WEBVTT - S05E07 | It's Layered | Delve Deeper Into.. Allyship 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:18.079 I'm always always, sir, be careful love. 0:00:18.880 --> 0:00:26.720 Those um books. Let well use your head. They will 0:00:26.840 --> 0:00:33.840 tear you lack a purple talk. Oh no, no, no, yeah, 0:00:33.960 --> 0:00:40.400 yeah yeah yeah, oh no no no. Hi. I'm Amanda 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:41.600 and I'm Rumby. 0:00:42.000 --> 0:00:43.560 Welcome to its lay It. 0:00:43.880 --> 0:00:46.800 We're in a long distance friendship that started over twenty 0:00:46.880 --> 0:00:48.600 years ago when we were in high school. 0:00:48.920 --> 0:00:53.200 We'll be talking about all things life, love, family, anything 0:00:53.280 --> 0:00:55.160 and everything else under the sun. 0:00:55.280 --> 0:00:59.680 Delve deeper with us because in life, you know my layers. 0:01:00.480 --> 0:01:07.160 Oh no, no, no, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. 0:01:07.319 --> 0:01:12.319 Welcome to another episode of It's Layered Podcast. What I Do, 0:01:12.400 --> 0:01:13.560 What I do, What I do? Good? 0:01:13.800 --> 0:01:19.199 Yeah, yeah, yeah, somebody we need to find that sound 0:01:19.200 --> 0:01:22.319 I know, asked DJ it kicks or something and just like. 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:27.840 A salad because apps all the time, honey, it defeats 0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:30.280 the purpose. Anyway. How are you doing, Amanda? 0:01:30.600 --> 0:01:31.760 I'm good, my love. 0:01:31.840 --> 0:01:35.559 How are you? How are you? Yo? Girl? We could 0:01:35.600 --> 0:01:38.319 go on, we could write a novel. I'm doing alright, 0:01:38.600 --> 0:01:43.600 surviving winter monthsA here like it's great, gloomy trying to 0:01:43.640 --> 0:01:48.840 I'm that vitamin d intake and just the little sunshine 0:01:48.880 --> 0:01:49.240 we get. 0:01:49.560 --> 0:01:51.920 So I don't know if I envy you guys, Like 0:01:52.000 --> 0:01:55.600 I mean, I love I love European Christmas or like 0:01:55.640 --> 0:01:58.440 I should say more than Hemisphere Christmas. 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:00.640 With the cold, the snow, that that whole. 0:02:00.680 --> 0:02:01.320 But I love it. 0:02:01.800 --> 0:02:03.800 But to actually live it, it's like, okay, no, I 0:02:03.920 --> 0:02:05.600 like to visit and leave and leave. 0:02:06.240 --> 0:02:08.280 I don't want to be like seeing the build up. 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:11.160 Yeah, the build up is that's what breaks you because 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:13.800 you see these days. I think at like for for 0:02:14.000 --> 0:02:16.880 thirty now or just before four thirty, it's black, like 0:02:16.919 --> 0:02:18.800 it's dark outside, like pitch black. 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:22.240 So and meanwhile we're recording now and it's meant to 0:02:22.280 --> 0:02:24.519 be my evening and it's like some obviously, so it's 0:02:24.560 --> 0:02:27.280 still light outside, trying to put a child down when 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:29.360 it's just like you'd be looking at you like are 0:02:29.400 --> 0:02:32.359 you crazy? 0:02:33.600 --> 0:02:35.880 It's like are you there? There's no winning in life. 0:02:35.919 --> 0:02:37.320 You need to know there's no winning. 0:02:38.080 --> 0:02:42.280 To pick your battles, use your yeah, and speaking about that, 0:02:42.440 --> 0:02:45.880 which is so apt for our episode today, our episode 0:02:45.880 --> 0:02:46.840 on ally ship. 0:02:47.160 --> 0:02:51.200 Yeah, how do you define ally ship? So that'st word, 0:02:52.040 --> 0:02:54.320 very big buzz word. I decided to let me use 0:02:54.360 --> 0:02:58.120 the dictionary. Okay, it's dictionary. It okay, So according to 0:02:58.160 --> 0:03:02.720 the Cambridge English Dictionary, it's allyship is the quality or 0:03:02.760 --> 0:03:05.680 practice of helping or supporting other people who are part 0:03:05.720 --> 0:03:09.320 of a group that is treated badly or unfairly, although 0:03:09.360 --> 0:03:13.000 you are not yourself a member of this group. One 0:03:13.000 --> 0:03:16.200 of the most important ways to practice allyship is just 0:03:16.400 --> 0:03:18.960 to listen. I thought that was quite a. 0:03:20.120 --> 0:03:22.920 Again for the people on the back, just to listen. 