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Speaker 1: Already and this is the Daily This is the Daily OS.

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Speaker 1: Oh now it makes sense. Good morning and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the Daily Oz. It's Tuesday, the thirty first of March.

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Speaker 1: I'm Billy fitz Simon. I'm Yesterday, one of Australia's biggest

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Speaker 1: man hunts in history came to an end with the

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Speaker 1: news that police had shot dead a man believed to

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Speaker 1: be fugitive Desi Freeman. You might remember that name. Last August,

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Speaker 1: Freeman killed two police officers and injured a third at

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Speaker 1: a property in Regional Victoria and he's been on the

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Speaker 1: run ever since. That was until yesterday. Today we will

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Speaker 1: go through what we know about the killing of one

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Speaker 1: of Australia's most wanted criminals. But first here is a

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Speaker 1: quick message from the TDA team. My name is Aula.

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Speaker 2: I'm the content production Manager at The Daily Oz, which

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Speaker 2: means I'm the person here who makes all the production

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Speaker 2: things happen like right now, I'm the producer in the

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Speaker 2: room making sure everything is running smoothly during this record.

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Speaker 2: Not always an easy task when you have such a

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Speaker 2: small team. The Daily Ours is an independent media company

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Speaker 2: committed to delivering accessible news to young people. If you

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Speaker 2: want to support us and help us reach new audiences.

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Speaker 2: Hit follow on whatever podcast platform you're listening on, and

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Speaker 2: thank you for being a part of the TDA community.

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Speaker 3: Billy, you are about halfway through your editorial meeting yesterday

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Speaker 3: morning is.

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Speaker 1: Before you barn.

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Speaker 3: Am when I ran in with a breaking news alert

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Speaker 3: that police believe that they have killed Desi Freeman. I

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Speaker 3: want to get something out of the way first though,

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Speaker 3: before we dive into the background of this story and

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Speaker 3: what happened yesterday. We're saying the word believe here. Explain

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Speaker 3: the framing that the police have applied on this case

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Speaker 3: and why police are saying that they believe it's Desi frames.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this is always something confusing that happens because often

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Speaker 1: when police announce that there has been a killing some sort,

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Speaker 1: or even an allegation of a crime being committed, the

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Speaker 1: media will name the person, but police officers will often

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Speaker 1: then hold a press conference and say, well, we actually

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Speaker 1: can't identify the person in this case because they have

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Speaker 1: killed or allegedly killed Desi Freeman. They now need to

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Speaker 1: undergo a formal identification process. From what I can tell,

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Speaker 1: it's mostly just a procedural thing, but they do believe

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Speaker 1: and they were very explicit in the press conference that

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Speaker 1: they held yesterday that it was Desi Freeman who was killed.

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Speaker 1: There was definitely a man killed, and they were very

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Speaker 1: explicit in saying that this is all in relation to

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Speaker 1: the Desi Freeman case. They have spoken to the family

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Speaker 1: members of the two police officers who were killed by

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Speaker 1: Desi Freeman last August, so they're very clear in naming him.

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Speaker 1: They've just said that there does now need to be

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Speaker 1: a formal process to identify him, but they believe it's him.

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Speaker 3: So that's why there's this kind of funny modality around

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Speaker 3: what the police are saying. You would have to think

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Speaker 3: that they're not going to call a press conference contact

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Speaker 3: the families of the decease officers if they weren't absolutely

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Speaker 3: confident that this is the man that they were looking for.

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Speaker 3: And it's been a long journey to get here. It's

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Speaker 3: been over six months. And before we explain what happened

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Speaker 3: yesterday and how this whole kind of came to an end,

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Speaker 3: let's go back to who Dessi Freeman was.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so it was the twenty sixth of August last year.

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Speaker 3: So over six months ago.

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Speaker 1: Now it's seven months it's been so long. So it

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Speaker 1: was at that time that ten police officers rocked up

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Speaker 1: to this property in Porpunka, which is a town in

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Speaker 1: regional northeast Victoria. That is where a man named Desi

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Speaker 1: Freeman was living with his family in a kind of caravan,

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Speaker 1: kind of bus kind of thing. Police were therefore a

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Speaker 1: warrant related to alleged historical sexual offenses they believed were

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Speaker 1: committed by Desi Freeman. Now what happened after the police

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Speaker 1: rocked up is basically what they described as an ambush.

