and we know tourists want

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Speaker 1: to come to the top end and experience, you know,

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Speaker 1: our natural wonders, our great lifestyle. So when you have

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Speaker 1: large chunks of rooms blocked out for defense exercises, that

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Speaker 1: clearly has an impact.

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Speaker 3: So it'll allow us to have certainty there. It will

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Speaker 3: also allow for these military exercises for those visiting forces

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Speaker 3: and services to have certainty and to potentially expand, remembering

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Speaker 3: that they do get you know, it does have catering

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Speaker 3: out there at Howard Springs, but those supplies come from

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Speaker 3: local contractors, so it does have a positive flow and

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Speaker 3: effect into our economy from this defense, but also allows

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Speaker 3: the growth with tourism.

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Speaker 1: Now. Is all the repair work complete out there now.

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Speaker 3: Katie, I knew that you'd be keen for an update

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Speaker 3: on that. My understanding is there is a portion still

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Speaker 3: to go, but there has been around two hundred and

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Speaker 3: eighty thousand dollars of repairs to date, and as I said, it's.

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Speaker 2: A big facility.

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Speaker 3: So we've got the personnel coming into areas that are

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Speaker 3: fresh and ready for them whilst we finish off that

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Speaker 3: other repair.

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Speaker 1: Two hundred and eighty grand already spent and a portion

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Speaker 1: still to go at this point, correct how much still

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Speaker 1: to go?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, we.

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Speaker 3: Will be releasing a tend or I understand, for that

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Speaker 3: final repair work, and when that is finalized, we can

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Speaker 3: share that figure with you.

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Speaker 1: So don't know how much that tender is going to

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Speaker 1: be for.

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Speaker 3: I'm sorry, Katie, I don't have even any indication of

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Speaker 3: how much that is, but I'll certainly get that to

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Speaker 3: you next time we speak.

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Speaker 1: Is it like windows or what else needs.

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Speaker 2: To be done?

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Speaker 3: That's my understanding, Katie, is that's for the windows. So

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Speaker 3: I was out at the vascility with the minister, federal

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Speaker 3: minister yesterday and it's certainly, you know, looking spick and span.

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Speaker 2: They were really impressed. He hadn't been there before.

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Speaker 3: Officials clearly had been, but he was really impressed at

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Speaker 3: the layout of it and the way that it could

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Speaker 3: operate to support defense. Because Katie, we have three bases

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Speaker 3: in the top end and then obviously going down to Tindle,

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Speaker 3: but they're full. Robertson Barracks has had a lot of

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Speaker 3: infiel and a lot of development over the years, and

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Speaker 3: so you know they needed that capacity to help them.

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Speaker 1: Is there going to be any sort of if we

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Speaker 1: do have evacuate evacuees again, is there going to be

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Speaker 1: any mitigation work or work done to ensure that we

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Speaker 1: do not see the same level of damage, because I mean,

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Speaker 1: two hundred and eighty thousand dollars to date is an

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Speaker 1: awful lot of money.

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Speaker 3: Yes, Katie, we of course, following any critical incident emergency

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Speaker 3: response review that workout how can we care for those individuals,

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Speaker 3: but what can we do to mitigate those types of

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Speaker 3: behaviors that we saw. There was work that was undertaken

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Speaker 3: at the time, but yes, we of course would review

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Speaker 3: that now.

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Speaker 1: Jerry would sent me a message late yesterday he said Katie,

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Speaker 1: the IMPECX Camp recreation facilities were to be given to

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Speaker 1: the community when IMPECS left, regardless of the idea of

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Speaker 1: taking a lease over the camp. The recreation facilities should

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Speaker 1: still be open to the local community as reward for

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Speaker 1: the camp being built in the rural area, as promised

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Speaker 1: at the public meeting at Howard Springs.

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Speaker 2: What do you make of that.

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, I know that the facility was to be

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Speaker 3: handed or the Northern Tertory government could choose to take

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Speaker 3: that facility. I'm not aware of conversations around access to

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Speaker 3: the recreation facilities. I know Jerry is really keen on

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Speaker 3: a pool in the rural area, and this is something

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Speaker 3: going right back when Clare Martin was Chief Minister. I think,

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Speaker 3: or maybe Paul Henderson that they did try and work

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Speaker 3: with a Lichfield council to put a pool out there

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Speaker 3: and that didn't progress. But I'm not aware of the

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Speaker 3: comments that you've just articulated on behalf of Jerry.

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Speaker 1: I mean, should the locals out there be allowed to

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Speaker 1: use the pool?