0:03:23.360 --> 0:03:25.720 Just to listen. One of the most important ways to 0:03:25.760 --> 0:03:30.880 practice allyship is just to listen. So just listening, close 0:03:30.880 --> 0:03:35.720 your mouth and open your ears and listen. Actually, so, 0:03:36.080 --> 0:03:38.880 I think that's a definition that was given and I 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:41.240 thought it was really I need I say more. 0:03:41.440 --> 0:03:44.760 That's now you've just yeah, I guess that's just nailed it. 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:48.960 I mean, I guess the only thing in our to 0:03:49.040 --> 0:03:53.520 make it more like less dictionary is just that it's 0:03:53.560 --> 0:03:57.240 obviously come up in the last couple of years. It's 0:03:57.240 --> 0:04:01.480 a concept that's probably always exists, but it's actually now 0:04:01.520 --> 0:04:05.200 got terms and all these things around it, you know, 0:04:05.480 --> 0:04:07.720 and some people do it naturally and semple I've had 0:04:07.760 --> 0:04:09.960 to learn to do it. So I think that's the 0:04:09.960 --> 0:04:12.760 only thing with allyship that is like something that I 0:04:12.800 --> 0:04:16.040 think future from now on and future generations. 0:04:16.080 --> 0:04:18.640 It's just going to be part of living. 0:04:18.600 --> 0:04:21.400 Yes, really yes, because I think for some time there 0:04:21.480 --> 0:04:26.120 was just no awareness or understanding of the need. You know, 0:04:26.160 --> 0:04:29.000 they say that if you don't have the word for 0:04:29.520 --> 0:04:33.760 a term or something you need, it's hard to feel like, 0:04:34.720 --> 0:04:37.039 how can you actually get the support. 0:04:36.480 --> 0:04:38.400 To conceptualize and sexualize? 0:04:38.600 --> 0:04:41.880 Now that we have the vocabulary, it helps and will 0:04:41.920 --> 0:04:45.840 help build stronger forms of allyship and so on and 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.680 so forth. So it's really interesting. So of course a 0:04:49.680 --> 0:04:51.880 man has already spoken about how it's become a topic 0:04:51.920 --> 0:04:54.760 that's come up more and more over the last couple 0:04:54.760 --> 0:04:58.279 of years, after social movements such as Black Lives Matter, 0:04:59.279 --> 0:05:04.120 Stop Asian Hate or advocating for the lgbt QUI plus community, 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:09.440 as well as we've seen the wars in Gaza and Ukraine. Yo, 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:14.400 how do allies play a role? Like actually just listing 0:05:14.440 --> 0:05:19.440 those and in the last few years it's right, wild, 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:23.880 okay wild, But how do allies play a role actually 0:05:23.960 --> 0:05:26.280 in these scenarios and situations? 0:05:27.080 --> 0:05:29.760 I think the way you first described it, that is 0:05:30.000 --> 0:05:33.680 like rallying and advocating for a group of people that 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:36.920 you're not a part of, yes, who have been marginalized 0:05:37.080 --> 0:05:40.719 essentially right, So all those social movements, I mean that 0:05:40.800 --> 0:05:44.240 you've mentioned the wars happening that you've mentioned, We're obviously 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:47.960 not there. I'm obviously not of Asian descent all those things. 0:05:48.160 --> 0:05:50.839 Hence we need to show up, right. 