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Speaker 1: Desi Freeman then shot and killed two police officers and

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Speaker 1: injured a third. Then what we know is that he

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Speaker 1: took off into the bush and that was the last

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Speaker 1: time he was ever seen. Police said that he had

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Speaker 1: guns with him when he did take off into the bush,

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Speaker 1: and then what ensued from there was him being on

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Speaker 1: the run and one of Australia's biggest ever man hunts.

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Speaker 1: There were police involved in this investigation from every single

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Speaker 1: state and territory in Australia, and there was even police

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Speaker 1: that flew over from New Zealand to be part of

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Speaker 1: this investigation, which I think just kind of shows the

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Speaker 1: extent of the investment that went into finding Desi Freeman.

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Speaker 1: We now know he's been able to stay alive for

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Speaker 1: seven months on the run in the bush.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, it was Victoria's largest ever man hunt.

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Speaker 3: It was Australia's largest ever tactical police operation. It almost

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Speaker 3: shut down the town of pop Punker there for many,

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Speaker 3: many weeks, if not months, because of the overwhelming presence

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Speaker 3: of police there. I remember. The one kind of odd

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Speaker 3: element about this case was us all getting our heads

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Speaker 3: around the fact that Desi Freeman described himself as a

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Speaker 3: sovereign citizen. Just remind us of the context of what

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Speaker 3: that meant and that idea.

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Speaker 1: Yes, so, a sovereign citizen is someone who doesn't believe

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Speaker 1: in the standard laws and governments of where they live. So,

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Speaker 1: just like you, I, I hope try to comply with

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Speaker 1: the laws and the governments of where we live, a

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Speaker 1: sovereign citizen is someone who doesn't believe in that and

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Speaker 1: doesn't believe that they need to comply in that. So

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Speaker 1: when he was issued with this warrant for these historical

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Speaker 1: sexual offenses, our understanding is that he doesn't believe that

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Speaker 1: he needs to comply.

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Speaker 3: With law right, so he kind of doesn't believe that

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Speaker 3: the police of Victoria have the authority to arrest him

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Speaker 3: for crimes because he's not actually a citizen of Victoria exactly, Okay,

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Speaker 3: And so there's this really complex kind of political identity

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Speaker 3: that's overlaid onto this case. Police are ambush at the property,

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Speaker 3: too killed. It's been seven months since then, and I

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Speaker 3: did think up until yesterday that at least the strong

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Speaker 3: message from Victoria police was that Desi Freeman was dead.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's exactly what they thought. It was only last

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Speaker 1: month in February that Victorian police announced that they did

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Speaker 1: believe that Desi Freeman had killed himself, and they said

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Speaker 1: that there was enough evidence to suggest that, but what

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Speaker 1: they didn't have was a body. So that's why the

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Speaker 1: investigation continued. But it kind of turned from what I

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Speaker 1: understood from what police were telling us. It turned from

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Speaker 1: an investigation into where Desi Freeman is and more into

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Speaker 1: where his body is because they believed that he had

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Speaker 1: killed himself.

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Speaker 3: Yea. There was a stage there where police were bringing

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Speaker 3: in cadaver dogs to the site, which are dogs that

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Speaker 3: can smell the scent of dead bodies. So the framing

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Speaker 3: of the investigation certainly was that they were looking for

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Speaker 3: a corpse rather than a suspect.

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Speaker 1: And the evidence they had they said that two hours

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Speaker 1: after he ran into the bush on that initial shooting,

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Speaker 1: so the twenty sixth of August, there was a single

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Speaker 1: gunshot heard right coming from the bush and so that

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Speaker 1: is why they believed that he had killed himself. However,

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Speaker 1: we discovered yesterday that that is not what happened, and

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Speaker 1: he has been on the run for seven months.