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, we did look at with the Palmerston Pool

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Speaker 3: being upgraded significantly. But it's not straightforward to allow general

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Speaker 3: community access to a facility that has been designed and

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Speaker 3: is operational for restricted use, is my understanding. Now, I

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Speaker 3: do want to move along because it is a lot

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Speaker 3: to get into this morning, and just on some of

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Speaker 3: the other work being undertaken by Defense.

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Speaker 1: The work at the airport now we now know that

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Speaker 1: it means the route between Darwin and Bali is off

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Speaker 1: for a month later this year, as we'd revealed on

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Speaker 1: the show last week. Are you concerned that this work

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Speaker 1: is going to impact other routes?

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Speaker 3: Yes, Katie, we want to see this between the Darwin

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Speaker 3: Airport Development Group and Defense urgently solved. We need them

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Speaker 3: to come together to give certainty around the scheduled works

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Speaker 3: and the timeline because our.

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Speaker 2: Airport is so vital.

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Speaker 3: We respect it's a military runway, but it's our connection

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Speaker 3: to our family, our friends, and it also for our tourists.

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Speaker 1: Who isn't passing the information on to the Northern Territory

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Speaker 1: government because last week I'd actually put this to the

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Speaker 1: Minister for Tourism based on messages that I had received

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Speaker 1: from a listener basically asking Katie, why can't your book

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Speaker 1: flights at this time, and it was news to Nicole Madison.

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Speaker 1: To her credit, she came back to me within half

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Speaker 1: an hour and had told us what the situation was,

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Speaker 1: and it was because of these runway works. But honestly,

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Speaker 1: I thought, what a situation to be in where the

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Speaker 1: Tourism Minister hasn't been notified that that's the case, Katie.

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Speaker 3: As I outlined, this is a project between the federal

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Speaker 3: government Department of Defense and the Darwin Elopment Darwin Development

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Speaker 3: Group at the airport and it's not to do with NTG, but.

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Speaker 2: It absolutely impacts our community.

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Speaker 3: So we're calling on them to come together and to

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Speaker 3: have the most minimal disruption to the runway for the

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Speaker 3: reasons I outlined before.

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Speaker 1: So are they passing that information onto the Northern Territory government.

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, we've been working with them to get as

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Speaker 3: much information as possible. But my understanding is that it's

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Speaker 3: the Airport Development Group and Defense coming together to finalize

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Speaker 3: how these vital maintenance works will take place.

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Speaker 2: That's what is being waited well, and.

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Speaker 1: Look, everybody understands that that work needs to happen. I

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Speaker 1: think that's you know, that's not the point being made here.

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Speaker 1: The point being made is the fact that you know,

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Speaker 1: the Tourism Minister hadn't even been made aware that there's

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Speaker 1: going to be a month we can't catch a flight

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Speaker 1: between Darwin and Bali at the same time that she's

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Speaker 1: having discussions with me about trying to entice other airlines

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Speaker 1: to the Northern Territory and to Darwin. How on earth

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Speaker 1: are we going to get other airlines to start operating

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Speaker 1: out of Darwin if we don't even know what's going

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Speaker 1: on with the runway at this point in time in

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Speaker 1: terms of what flights can and can't leave.

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Speaker 3: And that's why, Katie, we need those two organizations to

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Speaker 3: come together to come up with a plan with the

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Speaker 3: most minimal disruption on the runway access for both our

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Speaker 3: community and tourists alike, and then to share that with people.

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Speaker 3: So we really call on them to sort it out.

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Speaker 3: We all get the works need to take place. We've

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Speaker 3: seen runway works take place previous decades and it has

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Speaker 3: an impact, but we need them to come together to

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Speaker 3: have that plan. So exactly for your point, we're trying

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Speaker 3: to attract new airline, we want to support the airlines.

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Speaker 2: We've got here. We know how Vidal our air services are.

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Speaker 1: Are you confident that they're going to be able to

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Speaker 1: do that? Katie?

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Speaker 3: I am confident, and you know the Assistant Ministry yesterday

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Speaker 3: certainly was getting across these issues from defenses perspective. So

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Speaker 3: I'm confident we'll get sorted. But we just need to

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Speaker 3: understand the information. No one's saying it doesn't need to happen.

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Speaker 3: We just want to understand the when and what the

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Speaker 3: impact is so we can work around it well.

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Speaker 1: And are you worried? Then? Obviously we know that this

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Speaker 1: is just impacting that Bali route, but are you concerned

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Speaker 1: because we do have even a lot of our domestic

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Speaker 1: routes travel at night time. I don't know exactly what

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Speaker 1: the reason is why Jetstars decided to cancel this one,

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Speaker 1: aside from saying that it is as a result of

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Speaker 1: that work that's underway. But what's to stop any of

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Speaker 1: the airlines canceling other routes at this point?