0:05:51.080 --> 0:05:53.640 That's that's the that's the I think it was Rihanna 0:05:53.640 --> 0:05:56.400 who said, no, tell all your white friends pull up pully, 0:05:56.480 --> 0:05:58.719 want to put they want to have dinner with you 0:05:58.920 --> 0:06:02.000 and and love your culture, blah blah blah, talk about it. 0:06:04.040 --> 0:06:06.919 And I think that is how allies play a role, 0:06:07.600 --> 0:06:11.880 Like not only are we listening intently, we're now also 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:16.640 educating ourselves on the right stuff. And that's now we're 0:06:16.640 --> 0:06:19.440 also taking action as well, Like then what And I 0:06:19.480 --> 0:06:23.200 feel like it's so it's a tricky thing social media 0:06:23.320 --> 0:06:25.800 because like, in some ways people want to know where 0:06:25.800 --> 0:06:27.880 you stand, where you do this, But I feel like 0:06:27.920 --> 0:06:31.599 it's such a personal role or maybe in my life 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:34.320 I've had to like break it down to day to 0:06:34.440 --> 0:06:37.479 day things, like are they moments when I can be 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:41.600 an ally in the situation for sure? 0:06:41.640 --> 0:06:44.800 I don't know for sure. It's definitely tricky And I 0:06:44.839 --> 0:06:46.760 think you hit the nail on the head when you 0:06:46.800 --> 0:06:51.119 say that educate yourself. I think during Black Lives Matter, 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:55.920 for us as black people, it was obviously quite It 0:06:55.960 --> 0:06:58.240 affected us a lot. Yes, we know we're not black 0:06:58.279 --> 0:07:00.640 American because some people brought that up. You're not you 0:07:00.680 --> 0:07:05.839 know it's happening in America. But it's like, we know 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:07.920 what it means to be black. If you're black, you're black, 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:09.720 you're black. If you're black here, you're black there, you're 0:07:09.720 --> 0:07:14.400 black everywhere. I'm sorry, there's no sort of differentiation. And 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:16.280 when people are like, but why and wanting you to 0:07:16.360 --> 0:07:19.560 explain all these things, and it actually gets exhausting for 0:07:19.640 --> 0:07:24.120 the person in that community experiencing that. So that the 0:07:24.200 --> 0:07:28.720 Asian who's experiencing Asian hate, people in the lgbtq I 0:07:28.760 --> 0:07:33.080 A plus community who are being marginalized, they're tired of 0:07:33.120 --> 0:07:36.320 having to explain how they're being killed off, how in 0:07:36.480 --> 0:07:40.520 Uganda it's illegal, and you know they are afraid of 0:07:40.560 --> 0:07:45.200 their lives. Do you understand what I'm saying? Definitely, I'm 0:07:45.400 --> 0:07:48.120 I'm dealing with and trying to persist it internally for 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:51.000 myself and now you want me to break it down 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:55.280 for you. And usually people who ask that come across 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:59.920 with an ignorant mindset, like they're not wanting it's just like, oh, 0:08:00.200 --> 0:08:02.200 but why is it an issue? You know, and it's 0:08:02.320 --> 0:08:05.880 very why is it a problem? Why is it a problem? Yes? 0:08:06.000 --> 0:08:08.520 And I think also in this year of twenty twenty three, 0:08:08.640 --> 0:08:11.320 twenty twenty four plus we got the internet. 0:08:11.680 --> 0:08:14.480 Yeah, it's like what why are you asking me? 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:18.000 Like there's people who've done research articles on this, you 0:08:18.080 --> 0:08:22.360 can explain the whole history, reliable resources you can use 0:08:22.880 --> 0:08:25.720 to find out the history of what's going on. Yes, 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:27.760 you know, and I think like even like and try 0:08:27.840 --> 0:08:30.040 to think of even in Australia now with what's happening 0:08:30.120 --> 0:08:33.440 in Gaza, and it's like Palestine Israel, which side and 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:36.560 then you find out that the history on both ends 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:40.800 is so layered, So okay, but let's not even But 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:43.679 then there's also that whole thing with ceasefire, Like as 0:08:43.760 --> 0:08:46.520 much as the history is there and whoever thinks they 0:08:46.600 --> 0:08:49.040 write things, they're right, But at the same time, it's 0:08:49.080 --> 0:08:52.080 like you there's people dying who are. 0:08:51.920 --> 0:08:54.000 Innocently part of this as well. 0:08:54.320 --> 0:08:56.720 So it's like all these things where it's like, Okay, 0:08:56.840 --> 0:09:00.920 you need to just really find an independent resource we 0:09:00.960 --> 0:09:03.840 can really go through everything, and you still have to 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:07.760 use your judgment to realize, Okay, what am I what's next? 