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Speaker 3: I want to hear exactly what happened yesterday in a

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Speaker 3: very dramatic conclusion to this, But first a quick message

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Speaker 3: from our sponsor, so Billy. We're talking about the shooting

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Speaker 3: of Desi Freeman, the suspect who is believed to have

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Speaker 3: killed two police officers and injured a third in Northeast

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Speaker 3: Regional Victoria seven months ago. Now, so in the end,

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Speaker 3: they now believe that Desi Freeman was actually alive and

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Speaker 3: had managed to stay alive for these seven months. What

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Speaker 3: do we know about where Desi Freeman was found yesterday

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Speaker 3: and what happened when police arrived at that site.

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Speaker 1: So we'll say before we get into it, everything that

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Speaker 1: we do know happened during the press conference yesterday. Police

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Speaker 1: were at Pains to explain that they don't know everything

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Speaker 1: at this stage, and their answer to most questions from

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Speaker 1: journalists was that will form part of the investigation. And

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Speaker 1: they were very clear in saying that we are now

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Speaker 1: kind of only at the start of this investigation now

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Speaker 1: that he is dead, of finding out what exactly did

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Speaker 1: happen in the last seven months.

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Speaker 3: So very much what we know so far outstate.

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Speaker 1: Yes, what we think we understand is that Daisy Freeman

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Speaker 1: was found at least one hundred kilometers maybe as much

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Speaker 1: as two hundred kilometers away from Pop Punker, which is

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Speaker 1: where the initial shooting was last August. And they believe

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Speaker 1: that in order for him to have got from Port

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Speaker 1: Punker to potentially two hundred kilometers away, he had to

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Speaker 1: have had assistance of some kind in order to get there,

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Speaker 1: because that's a long way to go.

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Speaker 3: So he's talking about somebody in the vehicle potentially potentially.

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Speaker 1: They have literally revealed no details. It seems like they

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Speaker 1: don't even know themselves. They've been so focused on where

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Speaker 1: is Dessi Freeman that only now will they look at

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Speaker 1: whether or not he had assistance to travel that far

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Speaker 1: over seven months and to stay alive, because obviously he needs,

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Speaker 1: I mean all of the essentials. He needs water in

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Speaker 1: order to survive. So they believe it would have been

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Speaker 1: near impossible for him to do this all alone.

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Speaker 3: And so they don't really have an idea just yet

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Speaker 3: in terms of if point A is the shooting in

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Speaker 3: Point B is where they found him yesterday. They're not

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Speaker 3: sure about how long he spent in point A and

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Speaker 3: then moved to Point B. Whether he was in Point

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Speaker 3: B the next day after the shooting and has been

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Speaker 3: there for seven months, they're not quite sure of that right.

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Speaker 1: No idea from what they said. What they do know

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Speaker 1: is that he was found in this kind of carrot

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Speaker 1: They said this, it was kind of like a long

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Speaker 1: caravan slash container type thing.

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Speaker 3: I imagine it kind of a shipping container in my eye.

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Speaker 1: Yes, well, they said it was kind of like that,

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Speaker 1: kind of like a caravan, which kind of sounds similar

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Speaker 1: to what he was initially found in when back in

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Speaker 1: August when they rocked up to the property.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, And so did they go to the property

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Speaker 3: knowing that he was there?

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Speaker 1: Essentially yes, and he might have seen some reporting that

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Speaker 1: they got a tip off, so that's been again, it's

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Speaker 1: kind of that confusing thing where media has said that,

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Speaker 1: but police have not confirmed that. And what's interesting is

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Speaker 1: they said that they will never confirm that from what

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Speaker 1: I can understand, because they want all tip offs to

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Speaker 1: be confidential, and they want I presume not just in

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Speaker 1: this case, but in all future cases. In order for

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Speaker 1: people to help police, they need the general public to

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Speaker 1: know that their tip offs will be confidential and that

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Speaker 1: no information will be revealed about that. Because there was

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Speaker 1: a one million dollar reward for information that would lead

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Speaker 1: to the arrest or the police finding Desi Freeman, and

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Speaker 1: so I don't think that police will ever reveal any

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Speaker 1: information about that.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So whether they get it through a tip or not,

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Speaker 3: they kind of know where he is. They go to

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Speaker 3: this property, yes, and was the plan and they're for police,

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Speaker 3: based on what we've been told, was the plan to

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Speaker 3: kill him straight away.