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Speaker 2: And Katie, for.

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Speaker 3: The airlines, they will be dealing with an impact to

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Speaker 3: runway access here in Darwin, but that plane will either

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Speaker 3: be coming from or returning to a location that may

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Speaker 3: have a curfew, for example. So that's why the information

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Speaker 3: as soon as possible is vital, so the airlines can

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Speaker 3: make the adjustments that may be needed or understand there

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Speaker 3: won't be an impact and we can understand the services.

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Speaker 1: So you're essentially calling on the Department of Defense and

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Speaker 1: also the Airport Development Group to provide that information as

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Speaker 1: soon as possible.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, all right.

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Speaker 1: I do want to move along and ask about these

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Speaker 1: protesters out at Lee Point yesterday demonstrating against a housing

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Speaker 1: development in which three people have reportedly ended up being arrested.

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Speaker 1: The group of protesters blockaded the entrance to the former

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Speaker 1: defense facility. They're at Lee Point. It is all in

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Speaker 1: an effort to stop Defense Housing authorities proposed mixed use

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Speaker 1: development at the former Commonwealth site. Now they're concerned that

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Speaker 1: this development is going to damage ecosystems at Lee Point.

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Speaker 1: That's clearing at the site is unsustainable and will have

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Speaker 1: lasting environmental impacts. Is the government concerned about the issues

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Speaker 1: being raised by these protesters.

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, that site has always been Defense used to

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Speaker 3: hold the old radio towers. Defense back in the eighties

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Speaker 3: and nineties talked about the fact they needed that into

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Speaker 3: the future. This housing project has been long talked about,

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Speaker 3: long planned. We did see the Federal Minister for Environment,

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Speaker 3: Tanya Plibisec take on board the concerns of residents around

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Speaker 3: the Gordian finches under the EPBC, which is Commonwealth legislation.

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Speaker 3: She reviewed what was being planned and reviewed the wildlife

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Speaker 3: and she has expanded the corridors and also an area

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Speaker 3: around the water source, the dam where the birds are

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Speaker 3: getting water. So I think that there has been a

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Speaker 3: thorough review of this. Just because someone doesn't like that

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Speaker 3: final outcome doesn't mean there hasn't been a process around us.

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Speaker 1: So you're confident that that's enough, that enough has been

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Speaker 1: done here.

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Speaker 3: That's the advice I've got from the Commonwealth government who've

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Speaker 3: reviewed this.

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Speaker 1: Now, those people that were blockading that development yesterday, are

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Speaker 1: they going to face fines? From your perspective or from

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Speaker 1: your understanding with the police?

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Speaker 2: Ok that would be a question for police. I'm sorry,

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Speaker 2: I don't have that information.

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Speaker 1: Now, Okay, let's move along because there is so much happening,

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Speaker 1: and we know that the coroner has well, there's been

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Speaker 1: a has heard throughout this the last couple of weeks.

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Speaker 1: We know that the coronial inquest does indeed continue into

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Speaker 1: the deaths of four Aboriginal women, and the Coroner heard

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Speaker 1: that there's been a one hundred and seventeen percent increase

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Speaker 1: in DV reports to police in the last ten years

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Speaker 1: and it is projected to increase by another seventy three

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Speaker 1: percent in the next decade. That is according to a

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Speaker 1: report by the ABC Now. The inquiry has repeatedly heard

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Speaker 1: evidence about relentless pressure on emergency and community services to

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Speaker 1: handle an overwhelming number of requests for help, with the

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory suffering the highest rates of domestic violence in

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Speaker 1: the country. The coroner described the situation as a crisis

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Speaker 1: with domestic and family violence response systems facing a complete

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Speaker 1: breakdown because of being overwhelmed. Chief Minister, there's no doubt

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Speaker 1: that an enormous amount of work does need to happen here.

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Speaker 1: But at the pointy end, we have heard during the

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Speaker 1: inquest that calls are going to the call center, to

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Speaker 1: the police call center, and there aren't enough police crews

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Speaker 1: to go out to those callouts. Why does the government

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Speaker 1: keep saying that there are more police than ever before

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Speaker 1: when it's becoming increasingly obvious that we don't have enough.

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, if I could answer that in a couple

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Speaker 3: of different portions, of information. So essentially there's more police

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Speaker 3: resources than ever before.

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Speaker 2: Do we need more?