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:10.840 And I feel like a lot of times people just 0:09:10.880 --> 0:09:13.560 want to be told like this is right, this is wrong, yes, 0:09:13.600 --> 0:09:16.680 And I think allyship really pushes you to be like, no, 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:20.720 it's your own journey, like you think, what do you 0:09:20.760 --> 0:09:21.680 think sounds right? 0:09:22.240 --> 0:09:26.360 You know for sure? For sure? I completely agree. And 0:09:27.160 --> 0:09:29.440 part of it too, and I don't know, maybe we'll 0:09:29.440 --> 0:09:31.280 go into this later, but I think part of it 0:09:31.320 --> 0:09:33.480 too is taking a step back from what you're seeing 0:09:33.920 --> 0:09:37.240 on social media and all the buzzwords and this person 0:09:37.320 --> 0:09:39.920 saying you have to do you really need to take 0:09:39.920 --> 0:09:44.360 a step back from you know, other opinion and take 0:09:44.400 --> 0:09:51.040 a moment to formulate your own informed yeah, keyword informed opinion. 0:09:51.640 --> 0:09:54.960 Yeah, and also give yourself space to say I don't know. 0:09:55.800 --> 0:09:58.720 So I feel like with social media, especially when something happens, 0:09:58.760 --> 0:10:01.679 people are so quick to post on their stories or whatever, 0:10:02.400 --> 0:10:06.160 whichever side they support or don't support or and yeah, 0:10:06.280 --> 0:10:08.600 in one way, that's great, but it's like, okay, but 0:10:08.760 --> 0:10:11.920 have you processed this enough to come from a space 0:10:11.920 --> 0:10:15.080 where you knew nothing about this to now enough for 0:10:15.160 --> 0:10:18.280 you to have such a strong stance whatever side yes, 0:10:18.440 --> 0:10:20.800 So I think that's just one makes it tough because like, 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:25.640 do you actually know exactly? Yeah, yeah, any situations that 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:28.280 you feel allies make things worse. 0:10:28.880 --> 0:10:34.160 Oh, so many, so many. I think allies can make 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:39.000 it worse one when their opinion, well, they develop an 0:10:39.000 --> 0:10:44.400 opinion shaped with misinformation. Absolutely, I think just in general 0:10:44.400 --> 0:10:48.160 as humans, we cause problems when you are misinformed. I 0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:54.720 think too when sometimes aggression you know or I don't know, 0:10:54.880 --> 0:10:58.640 causing beef or wanting to fight. Yes, of course we 0:10:58.760 --> 0:11:02.800 appreciate you stuff for us and supporting us, but sometimes 0:11:02.840 --> 0:11:05.599 the message doesn't get across. I'll give you this example. 0:11:06.640 --> 0:11:10.200 You know, we all heard about all lives matter, you know, 0:11:10.320 --> 0:11:17.480 when people that that conversation, and the issue with that is, 0:11:18.520 --> 0:11:21.400 you know, people are saying, yes, but we all matter, 0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:24.240 and it's like putting yourself in the shoes of the 0:11:24.240 --> 0:11:28.480 one being suffering someone who's having a hard time, and saying, 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:32.000 but also me trying to put yourself here. Yes, you 0:11:32.040 --> 0:11:34.480 don't even need to you don't need to be in 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:37.560 the equation. It's about empathy. What you need to understand 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:41.280 is allyship is about empathy. I may not understand fully, 0:11:41.640 --> 0:11:44.920 I may not have experienced anything similar to this. However, 0:11:45.040 --> 0:11:47.520 I'm here for you. What can I do? Not you 0:11:47.679 --> 0:11:51.120 assuming what you can do? I e. Being aggressive people 