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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast.

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Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the time poor parent who just

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Speaker 2: wants answers.

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Speaker 3: Now, when you try to do it the quick way,

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Speaker 3: it often ends up taking longer. If not in the

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Speaker 3: immediate short term, over time it takes longer.

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Speaker 2: And now here's the stars of our show.

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Speaker 3: My mum and dad. Hello, this is doctor Justin Coulson

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Speaker 3: and my wife. Kindly. We are the parents of six children,

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Speaker 3: and I've written six books about raising happy families. And

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Speaker 3: I'm feeling lucky to be alive today because our third daughter,

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Speaker 3: she's about to get a driver's license, and it's it's

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Speaker 3: sometimes you really do take your life into your hands

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Speaker 3: when you get into the passenger seat of a car

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Speaker 3: beside an l player, don't you well, I think.

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Speaker 2: You kind of draw the short end of the straw

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Speaker 2: there from the very beginning, because after my very first

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Speaker 2: learning experience with our elder.

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Speaker 3: Have we told that story in this podcast.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if we have. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: we should.

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, I'm telling it right now. Do you want

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Speaker 3: to tell it? You were the one that was in

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Speaker 3: the car. I'm going to tell it while you laugh

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Speaker 3: and you jump in and fill in the details because

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Speaker 3: this is so good. So Chanelle is our eldest daughter

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Speaker 3: several I don't know how many years ago, it was

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Speaker 3: now like seven eight years ago, she got her else.

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Speaker 3: She was so excited, and Kylie was the one that

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Speaker 3: took you. Took her to the motor Registry to do

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Speaker 3: the test and she got her learner permit to drive

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Speaker 3: a car. And I specifically had said, because it was

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Speaker 3: before school, she was getting to school late so that

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Speaker 3: she could do it, and I had specifically said, don't

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Speaker 3: let her get behind the wheel. I'll take her out tonight.

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Speaker 3: I feel like this is a kind of a it's

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Speaker 3: a daddy daughter thing. It's something that I want to

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Speaker 3: do with the girls. I want to teach them to drive.

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Speaker 3: You teach them so much, and this is something that

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Speaker 3: I can do. So I wanted to have that experience.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't because I thought i'd be better or anything

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Speaker 3: like that. It was just I want to teach you

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Speaker 3: to drive, but you didn't listen. Did you come on?

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Speaker 3: Tell us what happened?

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Speaker 2: Well, she was so excited, and I just wanted to

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Speaker 2: be the cool mum, and so I decided that the

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Speaker 2: first mistake.

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Speaker 3: It's not about being the cool mum. And by the way,

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Speaker 3: this is not what the podcasts about, but the story

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Speaker 3: is just so good. So so you're trying to be

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Speaker 3: the cool moum. What happens?

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Speaker 2: So I took her down to a nearby church car

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Speaker 2: park and I let her get behind the wheel. Now

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Speaker 2: you need to understand that Chanelle has actually never got

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Speaker 2: behind the wheel of a car.

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Speaker 3: Oh, and it was a manual.

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Speaker 2: That was the big The big challenge was that she

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Speaker 2: was actually going to be learning to drive a manual, because.

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Speaker 3: I'm a stickler for the rules, right, you don't drive

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Speaker 3: until you've got your learner's permit.

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Speaker 2: But in Chanelle's defense, she'd been watching all of her

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Speaker 2: friends who had been getting behind their parents' wheels and

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Speaker 2: you know, driving just in the car park, these little

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Speaker 2: nice little reverse for reverse bag you drive forward just

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Speaker 2: as little. They weren't doing anything major, but she didn't

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Speaker 2: understand that they were actually in automatic cars and so

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Speaker 2: it wasn't taking a huge amount of skill to you know,

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Speaker 2: put your foot on the accelerator and get the car moving.

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Speaker 1: So we're sitting in the car park and she is

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Speaker 1: just pumped.

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Speaker 2: She is so excited that she finally gets to get

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Speaker 2: this car moving. And it didn't matter what I did

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Speaker 2: with her, We just she could not get that rhythm

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Speaker 2: you know that you need with your clutch and your accelerator.

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Speaker 3: It's pretty tricky when you've never done it before and

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Speaker 3: you've never had the experience of even understanding how it works.

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Speaker 2: I really, really, really thought I was going to be awesome.

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Speaker 1: I did.