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Speaker 3: That is certainly the work that I want to undertake

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Speaker 3: understanding what we need across the board in terms of resources.

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Speaker 3: So there is more resources than ever before, but do

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Speaker 3: we need more? Of course, there's work to do in

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Speaker 3: that space.

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Speaker 1: I do we do need more? Well, that's the work that.

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Speaker 3: We're undertaking with the electronic rostering and then reviewing police

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Speaker 3: resources with that in terms of the coronial, and I

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Speaker 3: want to respect the process that is underway. A coronial

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Speaker 3: is undertaken to look at systemic government based issues in

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Speaker 3: the tragic death of individuals of Territorians. And so we

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Speaker 3: know domestic and family and sexual violence is a huge

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Speaker 3: issue in the Northern Territory. There was increased budget for

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Speaker 3: that sector and for those programs. We want to make

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Speaker 3: sure that we address the behaviors I find it. I

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Speaker 3: just find it apparent I don't understand the people that

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Speaker 3: you're meant to love, you then commit a violent crime

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Speaker 3: to them. And so we know that the large number

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Speaker 3: of victims are women and children, and that's why those

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Speaker 3: men's behavior change programs that help perpetrators address their violent

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Speaker 3: behaviors are so important, and we've got two of those

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Speaker 3: in the territory, run by Catholic Care in the top

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Speaker 3: end and Tongue and Geer in our springs, and they're

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Speaker 3: the programs that will stop that statistic of seventy three

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Speaker 3: percent from coming into play.

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Speaker 1: Look, I agree, and I certainly you know, we know

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Speaker 1: that the coronial is obviously continuing on, so I'm very

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Speaker 1: cognizant of that. But you know, hearing last week that

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Speaker 1: we're in a situation we're at jesk so at the

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Speaker 1: police call center, that you've got evidence that's being provided

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Speaker 1: with I are saying that there is not enough cruise

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Speaker 1: to be able to send out at the pointy end

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Speaker 1: to intervene when it really is at that terrible point.

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Speaker 1: That's utterly heartbreaking and it does totally go against what

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Speaker 1: we have been hearing from the government that we've got

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Speaker 1: enough police.

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, that electronic rostering, and we spoke about this

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Speaker 3: last time I talked with you, particularly in Darwin and

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Speaker 3: Ala Springs, the bigger centers, making sure that we've got

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Speaker 3: those resources operational at the right time of the day

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Speaker 3: to respond to the community's needs. And that's why that

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Speaker 3: electronic rostering work is so important. But as we have said,

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Speaker 3: we will independently that data let that guide the review

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Speaker 3: into police resourcing.

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Speaker 1: All right, So the Minister said on Friday during the

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Speaker 1: week that was that she hopes that it's going to

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Speaker 1: get underway and be done and dusted within six months.

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Speaker 3: Is that fast enough, Katie. That's where and when we

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Speaker 3: spoke last time. Rather than waiting for all of that

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Speaker 3: rostering work to be done territory wide, focusing on those

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Speaker 3: bigger centers and also doing work concurrently, it doesn't mean

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Speaker 3: that we can you know, we can start to get

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Speaker 3: information that can feed that police resourcing. So we heard

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Speaker 3: from the Police Association around over time.

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Speaker 2: Now there's some overtime.

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Speaker 3: Katie, that can't be avoided because it might be a

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Speaker 3: specific person to an operation that needs to Then you know,

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Speaker 3: if information comes through out of ours, they then need that.

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Speaker 3: But if we are seeing significant hours of overtime, which

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Speaker 3: we saw during estimates, using that information as well as

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Speaker 3: the electronic monstering to guide us towards those police resources

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Speaker 3: is what I'm keen to achieve.

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Speaker 1: All right. Well, I've got a couple of issues that

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Speaker 1: I want to discuss really quickly. We spoke to the

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Speaker 1: Nursing and with Free Federation yesterday about the EBA which

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Speaker 1: has been reached. It is good news, but in the

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Speaker 1: same line, we've seen a number of code yellows. We

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Speaker 1: know that there is one at the moment due to

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Speaker 1: an electronic fault out at Palmerston last month, though we

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Speaker 1: had two across Darwin and Palmerston. Do you think that

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Speaker 1: this agreement on when the EBA is going to entice

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Speaker 1: small nurses to work in the Northern Territory.

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Speaker 3: So we worked really closely with the Nursing and midwif

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Speaker 3: Free Federation to make sure that our hard working nurses

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Speaker 3: and midwives got what they needed to do their job

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Speaker 3: and recognize their efforts. So I am confident that resolving this.