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:56.439 are going during the protests and causing scenes or creating chaos, 0:11:56.559 --> 0:11:58.760 or do you understand what I'm saying. There's so many 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:01.199 way where you make it about yourself. I think the 0:12:01.280 --> 0:12:04.040 key thing is when people make it about themselves. We 0:12:05.400 --> 0:12:09.000 the progression that you need. What an ally should be 0:12:09.120 --> 0:12:11.880 doing is saying, you know, in certain rooms, when you're 0:12:11.880 --> 0:12:15.360 at dinner with similar people who may not understand what 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:18.240 exactly is happening in gaza or so on and so forth, 0:12:18.480 --> 0:12:20.600 you can be the person who says, actually, you know 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:24.520 the reason why X y Z is because ABC? Do 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:27.160 you undersund like giving them the information so that me, 0:12:27.840 --> 0:12:30.720 as the one who's marginalized or suffering, doesn't have to 0:12:30.760 --> 0:12:32.640 be like, oh but you know this. This this is 0:12:32.679 --> 0:12:35.280 easier people. It's more palatable when it comes from someone 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:38.720 who looks like yeah, yeah. 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:41.439 And also to offer different perspectives. I find a lot 0:12:41.440 --> 0:12:43.920 of times in these rooms they're trying to make its 0:12:44.000 --> 0:12:46.640 trivialize it right, like ah. 0:12:46.160 --> 0:12:47.800 Why are they even stressing about that? 0:12:48.000 --> 0:12:50.439 Like you know, and it's like have you ever folt, 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:53.440 how we feel if this and that happened to you. 0:12:53.480 --> 0:12:54.120 No, so. 0:12:55.640 --> 0:12:57.319 You know, and I feel like a lot of times, 0:12:57.400 --> 0:13:00.560 especially here with immigration issues, you know, you got people 0:13:00.559 --> 0:13:03.080 who there's this whole theory of your jumping the queue, 0:13:03.120 --> 0:13:05.160 like they call them boat people, people who come on 0:13:05.160 --> 0:13:08.840 a boat as opposed to like applying from a detention 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:10.800 center overseas. 0:13:10.240 --> 0:13:11.480 Or for asylum or whatever. 0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:14.040 Okay, obviously, once you come over on a boat, you're 0:13:14.040 --> 0:13:16.640 already here. So now that you have to like pretty 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:19.160 much something people yeah, see it as a fast track 0:13:19.200 --> 0:13:22.200 to get in, and then there's this whole thing about it, 0:13:22.280 --> 0:13:24.080 like people were very opinionated about it. 0:13:24.080 --> 0:13:26.880 But it's like have you ever thought how desperate. 0:13:26.520 --> 0:13:31.480 One must be to get a little boat, right, to 0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:34.600 like seek a better life? And like, yes, of course 0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:37.120 the system is broken, we already know that, but it's 0:13:37.160 --> 0:13:39.680 like such a wide up. And I think that's where 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:42.480 the word empathy, as you said, comes in, because it's like, Okay, 0:13:42.880 --> 0:13:46.000 don't make it such such a broad thing. That's why 0:13:46.040 --> 0:13:48.840 I think I think allyship needs to be very singular. 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:50.680 And you you. 0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:53.240 Decide do you think that sounds right yes or not? 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:55.960 And what do you do about it? How are you listening, 0:13:56.000 --> 0:13:58.720 how are you providing a voice if you can? Yes, 0:13:59.360 --> 0:14:01.040 and for everything as well. 