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Speaker 2: I honestly, I thought I was going to be awesome

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Speaker 2: at this. So we bunny hopped that kind of fifteen

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Speaker 2: meter driveway for about twenty minutes. There was smoke coming

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Speaker 2: out of the exhaust vibe, and I finally looked at

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Speaker 2: her and I said, you know what, we've been here

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Speaker 2: for twenty minutes. I think that we need to call

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Speaker 2: it quits.

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Speaker 3: And just we've already destroyed the clutch. We probably should

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Speaker 3: go now right.

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Speaker 1: Go to school.

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Speaker 2: And she just wanted to have that feeling of freedom,

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Speaker 2: and you know.

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Speaker 1: The car driving down the road. She had it.

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Speaker 2: All pictured and she just she was so excited. And

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Speaker 2: I finally gave in and I said, all right, I said,

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Speaker 2: do you think that you could get the car rolling

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Speaker 2: forward so that we can actually pull out onto the road.

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Speaker 2: It was a nice quiet road and you can just

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Speaker 2: kind of turn ninety degrees and pull up along the

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Speaker 2: side the curb.

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Speaker 1: Way.

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Speaker 2: Even now when I'm saying it, I can't believe that

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Speaker 2: I thought that she could do it.

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Speaker 3: I can.

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Speaker 2: I know, it's just but at the time it just

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Speaker 2: seemed like such a simple request. So we got we

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Speaker 2: got the car started, and you say we.

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Speaker 3: I mean Chanelle turned the ignition on with her foot

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Speaker 3: on the clutch of it. She did did money help?

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Speaker 2: Yet she did, and we actually made it up the driveway.

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Speaker 2: We actually got some you know, good momentum. The problem

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Speaker 2: was that when she got out of the driveway in

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Speaker 2: into the street, she's now at a ninety degree angle

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Speaker 2: in the middle of the road, and she's panicked, and

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Speaker 2: so she's over corrected herself. So we've done a full

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Speaker 2: one eighty and we're now facing the church and she

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Speaker 2: driving straight towards the filming. We've gone up over the

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Speaker 2: curb and we've gone head first into the church building.

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Speaker 3: So what happens here is that you've got the baby

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Speaker 3: in the backseat.

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Speaker 1: I had the baby in the backseat. I can't befuily

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Speaker 1: be telling everybody I.

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Speaker 3: Trapped in But again, this is one of these great

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Speaker 3: learning experiences that we all have because we're not complete

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Speaker 3: and fully perfect human beings. I get a phone call

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Speaker 3: from Kylie Uh, and it's something like, justin, can you

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Speaker 3: come down to the nearby church building. There's something that

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Speaker 3: I think that you really need to see. And in

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Speaker 3: my mind, I've got two thoughts that clash instantly. Thought

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Speaker 3: Number one, Chanelle's driving the car and Kylie wants me

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Speaker 3: to see how good she is at it, and exactly

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Speaker 3: the same time, this, well, what a ridiculous thing that is.

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Speaker 3: She's crashed the car because she can't drive. So I've

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Speaker 3: driven down. I get there and Chanelle is in tears.

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Speaker 3: The air bags have exploded, the front end of the

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Speaker 3: car is right off, Chanelle's boiling, her eyes up, like

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Speaker 3: I said, and you're standing there going thumb twiddling sort

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Speaker 3: of thing.

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Speaker 2: So we hadn't actually planned to tell that story at all,

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Speaker 2: not even a bit. And it's really really painted me

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Speaker 2: in a really bad light.

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Speaker 1: But do you know what it actually.

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Speaker 3: That's why I've now taught all of our children to

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Speaker 3: drive who are able to. I'm now the driving instructor,

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Speaker 3: and I actually.

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Speaker 1: Get anxiety being in the car with the kids. It's

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Speaker 1: very very scary.

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Speaker 3: Well, so to why it is very very scary. But

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Speaker 3: the purpose of our podcast today is actually talk about

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Speaker 3: a really important principle that matters in family life and

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Speaker 3: life in general in a whole range of different ways.

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Speaker 3: And I think that this story accidentally illustrates it just perfectly,

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Speaker 3: and that is that fast is slow and slow is fast.

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Speaker 2: Okay, well, the fast thing would have been for me

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Speaker 2: to just drive the car myself.