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Speaker 1: So they said that it was at five thirty am

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Speaker 1: on Monday that they went to this property, and they

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Speaker 1: said that they kind of started a negotiation they wanted.

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Speaker 1: In fact, now that I think about it, no, the

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Speaker 1: intention was not to kill him, because they did say

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Speaker 1: that they wanted him to peacefully surrender and that they

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Speaker 1: gave him the chance to peacefully surrender. They said their understanding.

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Speaker 1: Again at this stage everything is forming part of the investigation. Yes,

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Speaker 1: but they said that they do believe that he came

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Speaker 1: out in a blanket. They believe he was armed, and

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Speaker 1: so that initially happened at five thirty am that police

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Speaker 1: went to the property and it was at eight thirty

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Speaker 1: am that he was shot and confirmed dead.

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Speaker 3: A three hour standards.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and we don't know what was part of that negotiation,

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Speaker 1: if there was ever a negotiation, or we know is

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Speaker 1: there was a standoff that ended in a man believed

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Speaker 1: to be Desi Freeman to be shot dead.

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Speaker 3: And police didn't even confirm if Freeman shot at them, right.

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Speaker 1: No, they didn't say that. All they said again, the

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Speaker 1: police that were giving the press conference is different to

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Speaker 1: the police that were at the property, which is why

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Speaker 1: I think that they can't share the exact details yet

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Speaker 1: because it all goes through this process. But all the

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Speaker 1: police at the press conference said is they believed that

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Speaker 1: the police were justified in shooting him. They didn't say

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Speaker 1: whether or not Desi Freeman shot at the police officers

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Speaker 1: that were on site. They did say they believed he

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Speaker 1: was armed.

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Speaker 3: I also note that the commissioner giving the press conference

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Speaker 3: also said that the officers at the site acted with

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Speaker 3: textbook professionalism. So I think there's a kind of understanding

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Speaker 3: amongst Victoria Police that it was the right call to

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Speaker 3: kill this suspect. But what happens from here though, because

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Speaker 3: it's one thing to say the press conference that this

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Speaker 3: is the right thing to do, but there's a bit

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Speaker 3: more to it, right.

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Speaker 1: Think the next steps. The two main things that they

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Speaker 1: have to confirm is a they have to formally identify

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Speaker 1: him and then confirm that to the public, and then

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Speaker 1: the second thing is to investigate if they did have

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Speaker 1: any help. That seems like a real priority for police

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Speaker 1: right now, because obviously that would be a crime if

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Speaker 1: you are someone who is helping one of Australias always

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Speaker 1: wanted criminals. Assisting anyone in a crime is a crime

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Speaker 1: in itself, and so that seems to be one of

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Speaker 1: their big priorities at the moment.

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Speaker 3: Billy. There's still reactions to this series of events still

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Speaker 3: coming out as we go to where now. The Police

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Speaker 3: Association of Victoria they released a statement yesterday saying our

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Speaker 3: members said they would find him. They did. We've also

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Speaker 3: heard from Victorian Premier and Opposition leader and local community members.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for that updating what is a big development

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Speaker 3: in one of the most notorious cases in modern Australian history.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for barging into our editorial meeting yesterday to

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Speaker 1: tell us it's crazy news. It was up early breaking news,

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Speaker 1: and yeah, it brings to an end one of Australia's

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Speaker 1: biggest ever manhunts.

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Speaker 3: We'll make sure to update everybody when there's a clear

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Speaker 3: conclusion to this investigation with some more details from police,

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Speaker 3: which will I'm sure be a couple of weeks or

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Speaker 3: months away. That's all we've got for today's podcast, though,

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Speaker 3: if you're around this afternoon, we'll be releasing our evening

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Speaker 3: headlines later on. Until then, have a beautiful day.

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Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda

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Speaker 1: Bungelung Calcoton woman from Gadighl Country.

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Speaker 3: The Daily oz acknowledges that this podcast is recorded on

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Speaker 3: the lands of the Gadighl people and pays respect to

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Speaker 3: all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Island and nations.

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Speaker 1: We pay our respects to the first peoples of these countries,

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Speaker 1: both past and present,