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:03.920 I was gonna say, sometimes you need to know when 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:07.559 you don't need to say anything. It's like I cannot 0:14:08.120 --> 0:14:10.800 I don't have the information, I don't have the ability 0:14:11.160 --> 0:14:12.720 because there are a lot of causes to if I 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:17.800 and they stay coming up and speaking to a point 0:14:17.880 --> 0:14:19.960 actually about do you know what it's like to have 0:14:20.000 --> 0:14:22.480 to hop on a boat to make your way to 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:25.880 another country to seek asylum? If anyone has not yet, 0:14:25.920 --> 0:14:29.640 you should watch The Swimmers on Netflix. That film will 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:32.760 give you a great sort of understanding of what it 0:14:32.840 --> 0:14:38.240 means for all these immigrants who are escaping wars and 0:14:38.600 --> 0:14:41.440 you know, difficulties back home, even in Europe. You know, 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:44.880 there's been a lot of talk about illegal immigration, which 0:14:44.960 --> 0:14:48.680 is a whole other but when you're just seeing it 0:14:48.800 --> 0:14:54.440 as with humanity in your heart, it changes how your 0:14:54.480 --> 0:14:57.760 perspective on how how things done and how hard it 0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:03.040 must be. Brutal, Yes, exactly, exactly. 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:04.440 And we already know that living in the sport, but 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:05.280 there's another level. 0:15:05.760 --> 0:15:09.840 It's another level, yeah, another anyway, So watch that if 0:15:09.880 --> 0:15:14.240 you haven't. But do you think you're a strong. Ally, 0:15:16.640 --> 0:15:17.080 this is. 0:15:17.040 --> 0:15:17.720 A quot. 0:15:19.640 --> 0:15:20.880 Because I don't know. 0:15:21.520 --> 0:15:24.080 I literally as you said that to you girl, you 0:15:24.120 --> 0:15:26.520 put me on the chopping blog. Yeah, it's literally, I 0:15:26.800 --> 0:15:31.160 don't know. I would like to think I am. I 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:36.040 would like to think I am learning to become become one. 0:15:36.680 --> 0:15:39.680 I would like to think that. One thing I definitely 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.200 know that came out of Black Lives Matter for me 0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:46.280 personally was that if you're silent, you're complicit, not silent 0:15:46.360 --> 0:15:49.560 as in you're listening. Listening silence is different because that's 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:53.840 when you're like educating yourself. But like when something happens 0:15:54.560 --> 0:15:58.000 and you have the power or the space to speak 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:00.800 up and you don't because you're like too high to 0:16:00.960 --> 0:16:04.760 awkward in most cases, then we are also complicit because 0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:07.920 your silence makes it seem like it's okay and that 0:16:07.960 --> 0:16:11.240 person should be added. So I think I have learned 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:14.280 that my voice, even if it's a quiet, meek voice, 0:16:14.480 --> 0:16:18.240 it's it's it's important as well, right, because a lot 0:16:18.240 --> 0:16:20.440 of times people will see things and it's like and 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:23.600 when someone speaks up, everyone's yeah, like if I'm thinking 0:16:23.680 --> 0:16:24.160 the same thing. 0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:26.520 Because we are human, we do all. 