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Speaker 3: Yes, that's right, you know, let's talk about what that

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Speaker 3: actually means right after the break. It's the Happy Families Podcast.

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Speaker 4: Imagine a home where discipline got results without anyone having

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Speaker 4: to feel bad or in trouble. The do's and don'ts

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Speaker 4: of discipline. Theres a webinar to help parents set limits

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Speaker 4: with love, compassion and humanity. Find it now at happy

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Speaker 4: families dot com, dot au slash shop.

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Speaker 2: It's the Happy Families Podcast, the podcast for the time

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Speaker 2: poor parent who just wants answers now.

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Speaker 1: And we have been talking about my.

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Speaker 2: Probably biggest parenting blonder in the history of my parenting journey.

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Speaker 3: We have made a couple of big ones, but this

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Speaker 3: is up there. It's definitely top three. So she now

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Speaker 3: writes off our car and we're talking about this idea

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Speaker 3: of fast as slow, slow as fast. I was just

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Speaker 3: that we got onto that because I've been teaching out

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Speaker 3: the daughter too. She's about to get her peeplates and

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Speaker 3: I don't quite think she's ready, but I thought that

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Speaker 3: about our second one, and she got them as well.

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Speaker 3: And mind you, still getting nervous when I get in

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Speaker 3: the car with her. So the idea of fast is slow,

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Speaker 3: slow as fast applies in so many different places. What

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Speaker 3: happens when you try to do something too fast is

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Speaker 3: you actually end up slowing the process down, especially when

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Speaker 3: we're talking about something like teaching your children to survive

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Speaker 3: in life, like to drive a car by trying to

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Speaker 3: go fast, by trying to get her to do something

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Speaker 3: before she was developmentally capable of doing it. She hadn't

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Speaker 3: had the training, she hadn't had the induction, She hadn't

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Speaker 3: had the experience that she needed to manage a clutch

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Speaker 3: and accelerator at the same time while turning a wheel

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Speaker 3: ninety degrees to the left to pull the car up.

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Speaker 3: She just didn't have that experience. So fast actually turns

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Speaker 3: into something slow.

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Speaker 1: That is, she.

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Speaker 2: Decided she was not even going to get back behind

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Speaker 2: the wheel, didn't she right?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I had to do a little bit of

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Speaker 3: gentle exposure therapy with her to help her feel safe

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Speaker 3: getting into a car again, and particularly sitting behind a

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Speaker 3: wheel of a car.

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Speaker 1: Is that what you've been doing with me all this year?

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Speaker 3: And so what we're really getting at is we do

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Speaker 3: this with the kids all the time. And a simple

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Speaker 3: example the little children is shoelacers. Right, it's just faster

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Speaker 3: to tie little kids shoelacers up.

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Speaker 1: No, you just by think it's faster.

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Speaker 3: To buy a velcrow. But if they do have to

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Speaker 3: wear lace ups, you just get down on the ground

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Speaker 3: and do it because it's painful. It takes a long

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Speaker 3: time to tie shoes up. I don't know what the

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Speaker 3: stats are, but I reckon back in the olden days,

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Speaker 3: when we were kids, we learned to tie up our shoes,

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Speaker 3: probably by the age of four.

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Speaker 1: I think you.

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Speaker 2: Guys just left your shoelaces undone. I think they just

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Speaker 2: tripped over them all the time.

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Speaker 3: No, I was tying up my shoes, thank you very much, missus.

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Speaker 3: Happy families. But nowadays, like kids are six and seven

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Speaker 3: and they wouldn't have a clue how to type their

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Speaker 3: shoe lacers. It's just not a thing. And so if

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Speaker 3: you go with the fast option, it just takes longer

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Speaker 3: and longer and longer. It's slower and slower and slower

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Speaker 3: until you can get the outcome. Another example, kids doing

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Speaker 3: chores around the house. How's that going?

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Speaker 1: Okay?

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Speaker 2: So this is probably my biggest blunder. I really really

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Speaker 2: struggle with this because I like things done a certain way,

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Speaker 2: and you know, whether.

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Speaker 3: It's I'm not allowed to fold a towel because I

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Speaker 3: can't not allowed to because whenever I do, I try

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Speaker 3: to copy the way you'd so Kylie. For those of

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Speaker 3: you who are new to the podcast and don't know

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Speaker 3: much about Kylie, Kylie just has this incredible ability not

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Speaker 3: just to fold towels, but to make things look beautiful.