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Speaker 3: There'll always be issues and ideas that we can work on,

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Speaker 3: but having this matter settled and giving that pay rise

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Speaker 3: to those workers was really important to me and now

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Speaker 3: we can continue to work in partnership with the federation.

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Speaker 1: Are you concerned about the level of code yellows that

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Speaker 1: we are seeing, So, Katie.

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Speaker 3: For your listeners, when you're in a hospital, there's a

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Speaker 3: number of different codes. They all have a color that

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Speaker 3: are called to help people in that complex working environment,

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Speaker 3: understand what is going on. So a code yellow means

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Speaker 3: there's something that could impact the delivery of care and

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Speaker 3: to make sure it's safe that code yellow is called.

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Speaker 3: And sometimes there's things that are internal external. But Katie,

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Speaker 3: we of course want to work so that we're not

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Speaker 3: seeing those codes.

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Speaker 1: Called well it applying them down. I mean, it is

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Speaker 1: still a pretty serious situation to be in a code yellow, Katie.

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Speaker 3: Since I've been the Minister, I've made it very clear

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Speaker 3: that Territorians need to understand what is happening within their

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Speaker 3: health services. We have publicly put out a press release

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Speaker 3: every time one of those is called. There is varying

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Speaker 3: factors as to why they're called. Sometimes it might be

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Speaker 3: that there's been a telecommunications outage, for example at Nulan

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Speaker 3: Boy Hospital, so we make sure that we share that information.

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Speaker 3: We've got two billion in the budget for health and

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Speaker 3: as I just outlined, we will keep working with those

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Speaker 3: that work in the health system.

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Speaker 1: A very quick one. Last week we spoke quite a

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Speaker 1: bit about fuel disclosure records showing that backbench MLA Duran

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Speaker 1: Young had spent more than seven thousand dollars on fuel

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Speaker 1: purchases over a four month period from December last year.

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Speaker 1: Of this, more than two and a half thousand dollars

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Speaker 1: was spent on private travel in New South Wales and Queensland.

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Speaker 1: The records also showed the Northern Territories Attorney General Chancey

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Speaker 1: Paike wrapped up more than seven hundred dollar in fuel

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Speaker 1: costs on private travel between Adelaide and the Northern Territory

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Speaker 1: from late last year to early this year. Now, from

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Speaker 1: what I can gather, this isn't against the rules that

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Speaker 1: are set out by the Renumeration Tribunal. But Chief Minister,

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Speaker 1: do you think that using a government to issued fuel

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Speaker 1: card while interstate not on government business passes the PUB test?

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Speaker 3: So, Katie, these entitlements are set by that independent tribunal

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Speaker 3: and people do receive those entitlements as part of their job.

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00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:33,120
Speaker 3: Different members take different entitlements. They are independently reviewed each

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Speaker 3: year to make sure that their contemporary and meet community expectation.

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Speaker 1: So do you think they passed the pub test?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie?

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Speaker 3: It varies in terms of what entitlements different members take.

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00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:42,760
Speaker 1: Yep.

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00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 2: If you ask me, does I think it past the

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Speaker 2: pub test?

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Speaker 3: No? The simple headline does not, But I think it

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Speaker 3: is important for your listeners to understand that this is entitlement.

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Speaker 3: Everyone has different entitlements with their jobs. There's tax around

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Speaker 3: those entitlements, but they are reviewed each year and they

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Speaker 3: do vary between Bush and Urban members.

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Speaker 1: Do you think the tribunal needs to look into it?

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Speaker 1: I mean it is a bit embarrassing for your government

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Speaker 1: that this has sort of come to the fore that

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Speaker 1: a fuel card is being used interstate when you're not

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Speaker 1: away for work.

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Speaker 3: So Katie and I do not understand the fine detail

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Speaker 3: around the tax and the fringe benefits enough. But what

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Speaker 3: I will do is we will make sure the independent

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Speaker 3: Tribunal they take information and then do their review.

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Speaker 2: We will raise this.

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Speaker 3: Issue with them so that we can all be assured

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Speaker 3: that they have looked at it in detail to ensure

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Speaker 3: it's contemporary and meets community expectation. Is it something you

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Speaker 3: would do so, Katie, different members have different entitlements, and Katie,

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Speaker 3: I'm in a different situation. I don't have a government vehicle.

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Speaker 3: So I think that I've explained how it works to

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Speaker 3: your listeners. It's part of their employment entitlements, and different

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Speaker 3: people take different entitlements.

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Speaker 1: Chief Finister, we are going to have to leave it there.

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Speaker 1: Thank you very much for your time today.

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Speaker 2: Always good to catch up. Thank you