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:29.440 Feel the same things, and like most times and then 0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:32.480 like I feel like I've learned that and I think 0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:37.520 I'm still I'm realizing that allyship is a journey and 0:16:37.880 --> 0:16:40.640 it's not said and done like Okay, I was an ally, 0:16:40.880 --> 0:16:42.480 it stop Asian hate, I'm done. 0:16:42.560 --> 0:16:43.800 It's back. 0:16:43.920 --> 0:16:46.880 Like it's like there's so many things that we need 0:16:46.920 --> 0:16:51.280 to I don't know, human levels usually actually daily that 0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:53.440 we need to be calling things out. 0:16:53.640 --> 0:16:56.320 And I was going to ask you to ask you 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:00.480 do you think it's only about the posting? Hey, you 0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:04.359 guys need to know that x y Z is is 0:17:04.440 --> 0:17:07.439 that if you don't post, you're not an ally or 0:17:07.480 --> 0:17:10.440 if you don't say hey you guys, do you understand 0:17:10.480 --> 0:17:11.679 like on a public sade? 0:17:11.760 --> 0:17:14.800 Yeah, I think you know what, This is a tricky 0:17:14.840 --> 0:17:19.199 one because I do think when you have a huge platform, 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:21.879 your voice matters. So like you know, you see on 0:17:21.920 --> 0:17:24.920 a KIMK and you know, they post pretty quickly when 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:29.040 things happen because they almost have to in a way, 0:17:29.080 --> 0:17:31.239 they have to because they have to show that. And 0:17:31.280 --> 0:17:38.160 also and that's yeah, if there's such a word, because 0:17:38.160 --> 0:17:39.840 it's like okay, then now you start to think, Okay, 0:17:39.840 --> 0:17:40.880 what are you actually standing for? 0:17:40.960 --> 0:17:42.200 Study you know what I mean? 0:17:42.520 --> 0:17:45.280 But at the same time, if they don't say anything, 0:17:45.440 --> 0:17:49.560 it's such a problem. So it's like I don't envy celebrities, 0:17:49.720 --> 0:17:53.920 so my my, in my everyday life. I don't think 0:17:53.960 --> 0:17:56.959 you're forced to do anything that you're not that's not 0:17:56.960 --> 0:18:00.879 coming from the heart, you know. I think you have 0:18:00.960 --> 0:18:04.159 to be honest with yourself and honest the people are 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:07.159 trying to uphold and uplift in that moment. It's not 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:10.679 about you, as you said, so why and if you 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:15.239 feel the urge to to obviously talk about it and 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:19.919 to help and to post, and you have the correct resources, 0:18:20.040 --> 0:18:23.639 then yeah, reliable resources, then why not. But if you're 0:18:23.640 --> 0:18:27.000 still in a moment of learning, a moment of education, 0:18:27.160 --> 0:18:29.639 then maybe premature to really. 0:18:29.760 --> 0:18:32.680 So it's like it's so dependent. What do you think 0:18:33.280 --> 0:18:36.080 I think. I think it is very dependent. And I 0:18:36.080 --> 0:18:40.280 think sometimes the strong form of allyship is in the 0:18:40.640 --> 0:18:45.119 closed within closed doors, and I've seen it personally in 0:18:45.800 --> 0:18:50.159 rooms where people have these opinions and then to be 0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:53.840 able to actually use your voice and say, actually, I 0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:58.040 don't think that's so correct, or actually it's actually harder 0:18:58.080 --> 0:19:00.399 than just posting that on So I will tell yeah, 0:19:00.440 --> 0:19:02.879 for free, I will tell you this. It is so 0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:06.240 much harder to be in a room where you have 0:19:06.320 --> 0:19:09.800 people who probably look like you or believe the same 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:12.520 same values, that have the same values that you do, 0:19:13.080 --> 0:19:16.720 and they bring up something that may seem sort of 0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:20.840 is left fields, especially if you consider yourself an ally 0:19:21.359 --> 0:19:25.119 and having to say no, actually, I don't think that's correct, 0:19:25.200 --> 0:19:28.560 or have you ever considered that? So there's actually sometimes 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:32.760 more power of influence in those spaces. So I just 0:19:32.800 --> 0:19:36.040 want people to know that it's not always about Yes. 0:19:36.080 --> 0:19:38.080 Of course, if you have a platform and can share, 0:19:38.440 --> 0:19:40.800 do so. Sometimes I think we are scared to share 0:19:40.800 --> 0:19:44.320 because we don't know. There's a lot of information going around. 