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Speaker 3: And our house looks beautiful because of your skills and

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Speaker 3: your strengths, and that this particular talent that you have.

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Speaker 3: But Kylie also has this sort of perfectionistic streak in

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Speaker 3: that it doesn't just apply to making sure that the

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Speaker 3: living room looks nice, so that the bedrooms are well decorated.

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Speaker 3: It's like the towels have to be magazine folded kind

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Speaker 3: of thing. And so I do my best, and I've

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Speaker 3: watched and I've learned, and even my very best is

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Speaker 3: probably about a six and a.

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Speaker 1: Half, very generous.

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Speaker 3: Oh gosh, I can't even fold a towel, crying out loud.

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Speaker 3: I've got a pH d in psychology and I can't

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Speaker 3: fold a towel. And so you've been trying to teach

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Speaker 3: our kids how to get this right, Well for.

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Speaker 1: Many years, I didn't even try.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think that's the point.

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Speaker 2: Isn't it much faster for me to do it? I

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Speaker 2: get the job done the way I want to get

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Speaker 2: it done, and we move on. Yeah, one of the

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Speaker 2: things that you're really good at is that whole induction

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Speaker 2: process and helping our children to learn these skills. And

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Speaker 2: I kind of look at you and I roll my eyes.

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Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't have time for this. I just

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Speaker 2: need to get the job done.

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Speaker 3: We're running out of time on the podcast. But can

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Speaker 3: I share a story about why I'm good at induction?

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Speaker 1: Okay, let's go.

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Speaker 3: So my dad runs a furniture moving company. My dad's

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Speaker 3: been a furniture removalist. Well, first off, he was a milkman,

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Speaker 3: and then he became a furniture removalist and dad runs

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Speaker 3: this furniture moving company, and as I was doing my studies,

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Speaker 3: I worked during the week in retail or at I

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Speaker 3: had another job, but then on the weekends I would

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Speaker 3: do furniture removals. And one time one of Dad's trucks

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Speaker 3: was nearby and he asked me to go and help

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Speaker 3: his driver to unload some furniture, including a piano, into

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Speaker 3: a nearby suburb. So I jumped in the car and

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Speaker 3: drove over there to do that because it was a

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Speaker 3: little bit of extra money, and we were students and

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Speaker 3: we had none, so I was saying yes to any

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Speaker 3: work I could get. What I didn't know is that

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Speaker 3: the guy that I was helping was brand new. He'd

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Speaker 3: never moved pianos ever. It was one of his first jobs.

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Speaker 3: And I had been working on furniture trucks for my

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Speaker 3: entire life with Dad, but I'd never sort of been

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Speaker 3: in charge. I just kind of did whatever I was told.

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Speaker 3: But this guy didn't know how to move the piano,

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Speaker 3: and I just figured that we'd do what I'd always done,

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Speaker 3: but I got it totally wrong, and what ended up

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Speaker 3: happening is that we lifted the piano onto the little

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Speaker 3: piano trolley and we started to push it towards the doors,

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Speaker 3: and I was underneath, or you know, at the base

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Speaker 3: of the piano, so that as it starts to go

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Speaker 3: down the ramp, I'm acting as the break and he's

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Speaker 3: at the top and he's pulling it towards the top

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Speaker 3: to try to slow the speed of the piano going

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Speaker 3: down the ramp, because those ramps can be kind of steep.

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Speaker 3: And what ended up happening was that I had my

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Speaker 3: arms outstretched and I'm pushing against it like I'm pushing

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Speaker 3: against a wall. And the piano starts to roll down

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Speaker 3: the ramp and I hear him say ah, because it

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Speaker 3: was really heavy, and I think, oh, because my arms

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Speaker 3: started to buckle. You know, my elbows just started to

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Speaker 3: bend because pianos are heavy. This thing was an old,

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Speaker 3: like I was one hundred and fifty year old piano.

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Speaker 3: It was an old piano, and he's starting to lose

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Speaker 3: his grip and my arms are starting to buckle, and

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Speaker 3: the piano's picking up speed, and then all of a sudden,

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Speaker 3: it crashes into my shoulder and I dive off of

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Speaker 3: the ramp and the piano follows me and it literally

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Speaker 3: rolled across me. And somehow I didn't break, but the

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Speaker 3: piano did into hundreds of pieces all across the road.

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Speaker 3: And when we rang my dad to tell him, he said,

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Speaker 3: tell me exactly what happened. And so I told him

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Speaker 3: about what ramp, you know, what part of the truck

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Speaker 3: we were pulling it out of, and he said, that's

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Speaker 3: the highest and steepest part of the truck. You've always

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Speaker 3: got to go out to the back, not the side.

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Speaker 3: And he said the camera of the road meant that

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Speaker 3: the ramp was even steeper because you were going out

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Speaker 3: the wrong side. And by the way, when I told

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Speaker 3: him that I didn't have my shoulder pushed against the piano,

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Speaker 3: I had my hands outstretched against it. He said, your elbows, Ben,

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Speaker 3: You've got to have your shoulder into it. And Dad

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Speaker 3: walked me through this process of induction. About an hour

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Speaker 3: or too late. The piano was just a ride off.

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Speaker 3: And so that's really the principle. How fast is slow?

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Speaker 3: When you try to do it the quick way, it

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Speaker 3: often ends up taking longer, if not in the immediate

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Speaker 3: short term, over time, it takes longer. Whereas if you

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Speaker 3: remember that slow is fast if you work through induction,

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Speaker 3: whether it's teaching the kids to fold towels or tie

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Speaker 3: up shoelaces, or teaching them slowly how to drive a

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Speaker 3: manual transmission and gently leading them to the next point.

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Speaker 3: That's when you start to see really great results and

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Speaker 3: you teach your children to be self sufficient.

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Speaker 1: Well, I have had a really good experience with this recently.

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Speaker 3: Goodness, because you were starting to sound a bit incompetent.

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Speaker 3: I'm just not that you are, because you're incredible, but

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Speaker 3: you were, just for a minute, I was.

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Speaker 2: Thinking, oh, dear, So recently we kind of reshuffled the

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Speaker 2: roster chart and we talked about some of the jobs

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Speaker 2: that needed to be done around the house, and one

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Speaker 2: of the girls decided that she wanted to do the laundry.

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Speaker 1: She never touched the laundry before.

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Speaker 3: And you've done laundry for a family of eight for

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Speaker 3: you know, well, as our family's grown across the last

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Speaker 3: twenty three years. I have a lot of it, a

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Speaker 3: lot because nobody else can do it like you.

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Speaker 2: So anyway, Miss thirteen decided she was going to give

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Speaker 2: it a go, and so I went through the process

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Speaker 2: with her, and I showed her how to fill the

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Speaker 2: washing machine and make sure it wasn't.

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Speaker 3: Too full on the podcast how.

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Speaker 2: To sort the washing so that we didn't end up

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Speaker 2: with colored whites and you know, darks with lint all

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Speaker 2: over them and all of those kinds of things. And

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Speaker 2: she just picked it up so well, and over a

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Speaker 2: period of a week we kind of went through, you know,

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Speaker 2: how to hang the clothes so she wasn't stretching, you know,

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Speaker 2: my waistbands out, and that the ironing wasn't so crushed

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Speaker 2: and all of those kinds of things. And we've just

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Speaker 2: watched this kid who didn't know how to do a

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Speaker 2: thing in the laundry now being completely capable of taking

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Speaker 2: care of that job for me.

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Speaker 1: We still haven't got to folding. That's a really tricky one.

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Speaker 3: Folding is obviously going to take a long time. But

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Speaker 3: again that illustrates the principle fast is slow. When you

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Speaker 3: just say go and do it, or you force them through,

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Speaker 3: you just get lousy results. Whereas you go slow, slow

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Speaker 3: becomes fast because they become self sufficient they think out

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Speaker 3: how to do it. We didn't talk about any of

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Speaker 3: the stuff really that we're going to talk about, but

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Speaker 3: I think we got there. I think the principle was

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Speaker 3: taught is that Okay.

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Speaker 1: Well, yes, you've completely bandied my name all over.

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Speaker 3: That you did that. I didn't do that at all anyway. Look,

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Speaker 3: thanks so much for listening to The Happy Family's podcast.

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Speaker 3: If you do enjoy the podcast, all you have to

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Speaker 3: their families happier. The Happy Families podcast is produced by

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Speaker 3: Justin Ruland from Bridge Media, and Craig Bruce is our

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Speaker 3: executive producer. If you'd like more information about making your

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