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:46.040 Am I sharing the right thing in the right way, 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:48.320 especially when a buzzy topic. 0:19:48.440 --> 0:19:51.399 Yeah, you don't have time to educate a buzzy topic 0:19:51.440 --> 0:19:53.520 you might not know lots about exactly. 0:19:54.040 --> 0:19:56.240 And that's why sometimes it's good to take a step back, 0:19:56.440 --> 0:19:58.879 take a moment, to do what you need to do 0:19:59.040 --> 0:20:00.000 to figure out. 0:20:00.400 --> 0:20:03.719 That's just like that Empire dude, which do you remember 0:20:03.760 --> 0:20:07.400 the sorry story time the Empire guy? 0:20:08.280 --> 0:20:10.280 I forget what just small letter? 0:20:10.280 --> 0:20:14.240 I think, oh, yes, all the celebrities were like he 0:20:14.359 --> 0:20:15.040 was attacked. 0:20:16.359 --> 0:20:18.560 I know, Jersey, he's innocent. 0:20:18.800 --> 0:20:23.280 Jersey's in the Nigerian dudes were like a man you 0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:28.800 were paid to paid those posts of support because the 0:20:28.840 --> 0:20:31.160 initial thing was he had been it was a hate 0:20:31.160 --> 0:20:33.359 crime and he had been attacked. And I think the 0:20:33.400 --> 0:20:37.199 thing was stand with Jesse. So it's like that's the 0:20:37.280 --> 0:20:40.879 thing as well with posting, because you got both talk 0:20:40.960 --> 0:20:43.720 quick to far stored out. 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:52.399 So edumate yourself. You gotta edumacate yourself to Speaking of edumacation, 0:20:53.720 --> 0:20:58.000 you know when we talk about the right resources, Sorry, 0:20:58.040 --> 0:21:01.320 I'm really digressing. It's just because what are the right resources? 0:21:01.320 --> 0:21:04.399 Because we recently had this conversation We're talking about the 0:21:04.960 --> 0:21:10.000 war and the conflict in Gaza, and we're like, okay, 0:21:10.320 --> 0:21:14.840 what are the informed resources, especially for things like war, 0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:20.840 because war is genders on every side. Every side, someone 0:21:20.920 --> 0:21:22.840 will tell you what they want you and put it 0:21:22.880 --> 0:21:24.960 in a way you want to hear. Will they want 0:21:25.000 --> 0:21:26.719 you to hear it, and someone else will come and 0:21:26.880 --> 0:21:28.480 give it to you in a way that you want 0:21:28.520 --> 0:21:31.960 to hear it. It's personal disclaiment. I want to say, 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:34.680 I get very triggered by reading the news. I'm very 0:21:34.720 --> 0:21:39.240 all the time. It's a very hard thing for me 0:21:39.359 --> 0:21:44.080 to do. I typically will be like, Okay, this keeps 0:21:44.119 --> 0:21:47.240 coming up, and then headlines and then eventually I'll be like, 0:21:47.280 --> 0:21:49.840 let me do my research. But I'm not someone who's 0:21:49.920 --> 0:21:53.159 like quick fast, like yeah, let's hear what's more So, 0:21:53.960 --> 0:21:56.399 it's very triggering. So if you're someone who feels like 0:21:56.560 --> 0:22:00.119 I have a very difficult time with reading the news 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:00.960 in general. 0:22:00.720 --> 0:22:04.639 The empathy level was on one hundred room big, I 0:22:04.680 --> 0:22:08.119 feel it's hard. It's tough as well, because let's not 0:22:08.640 --> 0:22:10.840 to get even deeper into it, let's not lie that 0:22:10.880 --> 0:22:14.560 the media is media is controlled by certain entities. So 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:16.840 when you're even if you say I'm going to watch 0:22:16.920 --> 0:22:22.280 CNN or BBC, somebody's paying them checks march and they 0:22:22.320 --> 0:22:27.440 have a certain they have a certain image American Well yeah, exactly. 0:22:27.680 --> 0:22:30.359 So it's like I remember, even for Zimbabwe, there was 0:22:30.400 --> 0:22:32.280 a time when I had to like grow a lot 0:22:32.320 --> 0:22:34.880